 Next question is from Coach Carruthers. What were some of the resources you read or studied that had an impact on your current programs? Oh my gosh, you know, so here's the thing. We, MAPS Anabolic, I created, what was it? Back in what, 2013? 13, okay. And then, you know, MAPS Performance and Aesthetic and Split and so on, all the other programs we all created together. What went into writing those programs? Decades of experience between all of us. So you're looking at, you know, 60 years of experience. If we don't even count Doug, you can throw in another 20 years on top of it. With all the studies and all the certifications. With studies, certifications, with reading, with training, so many different clients and training ourselves, that's what went into the programs. So if I listed all the stuff that I read. But not only that, like I know where this person is going like with this, like, oh, you know, you guys, the way you have your frequency or the choices of exercises, like what studies led to that. And it wasn't a study that led to any one of those single decisions. It's a culmination. It's concepts. Yes. I think it's all these concepts that we were exposed to. We tried with our clients. We saw successes by doing certain methods that we learned and gone through certification courses and things. And we're like, I really like this for this specific reason. And so I would take certain types of, you know, mobility moves and be like, this is going to be a great assessment. And so I would, you know, look at things like that as I was going through these courses. So yesterday I get a DM from someone. So I guess Mike Matthews, a good friend of ours, right? Owns the Supplement Company Legion, also writes some good fitness books. Knows his stuff. Mike Matthews is one of the better, I'd say fitness authorities that there are today. But Mike Matthews interviewed, what's his name? Menohelmensman? I don't know how to say his name. Big body bowler guy? No, this guy does lots of studies and training people for a long time. He was on his podcast and the debate was full body workouts versus body part splits. Now we know Mike Matthews, a big fan of body part splits. Menoh is full body. And if you ask a lot of coaches and trainers who've trained a lot of people over a long period of time, they say full body. So I get this DM and he's like, you know, I love Mike and I love you and you guys are so smart. But, you know, Mike, he leans more towards splits and why does he do that when you guys are always talking about full body? And I said, look, I said, Mike is extremely knowledgeable, very smart. The guy reads everything and he knows how to disseminate it and break down the studies and pick what is actually working and what's not working. Now we've done that as well, but we also combine that with lots of experience, training lots and lots and lots of people and that's why we get the best way we have our opinion. There's a behavioral component in all of our decisions. When I think about the core. At the end of the day, it's what works. When I think of the core principles of the programming that we've done, like obviously all the research around periodization. So if you read all the research around periodization, you'll get the understanding of why we phase the workouts. If you read all the research on the exercises that are the most valuable, the biggest bang for your buck to show the most results, everything from CNS to building muscle to burning fat to burning calories, you'll see why we picked all the exercises. Just the core of all of our programs. And then after that, then we have taken an account, then frequency would be another one, right? All the studies that are around frequency Tempo, volume. Those to me are like the really good as far as the research is there. Then after that, then we all sit here and we go back and forth on what we've seen. And we take an account. So some study might say, oh, this is the best for this. But then we go, well, wait a second. How many of the clients did you ever train stuck to that for longer than two weeks? That never works. Right, exactly. And how do those flow together in the workout? Because everything written on paper is completely different than actually applying it in person, watching somebody go through it. Yeah, I'll make a silly example. Let's say a study comes out tomorrow and it says, cardio at 4 a.m. Fasted for 45 minutes, burned 15% more fat than cardio at any other time of the day. Then you'd get the research junkies who come out and be like, this is how you should do cardio. This is what I prescribe. 45 minutes at 4 a.m. Because here's what the study said. Me as a trainer is going to say, don't do that. I've never had any client that's ever done 45 minutes of cardio at 4 a.m. every single day. Forever. It just doesn't work. Right, they're not going to do it forever. Yeah, so it's not worth the 15% because you're going to get 0% because you're never going to do it. That's a silly example that I made it very clear. Another good example is what you're talking about with the body part split versus the full body argument. We talk about it at Nauseum on this podcast. And it's because the reality of it is nobody ever trains like a perfect study does, where you don't miss anything, you go perfect, you measure the volume, everything's all, no, everybody, very few people are doing that. Most people are going how they feel. Most people have shit that happens. They get sick. They miss a day. And so you have to factor all that in and consistency with whatever they're going to do is really important. So if you have somebody who's on a body part split and they're like 80% of the population who goes consistent for a couple of weeks or maybe in a couple of months and then falls off the wagon and comes back, what you end up finding out is over the course of months and years, somebody who follows a full body routine ends up hitting the muscle groups more frequently, which ends up giving them more results in the big picture, not just in a six-week study. And it's also this other factor that nobody ever considers, which is just the practice. The practice of the same exercise is over and over and getting good at them. That's why it makes them so effective, full body workouts do that. So I'm going to list certain books that have been more influential than others. Now, as