 Yeah, so this is a training about branding and we are here today with Santiago and Johanna from, is it Johanna or Johanna? Johanna. Johanna. Johanna, make sure of the two. Johanna. Santis from Camp Jaguar-Siembra in Colombia and Johanna is from Sinal de Vale, which I was calling Sinal de Vale and I was saying it wrong in Brazil. And the two of them are selling products from their projects that are helping them finance their restoration work. So they are both here today to share the stories and the journeys of how those brands were created. And we will begin with Santi. So Santi take your way. So hello everyone, thank you very much for the invitation and for being here. As Ashley said, I'm from Colombia and we are working in a special site that is the Sierra Nevada de Santa Marta is the biggest coastal mountain by the sea in the world. And it's a really unique ecosystem because it goes from the ocean to the snow in only one place. It has all the thermal floors and it's said that it's the most irreplaceable biodiversity place in the world. When the conquests arrived, the indigenous communities that were living there went up into the mountain and they have been preserved for thousands of years, living in a really special connection with nature. They call themselves the elder brothers and they call ourselves the younger brothers. And they call that place the heart of the world is proven that there is an ecosystem there in the Caribbean that everything that happens there affects the rest of the ecosystem in a bigger scale. So these communities right now they are open to us and they want to teach us a lot of things about our relationship with nature. And we've been working for them for five years. Actually, I'm a filmmaker, I'm a photographer, and I started the project as a documentary as a transmedia project. Then I was studying permaculture and I started to plant in trees and we are focusing in agroforestry that actually is the traditional sowing systems that the communities have been using for thousands of years. So the problem there was the coca plantations, the weed plantations and the conflict, the forest, 80% of the Sierra and 30 years ago, 20 years ago, the communities have been recovering the land. They do natural restorations, they do a lot of restorations with different methods like quartz planting and gold planting and different types of things that actually we don't use too much, but they are focused on that. And the thing is that at the same time that they are recovering the lands, the soils are really damaged so we started to work with regenerative agriculture to recover in the soils, we are focusing into growing cacao. But the communities adopted coffee 100 years ago when the one Spanish cappuccino mission from the church went there and bring the seeds of the coffee and the communities start realizing that actually the younger brother likes too much coffee and the younger brother pays a lot for the coffee so they adopt the plant, they do a lot of rituals to adopt the plant in the territory and they've been growing coffee from actually 100 years already. So coffee is one of the reasons, the reasons why the forestation stopped and right now is one of the main incomes that the communities had. Cacao is native from there and it's really special, we are focusing in both, but last year we started with a project that is called Coffee for Biodiversity. So we started with the project, we are working with 60 families that are in just one town, it's a singular region coffee and these coffees grow by them with the moon cycles, with the star cycles, they have a lot of rituals before the sowing, they had a lot of, they call it payments, so payments to the air to grow the things to harvest the things and they have a really special project, a process with food. So in long story short, their message is that taking care of nature is actually really easy, like if we change the way that we consume food, everything is going to be like a wave into how to taking care of good of nature and of course, producing and consuming are interconnected. So we have started with this project, this project allows us to pay the operational cost of the foundation to support the families and at the same time regenerate the land. And we are working with community supported agriculture so we are a community that pre-buy the coffee with a monthly subscription, so the people that want to join pre-buy the share of the harvest and we deliver it monthly. So that creates more resilience for the farmers and for everyone that is involved in the project because coffee is part of the trading system that is regulated by the stock market so in that way we are not participating in the stock market. And yeah, here I'm going to start with the presentation so I'm going to share the screen but I don't know how, Ash. So in the bar below there's this green button that says share screen. I see, yeah, actually, yeah. So now you can see it. Yeah, we can see it. If you make it full screen. I'm trying. But how I don't make it more. I can, yeah, okay. The bottom, there's this, that one, that one. Okay, we have it. Okay. Okay, so here is our logo and I would love to start there because I think it was the first branding and image that we create as I come from the arts and from filmmaking and from all these background. It's easy to have all the elements that represent the project. The Jaguar is the father of the forest and if there is no jaguar in Latin America the forest is, is not healthy and it's going to die and the Jaguar has a really deep relationship with the indigenous communities is seen as the, as the energy force of the earth and is the regulator of all the indigenous systems. So our project is called how what a siembra that is means the jaguar that is sewing. I don't know if that that's the exact translation but yeah, and we focus in natural and cultural projects. We started with this and we wanted to have all the representation of the project there so as you see there is a seed here. The triangle is the Sierra that is the moon, China is the moon and the sun is the circular the circle that engage and hold like the earth and all of us together. The circle is really important in the indigenous communities too. For example, their houses are circular. You sit in the circle to start to talk in and to discuss in these things. So they have four worlds. So the four worlds are represented in the middle of the eye that is the eye of the consciousness. There is the Jaguar there and, and yeah, like, we wanted to have all of these in in in the logo and we create that and of course this is based on semiotic and semiological things but then you have a result there is something kind of simple that the people can engage and people do not need to understand all of that background, but the image is going to attract the people already. And that means that we have there are going to be enclosed in the people, even if we cannot understand it so good. So this was the first part. Then when we wanted to start with the coffee project I think that the first thing that we need to ask ourselves when we are going to start a project is, is, is why because of, of course, the reason that the why of most people is to, yeah, to have an income to create resilience to sell something or, or is kind of the same that the main goal of all of these projects but we need to go deeper into that because if we go deeper into that questions we are going to start to find in some answers that are going to be really important for the development, the development of the message and the branding that we want to share the branding. Personally for me is actually the message that we want to communicate to them, not the customers but all of the people that are going to see the project so the branding is the image way to communicate the message from from the project. And for us, like for example for the indigenous communities, then the reason why I start with the coffee is because they see the coffee as a messenger. So they are actually not interested in the money the money is something important. Yes, it's going to create resilience is going to create an income. But for them, the coffee is a messenger from the heart of the world to the heart of the people that are taking that food. So this is the main reason why they want to start the project. So they say that every time that we are consuming a food we are connect we are connecting ourselves directly with the territory. So, I think said is is having a call or something like that. You can please mute your phone. Who's that. Okay. Good. Yeah. And it's like every time that we are consuming a food we are connecting with that territory. So if we are consuming a Colombian coffee we are connecting with Colombian territory with the soil with the biodiversity that is around there with the people that grow it in a more sense is like we have in a relationship with our body and with nature itself. So this is the why that they wanted to create this project so we started to talking with them and to see yeah what is the best way to call the project and they always say this is coffee for biodiversity. So this is coffee for the preservation of biodiversity. And then they start to arise them. The message that they wanted to chair is like the connection that we have with food how we can change things through food to have a healthy and to make peace with nature they call it like that like they call it like we can make peace with nature through food to eating organic food to farming good and to creating good trade systems and so on. So that was the first part and then we started to encounter the problems so we are living in a the coffee is a new colonel. I don't know how to say the name is but now colonization is like a new colonized product that has not changed the trading from hundreds of years is an industry that is building exploitation as the same as cacao. And the farmers 50% of the farmers are living of coffee farmers in Colombia living in poverty and they are giving up the coffee plantations that creates like the women's are more subject. So if I don't speak so good English, I have a confused of languages in my mind. But yeah, it's a problem for the women's too. And then the people that are growing