 So, I talked about this compactor thing which largely are used then there is the transportation issue then the transportation is should we have larger trucks that is what I tell to students should we have smaller trucks. And then you must have heard about transportation yes you have heard but many students may not have heard. So, I just also tell them what is the transportation and why it is required because they may not be knowing but why do we need transportation and I also tell them that why what are the problem with the larger trucks. Larger trucks are good in terms of the total amount of waste they can take in terms of per unit cost that should be okay. But for example if we have a communities or cities where there are really really small small streets larger truck won't go there ok. You will find that I do not know whether university but in my this area we find that sometime you will find that there is a big truck which goes to collect waste and the whole street is choked because of there is only one place to look at. So, then the question comes whether the large trucks are good or better and then the question comes whether we should have transportation I tell them what is transportation it is basically to collect waste from different small small places and put it in a larger truck etcetera so that it can be transported. And the people then ask that should we have a transportation or that is the important question to ask for should we have it or not should we have a transportation okay yes yes yes okay. But then it is a question that if I want to have a transportation inside a city that also will have some kind of order problem etcetera and that precious land for example in cities like Mumbai is no no right and then also comes the issue of NIMBY not in my backyard I do not want transportation here to my house right okay so these kind of in social environmental issues need to be considered and the routing routing is also important what time the waste should be collected from individual houses right and what should be the path. So, I tell them this is a critical path critical path method you can use the CPM part problem I do not go into detail for the obvious reason because it is just 2 hours lecture then I teach this course for 40 40 hours I actually solve this problem and then you will find that many books they talk about routing and in many books you must have found that this is the typical they have shown take a right turn take a right turn take a right turn take a right turn right this is the problem of this is the issue of the routing this is a right term always you should take a right term all your international books is right term but in fact in India they should be right term because we drive on left side okay so if you are following an international book please do not follow this path you should not take a right turn in fact you should take a left turn because left turn is allowed to us not the right turn so when you are talking about left right turn in India that means you are actually crossing the traffic from the front if you are taking left turn you are allowed to do that many problem many students or many teacher does not understand this because they are following international books or many Indian books also do not understand this so they have copied this so basically you do not take right turn you should take a left turn because left turn is allowed in India little bit small thing but very interesting and sometime they start designing it the right right path method which is not correct I just tell that thing also okay few students become really interesting in this and they start thinking okay so that kind of interest you know they dwell by understanding the small things then I also I talk about large and small trucks and I also tell them that if we are talking about segregation dry bed based okay so that means the transportation system will also become complicated why it will become complicated either I should have multiple trucks or I have should have a truck with multiple container otherwise you know that problem would not be solved and then my composting facility may be at x place and my disposal facility may be at y place so probably I need now two number of trucks or even three number so sometime this segregation will complicate especially your transportation problem and the optimization of your route etc will be little bit more difficult okay so these things need to be told to the students and of course that is interesting too and then I also show that what is a transfer station basically there is no transfer station I am directly taking it to the disposal site if I have a transfer station I am transferring in Whitby yes that is what transfer station is you have everyone of you know it right I also tell them this cost numbers in terms of economics whether transfer station is viable or not okay because if you are going far far away okay that means transfer station is more economically but if you are very close your your disposal site is very close for example many of small cities there is no point of having transfer stations you know this is this is called a distance break even distance after that transfer station will have a more logic than having a small trucks taking directly to this to that it is a break even analysis it is a cost component because when you are having a transfer station you will have capital cost on that okay you know you know it but that is need to be told to them that why we decide and how we decide socioeconomic problem cost issues then we talk about transformation or many of you will call it is a treatment and up to this point of course many will agree that why we need it if they do not need to tell them a couple of things that okay we have to reduce volume etc it can produce some kind of energy that is why we need transformation that is the way you want it then I tell them why transform solid waste I tell them advantages capital cost etc generation of energy reduction of volume etc I skip this because you know it upfront I do not have to tell you but this should be told to the students okay and then there are different methods physical chemical and biological methods that is what are used for transformation or you sometime you call treatment that is up to you guys it does not matter whatever you want to do or whatever the student want to understand and then what are different transformation method physical for example component separation volume reduction compaction for example okay and size reduction for example if I want to take my biological waste to a diester I have to reduce size right I cannot take the larger component so these things I tell them little quickly and it is not so interesting also for many of them and then also chemical transformation combustion gasification and pyrolysis that the largely the chemical transform then I ask what is combustion and I ask who is from chemical and then they change their branches I am not from chemical for today the class no I am not the kids are different right so what is combustion controlled burning what is gasification in absence of oxygen okay what is gasification then limited supply of oxygen basically in combustion we oxidize it to complete final product CO2 and H2O and so comes along with that and in gasification it is a partial oxidation that means you are converting solid fuel to a gases fuel we have plant in Pune who is from Pune anyone from Pune or in that area so we have plant there for gasification right no just chemical have you seen that no don't worry just seed some direction that is interesting only one plant across the country and what is pyrolysis complete thermal destruction in the absence of oxygen what is the benefit of pyrolysis why do we do pyrolysis gas as well as liquid fuel sometime pyrolytic oil not energy intensive process but of course then if you are not producing enough energy you won't do it right but then for example many people are saying that for them plastic the pyrolysis could be a good choice you are converting it to a liquid fuel