 Hi everyone, this is Sonali. Thank you all for coming out some time for attending today's webinar on the episode 27 of the Business X Learning Series, Invest, Scale, Value and Exit. To all the attendees out there, please type in any questions you might have in the Q&A section and we'll try to answer as many as possible at the end of the session. I would now like to welcome our speaker, Mr. Gaurav Mariah, Chairman and Founder of the Franchise India Group. A very warm welcome to you, sir. Thank you, Sonali, and welcome friends and welcome to another edition. If you're joining this month, the first time, very, very happy to hear to you. This is our regular edition on Saturday afternoon, just about 30 odd minutes, where we spend about 20, 25 minutes on giving you one topic on a particular aspect. It can be on value, exit, scale and how do you really do any of these things in the cycles of your business. So you talk about that and then maybe 10 minutes, a little more interactive your questions. So if you have a question, you would have to go to a Q&A box and start asking your questions and I'll probably spend more time in answering your questions today. So today's topic is about mentorship. So a lot of these days, I mean, startups come to us and especially on a Business X platform where they would see that should I take a mentor, should I not take a mentor, which kind of mentor is required to be done. People share their experiences of different kind of mentoring programs they've gone through. They've gone very institutional mentoring programs, they've just gone with one mentor which has taken them help them in terms of doing it. I can tell you there are a lot of good case studies on that and there's enough and more data available. You should really spend the lead. If you are a startup or starting your own business or planning to start your own startup, I think you need a mentor. Even if you are doing a business which has some kind of history like when franchise, even if you are doing a franchise business where you are trying out with the already established brand, it's still not a bad idea to have a good mentor. Because still it's a startup, it would still have its own challenges and if you are somebody who's not done business in the past, you would need to take a mentor. And so what we're going to cover today's topic is why you require mentors. As I said, I mean, I'll go into detail in terms of what is the real impact of being mentors around and why we need it. Then we'll also talk about types of mentors available, what kind of mentor you should choose. I always believe it's much easier for a mentor to choose a mentee than a mentee to choose a mentor. It's actually other way around. People think that getting a good mentor is difficult. Actually that's easier but for a founder or a company, the business owner to really go out and say this is a mentor who's going to help me out and I'm going to be staying with him for many, many, many years and probably have a long, deeper association and share whatever my challenges are and open up my everything to this mentor is a very important. It's like you're choosing your Dronacharya. It's something which is very, very difficult for somebody to do that. It's like choosing your own Christian. So anybody in our mythology also, there is a very big importance of a mentor. Mentors really have to also see through and there has to be a collective bonding unless and until that is there, this will not last and you will not be able to get results and it actually can become better. I've seen people who are talking and giving that this is my mentor at the particular stage and later they are not doing it and because there was a mismatch of expectations. So we'll talk about types of mentors. We'll also talk about the stages where you need a mentor and what are the stages and this is also self-evolving. Different stages, different mentors would be able to guide you through. I'll also talk about the nine reasons which why mentors would work. What are the key impact areas they would really work on that? Three areas which I will talk about what is the objective of a mentorship program. What kind of objectivity you need to bring in? You need to be very firm on that. These are three or big objectives and I think these are three big objectives which a mentor should really look at. And finally, how to select a right mentor. Who should really go out and select the right mentor and how you are creating a long-term valuation because a mentor at the certain stage was a fancy word. You know, everybody wanted to be a mentor. People liked that in that situation. They start the programs and then they all that. It's asking a lot of time from them and a lot of commitment from them and that's where they start pulling them back. So I realize that unless and until you have very defined a role, it's just not done because somebody has become very successful and now wants to do a mentor, other young people or you just for a sake of it getting a great name who is looked like your mentor would not make sense. I think either side of that would not create any kind of a value. So how to really be able to define that is very important. So we will start with first understanding why you need a mentor, why you need that and mentorship is not for everyone. I've seen a lot of successful people started their program and started doing mentorship with young people, young founders and they had no impact on the business because it needs a lot of commitment. It needs a lot of commitment and continuous working. It's not also sometimes your own personal experiences while it helps you as a mentor to have a lot of personal experiences but unless and until you are somebody who goes other way around and sees a lot of data, a lot of time you spend and then give you your advice. It's a bit of a coaching which is different from you know just bringing your own domain expert. You need to be somebody who's has to have ability to read better. Somebody who has the ability to go out and read better in businesses. Somebody who has ability to understand the data better would be able to have more analytic capabilities better than only you can be a mentor. So even for mentors I would say they have to really ask themselves would they have enough time and commitment available? Are they also not somebody who just put their own personal opinions on things because that doesn't work because every single business and a business owner is very very unique. So you cannot just go out and make your own personal opinions on this. I've been involving a lot