that are not growing coffee then they start to grow coca and they change to illicit crops. And it's a wave of so many things and social and cultural things that are really bad. The coffee farmers never see a profit like the profits are always in the northern countries. There is a study that says that the people that trade coffee have a profit of 200% of every kilo that they are buying the coffee community the coffee commodity is has created a lot of monocultures to supply the demand of the northern countries. So, and the and the price is regulated by the stock market and is like for example, one euro a pound or sometimes even one euro a kilo. Here in Europe, we can take a cup of coffee for three euros and it's 10 grams. So you can calculate how many is that this balance. Right now we have say sales that are fair trade rain forest alliance all that things, but all that says only guarantee that you pay 20 cents more or even one euro more for the coffee that you are buying and that's actually not change, not changing is helping because the people are more aware of the things that are buying, but it's a long way to create equity in the in the in this community at the same as cacao and other ones. This is our why our why we wanted to start the project as we are based here in Vienna and we wanted to share that message from the communities. We wanted to start a conversation with the coffee industry to. Yeah, we could grow coffee in harmony with nature, but we can trade it good to and we can share the profits from here to there we are. We are a nonprofit so all of our profits are going back into the place of our region. And in that way we can change a lot of things so it's something about to start to have in a conversation and if they consume change here in Europe or in United States or in Australia, then so their countries are going to start to have a revival. We are not going to the forest more to grow these types of crops. The families are going to create resilience, and we are going to find a way that if the coffee industry and the cow industry change. Wow. And how many acres of regenerative agriculture how many things are going to change because is the second commodity. In the world so it's a two billion industry, more than two. We escaped the number but it's really big. Dos Santos be honest dos Santos will be honest, the, the, the autos. That's something really that even that amount of money in my head doesn't doesn't fit. So, this is why we wanted to start the project and we say like, okay, this is the message that we want to share but we need to share it with us, because if we are going to start to attack everything. It's a busy cycle and yeah, the best way to create it is that yeah coffee for biodiversity is good for you, and it's good for the planet. The second thing is actually the research did all of this is based in a research coming from Colombia and we grow. We are really famous to growing coffee but actually we don't drink to us so much good coffee because most of the coffee that is good is going to the country and we don't have a coffee culture. I start to understand about coffee here in Europe that the roster and the people are more involved in the notes the scales, how he's processing how is a lot of technical stuff that that that is really incredible so it was a long research actually the when I was a study permaculture, I make a pilot of an agroforestry extra with coffee. And since then, we, we wanted to do this. So, then we found a community that was already growing coffee we start to working with them. And we start to investigate. Okay. What is the specialty coffee because for example we are in the specialty coffee coffee has an scale from 1200 and the coffees that are above 80 that are organic coffees and so on. And what we call specialty coffee the rest of the coffee is commodity coffee, the coffee that we usually drink in the supermarket is 60 points between 6050 70 points. The coffee harvest is more cheaper to trade. They are, they are only three big companies that are buying 50% of the coffee harvest of the world, and that 50% of the coffee harvest of the world are produced by a small farmers. So, in the small farmers, we already know that 70% of the food that we consume is created by the bias by small farmers. So, it's really, it's really important to start to uplift the farmers to stop to changing that consume. And we noticed that of course there is a lot of new boom with the specialty coffee the new generations are really involving that in how their consume habits are having an impact of the planet. And yeah, that was or or why and our research and how to start the project. Then we already have a clarity of what we wanted to do but there's always the question how I'm going to do that. And we are living in a, in an era that everything is around image and with the image you can create a lot of good things and you can share a lot of good messages, and the image is really important so the, the, I don't know next press so invest thousands of heroes into their campaigns and to get the packaging all that stuff. But as a person that comes from, from, from, yeah, from the arts. We don't need all of that to create something beautiful and something that creates impact. So, for example, all of our branding on all of our image was using a permaculture principle that is with the less amount of energy let's create the most amount of energy. So it's the way that nature works, and we are applying all of in all of our, our processes. So the, the first recommendation that I have to you and the first thing that we did and everyone needs to do when we are building a brand is creating a mood board and mood board is simple. This is the version of images of other pros audio other projects other brands that you feel attracted. So, I made this one. So, for example, we started to see yeah this, I like really these colors, I love how the way they use the typography here. So, in the communities that we work. This is something that our designer that makes the project it so we have it as a reference for ourselves. How do nature is interconnected with coffee. In the beginning we wanted to have the job where so we found this monkey in a project and, wow, it was really good and we started to make this mood board and from this mood board, everything is going to start to take more shape. So, then you need to combine few things that are really important. Yeah, the message that you want to share and the things that you like. Yeah. And the problems that you have. So, for example, I started in the research that we did, even with the indigenous brands that they already sell coffee or something like that. We found that it was a lot. There was a lack of representation of who were, who was the indigenous communities. So they have beautiful packaging packages with yeah nice typographic or something like that. But the people doesn't know who are their wackos their wackos are these tribe that are here they have a, this is them. The traditional dress here is the mochila as you can, you can see these hard to represent the snow of the mountains, the mochila is made by the women's and represent like is a way to carry in the earth with us. And we found that yeah this is something that we need to include in our packaging because it needs to be there for the people to realize who are the people that are growing this. So for example if your project is focused in woman, it will be great that the image needs to be a woman and needs to have the elements that represent the ideas that you want to share. So we make this, and then we, we went to face of drafts. And we wanted to, I wanted to explain something that everything that we are doing in our process is more a journey than a destination. Actually, we are working in our third packages, our third, our third third packaging. So, so and on so we are rebranding the project every time that we release a new harvest. And I think that's some brands, they just make one thing and it's okay it works for years, but we wanted to include art. So our idea is that every year we are working with a different artist to create some different piece of art for the packaging. Yeah, it's something that is going to evolve and changing over the time. So the first two elements that we say like okay we need to have the community, and we need to have the hour. Then we started with the draft. This draft. It was the first draft that we made. And then we, it evolves. We make the evolution to this one. Yeah, as you can notice the job where is a little bit different here the job where is more like a cat or is not so much a job work here is more a job work. So in this little details are a lot of things. We found that yeah we need to include the ocean and there's no munchens and that's a representation of the place. It goes from the ocean to the snow munchens. And here is the plant of coffee. Something that I found that is really interesting as does in the northern countries, most of the people that consume coffee or cacao they don't know how that plants looks. They don't know how a plant of coffee looks or even a cacao plant looks. They don't know. It's like and they don't know the process from the farm to the cop. So that is another why. Okay, is another message that we need to start to talk about it to the people. So this is the disconnection that we have with our food there like we don't know even the food that we are consuming. Where are the plants or who are the plants that are producing that food so it's something that we really want to get deep on that. And then we create this final draft that is here. So we evolved them. They are wacko, because it was looking. Yeah, a little bit different actually the indigenous communities in the Sierra they are really Asian look they are really is really incredible they are really. So for them is like a really deep connection with the with Asia. So it's for me it's really fascinating. And then we started to evolve into these. Yeah. The hair the long hair is a representation of the, the hair is our intense for the earth. So it's the way that our thoughts or energy is there in the, in the, in the hair is something. And that's why we men as we are in the communities we use it the, the long hair, when the Spanish