 So the agenda is very clear, pardon the pun, clearing as it exists today, the scale and scope of clearing and the challenges and the proposed solutions and some anatomy of a use case and then the solution which will be presented by money. And we are not talking about some pie-in-the-sky stuff here, money is actually building stuff and is almost, you know, 40 to 80 percent, I mean about 80 percent complete with that. So we are not in discussion or POC stages, okay? So going back to the presentation, it's about processes to control risk, legal and other kind of risk. Can you hear me? Yeah, yeah. Is it clear? Okay. Because I just got a message saying my internet connection is unstable. So we're going through all kinds of problems. Messages, of course messages consist of electronic messages, acknowledgments, everybody maintains their own infrastructure and so on. And the payments, so the first A, B, C and D, maybe A and B concerns trading itself and these clearing is a post-trader activity. So in payments and settlements because clearing payments, settlements can be operated through one entity and the settlement activity can be done through RTGS, a real-time gross settlement which is immediate and irrevocable and it uses central bank money. Deferred net netting settlement or called DNS is basically a way to bunch of trades and then settle and net the trades and settle them. It addresses one of the major problems with RTGS. RTGS is immediate settlement. So if you're doing bilateral settlement immediately all the time, the liquidity, it is the safest form meaning you've traded, you've settled, gone. But the liquidity needs, the liquidity which is one of the most important parameters for survivability is highest in RTGS. That means in deferred netting and settlement for example in DTCC about 200 million transactions per day are netted down to 1 million transactions per day. So that means it is going to be just about 0.5% of the transactions. I mean in terms of raw volume, it reduces to that. That means all of the opposing trades are canceled or netted together and then you get to a point where you only have to do 1 million transactions per day. But it introduces another risk which is because of the delay, it obviously means that positions remain unsettled for two days, for most, D plus two for most and it also introduces a pause in the system. We'll go through this in slightly more detail later and then there's hybrid which is a way to introduce a liquidity saving mechanism into the settlement process so that we can save liquidity and cut down on the risk. So how does the CCP operate? Can you go to the next slide please, money? So the CCP which is a central counterparty is a buyer to every seller and seller to every buyer which means they are interposing themselves between the buyer and the seller and it is done legally through UCC and through the fact that they maintain the books and they can just do a book transfer. So no physical transfer of anything, it is all maintained in a dematerialized form. That means it is no longer paper certificates or anything like that. It just gets switched in the books of of DDCC for example in the US and in other locations other CCP's operate. Sometimes the settlement authority, the custodian, all of these are different and of course even here custody is handled by big banks. The risk management is through margins and pool collateral and the default risk is shared. That means if one party defaults then it doesn't cause a collapse of the system but the systemic risk is still present in the form of the DDCC itself because they take money collateral from everybody in order to manage that risk. They do have an intermediate mark to market which is what the Robin Hood saga exposes. That means you deposit a certain amount of money with the DDCC and if your intraday exposure exceeds that due to mark to market then you have to post additional collateral. That is the, that's what happened. So even though you're settling in two days time they keep DDCC keeps a running tally of what your exposure is and if your exposure rises suddenly any dealer or counterparty has to post extra collateral. Anyway, so the diagram below exhibits what is there. Basically everybody interacts through the financial market infrastructure FMI A here which is basically the central counterparty. Next slide please. So here more complex central counterparty interactions are preserved here are shown here also from the same reference that I took. Here multiple CCP's in the same jurisdiction interacting with other FMI's in the other jurisdictions. Next slide please. So what are the challenges we all we already kind of went through some of them but the long of the settlement cycle and delay increases the risk. Obviously it also increases the compression that means that like for example 200 to 1 compression you're able to get by netting. If we were to increase the settlement cycle to one month which used to be the case before the netting site netting increases I mean the netting efficiency increases a lot. Obviously you cannot have 24-7 trading because you have to pause for the deferred net settlement. You have to pause all activity so that everything can be tallyed up, totaled up and netted in order to do this. So you cannot have 24-7 trading if you have DNS. And the third one which is obviously because of the unforeseen effects there can be regulatory capital calls in the middle of the heavy trading or volatile trading and the fourth is the books and records are not timely. Two days you know things are in flight and plus because of omnibus accounting, omnibus accounting meaning nobody owns these shares except the DTCC. DTCC is the omnibus account. We only have at you know at a