I do not know I do not so also please do not give them a sentimental answer what is a sentimental answer pyrolysis waste katham anaerobic diation biodegradable over combustion energy don't give that answer okay they are that unfair to the students they just give them realistic answer how much energy if I tell pyrolysis I also tell them okay it's not done in India there are different reasons for that energy intensive actually your waste is not segregated people have not find it interesting many places we tried it failed tell them a real story okay they are very intelligent you might be knowing that then today's students are not our time student they have resources okay you remember what professor other day flipped classes why flipped classes because they know upfront they don't need it what we are doing them so idea here is also have to be a realistic answer to their problem and telling the realistic stories otherwise what will happen pyrolysis do that you are doing they shouldn't come don't tell them because these are their issues with pyrolysis there are issues with gasification there are numerous issue with combustion okay and then biological processes I tell them upfront in many times that although I have not necessarily the fan of biological processes but I tell them the biological processes a good option for Indian waste ultimately there is nothing to lose composting good doesn't happen 50% composting okay another direction produce some useful energy that's still okay because why I am saying there is nothing to lose because when I am doing combustion I am putting some kind of flue gases to the air and that sometimes are dangerous that's probably is not a case with the another direction so I always say that biological processes is at least go for Indian waste then I give little bit of example of this physical processes and chemical and biological shear shredders these are used to just shred your waste right you know what is shear shredder right if you are teaching for example different other courses we ask ask them to design different components but because of this three hours thing we don't do that I don't do in my classes we don't ask them to design something because it's too small of the time right so I just tell them this is shear shredder basically if you have paper plastic etc or some kind of basically you just by using shear forces you just shred it okay then I have to tell them what is the trauma screen to segregate waste on the basis of size largely works from solid kind of waste if it's liquid in nature then this this screen will be choked little bit of idea what kind of different systems we use and you should also tell them that you know when we are having these systems we have to use them in tandem that means it's not only one we use several of them like integrated waste management so that's what I tell them this is what you tell to your students by the way okay I just forget to ask this question so how do you teach is it by blackboard or is it by PowerPoint or how do you do that okay how many of you use PowerPoint quite a lot right and how many of you or your institution just use blackboard so combination is there so combination I considered in PowerPoint okay only blackboard only few right okay so it's changing everywhere right okay so you know what has happened with this blackboard versus PowerPoint training is for example this picture right I cannot draw it actually if I have to draw it take a lot of time or other way initially when I was student professor will bring that chart right big chart they will bring otherwise it has become difficult to teach so that means we are more or less on the same page you are also using PowerPoint air classifiers if I have to let's say separate paper or lighter materials even plastic I can use air classifier I pass my base with high speed air I increase the area velocity comes down the papers are separated but other materials are settled on very simple technology if you just see this this is also I tell the student and horizontal also as well as the vertical one and then magnetic separator for magnetic materials you pass it with a kind of conveyor belt there are couple of magnets they extract the material which is magnetic in nature and the remaining falls down and I do it second time also little bit of more purity comes you guys tell everything on this so do you teach this also in the course you said yeah that side yes show us so show picture but no only picture because we are to my knowledge I don't know where actually it is working very interesting it is not in many places even not in Mumbai also for them for example but I think the the interesting part is even you show them this picture that should be enough no no they don't agree yeah in when I was a student the my teacher asked us how many of you have seen railway track actually 50 percent of class in the engineering I am talking about 50 percent of student were not having seen a railway track now a thing has changed now yes if you ask railway track they will just you put a youtube and see railway track right where is this you know in the railway track there is a design of sleepers etc and it was very difficult to visualize to for many of us because we haven't seen the railway track actually so visualization and actually this mobile technology etc has helped us in many ways right but if you are asking that probably should show some film on youtube actually I do that I not always show them or keep them a link send an email that this is a link you can see that is the way because I think in I don't think in Assam they are doing it there is no magnetic separation happening probably yeah I know that too also as far as my knowledge is concerned not so it but at the same time in youtube we will find the very interesting films in which everything is there so they can you can show that part then I tell them what composting you know it is a very interesting technology probably a more or less a free technology I call it a free technology if you have space there and you produce a material humus material which can be used a kind of kind of fertilizer you can call it fertilizer or at least a soil stabilizer soil condition is the right term to use it okay the if the C to N ratio the nutrient etc is little bit okay so you can call it even a fertilizer but the soil conditioner is the right term right so then many people when I tell them this is composting then they ask why don't we do composting it's free you understand what I'm saying because I tell them it's more or less free technology okay and then they ask very simple question right why don't we do it then land should be available it's duration shouldn't be 365 it will happen in a month for normal composting to take place basically two months two to three months I would say in two months it will happen if you're you're optimizing the heat no sir you're told that's a free technology so in case if you're not optimizing it will I see what you're saying but whatever I'm saying we're optimizing it just put try to control the temperature put some little bit soil on the top of it okay even if open three months should be okay yeah then people ask why don't you do it then okay but even for composting we have 40 percent of solid which are composting not not much not much very very good there is no what else why don't we do it then solid waste should be there okay so farming system is mainly depending upon the chemical fertilizer usage and all so nobody is ready to do this very nice very nice yeah it's it's there are many issues with that one issue is that our waste is not segregated so along with that we will get glass we'll metal who wants who the hell wants metal in the agriculture field there is no market actually there is very it's very we have found that it's very difficult to find a proper market and then our agriculture land is very far from cities so that means there is a transportation of composting and then sometime we found the nutrient value is not so high so I better not invest that much money in that terms okay but