 We're now going to start our last session of the expo's policy form and this last session is focused on storage energy storage EVs electrical vehicles and grid issues and one of the things again, I don't know whether How many of you have been in here for other sessions? But once again, it's really incredible in terms of thinking about how these are all Complementary strategies and technologies and that it's very very important for us to always think holistically and The vast number of solutions that truly are available as we work towards a clean energy Economy in this country. So first up, we're going to hear from Dennis McKinley Who is the director of North American wind power for ABB Dennis? Thank you Sound okay Couple points Got a colleague here that will hand has handouts available if you're interested in them Just raise your hand somewhere during the session here. She'll get a handout to you And also we've got a tabletop set out if you want to come out and talk to us a little bit more detail Guess we're starters. Thank you for giving us the opportunity to speak with you today Those of you that aren't familiar with ABB I'll start off with a little bit of background on the company vision for the United States and Specifically is how it relates to smart grid renewables energy efficiency and our energy future ABB is a global company with two primary areas of business power and automation. We employ approximately 140,000 people globally More than 20,000 here in the United States ABB and its predecessor firms have collectively supplied roughly two-thirds of the Equipment that makes up the high voltage transmission system in the United States In addition, we are also touted as the largest supplier of electric motors and Motor control devices known as drives throughout In the United States, we've got about a hundred locations 28 different states Major facilities that manufacture products. We also have corporate R&D based in Raleigh, North Carolina. Our corporate headquarters is based in Kerry, North Carolina Obviously, US is the largest market for ABB From an energy outlook perspective energy independence requires utilizing all generation sources plus energy efficiency and transmission distribution storage and end-use Reliable affordable sustainable energy is critical to US security and international competitiveness However, our aging power grid and our long industrial heritage of less deaths in trends with some infrastructure That's pretty outdated pretty archaic. It basically drains energy resources and threatens our environment There are technologies available that we have today that can help make that better The stress would be we need leaders that can push some of those changes that are required From a renewable energy standpoint every hour the earth absorbs more solar energy than the world's population consumes in a year And if you find a way to convert that solar energy into electrical energy carbon dioxide emissions can be reduced In addition wind technology is the most mature and most utility scale ready alternative of all the renewable solutions Though several challenges arise with these alternatives to traditional electricity generation Advanced technologies available today and in the near future will play a major role in more wind and solar energy penetration These renewable energy sources have assumed key roles in the future of the energy policy Talking a little bit about smart grid smart grid is one of the keys to improving efficiency and ensuring our energy future Unfortunately the concept of smart grid is a widely misunderstood Most public and media attention focuses on smart meters and they do enable things like time of use pricing and give the computer The consumer information needed to make better decisions about how and when they use energy But that's only part of the story Other smart grid technologies include wide area monitoring systems that can identify potential problems before they cause blackouts advanced transformers power cables and other so-called primary equipment a Challenge of remote locations of wind farms and transmitting electricity over long distances can be solved using technologies known as high voltage direct current And we've just recently opened up a manufacturing facility in Huntersville, North Carolina that actually manufactures HVAC and HVDC cables Approximately a hundred million dollar investment in that facility that will be able to help transmit or beef up the infrastructure in the United States The technologies improve the stability within the grid and they also provide the the ride-through capability during external faults and voltage lags and sags The other part with the high voltage DC technology as you can promote connect remote power generation sources like solar and wind power and Get them a little bit more efficiently transferred or transmitted out to the loader of the demand centers in the United States Industrial energy efficiency, which is a big push Tight budgets and environmental considerations and rising energy demand are all topics when the term energy efficiency is brought up Approximately 33% of global energy use is attributed to industry and industry electricity is largely consumed by large electric motors Which are the workhorses of modern industry then run machines fans pumps compressors conveyor belts and the list goes on Modern control solutions automation products and electrical equipment can run motors and other industrial equipment more productive productively and efficiently Energy efficiency makes up energy go further Curbs the emissions and is a path to meeting sustainability goals without added costs Saves money through productivity gains and waste reduction and allows the US to compete globally where utilities and industries are subsidized