distance claims to what is on the omnibus account. So DTCC I mean I'm using DTCC as an example it can apply to other countries where similar structures exist. So this is a big problem. The beneficial ownership records of not being accurate is a big problem because of two things. One is who do you pay dividends to? Dividends are paid as of the record date to the beneficial owner. The other is how do you find beneficial owners who are proscribed meaning they are due to some terrorism watch list or something. Some beneficial owners are on a proscribed list, a banned list and you you have to be able to detect that and not even trade with them. And all of these things are managed in cycles so there is no immediate or ambient regulation and this is a big problem because after the trade is complete after everything is complete you may discover that you know one of the parties is on the proscribed list. This is all because of the way in which the books and records are settled periodically and also the way in which KYC, AML and CDD tests are done in what could be called you know huge time periods, huge time lags meaning one year and so on. Next slide please. This is just an illustration of the number of the value of securities held by the various corporations by the various CCPs. On the leftmost square is the value of securities held in the middle is the value of the delivery instructions which is the flow through the system. So you can see it's $80 trillion held by the Fedwire security services in the US and that is mostly because of government securities, treasuries, GSCs and so on. DTC holds between $40 and $60 trillion and so on and so forth. The value of delivery instructions is around $600 trillion for the Euro clear bank and it progressively goes down. So the value of delivery instructions is the flow through the system, the total flow in a year, the value of securities held is how much is held on an average day during the year. So you can see these CCPs handle enormous, enormous quantities of money. I mean assets worth enormous quantities of money, daily flow through DTC is in the order of you know the 200 million transactions is somewhere around three times GDP, just a single day. So they are obviously very important and centralized points of failure in the system. Next slide please and with this I pass on you know after the next slide. This is calls for change due to what happened in Robinhood which stopped trading and stopped the short squeeze of GME by stopping buying of securities but not the selling and this is due to inter-day margin calls and as the system is designed to work from DTC to Robinhood they had to come up with one and a half billion dollars just like that. Otherwise they would not be allowed, they would be cut off. So anyway now I gave over to money, I'm sorry I think I've taken too much time in the beginning. Money is going to lead you to the rest and can we see if anyone has any questions before we jump into the next? Yeah sure anybody has questions or is it to abstract and abstract? All right maybe you know we can take up the questions and I'll try to make it everything short. So we at OTC Digital have been at this problem of bringing decentralization to institutional digital asset space. I've been working on for the past few years working towards standards you know looking at the processes and how this whole process can be the risk that is now concentrated on a single entity, how it could be mitigated. So there's a lot of thought processes and work that you've been doing and so sometimes it comes in timely as to what happened with the GameStop and Robinhood highlights the issues of the current market infrastructure and you know what we are trying to do maybe alleviates or reduces the risk and you know let's go through that and you know I'm going to use a recent article, a white paper from Northern Trust that have given and indicated what is the current equity market structure to the left and what they expect to be the new ecosystem 2030 although you know that looks too futuristic. We think that the infrastructure that are necessary for all the blockchain are a decentralized network are already there and you would start seeing some solutions in 2021. I don't want to go through too much into this process, I've been a slightly gone through with all the intermediaries and why it takes you know days to settle our trades you know this is something that has been a legacy and everyone wants to keep their own pie and their own grip on the market infrastructure and that's why it's harder to transform. Whereas you know what the market is envisioning or looking forward is something of a ledger based solution where it can be decentralized to a large extent and the chances of failure or a single point failure you know are very very low in the new market structure. The most of the infrastructure that are required are already you know a lot of the blockchains in today's world are already addressing the core needs of the system. Now the regulators have you know clearly distinguished between crypto assets you know and securities transactions or securities management in the sense that they have a very clear prescription of the ownership and know your KYC, AML requirements and how settlement must be final and parties have acknowledged there's a whole host of you know a clarification statements from SEC, CFTC and you know and even other regulators worldwide had given their inputs on it. So based on which there are a lot of blockchain reports of custom blockchains are now emerging that addresses the specific requirements for securities processing. So you know this is the other side of it where I have been working on not only on the equity side we have done a lot of