 A very good afternoon, everybody who has joined us live on Facebook for this chat show with the counsellors on digital responsibility, the do's and the don'ts. We are very fortunate to have with us Ms. Tiffany Ingram. She is a pastoral lead and head of languages at Wapping High School in East London. That's our international partner school. She also leads coaching throughout the school and believes in this approach for nurturing independent and prepared learners. She is passionate about student engagement and well-being and believes in a holistic approach to educating the whole. Welcome, Tiffany. Thank you. We also have with us our very own head counsellor at Alpro International School, Ms. Kinjal Goradia. She's a professional being a counsellor and is associated with EIS since eight years. With a naffable personality, she has been a favourite among students of all ages. Welcome, Kinjal. Thank you, Sudanda. The moderator for today's chat show is Araditha Sadaf. She is the founder of the Veloquent Digital Writing Centre. Additionally, as a digital hygiene trainer with Google News Initiative, she ensures all the content generated through her platform is fact-checked before it is published. She believes that in this exponentially growing world of technology, digital hygiene is as important as physical cleanliness, safety and security. Araditha is our content partner and has worked extensively with the school. It's my great honour to welcome all the three of you. Say hi, Araditha. Thank you. Thank you, Sugandha. All right. So without any further ado, Araditha, it's all up to you now to lead this chat show. Thank you so much. Enjoy this. Thank you, Sugandha. Thank you for the lovely introduction, Sugandha. Good afternoon to all of you and thank you so much for streaming our chat show today. I really hope you've been keeping well and indoors. Over the last couple of months, we've all been taking utmost care to wash our hands and maintain personal hygiene. And now I believe it is time to reciprocate that in our digital lives as well. So without wasting much time, let's learn more about how we can maintain digital hygiene by our guest speakers present here today. While researching more on this topic, I learnt that 59% of teenagers in the US have been bullied or harassed online. And that brings me to my first question to Tiffany. What do you think are some ways in which we can safeguard ourselves from cyberbullying? Absolutely. I think it's a really scary thing and it is, you're right, quite prevalent across the world. I think the first step is really to help parents open those conversations with young people. Because if they're learning from home initially, it will make it easier for them to kind of work digitally in schools or with their friends, etc. And tied in with that, I think it's really, really important that the school curriculum embeds the idea of digital hygiene and of kindness around digital hygiene. To ensure our young people are making the right choices when they're logging on, particularly to their social media accounts. And they're aware of, for instance, the safety features as well. For instance, on Instagram, if someone is being unkind to you that you can report them likewise on Snapchat and you can disable things like location features. So it's really making sure that they're aware of what is available to them, what to do if someone is bullying them. And then also, as I said at the beginning, those preventative measures that parents and schools can take to stop students thinking it's okay to bully each other online. Because it can have lasting impacts, as we've seen, you know, many times on the mental health of students, as well as, you know, when they become adults, the mental health of adults, you see you see people online being very unkind to each other all the time. I think if, you know, if that's stopped from a younger age, if those conversations are opened up, then we'll see less and less of that, hopefully. So I think, you know, the message from schools and parents to their children has to be be kind to each other, and hopefully, you know, they'll take that on into a digital world. Yes. So that brings me to my next question to you, Kinjal. What do you think parents can do? How can they intervene and make sure kids are safeguarded from the perils of social media misuse? Okay, so there are a few preventive measures which we as parents can take before the child enters the social media world. First being talking to your child. What I see missing is talking and educating your child about what is social media, what is Instagram, what are the features of Instagram, what all to do in on Instagram or Facebook, or on WhatsApp, anything, any media, what are we going to do about it? So I think what is missing is parents talking to the children about it. Second is, as a family, a few rules need to be set. It's very important for everybody in the family may be a family of three or maybe a family of 10. You need to sit together and decide a few rules as you all mutually agree and need to follow it. It's not only rules for children, it's rules for adults also. So that's the second thing. Third is how good a role model of parent is. If the child sees the parent wisely using the digital device or the social media or anything on the device, the child is likely to follow it, likely. But at the same time if the child sees that the parent is constantly on the phone, playing games or watching random things or just going on WhatsApp and forwarding messages which don't need to be forwarded, children are going to follow that also. It's obviously said that children do what they see and not what they hear. So as parents, you need to be a very good role model when you are going to implicate the social media age. But one thing said, so what one thing I've seen is most of the parents also are not educated enough about the social media world. I'll give you my example. I'm from the Facebook generation and not from the Insta generation. I deal with the high school students so a few years back some students came and said, this is what happened on Insta and