 Good morning and welcome to Moments with Melinda. It's nice to have you with me today. For my guest today, I have Leslie Fry. Hi Leslie, how are you? I'm fine Melinda, how are you? I'm fine, I'm so glad that you agreed to join me and talk about your life and your career. But let me start by telling my viewers just who you are. Leslie Fry is a third generation Vermonter who was an award winning multimedia artist. Her work has been exhibited internationally in museums and galleries. Her public sculptures have been commissioned worldwide. Leslie Fry is one of the most celebrated and accomplished Vermont artists. And Leslie, I'm so pleased to have you with me here today. Thank you, I'm honored to be on your show and I've looked at some of your other interviews and this is great looking forward to. Well, you have a lot to share with my viewers. And I also want to share with folks that you and I are also good friends. We also go back in time and we're good friends. So Leslie, let's start at the beginning. Can you talk a little bit about your growing up in Vermont because you are a third generation Vermonter? Talk to us a little bit about that. Okay, if you're a Vermonter and you want to get technical, I was born in Montreal, which is where my father is from. My mother was from Barry, Vermont and she went to McGill and that's how she met my father. But they split up when I was three and she moved back to Vermont. So just get that little technicality out of the way. And yeah, I grew up in Stowe, looking at Mount Mansfield every day out the window of our living room. And of course, growing up in Stowe, part of phys ed in school was skiing every Friday for free and then on the weekends free. And so I grew up looking at mountains, skiing and hiking in mountains, like feeling them. And I mentioned that because over time when I was older and traveled to other places and really observed landscapes, I realized how important mountains have been to me as I think it's the reason I'm a sculptor. And by the way, I live in Winooski and right now F-35s are flying over. So I hope it's not too noisy and you can hear me okay. I can hear you perfectly. Now you're in your studio, right? You want me to keep talking about childhood or Stowe? I'd love to talk a little bit about your education and about growing up. And my next question was that I wanted to ask you, was at what point did you realize you wanted to be an artist? Okay, ever since I was a little girl and I think not to generalize too much about culture and so on, but the fact that I was a girl, even though I wasn't from a conservative family, nobody said boo, yeah, fine, be an artist. And plus I grew up, my father moved to New York, so he was the only one that ever put a negative on that, like how are you gonna make a living? Whereas my mother was a beatnik. And so growing up, she let us draw and paint all over the walls and stuff, you know. So yes, I always knew I wanted to be an artist and nobody ever said bad idea. And so I totally focused on that. And in school I was the class artist and all that stuff. And it's just been, I think until I graduated from high school and I was going to college, it's just been a definite in my life. And then a few times I've had a, hey, wait a minute, you never really tried anything else because you were so sure you were gonna be an artist. Let's explore dance, let's explore this, but no, it's stuck, I mean, that's it. But over the years I've also tried to not be a sculptor because it's so inconvenient unless you're independently wealthy. I mean, to make sculpture, especially if it can be, if it's gonna be outside the materials or storing it, if it's gonna be inside shipping it, trying to sell it. And so I've tried being a painter many times but again, nature calls or however you wanna put it, sculpture, and then I sort of relate that to the Vermont landscape and mountains. Mountains are big sculptures made by, by the glaciers. Well, you, yeah, but maybe something more spiritual too. Well, maybe so, that's very true, my friend. So yeah, we are a multimedia artist. So Leslie, who had the greatest impact on your life and the choices that you've made? Oh, wow, that could be many, but I will, as soon as you said that, what sprang to my mind. Oh, no, I'll mention two teachers. I was fortunate enough to go to the Putney School for two years and there was, you know, it was the Putney School, it was great, you know. They had a painting teacher and a sculpture teacher and the sculpture teacher was Robin Campbell and she was just really cool. And, you know, you'd just see her outside in all kinds of weather. She was a carver carving huge wooden sculptures and I was assigned, she was assigned to be my advisor and the first day I met her, you know, I met her in the sculpture studio and she was just, you know, she's not touchy-feely warm or anything. She's just, I lost you, Leslie, I lost you, you're back. Where did you lose me? You were talking about your art teacher, who was very cool. Okay, anyway, the first- She had a great influence on you. Yeah, she taught sculpture, Robin Campbell, I don't know where I got cut off, but anyway, so the first day I met her because she was my advisor, was in the sculpture studio and she was very tough and very brief and just said, here's my back room and there's a cot in there. If you ever need to cry, you know, come on over. And that was it, that was our meeting. And then fast forward to, I did high school in three years and then I went to UVM. And a lot of people in Vermont would be familiar with Paul Aschenbach and he was a great mentor to me and many others. And it really meant a lot to me. I was only, I started out at seven, probably by the time I was 18 or so, I had already taken a few courses with him and he said to