work on derivatives with a lot of different you know market participants over the past 15 years you could see that this is the other completely decentralized in a sense but still a lot of intermediaries holding the market structure and essentially are you know having a hold of the infrastructure and a lot of the market structure actually evolved based upon the 2008 market reforms things like credit hubs and execution venues, market server acting as an intermediary to provide trade confirmation a lot have evolved over the past I would say 10-12 years and the most important thing is of all is the CCP's and the SDR which keeps track of all the trades and in derivatives market is much much more complex you're talking about trades running from you know few months to 20-30 years the parties are mostly bilateral and there's a lot of credit risk and marketers and hence the regulators came up with margin and collateral we call it initial margin and variation margin but I don't want to go too far into it but just to give you an idea of the context between cash base settlement and derivatives base settlement the concept is the same where you have CCP's everybody's facing a CCP in a cleared you know in a clear context for derivatives but the mechanisms are a lot more complex and again these screens for another area where disinflation can help but it's a longer process and to an extent some of these post state processes are already being addressed through blockchains for example Axoni has done some work in this area for equity swaps and they're trying to you know push it through for other products as well so but as a comprehensive solution is still years away. Let's focus I'm going to take a simple example and highlight what happens in in the actual world this is maybe a very simple example but to highlight the fact that two parties trade a bunch of trades I'm not going to go to the details but to give an idea if a CCP is sitting in between these two parties and we use a deferred netting at the end of the day you would net all the trades and each party would settle the trades against the CCP and you know and then they move on to the next phase trades this process has been happening you know for the past 30 years the in real world it is not but in party 8 party b there are hundred you know 200 different broker dealers are involved and each one trades against each other the CCP maintains the books and records as we've been indicated before and they would settle with against each party independently and that's why you know you would have a collateral charge and maintaining this collateral is critical for the CCP's smooth function to the second half I'm just showing you what happened again a theoretical example of what happened given the fact that GameStop prices were all over the place about a week back or 10 days back and I'm giving you an example of what you know retail users coming in doing a lot of trades you know buying and holding I'm not talking about options here just simply we're talking about you know cash trades and what kind of you know collateral exposure or net or sorry gross exposure that created and hence this is just simply a few number of trades in reality Robin Hood racked up a quite a bit of trades in the process that ran into billions of collateral requirement and the fact that this is game in Bloomberg which said GTCC on January 28th you know had to up their overall collateral requirement from a normal 26 billion dollars on a day-to-day basis to a 33.5 billion is almost a 30% jump in collateral requirement that and this collateral calls were not just mostly against Robin Hood but other broker dealers were also involved this just shows what happens when you are holding and you know doing a deferred netting based upon a predefined or T plus 1 T plus 2 because of the fact that these cash has not settled for you know in a couple of days the credit that is building up in the system is quite comprehensive and it can really exasperate the overall market risk that's what you want to show and it would be interesting we are solving this problem again it's another example I'm showing you is what could happen in a decentralized creating between these two parties the critical point here is that is still they go through the netting exercise and they're settling but the settlement can be set up in such a way that two parties decide how frequently they want to settle so this settlement can happen every eight hours every day it's up to the parties and they could decide based upon the credit profile against each other they could settle much much more faster because when these trades are recorded and operated and managed by a blockchain it's a lot easier to do the the netting and settlement because the netting and settlement is only between these two parties and the settlement itself whether we use in CBDC stablecoin on the cash side and on the security side you know again whatever the underlying blockchain is they can all be done simultaneous in a matter of minutes between these two parties so they could the parties two parties decide you know and every eight hours they're going to settle their records against each other they could be completing their settlement in a matter of minutes and their credit exposure to each other is you know back to zero it's a very simple again in an example of a decentralized creating and this is something that we have been building the infrastructure for this for the past I would say three years plus a lot of it to do with digital data standards the challenge today I'll jump into the next slide to show you between all the different aspects of centralized market structure versus a decentralized but a regulated market structure is we touched upon the