Overall, we need to do several things to be ready for the challenges ahead with our power needs combination of renewable energy Updated infrastructure that can transmit large quantities of power over greater distances like ABB's HVDC technology Smart grid implementation that will proactively manage the grid and reduce blackouts in downtime and focus on energy efficiency from everything from our homes to our businesses Given the current trends powers a critical component to success in the industries we serve such as Electric utilities oil and gas mining life sciences data centers, etc Really what we found is the best way to save energy is to be more official with how you use it. Thank you Well next here from Catherine Hamilton who is the policy director for the Electricity Storage Association and of course storage is really key to Making the providing much more resilience within the grid and many more options and can be a real game-changer Catherine Thanks. Thank you, and I hope during this speed dating round that you pick energy storage My name is Catherine Hamilton. I'm with the Electricity Storage Association We have almost 120 members. These are developers utilities suppliers entrepreneurs The technologies are represented are batteries of all chemistry types flywheels compressed air Pumpt hydro thermal storage like ice and heat storage So it's a big world out there for energy storage, and I'm going to address four questions. One is what is it? Where can we use it? Who does it help and how do we get more of it? So the first one what is it right now? Our power system is built such that when you generate electricity you have to use it immediately or it goes to ground So how can we capture that rather than just building more power plants to generate more electricity? How can we use better what we already produce? Well, we need warehouses for it and energy storage provides those warehouses essentially that is what it does it allows you to store Electricity and then use it when you need it and when the price is right and where you want it So where can we use it then energy storage applications are everywhere on the grid? They can be on the transmission side. They can be in community scale They can be backup for large commercial and industrial facilities and they can also be in residential applications Like with rooftop solar with battery backup, so they operate everywhere on the grid Who does energy storage help? Everyone it helps everybody on the grid. It is completely technology neutral the original plants and right now they're 98% of what's on the system right now is pumped hydro and Those were originally built to backup nuclear power plants for a peaking But we can it will take a charge a battery or a flywheel or any of these technologies will take a charge from anything on the grid Particularly useful for renewables or other dynamic resources on the grid But also helps the natural gas run a lot more efficiently so really helps every resource on the grid It also helps customers because there are no emissions You can you can use it when you need it when the price is better There's no environmental permitting needed with because there are no pipelines. There's no need to you know site it in a specific area You can site it in a basement of a building you can put it anywhere It allows the grid to become more resilient more flexible and allows for more distributed resources So it is pretty much the holy grail So why don't we have it everywhere? Why isn't it everywhere already on our grid? Now I don't know how many of you were here when Commissioner Norris was speaking, but he said something Totally correct, which is we need to recognize the value of all of these potential opportunities on technical technology to the grid and energy storage is one of those where We need to recognize the value so that we can build that into how much does it cost to provide services to the grid So let's think about all the different policy pieces because you all hopefully are policy people And I'm going to give a shameless plug plug for a bill in just a minute so first of all so on the the First part of the technology you need the R&D so Department of Energy the stimulus grants the RPE program Those are really helpful in getting new technologies built in being able to form Partnerships of the entrepreneurs with the utilities and really starting Testing demonstrating proving out these technologies that was terrific. That is one piece of the investment cycle What else do we need FERC so Chairman Norris was here Chairman Norris described the value that we need FERC has been enormously helpful in setting the appropriate policies on the energy markets because if you can Reward somebody for what they can do not reward them for the technology they have but reward Somebody for the service that they provide to the grid then suddenly the value increases enormously for opportunities like energy storage State public utility commissions really key as well So California PUC just made a ruling in the LA Basin not long ago that required 50 megawatts of capacity for storage Energy storage in the capacity market. Why not? This is great and this is a great way to show that it actually does provide Capacity similar to generation now on the Direct congressional policy side. There are a couple of bills that we really care about The most important is an investment tax credit for energy storage and it's HR 1465 for anybody who's a staffer your member should be a co-sponsor of this bill It is completely bipartisan and bicameral So we have a Senate version as well as 1030 and it provides an energy storage Investment tax credit so you have to bring private private investors to the table first before you can get your tax credit It is of limited cost So it has