 On this episode of Skeptico, a show about considering all your options. The President, I would not rule out the chance to preserve a nucleus of human specimens. The radioactivity would never penetrate a mine some thousands of feet deep. How long would you have to stay down there? Bill, let's see now. 400 years? And a show about when crazy doesn't sound crazy. This crazy mutual destruction kind of thing. The way you lay it out, it actually kind of makes sense. They were starting off the 7-hour, but they were also concentrating on the nuclear arms race. So they were both really scared. In 1957, when nuclear war and foreign policy got released from the CFR working group that Henry Kissinger released it, and it kind of said, okay, what would be better than all-out nuclear war is that we have this slow perpetual warfare. That first clip was from Doctor Strange Love, which if you've never watched it, or if you haven't watched it recently, is a must, an absolute must. And the second is from today's excellent, excellent guest, Johnny Bedmore of Unlimited Hangout, who has some just extraordinary articles that were not even going to be able to scratch the surface on. But I hope you will check out after listening to this interview. Welcome to Skeptico, where we explore controversial science, spirituality, and other big picture stuff like we'll hear about today. With leading researchers, thinkers, and their critics, and boy oh boy, do we have a good one today. I'm just super excited to welcome Johnny Bedmore to Skeptico. He is an incredible investigative journalist, and I mean incredible. So you'll find some of his work on his website, JohnnyBedmore.com, or you might also stumble across him on the very excellent Unlimited Hangout. You know investigative journalism is more or less dead today, right? From the usual sources that you would find it. You're just not going to get this kind of stuff, particularly the way that Johnny documents it, researches it. One of the fun things I hope we get a chance to talk about today is some of the methods. I mean it's like old school, hey, I had to dig into this archive and I used the Wayback Machine and that led me to 500 names that I had to trace. Now everyone, this is true investigative journalism and it goes places that, as we know, you know, we're just not getting there through what we call our mainstream journalism. So it's really rare these days. But anyways, a lot of work here. Also a musician, right? Hey, what do we want to play right now? Just a little. Come on, man. Oh my lord. Well, you know, I'm proud of, I'd say, Evil is really one machine what you've got. Yeah, you're on the trigger. Damn, I'm ready to go. It's got a minute and a half synth solo at the end of that one. That's mostly synth solo to be perfectly honest, rather than some. I'm fired up now. I mean, that's gonna take me a while to settle back down. Okay, so anyways, Johnny, welcome to the show. Thanks so much for joining me on Skepticoat. Well, thanks for having me. I mean, it's been a really hard journey to get to a point where people know my name because, I mean, there's so much censorship in this and that's partially like runs alongside the fact that, like you said, investigative journalism is dead. I didn't really know what it was when I started doing it. You know, I didn't know what, what I was heading towards because I'd never really seen that type of journalism. It's not introduced to you. It's out there in the back and then, you know, there's a few people who have kind of like inspired me and their work has made me go, wow, wow. That's what you do. You put, you put all the facts there and that's what investigative journalism is. You get all of the facts as many as you could possibly find. And I'm a collector of facts, I suppose. I'm a collector of these little pieces of history, little sources from history, evidence from history that tells us the real story, you know. You know, it's funny you say that because I kind of get the other impression. A lot of the stuff I find more and more in the conspiratorial vein is this kind of data dump, you know. And I think you rise above that in that you do have a little bit of storytelling element. Maybe that's because of your, you know, music background and your telling stories and your writing lyrics with the beginning and an end and all that kind of stuff. I mean, I don't know, I think it's more than that. Yeah, yeah. Well, I mean, I spent years with a guitar, just sitting there with a guitar, writing song after song after song. And I tried to... How long, how long were you? Give us a background on you. A Welshman, a Welshman, a fighting Welshman with an edge on the music we can hear. Yeah, I mean, I had a really strange upbringing. I'm from the capital city of Wales, so I'm from Cardiff. But my family and my dad was, we were in this reenactment organist society. So it was a 17th century reenactment society called the Sealed Knot. And almost every weekend and for sometimes weeks, I was out in a campsite somewhere dressed in 17th century clothing with people walking around in armour, fighting with swords, cannons going off, muskets, gunpowder. I used to, when we used to travel down to the musters because my father was the commanding officer of Colonel Birch's regiment at foot, I used to sit on the gunpowder keg that we used to travel to the actual events for our regiment. Our regiment would have to bring their own gunpowder. That eventually stopped in the 90s, late 80s and early 90s when the regulations got more heated up and they were a bit more careful about allowing people with kegs of gunpowder on the road. But I had this really strange upbringing. My father was a really eccentric man because of the way he