of mentorship programs and I used to do that. I will be very honest and I will go and make same opinions because of my own understanding of businesses but I've stopped it completely. If anybody ask for advice from me I will say feed me a lot of data. The only thing I can tell is that I have ability to read that data and tell you where it stands and that becomes that I'm not judgmental on my own opinions and I'm actually going by a very methodical approach a more scientific approach towards guiding somebody. So it's a very important decision when you do that and why that's why most of the times your close relationships fail as being mentors. Your friends, family they are not the greatest mentors why because they would not be able to give you impartial feedback. Their advice would be always some form of bias to the nature and they would not be backed by strong data and a factful experience. So all this would not be available. So sometimes your close relationships and close people in the family are not the best sometimes to take as a mentor because they would not be able to give you they were always impartial about some kind of feedback to you and that's something is not good because the whole purpose you're taking a mentor is very very important. So you need to really see what is the kind of impact you're looking for this program that's very important how is there a deeper reasons why you are taking this mentor that's also very important why you want to really take a mentor because you need to really have some kind of a deeper reason. It's just not that you have a startup and you really want to engage somebody as a mentor you need to really see what is the deeper reasons and you also have to know your strength areas weak areas the areas where you need really help and so on and both sides have to have a very strong objectivity before they commit to this relationship that's very very important. So now let's get into the types of mentors there are two types and I've realized that there are two types very clearly and one has to really see say I was I was developing a new product or I needed a some kind of ideation or innovation in that product it happens in technology it happens in I think then I need a mentor who comes very clearly a domain specialist somebody who can guide me through in this it's very very similar to what happens in when you have a mentor in your education because if you are a particular subject you're reading you need somebody who has been a specialist on that subject who can guide you through that it's very similar when you have a mentor in a in when you're doing a phd or doing any other thing very clearly you need a domain because you will stuck at different stages and you need somebody to pave it through for you is it improves your critical thinking it improves your your capability to solve problems but you need to have somebody who clearly comes from the domain so you need to really ask where you are if you are somebody who is developing a new product or innovating something you need to have somebody who's an absolutely domain specialist say I was doing a you know personal care product and I want to really take this into that I need to go to somebody who understands personal care market deep down and especially if it is a product which needs a little more engineering then I need the product specialist somebody who has the absolutely product specialist and then take him as a mentor so very clearly understand where your startup is but if your startup was something which has some form of a product which has been already commercialized and now it's it's running as a business and you need somebody who comes with a larger business experience and business reputation or somebody who can help you open doors open the network and so forth then you need another second type of I think somebody who comes generally from a business experience on being an entrepreneur very successful and do that so very clearly ask yourself where your startup is and where you need to do that thing so there are two types of very clearly mentors to be in the market one are very very clearly domain champions they are they would help you to address your or your business where its stages now let's get into the why what are the stages of this mentorship program you know to me any business would have to pass through four stages and four stages there are very few times I've realized that a mentor can actually help you all for you might have to have different mentors at different stages at the first stage when you are pretty much at the what I call the validation of your business you want to really have somebody who can help you to validate your business idea take it to the next level get even the business model validated in terms of that it would have have a sustainability or a performance in going forward which is more productization of your idea so come form of you need to really come down to first stage second stage is what I call the incubation stage where you need to really reach out to your audience it's very clearly go to market and get your first success normally these two stages I think should be idly done by one single mentor and then third is a little different stage it needs a scale it needs somebody who has seen that you know people who are very clearly domain based experience they might help you in the first two stages but not be able to scale this because scale might need somebody who's seen it long term right so somebody who has has an ability to really go take this to from a certain size to a certain level who has a very strong capability of driving what I call organizational design and also performances monitoring and so on especially young founders even if they get capitalized I've seen that they get fail when they scale because they have no ability to understand how large organizations would be done so it becomes very overwhelming for somebody who's just maybe a few years in experience in business and certainly has to manage a thousand member team so how do you really get to a level where you have somebody along with you who can guide you through in this process and and fourth is where you need to really what I call monetize your startup which means that you need to look at an exit or look at a you know some kind of a capitalization for the business so that stages are there so I would say I would split this into two part which is a little more mature side of things and then the first is very clearly a validation and incubating of your business model so that's how your structure would work now let's get into