somebody said something. And a few technical stuff she said and I did not know anything about it. I seriously did not know how to help this child. So I realized that I need to also learn this new thing in Instagram which has come into my life. So I learned a few things only, then I'll be able to help. Similarly it goes to the parents also, they need to learn. One simple thing, parents have to be one step ahead of the children and not behind. So if parents know everything, they'll be able to help. So this is a few measures which parents or adults can take around that children do not fall into a trap. Very, very true. That was very interesting and insightful. Tiffany, did you have any tips on what are some etiquettes parents can follow so that their children practice what they preach? So what are some etiquettes you think parents should teach their children through? Absolutely. I think as Kinja said that idea of modeling appropriate usage of your digital device. We're all on our phones and our computers and everything more than ever now especially because of the lockdown. But for example, a very easy win and I'm completely guilty of this. Luckily I don't have any children who are going to see me. But when you go to bed instead of like passively scrolling through Instagram or through the news or whatever it may be making sure that you are modeling to your child that you are turning that phone off or putting it even in another room to charge. And having that half hour to an hour before bedtime to make sure that your brain can start to relax that you're not getting that blue light in which is going to obviously disrupt your sleep. So I think that that's a really, really important thing. Likewise, you know, basic manners and not having your phone out at dinner or lunch that kind of thing when you're with with your friends and you're kind of there to socialize. Not sort of having your phone in front of you and being, you know, essentially unsociable. I think it's really, really important. I also think in terms of modeling and making sure that, you know, parents are fact checking information before they're forwarding it on, not just sort of, you know, sending out whatever they see without kind of thinking about it because that's that's how we see misinformation spreading and that that I think over the last maybe sort of five, five to 10 years has gotten really quite bad. And I think if children are taught to kind of consider what they're sharing and what they're putting out into the world, if they see their parents just sort of randomly pushing everything forward then they're going to struggle to make those right decisions. And I would say, yeah, probably a good sleep hygiene and digital hygiene combination, making sure that on a social scale your phone isn't kind of your top priority, and then making sure that you're being careful about what information you're putting out. Very, very true. I think including just maintenance of digital hygiene, these tips would also help us improve like relationships and our personal health just by getting better sleep, eating more mindfully, etc. So social media when overused is definitely a big sign of it being misused. So how, how often do you think we should take breaks from our digital devices like how much time online is too much time online. I'd like to start with you, Kenjal. Now, I think the answer isn't the question when you said how often, I think often is the answer that we need to take a break from our digital devices. These days we've got a new concept of digital detoxification. People, you know, rather than just the physical one, these days people leave their phones and you know for 15 days they don't want to be on Instagram or Facebook or on WhatsApp and then they come back because they want to see how much it has affected them. So often is the right word. See what I understand over here is on one side you have your work, you have your personal life, you have your family, you have friends, you have your hobbies, and one side is the digital life of yours. Being these, so many of these things but still we are giving a lot of time to the digital device. So we are losing out on a lot of things over here. So I think the balance has to be right over there only that where we understand these so many things need more of your time, rather than this one digital device. Obviously during this pandemic we cannot compare anything because things are different presently. But once we are back to the normalcy of life, we need to understand and balance these two things. And then there are, you know, I just, you just need to figure out, you know, what you can think about, you know, these are, you know, such important things of your life, and this is just one digital device what do you want to pay attention to. So often is the right word I would think we should, you know, give a break to our devices. Absolutely. And if I, if I could add when I've, you know, obviously been in contact with a lot of parents over the lockdown who've been concerned over, you know, are there, are their children studying enough and obviously most of the work is done digitally. And I've made it made a point of saying, you know, build a revision timetable with your child but make sure that breaks are built in often. So once that screen for six hours a day. It's not, it doesn't matter if you're working for six hours a day is not healthy for you to be that kind of engaged in a screen for that amount of time so I completely agree with you on that point Kendra. I agree as well. I agree as well. So I think like when we're kids, we don't even know what the importance of breaks are and how often to take them, which makes me think of what would be the best age to like give a child their own digital device maybe an iPhone or an iPad or even laptop what like, So that we know that the child is able to, you know, make these decisions of taking breaks and maintaining digital hygiene appropriately. What do you believe would be a good age Tiffany could be here thoughts on this. Yeah, absolutely. I mean, it's a tricky one for me because as I work with crime with a