conquist arrived, it was the first thing that they started to do it with the men's they cut the hair, and that create like a disconnection and less power so the sense on history and all of that it has something about something to do. And we need to revive all, all of that traditions. So, we made this and with this we release our first coffee that this was the first presentation that we have after the research, the ideas that we have. And of course the simplification of that idea as we cannot include everything that we want, but we started with this, I recommend always that less is more like an image less is more, you don't need to put a lot of elements or to have a lot of outdoors or something like that. You, if you notice and if you go to a supermarket that's a good exercise, go to the supermarket and go to the places and start to look in the packaging. And I start to look in yeah, what is the packaging that you feel more attracted what are the things that you like it from from that. In that exercise I found that even here there was a roasting that was already selling this type of coffee from the indigenous communities from from other ones, and they were selling it in the name of crystal alcohol on. We have a fight and a discussion with them because they were selling an indigenous product with a name of a genocide there. So it was really bad and they were selling it really good because the concept of them is pirates coffee. And of course crystal alcohol on was a great pirate, and they create all of their marketing in dad, and I was, and then I arrived and I was like yeah you know who are growing these coffees indigenous communities yeah yeah. But you know who was crystal alcohol on and they did the first thing that they told me yeah the picture is not so good. But we are working in the package and I was like yeah no it's not about the picture is it's about that is, as I see it is like if you are selling a heap of coffee or something like that. You need to do a good research before to put in something like that because you are selling an indigenous coffee with the name with a person that kills millions of indigenous so then they retire the coffee and they change it right now they are not selling it now, sadly, but yeah that was something that happened and it's something that it passed too often. Yeah, so big brands start to creating their marketing and the image with the wrong messages, and the people are buying that so so imagine if we could do the things good, and then it's going to have a better way out. So we created this packaging is a we created this element to that it is included the history and other thing that I noticed that it was a part of our focus is that we need to tell the story of the people that grow the coffee, and that's something that most of the people, most of the coffee doesn't do not do. So they say yeah it's a fair trade coffee, it comes from Latin America. But you don't know. Oh, it's coming from the farm for beta phase and that's it. So we did that and we here we tell a little bit of the story. And in the backside that I'm going to show you here. So we put a cool code that the people can access to our website directly when they put their phones. So using technology something really good. And then we create the story of the heart of the world. Why this, this place is the heart of the world, who are the communities that are growing. The communities want to sell coffee so Mamos says the coffee acts as a messenger speaking directly from the hearts of the native people to ours a bridge between worlds a demonstration of how we can live in harmony with nature and cultivate the land without harming these fragile ecosystems, how it's really possible to create regenerative organic cultures and circular economies. So you need to. Yeah, every part of the packaging is is a canvas. So it's really great to put all the information that you want there. There's a lot of official things that you need to have. Yeah. So for example here in Austria this needs to be in German. We make all of our communications in English. More logos and more design based in the old the things that represent us that as you can see it is the Jaguar Jaguar is the main that is our main object or main animal or main image that we want to share to the world. Then we receive some feedback. So we release that and we receive some feedback. Yeah, the woman was not included. Yeah, and we start to talking with the community and they have the same problem. Yeah. Like they have this discussion that the woman is always put it outside from from a lot of things. So I don't know if you know one but this but it's a really big brand around the world that is farmer with a donkey. And it's really famous even in Hollywood. It's that brand that has a period. And in the beginning we were focusing on yet only one character simplify everything. And then we start to change, because the moments are really important. Actually, we work with a lot of women that are the leaders, and the message from the communities in the Sierra is that the community is lived by women's is going to be a woman lead. So the energy of the earth is a female energy and even ourselves as men we have it a divine female energy and we wanted to represent that in them in the packaging to win the communications that we want to do. So, in the beginning was a middle misunderstanding with the community because for them, all of this process we do it with we, we, we always making it with the community is like we have gathered in here we are talking about the packaging, what we need to include what we need to And in the first one we commit the mistake to know include the woman for a lot of factors we are in a rush we wanted to release fast we didn't have so many times, we can create a lot of excuses but in the end it was a mistake. So, yeah, we need to come back again and start to doing everything and to include the woman so we start to make in a draft. As you can see here this is the first idea that our designer send us and we always start to working with her. Yeah, let's create the waves a little bit more beautiful. Let's we don't like this thing that she have here. I don't know, maybe she looks better here or she looks better here. So it's always something that is talking and talking and talking. Then we create this one, but the colors and the things it was not the fit. And then we arrived to this one that is the last one. Yeah, so as you can see the waves are really good here, we change the name because the first one was another coffee different from this one this this one is a singular region. It's it is put it here that is coffee for biodiversity is an equal is the community that grows the coffee is our wacko. And then we have it the job whereas a totem, but actually it's the little evolution from the first design that we have. It's really good because in the beginning everyone was really wow nice the packaging looks nice and everything but it was only a few people that actually it was two persons only that says like it will be great if if you can put the woman there too. And then these two voices become something really special. And yeah we start to get in an evolution. This is for example them the color version. Yeah, you can see there is more detail this is some posters that we print that we pasting today into into in Vienna. And I think like coming back to this type of team things is really good to like right now where everything is online we put Facebook ad or something like that, but traditional publicity is always going to be really good because most of the people buy coffee in the stores, not online. So we need to find a way to the people that are walking in the street, see the image, have put the phone in the cure code and go to the website and realize that yeah this is something that I can buy only online we don't have an a store. The only thing is just an online shop. And then we put a more bigger key coffee for biodiversity, and our website and yeah a little improvements there. So, from this is something that we found that yeah it's really cool it's really nice, but it's in a personal opinion it doesn't fully find my myself. There are things that we wanted to do. So this year, we change it again, and I'm going to show a little bit of the process that we are doing. This is the final packaging that we have right now. I can show you here too. It's like, I don't know if you see it good there. But yeah, here contains the story. Here is the packaging. This is China the first step that we make until December with the first part of the harvest. This packaging is not compostable is made by stickers to, and this is something that we wanted to change like we wanted to have everything, every part of the process, and every part of the project needs to be more integrated with the things that we are doing, but a compostable packaging is, is more cheaper actually than a package like this for example these packages cost around one euro a compostable packaging cost 50 cents. But the thing is the amount of that you need to buy so for the compostable packaging we need to buy 10,000 already. This, the coffee that we are producing is a micro lot so it's no more than two tons. So we didn't, we don't, we don't have the resources to do that investment so we release it in this way, but the idea is to keep evolving. This brings us to this year. So this year this is in what we are working actually right now. Next month we are going to release, we always release a crowdfunding where the people can pre buy the harvest, or where the people can pre buy the coffee consumption from the year so if you drink one kilo coffee in a month you can pre buy your 12 kilos and we are going to send it to you every month. So we started to evolve again and they start to include in more things that we felt that it was left. So Columbia is the second most biodiverse country in the world. We have the most amount of endemic birds. We have 40% of the country is jungle, and we are really know for nature right so we wanted to include more of that into the packaging. So to tell the story a little bit more clear. So, this is the first trap that we, we make, and one of the things is that when the people see a Colombian coffee they think in quality