nevertheless this still is a viable option in many places for example if you have a small city probably you're surrounded by agriculture land etc market with respect to season house that's the important point out so these things need to be told to a student otherwise they ask on you you said it's free but why you're not doing it at least free everyone can do right sir in belgium it is practiced actually yeah I can tell you that the composting is the most practiced technology across the India so they're selling it as a manual to the farmers nearby farmers in banks okay so how much you are charging I think 30 rupees something like that how much 30 rupees I think 30 rupees for what I need to cross check the rates for that 30 rupees for 100 kilo one ton no in bags I'm talking 400 kg 30 paisa no not 30 paisa in terms of rupees I need to cross check but what we have seen is that composted material can be used as a manual actually these Ramkee and Miro engineers they are no I'm not denying it that's what I said it free technology and it's it's produced compost following this but I'm also taught I should I talk to my students about the challenges also no no yeah that's another point also it's a social issue also that oh kya has no waste you're bringing waste from every city to my farm why should I take it and you will find that even we are doing segregation there will be some kind of plastic etc so I'm not denying it but I tell the students the issues also okay that means why it is not the obvious choice in many ways pathogens are there if I can maintain little bit high temperature pathogens generally goes but certainly there are pathogens we basically I don't want to bring cities problem to my farm that is the main critical hello sir city of Indore is associated with composting yeah where the first time in 1930 Indore method of composting was adopted and in those days because trial attains were there so night soil along with the solid waste was being arranged in the layers and the top was covered with the soil cover and the period was two to three months very good so I think what I should do is probably glance all my slides and then we can discuss probably right that's better way yes yeah otherwise it's probably we won't end up my presentation any day but I understand you have real problems and real issues and that's what need to be told to the students so then after that I hello sir sir why vermicomposting is not getting any yeah I will know what vermicompost right now let's let's go talk first and then I will tell you why okay thank you so and then I also tell you what advantages okay I just keep this and then different types of composting conventional conventional the one windrow composting and vermicomposting and then so this is I give you an example of windrow composting basically you make a windrow right okay and you know sometime there is this interesting designs also have you if you go to any book you will find interesting designs also so I generally do not go in this class for telling all these designs and I also tell you what rotary drum composting what is rotary drum composting yeah we are circulating it's a closed system we can maintain the temperature yeah I mean those ways which can be composted in open compost it can also be composed rotary drum that's what I tell them okay so again rotary drum composting a little bit expensive but at the same time it's faster you were saying three months we can finish it in let's say three weeks rise in temperature and even I can control order problem also and because it's mixed right it's circulated so what happens is that the reaction is a little bit faster okay it's a closed system it's a more control I have it no it's aerobic yeah it's just 20 30 filled and I allow even air to pass natural circulation okay so I also tell about this and I also tell about vermicomposting what is vermicomposting yeah everyone knows vermicomposting right and we do I also tell them vermicomposting and to make it a little bit interesting I tell them these worms are not free they cost a lot you know how much they cost how much they cost no cost no yeah it may if it's if it's free in chinay send us some if they are free in figure from tamil night go into if it's free in selam send us send me some if they are free in selam which one this one hero which is available yeah hero which is available but the cost is really low so even if we are not so which one you said this eugen utilize eugenia sir if it's exotic exotic no I thought it it is coming from africa africa but it costs thousand rupees per kg chinese firm sir yeah so usually the biodiversity concern no so we have to use the indigenous species sir so we have to do this vermicomposting in the local or otherwise the indoor method is very nice user so basically what I tell them is our biodiversity yeah I understood so what I tell them is that the worms which are everywhere in rainy season the local one they are not that efficient so to make it a little bit faster we have to have these species brought from africa and china etc they are not indian indigenous to make it faster right and they cost a little bit someone told me it's thousand rupees per kg 500 they are a little bit you are doing a business now okay 500 okay he he will sell you in 500 I will sell in 1000 rupees okay so there is a cost involved but nevertheless vermicomposting has been a a decent technology for sometimes basically they eat your food and make a material which is good for soil soil conditioner and I don't know whether it can be qualified for vermicomposting has been a success I don't know it's the one time so once you buy for example 1 kilo no they will grow yeah so I told you it's just for making it interesting to tell them they are not free rate of radiation yeah very high rate is more yeah they are very very faster yes you can tell them all technical terms I stood and tell either faster quicker yes you can see idea is to make student understand your problem but at the same time make it interesting also okay make it technical at the same time make it interesting move ahead then anaerobic digestion waste to energy good idea or bad idea good idea okay many of you are doing probably to say good idea okay I tell that you know we have food paste or biodegradable waste and we convert it into some useful energy we produce biogas and some kind of residue which actually can be used as a compost yes the residue can be used as a compost that's what I tell them and I also tell them this one compogas remember this compogas is a I think Denmark waste or European company which has which is doing this anaerobic digestion I asked them to stay on this slide for one minute just try to understand it so you should also spend 30 seconds then because your process is faster it's nothing but basically anaerobic digestion and what they are saying is that whatever is generated that can be used basically they are saying it's a closed system you are generating biogas which can be used for energy generation you are producing liquid which can use a liquid fertilizer okay this is a company in the Europe okay then many of you or many of your students will find it how much energy I can generate that's a simple question right if we can generate biogas once you tell them this is the process there are two types of single phase and two chamber system where you can have methanogenesis and it as to tell them whatever you think is appropriate for them okay but then they ask them how much energy we can generate that's very important question right how much so I tell them I show them this slide which basically tells that and this is an experiment done by an company which may not be that correct but doesn't matter which says that if I have 150 tons per day production of waste which can produce you 1.2 megawatt of power so now I ask them to calculate how much energy can be produced for Mumbai but because many of you are not from Mumbai so may I ask you to calculate how much energy can be produced in your city can you do the do the calculation quickly if it's 1.50 tons