was. The society we were in was like 8,000 people. So you had 8,000 people dressed up, fighting for charity. Loads of people come watch. Of course, it was a massive event over the weekends. The commentary every night was just, you know, you out in the middle of a field, out in the middle of nowhere with a load of friends you see every weekend, but you don't live with and it was always party atmosphere. So I was brought up with that party atmosphere all around me all of the time. And I got to learn about history really deeply by exploring the castles myself. As kids, we would just let off the rain. Our parents, because this campsite was closed off usually, they would just let us go off and we would have to return by 12 midnight when they finished their party. And as a child, that's what my life was. We'd just go off in the middle of nowhere and we'd explore castles and we'd sneak into places we weren't allowed in. And then in the weekdays, I had this normal life which go into school and everybody, like my experiences were so far removed from each other. And I think that led me on to understanding that, you know, what people see every day, what most people see every day is just a bit illusory and there's actually this whole other world out there and you can be doing loads of different things all round the place and you go back and sit in an office and everybody thinks you sit in an office all the time. You know, yeah, I worked in hotels when I finally like, you know, when I got to age of 19, I went into a full-time work in hotels and a lot of people talk to you. I was on the reception desk, friendly, always talking with people, meeting people from all around the world and there was loads of people I would meet who I discovered would believe that I was constantly behind a reception desk because that's what they saw. And I understood like the idea of perception was really interesting for me. I also had like a load of really negative experiences when I was young. So my family that was like, even though we were really loving in the same way, there was loads of violence, like really hard violence. I was groomed from when I was 9 to 11 by a guy who was in this organization, in this field now and ended up going to court and he got convicted and then he got let back into the society again and was just around me all the time. So I had loads of these horrible experiences I had to deal with in life as well and it all really affected me negatively. By the time I hit into my 20s, you know, September the 11th is happening and the world just seems like this crazy mess, you know, the internet's coming, everything's exploding all at the same time, yet we've still got nothing. Like everywhere, everyone I knew had nothing. We were living off like, we were earning like £4.50 an hour. You know, I don't know how much that is in dollars, but it was not much and couldn't get much work and the financial crisis was on its way. You know, life was really sad and I kind of like kept trying to make sense of it and I kept going into a kind of the internet world, just exploring around and reading and reading and reading and not realising while I was doing that, that I was actually starting becoming a journalist. I was one step away from being a journalist, which I was gathering all information. Yeah, I wasn't writing that information down and that was the only difference between before and after is once upon a time. I wasn't a journalist because I didn't write anything I knew down and anything I find. It's not even what I know. What I always discovered is that you can tell people your opinion until the cows come home and people disagree with it or not. It doesn't matter. They're ethereal. They disappear really quickly, opinions. They go with trends and fads and they go with the time, but when you collect real information, when you're telling people facts about the past and history, it can make them understand loads of things about their own lives and their own interactions with the world that they could never understand before and suddenly their eyes are open to so much more. Or not, or not. Or not, or not. And all of this time I was suffering from something called Graves disease, which was a really, like it was undiagnosed for most of my life, so only diagnosed when I was 27. It was a really heavy thyroid disease and basically by the time I was 27, I was almost dying. So I was like, you know, as my ill health was going, I was unable to sing, unable to keep a job. All sorts of symptoms were occurring. It was still undiagnosed and I felt like completely and utterly lost and eventually that got rectified and understood and then I had radioactive treatment and I had my fibroids taken out and then I had all this depression, anxiety and all this feeling of weirdness and I was put on loads of chemical compounds, fluoxetine and other things, chlamypramine and other things that made my head go crazy. And I fell into that world. I fell into that world and by the time I got to about 2014, 2015, I was a mess. I was a mess but I had like music, my sort of like musical projects I had built, you know, music's really hard. You get into a band, you get into a band with other people and other people, you know, especially musicians are usually crazy, fickle, they go, you know, they're airy-fairy, they turn on each other with great ease and so that wasn't going very well and I was really depressed and I was just like, what am I going to do? I got to the point where I was, I had just been taking more drugs and more drugs and more drugs until eventually I was just on morphine and I was taking morphine and I was puking up. I would say, you know, nearly straight away, nearly straight away. It's like I was heading towards