me, you've got what it takes, which meant a lot. And so I'd say he was a huge influence and he was very hands-on, like, why don't you? I've tried carving stone, wood, I've done welding, I've done all the stuff and I'm a natural modeler. I like my hands to be in messy stuff, which then if you want it to be permanent, usually you have to cast it. And so he'd say things like, okay, you made this thing. Now make a plaster mold. Now run around to all the garages in town and ask them for the lead weights for balancing tires. This really dates me. So this is like the early 70s. No, first of all, no teacher would ever say this, like in other words, go melt some lead, you know, and pour it into this mold. And I still have some of those castings. Anyway, I'd say as far as teachers go, those two reinforced my life as a sculptor specifically. Now you talk about the importance of community in your life. Can you talk a little bit about that? Okay, I've always been single except for, this is gonna sound silly, except for numerous relationships, but one lasted about 10 years. And so, you know, didn't get married, didn't have kids, et cetera, et cetera. So I think that community as far as emotional support or when you break a bone or you're really sick and you're alone and also as an artist, the support I've received from living here has been like integral. I've lived in New York and London and Montreal as an adult at various times, but I kept coming back here and, oh, in Florida. And you know, I just, I'll never, yeah. And I'll just never be able to replace the long-term friendships and even people that I don't know that well. We all know who live in Vermont, what happens when you are stuck in the snow or a flood unfortunately happens and people come and they help and vice versa. Beautifully said. So you are a sculptor and you said that you make it with your body and you experience it with your body. Can you share with my viewers a little bit about that? Yeah, I mean, I like that in the beginning you said multimedia artists because yes, I work two-dimensionally, I've done videos, I've done performance art, I've done other stuff, but sculpture is my main passion. And I think a few things about sculpture, why? To me, it's the most real because you are actually, and when I say sculptor, I mean making objects because there are many brilliant sculptors who are just working with sound or just working with light and, you know, so on installation, it's, but to me a physical object is making some kind of reality whereas, and this isn't a put down of painting but a painting asks you to enter into this other world within this rectangle or whatever shape it is. Whereas to make a physical object, you have to use arms, hands depending how big it is your whole body, lifting, using materials that are real, figuring out how this thing is going to, like architecture structurally work and last and then you've made something that like a building or a landscape, someone has to experience with all their senses. They don't just look at it with their eyes, you know, and if it's what I like to do is to make things that can live outdoors and that are really, really permanent like cast and bronze. So you can also touch it, it's indestructible, you know, it's living with the elements and you experience it in the round and it might actually have a sound and it might have a scent. It depends where it is and what it's made out of and you experience it fully as opposed to just visually. So let's talk about the piece of work on Shelburne Road and for my viewers, if you drive down Shelburne Road and you're at the, where the TGA Max is, that development here, one of Leslie's installations is there. Talk about that installation because I bet you most of my viewers who are watching this have seen that and admired it and wondered about it. Yeah, okay. I created that, that was finished in 1999 and it's a public art project and I collaborated with a great architect, right in Shelburne, Stephen Schenker and, you know, it's a competition to get these things and we were semifinalists along with two others and there are a lot of things I could say but here, regarding public art, the usual trend is if you are creating something for a public space is what does that public space ask for? What does it need? Are you going with some history? Are you going with some visual or architectural element or how does it serve the people that circulate in that space if it is that kind of space? And, you know, this is Shelburne Road, it's on a shopping strip and we were just like, we decided to do the opposite, to create some kind of space that had nothing to do with the surroundings. And... Oops, I lost you there. Are you there? Are you there, Leslie? Shoot. There you are, you're back. You know, I have full bars, so I'm not sure. I do too, I don't know what's going on. Okay, but I wonder if something happens if I move too much and I should keep my hands. Nothing, that shouldn't have anything to do with it. It has to do with the heavens above or whatever, but don't you worry about that, you're back. So thank you for sharing that. And for my viewers, I've experienced, I know probably most of my viewers have, and let's move on to what are some of your... Oh, by the way, to my viewers, I would love you to go to www.leslifri.com and visit Leslie's website. You'll learn so much about Leslie and see her work, and it's a beautiful website, so I encourage you all to go visit her website. So Leslie, what are some of your most memorable projects? I mean, you have a piece behind you. And also you merge the female form a lot with birds. Can you talk a little bit about that? Yeah, I will. And I just wanna... I will, I wanna add on just a little bit when you asked me about the park on Shelburne Road. So