 Hi, everyone. We're going to give it just a few minutes for everyone to come into our Zoom room, but as always, this group is incredibly prompt, which is always greatly appreciated. And while we're doing that, I'm going to go ahead and start sharing my screen. We will jump into today's program. Well, as always, I want to welcome everyone to the CDC care webinar. My name is Robin Bauer Kilgoe and I'm the CDC care coordinator. I'm going to outline just a couple of a few things at the top of today's program and then we're going to throw it over to our presenter. You are here today for exhibiting photographs. We'll be running from about one to 2pm Eastern today for this program. And again, my name is Robin Bauer Kilgoe. I am the CDC care coordinator coordinator. I'm located just outside of Washington DC in Silver Spring, Maryland, where we're starting to see some spring. So it's kind of nice, even though it's been a pretty mild winter. It's nice to kind of see all the flowers blooming right now. Feel free to go ahead and put your location in the chat if you'd like. And you can also mention the weather, if you would happen to find that interesting. Just quickly, this is our home on the web connecting to collections.org. On that website, you will see all sorts of fun back resources for our program, which has been running on for over 10 years now. And quite the archive of courses and webinars, also a moderated community where you can ask questions and a bunch of other fun information. So I encourage you to go check out that website when you can. We also have two homes on social media, Facebook and Twitter out there we put announcements on upcoming programming so I encourage you to take a look at those if you haven't already to make sure they see what's coming up in the next couple months. A couple of quick technical notes before we start today. The chat is there for you all to say hello, and to say where you're from you all are doing a wonderful job at that so I don't think I really have to explain it much more than that. I would note though that in the chat box there are actually two drop downs one that says everyone and one that says hosts and panelists so make sure if you want to talk to everyone, talk to everyone, you want to talk to the hosts and panelists. Talk to the hosts and panelists on that drop down box. You also have the ability to use a Q&A box that's there for question and answer during the question and answer period of our webinar. I really encourage you to use that Q&A box when there's a question it helps us track the questions a little bit better than in the chat box which turns into kind of a nice stream of consciousness so again if you have a question at any point, please place it in the Q&A box. Also we have enabled closed captioning for this program so if you hit that CC button down at the bottom you should be able to see that. So please go ahead and do that if you like. We're also recording today's program and yeah you should be able to access it within just a few days after we're done. So if you happen to have to drop out or anything you'll be able to access before recording at that time. We've also posted resources from today's webinar and a copy of the slide deck and some outside resources our wonderful presenter has put together on our website which I'll be putting a link in the chat for that soon. We do have an upcoming webinar scheduled right now for April called Care of Judaica and on April 3 2023 from 1 to 2pm Eastern. We realized through talking with our advisory group that there are quite a few of you all out there with Judaica items within their collection so we have a specialist coming in to talk about care. Not only preventative care but kind of like cultural and sensitivity care when it comes to storing these items so I would encourage you to sign up for that webinar when you have a chance it's free as are all of our monthly webinars. We're also almost ready to announce our programming for May which is in conjunction with the annual May Day program that happens with FAIC so keep an eye out on all those little outlets that I talked about at the beginning of our program. When we announced that program coming up shortly. So I'm going to stop sharing my screen and I'm going to introduce our presenter today her name is Emily Phoenix she has worked in framing exhibition installation and photography preservation for over 15 years. And it's currently the head preparator at the George Eastman Museum in Rochester, New York. And in today's webinar we're going to go over the process of planning and executing the preparation of photographic objects for exhibitions with a focus on collections care. And throw this over to Emily and then we're going to come back at the end for a little bit of Q&A when she's finished so Emily feel free to take over whenever you want to start. Right. Thank you. I'm going to pull up my presentation here. Turn my video off. Can you see and hear me all right. Everything looks perfect feel free to go whenever you're ready. So, as you said Robin I'm the head preparator at the George Eastman Museum in Rochester, New York, which is the oldest museum dedicated to photography and film in the world. Our collection consists of over 400,000 photographic objects from the earliest days of the medium to the present. We're also a historic house museum, which gives me some familiarity with challenges, not just a large exhibitions in gallery spaces, but a smaller displays in areas that are not necessarily designed as exhibition spaces. Our first exhibition of photography was in 1949, long before current standards for the preservation of photographic objects on display have been established. As a result, many display methods which would be considered dubious today were regularly practiced and can still be seen in the current condition of some of the objects in our collection. Before 1989, our galleries were located in the historic house where the photographs that were exhibited were without doubt exposed to temperature and humidity fluctuations and also to a lot of natural light. As you can see on the image on the right of an exhibition of Walker Evans work in 1975. Our practices included dry mounting prints and exhibiting them pinned to the wall without framework glazing. Both from photographs of exhibitions from the time and also from this letter which was written in 1955 by the well known photographer and former employee minor white. Dear Mrs Brooks, thank you for your note the holes referred to are the pinholes that you mentioned. I must admit that I see red when mounts are damaged during installation mounts are expensive time consuming to remake and for a show that is expected to travel extensively. Soon give