 So Michael, before we look ahead to the Dr. McKenna Cup, you've got your dairy jersey on you, were you a bit disappointed with the result the last night? I was, you know, from the simple point of view that dairy did so much right in the first half, but as you saw yourself, just the concession of those two goals just left them with a mountain to climb. And sort of the general summary of the McKenna Cup was that dairy have come on so much in the last two years, you know, in terms of progress and the fact that probably Rory Gallar's first game against Monaghan in 2020 or December 19, they didn't look like beating Monaghan. And two years later, they were disappointed that they didn't and I suppose that shows the level of ambition and sort of excitement there is with football in the county at the moment. Yeah, so you were excited then ahead of the league in the championship this year in the Oakley County? I certainly am, you know, Rory, as he said at the end of his interview the other night, he is going with youth and it's probably a good way to go. But, you know, you're trying to get to the level of Adonis Gallar and Monaghan that have established players and established teams. And that's just where you have to get to. And it doesn't happen overnight, but a decent start. Yeah, would you make Adonis Gallar the last night and what do you make overall in their McKenna Cup performance now as they head to the final? I'd say they'll be happy enough to win it and to get another game. They're probably not that happy with their performance. You know, you take the two goals out of it and there wasn't much in it, but they still needed Murphy. I said to Charlie, you know, on air, I says, you know, I'm surprised that he's playing in the McKenna Cup. And I suppose there's that feeling where Michael wants to play every game, but they actually needed him. You know, we won a couple of kickouts and he stopped the derri attack one time when they were trying to go through the middle and they were wasteful. You know, they kicked, I think it was six first half wades by my count. And, you know, I think Derri outscored them three points to 0 in the end of the game, so they didn't push on. I'm sure Donny Gallar's focus is on one thing only, and that's the championship. They'll be disappointed last year losing to Tarone, saying Tarone going to 1-0 Ireland. So I'm sure Declan Bonner and Stephen Ratsford and Paddy Campbell and all the background team, I think the championship will probably be their sole focus. Yeah, but from a Donny Gall point of view, no one Derri knows too that not to look too much into the McKenna Cup. It's just about getting the legs right and getting game time into players. But Declan Bonner will be very much welcome that they're going to get another game before next week because there's nothing better than trying to get that match sharpness. Definitely. So like a lot of people use the statement, it's only the McKenna Cup. It's the case here that you can only win three competitions in a year, and that's one of them. It didn't do Trood any harm whenever they were sort of building the team. So games definitely, and I think Declan's used 31 players I think so far, and 15 of them have started at least two games. You'll correct me if I'm wrong. I think from last year's championship, Q McFadden, Steve McMenham, Big Neal McGee and Owen McCue maybe missing. I'm not sure if there's anybody else. So they have probably most of what they're going to have on their sort of roster for the McKenna Cup. Yeah, there's going to be a couple of more players missing this weekend as well. It looks like Jamie Brennan set them us out with that injury that they picked up early in the match. And Michael Langen is among the players that's seen as a doubt too. So Declan Bonner will be calling on his students again, the LYT players that are playing colleges football at the moment back in on Saturday, Michael. Hi, you know, the colleges football is definitely, it's a very busy time of the year. Like there's something, I can't remember the names off hand, but like last week there was players playing for the county and then turning out for their college in the same day. That stuff's just crazy. Well, Jack McKelvie, Jack McKelvie is an example of that. The played for Donegal on Tuesday night, the new Connell player who you watched. And then last night he lined out for UCD on Wednesday night in the Sigerson. Two games in 24 hours. There's always been this talk about player welfare. Where does that come in to the bracket of player welfare, Michael? I think that's wrong. Every manager will have their own way of looking at things. But I think you have to look at the player and realize like, you know, Jack McKelvie is just, you know, he's come in here. He's probably trying to make an impression. But he was not better playing for his college and going back to Donegal when he's ready. Or if you make a decision, look, I'm not going to play for my college because I'm trying to break into the county. That's a hard thing to do but for a young player to turn down the chance of playing in Sigerson, whether it was his college or senior football, or even the other side of that is turning down senior football to play for Sigerson because that player might get the opportunity again, Michael. Yeah, look, there's Austin McWilliams. I'm not sure the circumstances have been too late on, Swicky, but he's with Queens. And he didn't play with Queens, but he played on Tuesday night for Derry. I honestly don't know what the circumstances were. I don't know. But like, Austin McWilliams is probably a player who, he's been a plus in the McKenna Cup. And he's probably looking at it and thinking, look, Rory made a statement that he knows 13 of us starting 15. He's maybe thinking, am I going to be one of the other two? So he's a decision to make. The difficult thing with Sigerson is, in a lot of cases, there's scholarships. Maybe you have to play for the uni. There's that element as well. It comes