already. So that is kind of already established so it's really good to find that things from your product that are already established to take advantage of that. Right now we are putting Colombia here more bigger. Tyrona is the name of the indigenous communities that it was there right now are the descendants that are for tribes and they have different names. So we wanted to revive that original name that actually is really famous because we have a natural park that is called Tyrona, and it's really is visited for thousands of tourists a year. So we are going to change and we will make a step back. And we say like okay yeah it's really cool to have the representation of the man of the woman, but we are always talking about for example the mammals that are the spiritual leaders but not the sagas that are the woman and spiritual leaders. We need to uplift this and the only need the way to uplift this is to create a space for that. And when we put together the man of the woman, yes, beautiful story is humanity is as we are, but we right now we wanted to focus only into the power of the woman. So the woman is really there, the woman has a really beautiful relationship with some plants the woman is the only one that is allowed to grow it is allowed to harvest. So, for example with the coca, the woman is the only one that is allowed to grow it and is the only one that is allowed to harvest, but the man is the only that is allowed to consume it. And the reason is because the woman already have all that energy of the plant inside and we as men, we need that plant to have that energy. It's something really, really beautiful that I found this is like these intersections into dependence of the generous into nature and into sewing into the way that they see the world. So we wanted to evolve, then we evolve it to this draft as you see the lines are more, more, more clear. There in the community, there is a micro colibri that actually is as big as one. Yeah, it's as this is endemic from the area and it's really important for the communities, these animals appear for example when the harvest is ready. So they found this frog that is actually they don't found it the frog was always there. But last year National Geographic, National Geographic went with the coffee community that we are working to photograph this frog that is here that is a black fraud frog with white dots that actually it creates light in the darkness is something really really incredible and really beautiful. It appears into the coffee into the other plantations when the when the harvest is ready. So this is they are really into connected into observing nature in every part of their life. So we wanted to include it at the same as the colibri because that are two animals are really important. Then we wanted to include the house to because it's something really special. They say that, for example, our the way that we are living always in houses that are in a square is something limiting for the energy. And this is why they live in circles in circles. So it's like this is why we have sometimes our thoughts in not so good direction because it's like they are in a box or we are living in boxes and not in circles. And this is a really special place that is called the tuna is our Machu Picchu is called lost city is known as not as lost city and it's more older than Machu Picchu is pyramid side in circles. And then we have it here there's no peaks and the representation of the fauna, the other condor the eagle, the butterfly that it has 89 and in in their body. The waves and we are creating this to evolve in right now the woman are going to be like a tight on a woman before they were dressed in gold when they when the conquist arrived they noticed that every one of the community was dressed in gold, but but gold for them, it was this it was the it is actually the spiritual material is the most energy is the best energy conductor in on earth. And it's a reason why gold needs to be on the ground and why, when we use gold as dressing or an offering the most of them the gold in the indigenous communities were used by artists by craftsman. So it was really important and right now we want to create a tyrona saga, a tyrona wisdom woman dressing gold. And this is evolution that we have until now, we want, we are going to release this next month with the crowdfunding campaign. And we are working to final finalize here to finish this. So maybe next month when we release the campaign, the campaign, I'm going to share it with you and you're going to see the final result of what we are doing with the full color with the possible packaging with the new messages that we want to create with the video that is going to be with the campaign with the new infographic pieces, and then you are going to see everything that I just talk more visually and I think that is going to be the next step so you can go to our website is howarsiemrapun.com and then the release is going to be the 22 of May that is the biodiversity day. So I hope that it was helpful, it was good for you to hear all of this story. I'm going to try to do it in more the most simple way. And, and yeah, looking forward to see your projects and how they are evolving if you need anything or if you want to get to go more deep into these concepts. Just write me I'm going to put my email there into the chat, and we can have a conversation that will be awesome. So, thank you very much. I think this is my part. Thanks Auntie that was amazing. Your brand is so beautiful. And I have some of the coffee at home. And it's really yummy and tasty it's not it feels less intense than coffee that you buy in the supermarket it doesn't give you the same, like anxious jittery feeling that the coffee market gives you it's like a bit more gentle. It's a soft coffee. Yeah. Yeah, which is really nice. And so, does anyone have any questions specifically about the branding part I know I saw that. Jasmine had some questions about packaging and marketing but I just wanted to focus today on branding because I think it was Johanna that said, marketing and packaging are topics of their own that will take more time to discuss and it's it's too much to talk about all of them in one session. So does anyone have any questions for Santi about creating his brand. Yes, I have many questions. So you sell the coffee to the immediately not through a distributor man but straight to the store or straight to the consumer. Am I right? Yeah, I straight to the consumer actually is our donors. So we are building a small community that subscribe monthly and is just to the consumers directly with this coffee is really difficult to expand to the stores because it's a limited coffee. The community is calling it natural edition. So it's not limited edition but natural edition. So we don't have a big amount of coffee we want to bring more coffee for different communities and then to start to go into the stores and something like that. But right now in the beginning is just directly to the consumer here for example I'm going to show a little bit of the website. This is our website and then you can, there is a video in the beginning that the people can have an idea of these communities the nature that is around these are special elements from the water to the houses to the community itself. And then we use a lot of illustrations to tell the story that we wanted to do, like we have a monthly program for you to take climate actions and the things that we are doing. You can call it breathe and a video and how it's work how you can be involved so you can donate monthly and then you can be in the coffee club or then you can create coffee at Forest. Then what is a food for it because most of the people is they don't have they don't know what is a food for it so we create an illustration to yeah you can grow all of these things together as the people do it before here we have coffee and here we have cacao. What is regenerative agriculture and what are the things that we can achieve with that. Here is the product and then a chop that where the people can, yeah, take single orders of subscriptions so they can buy for example six month, six month subscription or a journey subscription. And this is the way that we do it and it's the fact how we distribute the money, for example, how it costs all the transparency that is really important to have it in all of these projects. There are the benefits. Why we are doing this more images like this is the communities that we are working as you can see they live really in harmony with nature. And because what I think is that if I do not involve all the people around my community where like 1200 people around. I mean forest is not being protected. So you have to do some some some for them, in order for them to have a good quality of life. I don't know what altitude you have, because I am at 920 meters high, which is not much for the for the coffee but we do have some coffee that they kill all the coffee because suddenly the cacao was the highest price. So everybody planted cacao, the cacao started to have illness and plagues and so so because monoculture is not what you should do in the forest and they kill many, many of, for instance, we had Castaña the almond. We were, we had a lot of almonds trees, and they cut them down totally because of the wood. No, but if you can make like a trade with people directly, I mean they will have a better amount of money from income. You know, and that's the only way to do it is. And do you link with is this a movement around the world or is just you that started this because I am interested in how to do it. I think there is a lot of cool projects doing a lot of the same things actually everything is basic in community support agriculture the problem with the farms is that they put a lot of money and energy and energy to grow something, and they started to sell it so they said it's really cheap to the first person that appeared that our cooperatives most of the time and from that cooperative sell it to the exporter and from the exporter to the importer and so on. So we changed that into create a direct relationship from the consumers to the farmers and that created deeper bonds. So we started with one family working with one family and then