a limit to it and we feel like this is going to really change the game for energy storage and allow us to scale Other bills that we care about are the MLP parody act So that one again is bicameral and bipartisan and that allows energy storage companies to be able to organize their Corporations as master limited partnerships. That is also important It's separate from an investment tax credit, which is our number one priority But it's also important and then also provisions to adjust the R&D Tax credits so that they allow for pre-revenue companies to succeed and to be able to take advantage of tax credits because we think that You know so many of these entrepreneurs and these investors are really at the pre-revenue stage And yet we want to be able to have them take advantage of R&D credits So those are those are sort of our big our big pushes on the policy side and We hope that you all will ask us if you have any questions We have a booth outside electricity storage association and I have cards and you're welcome to call and ask any questions Thanks, Catherine. We're not going to look at another important piece of the technology Solution and For that we're going to hear from Duretta at Capra Rola who is the marketing manager for Fuji Electric Corporation of America Hi, everybody. My name is Duretta Capra Rola. I'm with Fuji Electric and for those of you who are not familiar with Fuji Electric We've been a global manufacturing leader since 1923 Our products range from the smallest IGBT to some of the world's largest power generation systems With engineering and R&D expertise in power electronics products It's no wonder that we had already sold over 300 electric vehicle charging stations worldwide when we entered the US market Since March of 2012 we've obtained UL certification on our 25 kilowatt DC quick charger And we've begun begun manufacturing the products right here in the US in Milpitas, California Manufacturing the products out in California allows us the flexibility We need to respond in shifts in market demand and design requirements here in the US Without shipping delays and long development lead times We're now able to focus on consumer awareness and education and are focusing our efforts on helping potential station owners Understand the business side of installing public charging stations Typical charging sessions last 20 to 30 minutes And we're helping them to understand how they can offer charging as a value-added service to their customers While also creating a recurring revenue stream for their business Studies have shown that approximately 70% of the oil consumed in the United States is used for transportation With our corporate headquarters for Fuji Electric located in Edison, New Jersey Those of us on the East Coast were smacked in the face with that reality in November of last year So some of you might remember that In the wake of Superstorm Sandy the East Coast and New Jersey in particular was crippled by the storm and the destruction It left behind Power outages stretched on for weeks in some areas and gas station lines resembled those from the 1973 oil crisis just a little bit before some of our times, but it existed At the storm in addition to showing just how powerful mother nature can be Also highlighted our extreme dependence on foreign oil and the need to diversify our fuel sources for transportation Even as power began to return to towns Gas stations remained out of service as they waited for deliveries that were delayed due to devastation at the ports This domino effect left a lasting impression and renewed statewide and nationwide discussions on alternative fuel types in the United States 94% of cars trucks ships and planes depend on oil Supporting the electrification of transportation is just one way of reducing this dependence on foreign oil According to the DOE there are approximately 12,000 Alternative fuel charging stations in the US with roughly half of those stations specific to electric vehicles as We begin to see an increase in the widespread adoption of EVs It stands to reason that we'll see an increase in the development of public infrastructure to support this growth Vehicle owners will continue to rely on residential chargers as their primary source of power But the development of publicly available stations is critical if we hope to achieve mass adoption Right now business owners and city officials can take advantage of federal and state incentives But what happens when these programs run their course? The EV industry must begin future preparations now to ensure that we can stand on our own when necessary and in order to achieve sustainability Owners of EV charging stations must be able to tap the potential revenue stream that public charging offers Although most station owners began offering the charging sessions as a complimentary service as a value add to their customers The costs associated with installation and ongoing operation must be offset by adapting a pay-per-use model In the meantime, it's imperative that the programs offering tax incentives for Infrastructure development are extended for a minimum of five years This stabilization of incentives will help in two ways by offering support during the long sales cycle of EV infrastructure Development and helping businesses justify the installation from a financial perspective We've seen such incentive programs for the gas industry and there must be a level playing field with the EV industry in order for it to thrive EV owners are willing to pay to charge their EVs so long as the price of their charging sessions does not exceed that of a trip to the gas station Paying a few dollars to top off their car. No problem By educating station owners on the pay-per-use model. We're positioning them and the industry for