back down to the fixture congestion, but in the middle of fixture congestion, it comes down to man management and, you know, just not having players playing like that because where do injuries come from? Like, remember, what do you call the guy, Keeney, from Four Masters? Yeah, look, Keeney. Look, Keeney, like his story. You know, where did that come from? Just years and years of games. And, you know, it's very hard as a young player to say, you know, because all you want to do is play. You want to want to play with your mates and you want to bring them to the senior team. But maybe that's where, like these massive management teams that people have now, maybe there needs to be a welfare officer that says, I'm sorry, but you can't or a fizzy or something. But you can be lucky and not get injured. But by and large, it probably catches up eventually. Well, we're in the thick of it at the moment between Colleges and McKenna Cup. And Donegal were due to play Monaghan in the McKenna Cup in 2019. And if we recall, Donegal actually pulled out of the competition. It was through the semifinal stage of Michael. And one of the reasons was player welfare because there were so many players involved with Michael Murphy's L-Y-I-T. And there were so many players that were out injured that Declan Motor just didn't have a squad to fulfill the fixture. But he has a squad this weekend against Monaghan. Monaghan last week, or on Tuesday night rather, probably put out their strongest squad of the year and beaten Armaa in the McKenna Cup semifinal. And they won it in penalties. I'll ask you about the penalties for us, Michael, because should they be still ending Gaelic football matches with penalties? I don't think so. That's my honest opinion. It just doesn't feel right, does it? It just doesn't sit well. It doesn't sit well. And it was always of the opinion that it's unfair to decide a game on the night. For the simple reason that somebody has to lose in difficult circumstances. I was at a game in the flesh. Banner had lost to Muller Horne in an Ulster Club semifinal. Now, Banner had never been an Ulster before. And they lost on free kicks. And there's a young fellow named Niall Muir who missed the last free. And he was excellent all year for them. And that was cruel. Jamar Hall all night is the same. But I'm starting to think that you probably do need to decide games on the night because of fixture congestion like we just spoke about. So I think you probably needed some sort of a plan B. What's the alternative then? What's the alternative in your head? Well, I don't know how we would go about getting this through at Congress. I don't know if I can make a proposal and look for a seconder. But at the end of the day, young Muir and Jamar Hall, they were the villains. They missed their chance. Now, a McKenna Cup game probably wouldn't cost them a thought. But Banner missed out on the chance to win an Ulster Club championship because of free kicks. I think you have to have a scenario where you're making a hero from somebody. And hear me out here. Maybe you have a scenario where you have a 1v1 or 2v2 duel. So say, for example, the other night, Monaghan and Arma had three chances to score. So the ball was thrown to an Arma player and they did 2 on 2 and you had to score a point. And then it was Monaghan get the ball the next time. So instead of getting a penalty, you get possession. So it was 2v2. And you imagine, like, say, you had Nadine McGee and Steve McManum and up against Connor McManus and Jack McCarran. And you see who scores. And then you pick a different two players or whatever. Whatever way you do it, it's complicated. But the bottom line is the person who makes the block to one sudden death sort of element is every much a hero as somebody who scores a penalty. Like, when you think about World Cup 90, the first two names going to my head are Pacquie Bonner and Daniel Tomas. A penalty saved and the guy who misses. And that's me growing up and that jumps out at me from World Cup 90. So I think you have to have a scenario where you have a skill element to it. Like, you can't keep playing 10 minutes and 10 minutes until the lights go out. You know, but it's complicated. But I think that's something that maybe needs to be looked at. Like, it would promote defending. It would promote decision making. It would promote taking a man on. And it would bring entertainment. It would be a lot easier sold than a penalty shootout, anyway. I think it would be, you know, again, for example, say it was Darian Tarone and Ulster Jamber this year. And it was Brenton Rogers and Potty McGrill against, I don't know, two-to-one pairs and Potty McGrill going to mix a block. And Darian goes through the next round of Ulster. He's a hero. He makes a block. You know, and the person who's blocked down, whatever, say it's Connor Maynard, say he's blocked down. Some difference in being blocked down and missing a penalty. It's more to do with the coaching of the game. And again, I used to be anti-finish on the night, but that rules out replays. It's interesting thinking. I don't know if you can get a seconder from that somewhere. Tell you what, Michael, you can start the ball rolling on Darian and let us know how you're getting on. We'll see if we can get you a seconder or somebody's going to do a third and a fourth on it from over on this side. But yeah, certainly interesting thoughts on how it's an alternative to the penalty shootout. Back to Mona and I said that there were full strength. There were near enough full strength the last day against Arma. We expect Mona and the line-up pretty much the same again as full strength as they can be, because they're playing in Healy Park. And don't they start their league at Healy Park the following weekend? Yeah, well, that's probably a good way to get a game there. The guy I think, Connor McMahon, is the only person who hasn't hit the mechanic up, you know, from their main man. So what better chance to get playing at Healy Park to know