it a moth eaten appearance and I believe unnecessarily photographs should be mounted under glass in a manner that does not mar the mount. These color prints have especially delicate surfaces and must be handled appropriately. In that matter, all photographs have tender surfaces and the way they're handled often leaves me shuddering sincerely minor white assistant to the curator, and I couldn't agree with him more. Just in case I sounded all judgmental of any of my predecessors I wanted to include this image of our staff myself included installing a work by Alan carry with push pins as directed by the artist. Though photographs have been made in a wide variety of media and formats over the years, they do indeed have in common these as minor white put it tender surfaces. They can be easily damaged through handling, as well as being sensitive to light and to humidity in their environment. The topics I'll cover today are all related to the preservation of photographs while they're on display matting and framing mounts installation lighting use of reproductions and maintenance of gallery spaces. It's a lot to cover in a short period of time so as Robin did mention there's a resource page with some more information on these topics on the connecting the collections care site. How photographs are framed and especially how they're matted and mounted can have a huge impact on their long term preservation. I thought that I'd start with talking about some techniques that I've seen in our collection that should be avoided. Finally, some of these are still fairly commonly practiced. And whether you're doing your framing in house or working with an outside framer, you should do your best not to perpetuate these harmful practices. One choice that I've seen is to leave pencil lines on the inside of a window mat. The pencil can transfer to the photograph. And while the marks can be carefully removed by a conservator, it's best to just avoid them by erasing the pencil. Another mistake is using materials that cause chemical deterioration. These are a couple of extreme examples of a wood backing board and various acidic paper backing board being used. But even though these materials are hopefully no longer used in framing materials like foam core and lower quality mat board that doesn't pass the photographic activity test are still often used. Even acid free foam core contains polystyrene which degrades over time and can warp in yellow. Another unfortunate matting choice is when the window mat has been hinged directly to the board that the photograph is mounted to. Original mounts are part of the object and shouldn't have adhesive applied directly to them. This also makes the window more difficult to replace as it gets dirty or damaged over time. At a period of time, it was fairly popular for photographers to include a signature title or addition number on the window mat. Once the mat has been signed, it takes on new significance and it needs to be saved as part of the object. That's an issue because mats do become worn through handling over time and it's better if it all possible for them to be replaceable. I've seen a lot of problematic corners being used on photographs. The kind of older style of paper corner on the bottom is not recommended. I'm also not a huge fan of the small polyester corners on the left because I have seen them fail on a couple of occasions. And I definitely wouldn't recommend using them for larger photographs or for photographs that have a thicker mount like this. One of the worst and most common mistakes that I've seen in framing has been pressure sensitive tapes or adhesives being applied directly to an object to hold it in position in a frame. Adhesives, even those that are marketed as archival, can be difficult to remove and may cause irreversible damages. Photographs shouldn't be framed directly against the glazing. The graphic emulsion is very prone to adhering to glass in the presence of moisture. So there should always be some kind of mat or spacer between the photograph and the acrylic or glass in the frame. As important as protecting against chemical deterioration is providing physical protection is equally important. We used to have a large number of works in our collection that were framed in narrow frames with only thin wire crossing the back to add any support, which is really insufficient. One by one we've been reframing these oversized works with strainers, which are essential if you're framing large works in a thin frame profile. When it comes to selecting frames for exhibitions, I would strongly encourage organizations that are doing framing in-house to select standardized frames and to prioritize frame reuse. In the long term, sticking with a standard profile finish and sizes reduces costs as well as being better for the environment. So where we do make exceptions to our standard profile is to sometimes select a more period appropriate frame for 19th or early 20th century work, or when we're working with a contemporary artist who has a particular preference for finding their work. Maths not only provide an aesthetic function, but they're also critical to providing space between the photograph and the glazing. In terms of matting choices, we mostly use shades of white, off-white and cream to match the paper and image tone. Map work can either be cotton rag or alpha cellulose, but should have passed the photographic activity test or PAT. Some processes such as cyanotypes and di-diffusion transfer prints should be matted with unbuffer board since buffering agents can have a negative impact on the preservation of those processes. There are a variety of techniques to safely mount photographs in a frame without directly applying adhesive to the objects. Ideally, an object is securely attached inside of the mat, but can also be easily removed so that damage doesn't occur if someone needs to take it out later. These are a couple of examples of using folded paper corners to mount photographs. The prints on the right have a style of corner that can be easily folded back to remove the photograph without needing to cut the tape holding the corner. And there's more information and instructions on cornering on the CTC website. A sink mat should be used if a photograph is mounted to a board, and especially if it's warped or curling. On the left, you can see this photograph had previously been matted using corners, which wasn't ideal. On the right, it has a new sink mat that has enough depth to hold the object without applying pressure, which in some cases could cause the mount to crack or split. A technique that we use less frequently but can be helpful when mounting some trickier objects are edge strips. In this case, I was matting