long-term success and sustainability Economically the EV industry can reinvigorate the declining manufacturing sector in the US It's estimated that manufacturing makes up 59% of the EV industry jobs These are high-tech jobs requiring skilled labor Exactly the kind of job growth we want to see brought back to our country This industry isn't just about getting people to buy EVs nor is it about getting them to sell getting us to sell more EV charging stations It's about changing the way our country looks at transportation Appealing to the business side of the industry will gain the support of key segments such as retail Hospitality parking lots municipalities and more We need to help them understand how this can be a viable addition to their business as much as these Professionals want to show their corporate social responsibility. They need to justify the cost of adding charging stations The more they understand about the EV industry the more they'll be willing to do to support its growth and development. Thank you Thank you and Doretta was telling me earlier that on the West Coast that most people when they Charge Do it for 20 to 30 minutes. It's sort of the same practice that you find with people with gasoline with with icy cars in terms of wanting to make sure that they haven't That they're not driving around with fumes, but instead want to make sure that they're You know filling up and that that it appears to be sort of the same sort of thing that's happening with regard to EVs Although they you fully charge within an hour, right? Which is really really interesting and good news We're now going to turn to Dan Arden who is with Eaton Cooper and he is going to be speaking on behalf of Neiman the National Electrical Manufacturers Association Good afternoon I'm Dan Arden. I'm from Eaton Cooper. I'm the product director for distribution automation Eaton is a member of the National Electrical Manufacturers Association. I'm here representing them Jim Creavy from Neiman is here So my thanks to Jim for the opportunity to get to talk to you about Volvar optimization not Neiman and its members have collaborated on an initiative to Advertise the benefits of over optimization. We've heard quite a bit about different technologies that can help green the grid Volvar optimization is one of those. So what I hope to convey to you is first of all, what is it? second of all, I'll talk about the opportunity and then I'll talk about the regulatory environment and and the need that we see Two incentive utilities to pursue volvar optimization So today electric utilities are required to deliver energy at your house at businesses at industrial Businesses as well Inside of a specific voltage range So if you're a geek like me and you go home and stick a Voltmeter inside of the electrical sockets at your house. I don't recommend it. It should be above 114 and below 126 so utilities today have deployed apparatus to make sure that the voltage at your house is inside of that specific range You think about it a typical distribution system has around 2,000 customers on a given feeder a utility with a million customers has 500 feeters or so there are four Devices that would be mounted on poles or inside of a distribution substation That helps guarantee that that voltage is inside of that range. So it's a 2,000 or so devices a fairly limited number of devices So what's full of our optimization? Volvar optimization is the use of an intelligent control locally at one of those 2,000 pieces of apparatus that leverages a communication network to monitor points in the distribution system And to make sure that the voltage stays inside of that voltage range. I'll come back to that later Let's let's shift a little bit over to a load Every appliance load well not every but there are certain types of load that are sensitive to voltage such that the amount of power that they consume is can be linearly or Or proportion proportional by the square of the voltage So if we inside of that voltage range if the voltage is at the lower end of the range It would reduce the amount of energy that that particular load consumes there are other types of loads that Are more efficient when they operate like a motor at a nameplate rating now those nameplate ratings are typically closer to the Lower end of that voltage range. So if we extrapolate those two particular points If if a utility deployed technology that would allow it to manage Voltage in its distribution system down closer to the lowered Lowered end of antsy standard range C84 one. That's what they're required to deliver They can there's a tremendous opportunity to reduce demand and energy in the distribution system Let's talk about the opportunity If we make an assumption that Through the reduction in voltage we can reduce demand by 1% We could reduce the amount of power that is used across the United States by 7600 megawatts that the Cost savings associated with that deferment in expenses around three point eight billion dollars if we price Saved capacity cost at around five hundred dollars per kilowatt hour. So those are conservative numbers But there's a real financial opportunity there if we translate it to energy The cost savings from energy is around one point eight billion dollars when you price it at $40 per megawatt hour now the two are not apples to apples There are certain types of load where if we reduce the voltage absolutely get both demand and energy savings the other types where What we're doing is shifting the peak. So if you've heard about demand response We can lower the peak and shift load to the elbows of the load curve if you will and and that's an important point while Utilities today operate and plan the electrical grid for peak power if we can reduce the peak consistently with technology