we started to to grow and grow. And that's the idea that the people realize that yeah if I buy that coffee I'm gonna I'm gonna I'm gonna paint directly to the farmer yeah and I'm creating this but you can research more as community support agriculture. I have a community supporter. Support agriculture. Yeah, in the 60s it was a boom from that it comes from earlier because it was the way that we trade food in the beginning, but yeah it is evolving in so many different ways so for example in the states, the black communities they do it. In Japan they did this a lot so and right now it's reviving so we even with the pandemic we realize that yeah we need to change this system of trading because we started the project to because the coffee community roster from the state. He was going to buy the harvest and then the pandemic arrived and he said like okay I cannot buy the harvest so so sorry, and they were in risk to lose the harvest. When you are working with community support agriculture, if you pre buy the harvest the farmers are already have part of the harvest already sold. So they are not worried of that and they are not participating in the in this market so I think we need to move from going from that and it's a lot of projects in every part of the world that are projects that you can buy to the farmers and they they deliver some fresh pages in the week and is is the same. Okay, how altitude you have in your seat with it. This coffee is a high altitude coffee this is why soft, it grows 2500 meters high is really high but the beautiful thing with coffee is that it's an excellent plant it grows everywhere. So, and you can manage that, but yeah I will recommend that if the if cacao is native from there. You can have both, but if the communities were already growing cacao and the cacao had diseases, then you need to change is the way that they grow that cacao and to start to working with regenerative agriculture. And the cacao is going to be the saver, because it is was not the problem of the cacao it was the problem and how the cacao was growing. We are also we had a lot of cut me in the in the cut me in in the soil, and I need to change the pH of the of the soil first. So I will do it with me. And I'm working also with bio dynamic people that are fighting the same. So it's not bio dynamic is that it's not so expensive. I wanted to change the soil. No, with the color I don't know how you call calling in English and and you mash stones in order to have minerals to place in the in the. So, you will not have only can be on the menu or other, you know, things to eat for the plant. So, so I am I am trying to think how, which is the easiest and the fastest thing to do in order to change the soil and in order to, you know, other people to follow me. So I have to do it first with my field in order to prove that is that it works. I'd like to remind everyone that this is a training about creating a brand a brand. Yes. Yeah. I know you have questions. No, it's fine. I understand you have a lot of questions but yeah have a another presentation now from Johanna in Brazil about the creating her brand and I think if you want to ask more general questions about each other's projects there's going to be enough we're creating a new platform for you to be able to do that. Yeah. Yeah. So Johanna would you like to to take step in now and thank you Santi for a really great presentation and your project is so inspiring and I'm really happy. Thank you and yeah I think this the next part is going to be really amazing so take notes because I think Johanna has a lot of beautiful things to say so thank you and I'm going to be here. Thanks Santi. I'm such a fan of Ceguarsia but I stalked them before and I love the image and everything is really great to hear the story. We have a completely different kind of approach and and story, a little bit because I guess our background was a little bit different. I want to talk to you guys a bit about Sinal quickly of what we do Sinal is a camp that is like 200 hectares, and we are in the rainforest outside of Brazil. Oh my, oh I'm still here. And the rainforest outside of Brazil, sorry, I'm originally Mexican but I've been living here for the past five years now. And basically, we what we do is we work directly in the 200 hectares but we also work as an influencer for the, we basically act in the buffer zone between the last remaining protected areas of the Atlantic rainforest and the urban sprawl of Rio. So there in that in between there's a lot of pressure on biodiversity, a lot of informal occupation. And so there are a lot of the typical pressures that the urban sprawl will give to this forest that is already at 12% forest cover. So it's quite endangered. And the brand that we created is not really I'm not going to talk about Sinal but but one of the solutions that we came up with, which is like a brand of jackfruit green jackfruit. I don't know if you've ever seen the fruit or heard about it. But basically one of the solutions that we came up with and in the many different ways that Sinal acts was this idea of creating a brand for jackfruit, which is really what I'm going to talk about how the process was of creating it. Sorry guys it's taking me a little bit long because I just updated my computer and it's asking me for all these permissions now. So I have to do that. Okay. Is everything okay. Oh she's gone. She's back. Internet issues. Yeah. It asked me to like restart zoom and I just like went as fast as I could. So we're back. Can you see my screen. Yes. Perfect. As I was saying, we'll see now really works creating a lot of different solutions for for infrastructure problems and several like problems that that come out of this pressure of the urban sprawl. And mother was was born like mother is a name of the brand and it was born out of this intention to find a financially sustainable mechanism to regenerate the Atlantic rainforest. Because jackfruit is actually invasive it's not really from from Brazil, and it's dubbed invasive here. It just grows a lot it's a very big fruit it has a lot of a lot of seeds so and it really likes the conditions, the tropical conditions here it's originally from India. And so it has spread all around the, the, like the native forests of the area and the way that the government has chosen to tackle this issue is by is by. You say this in English by cutting a ring on the trees to to cut the circulation of SAP and killing the tree. The thing is that the jackfruit tree is very resilient. No, so it doesn't really work a lot. It's also expensive because you have to send a lot of people to do these physically like go tree by tree by tree and cutting out. And at the same time it doesn't really take into account the fact that it still sinks carbon, the biodiversity already relies on on this food source. And the interesting thing about jackfruit is that it's also if you if you grab it green, it doesn't really taste like anything. And, and so you can, you can use it as a substitute for meat and it just allows for a lot of creativity. And so we decided to propose this this counter like counter proposal where it's like well what if we collect the green jackfruit that is already around it's so abundant. And then we we create this sort of like processing method that grabs every single different part of the jackfruit and sells it to vegetarian restaurants in Rio de Janeiro and will by creating like this in this entire value chain then people who are like farm small farmers that are our neighbors can can make a living out of selling these jackfruit. So we designed that there's a very technical aspect to it we've designed this agroforestry model that is containing the jackfruit but taking it away and processing it and also inserting at the same time other native species like Kupuassu and Jussara which is the SIE of the Atlantic rainforest. And so basically that is the product that we use that we that we had to create a brand for. And the biggest challenges were that well we had nothing it was a it was a brand that we had to come up with that is different from Sinal because while it's a project of Sinal's Sinal's ultimate mission isn't to sell jackfruit. So we had to come up with something else. And at the same time it's not jackfruit has kind of like a bad reputation Brazil so we had to come up with something to make it exciting and to make it new. And just to create a personality out of nowhere, basically. Then, so the branding process was like this, I'd like to begin by saying that there's a big disclaimer there's nobody at Sinal really who has a graphic design background, or even a communications background. I myself I'm the coordinator of communications but I that's not my background at all I studied international relations and I used to work for the United Nations. I didn't really have any communications experience really at all. So, hopefully that will give everybody some like peace in the sense of if you guys don't have anybody in your team that has done this before it's not the end of the world. And also the good news is that we are all really kind of trained because we are all creative and we're all consumers of brands. So we all in a way have this possibility of stepping outside and looking at examples and thinking about what that means. So basically we said well how do we even begin to give a personality to our project. So we had this guy who was living here who has had a designer background but he didn't really work for our team and he he gave us some tips and helped us come up with an idea so that we could create a story around the whole jackfruit situation and the first part was trying to think creatively and understanding our project understanding our story and thinking about how we could tell it to people. And then we looked at a lot of options of narratives and then chose one, and then we made our first basic materials to get going, which were like sales presentation the social media and the labels basically. So they're getting creative to get things going we started interviewing everybody that had to do with the with the project at some point of everybody here at see now has technically a different job I do communications. Somebody else does some sort of like coordination of the VVEDO