dying and I knew it, I recognized it and the first time I really recognized it was I lied to someone who I loved very much about what I was doing and what I was taking and within a day I just felt really like the lowest I felt in years because I had lied to someone I had completely adored about something that was so horrible and I went to that person and I said, I need help, I need to get out of it and they said, you need to work out, to get out of it and so I went up to the Welsh hillside and they picked a load of mushrooms and I spent about three months on mushrooms like do or die I'm going to have to like take everything into my brain and I'm going to have to have this experience and I did. What is it, what grows up there? What kind of... We have what's called Welsh magic mushrooms I can't remember the name Are they the little Christmas ones? Yeah, they're like little wizard hats sort of mushrooms and they're beautiful, they're wonderful they're so powerful they're really up high on the mushroom scale and they're in abundance just outside the city go up to Garth Hill anybody who lives in Cardiff go up to Garth Hill in the right time of the year you can pick hundreds, thousands you can dry them all out keep them in a pot and Bob's your uncle and I kind of just felt like certain parts of my life were breaking down I had to reform, we take control of my life come off drugs, come off all of these other things that had been forcing me down and that was just like it opened up another thing to me it made me realise, I got to a point where I realised am I going to continue being quiet living in this world where everything's miserable all the people around me are unhappy all the systems don't work politics is horrible people are turning on each other it's getting worse and worse people are getting poorer all the time do I want to live in that world in a little room taking morphine and dying and killing myself I want to go and say well, if I'm not going to kill myself that way, because if I continue that way I'm going to die then you're going to have to kill me and so I looked at the people who made me the most angry in society the secret services the intelligence agencies the people are hiding things from people I said, okay I'm going to try and find a way and politics mainly at first I'm going to try and find a way to reveal information find information can I ask you this because there's so many twists and turns to the story but let's just go right where you were you're up there and you have the psilocybin experience one, how did you even know to do that or why did you think that would be somehow help you out of this situation and then two how effective was it for you particularly to to kind of start healing yeah, if I was going to I mean, my thought was that if I wasn't going to kill myself with drugs, I was just going to end up killing myself and so the other alternative is that you party yourself to death but I'm killing myself with the same stuff I'm partying with so I needed to get earthly with it I needed to get I had already experienced psychedelics I had already a big fan of psychedelics never on that scale I've really got to start not just in a sense it was a reset it was a reset of the mind yeah, it was like a lot of it I spent one night I took what Terence McKenna would call an epic dose of mushrooms I fell asleep and I don't remember the night the dreams, anything I just remember waking up and feeling this complete feeling of refreshment like refreshed my soul and I was doing so much in the way of much I just felt like I was constantly it was about resetting my sadness my inability to concentrate on certain things like the aspect that I got groomed I mean, if you try and look at that when you're on psychedelics you have to look really deep within yourself and you can disconnect yourself but you can also be with yourself and I started to kind of understand that the things that happened in the past were kind of a different person or nearly every single bit of your bone and your skin will fall off and reform during like six, twelve, eighteen months depending on what thing it is and eventually you just reform to be a new person and you hold all of this angst and all of this pain with you for someone who, if you can get into the right frame of mind you can sort of communicate with that person from an external in an external sense, in an external way you can say I know what you went through, I really do I'm the only person who can know what you went through I learned to let loads of things go I learned to let loads of things go but letting things go also I saw what was important and the whole time there was a sense that the only thing you learn from resetting yourself on mushrooms is truth is the only thing that's important truth going out there and finding truth that's it's always opposing, whenever you anything psychedelic, you know, it's good, bad it's so juxtaposed the whole experience but truth as opposed to lies because everything, when you examine it everything that has caused you pain throughout your entire life all stems from lies, it all stems from that one thing that someone told you something that is not true and it has hurt you you know what it's kind of interesting about that not to just pry totally into your personal kind of thing, but like you grow up in an intentional alternative reality I mean you were doing simulation before there was simulation like now it's, you know, I've had guests on are we living in a simulation, a popular topic you know dude you were living in a simulation by choice and your father to put you in that you know, I'm a dad, got four kids I can be eccentric as hell every weekend and then, you know, creating a situation