and framing an album page. The page not only had delicate and worn edges and somewhat dog-eared corners, but also had a hinge where the page would have been bound into the album. I made narrow strips along three of the sides to allow as much of the page to be visible in the window of the mat as possible. But used a wider strip on the side with the hinge to support this line of weakness in its structure. There are times when being able to see an object in its entirety is important to understanding its context. One way that we can show an object safely without over matting is to use small bent pins covered in teflon tubing to hold an object to the backing board. Though it's more rare, we also use magnets to mount objects like tin types without any visible mounting method. Another way that the entire object can be shown without a visible method of mounting is by applying hinges for a float mount. Because this technique requires adhesive to be applied directly to an object, this type of mounting is done by our conservators to make sure that the adhesive and the hinge that is applied is reversible. In these images, a conservator is applying small v-shaped hinges to the four corners of the objects. Because these hinges are folded behind the object, they aren't visible when the piece is framed and give the illusion of the objects floating on the backing board. Other important mounting methods to know about are dry mounting and pressure sensitive cold roller mounting, which uses a polyester carrier with acrylic adhesive. This is a popular option for large contemporary inkjet or chromogenic prints and for good reason. It keeps large work that is prone to sagging and distorting nice and flat and it protects against damage from handling such as dents and creases. The drawbacks are that it's not easily reversible. Also to mount to an archival substrate like Dibond can be costly and the availability of this service is more limited. Since it's more high risk and fairly permanent, it should be done by professionals with the right equipment and experience. We usually work with Lamont in New York and on the left is a picture of them mounting a large chromogenic print. On the right are mounted and framed works by Tanya Marcus from her exhibition Woven. Photographic objects are sensitive to changes and extremes of humidity. Some processes like albumin, yellow and fade more quickly in high humidity. Other processes like Woodberry types are prone to cracking in low humidity and almost all prints with an emulsion are prone to curling or cockling when humidity changes rapidly. So as much as possible we like to use sealed packages, which create a microclimate in our frames with a humidity range of around 35 to 50%. This is a cross section of a typical framing package. We use mainly UV blocking acrylic for our glazing. Then we have a window mat which provides space between the glazing and the photograph. A back mat which provides support and is what the object is mounted to. We may or may not use a condition sheet of ArtSorb in the package pending on whether our workspace is outside of the desired humidity range for the object. And for our backing we use Coroplast. In this cross section you can see these layers of tape right around the outside of that framing package, and that's what's creating our seal. First we make a back for the sealed package using an extremely impermeable material called Marvel seal, which is attached to the piece of Coroplast. The material is added using Escal which is a polyester with a ceramic coating so that a humidity indicator strip is visible. This strip makes it possible for us to see what's going on with the humidity on the inside of the package. The edges of the package have a layer of relatively low tack P90 tape, which protects the map from the more aggressive adhesive on the aluminum sealing tape. These are individually cut out and carefully folded around the package to eliminate any gaps where air could get into the package, and all of the tape is burnished to make sure that it's tightly adhered. Occasionally the aluminum tape is slightly visible under the edge of the frame and needs to be carefully trimmed so that it's hidden. The last step is to apply a label identifying what humidity the object was sealed at. Using this label allows us to check the object later to confirm that the seal package hasn't become to leak. In addition to protecting against humidity changes seal packages can protect against other factors such as pollution insects, and could even protect against damage from disaster situations such as a fire in the building or leak in the gallery by preventing smoke and water from entering the package. I don't often think of photographs as being two dimensional objects but there are actually a lot of types of photographic objects that have some kind of dimensionality. Photographs maybe in albums or books to gear types and amber types are often housed in cases, and there are beautiful examples of photographic jewelry. Artists also incorporate photography into sculptural works. To display these objects and cases mounts are needed to provide support and stability. One of the most common types of mounts that we make our book cradles. In this image I'm working on a cradle for an album which was in very fragile condition using a combination of finders board and map or to build the structure. The cradle was then covered with cloth. When a spine is in disrepair it's really important to create a book cradle that will support whatever structure remains. This album had a broken and separated spine and a separated signature. So in all I think it was in about five pieces. The cradle was designed to gently and carefully hold these broken components together so it could be seen as one object. That is one example but there are really limitless possibilities for mounts for objects and cases. On the left are cradles that were made with an archival and very clear plastic called PETG. That allowed the back of the postcards in the Robert Cumming exhibition to be seen. On the right are cradles that are made with map board and fabric for a group of daguerreotypes and amber types and cases. The oval mount also incorporates soldered brass wires to create a mount that follows the shape of the object. Objects are particularly vulnerable while they're being installed. Ideally there's enough time allotted to installing a new exhibition to allow for staff to work at a careful pace. But there's often pressure to allocate as little time to changing over exhibitions as possible which unfortunately can sometimes lead to rushing and to accidents. It is important that no matter how rushed you may be you always have enough people to safely install the