per day you are producing 1.2 megawatt of electricity equivalent if it is what is your waste generated in your city how much energy you can produce so tell me who who is from Delhi Noida you're from Delhi Noida okay so how much energy we can produce in Delhi madam no use calculate by using this method don't don't tell me the numbers just like that because you know it right they're using they have three plants in Delhi now I need to know what is the total waste generated in Noida okay do you know what is the total waste generated in your city I know it is 5.6 megawatt because it is about 700 tons per day very nice 5.6 megawatt what could be the total energy or electricity consumption in your city any guess 1,000 megawatt equivalent 5 for this for my water supply scheme yeah Narmada project yeah in water comes 70 kilometers away from river Narmada Maheshwar to Indore and for that 1 crore per month they are paying as electricity charges okay so that much I can inform okay so I do not know but you I tell them that calculate how much electricity is consumed by a city and how much waste you are generating and out of that how much electricity you can produce and tell me in terms of percentage how much it is how big this number is okay so when we are talking about generation of energy are we saying that we are transitioning our cities is it significant or it's not significant so how many of you think it's significant significant yeah that that's another question there are two questions anything coming from from nothing is yes yes but the question another question is is it a good number is it significant or not no I understood that that's there but is it significant in terms of energy production or not for 50 megawatt I don't think so no states are basically fighting for energy from the central pool these days so if I stay a single city can produce 56 megawatts means what about the other cities Mumbai is the largest city yeah not just where are you from I am from Kerala which city Kochi Kochi how much waste probably you are generating what is the population 3000 maximum no no no there's a thousand not even thousand per day 200 300 300 so that means five megawatt so is it five megawatt significant for your city or not no if you just take Kochi it's okay but if you're thinking about Calicut thinking about thinking about okay so this kind of answer you will get every time right very interesting many say it's no it's good many say okay so I thought it was too much but it's too less okay this kind of question is comes basically the idea here is to give them a real picture to tell them it's just one percent probably or even less than that but still it's okay right if I am getting my salary is one lakh rupees if I'm getting one thousand rupees extra for doing little bit extra work and probably even no work right I was sleeping instead of sleeping I start working something like that because sleeping is important for that sleeping but something like that if I get little bit extra work and extra money it's not bad right is it bad no that's the same with this I am reducing my waste I am reducing the impact on the environment in different ways I am producing energy which probably is not more than one percent still it's okay okay the whole idea is do not tell them the energy scenario will change of course it won't but still I am using generating useful energy I am reducing my waste which otherwise is going to landfill and creating other kinds of air and water problems that is the whole idea okay so the point here is the realistic answer then in generation thermal road many of you say especially the people from Delhi Noida says that insulation is a nice way insulation is a good technology or bad technology who said good not feasible bad even if it's feasible it's bad or good so inorganic waste is no calorific value no okay hospital waste is another but like municipal waste yeah but that carbon is carbon neutral it's a good good good idea why because you can stand near to that okay so you have to tell them that what is basically insulation it's complete combustion this is the typical types of insulator we use great kind of insulator I do not tell them what other technologies because there are numerous technologies and I also tell them that so this is the question I keep on asking students many 12 countries when I say 12 countries for example US they haven't used or they haven't they are very engaged waste energy systems even insulators carbon issue if you see what carbon that creates carbon neutral actually hello sir this system may be good for disposing this biological waste bio biomedical waste but not for this not for our simple municipal solid waste right yes sir why actually we are not generating anything from that municipal solid waste because the calorific value of indian MSW is pretty low it certainly may not in many cases generate useful energy okay and then there are what the issues about the which pollution air pollution right that is the biggest problem you have to have supplementary fuel that's there but you know more concern is about the air pollution okay so then I tell them little bit what air pollution it's not simply the what professor said he tells but I little bit what the specific issues and what are the specific issues with the insulators sir I had one doubt yes sir in cold climate race pressure will be very low I don't know whether biological treatment will work or no means you may be knowing that the most of biological treatment is used in cold climate conditions means temperature less than they maintain the temperature yeah because I have not you have insulation in Denmark Germany they are using an aerobic direction a lot because they can maintain it you insulate the system no heating insulation okay I tell about them what the emissions I tell them that there will be heavy metals there will be particulate metals there will be inorganic gases there will be dioxin and furan do you know what is that dioxin and furans plastic any kind of chlorinated material if you burn it you certainly end up having dioxin I sensitize it a lot I tell them if you are burning plastic in open probably in the northern part of India where there is a cold place you are exposed to dioxin and furan I do not know how you do it but that should be told actually that is very very critical right many of you may be knowing dioxin and furan it is very dangerous compound most toxic compound one of most toxic compound ever invented by human okay and then I tell them what are the different pollution you talk about effluent etc I keep on telling that basically insulation can produce some energy but then we are talking about different types of pollution and why it is not even used in many of 12 countries us is one example because of the issues of dioxin and furans and then I ask them to read a book by Rachel Carlson Silent Spring no one reads it but it is no harm to us no I am talking about student not you you must have read it I tell them to read it you know and some some students 1 2% find it interesting they start reading it Rachel Carlson book is very interesting actually so then I little bit tell them what is dioxin and furan and then also you should also tell them that even those can be controlled it is ready to temperature then I tell them this is the chemical structure of dioxin and furans and now the modern waste energy system or even incinerators who is telling incinerators this is what they look like okay so I ask them what did you notice in this picture that same question I ask you guys what did you notice emissions which are emitting after incineration they are treated with the vet scrubber and ESP or back filter methods very nice basically I tell them that you know the modern waste energy systems are not like our old system the combustion does not mean just I burn it I tell them it is what air pollution control devices and 60% of the money 60% of the total capital cost actually is for air pollution control devices so those cities those countries who are useful generating useful energy out of it