secondary school children and I don't have any children of my own. So I can understand how, you know, it might be an easy solution to hand a small child a device to distract them. So I think it's important that they're sort of of the age where they understand, you know, the power of the device and the safety features of the device as I mentioned before. So I mean I'd say probably to have that own device probably towards the end of primary beginning of secondary. I mean you have, you know, I mean I remember getting my first phone and it was very exciting but the only reason I was allowed a phone was because I had to go to school about an hour away from home and my mum wanted me to phone her to make sure that I got there safely. And so I think there are different reasons why parents might choose to give their child a device. But then in which case I think it's very important that the parents are educated on the safeguarding kind of procedures they can use on the device so in terms of what they can restrict internet wise what apps they can restrict, but also apps are a really positive addition for their children so learning apps or I don't know if it's like the older children like yoga meditation like stuff that is going to help the children kind of thrive digitally. But also just being really mindful of what would definitely will not. I would like to add up over there. I would agree with Tiffany as she said her own experience of her parents giving her the phone was for the safety so I think when parents decide to give a device to the children, they need to understand the purpose behind giving the device. If it's safety, as Tiffany said, or if it's work related so if there's some research the child needs to be constantly or, you know, look at some YouTube videos for his education path. Then the answer is yes, but if the reason is if the child is throwing a tantrum that I need a device because all of my class has it, or I need a device because my friends are on Insta or Facebook, or I need a device because that's the cool thing these days. Then the answer is no and parents will have to really step in. It is very difficult. I'm a parent. I know that your child can literally be behind your life to get a phone, but you have to be very clear in your head. What is the purpose of giving the phone? Do not compare that this is a manna. Sorry, Tiffany, I'm a little, you know, one sentence of Hindi that, you know, it's more like, it's more like, everybody has it these days, you know, all children have it. If you're going to go by this thing, then I think we're on the wrong track of parenting. So as parents, we have to be a little more firm on that aspect. It's very important. I remember since, yeah, sorry, Tiffany. I was just going to say, you know, it's also important that parents teach their child how to, you know, manage the device in terms of the device hygiene as well. Because I can't tell you the amount of students we have that can, you know, upload a crazy TikTok video or send out these like crazy snapshots with loads of like graphics, but they cannot save the file with their somewhere sensible on a laptop because they won't know how to name the file and then they won't be able to find it afterwards. So it's also just, you know, sitting down with the child and making sure that they understand how the functionality of the either the laptop or the phone and make sure that, you know, they have a, I guess, a tidy device in that instance, especially if they're at school, especially if they're of an age where they're starting to have more documents linked to their work. And, you know, they might have that IT at school as well, which can help with that. But it is really useful if the parents can just kind of maintain that with them as well, I think. Absolutely. I think a good age then to summarize what both of you said would be when the child is able to completely understand the users of apps understand how to maintain the digital device and like Tiffany mentioned understand the power of the digital device. Since you mentioned like keeping your digital device tidy, I would like to ask you, Tiffany, how important is that considering that we are all now working out of our laptops. It's basically become a workspace we don't really need the desks and the idea is a digital device or a laptop is basically what is helping us carry out all our work. So how important do you think it is to keep that tidy and what are some good ways to do that? It's so, so important. I mean, I'm naturally very messy. It's so important for me to make sure that my files are accurately labeled that they're appropriately labeled so I can easily find stuff I'm not like cool that could be in two different places. Because that's not going to be time efficient for me as a teacher. So I do think it is really, really important that whatever system you're working on that you familiarize yourself with it that you know if you need to research it a little bit that you do that and you create a space where you can have like a clear working area. And also, you know that you don't have a massively cluttered desktop which I was for years I was guilty of that until my partner just looked at me and went what are you doing and I was like I should probably clear that. So you know it's something that you know some some of us will naturally be able to do that and some of us will have to work on it. But I do think making sure that again that is modeled to your students or to your children or whoever it is. That's basically important. I mean, as a for instance a GCSE student over here when you're sort of 1516 if you can't find your coursework on your computer. That's going to cause you extra stress it's going to cause your teacher stress can cause your parents stress so if you've kind of taken the time to make sure that your sort of digital cleanliness is is up to date. If you have a phone, you know that you kind of are going through do you need those 700 apps probably don't need all 700 of them is your, your devices can be running slower because you haven't actually looked after them. I think it's really really