settlement duration again operational time this this is where it enables us to go 24 by 7 in a decentralized infrastructure the centralized market infrastructure one of the one of the classic while they do provide a large amount of netting and settlement they go by asset classes so that means if you take an example of a DTCC they have a separate infrastructure or a legal entity to handle equity separate one for fixed income separate for derivatives but in a in a decentralized fashion two parties can decide subject to regulation what other what asset classes they want to engage in and netting and settlement so while you you may not get the multilateral benefits from what a centralized infrastructure would provide you get a bilateral benefit in terms of multiple asset classes so it's it's not exactly in an you know an apples to apples or comparison but given the fact two parties can settle at their own pace reduces the credit risk and also improves trading between those parties particularly between a a bison and a sell side in a sell side always looks for their top tier perform performers and they would like to do as much trading as possible but the current infrastructure of t plus two if the buy side uses up their credit credit line with the sell side very in a very short order like what happened in January 28 they are cut out from trading further in a decentralized fashion you could since the session timing is let's say four hours eight hours whatever the whatever the defined timing is they could actually settle the whole trade some of between the buy side and sell side and then kick off the next session of trading that which means the credit utilization is much higher at the expense of a little bit of more higher liquidity and this is always going to be a balancing act between you know reducing your credit risk at the same time you know slightly increasing your liquidity exposure the very extreme is rtgs where you have zero credit risk but very high liquidity as we've been pointed out before and the other extreme is you know t plus x number of days where you have a higher credit risk but lower liquidity or higher the higher liquidity efficiencies the the other interesting point which we kind of ignore is the security this is a single point of failure given the fact that there are state actors you know really going after market infrastructure or national you know power electric infrastructures today watch stops from going after and disrupting as you know a single ccp from operating imagine the scenario what happens if if there is a hack into one of the ccps what kind of a market infrastructure disruption that would happen that's something that a decentralized marketplace can take care and and you know and and reduce that big risk that that's something that we don't see it until really when it happens and it happens it becomes that you know we market structure will start regulators will start simply saying why not we go to decentralization that's my prediction that you know we don't want it to happen but we can't keep it we can't keep praying that it would never happen so that's something very important to keep track of settlement currencies every ccp uses a national currency to settle here you had the parties can choose any combination of you know stable fiat cbdc whenever that appeared whenever that occurs and also interestingly enough you don't need a currency to settle because if you really look at the crypto world it could be a token i call them a token star versus token star is a bunch of tokens being exchanged between two parties and the tokens may not be any of the cbdc's because of the the trades and mobs so you really get a big advantage in how you would settle across multiple currencies i won't go through too far these are all the things that we know when we address address in our top now this is the new market structure that is evolving there are a blockchain that are what calls purposeful purposeful built blockchains that are coming up with on-chain confidential asset registry where the identity we are moving towards more of a identity based blockchains as opposed to today what we have in the crypto world which is address based blockchain and we really do we really do not know who's behind each address or essentially the wallet address we talk about whereas in the next generation of the blockchains i give an example of what polymath is coming up with and i'm sure that there are other we have seen other blockchain vendors also moving towards is more of an identity based blockchain where the parties have identities but the the symbols are the positions are the assets and the amounts are all fully encrypted which is not the case in today's you know erc20 or you know erc xyz token implementations where the address is is is you know you do not know the party behind the address but the quantity and the amounts are very visible which means through you know crypto forensics you can really find out who the person is then you are completely exposed in terms of your holdings in the current market structure whereas in the emerging digital asset or more securities market structure these things are completely encrypted only the parties get to know and also if you go further the permission layer enables that the issuer administrator and regulator may have full access to the all the entire asset registry because of either regulatory requirement or you know as an asset issuer you want to have full visibility um the parties themselves depending upon who are collaborating on for example an investor working with a a broker dealer and a custodian and a custodian in this case and an administrator may give only certain permissions to operate on all the assets that the investor