they are not polluting air they have they are doing it in the city center in den markets in city center okay in in in Taiwan they are doing in city center but they are having air pollution control device they have online monitoring system actually you can see on your computer you can see on your mobile that what are the pollution coming from the incinerator which is next to my house okay and remember this will cost us a lot but it is controlling all kind of air pollution problems so this thing also need to be tell that that means which cannot be biased towards one technology because we do not like it personally okay you have to tell this also that this is and why the issue is with Indian condition so far Indian because if we do not follow the if we do not have air pollution control devices ultimately we are creating more problems forgot about 2 megawatt 3 megawatt we actually are end up having air pollution problem which is much much severe than just having a solid waste management problem so that is the concern for India okay so far so good okay and then gasification you know it is very simpler to incineration what we are doing partially oxidation you can tell so this picture also and then I come to disposal what is disposal it is very the waste coming after our treatment yeah again to be disposed to be disposed whatever remaining waste actually but in India all of our waste is disposed directly you are under okay yeah you want to see something else yeah and in many times in many in the in the previously they said that we can put into sea also good idea or bad idea why sea is so big you put anything that is our tradition subcoach gangam and although no accumulate in fish not it fish we vegetarian we wagons americans said now is a wagon now I don't know what's a wagon means they don't even drink milk huh so the ecosystem of the water body will be spoiled the ecosystem of the water body very nice very nice this and the photosynthetic rate inside the sea I see that reduced you should make this point to the students that you know it's good to solve your problem do not give your problem to fish means by that do not destroy the whole ecosystem because you cannot manage the waste so this sea dumping is largely no no in the 12th world open dumping but what we are doing in India so far largely someone said that it's not 100% but largely we are open dumping that need to be stopped in future then I say why landfill you know people little bit of example it can generate emissions if I am doing open dumping that means I am telling what the sanitary landfill and I also show what means sanitary landfill means because I'm skipping many of slide because this is common very basic slide you know it I'm not teaching you I'm just telling it what I teach please remember this sir I need to ask one question yeah please ask in the landfill what is happening in Delhi Noida area nowadays that the heavy metals are getting leached into the water table yeah so what do you think about the sanitary landfill and the landfills that we are using very good so what do you think guys I think madam is talking about okla landfill if I'm correct okay exactly if I'm talking so many of the people if nowadays we want to visit it first we'll be visiting okla landfill if I'm correct Delhi so what is the other round is if this is going to continue in a unmanaged way might be the other foreigners might be visiting Delhi for seeing how we are managing that is a question the second one is we can go for liners many of you are becoming researchers now that's very interesting but that's not a part of this course we can go for double liner systems yeah we can go triple liner also but that will cost us a lot okay I understood your question I will answer it so basically you know what is the sanitary landfill right it's a liner system your leachate collection system and by the way open dumping we always have this problem if you are open dumping your waste your leachate will be generated no one can stop it if you are putting your waste somewhere if the rain comes into that the material will leach and if it leach it's simply the first thing it will go to surface water and if it percolates it will go to groundwater no one in the world can stop it open dumping will always have a problem of groundwater contamination of course and also this surface emissions if you have a sanitary landfill if you have properly sanitary landfills you know what is sanitary landfill it is a liner system it has a compacted clay basically there are a couple of layers which bond allow this shouldn't allow this water to flow to groundwater provided you have a proper leachate collection system which is properly designed okay there is no mashing but what has happened even if you have liners for example you were saying about liner the liners are also very interesting and you know these rats rodents they are also very interesting why did I say that this rodents have this long teeth right you see in the rodents they are longer teeth and then it will need to be they have to cut something if they don't cut they probably die so they need to cut every time you know it's not about food it's not that because they are eating our liner so many times this rodent will cut those liners also and there is some kind of their minimum molecular diffusion happening through this liner you cannot stop that that's as per the science and the interesting part is about the operation and how you have laid them they are basically synthetic material you put a nail start leaking and the very interesting example I give to everyone is it's only for mail please excuse the females when you go to washroom to urinate what is the first concern if it's not good hotel or five-star hotel or your house because that urine can fall on your on your trouser why because the pipe is leaking you didn't notice that yes or no yes why it is that I spend one lakh rupees having this beautiful toilet but the person who is doing the maintenance he probably charge it 200 rupees he has not put the pipe properly it always leaks and I put the same analogy for our liners you have spent lakhs x rupees you have very high quality G material but if it is not put properly if it's not attached from one line to another it certainly will leak and no one can stop it so madam your noida valla problem no it's better to buy house somewhere else I'm joking look they don't go you know that godwater contamination even if it is happening at 100 kilometer away probably you are you are what is contaminated in another place yeah we normally go to the sanitary landfill yeah only after having so many years open dumping and open burning then only we go for implementation of the sanitary landfill even for co-emptive city that is happening yes they are having about 700 acres land for the disposal of solid waste for the 15-20 years they have gone for open land dumping already the groundwater got contaminated now they are going for the sanitary landfill so you said why they're doing it or what you're saying I don't know what's actually this is not the problem because of the sanitary landfill after the current formation of sanitary landfill it has been started little earlier yeah I know but at least still they're doing something so you should be happy for that because the problem already is happening even assume if they don't do it even today it will more contamination but at least they're doing it at least so that's okay okay so it's all about all these issues the gentleman who said double liner is actually a good idea except that it will cost little bit more but it's a full proof system that's why you know for your biomedical waste and hazardous waste we use double liner system at least the second liner system is a control but then it's a question of the cost also you know if the system doesn't come free how much is the cost of waste disposal or proper treatment facility if I should have a total engineered landfill biomethanization plant segregation RDA what do you think what can be the cost if I ask you for per unit cost that means for