we made a circular space with a sitting wall so people could be there, but the sculptures I made were what people call them gargoyles, but they're sphinxes. And just getting back to what you said, they're female figures that are part, well, they're sphinxes, but they have wings and they also have paws and the tall ones on the columns have tails that you don't see anymore because of all the vines. So they're, you know, my theme is transformation. And so like you say right behind me, there's, oh, and sphinxes are guardians. So the idea is that they're guarding the people in the space on Shelburne Road. Okay, and there's a bus stop there. So there's a reason. Behind me is a more recent sculpture called Arise and it's a bird woman in a positive form because some people think of harpies. And it's in mythology, they sort of menace and scare off people, bird women, but we don't know. That's not, the idea is this is a woman who can fly, okay? And so, and she's looking up, she's got boots on because she's from Vermont and she's also down to earth. But she's looking up and what the coolest part of her for me is because I love dealing with the relationship of sculptures and their pedestals or bases like very inspired by Brancusi, but in a different way. She's on this column and there are all these women, bird women who are flying. And they're like crazy sort of, you know, really flying. And they have on all different kinds of shoes like high heels or espadrilles or, you know, more boots, knee-high boots, stuff like that. So they're kind of like her subconscious or inspiration flying around and she's looking up about, hopefully about to fly off. And so that's to me, it's a very positive sculpture. And I made her in bronze so she can live outside and P.S. she's for sale. Wow. All right. So lesliefry.com, visit Leslie's website. So now your work has received international claim and it's an incredible list of accomplishments and awards. Leslie, how difficult was it to take your art and turn it into a business or not? Yeah, I don't even know if you call it a business. It's just like how to survive as an artist. Yes. I mean, like most, again, unless you've got money, like most artists, I've done a million jobs to support myself while trying to be an artist and teaching has been the most common route. But at various times, you know, I do adjunct teaching but I try to get commissions and so on. And then like many artists, I went for a tenure track position, which was in Florida and it was the worst job experience I've ever had. And so I left there and thought, now what? But I learned a lot being in Florida and one thing is they have lots of money for public art commission. So I thought, I'm really gonna focus on public art. And so that got me into more of a head of you seek out opportunities, you have to create proposals and drawings and models and learn how to write better, which is still a struggle for me. And get commissions, you know? And then I still do that, but I've also, I have an online shop, which is on my website for smaller sculptures and two-dimensional works of art. It's just, there was no decision to become a business. It's just how to survive, how to survive, how to pay the bills and do whatever, apply for grants. This past year I got a creation grant from the Vermont Arts Council. And yeah, it's just how do you survive? If you don't have a regular, like for instance, tenured position as a professor or some other like stable but job that doesn't totally drain you. Oh, and wait, I don't wanna add one more thing because younger artists go, oh my God, how do you do it, bubba bubba? And I said, listen, I hate to tell you this, but now that I'm old, which also means I've lost some physical strength, things got a little easier because the second I turned 62, social security, then at 65, Medicare. So I got, I get money per month plus the whole health insurance thing. I'm just getting down to details and brass tacks because it is damn hard to survive as an artist. And so things got a little easier simply because I got older, you know. Well, good for you. Thank you for sharing that. So I just wanna say that you have been reviewed by some of the most important art influencers in the country. And again, my viewers can see those accolades at lesliefry.com. Your art has been focused on feminist thinking, fairy tales, dreamlike, quirky, nature, human consciousness in the natural world. So let's move to your garden because you have sculptures in your garden. And my understanding is that your mother and your grandmother were really influencers on your love of gardening and flowers. Yeah, I think I must have said something about that somewhere. I don't know if they were, you know, it's sort of the opposite. Even though I grew up in Vermont and you know, shoveled cow shit and stuff like that, I'd look at my grandmother and my mother like bent over, you know, clawing at the earth and I'd go, why are they bothering? You know, I didn't love, no, I just love, I love flowers. And when I was a little girl, and this is like totally, I think, a definition of who I am. I do things rather intensely. I picked a pansy and I was just going, this is so beautiful. And I sniffed it really hard and it went up my nose and I had to go to the doctor and have it taken out because I do things intensely and I love flowers. But, you know, that's like going overboard. I don't know why I'm telling that. Well, because you, because you're so honest and open with the comic release. But anyway, a couple of tourists is what can I say? So Ken Picard highlighted you in his article, Body Works in seven days. And he said, quote, human-like sculptures that have one foot in the botanical world and another in ancient architecture. And then he goes on to describe your