holds and these assets are not visible to other parties and vice versa a broker dealer could be actually be working with his own sets of custodians and auditor but in reality the investor and broker dealer might execute it against each other on an exchange or a decentralized venue but eventually when they are settled these are all settled independently in independent data records within these asset registry um the you know if I here I've given you to to accommodate these implementation there are now zero knowledge proofs and homomorphic encryption that's for another day stock but those are all this being the technology behind the vendors are implementing to make this whole thing secure identifiable and also interestingly enough you get to other infrastructure requirements like KYC AML lockups settlement finality another interesting thing that happens is both the custodians who are engaged in settling this asset have the final say of accepting or the transfer itself because it needs both parties to accept the transaction as opposed to in the crypto world today you know if I know your address I can send my you know send any token to that address and you have no say over it which is what creates issues like airdrops and these problems are all mitigated you know in the the next generation technology any questions so far before I go to the last two you know couple of slides and then we can open up further for discussions uh money this is cute to hear so quick question are there any disadvantages to using such a decentralized structure well you know this is always the battle between centralized and decentralized right um the disadvantage of the sense this is a much more newer infrastructure it is going to be a little hard you know it takes a time to build it takes a time to build this infrastructure and create confidence but it is essentially you know the disadvantage if you really want to look at is the liquidity the liquidity provision like DTC says that you know for every hundred dollars of total uh or whatever if you do our RTGS settlement the netting benefits is significant because you're only going to put up four to five you know there was an article about four to eight dollars that's all actually you're going to settle whereas in a buy in a decentralized fashion you may not get that kind of an efficiency however you get much better through uh you know credit risks that means you get to trade a lot more with your clients which is much more important for the broker dealers that means they can they can serve much better to their clients that means more uh uh revenue opportunities but purely if you want to look at the big advantage of centralization is the liquidity provision and also also one more comment money has presented a bilateral netting situation but it's possible to enlarge that group to others towards recreating some form of centralized multilateral setting uh netting sorry uh through uh through this infrastructure but that that's much more complex in fact netting multilateral netting is a NP complete problem if so there are only empirical solutions um you know true multilateral netting which is a dynamic that means you know it adjusts to the pace of the market like let's say that you say it's two hours but when in terms of high volatility and high throughput the netting cycle strength to one hour whatever you know there there can be other other structures but for this we need a highly sophisticated program it's not just program trading now we are talking about program post settlement right so some of the solutions like confidential computing and there are solutions from vendors like R3 who are addressing that but that is still in research space today they're not they're still in alpha but yes the longer term it is possible to have multiple parties join together and then to increase the uh improve the liquidity uh but then you're giving up a little bit on the credit risk so it's always a balancing act and it is very possible uh that a bilateral netting exists as well as multilateral netting exists it's up to the market participants to decide what is beneficial to them and also I'd like to speak to the issue of anonymity and pseudonymity regarding uh transaction or activities on DFMI in opposition or in contradiction to the blockchain technology like money during the course of your presentation you actually mentioned the fact that okay transactions on the DFMI would actually happen and you will not know the uh the part is involved because of the anonymity of the DFMI for instance so in such a situation that becomes an issue because one of the value propositions of the DLT itself is the fact that it's it's kind of transparency accountability auditability traceability and the rest of them so yes my question really to uh get onto the brass tax it's the it's home the point is how is this actually addressed the question of pseudonymity or anonymity depending on where you're standing is it addressed in the DFMI ecosystem or atmosphere yeah so you do want anonymity because you do not want any of your competitors to know your holdings or the amount of holdings that's a big no no with with you know as a participant at the same time you want transparency and accountability that's things are all again this is all based upon what kind of permissions that the various participants have for example a regulator has full account you know full access to the money to the whole what he calls the asset registry I think we have to yeah we have to kind of step back a little bit uh and talk about this is not bitcoin this is not your normal stuff we are talking about something very specific which is polymath money for example is talking about polymath in this example anyway go ahead