what I call the nine reasons why a mentorship would work you know why would a mentor would be able to help your business so first it is it is essential when you're starting a startup how it would be good to have a mentor because you will save a lot of time to really go to the market and that time I think can take a lot of serious you know pain areas because it's a most difficult time especially if you're not from that business and you're starting off that business say I was starting a business in health care and I have somebody who's already have that experience and a lot of people start and they a lot of the people young people from technology backgrounds they come into these domains and they don't have industry domains available they don't understand health care but they understand technology so they understand that they're creating a product but they need to have a good mentor who can align with them understand validate their product and tell them a real practical issues on health care they understand the industry get some contacts and then get into the market so that's where I would strongly say you need to really if you want to save your time and money and get to market fast you need to have somebody who's a strong mentor around with you another thing which is would be the second point the mentor helps you learn faster and also become more smarter on your database because every single touch point or data point can be backed by a lot of other industry you know facts and so they keep validating those facts so you get a bouncing structure with your mentor which can help you do that third which is very very important I think the most important aspect of this is that we give access to their networks so if you have a good industry mentor and you're getting into that industry you would be able to quickly get into a lot of networks it also would continue to refine and continue to improvise your strategy so once you draw a strategy in a business plan it needs improving much much you know many many times in your cycle it needs maybe every 60 days go back to the sea that arc is the strategy working as per what we really thought improve on all other touch points for your communication any kind of communication marketing you know a business strategy that also would be able to do that and the other point which is very important is the financial agreement this is where I think a good entrepreneur who has been successful in past would be a great advice and I've seen the businesses especially early startups in the first 24 months do a lot of financial disasters you know they do a lot of financial mistakes they don't understand how to plan their budgeting they don't understand how they really want to forecast how they really want to really kind of build the sustainability in the network and that's why we have many many many failures in startups a lot of startups we've seen failing and especially in this COVID period we saw even more failing because they had no financial agreement so this is the area which I would say a mentor gets a very very important aspect also another thing which is access to a lot of knowledge and external knowledge base you know so every time you have a new new area to really learn that a good mentor with his experience and his own network and his understanding to ability to bring other parts of experience also can be a lot of other alignments in your business which you require can also be brought in another area which is very important is to continue to boost your emotional intelligence your creative thinking this is one of the areas which is actually more emotional in nature because sometimes when you're starting a business you almost every week you have an emotional rundown you are not successful you're not able to get that so keep your emotional balance and your creative thinking going up you need a mentor somebody who is along with you appreciates what you've done and also guides you through if you've not worked for you or it needs a change of strategy that also is important and finally somebody would be able to help you to raise capital or carve out your exit strategy and even at a certain stage help you to get some more resources that would be also done by the mentor now what is the objectivity why we we really need a good mentor with us I would say the three parts to this piece one is accountability you know when you are a founder of a business nobody really comes to you you are the boss of the company while you are on a small you know big business but it still is your company you have no accountability and especially early stage founders are not having the structured boards you know when you're running a large company then you have a board you become accountable to board every CEO every business owner has to go back to the board to take a lot of decisions but when you're running your own startup you have nobody to really go to apart from if you have got some early investment maybe you're investors but you don't have a day-to-day accountability so first very important aspect is put yourself in the shoes where you think that there is somebody you are accountable for and morally you are responsible on taking those decisions and once you've taken the decisions going back and telling what happened on those decisions is very very important and that works very well I mean I think self-accountability is really very important in this business and mentors with you from that second is to everything becomes process-oriented it is very important then when you are early stage startup you don't really took too much of time in putting setting some processes but mentors help you to set those processes because that would be I think more foundational so that you tomorrow when you start scaling up the business business and third thing which I would say most important aspect of a good mentor is that he's a rainmaker he knows when you need help when you need help he's always around with you and helps you out to really get some kind of not necessarily just a funding but it can be other resources which are required so he's a rainmaker he is somebody who's always around you and would be able to do that now let's get into what do you really need in a mentor what are the reasons why you want to really do that as I said it's very important industry knowledge second somebody who has an entrepreneurial edge on your business he has some kind of you are starting your entrepreneurial journey now but he is a little ahead of it so he's able to see through a little more than what you're able to see through he obviously