each kilogram of waste I properly manage scientifically what do you think will be the cost 1 rupees per kg 2 rupees per kg 5 rupees 10 rupees 20 rupees less than less than 1 rupees for having a engineered landfill biomethanization plant etc having an integrated waste facility less than 1 rupees which technology will do it in less than 1 rupee any guess and I think the cost of land except cost of land cost of land will be a variable big variable in addition to cost of land any guess 2025 what no that's little bit too much but around 5 to 10 rupees per kg 5 to 10 rupees per kg for the proper management of MSW sometime I get tomato in 10 rupees per kg yes say yes not in general in Mumbai but in once in blue moon elsewhere I was probably get quite often right but I can tell you the cost of this treatment disposal etc is proper management I am talking what is in the range of 10 rupees per kg okay so that need to be also told to the students as well to the policy maker it doesn't include transportation cost so if you add to 2 rupees more 12 15 rupees that is really expensive right that's the truth I also show this landfill bottom this is a liner system it's probably visible one this little bit of making it more interesting then sell liner basically this is the liner I am talking about high density polyethylene material okay it's a good idea you put it in the bottom so that your leachate problem which is generated in cities that shouldn't go to the groundwater and on the top of that you put a leachate collection system okay but this is what I am mentioning if there are cuts into this if there is some kind of leakage your whole problem your whole this costing of a few crore rupees gone because it will leach then leachate collection system I show through them show little bit of these pictures how the landfill is working I also show them that what is the right way for example I am taking waste today it may rain in the evening right so you have to put some kind of soil covering every day so that means some kind soil covering should be there after once your the cells are over basically put in different cells you should fill it with the final cover that means 2 feet of soil and by the way this soil also this is a clay soil liner this will also cost you okay so what is the best way then do not produce waste once you produce it you have started the problem you have started the cost issues you have started all kinds of problems reduce okay this is about gas collection system and I also tell them about some kind of activity happening there and I also it is not may not be that visible for you guys but I will show you this what is the leachate right it is highly contaminated wastewater even more much more than our municipal wastewater it will have heavy metals what you are saying madam that will be there you cannot stop them okay so what do you think what can be done in noida there was a talk in it deli about all these things in the rdt department which department rdt rural rural development technology and they said that they have developed some worms which can eat away the heavy metals you know yeah I do not know about that but there could be some technologies which can so they have been working upon it and they say that 70 percent of the heavy metals can be you know extracted I think well that that could be a good idea but I think it will work in the small skill but large skill it could be really really complicated think of a few thousand tons of waste thousand square meter how many worms you want to know but they first analyze the waste and accordingly they put the amount of worms that that are required yeah but it's an experimental stage right yeah okay to control the leaching problem first we have to take care of the site where we are making the landfills unless that the ground is not watertight there are aquifuse aquiclude formations soil cover followed by such strata which are non porous non permeable in nature so if we go for making dumping of the solid waste in these areas there will be no chances of percolating or leaching of the solid metals in the groundwater so basically what is the problem here is you are researchers you are not students you always find a research angle everything that is not happening with the students right I appreciate what you're saying but we have basically we have to do basic EIA sure we find a proper site there should be proper groundwater should be low there are different conditions for doing that okay so that's okay I understand that but you know this is very interesting but because we cannot tell everything to to student in 2-3 hours so I don't go on EIA kind of things okay that's another interesting part that how to select your sites what should be the ground level how far it should be from locality communities municipal etc we can do that but not in this course and once you close the site what do you do grow beautiful trees make a garden yes monitor it for 15 30 years as per government of India's MSW rules it should be monitored for 15 years actually in the 12th country they should say it should be monitored for 30 to 40 years okay children can play there right okay yes but remember if it is not properly managed and if you have different types of waste many times you put hazardous waste into that it can create a problem it's not a good idea I don't think it we should use this for garden purpose etc we can have it further used for landfilling again we take out the waste and again make it a landfill rather than using it for some other purpose because our systems are not that robust remember this but nevertheless we can do that okay how much land is required so if you can calculate for your city that would be wonderful can you calculate how much land is required for your city for next 10 years if I use this kind of hypothesis I give you two minutes you may be knowing that you know in Mumbai this MCGM is struggling a lot with finding a proper landfill site okay because there is no land actually and no one it's you know this nimby issue not in my backyard no one wants landfill near to any place no one wants it right so could you calculate it for your city yes no okay you know this is another way of sensitizing it and tell to student do some kind of calculation and sometime I tell to a student this will come in the exam and 90% of time it comes in the exam and still 80% of students cannot do it because they never tried it they didn't trusted me in the class sometime I tell them these are 10 questions I will ask exam and I ask five out of it still people have bbcc grades yes have you have you have noticed that if you tell student this is a 10 10 question I will ask exam and even if you are 10 still you will find that the grading has happened legal framework you everyone of knows legal frame I just cover very small component of legal framework I tell them there are rules MSW 2000 rules they are likely to be amended very soon and I also tell them what is the responsibility of municipalities and what is the responsibility of individual citizens and I slowly tell them that no one is following the rules there is no much point in talking what the rules which are no one is following so far neither municipality nor none of us okay someone was telling me hierarchy waste management hierarchy right that is what I also tell them that reduce reuse recycle waste analogy then ultimately the where minimum should go to the landfill I also tell them 3R reduce reuse and recycle I do not want to tell you what is reduce reuse and cycle because you know it but sometime you should tell the student that what are the advantages of reducing reusing cycle give them some beautiful examples I also tell them that if I am reusing my not using but recycling my aluminum canes is coca-cola cane versus if I am producing the virgin aluminum from the from the ores or from the mine the energy uses 10 versus 100 so if I have to produce it new new aluminum ore I have to use 100 units of electricity if I am recycling it I just use 10 or even less than that units so how important how we are first