of the of the nurseries, and somebody does the the culinary aspect of see now, but then everybody at the same time is contributing to this project and it was very important for us to interview everybody to get a feel of what everybody's perspective was because because everybody has a different approach within the project for example the person who collects the jackfruit has a completely different experience about it that the person who is cooking it, and then the person who is processing it then the person who is cooking the story. Everybody has sort of like a different association with the project a different scent of like what it smells like what it tastes like what it how what it means to talk to the owners of the farms from the jackfruit trees that we have to map and so if you if you can track all of those stories and all of those like perceptions. You can create something that everybody's involved in and then you can see all the possibilities that there are to tell the story. So that's what we did first we we interviewed everybody. And we interviewed them with like three types of questions I actually made a folder that I that I can share to Ashley then she can share to you guys of these tools that might help you. So the questions are kind of like a random questions of like name a place name name an animal name to get a feel of how the person is coming in with their with their own personality. We did some association questions of like, if the project were a tool. What would it be if the project were an organ, what would it be in and it's in this whole idea of just getting people to to think creatively about the project and think associated with any type of metaphor and then some up front questions about it of like how do you see this business and and who are, how do you see the people that we're selling to. And how do you see the team, what do you hope for in the future for this project, and then we just basically made an excel sheet and put everybody's answers in there. And that came out when we when we sort of looked at this and saw this repetitive repetitive repetitive constant of of the concept of abundance, for example, in the sense that this project was created because we started thinking. And we should do an agroforestry model to to create a source of income with minimum effort for people in the community and at the same time we're protecting the ecosystem. But then at first we started thinking no we're going to we're going to plant this like red pepper that they like in France and it grows here and we can make like start from scratch. And then in our thinking we, we thought well there's jackfruit everywhere. It's, there's so much jackfruit that it's actually sort of like, it makes more sense to think about like how to contain it, then to think about like how we're going to create something new out of the blue. So, coming in from this perspective of abundance really what sort of like wasn't tuned with everybody. And it was something that it made sense to include somehow in our narrative. And then at the same time everybody in in one way or the other talked a lot about interconnectivity about like how we wanted to protect the environment but help people have a source of income, but at the same time make something that was tasty. And that it had just a lot of different perspectives and then that we all everybody talked a lot about the idea of bringing back this ancient wisdom instead of like not not as capitalistic not as a sort of like cut throat, but more of this bringing back this indigenous sort of wisdom of the land here in Brazil and that is represented across Latin America. And there was also this sort of like dichotomy in it because people people were sort of trying to bring back this this ancient wisdom but at the same time we were like but we're new and we want people to know that this is how it is and that we just want to offer something different. So we had this sort of like okay these are some of the values and these are some of the concepts that are coming up. And at the same time in terms of like sensations of people people have this feeling of the brand that it should be very tropical. That it should be very Latin, which is was interesting because it's, we know that that jackford is Indian, but at the same time everybody was like no no no this have a feel that there is coming from Latin America as a solution. And it's funny because jackford is very popular as a sort of like a meat substitute in Germany and Europe, but then Latin America not so much yet and so the idea was like no let's just bring this back to to like this local environment. And so at the same time there was a sort of like this like light, lighthearted yet firm sort of sensation of like oh we want to be sort of like protecting the environment and all but then at the same time, a little bit like this is how it is going to solve climate change and so so how do the idea was like okay this is a lot of information it's very abstract so what do we do with this. And then we asked ourselves well if we had to reunite all of this into one personality or one either one person or one group, like, who is like that, you know. We came up with the idea of a council of Latina matriarchs of like this a council of like women that are like older women you know they've seen stuff they they they have this wisdom, and then the fact that they're for example, very loving and very nurturing and very forgiving but they're also kind of stern. I don't know, well, Sancti is also Latin American but I know he agrees with me but there's something about like the persona of Latin mother that is kind of this kind of very loving and very warm but at the same time I don't mess with with my mind you know. So, so our idea was sort of like to it sort of made sense and then we started thinking about like how it meant to be like everything that possibly had to do with this personality and and one of them was also kind of like there's this community and this ancient wisdom and this whole, like, big persona, like idealistic persona but at the same time there's also like the gossip and the and the fun of it, you know, and and so it really helped us to to think about a personality that helped us create the colors and the languages really and the way that the way that this entity that is being born is gonna talk talk about itself you know how it's going to express itself in all possible ways. And so, once we had this idea of the matrix we had a weekend where we were like, let's just explore everything of getting a feel of what this means and we use Pinterest, which I really recommend for the mood boards that Sancti was talking about. We used also we made a sort of like a mood board of Spotify just listening to all the music and Netflix so like oh what what are some movies that we should watch about like these personalities to get a different feel of this. And so we made a mood board as well. We put a lot, a lot of different stuff in there it's not just. We didn't just do, for example, thinking about other products that are similar, like chocolate barra for example that sort of like chocolate over there is like a brand of hot chocolate in Mexico or Royale which is like everybody everybody's household has one. We were thinking also about like what is the typical thing of like one of these businesses run by these women, oh that in Latin America and I think in India as well I don't know if in other places it's very common where you you write on the wall that the sort of like oh Cosina economic which is like economic kitchen loop and it has like the menu written on the wall and there's a very specific they use these shadows and then also means that this Jesus in the Boca is an expression in in Mexican Spanish I'm not sure of another in other cultures in Latin America where mothers say that a lot like oh you had me with the Jesus in the mouth it's like I was so worried. And all these like feelings so the mood board really reflects not only not only like the other brands but but aspects of this entire culture that I don't know if you guys have seen the movie. What's it called in English. I think Coco in the Pixar movie with the Dia de Muertos and the late there's if you've seen it in the in the like the corner below to the right there's the grandma. Of this character in the ground my eyes is such a like a typical typical character of what we wanted. This brand to sort of look like where she's like trying to force feed you food because she loves you and she thinks you're malnourished and so she gives you like five miles and and she like has her her shoe that she's threatening you with and so this sort of this sort of like creating this mood board not only about the visual aspects but the culture really. And the same with with Spotify we we grabbed a lot of songs songs from different things in Latin America the idea was thinking about like what what what the voice of these women sound like what would they sing about. What are the rhythms and we used everything Cuban sort of salsa and kumbia and samba and so so we just we would do the mood boards listening to that music and just try to be you know as as immersed as possible in this like personality that we're creating. And that was a lot of fun I really recommend that. And so after that we went to the naming which was basically a process of really the ideas and any idea is welcome the creativity should have no filter in that sense. So we made this this open spreadsheet and we wrote the name would just write the name. Why you think it's a good idea and then voting. So everybody had some time to write their names and explain why. And then we went through voting rounds. And in the end, it's funny because one of the the actual name that had originally one, which was a do pay, which means sort of do pay is like right from the source of the tree is this play on words in Brazilian Portuguese, but it was already taken. So the next one that one was madre and madre is interesting because madre isn't the name for mother in Portuguese that that's mine. But madre is sort of understood in a way that is sort of like a more mother nature. Like, so we thought that that was a great idea to sort of like encase the entire idea of the personality. And then from then we