it's a different opposition? Still a cup up for grabs. You know, I think the Tuesday mechanic up thing probably stuck on everybody's throat. Whereas now, Gunny Gaul and Monaham have from Saturday until the following week to prepare for the league. You know, and Jamie Brennan's injured and Connor McCluskey's injured and that's unfortunate, but you've got a week to prepare. I think it's excellent preparation. It definitely is, you know, for both teams. And Declan Bonner and Bante can look at their pages and think, who have we got? Who can we not afford to play? Who needs game time? Who played well? Like, for example, say Mark Kern, for example. We'll put him in against Jack McCarr. See how he shapes up. Jack McCarr insisted a corner forward. We'll throw Mark Kern on him and just see. What better way have you to test players? So that's the value of the mechanic up and that's the value of Saturday for these counties. Who are you tipping to one on Saturday? Who do you think is going to come through it? Well, we get a glyph in the other day. I went for, I went for Gunny Gaul if he can sharpen up their shooting from the other night, but making predictions in the mechanic up is a complete lottery. We get them wrong anyway, but at least in the mechanic up, we can roll out an excuse that it's a lottery because it depends on selection. But probably Gunny Gaul have more improvement to do and they won't be happy with Tuesday night. Like I'd say Rory Gallar deep down is probably happier than Declan Bonner this week. So it depends how much of a sting that brings in and it's back to your point, Oshene, about the colleges it depends who's in and who's out. But Gunny Gaul probably. We'll not roll out penalties, will we? It's possible. We'll maybe have to go to watch it to see. TG Keahar could be interested in viewing on Saturday evening to see if, I don't know what way we Martin Cubes fix their comedy penalties. We'll be looking forward to it. We'll be able to wing it so we won't. There's a moving away now from the football. There is, of course, two important hurling games on this weekend. Both Derry Clubs, give your Derry a shirt on you. Slok Neil taking on Balli Gunnar in the senior semi-final. And Banna Herb are heading to the air dome to play Kill Mali of Kerry. What's the chances of the two Derry Clubs then this weekend, Michael? Well, they're both up against it. There's no doubt about it. Balli Gunnar and Slok Neil are coming from different, they're coming from obviously the Monster and Ulster champions. But they're pretty similar in terms of what they've done in their own county. Slok Neil have won nine championships in a row. Balli Gunnar have won eight in Waterford. They're both up against it. There's no doubt about it. Balli Gunnar have won eight in Waterford in a row. And I think a 4.1 margin as close as anybody's got to them in a final. So they're pretty much dominant. And a lot of those finals, they won easy. They've clocked up. I think there's a score on average of 3-17. And they're across their three Monster games. And they're pretty impressive against Kill Mali. So Slok Neil knew exactly what they face. Slok Neil themselves were excellent against the Loi. Once they settled, they completely controlled the game and probably never looked at losing against Balli Cran. They've had a layoff. Whereas Balli Gunnar have got that other game just sitting perfectly for them. So that's where the counties come from. Balli Gunnar have won three Monster championships. Slok Neil have won four Ulster. But Balli Gunnar have neither. They're in final. Speaking to Karmic Udahari and reading Michael McShane as well. That's the goal. They've got that wee bit better. They took a pace from Kula. They're very good for long spells against the Pearson. There was that game against Balli Healer. Slowly getting better. But this is a really tough test. And Desi Hutchison came back from soccer. And he's been brilliant for Balli Gunnar all through the championship. He's probably the play, I think. He's probably the Brenton Rodgers of Balli Gunnar. So both are exciting and both are match winners. Slok Neil definitely won't They'll get a lot closer than a lot of teams have so far to them. My worry is that Desi Hutchison will just have wee bit more attack on flare. I hope I'm wrong. Because I'm obviously a Slok Neil man and they've been progressing really well. Big, big test. I hope I'm wrong. I'll just swing it for Balli Gunnar. OK. What about Bannerhurst chances against the Kerry side? Don't know an awful lot about Kilmoyle. I know they have a few county players from Kerry. Their man is John Mailer who has a long stance in the game. He's been down there quite a bit. He was on a podcast one time where he says he goes there a lot of time to chill out from Hurlin. And he's in charge of them. He's been scoring heavily for them. They play with a sweeper. Dougie Fitzell places a sweeper and from talking to Bannerhurst during the week Ryan Lynch they're sort of aware of that and they're trying to sort of suss out how the best to go about that. Bannerhurst probably don't score enough by the rolling admission. They haven't scored enough. Their defense and goalkeeper have been very, very solid. And they've been getting goals from the competition. And they have never won Ulster until this year. But there has never been an Ulster team in the final of this competition to the best of my knowledge. I think they've been proven wrong and Bannerhurst have to overcome that. But I'm not going to be very popular in Ulster this week. I'm probably going to go for Kilmoyle. Are you popular in Undead? Will you never mind this weekend Michael? I don't know enough about Kilmoyle but the four or five players that played in the QA teams that were knocking around Joe McDonald so that's the challenge that Bannerhurst have. Okay listen Michael, it's always good to see you. Good to talk to you. And we'll see how the football goes. Enjoy the action over the weekend. Thanks for joining us today.