important and you know if I can do it then I think anyone can. Thank you for the inspiration, Tiffany. So I think we've ascertained by now that digital devices can be as much of a bane as a boom. It has as much of downsides as like the positives. Can you tell us a little more about what the biggest downside of social media sites is for you or if you've witnessed it for other people as well. In a one liner if I try to put this across your life is your life becomes a public land then. So once you're on social media you have to be you're there for people, people know you and generally we all post the happy moments of our life when we are partying when we are going for a good trip or it's a anniversary or birthday, but nobody posts anything when sad is something sad or something you know negative is happening in your life. So, it's very important that once you're on social media and if you're posting very regularly your life really becomes public and people are going to start judging you. So, it's, you know, it's simple as that your life doesn't remain yours. I think you know what can just said there's really important and I think the idea of a digital footprint, the digital footprint that you leave online. I don't think young people necessarily have a con context of how that can impact you later on. If you're posting things when you're 1314. That's that will stay there they're like oh but I'll just delete it but someone will have screenshotted it or someone will have sent it to someone else. And that can obviously have lasting ramifications I mean you hear you hear stories of it all the time with like you know politicians that put something online when they were in college. And that then comes back to haunt them or they uploaded a photo that then comes back a few years later. And it can have really you know it can have impacts on careers have impacts on college places on on a whole range of things. And I don't think that, as I said I don't think young people are quite aware of how permanent essentially the Internet is. And so I think it's really really important that that is made super super clear to them. And because that that can have a lasting impact on them. Yes, very very very true. Let me talk about communicating on social media and just on the Internet. I find there are two very different ways of communicating like there's the formal way of communicating with when you're working or with your colleagues and then there is just the informal way of communicating on social media like through short forms of abbreviations emojis and all of that. Often because kids get access to their phones to and the first interaction is with their friends. They often tend to like communicate informally first and then they cannot differentiate between formal communication and informal communication everything on typed on the Internet becomes informal communication. What do you think, how can we instill this in kids like teach them the difference between communications, why is it important and do you think it's going to like affect communication in the long run. I was hoping both of y'all could answer maybe Kendra could answer this question first. Okay, so, you know, in our real life how we teach children about verbal non verbal communication. I think we need to implement these new aspects of, you know, digital communication also, because we start off with WhatsApp these days and where we write the bio you as you, you know, and sometimes we as adults also make a mistake while we are, you know, mailing something formally because we are so used to this kind of communication. I think teaching our children what is the difference between, you know, mailing or writing back something formally, or if you're with your friend and then how, how is that, you know, different when you're dealing with just friends. So this is very important that we need to teach our children if you educate them that this is how it is this is how the format is in fact I rather in English how we follow the letter writing and you know, formal and informal I think I think these days we need to start off with digital letter writing or digital. This is going to come up, you know late later on in our life. Who writes it now though, but still when we write it digitally it's different so I think we need to implement this in our education system into our subjects and this is how we can implement it there. I completely agree I mean I think as I mentioned before and we met I've had several students email me where the entire email is in the subject line. So I think teaching them, you're quite right it's that old fashioned skill of letter writing but doing it on a computer so where things go how simple things like how you like CC and BCC and all of that. I think are really important but but having that language where they can communicate with adults or they can communicate with, for instance if they're applying to a university or a college, and the language is appropriate. And I think that starts as well with you know how they speak to face to face if the student says yo miss to me that that's it's not going to work out. You know it's picking them up gently on that you know it's not telling them they're wrong but it's just showing them the differences between between the different uses of language and language I mean I'm a languages teacher so I find language super interesting whether that's different modern languages or whether that's the way of communicating that young people and maybe older people have. I'm just making sure that they understand the concept of just, you know, it doesn't even have to be really formal like this but just writing an email that is appropriate to, you know, a respected adult I suppose. And, you know, otherwise that they're really going to struggle when when they continue and it's the same I suppose in a text. You know, if my 14 year old niece texts me I think she probably talks to me slightly differently to the way that she would her friend. And I think it's it is important that that is instilled so perhaps when parents and children are texting that some of those boundaries are