we can allow them to plan for plan for a Targeted investment in technology okay in 2011 the National Association of Regulatory Commissioners excuse me is November of 2012 Issued well, I should first say that may rook is a body that represents all 50 public utilities commissions Regulatory bodies across the United States and all the states and and territories and they issued a resolution of support suggesting to those bodies to explore Mechanisms by which utilities could make a targeted investment in Volvar optimization technology to to to Achieve an operational objective as I described it reducing demand by reducing voltage and specifically noted in that that suggested that those utilities commissions should incent utilities to deploy in deploying that technology by regulatory cost recovery mechanisms In deploying that technology so if you think about that that the the important point of if in deploying that technology The utility would have to generate less power. They would have they would reduce the amount of pollutants greenhouse gases that they emit but What they make less money revenue decreases? So they need to be incented in some way to make a targeted investment in technology While it reduces a revenue source for them Okay, let's talk about the regulatory environment Today there are 20 states across the United States that have specifically drafted energy efficiency Regulations those regulations are not especially clear for the most part about their ability to About whether or not Volvar optimization qualifies as an energy efficiency Technology so that's an important thing now. There are some differences Ohio and North Carolina in particular just two examples Where the utilities commissions have? Qualified rate recovery mechanisms for the utilities in those states and have Define created a path such that those utilities can Incent it can invest in deployment of over our optimization Okay, so that that's important so Nima one of the things that we want to suggest to you all here as congressional staffers and Participants in policy making We support that new Nairu initiative So there is an appropriate role for federal guidance and support of those regulatory bodies in being clear about the qualification of volvar optimization for As an energy efficiency technology being clear about supporting Volvar optimum optimization with revenue recovery cost mechanisms such that utilities make a targeted investment in software communications and discrete controls To to reduce demand per some of those figures that I gave you earlier I think what representative Cardenas said in around lunchtime was Was a great point. I mean the best energy Saving strategy is using less energy. That's exactly what volvar optimization is targeted investment where we can reduce the amount of energy That is consumed across the United States Utilities have been trying the technology. There are case studies that are available if you wanted to go research Volvar optimization and conservation voltage reduction you can find material online The opportunity is real and persistent and appreciate your support in considering Regulation and policy making that can help Utilities make an investment of over our optimization. So thanks for your time Okay, thank you Dan and to wrap up our panel discussion is Gary Seaford Who is the business development executive for OSI and so we look forward to hearing about your technology? There's a layer of what microchip is how many of you are familiar with the fact that a microchip has to be able to sink in and out of the grid without exactly on the system? Tremendous numbers of facilities of campuses hospitals that say I have a microchip But the majority of them do not have the amount of generation that needs to be used for work. They don't have the instrumentation to monitor. They need to synchronize before they can't manage their limits If you don't know what you have really have no ability Well, that's really the message that has passed on today If you don't know what you have, you're not majoring in talking about the message If you can't make good decisions then you're not going to probably make good investments So now what we do know what it is There's some new technology that's been floating around And this new technology is making that better monitoring equipment Most of you have heard of WANs Why they're unmanageable And then the immune system is very accurate But they're continuing to tell you what that power system is for Now the nice thing about that is that we can actually use that To tell us what an health grid is Before the lights go out And help us meaning managers do a lot better So that we're better prepared when the system starts to go down Is that something to use? No And also, we already heard today from another analyst about energy storage You can use your monitoring system and your control system When you want to use storage versus what you want to use generation And that's one of the biggest changes we're going to see in the next few years And if I can make this change as well For our current legislation that would be to help incentivize the small line For grid loaders to slowly get campus based on this message How do we access those markets without looking like the utility Without looking like the entity that has all that investment behind it Which is really hard for those people to do that Another place to look at it is to manager and monitor all your loads Because what is load management? If I have a generation, I can basically take general manager But if I have load management, if I discreetly manage my load And monitor my load all the way down I can treat all of my loads that I'm managing and controlling a lot better As a negative generator, as a generation asset By reducing essentially