of all saving material in recycling and reusing we also are saving energy we are also saving money that need to be told to students in your different ways but what is reduced reuse cycle most of your students will be knowing but sometime it does not hurt tell them a little bit of interesting story okay that is what I told in the beginning my class is all about stories when if it is of recycling I tell them sometimes little bit slowly do not spend much of time on that I also tell them what is happening in the 12 countries because you know people are it is a global world right people always want to know that what is happening in the different parts of the world I also tell them that you know they are moving away from land filling but still land filling is prominent there there is lot of recycling recycling continuously decreasing and incineration is more or less steady it is not increasing not decreasing and it is for 32 major European countries okay these things I keep on telling them and that what we are doing in India it is not very accurate number we I do not know authenticity of this but largely we are open dumping very small amount we are composting there are a few four five based energy plants in different places I do not know personally whether they are working nicely or not you will find different stories why there are different people in the news you will find that this plant is not working that plant is not working there is who is from Hyderabad so you have this RDF plant in Hyderabad right RDF RDF plant in Hyderabad refuse derived fuel plant yeah it is you are from Hyderabad also I am not from Hyderabad I am from Selangiv local district which technology that the selco t-fact technology no whatever the this rubbish materials we are going to die to use for to compressing all these things or we are making the bails and send them here into the industry yeah very nice so yeah basically some industries have some municipality is RDF system which we are segregating based and then making this paper plastic and some kind of wood material etc as a fuel sending it to some kind of cement factory and sometime burning to produce energy yeah Hyderabad is one example I think there is another couple of more cities Vijay Vada has that I also tell about them mechanical biological treatment system where this basically this is kind of system which need to be used for larger cities you know when we talking about 7000 plus tons of waste like Mumbai we are not talking about small waste energy facility which will take 2 ton 1 ton 3 ton 7000 ton is means that means we need 7000 facility similar to that that is not going to happen for larger cities like Mumbai etc you need tremendous big systems which are continuously working controlled by SCADA automated systems take lot of waste all machines working automatically that is the only way or if you have land then you use decentralized facility right otherwise you need all kind of sophisticated systems I sometimes tell about that component to them and after that I show them a video 7 minute film which is from YouTube I show it to them unfortunately or fortunately I do not think I have okay so these this is an interesting picture can you see that yes can you see that from the okay the guy who is doing somersault and when I asked them to write a caption on this I do not know whether you can see it from the bottom okay to make it a little bit more interesting you can also write a caption it is taken in I do not know where and then this one what is this child thinking and whose responsibility is this actually for example someone was telling me that how we are related you know I do not think that the people I have the student has this kind of feeling because they know that it is ready to us right give a child this is very interesting right you can see from there if I have to throw it outside my window it is free if I have to give it to someone I it cost me which one is a better option in terms of economy first one okay but then said he said who is human being human con a human so which option is better now second option okay it is not all about money yeah every one of us are not only here for earning money that is not the sole objective right then probably not teaching then probably some other business or some other thing would have been better right every one of us not just want to earn money we also have some social responsibility we are good human also right so the second option is better than when we are using second option of course if you become responsible that certainly is the second option we always become I after that I generally take quiz it happens little bit in different manner in my classes because we take quiz after two three lectures right so what I will do it during this program because remember you all of your coordinator I will ask for this quizzes I will segregate them a little bit more for example the two three numerical I asked you to solve how much waste generated I will certainly ask again when I am taking those lectures and you have to make them I think you can solve it right very simple one and what will happen is for example how much waste is generated in your city so people may not be knowing so during the break etc you ask them to use their mobile etc or maybe next day they should bring the answer it is a little bit of more what do you call that inside it is not I go ahead and come I just little bit think a little bit because once they start searching what is happening in their city they will also know that what their city is doing yes so it is good to ask those kind of questions to students and also to the teachers it is bring you a little bit inside your city many time I ask to my students okay from where water is coming what is the source of water answer is one person will tell yes sir I know I saw that in X Y did it others know they do not know from where our water is coming in IIT campus okay so that kind of sensitization also do the only thing which I could not cover here unfortunately is the biomedical based so I will just glance the slides I will just show you the slides okay and then tell you this is what I do generally so I am sorry there is not enough time for this but let us I show you the slides okay but by the way in that class I will try to explain that too so definition what is biomedical based okay what is infectious waste and what is non-infectious waste what is the status in India how much is generated this I skipped there only same because then here I talk more about rules because biomedical based rules are generally followed in India by the way we may be knowing because that is hazardous it is hazardous in nature so I talk little bit more about rules because there are this color container etc etc I pay a lot of attention on rules here okay what how do we manage it what are the categories as per rules 7 category based and what are the different types of containers color coding color coding I tell them then different treatment options incinerators you know every one of you know that incineration is a good technology or much better technology for biomedical based then why there are two chambers what should be the temperature operating standards I think you also do the same thing right more or less yeah emission standard microwaving what is microwave technology autoclaving what is autoclaving irradiation irradiation plasma pyrolysis deep burial only for small cities and then I stop here again they have to write a caption so this is how I deal with this course okay we can also insist something on the leachate treatment in the leachate treatment in the solid base yeah but that's a very good idea I think why I didn't cover it because in my there is a wastewater treatment we are teaching so there is emphasis in there you have been practiced with open dump base yeah tell them something on landfill capping also landfill capping okay one one thing yeah and this contaminated site you can tell them like landfill remediation also landfill remediation but you know the problem is because I just have three hours