size and weight of the work that you're hanging. Smaller works can easily be installed by one person, larger works by two or three and very large works by four to six people. Extraordinarily large or heavy works may require additional equipment or people to be safely handled. Gloves are also important for safely handling objects. The cotton gloves on the left are never used for handling objects directly. They reduce your dexterity and they're also permeable and can transfer sweat and body chemistry to sensitive photographic surfaces. They do sometimes come in handy when we're using heat for fabrication and we want to protect our hands so sort of using them like oven mitts, but we don't use them for objects. When we're handling bare photographs we use clean nitrile gloves or if we're handling books or albums we may use clean bare hands if there's a sufficient margin around the photographs on the page. However, during installs it's my preference to use the type of nitrile palmed fabric gloves on the right for handling preys. While they don't necessarily provide like the very best dexterity, they also don't break as easily as disposable nitrile gloves, which is great when handling large objects. They're also a lot easier to take on and off repeatedly. So when I'm hanging framed work all drill or hammer use whatever tools I'm using with my bare hands, and then I'll pull the nitrile palm gloves on for hanging the artwork keeping it nice and clean. These illustrations of different types of hanging hardware are reproduced from the Brode's Diversity Apprenticeship Program Toolbox, which is a really helpful resource if you're just getting started with learning about art handling and installation. Cleats can be made from wood or aluminum and are great for heavy frames since they spread the weight over multiple points. D-rings come in a variety of styles and sizes to support different weights. If you're using vintage frames and they have eyelet screws, I highly encourage you to replace those with D-rings. I have definitely seen eyelet screws pull out of frames and cause damage in the past. Hooks also come in a variety of styles and sizes and again should be selected to support the weight of the object. It's important to be aware that your hanging hardware is only as secure as the wall that it's going into. The D-rings and hooks may be rated for the weight, but for example, we have three eighths of an inch of paint on our walls. So the nails that we use need to be long enough to get past all of those layers of paint and into a solid wall. In addition to hanging hardware, security hardware can be used for theft prevention as well as an additional level of protection against earthquakes, if that's a concern in your geographical location. T-shaped security screws lock into corresponding plates attached to the frame. Bell or T-shaped plates attach to the back of the frame and then into the wall. They're really straightforward to use, but they do have the drawback of being more visible. Leashes are secured to the back of the frame and then to the wall behind the frame. They're less visible, but they have the drawback of being slightly less secure than a plate with a security screw. Another installation challenge you may encounter are works that are too large to be easily framed or works that the artist prefers not to display in a frame. This work by the artist Lorna Bieber titled Tapestry is the largest two-dimensional work we've installed to date at 11 feet by 27 feet. This work was hung entirely with magnets using a steel bracket and strategically placed steel mounting blocks. I've included some links about using magnets for mounting on the resource page. They're an option that I've really come to appreciate for some of our most challenging oversized projects and they're definitely something that's worth exploring. If you're exhibiting 19th and early 20th century photography, you're likely to eventually be in the position of exhibiting stereographs. I'm a really big stereophotography geek, so it's been important to me that when we exhibit stereographs, we're always providing a viewer that allows the visitor to see them in 3D. The design I currently prefer is based on a Holmes Bates-style stereoscope. Since unfortunately the offer on the left has expired, I found that the most cost-effective option for us was to purchase a kit like the one on the right and to modify it. I eliminated the rail here and the card holder and also this hinge on the handle. The handle was attached directly to the lens board and I made a small bracket to hold the viewer and attached a chain to prevent anyone walking away with it. I stained the viewer to match our standard frame profile before attaching the leather hood. The design makes it easy to replace broken parts as needed or to change the color of the wood finish to match the aesthetics of a particular exhibition or object. With the front rail and card holder removed, the stereoscope can be held in front of a frame stereograph to experience the three-dimensional effect. The viewer allows a variety of formats to be exhibited, including daguerreotypes, tissue views, glass plates, mounted cards, or even digital reproductions. It also gives the flexibility of framing multiple cards together or to add a light panel into the frame to exhibit stereographs such as this image from the Diabolary series, which was intended to be viewed with both reflective and transmitted light. That brings us to talking about lighting, which is a really important topic because photographic objects are inherently sensitive to light. We only have time to touch on this broad topic, but I wanted to point you towards some additional resources. These and other links related to lighting can be found on that resources page. Light levels for photographs in our collection are determined by our conservation staff. And factors that influence that decision include the process, exhibition history, duration of the exhibition, and signs of deterioration occurring in the photograph. While there are multiple factors that influence light level recommendations, if you don't have a photography conservator on staff reviewing each individual object, and if you're struggling to determine light levels, these guidelines from the Smithsonian are a really helpful starting point for determining light levels based on the photographic process. Ideally, when you're working on lighting, you can have one person taking light level readings while the other person adjusts the amount of light. In this case, we are lighting a silver gelatin print. And while technically the light level recommendations for this process would have allowed us to go as high as 90 lux. Because of some visible