money sorry yeah right that's fine so the you do you do want a complete anonymity and confidentiality when it comes to the actual positions from the individual investors perspective or a broker-dealer perspective but you want full accessibility accountability irritability from all these let's call the regulators or administrators perspective and that's where the permissioning layer of these asset of asset registry is such a fine grained that each one gets what they need to expect so that you are addressing the the needs of each participants you know based upon you know the market condition so to a large extent you do not want in a particular in a security stance actually I definitely I'm an investor I do not want my investing position to be visible to any other market participants other than maybe my custodian that's it but you know for auditing purposes administrative purposes I make you special permissions to my administrator and auditor and definitely as I said the regulator will have full access to the entire registry so you are having a balancing act between complete confidentiality at the same time also addressing what's necessary for the market structure in terms of accountability did that address that or you know are you looking for more I mean oh sorry yeah let me just finish it up in another slide and then we can come back here yeah all right so yeah so this is again I don't want to go too far into it but what we are trying to say is that is we're not talking about another five six years the market structure and the infrastructure is all being built by various players you know we are we are actually building more on the capital markets infrastructure leading to issuance to trading the lot of the spots because we have experience in building uh dgcc platforms back for the past 20 years we have taken a lot of those things and you know are essentially rewired for the blockchain world the capital markets requires two parts to this one is the contract management which you know essentially tracks the trades these are all nothing but obligations or contracts and then at times a time of settlement netting and settlement you are actually going into a settlement platform like polychain or it could be any number of asset chains you want to be able to settle those things in those assets all you know within a matter of let's say minutes to achieve much more efficient netting and settlement gates so you know beyond that there are more interesting things coming in staking defy we don't have time for that today but that's where it goes we whatever happens in today's retail structure you know all those market structures now will be let's call it as cleaned up and then presented as a capital market structure in the in a more regulated environment and there are already vendors who are already looking at defy for capital markets very similar to what polymath is doing for cash security so we see a lot of infrastructure move now for addressing securities in this whole entire lifecycle of digital assets and this will then move on to you know lending and borrowing market structure then it goes into derivatives options so you are going to see a much much more market oriented approach and that looks very different from then from what we have the current market structure in terms of an equity option that are equity swaps and the digital option the digital swaps may look much different you know with that I'm you know I won't go into this we already went through this thing at the only last part I'm going to show which is the complex fees which is the settlement fees again I'm going to go a little bit faster here for lack of time these are two parties how do they settle net and settle essentially we maintain a contract network within these two parties and we provide all these services in our platform and these parties throughout the day you know build their trades trades a bunch of trades are essentially obligations or contracts however you want to call them and then at the time of the session we go through a netting process the netting can be you know we will talk about session netting but it could also be RTGS because if there are certain high value transactions you may want to do real-time raw settlement but you know if you make it simple these trades will then get netted to I simply I'm saying X versus Y these will be two assets and these assets are in two different networks for example so we have taken our retailer which we actually implemented as an open source in Hyperledge last year as one of the assets and then we are using you know CirclesUSDC which is a which is a stable coin on the public network and we demonstrate that how we can you know settle this thing between these two parties for a simplicity sake if party A is going to transfer as an X to party B it needs the wallet address and that's what we are showing you the party B sharing the wallet address securely to party A and party A goes through an approval process of essentially the custody process of and ensuring that this the payment matches the original contracts and once they are satisfied they would actually submit the transaction to the network get the transaction receipt forwarded back to your counterparty who could then go back and verify the transaction that it is what what party has party A had promises what she has delivered and vice versa for the you know USDC security so this is a bit of a more complex exercise but they are all happening in parallel so if they are exchanging you know a ton of you know large sets of assets through the day everything happens in parallel they can settle these things and across multiple networks in matter of minutes all depends upon whatever the delay in these assets or whatever