brings in effective networks but please make sure that I've seen a lot of mentors who have visibility a lot of network they don't open up they don't open up they feel shy to really share and do this and that it takes a lot to really make some introductions and at that stage a lot of people I know don't do it they would sound that they are available with you but they will not make a conscious effort to really make one of their networks and that's something is a very big differentiator and that's why I keep saying this sometimes the big names which we see in the industry and people go to them and make them part of their organizations and treat them as mentors they are not very effective well they're they're sitting there as I think opens up some few doors for you but they don't really pick up phones and open up their networks I like people who might be you know really seriously take their mentorship structures and the mentees and they would not mind opening up their networks and tools for a fourth which is very very important is chemistry you know the mentor and a mentee has to have a very strong chemistry they need to really understand where each other is coming from and they are how they enjoy each other's success and that's very very important and finally he has to be a strong a problem solver you know because the whole idea of having a mentor is that somebody who has the ability to solve your problem whenever it is arises to do that so how do you really make sure that you select a mentor really ask frank questions understand what kind of availability he would have what kind of time he can contribute set some kind of schedules it's very important you need to really set some kind of a schedule that they would be so many hours in a month where you will be able to get that kind of a that thing you are also able to get a regular feedbacks that's very important sometimes the physical meeting would not happen but you can send data you can get some kind of a strong but well read well understood feedbacks and that's also very very important and also understand what is the length what are you committing to this mentorship program because it can become a little bit of a difficulty later to really when you start that program then you become very difficult if you're not satisfied especially for founders it becomes very difficult to start exiting from that relationship so you need to really define what do you really want to achieve at what stage you want to really do that more you are respectful for defining it in the initially more it will be easier for you to take through this whole program and finally what mentors normally would do and I've seen a lot of people do it because they just want to help youngsters and they want to help new startups and they they want to really do that I think in now it's a mature part of it it should be very well defined there is normally a advisory equity which you should rather start up offer to your mentor if you really select one and you think that there would be somebody who would be with you for the next three four five years and you need that contribution and you can clearly see the kind of time that thing once you have done that I would say absolutely offer some kind of a small equity it can be anything from a one percent to three four percent depending on the role and the time and effort for the mentorship and because you do that they're more involved and sometimes that's not very defined and that's where it goes wrong so you need to really you know make sure that that you go and offer as a startup to your mentor and say this is what I would like to offer and take your mentorship and this is what your expectation is so remember it is very very important decision to have somebody who stays with you helps you out is a great problem solver he's a rainmaker for you and also somebody who is ahead of you to see through what is happening so that's where the opportunity of making somebody to guide you through and making him a mentor for you would work so this was a today's session hope you are able to get something out of it now I like to invite Sonali back if she has some questions I can answer that sure thank you so much for another wonderful session Gaurab sir we do have quite a few questions lined up with us already so I would just take them up the first question I would like to take up is what is the difference between a mentor a coach and a consultant a good question so I think so while there are fine lines between all of them but let me start with the consultant and consultant is somebody who's who's normally a very clearly a process domain or domain under somebody who have fixed your processes so they come with say if you have a supply chain problem or you have a marketing problem or you have a HR problem if you have a technology problem so you will hire a specialist who would come and fix that part of it they normally don't look at the business at large normally they would fix the problem entirely so those are consulting most of the times you know what you pay them as a fee and against that fee they will do that coaching is a little more personal it's more more connecting the dots normally it would work on various aspects to get larger results which you are looking to expect from that I think and mentor is even more ahead of it where somebody who's who has a much deeper interest in in your performance and so on coaching is a little more getting still in the in the business kind of a role a mentor is a little more on the business kind of a role where somebody who's who's who's looking at a larger picture for you and helping you to get there absolutely sir the next question I would like to take up is as you said just getting a big name as a mentor or a board member is not really helpful but as you can see in today's startups most of them just get a big name to showcase that he or she is associated to their startup in your opinion does it add any real value to that startup it helps it helps I told in the last I think a couple of I think we've one of the companies we advise what or Ratan data as a as a investor or a mentor in that and just Ratan data sitting there in that company help this company to really get all investors investing on that and they're not the big investors but micro investors who wanted to buy their franchise they would because they would all see Ratan data being there they all go out and queued up to take a share of that company so it helps you know not everybody's Ratan data not everybody's Bansal's and not everybody's very successful we have very very handful