had a name. And then it was just a matter of like starting to break down some things that we had to choose, which were the typography and the colors and the language sort of like how would she speak how would they speak how how what are the things that she speaks about. And so that sort of like took us into the direction of thinking okay what are some of the characteristics and how can we tell the story in different ways of madre. So we started by the logo really the logo, which to simplify things, we decided that our logo had to be the name of the company. We started experimenting with a lot of typographies and I in this presentation I'm putting some some resources that are pretty good of that are free also of checking out typographies that you can download like Google fonts and stuff. So we're looking at at some of the characteristics of each of the lettering and this is interesting because again I, we didn't really have a background on design. But then if you think about if you, if you if you train yourself to think about like for example Coca Cola is a brand that everybody recognizes. What is what is something a Coca Cola always talks about in their ads and everything it's really that it's not really about the drink it's about friendship and it's about sharing. So why is the name Coca Cola written in like these letters that are sort of cursive, or because that is sort of like warm and has this personality. So if you if you look at other examples and you get a feel of why they chose that maybe it gives you an idea of looking at these letters and thinking. Okay, I think this sort of engloba this represents some of the qualities that this personality is trying to say. And so in the end, we had all these versions we had this version that was more of like strong and the very like femininity and then we had this other one that had to do with it more like a vintage kind of look. And then to the right is the one that we ended up ended up choosing, which is, which is really the typography that I'm going to show you but we just inverted the colors and just use the shade of it. So basically what we liked best about it is that it's, it's in a way it's sort of like, it's this typography that would be like what they choose you writing in school how they teach you to write, you know, well, but at the same time. It's like what this, like the badass guy will tattoo on his arm like the name of his mother, you know, it has this dichotomy of being sweet but at the same time very strong. We thought that it made sense in like the context of this personality and then we thought about like how we really liked the whole writing on the wall of the business idea in the sense of like in at least in Latin America, the typical there's a lot of like eateries that are like this one lady or a family where they they just cook very homemade meals and then you arrive there and you pay very little and you eat something that is very homemade style so we thought well that that's sort of like also has to do with our brand and also very importantly, it's very much the image of the by shell of Luminense where we are the sort of periphery of really the janitor it's not. It's not fancy and it's not premium it's not it's not trying to like pretend it's something it's not it's it's sort of like urban so so in the end we thought it just made sense and we chose that one. And so we we settled on the typography which is day walkers it's called a walker and and the the it's it's always a good idea to have like two typography is the main the main one that you use for headings and for accents. And the one that you use for actually writing on everything if you pay attention, for example, to the web site. There's a there's a typography for accents and there's a typography for like all the text that doesn't really change the fact that the drawings change the art changes from package to package the the typography stays consistent and the colors stay consistent to so that that is very very important. We also settled on the colors, we have two main ones which is the yellow and the and the red and that was because when we were doing the the research, we realized that the vast majority of brands that that have sell products that are sort of like in nature in the sense that you cook them that they use to to spice something up or they used to create a meal. They're mostly those two colors that are very warm and they sort of like awaken the appetite so we have those two primary ones. And the three and three complimentary ones that are for accents. And we chose those because eventually this this forestry project is going to eventually start giving in a couple of years some more other fruits so we're going to have to expand our lines. So we're already creating this brand that is sort of it's not this one product but it might grow into other ones. So subconsciously I guess we're trying to get the people are clients familiar with all these different products or how it's going to feel eventually. And so for this I have these two tools that are free and they're incredibly easy to use that are Google fonts that is very good for for searching, even with with like ideas in mind you know I'd like something like handwriting and you write handwriting and it shows you a bunch of options and then you have like different ideas. So it's very easy to use. And then canva canva is just amazing it's it's great for if you don't really know or you don't have anybody who knows Photoshop or or anything complicated. It's super super easy it already has a thing to design to create logos, so it can help you decide and use a sort of a typography at the end of the day sometimes we we think we try to complicate things so much but at Sinal we have to do things like with what we have and how we can you know and and really the more simple that you make things the better when you're just starting out and then you get more sophisticated we really recommend those two tools that are free and they're also free canva has like a free program for NGOs that if you if you submit your request and you get it you get the pro version which is kind of like the the bigger version for free we have that for example for Sinal so we work we work a lot with that and and anyone can use it it's it's really great. But yeah so so those are the two fundamental things that we that we came up with and then we came up with the materials that like the minimum materials that we needed to start selling the jackfruit the first one is the brand manual which is really very internal but it's it's sort of like the Bible of the do's and don'ts and like the colors and the typography for everybody who needs to create a material to use or if I myself leave Sinal or whatever happens there's this people know that is just the way it is with with with the brand of Madre frutos and then there's a sales presentation which has the why of course the project vision and then the products and the prices and the contact the labels which is like you have to in our particular case you have to work with a nutritionist and and it has the logo but it's basically it's quite quite simple and the communication channels which for us were Instagram and Facebook because there's something very important see this this brand is incubated within the larger project of Sinal where a lot of things are happening at the same time. Right now we're building we're expanding our processing plants so madre is growing, but then you know the daily challenges are like the building of the plant and the fence broke and the cows escaped so there's just a lot of different things going on and really it makes more sense to start small and to build up what you can as as you grow because with especially with communication channels if you can't maintain what you've created it loses its credibility so it's better to start small we use both Instagram and Facebook because they're linked really if we technically it's pretty much like using one by itself and again canvas also very very helpful for creating communication for for Instagram and Facebook and this whole the thing the thing about creating a personality is that it not only dictates what the logo is going to look like but it's going to dictate also what you're going to talk about in the social media because you're not always going to post your products over and over again you know you also create this narrative so so if you sit down and say what what what would madre talk about what what would this council of women talk about oh well we have like a lot of sayings you know my grandmother is talks likes to say a lot of like sayings of oh better to have a bird I can't think of any in English I always have them in Spanish but anyway the important thing is that it gives you a lot of possibilities of creating interaction and creating messages and to create this familiarity with your clients so so this is why this is why the sort of like it gives you this creating this robust idea that will give you even like the smallest like day to day sort of messages and well so I have some final thoughts that creating really as I was saying needs no filter it's it's better to just like say whatever references coming to your mind so that so the people of us and think about it. In a different way it's it's the more that you can talk to your team and see the way that they respond and the way that they perceive the project the better. And if it makes sense and if this personality is something that all of a sudden makes sense to you then that's that's a good track. It's good to have a help with somebody who has a design background, even if they're not involved in the project just because they help you think. For example in my case they helped me a lot to think about well why do you think this this typography is this way, and not the other you know and so giving you a little bit of understanding of what you should look at. When you're when you're looking at colors and when you're looking at types of lettering and when you're looking at drawings type of drawings, it really helps out. But it doesn't have to be like the person doesn't have to be involved necessarily in the entire process. Again, another thing is that when communicating the brand the consistency is the key is it is it's