established. Absolutely yes. So when kids are on social media what do you think they should what do you think is the first thing they should be cautious about. There are quite a few evils we should be ready off but what do you think is the most important thing we should be concerned about. Okay, should I. Yeah, okay. So I think if we divide this into three aspects children are able to understand it better. One is they need to be cautious of what they see. Second is what they hear. And third is whom they meet. If these three aspects they are able to you know like really divide and then you know differentiate between these three, then they are able. They are I think a little more safer also like how we say we have we know about the rights and responsibilities as a citizen. Similarly, students need to know their rights and responsibilities towards the digital device to the towards the social media also. So if students are able to see this because see there's a lot of incorrect and negative information out there. Students watching the news is also not something which is going to help you because it's going to like literally take over you. It's so much of negativity. Plus, there are a lot of people out there with wrong intentions also. So, if we as parents or we as adults are able to help them, plus monitor them about what they see we also as parents and adults need to monitor what we are looking into what they're researching into what they're hearing. So is there some news which they're continuously you know trying to take a whole, you know, trying to understand what this news is about or whom are they meeting also. I would like to share recently I've dealt with a 14 year old girl from the city itself from a very much middle upper class segment, and she started so 14 means ninth grade over here and she started using Instagram without her parents understanding that she was in grade seventh. Okay, so somehow the other issues to get a hang of the phone and she started off. She started talking to random boys, just random ones, no connections at all. The recent thing is that she got into a relationship with an 18 year old boy who's nowhere connected to anybody and he stays in a remote village who's dropped out of education school has no work. And when I was speaking to this child the child said, I have taken care of everything. I am sure that this boy is good and he is correct. It's him being I did a video call with this boy, you know, I saw his house I saw his parents I saw him. So he's not cheating. So as a child she just thought by doing this kind of a thing is going to safeguard her is so difficult for the parent and that's when the parent got her she started talking about marriage and all at the age of 14 she started settling with this guy rather than you know, focusing on her hobbies and education. So this is what it does to a child you know social media is very very cruel in its own way. So as parents we need to see what children are doing. And it is not interference to an extent if you are going to communicate with your child correctly, rather than checking his or her phone, you know, behind her back, then I'm sure it's not interference in your child's life. So, yeah. If somebody does go through a bad experience and they realize that you know they are being cyber bullied or they are not they are they are being forced to misuse the social media. What do you advise the first thing like where do you advise them to go what is the first thing they should do. I mean I think it is really difficult. I think as educators we have to be very very aware of what's going on. So if a child starts presenting in a slightly different manner if they start looking a bit uncomfortable or just a bit different at school they seem down or whatever we need to check in with them. We would anyway from a safeguarding perspective, but just to make sure that you know there isn't anyone asking them to do anything they're uncomfortable with online. No one's trying to kind of groom them into doing anything they don't want to do. No one's bullying them there are such a range of things that can be going wrong online for them. And I do think that probably is much more common than like the I suppose the old fashioned bullying of like you know the school kids in the playground with someone being someone up I think the majority that of that we will find online these days. And so yeah I think educators need to be on the lookout. I think as as Kinjal said parents need to have this as much as an open dialogue as they can with their children I know it's difficult especially when they're teenagers and they don't want to talk to you. But I think if you try at home and nurture that kind of open and honest approach. It is really useful. And I think that you know parents as I think I think kind of said earlier need to be one step ahead of their kids. There are so many apps you can get on phones now that will hide, for instance hide your Instagram or hide your Snapchat. And I think it's really important that parents are wise to that because you know as as Kinjal story presented kids think they know everything. I thought I knew everything when I was 14 I definitely didn't. And they can become quite you know I rate when you tell them that no actually you don't and you do need to be careful because it might well be that you know this man is inappropriate or it might well be that you're actually talking to a 65 year old strange person in Russia or somewhere like you just don't know on the internet so you just, you know need to safeguard yourself and have the support from your parents and your teachers to help you. I suppose learn the tools to do that. Absolutely. On that note, we've been receiving quite a few interesting questions from the audience they seem to be engaging a lot. Thank you so much for sharing these questions with us. Do you think we could answer some of them. So the first question to Tiffany is how do you get students to be open about cyber stalking. I think you know as I said it is really really difficult but I think you know cultivating a culture of openness letting them know