deterioration in some areas of the print, we decided to light it lower at about 70 lux. There are processes or formats that don't easily fit into those light level recommendations, including ones that require transmitted light or more intense light sources to be able to see the image as it was intended. We have one exhibition that included stan hopes, litman plates, and a megalethoscope slide that all fell into this category of photographic objects that are especially difficult to light. The solution, since there was only so low we could go with the intensity of light while still allowing the image to be visible, was to limit the duration of light through both motion sensors on timers and buttons which would only trigger the transmitted light source for as long as a visitor was looking at the object. With hands with extraordinarily high traffic. This may still expose the object to too much light, but in our case, it dropped the light exposure to a fraction of what it would have been without time sensors and switches. Another way to limit light exposure without reducing light intensity is to use a curtain. We can use curtains for early salted paper prints, since these are especially sensitive to light exposure, but they could in theory be used on any photograph where light exposure is a concern, particularly if it will be displayed for prolonged period of time. Some objects are too light sensitive even for these lighting methods. A possible alternative for these objects is to use reproductions. This is a reproduction of an album of photogenic drawings at the Met. Photogenic drawings are extremely sensitive to light, both photogenic drawings and processes like autochromes are so sensitive that reproductions or exhibition surrogates are really the best option. In other cases, the original objects might not be that highly sensitive but the display may be very long term. Now as part of our museum, we have family photographs that are more or less on permanent display and are even picked up and passed around on tours by docent's when they're telling the story of George Eastman's life. In this case, it makes sense to use reproductions rather than the original photographs so that the originals can be preserved. Other times we use reproductions as graphic elements, murals and on didactic panels. We also use them in areas with food like in our cafe which is pictured on the left. We use an adhesive fabric material to create inkjet prints and then trim and adhere the prints directly to the wall. We have fortunately never had issues with it leaving adhesive residue on the wall so it's a good option for temporary displays. Another reason for creating reproductions is if you have a negative in your collection but you don't have a print. I worked from some exhibition surrogate projects I worked on while I was an employee at Chicago albumen works, where one of their areas of expertise is digitizing negatives and producing prints in historically accurate processes such as platinum prints from Edwin Hill, Lincoln negatives on the bottom left and albumen prints from Matthew Brady negatives on the right. Exhibiting reproductions and surrogates can be controversial and it isn't embraced by all curators. If you display reproductions you need to be certain that you aren't violating any copyright laws. You should receive permission from living artists, and you should clearly mark or destroy exhibition surrogates so they can't be mistaken for original objects. They should also be clearly identified as reproductions on any labels or didactics. Once the exhibition is up, you unfortunately can't just forget about it. Monitoring and maintenance of the exhibition is critical to the preservation of the objects on display. Having a schedule and routine for gallery cleaning is a critical part of integrated pest management. We monitor sticky traps and replaces needed and also dust vacuum and clean surfaces weekly or more frequently if there's a pandemic. We also routinely check to make sure that there aren't any lighting or technology issues that need to be addressed. At our museum conservators monitor the temperature and humidity in the gallery spaces. They upload the environmental monitor data monthly and also check the environmental conditions several times a week. In addition to these monitors the temperature and relative humidity are monitored continuously through the building management system, which sends alarms if there are issues such as too much deviation from the set points. The environment should fall between 35 to 50% relative humidity, plus or minus 5% over 24 hours. Ideally, low temperature is best for the collection, but comfort for visitors is a consideration so we keep gallery temperatures around 70 degrees Fahrenheit or 21 Celsius. Gallery checks are also important to notice any potential structural issues such as leaks. If a leak is spotted while there's still just a small water stain on the ceiling, damage to photographs on display can be avoided. While the leak on the right was not a great situation to be in, it was spotted early enough to cover elements of the exhibition that were at risk and to remove works on display and redirect the flow of water until the roof could be fixed, which fortunately it was. Doing regular gallery checks and maintenance also gives you the chance to check on the objects on display. If lighting, environment and framing have all been done well, ideally you won't see any changes to photographs over the course of a temporary exhibition. However, changes do sometimes occur. We had a pretty dramatic change while this study by the artist Shan Goshorn was being exhibited. The mounting for the study had not been done at the museum, and unfortunately the adhesives used failed wall on display. She was actually spotted during a walkthrough by one of our security guards over the weekend. Fortunately, we were closed on Mondays and we were able to work with our conservator to upgrade the mounting of the study and have it back on display on Tuesday. While it had a happy ending and no damage was done, it was a reminder of just how important checking on the objects regularly is both for the preservation of the objects and for visitor experience. In conclusion, exhibiting photographs has the potential to compound existing preservation issues, but it can also be an opportunity to provide care and attention to objects in the collection. To preserve these ephemeral objects for future generations, it's important that we do the best we can with the resources that are available to us. I'd like to acknowledge and thank all of my preparation and conservation colleagues past and present for their guidance and contributions. It's been a privilege to learn