negative load We don't do a good job of incentivizing from that Into a very good, high frequency, high speed, short return And our biggest problem with sprinkler driven grid is not Do we have not a generator spinning on the outside? How do we manage that first 10, 30, 90, 120 seconds When the grid gets a lot of trouble because they're very large And you don't have to have a scanner And address that last year with order 775 775 is an issue paid for performance And it targets that first one to two minutes And it allows you to put in very short term energy Investments in your system Which allow you to ride through and give your two generators And your governors and your systems time to come up And a lot to go back So there's a lot of value you can get from those pieces So when you go out and get your data Don't forget to grab your load Grab your input data and grab your output data But more importantly, you know exactly where you're at In your generation assets So feel free to take advantage of some of the things That some of the states are doing When you're from the life of the vehicle charging stations Within a couple of years Most of those will have to be bi-directional wires If I have an electric vehicle all over the U.S. working I have literally gigawatts of volume I can throw back in the grid for that one five minutes If I can do that and have an awareness of where it is And a knowledge of what the state of charge is By measuring that I can manage So I have a lot of opportunities going forward That we don't have today But one thing doesn't do everything All I'm trying to do is basically give you the idea that If you measure and if you manage That we can all move forward with less less reserve Which works a good deal We're going to have a higher percentage of renewables We're going to have a higher percentage of variable loads We're going to have a lower percentage of very large plants That we're shutting down They call it the end of the year We're bringing a lot of small generation assets on And they have completely different time constants As the future systems come on behind People need to be able to know exactly What their long-term capabilities are Because those are the ways they can get forward So storage, better control Knowing exactly what we can give us But it's full of time to do that You can just turn things back to the 10th, 15th, 30th, 7th That helps a good recovery So can we set a logic? Can we measure? Can we monitor? Can we control better? How do we look at it? And with that all set down We're going to have some kind of questions Turn the microphone on You turn it off Okay, it's on now So as I was saying, everything is connected And our last panel has made that abundantly clear We do have a little bit of time for any questions or comments Does anybody want to take advantage of having all these great people here? Shirley, you're not tired Or go ahead Great presentation stage We hear a lot of the technologies and regulations And that sort of thing I think we want to take a shot at speaking to how consumers are benefiting We talked about great efficiency But how are we to make the argument to consumers That technologies that your companies are offering Are good for that economically Who wants to start? Specifically, it's pretty easy with our organization When a client runs at its nameplate rating There are some published studies out there It will increase the lifespan of the appliance I've seen one of these where Matility said If they manage their voltage at the customer meter Closer to 115 Which is typically the nameplate rating of a motor Like in a refrigerator in a house You'll get about a 15% increase in the lifespan of that appliance So that's one example in particular to you So the eventual house with solar PV on the roof And you're connected to the bridge And you have a power outage So it's going to be great if your solar panel Is actually going to provide you electricity But the way it's set up, they usually can't So having a battery backup will allow a consumer To understand that if there's an allergy They'll be able to write off a little while Or at least keep their refrigerator or other key things running On the grid side, when you look at What is a battery on a grid That's providing services to the grid To want to do for the consumer Well, what would it be if we had to get To build an entirely new power plant That gets built into the grid base And the consumer's grid is still off So the difference in the cost is significant In doing something that actually The larger manager of grid better First time you build a new power plant Next, pass it on to the consumer So on CBB built and opened up A smart grid center of our system In Kensington State campus, Centennial campus Basically it's a great show place For what a smart grid is or could be Great consumer interest in that Basically you can use software And hardware technologies available today Proactively monitor the grid What's going on with the grid Look for potential outages coming your way Divert power and things like that And also get the operational data Back out there and you have to do a loss And get the power up a little bit more quickly Versus people running down with big bulls And bravers today So that's definitely a consumer's best interest To make sure that they've always got power So from the infrastructure perspective It's a pretty direct benefit To the end user and to the consumer As EV owners, you know As mass adoption increases For electric vehicles in the United States We're going to see a greater rise In the need for the infrastructure To support that growth, right? So as people purchase electric vehicles The first question is other than in my garage At night am I going to be able to charge this And leave the house Or