people who were very successful and build unicorns or larger corporations and so on and Ratan data is a very exceptional example he generally have a desire to help people and help their businesses to go which also carries risk with him because I'm looking at his personality and his size and his aura and his industrial capability it can be very risky because he can but if by the time he's doing in a good spirit everybody understands where he's coming from but if you just take it only for the reason of that if somebody like that it helps but I would say if you really want a mentor you need to have somebody who is who who's available for you he's available and he's giving you genuine advice because I know the mistakes startups do in the first two to three years and those mistakes can be saved and businesses can be saved if you have a good mentor who's who have also a time availability you know it's unreasonable for anybody to even expect Ratan data giving time on businesses to really look at your balance sheet to understand what is happening on the business he can he can be a godfiddler figure who can come in and and bless you with with he being available but he is not going to be available for really putting that time and energy and maybe it will not match because the the businesses he's seen from the way he's seen and the corporations he's run he might not be the best right person to really advisor early stage start but there are I would say good successful good mentors out there who've done you know few past businesses sold them on success or a profit these are great mentors and these people are really very very good one another thing you need to really see that some mentors I think they do overdo themselves so they're advising many many companies and they're advising or mentoring many businesses so it means that they're they're overloaded they have too much of work going on and so find somebody who has availability for you and he likes you and he likes your business and that's very important absolutely sir the next question is what are the various reasons mentors work for money or share in a business or just to share their experience what kind of a mentor or a coach should we choose as an early stage business the coaches would work for money they're monthly paid so this coaching is a profession it's a professional advisory or coaching business where you pay them monthly fee I feel that if you are not very sure that somebody can act as a mentor and you feel that it can be a better coach it's better best for the business because you pay it you're not locked in you have no long term commitment because sharing an equity with somebody is a very very long term commitment and it also can be questioned by when the future investors start coming in and if he's there this person is holding 3% they would like to have questioned why you know this was given and what value he or she brought in so I would say if you if you don't see that long term viewpoint then don't take momentum if somebody is a better coach and pay a fee or a monthly retainer to work and get that sometimes young startups really don't appreciate their equity so much so they feel that reserving cash is more important so they give away equity more slightly and that's not good but if you want to mentor I would say mentors largely there are two types I would have to say one genuinely want to help founders and help companies they do mentoring depending on their time it gives them refreshing they just feel that this is their way of contributing back a lot of them do it. Jack Ma has mentored many many many entrepreneurs in China I know one of his mentees who started a billion dollar shoe company they make shoes and eyewear company the two brand two products they have and he built this he mentored him and and he's a 31 year old young Chinese guy and will build a billion dollar company in eyewear and shoes again directly mentored by he has a big class which Jack Ma used to do every year you bring in a lot of people but he never takes interest equity interest on positions in these companies he used to do it purely by his his way of doing giving back to society and giving back to entrepreneurship but this is only done at a level of Jack Ma's and likes of them they do it for that but rest every mentor would expect a certain small equity in the business which is good you should really give that equity rather if somebody is shying away from not asking go and ask openly and say this is what my expect my expectation would be that I would like you to have a small equity in my company and mentor me through this whole thing but don't just rush it just because it's a it's a big name or a fancy name you want to give somebody in equity has no meaning to me unless and until you very clearly define what is an expectation in alignment and on really very similar lines we have quite a few questions with us asking us about what are the most prevalent engagement models and commercial terms in India or how do we fix fees with a mentor anything you would like to add on anything which is 1 to 4-5 percent is that's the high 4-5 percent again I would say it's very high conserve your equity it's very very important it's very prestigious and should not be given just for the sake of it and and also define who you really need you know why you need a mentor what mentor is going to do you know I've seen you know why one of the companies I was advising and I asked that and he said that I have a chef who's my mentor I said why you have a chef as a mentor he said no because I wanted a phenomenal product and he was guiding me I says he would have hired him because product development was only one time why would you have somebody sitting as an equity who's not a complete understanding of ruining a full chain because product development was just part of it it was phased I understand it was important and he said no he would have not worked with me on that stage but I wanted him to guide me and mentor me and I asked the same question I said what what do you expect now he says very little only three months he comes and improves my product and sees what is going on so don't really confuse between fixing your your different processes for that you need consultants or coaches are available but mentor is somebody who who is for a little long period and and a much holistic approach to this rather than just being a mentality and emotionally the most important thing which I think which is always underwritten is your emotional balance and that emotional balance it comes best with a mentor and somebody who