from and with them, and to have the opportunity to pass some of that information along to all of you. So now can move on to questions. That was great Emily thank you. That was a huge amount of information you covered in a really good amount of time so thanks so much for doing that. And we're getting lots of compliments in the chat so you know you did a bang up job with the audience. I'm going to start going through some of the questions because we have had some rolling in I'm going to encourage our audience to go ahead and put some more questions if you'd like to in the Q&A because we have a nice good amount of time for question and answer which is wonderful. We were wondering you actually ended up covering this but one of the first questions that came in was can you discuss using magnets to mount so could you cover that a little bit more maybe rehash a little bit about what you discussed during the magnet section. Sure. Well the image that I showed inside of a frame was a tin type and because tin types, at least older tin types and less so contemporary tin types that are using an aluminum material, but older tin types are made on a Ferris material so they're attracted to magnets. In that case I used an inset magnet in the mounting board to attract the tin type to to that backing board. For the larger piece. There are actually like a whole lot of ways that you can use magnets for mounting. In that case, I think I was kind of describing that we used a cleat that had steel facing on it so that magnets would be attracted to it. There's there's some links to that talking more about magnetic mounting and there's this wonderful book that came out I think in 2019 that if you're interested in learning more about mounting this has been a wonderful resource on that topic. That's fabulous. I know magnets are like the secret weapon of so many things it feels like that you don't realize you look at anything hung or even just like some textile presentations and you'll be trying to figure out kind of how things are working and you're like magnets. So many great possibilities like my colleagues like to tease me that like my top three three things that I geek out over are like magnets, stereographs, and like gloves. So yeah I mean I'm sure there's a lot more things that I think out over but all good. Good things to geek out on that's for sure. Just real quick someone asked could you please repeat the name of the transparent material used to create the window for the RH indicator do you happen to remember that off the top of your head. Yes, it's a scale, which I think is spelled ESCAL. Perfect, thank you. Thanks for rolling in so should be good. This is interesting so this is wonderful talk have you incorporated more sustainable materials, or do you take into account the carbon footprint of materials you use that's obviously a big, you know topic of conversation right now within the community. Yeah, I am very concerned about that. In terms of the framing what when I started at our museum about eight years ago, there was not a lot of frame reuse that was happening. A little bit but sort of not consistently. And so switching to standardizing those frame sizes and profiles allowed a lot more reuse. And the frame manufacturer that we use uses North American hardwoods that at least in theory are a little more sustainably sourced I know there are a lot of friends that you can get that are manufactured in places where it's highly likely that those are rainforest woods that are being used so I'm very conscious of like the kind of wood that we use in our frames and trying to reuse those materials. In terms of the sealed package. I would say that it's, if we weren't reusing those that would be pretty. It would not be very environmentally friendly to be using all of those materials that don't degrade, you know they're they're archival so you don't want them to decree, but that also means that they be sitting in a landfill for a very, very long time. But by by doing reuse were able to use those backs that glazing again and again and again hopefully. So that's trying to reduce our impact on the environment when whenever possible. That's great thank you. Yeah, that was, it's like it's this is a bit of a bit of the new West type stuff right now with the sustainability trying to figure out what we can safely reuse. What can't be said you know all that kind of stuff is a real interesting kind of new world right now which I'm finding pretty fascinating in general. Um, so this is this is kind of a big question but I'm going to ask to narrow it down a little bit says the question is, could you please give a list of which prototypes are susceptible to which type of humidity and their effects that's like a big but let's say more which are the most sensitive to humidity changes so let's try to focus in a little bit on what that questions really kind of looking for so which of the photographic types do you think is the most susceptible to humidity change. Yeah, without a lot of them are susceptible and pretty much anything with an emulsion because the emulsion is expanding at a different rate, to some extent than like the base layer that it's on, you really end up with more planar distortions, something like for example an etching and I guess you could say like a photo gravure which sort of a photograph but it's a photo mechanical reproduction. But yeah a lot of photographs are just very sensitive to humidity. And while we're on the topic of books if you're wanting to find out more about that. Preservation a guide to the preventive conservation of photograph collections by Levadrine is a good resource for for more information on the topic of humidity's effect on photographs. Excellent. I have a couple of last suggestions for materials to make reproductions and how so you mentioned, you know, using reproductions which I, I completely agree I think there's a time and a place for reproductions like someone actually in the chat had mentioned that they have a gallery that people can't fit that is not under constant security so they tend to use reproductions in there which I was like that's a smart move right because that's just a way to do it. But when it comes to the actual making of reproductions how do you all kind of do those are what kind of materials do you use for that. And so I'm going to go back to the fairies. Our museum there hasn't been a ton of use of like reproductions in the original media. It's interesting. I mentioned litman plates which is like this really interesting early color photography process that's fairly rare, and our process historian at the time Nick Brandrith was making litman plates so when we had an exhibition we couldn't reproduce the one that we wanted to