a kid, I read all the magazines. When I say all, I literally, I mean, I had my first job that I was working with my dad at the age of 13 and then I got jobs at restaurants after that, washing dishes. And I literally subscribed to Ironman, Muscle and Fitness, Flex Magazine, Muscle Mag, Muscle Media 2000, and I think that's it. I had five Muscle Magazine subscriptions. So I read all of them all the time. Those had a lot of influence and although they were big pamphlets to sell supplements, essentially, there was some articles in there that were pretty smart. And so I did learn some stuff. Arnold Schwarzenegger's Encyclopedia of Bodybuilding. Very, very impactful because it literally listed all of the, definitely all of the free weight exercises for every body part. So I learned all the exercises that you could do with free weights at a very young age from that book because I was able to study it. Mike Menser's Heavy Duty was another book that had a huge impact, mainly because he positioned an argument which was, hey, if you do way less volume, do more intensity, you'll get the same results. Now, what he said wasn't 100% correct, but it did get me to question certain things and look at the way that I would design my workouts. Dinosaur Training was another book that I learned a lot from. And then Old Publications. I'm talking about Turn of the Century, first the strongman of the early 1900s, watching how they worked out. Gene Sandow and your Charles Atlases and all those. I was totally researching all that stuff too. I loved old strength journals and ways that, people did it back in the day before we had this surge of anabolic steroids and different ways of organizing the gym with machines. It's like, what did we used to do? And so I got into that. I got into Dr. Ed Thomas' work. He was really movement focused, Greg Cook, Eric Cressy, lots of the sports-specific type of trainers out there that put out really good information. So another one was Super Training by Mel Siff, which is where we finally got information about everything from Russian studies. And it's just stuff like that. If you look towards your interest, and so obviously I had an interest in movement and specifically in athletic pursuits. Another area that none of us mentioned right now that is taking into consideration all the programs is mobility and movement. So books like Supple Leopard or certifications like Ken Stretch or Aldoah or FRC, things like that are also taking into consideration one more program. Because it's not just about the X's and O's on everything. It's also about just learning to teach people to move better and all the deficiencies and dysfunction that we saw for all those years. So things like that are taking into consideration when we choose certain exercise or exercise order because we know the habits and behaviors of people. And here's what else is really cool is that, and I loved it when I met Adam and Justin because I had met two other fanatics about fitness that were similar to my level of fanaticism. They would look at some different things, but they studied it with the same level of passion. And so what you get is you get, sometimes people get stuck at just listening to advice from one type of strength athlete like bodybuilder or powerlifter or yoga expert. One thing that I did is, and I did this later on and it was so impactful, was I studied how powerlifters trained and then I studied how Olympic lifters trained and then I'd read about kettlebell type training and I'd read about martial arts and calisthenics type training. And all of this, you get all these nuggets of wisdom from these old forms of training. Powerlifting's been around for a long time. So is bodybuilding, so is Olympic lifting, kettlebell training even longer. You're gonna get aspects and things that you can learn from each of them apply to your training. So what you see in our programs is a culmination of, it's like our programs, and although all of them are designed for martial arts like for example maps, performance, build muscle, but move well. We like to use the ancient athlete as the avatar. But what you really have are the mixed martial arts of muscle building programs. We pick the best from each category and injected what works so well in each category. So what you end up with is a very well balanced body that builds muscle, avoids plateaus, and it feels phenomenal. I also feel like we broke down a lot of barriers that we saw. I remember this was a lot of the motivation on the podcast is to your point, Sal, about how we tend to gravitate towards one professional or one expert in a field, and then we marry that ideology. And then what the fitness space does is they separate everybody, and my way is better than your way, because that's what sells better. I'm trying to sell my ideas that my way of training or my modality is better than your modality, and just the three of us didn't subscribe to that belief. Because we had so much experience in all different aspects, we studied all different ways of training, we saw the value of all of it, and it wasn't like, oh, this guy's more right than that guy. It's like, no, they're all right in their own right, and there's something to take from all of those. And really, when you look at the entire collection of all the maps programs, they are. There's pieces of all of that in every one of those programs, because none of us subscribed to one ideology. Dude, it's like Bruce Lee was quite a bit of a philosopher when it came to martial arts, and he was one of the first martial artists to say, here's what Kung Fu does, and that's really well. And oh, look at the way the boxers dance in their footwork, and look how they use the jab, and look how wrestlers change levels and are able to control a fight on the ground, and look at submissions and leverage and all that stuff. And I mean, all of those things make you a really good fighter, right? So that's really the big thing that you want to take out of this. Even if your goal is just to build a lot of muscle, man, you don't think power lifters build muscle or Olympic lifters build muscle or kettlebell athletes build muscle. You don't think mobility helps you build muscle. All those things contribute to better performance and better results, and so studying all of those things, I think that's gone into each and every maps program.