am I going to have to stay within a 40 mile radius Or risk running out on the side of the road So you really see a direct benefit With the development of publicly available Charging stations for the consumer As the EV owner So that they can again drive with confidence And know that regardless of whether They're running errands or taking a trip With their family, there will be charging stations Available along the way to support their travels The most important thing that we see We provide the historian database That most utilities use is that As utilities know more and more about their loads Their forecasts, their abilities They can run lower and lower reserves And still meet their reliability requirements Anytime you have less reserves online Less spending reserves Less investment going into future generation All that reduces the amount of cost That goes into the kilowatt that everybody spends From a long term perspective Of being in the power industry What it really does is it slows down The rate increase because in general Utilities are trying very hard To keep their rates down They're very conscious of that And if you can help them Help them reduce investments To optimize, to run better To have good historical trends To have good estimating tools All those features help those utilities Keep their costs down And if the costs stay down It's a slower rate increase And we all love to pay our electric bill Higher higher every year, don't we? I guess a question that I have is In terms of thinking about PUCs overall And obviously there's huge variation Among PUCs across the country Just as there is among utilities And so I was just curious in terms of As you kind of look at PUCs And you look at utilities Is there overall a really great interest In investing in these kinds of tools Or putting these tools in place If it also looks like There's going to be a reduction In the sale of kilowatt hours The Volgar perspective It just depends On each particular utility commission So Maryland recently In the last 12 months I didn't mention when I talked That they issued an act That said they'll shell go do Volgar optimization So we haven't seen that In other states And other utilities could be So it really depends It depends on which body There are particular areas In the adopted technology You know, sooner than others But there's no Atlantic I would say to how that happens Which means looking at some of those And using those to then sort of Skip ahead to other states Or utilities Okay, any other questions or comments? Sure, over here? Probably against smart meters I'd like to I guess fortify my Oppositions for that group Because I don't see that It's necessarily being Consumement Certainly not on the environmental Campus But I'd like to put up On why smart meters Are important And agree with that state Who wants to answer? Okay, go ahead, Chris Smart meters are the first Of many improvements Loosely termed in the Smart grid arena, right? But what a smart meter Essentially does is Allows the utility number one To read the meter more efficiently At a lower cost So they have a lower cost of operating Which reduces the cost Of power delivered Second, it allows that utility Or that industry That's providing the Management of that system A better feel for the Actual voltage And the actual performance Of their system Within their system real time And if you think of The term of Sandy We had talked about Sandy earlier It would have been very nice To have had a robust Smart metering system in place Because then the utilities Would have known exactly Which houses were being Impacted exactly which times Which allows them then To do a better job Of outage management Outage recovery Outage planning There's a lot of positives That come from having The smart meters But is a smart meter A smart grid And I think sometimes We get confused over Smart grid versus smart meters Smart meters are just A very good tool That does something We've always had And the information They provide is really The same information It's always been available It's just at a higher Resolution And why is that important? If I'm a utility Or I'm a power Plant producer Giving power to the system I need to know when That power is coming And if I can use Smart meters to fine Tune how that power Is being used regionally I can pick my Assets better I can pick my Generation better I can use the Right generation At the right time Without spending a lot Of extra money Long ways to win Bringing it in over The power lines I can also balance That against some Local storage And again That goes back to The EV world It'll be a Short time period Before we're using EV batteries And other localized storage To really help And the smart meters Provide the information To the planning people So that they can Properly locate Those assets For the next Phase of the smart grid I would just Echo what Gary said Simple use case How many people When their power Goes out Immediately calls The utility Okay If you don't have A smart meter The utility has No idea that Your power Is out For the bulk Of the number of Outages Because they're usually On a small scale Tree falls down And takes out The particular phase That you are Your house Is being Powerful So the first thing That has deployment Is smart meters With smart meters They're getting Last gas For notification Indicating that The powers There's The bulk Of the outages That occur Not sandy like Trees falling down It's a benefit For you directly Because utility Knows That your power Is out And you can Automatically route A crew To drive To what is The likely Location of the Outage I guess Thank you To our panel. Lots of information. Please feel free To follow up With everybody. And thank you For being a part Of this whole Forum and Expo. Thanks.