that they will not be in trouble for coming to you with a problem. Because I think sometimes you know say if a child is being groomed by someone older they might think oh no I've done something really stupid I've sent them some photos I shouldn't have I'm going to get in loads of trouble. I think you know all we can do is advise them like you know preemptively like don't do these things but if they do do them we will make mistakes that you know we will help you through this we will you know look at everything that's gone on. You know if we need to get any any legal things involved and we will do that. And that they can feel really really comfortable coming to us and making sure that you know we are able to help them that they're safe in the knowledge that we will be there to help them. Absolutely. Ginger. A question for you is how do you teach responsibility of digital usage to children. I think firstly what I said was be a good role model. It is very important if your children will exactly do what you're doing. That's the key to everything. What does sit and talk to the child that as per the age what are a few dos and what are a few dos for them. Obviously you can't compare the child cannot compare that mama you are doing this so I'll be doing this there's there's a lot of age difference there which we need to consider also. But at the same time you as a family if you sit down but this is what a few things you can do and these are a few things you cannot do. The parents are doing it that's their family matter that's their values and their ethics and whatever you know their family has decided but not something what we would be doing. So again coming back to the same thing about opening up and speaking first I think when you give a device it is very important to speak. If you want to do a preventive measure you will have to speak to your child. Otherwise we'll go back to the corrective measures when something has happened and then we'll have to rectify it. Absolutely and I think that's where we end up with kids who won't talk because they're like oh she's going to get punished. So I completely agree in those preventive measures. Okay Angel would there be a specific age you recommend a child can work independently on a gadget by that's one of the questions you've received. Honestly if personally you ask me I think till the age of 15 that is approximately when the child passes his 10 standard should not be getting an independent phone. Again if it's for safety if he's going for some classes or if he's going far away then you need to give a device but I'm sure you can give a very simple device which does not have other apps and all which the child could be going wrong with. Again it's very personal based you know some children are responsible by their own selves and some students are not like every human is different. Probably I was a responsible child and my mother wasn't one he was the naughty side. Probably my parents would trust me more and probably give me a gadget before him probably we did not get it then but still if I go to compare this with every child is different. So understand your child understand if he's able to and it's it's children so they are going to make mistakes. We will have to give that benefit of doubt that my child can go wrong it's very important. Most of the times I see that parents think my child cannot do anything wrong I say excuse me I'm sorry. Every child is going to make a mistake and that's how it's going to grow and learn. So having that benefit of doubt understand your child and then decide to give a device completely. Thank you for that Tiffany since one of the questions asks in addition to parents teaching their kids what about teachers how can teachers be open to educating children in classrooms. Absolutely I think that you know I think that needs to be as I said before built into the curriculum so there needs to be whether that's through tutor time or whether that is through. We here at Wapping have what we call a spire day so we have full days dedicated to different elements of a child's pastoral education. And one of one of those days it's built around you know internet usage cyberbullying etc so I think you know schools need to take an active step in building this learning for young people into their you know yearly curriculum because otherwise you know if it's just like oh yeah they might do a bit of that in IT or they might do a bit of that and you know wherever they're not going to get the quality of learning that they need in order to really understand. You know how to use devices how to be safe on devices how to interact and communicate on devices and how to use them appropriately for learning as well. Absolutely. The other question that is very interesting has to do with ads and something that bothers all of us about how they're like not very relevant ads that pop up and what what should we do when that happens for children like misleading ads that often poison the minds of children how do we teach them to ignore those and how do we teach them what to click on and what not to click on on the digital device on the internet. So I think when we start introducing a device to a child made in whichever grade I think it's for a few days as I told you that we need to educate the child that goes without saying we need to talk to them and to talk to them we have to be smarter that's for sure we have to be one step ahead. It's not to be that the child is teaching you at the end of the day you will have to otherwise the ball is in the child school he's smarter than you and as Tiffany said there are apps to hide Insta and Snapchat and smarter so we need to be a little more smarter over there. So when you're introducing a device. This is one of the things which we talk about one is the security settings of your phone or any apps you're using or social media using every now and then you'll need to check on your security settings and a few days when you're introducing the phone let the child use it in front of you. It becomes very casual it's not supposed to be or you sit next to me and then only know it can be that