have in the collection, but he was able to make his own litman plates so that we could show what that process looked like because they need to be lit very brightly so. Yeah, I, there's just so many options whether you want to create an inkjet print is probably the most accessible way to create a reproduction but if you're either you have experienced staff in historic processes or you have room in to have something produced in the original process that it was made in. That's a really interesting possibility out there because I think that you pick up some information about an object from the process whether that's consciously or subconsciously. So being able to see of an image that would have been originally printed an album and as an album and print is really different than seeing it as an inkjet print that at least to me. Yeah, completely agree. I'm going back to the the ongoing question of just like what you're what do you use said can you please repeat the type of glove you mentioned to wear while handling frames. So they're nitrile palmed gloves and I think the brand that I've purchased is show if I'm correct but there are other brands that make them they're similar like you'll see. Gardening gloves or work gloves that are nitrile palms so they're like fabric with just the the the hand part dipped in nitrile. They're also nice because you can wash and reuse them I'll usually like wash them on cold and hang them to try to extend their life, but a little less waste that we're creating through disposable gloves as well by using those reproduced reusable gloves. All right, thank you. Yeah the glove thing keeps this the use of gloves in general keeps raising its head there was a big article in the, I think it was the New York Times about that a couple weeks ago about use of gloves and stuff though it seems to just keep popping up in our field which is interesting. Any recommendations for handheld light and or humidity readers what do you all use at the Eastman for that kind of information. That is more a question for our conservators I'm not usually the one who's purchasing like data loggers for temperature and humidity. I know that the ones that were using in the gallery are PEM to but I actually just the other day learned that I think those are no longer available. So I think that that we've also used like onset data loggers. So that's another company to look into. Yeah, there's a bunch out there so we've actually had some there's been some webinars and some resources put it up on the Connecting to Collections Connecting to collections.org website on that, or you could also post that question in the community we can't endorse any particular brand over the other but it's always interesting to see kind of what the community is using right now for both of those materials. What is the best way to display glass plate negatives in your experience. It depends somewhat on the condition of the negative, because if it's if you have evidence that it's deteriorating, you may want to consider doing a reproduction rather than the original plate because to really see those well it's best to be able to backlight them and in the talk I talked some about like, since things are being lit more brightly when you're backlighting that having things on motion sensors and timers or buttons to reduce the amount of overall light helps to just prevent it from being exposed What we have used in the past, when we're lighting something from behind our LED light panels like this one. And this one, I probably shouldn't be like endorsing individual companies that I think there are you know multiple companies out there that produce things like this but this is a loony sheet which is made by evil light. So that's one that's worked well for us in the past. Perfect. In that same vein, can you give any tips on displaying the always stumble over this word in my life. The stereotypes, the reflectivity of the surface we have found particularly hard to display as of years have to be at the right angle to the object in order to see it. Yeah, difficult to display. In the best case scenario you're able to really have a high level of control of the lighting in the space. It helps to have like darker walls, even a darker ceiling if that's possible, and really tight spots on those objects from kind of an angle. And that way you're getting less ambient light in the room so you're getting less of a reflection from the person standing in front of it or from what's going on in the room behind it. So the darker you can make the space overall and the tighter the spot and kind of having that spot from a little bit of an angle can help someone lighting to gear types but they, they are extremely difficult to light. So I can't say what's the bad side of it is that there's a really, I like saying this in real life even though I stumble over the word. We use projector spotlights when we're lighting those, which make it so that you can really like focus and close down the light to be pretty tight on the object. And this is interesting. Are there any cases where a photograph was to be exhibited so as both sides could be seen. Have you ever seen something like that in real life. We had an an intaglio print I think that we showed both sides and we had sort of like a case that was really really really narrow case. So acrylic on both sides of it and kind of like was trying to remember the details which is sort of somehow mounted to the acrylic so that you could walk around and see both sides you see that often with paintings. Where the frame has been sort of inset into a wall with acrylic, the back so that you're able to see the back of the painting so it's possible to do just kind of tricky. Yeah, but it sometimes there's some good information on the backs of things you know not even meaning to so that I could see why that could be a challenge sometimes. Another nice option with that is sometimes we'll make a digital image of the information that's on the back and reproduce that on the didactic panel. So that people can can see what the back looks like without having to physically figure out a way to show both front and back. I like that idea. I've also seen this was more on objects but I worked at a place where there was something on the back of a textile and so we ended up setting up the exhibit folks set up a set of mirrors. So it wasn't perfect but at least the mirrors kind of gave you a reflection of kind of what was going on behind it. She was really interesting to see. And there is that image I had of postcards so those were like photographic postcards that had writing on the back and so you can have in a case where you're able to walk around the case and just have it mounted on something that's