true that organically it will evolve and people will give you feedback. And then as it grows in personality and as it grows a little bit in in sort of confidence, it will become more alive. But there's there's a certain consistency that that should should not change should be respected, which is basically like the the logo, and the, and the colors and the typography is very important it's kind of like the again the example where the the artwork might change but really the tracing of the drawings is pretty much the same aesthetic is it's it doesn't it feels familiar to people. And then and the name the the typography of the name is also the same and you know it just gives this familiarity and it's slowly even if you're changing things it's slowly sort of like no we're still these, like remember us, but and then and you go and then as time goes on. And finally, well I made a I made a little bit of like a package with the things that we with this presentation with with the things that we used with a spreadsheet that you guys can use if you want to take some inspiration also from like interviews and and how to interpret those interviews and then I'll send to Ashley, she can pass around. And we, again, just, just reiterate that here it's you know we don't really, we're not specialists in communication and we really just do are very practical and do the best with what we have but I'm very passionate about creating stories so if you need like detailed advice on tools and resources and how to figure things out, I'd love to help out. So you can reach out. Thanks so much. Both of those presentations were fantastic and really informative and yeah I can see from the chat that Yasmin and Margarita already have lots of new ideas as a result of your teachings so thank you so much for your time. In putting this presentation together and I'm sure many of the other camp coordinators will see these this recording to and and we'll have it on our YouTube channel under the camp trainings. Playlist so that all of the camps current and new will have access to this information. So, yeah, it was really worthwhile doing, and I'm really happy that that we now have this recorded so that everyone can can see it and learn from it in the future. I have to leave in about 20 minutes. So I think we can continue until then if there are any specific questions, both for Johanna and Santi. Let's try and keep the questions to about creating a brand because if you have anything else you want us to do a training on like marketing packaging etc. We can work on that. But seeing as this is a branding training. Let's, let's just talk about branding for now and anything else you want to learn about. Just let me know for future trainings. So, Yasmin seeing as this training was originally created for you. Is there anything that you want to know about more. I had the idea but obviously the team have done so far, you know, so well and you know, especially branding their names and how important just to kind of creating a logo and how important it is to have a story behind it. A story telling a product, telling the brand itself. Does that definitely inspire me and especially the last presentation really captivated me. The aspect that you know, obviously it shows that you know how far I am at and you know and how far I'm lacking as well. So this definitely came the position in the right time. So I have to kind of go back and think about the branding aspect of the project. Yes, you know, the difference between the products that is being shown tonight and the one that we're selling and we want to brand ourselves. So again, this one is a wild tree, you know, grows in the wild. It is one of the pieces that is considered to be threatened. So it has to be safe. Otherwise, you know, you know, people are afraid that internationally that we need this tree. So we have to and then a lot of women do work in this area and then and they're undervalued so bringing the woman in and valuing the small scale farms themselves and kind of giving a story to the after product, not just selling the product that comes from but actually, you know, kind of creating a community awareness. And I think that's what I got out of it. Before I was just focusing on just putting the package and just getting the thing out, but we want to tell a story why it's important. If you want to buy that product, why would it be important to buy that product, specifically from us, right? And we have to be able to connect the product to the community as well. And this was definitely a reminder. I would like to see this more and I will definitely reach out to the team to get their support as well if I need help. But I really appreciate it. This is quite awesome training. Cool. I look forward to hearing more Yasmin about some branding ideas for Camp Dry Land Solutions. It would be really cool to see some initial ideas for your brand as a result of this. Are there any other questions or suggestions for future trainings or anything else that we wanted to talk about before we close? I don't know how much. I will definitely go back again and watch it on YouTube as well. But I really like to learn, you know, maybe have another discussion about this, the branding aspect of it. Maybe share ideas as well. I don't know. But I like this one a lot. Do you mean share your ideas? I could do that next time when I put everything together. That sounds good. I think rather than it being another training though, maybe a branding working group could be created that the camps can join and then anyone else who's also working on creating their brand, that could be a place where it's done collaboratively with other camps. In June we're launching our knowledge sharing platform. So I think that could also be a good place for discussions about branding to take place. So maybe let's wait until then it's only a couple of months time and then see if that platform is a good one for discussing this. And if not then maybe I'll see if there's appetite for a working group about branding for camps to come together and share ideas about creating brands. Because there are other camps as well out there who have done it, who could be brought in to give their advice. Yeah, I want to share something I need to go to, but I wanted to share something before. And it's just more related for the process that you are living. I think like with all this information sometimes is a lot of information and then the problems that we don't know how to start. But I think it's like you need to focus into do it really simple. For example, even with the resources we started to just with one bag of coffee, and then with the two bags of coffee. So the idea is to put something out and to start to testing from there as you see the image is always evolving. So it's really hard to go from a concept and then to have everything done, but you could start with the even without selling your product without packaging or without a logo or without something like that. But it's a journey, so step by step, but yeah, I think it will be great to for you used to watch this again to research to always as for help maybe someone knows a graphic designer that will be while into volunteering your product and your project. And yeah, keep keep going until you make it. So, so I think he don't get motivated for the amount of things that that we need to do to create a brand is just to put in the first stone from there start to flowing. I agree with what Sandy said Yasmin I think some good steps forward that you can do now is to create a mood board, which is basically a collection of different images and colors and letters and things that you think represent your purpose and the feeling that you want people to have when they buy your products. But even before that, like Johanna said, have a conversation with with some people that you want to be involved in your camp and ask them what how they feel about frankincense and also have a think about who you who you would sell the product to. These are all things that I think could be done now to give you ideas and then once you have thoughts and opinions of people. Then you can start finding other images that have the same sort of that conjure up the same sort of feeling that you want to conjure up with your brand. If that makes sense. Yeah, and for example, I'm going to show you something like there is a lot of projects and even coffee projects and big brands or whatever that started with something really simple like this is a seal that you can make really cheap like if you're focusing to just have a name even write it with some nice typography and then you have a little bag with something and you put your seal, then you have a brand and then you could start to sell it in markets or with local things or with simple things like that. And even right now is a lot of people love that is even handwriting or. Yeah, that is not a super image we well made. We started with this actually to start to sending the, the, the proofs that we have from the coffee from different people and to chefs to locals to start like that and with a little note right by us by hand. And this was this, this was the starting of everything and then we started to evolve so. Sometimes we over complicate too much just to start and if you already have a product that you already have is is just finding the way to put it out. No, I agree with you. Sometimes it's the obstacles you just to kind of getting things started and getting out a brand now. And that that is definitely that support to see other someone like you guys were created a brand that looks fantastic. You know it looks so great. I really appreciate it. Cool. Amigos, I need to go, but thank you very much for everything. It was lovely to share these things to you. Thank you, Ash. Thank you, Hannah and everyone that was here, Margarita and the rest. So I hope to see you soon again. I'm going to send you the campaign soon as we launch it in the WhatsApp group and I'm going to share how it's going to or our new design is going to look like so. Yeah, have a wonderful day and night wherever you are. And let's keep in touch. Thank you, Sandy. Thanks so much. Thank you so much. See you. Okay. I think maybe now. And the training. Thanks everyone for coming. So much.