landfill mining I tell them a little bit I tell them that how they are trying to solve in Mumbai yeah leachate treatment with respect to physical chemical and biological we can patch up on yeah and here you and you have mentioned something about RDF that is also now shooting up yeah and we have been practiced with only open dumping operations we can tell them like landfill capping also if it is possible yeah and we have been practiced with so many years with open dumping operations but we can tell something on landfill remediation if it is possible and if it is anything on post closure we can also tell something on post closure monitoring also that is one mandatory and now is a catchy word is on landfill mining yeah another thing this is we can also tell them like co-generation plants not only WTE we can tell them is on co-generation plants with respect and the another important thing is this is the yeah some of the post closure monitoring and some of the latest developments in the waste sector very good I think the concern which many of you may also will have when you're teaching this courses you have to deviate from the core course always right I do not want to just focus on the 55 minutes on the course I have to take a little bit of interesting stories also otherwise students lose interest you agree with me no if I don't tell them 5 stories in my class no one listens to me I have to talk about cricket I have to talk sometime about films I have to talk about American that is reality right we cannot concentrate for a very long hours ultimately are they are sitting for 6 hours in a day right if I make my class just technical they don't listen to me so I make it a little bit interesting so I have I generally intentionally spend approximately 5 to 10 minutes on telling something which has no meaning in terms of class to make it more interesting and then I have largely for 55 minutes class I just have 45 minutes to teach the real thing right and then I have just 3 lectures on this if I want to add more then probably I have to squeeze and do it faster for example what I am doing here you just have to move faster that is not a very good way of teaching so what we have thought is teach them where minimum and you know these students are very intelligent right and then once we sense ties we tell them the real picture they can now think little bit and if they want to read something else for example land mining I just mentioned one line I mentioned that in Mumbai in we have no land now now there are projects coming that how to take that waste out of the cities and bring that land back to the landfill side excuse me sir reclamation yeah so so that kind of things need to be done but this is again a challenge I don't know what all you guys how you do it because this is for us is just four five lectures and actually I covered a little bit on greenhouse gases yeah that we do and we have this nfs probably you have also there are many volunteer students coming out of that better we can have a side visit yeah so okay so let's take talk about how to run this course when you are working as coordinator that what can we added further or what can we reduced or what can we done or should we have more points okay so side visit of course that's that's there but that's what a real teaching how about yeah how about for this so we have given them the form feedback form if you can take because you have very good points I take it at least for my class if not for this course but can you just note it down write it please so that we can see one more thing yeah you are mentioning about the area requirement for the landfills yeah it's very high yeah I calculated comes around yeah 10.5 hectares it's very huge area but I came to know from the sources there is a one type called landfill reactors yeah bio bio landfill reactors we have it here in consumer they can be an option for reducing these burden of land requirements there are some issues with that for example by rule we shouldn't put any waste which is biodegradable landfill okay but that this has gone but then there are some other issues with the biodegradable instead of biodegradable landfill why not to do an urban digestion but one more thing is regarding the heavy metal contamination in new Delhi area they were suggesting that microorganisms is it a proposal on the landfill or or it's going to be on a leachate or that I was telling that I want to yeah oh you sit on a land landfill area or you sit on the leachate collected or it is on the ground water what is the idea they are having yeah please answer so in USA there is a state called Washington and the first two nuclear bombs were assembled in Washington so it is near Canada border and there is a river that is coming from Canada and it is passing through Washington state near Seattle and the radioactive waste of those first two bombs were dumped 50 meters inside the ground chamber so 10 years ago they found that there is a little amount of radioactive leachate in the Columbia River so they investigated and they found that after 50 years of dumping the leachate which was not supposed to come out of 50 meters they traveled a long way and came into the Columbia River and they were polluting the environment and the fishes are getting radioactive and all other things so what they did they discovered some kind of microbe that would eat those radioactive materials and produce glass so they took I think it's called a glass chamber project so they introduced those microbes in that area and their idea was to make the whole chamber is a compact solid glass so it's a landfill yeah I think my another opinion on you see there are many technologies which always are coming up right and for example this reclamation this cleaning the leachate treatment there are always technologies for that but please when we're talking to students please make it very clearly to them whether it's a commercialized technology whether it's a lab scale unit whether it's expensive whether it's not expensive because otherwise what happens is if we just tell them oh we can do everything yes we can do but then we have to also mention in many times what is the cost component whether this technology which can is using can we use it for 7000 tons can we use it for one ton waste for example waste to energy right an orbit diation how we can be a plant so these things if you don't tell them they go from your class assuming that everything is possible but you're not doing anything that is kind of unfair way of telling them you tell them cost you tell them this technology is there but what is the scale where I'm using it so if you don't answer them then it is also confused okay it's always good to tell them about your research but at the same time tell that what is the limitation and what is the scale you're doing is it will clear the idea of cost and everything so better to take these two so you're saying that you should take your students to the site yeah that's a good idea I don't take it's under the equilibrium at my location we are having gasifier also where are you from sir one another okay so you have gasifier for solid waste yeah but from agriculture or no we are having industry sugar industry from industry right okay yeah that's a good idea take you should take your students to the field and show them reality what's happening okay that's very good idea I totally agree with that but please write as a coordinator that what need to be done further so that this course can be delivered in the best possible manner yes we should cover e-waste also yes we means it's I and you again together okay I will put something on e-waste this is very critical you want a jar of solid waste but then in three hours it will be too much to ask for if you want I can have two slides in the beginning I can have what is solid waste and what is a jar of waste what is industrial waste what is e-waste what is biomedical waste and I can add e-waste actually okay please write it down there okay so once you have written down please give it to them and thank you very much