questions you a lot and I had in initial days a dear friend of mine which I treat him as my mentor and he was an Australian he's Australian he lives in now in Australia and that time he was in India the one thing which I liked about him he was he was every time he come to me and he just has hundreds of questions for me and I will get on to like a school kid giving him answers on why this did and why didn't I think and why would you do this and why would not do that and I he took me always through a self-discovery and I used to feel that every time he left I used to feel what he gave me nothing but I started realizing that he was best because he really put my critical thinking he questioned me what I was trying to do and why I was trying to do and that made me much more smarter to take my own decisions so that's something which you need to really find who's this person in your life and who's this you know and everything and that's where I would say these these are smaller pieces which are more important to me rather than somebody opening up a strategy box and saying oh here is a strategy go out and do it that's not something which I think is an ideal mentorship right sir I'll just take up the last few questions now another question that we have is should I get different mentors for different fields like technology marketing sales etc where can I find a mentor who can guide me in all these aspects should I get different mentors for different fields like technology marketing sales where can I find a mentor who can guide me in all of these aspects so again you have to find out what is the most critical part of it again I as I said types of mentors if you are at the product development stage the most critical is to get your product right it really did the product so that piece would be I think would be more important to fix and as the business goes to a little bit of what I call scale and developing smaller pieces of your organization then you might need somebody who comes with a larger canvas of understanding business but don't overdo yourself with so many mentors at one point time because you know you just need a one good mentor and that's part of it but you need to define where you are in business and who would be the more more right fit for you and and that's something which is yeah sure sir so lastly we just have questions from people who are asking us about where they can actually find a mentor so so many questions regarding that so anything you would like to add on to that it's around you you know if whatever business you are started there are people who are successful in that you need to really go out and reach out to them actively meet them set them in that perspective offer them that look I'm looking for them I think don't sound them that they are the ones who are looking at it initiate a dialogue and see if their business and you fit them and their willingness is there for that entirely for you and if you want to really reach out even businessx is a big platform where we link you with couple of industry people in different structures we reach out to Sonali and she will be happily able to send you some contacts of some mentors in but you tell us which industry you want and who you want and thinking of that nature we will be able to be happy to do that definitely sir so with this we'll just strap up the Q&A session thank you so much once again Gaurav sir for another insightful session and for very patiently answering all of our questions as always anything you would like to say in the end so one question is what is the organization as a mentor or a franchise selection guide yeah so we mentor we don't do I used to I do it sometimes on a personal capacity and some of my team and senior team members also do it but we as an organization are multifaceted but largely a SME solution company a franchising is one part of it but we run licensing we run businessx is a business resale and a business investment banking outfit and then we have media then we but everything we do is around SME so we understand SME as a large then the startup to SME the whole space we understand pretty well and anything which we can service this community is done by a franchise India group so if I've answered your question right so if you have anything which you want to really present in terms of your startup which you want to raise capital or you want to exit your business or you want to mentor or you need help doing some collaboration joint venture or MNA opportunity please reach out to Sonali and she's working hard to organize these webinars to for them need to come and say that look if you want any services from Sonali you should go to her and take all the services okay thank you very much hope this was helpful for you any subject you would like me to share and I'm enjoying this because I feel that this gives me opportunity to touch on topics which are not regular for us you know in in our business advisory and things of that nature we we're always busy in doing whatever we're doing so it gives me also an opportunity to really interact and sometimes some of you write back to me and and I get an opportunity to know your businesses it's also very good and I realize that the next set of entrepreneurs would be very very young and they would come extremely young and I do not be surprising for me that the next billion dollar companies will be made by people who are 19 and 18 and likes of them because they're pure they're pure in thinking and more pure you are more your chances are that you will think of a genuine problem and try to solve a genuine problem rather than just being somebody who's just a follower so we are coming a long way because it's our it's I would say how we were trained and and raised and and educated created a situation that we became a good followers rather than innovators so as we are coming off that what I call hangover which was 300 years of our hangover of told that this is the only way things are done I think India would see a lot of critical thinking innovation will start coming thank you very much thank you so much Gaurav sir once again and thank you to all our attendees we really hope you were able to add some value to your lives through the session and as Gaurav sir said if you need any help if you have any questions please feel free to reach out to me and we'll see you next time next Saturday at 3 p.m with another session in our series of investments scaling up valuation and exiting a business my email id is gm at gaurav maria.com so please reach me I can be of any help thank you so much sir thank you everyone