whenever you're using the phone just be around me so you can keep on keeping in what's happening. And obviously you're going to educate the child about that these are the few things which will happen some random request you might get for there would be some screens or you know which will pop up and it could be irrelevant stuff for your age and if you're confused about it first thing just ask me or ask your father or ask your auntie uncle anybody who's an adult and not your friend obviously. And then you can take a decision if you want to you know get over there it could be a spam also these days you get so many spam messages on phone on two messages emails WhatsApp and you know different ways. So this is how you can introduce this to the child and I feel this is going to come up so it's better if you inform them beforehand. That's a very very good point it's talking about that the idea of what might happen it's that preemptive approach again. Because then they won't think oh maybe I've done something wrong on the social media for it to have this advert for me oh no. Instead they might be then be like mom I'm not sure what this is what do I do. So that sounds like. The other the other question that the audience is asking is. Do you think it makes sense to speak to 10 and 11 year olds about stalking do you think they understand that's for you to. Yeah I do I think it's really important to speak to if the child if the 10 or 11 year old has a device so for instance if they have Instagram that one seems to have popped up a lot. They might have people trying to follow them for example and then maybe start to like a lot of their pictures and then start to ask for information on direct message like that can happen so so easily. If the child for instance doesn't have high privacy settings they don't have their accounts set to private. So I think it's really important that children are aware you know I don't suppose you have to go into like horrific detail. But the children are aware that there might be some people out there who have, you know, poor intentions towards them, and that they just need to be aware. And they need to not be, you know, allowing random people on the internet to follow them for example. And, you know, they need to be aware that it's out there because it can happen to anyone you do hear stories of, you know, 10 or 11 year olds being groomed by untowards older people. So if they don't know that it exists they're not going to know how to manage it or they're not going to know that they need to speak up about it if something does happen. I think I grew up at an age when I was 18 and I got the digital devices started coming up when I was 18. So I was at more or less a safer age and everybody was trying to, you know, understand it adults and children likewise. But now when kids are the new kids, the kids that are being like they're receiving the gadgets for the first time they're like five years old. So it is very necessary this conversation was most insightful. And like I said, with as many articles and videos there are in person hygiene there should be just as many on like digital hygiene because we spend most of our days almost eight hours adults spend almost eight hours working on their laptops. So thank you so so much for this conversation. It was most insightful for me as well. And I encourage anyone who is ever lost and whoever needs help in regard to digital hygiene should definitely look it up on their digital devices because that's a good way of using it to you know, better your horizon of knowledge and just learn so much more about how to do things correctly. Thank you audience for being here and listening to us. I hope that was helpful. And I hope you all can maintain digital hygiene now henceforth. And yes, thank you for streaming in. It was a pleasure. Thank you. Thank you the audience. Okay, so just ending note to this that it's a dual challenge for parents it's a dual challenge for everybody that how to mitigate the harms of digital world in comparison to how much maximize we can benefit from the device. So as adults as children, if you're able to balance this up, just to see that the harm is, you know, as much less as possible, and the benefits are, you know, over there for us, then I think we'll be able to deal with our children or our own selves better and I think somewhere we need to accept that this is the world. It is the, you know, when parents say, oh during our times we did not have okay fine but unfortunately or fortunately this is what it is and we need to accept it, because we have also been on the digital device for the longest time ever now. It's better that this is what it is. So what can be best done out of it and I think that this end note I would like to say communication is the key communication of parents teachers very as the recent recent studies which I read was when a teenage or a child gets into trouble on social media, there's approximately 54% will approach their friends as compared to only 40% will go to their friends, go to the parents and only approximately 20 to 25% will go to their teachers. And I think as parents and teachers we need to raise our bar so that you know, firstly, children approach us and we can help them and not blame them. If children feel we are blaming them, and we are going to like reprimand them very severely, then they will stop coming to us. I couldn't agree more. I think you've really hit the nail on the head with pretty much everything I was going to say there striking that balance ensuring that open and honest conversation has the capacity to take place. And that education of the children around digital hygiene takes place on a regular basis, and not just you know once when they're 11 this is digital hygiene and needs to be consistent and needs to be maintained like like any hygiene. So I think that is incredibly important and I'm really I really enjoyed this, this sort of chat show. Thank you very much. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you audience. Thank you for asking the right questions. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.