clear. I like that. I have an interesting question that says do you have any recommendations on how these practices can be scaled for smaller institutions with a budget and staff limitations. Are there a few of the techniques discussed today that you would consider to be the most important. Venetian is if an institution can't follow all of the best practices and that's been a topic lately is you know sometimes just within budget staff everything this question or said you kind of go like okay obviously you're going to do the best you can but what would you think should folks focus on most when looking at those limitations. I think a good place to start is with how it's matted because I just it that's sort of the closest most intimate thing to the object so that's really where there's a lot of potential for harm to an object and it doesn't break the bank to to use a paper corner and you know an archival paper corner versus like a bad style of photo corner. So that's I think like where I would recommend starting as trying to increase how archival reframed objects are in many cases it doesn't cost that much more to to mountain in a way that isn't harming the object versus mountain away that does harm the object it's just that the time and the experience. That makes sense completely. I'm actually going back to the photo quarters questions someone said could you elaborate further and why you don't recommend using poly photo corners what kind of paper do you use for your paper corners. So with the poly corners it's a pressure sensitive adhesive, and that adhesive is behind the object. So when you slide the corner on and position it you have to kind of press down to get that pressure sensitive adhesive to be activated and you don't want to. I mean I suppose you could like carefully tack it down and then try and remove the object but then you're trying to like bend the object out of that corner to burnish down on the corner. So it. It's just a little complicated because of that adhesive being behind the object for pressing it down. And I've also on a couple of occasions. You know what particular brand this was or anything like that but seen where where the corners were seemed it wasn't seemed well enough. And so the seam didn't have the strength that needed and the seam of the plastic failed. The if that seam is, you know, well, well done. And if you can kind of like gently burnish the adhesive I'm not saying that like absolutely never ever use them if they're if they're your best option. There are maybe unique cases where they might be the best option so it's really case by case but the paper corners there's some instructions on making the kind of it full back. So we're usually using perma like paper for our corners. And then using film a plastish linen tape for adhering the corners to the backing board. Perfect. Um, someone wanted you to mention the book on magnets again so could you hold up the book. So they can see that. Excellent. Thank you. Appreciate that. Um, I'm trying to hit like one works right 159 so someone did ask real quick do we have access to the webinar recording yes you will I'm going to probably post it within a few days it'll be on the FAIC YouTube channel and also our website. Connecting to collections.org. I also put a link to the resources and the survey for today's webinar in the chat so if you guys could do that that would be appreciated. And someone mentioned the magnet book is in the resource list so thank you for doing that so that I think that's the most popular resource for today's talk which is great. Um, I think, looking at these will do this one do you have any advice and handling and showing holography holography, H-O-L-O-G-R-A-P-H-Y. I don't think I've had a holograph that we've exhibited yet, but I think it would, it would depend I don't think that they have any like particular lighting requirements so. Yeah I think I'd have to see the object in person to know exactly what I'd recommend like in terms like how thick it is or yeah new one for me but maybe someday I'll have one come in. I didn't mean to stump you on the last question let me see if I can find one more. This is in any way can you clean photographs is there a safe way to clean photographs would you think, or would that be more you think a collections person's question or what do you guys handle on the exhibit side of the house when it comes to cleaning. Well, they, when they come into prep they are sometimes dusty and the surfaces of photographs are so easily damaged, mostly to remove dust we use one of these little rocket puffers. And then if you have something that's like a little bit more clinging but you can tell would be possible to remove just like taking a really soft brush not like wiping down a whole surface but trying to just target some area and gently lift dust that maybe isn't coming off just with the rocket blower, but any kind of more invasive cleaning we would leave for a conservator to do. Well, I'm going to go ahead it's a little after two so I'm going to go ahead and wrap up today's program I'm I still have questions that get to be answered and what I'll do is I'll get those over to Emily to take a look at because we can pull the report from zoom. But I would also encourage you all to reach out to me at C to CC at cultural heritage.org with questions and I can see about getting them over to Emily as well for follow up. Just huge thank you. This was huge and it was really useful and you said a lot of really good information and I'm seeing lots of little clappy and hard about she's coming up right now so you know the audience enjoyed it. Do you have any last words you'd like to say to the audience real quick before we sign off today. Go to lots of photography exhibitions because that's where I feel like I learned so much and not just photography exhibitions but exhibitions generally I just feel like I'm always learning from seeing and trying and staying curious about techniques that other people are using and. Yeah, don't don't be discouraged if you're limited on resources and staff, you know just do the best with what you can because any amount that you can do is better than not doing anything so yeah good luck out there. At this point, thank you for closing with that. Well thank you to you Emily thank you to IMLS who supports this program thanks to FAIC. We will be back next month and just actually a couple weeks with care of Judaica so I would encourage you to register for that webinar and keep an eye out for that may day programming as well. Complete our survey and if you have any questions just shoot me an email over at c2cc at cultural heritage.org. Thanks again Emily everyone stay safe and we'll see you in just a few weeks. Bye bye.