the network delay imposed by these assets this is just to give you a very quick example of what a settlement happens and this is we've implemented we are demonstrating and this shows the fact that you can have a bilateral execution trading allocation netting settlement all can happen independently and that means you're talking about thousands of these you know independent parties settling amongst themselves in real time that means you are really creating a 24 by 7 market infrastructure I'll stop at this point so we don't have time to go further we'll leave it for more questions I mean it's a little it's a little much to yeah digest right digest but maybe we can have a you know we can break it down try to present a piecemeal sometimes but this is a quick overview in light of what has happened and what has affected all of us go ahead QT has just a quick question so this is great I mean thanks for this money and weapon my question was more from regulation perspective so how would regulation adapt to these decentralized models in the future I mean is someone currently looking at supporting these things or how is the regulatory guidance on these things regulators are writing papers every you know I've been writing papers for the last let's say five years now they're focusing on you know I mean they they haven't come to this but they're they're they're talking about let's say bilateral settlement or DVP but then they are aware of the liquidity needs of that particular situation so BIS has published papers on this other central banks project Jasper you know various projects have come up with these ideas but most of them seem to stop at implementing some kind of a DVP which is not the solution really because DVP starves people of liquidity and it would cause real problems so you got to have some something in between yeah just to add on that the SEC came up with so if I may ask that if I may ask that like in the DeFi space for instance you have the automated market maker right so it's an automated liquidity provision process in the DeFi space to address the question of liquidity and for that one okay go on go on well in DeFi space for example is run by over collateralization okay over collateralization that means 150 percent 200 percent of the asset has to be deposited right so liquidity is not addressed well the purpose of the AMM the automated market maker or automated market making process is to address the liquidity issue like for instance use the Uniswap decentralized exchange protocol it's how you have a liquidity process that is automated and you are instantly granted of access to liquidity if you transact on the Uniswap DEX protocol because generally in the crypto-economosphere there's a liquidity issue on decentralized exchanges compared to a centralized crypto exchange platform but maybe you can actually educate me for that when you said liquidity is not addressed well liquidity is addressed through over collateralization that is a problem because you're not using your money properly right I mean you're depositing 150 percent of your assets somewhere to get 100 percent value from it and this we are not talking about you know like capital market infrastructure right I mean this is yeah so we're in a capital market infrastructure there are there are you know exactly like Uniswap type of infrastructure is being developed but that's going to be very highly regulated and again this is another thing that SEC kind of guides everyone to say move away from RTGS instead because there's also bigger issue of what if you have like 20 exchanges all of them are doing RTGS that's not very good for the marketplace you really want decentralized execution but decentralized clearing that will bring you a lot of the liquidity and efficiency gains which you know the most 80s which all the today's crypto exchanges do not they all do RTGS which may work well for retail market but you know SEC is not happy about it that they are not interested in that kind of model and also regarding the question of regulation according to the UAML D5 European Union on Terminal and Dream Directive 5 that's actually a provision and this is a status law that for instance if I want to transfer to you bitcoin then you send me your public address and I use that to transfer it to you so there's a provision in that law that this is actually a EU-wide law anyway but then it's relevant for the purpose of understanding how to regulate the decentralized finance space generally so there's a requirement that the PII of a counterparty can actually be linked to the address for the purpose of identification and I think there is a good point on how to regulate the space this is addressing the question and I have one of the questions on this call thank you yeah unfortunately we have come up to the time similar laws exist or suggestions exist in fact they're going even further to source source of funds which is not just the wallet that you're transferring to or from but also the wallets that come from the outside to transfer and so on I mean they want KYC AML but the problem with that is who's going to who's going to keep this PII and what happens if there is a problem you know if there's an attack on that so all of these things are happening and we have to stop unfortunately and this we will continue this discussion mailing list other places and hopefully Marta and or Karen will send us the link to the YouTube live if we had the old you know if you have a YouTube live then we will publicize it on the next call next couple of calls and then we can see how the responses thank you all for attending and that'll be today unless you have something more to add money no that's a thing again thanks everyone for your time bye bye