garden. Okay, okay, so I don't know, we're probably running out of time. So my life as an artist and a person totally changed when I became a homeowner, then, you know, so I lived, I've lived in the same place in Manuski now for 33 years. I bought it in 1999, in love with the place. But it was a duplex because I couldn't afford a mortgage by myself. There was a garage that was gonna be on my studio and extra bonus, a barn, and I wanted a big yard. And it was very plain. And I thought, well, I'm just gonna make it into this magical environment. Uh-oh, can you hear me? I can hear you, you're still there. Okay. And so the first thing I did is I planted a hedge around this big lot to start making it into a more private green room. And over all these years, you know, I've added sculptures and I've experimented with plantings integrated with sculptures. And my goal is that you will walk into this sculpture garden and not know what year you're in or where you are necessarily, that it's like this magic place. And so, I mean, when I bought the place, I didn't know I was gonna be doing this for 33 years. But yeah, that's my jam, yeah. It's beautiful, it's so beautiful. So now I wanna just let my viewers know that on September 28th of this year, you will be receiving the Governor's Award for Artistic Excellence. And the event is gonna be held at Main Street Landing. And I just wanna congratulate you because that's an extraordinary accolade that you can add to the many, many, many accolades that you've received in your career. Thank you, Melinda. Yeah, it's really an honor. And totally out of the blue, so out of the blue. But so well, well-deserved. It's really well-deserved. So I wanna talk a little bit about the current state of our planet for a moment. I know that you care deeply about our natural world. What do you see as the hope for our future on this warming planet? What's your hope? That's, I mean, well, my hope is what anybody would hope. It's more when I get stuck on that questions, what can we do now to radically change the way things are going? And I don't know the answer. I know that we have to keep having hope. And so for instance, that bird woman, I feel like she's hopeful. And not that she's gonna fly away from here, but that she's looking upwards at the sky and taking it all in. And that we have to just keep working towards making this a better planet against all the odds, all the entrenched habits, really. And people don't like to change. And big business, money, they don't wanna change anything. And somehow, I don't have any answers. I don't have any answers. But your work, but your work is transformational. And when you experience your work, it gives us all hope. Now, we do have a few more minutes left. And I wanna just touch on your dad, John Fry, because he passed away a few years ago and he had just authored his book, his fascinating book called Abandoned Foolish Scheme, which is something his father said to him when he was going off to do something very foolish. And he wrote this book at the end of his life. Now, you took on that project after he died to get it finished and published. And it is a must-read, Abandoned Foolish Scheme. I encourage, I've sent it out to so many of my friends to read it. Can you talk a little bit about taking on this project right after his passing, Leslie? Yeah, I really, okay. So the year my, okay. The Christmas before my dad turned 90, which was January 22nd, I'm terrible at remembering dates. Okay, anyway, he asked all of us, family, his granddaughters, my brother, my sister, me, to be there at Christmas. And he said, possibly for the first and last time. Okay, so we were all there. And then less than a month later, he had his 90th birthday and he and his wife went off to Puerto Rico to celebrate it. And the day before he left, he sent me an email and said, if anything, he worded it better, but he said, if anything happens to me, my book is on my computer and I want it published, like that's so easy. Cause I know he'd been trying for a few years to get an agent and so on. And I thought, yeah, nothing's gonna happen. And then they were out swimming and he had a heart attack and died while swimming, having a good time celebrating his birthday. And so naturally with that kind of a message and as a way to mourn and, you know, of course, so I got the manuscript and worked with Tina Christensen, a great book designer, and had it edited. And the book is about dying too. I mean, that's what the theme is. It's incredible. But it's also about all the adventures and risks he took. And even though as a parent, he was the parent who would say to me, why do you have to be an artist? You know, you never make any money, you know, get a real job, blah, blah, blah, blah. Yeah, well, if you look at his life, you know- He was an artist. He was a- He was a- Yeah, different, yeah. He almost died like a million times doing crazy things. So yeah, anyway, it was a tribute to him, but it was his creation. Just to get it out there. So not to promote Amazon, but if anybody's interested, you can get it there. Well, and I bet if they call Phoenix Books, our local bookstore, they could get it for you as well. Now, Leslie, we have run out of time. So I just wanna thank you today for your hat, for your time to share with my viewers your life, your career, your wisdom. And I love you and I respect you so much. And I look forward to your event on the 28th, September 28th at Main Street Landing to celebrate you and your lifelong work. And I wish you well, my friend, and I hope to see you soon. Okay, thank you very much. Really appreciate this. And to my viewers, thank you. Thank you for joining me with Leslie Frye. And again, go to her website, lesleyfrye.com, okay? And have a beautiful August day. Bye-bye.