where something like that could happen not that he's responsible hey, hey, hey, he's my father who I don't really speak to my father he's a special man to be sure he extremely eccentric in his way unable to see anything but himself through most of his life and really impressive did anything that he put his mind to do but not only was he the commanding officer afterwards he became a town crier so like the oh yeah, oh yeah, oh yeah and once upon a time he was a steel worker for 18 years and he grew up in a pub in the roughest area of Cardiff and he's got all of these different strings to his bow and his cupboard used to be filled with like loads of different costumes and diving gear and all sorts of things that usually why don't you guys talk why don't you guys talk mainly because he was a terrible philanderer he was he was awful with the ladies he treated my mum like crap and there was a lot of violence in my house when I was younger so it comes to a point where anybody and this is a message to as well could be a message to anybody who physically abuses their children at some point their child will reach adulthood and will look at you in the eye and you will shrivel up into a ball and walk away that's it there is very rarely someone who can repair damage when it's been like years of physical really violent stuff he was a big guy was he ever able to own any of that yeah not with me no no I mean I think with my sisters more and I don't know it's really hard because I love we all love our family so much and I love him in many ways I see myself in him in many ways sometimes when I look into my son's eyes I see my father I understand the idea of looking back at your father's faithful history and almost every memetic moment in movies such as Star Wars when you cut off the face of yourself and discover it's your father underneath and it's just your face and it's your father and it's your face you know this is what builds our psychology all of these things but you know people don't suffer a death on just one thing when they like come to an end when they could decide to commit suicide you know it's death by a thousand cuts it's all these different experiences from all around all piling up but if you can rationalise each one and you could take out each one and you can understand why and I don't blame my dad for the way he lived his life I think part of it and I think he'll accept it was extremely high-strength alcohol beers mainly growing up in a pub didn't help him and he was wild and no one brought him back in my name was the great person around and my gravity was the greatest person around but I don't think they could control my dad so you know he's a man of his time very much so but he he's moulded me in many different ways the only thing we ever got on together with war games he taught me how to play because he wanted to do it himself and I had no one to play with he taught me how to play Axis and allies when I was like he was probably about seven six seven and and then he would invite round his wargaming mates and I would beat them all because I didn't have these pre concepts of what had happened throughout history that they all automatically seemed drawn towards doing the same mistakes throughout history that lost the other thing I picked up from your bio the two things one is you go through this dyslexic kind of thing you're tagged as being dyslexic like so many creative people are and now you know you're a writer a first class caliber writer here folks you just got to go read the articles and you'll see it's and so that's kind of you're probably tagged as being not super smart right isn't that what you were told kind of growing up I think there's a lot I saw a lot of what I see in society now where I was treated at school in the fact that I would the teachers all knew that I was good enough to go up to the next class but they would keep me from going up to the next class because there wasn't I had too much of my dad in me maybe maybe I could say that I hung around with some of the bad boys I hung around with everybody but I tended to like doing naughty things and when we were teenagers we were awful in Cardiff we were awful we were breaking into houses and we weren't stealing stuff from people we were going and using their telephone to prone porn lines and we would we would watch all their movies eat all of their food leave the place and mess and go again like you know we would do we were doing naughty things we were breaking windows for fun with burning garages and outhouses so the teachers knew what we were doing it was a Cardiff maybe 300,000 people more place everybody gets to know all of the rumors and I got tagged as a troublemaker more than I got tagged as anything else and so I remember one time when it was mass we had to decide whether they had to decide where we were going up a grade it must have been about 13 and I got like something like 70% in the test and the girl who I had gone to a primary school with and known for ages got 61% and she got chosen to go up and I got kept behind and I asked them why and they said they were just trouble and none of the other teachers want you so it was just you know that sort of theme kept going and so in school I did the same thing as I do when I right now which is I I basically said no to teachers but I argued with them in a logical way and like the headmaster used to sit me down when whenever we'd have a conversation about why I wasn't doing the thing so whenever they the teachers the worst threat they could do was go to the headmaster I went to a school which was extremely the headmaster was extremely Christian and it was a policy of no expulsion whatsoever so you could only be suspended and I was never suspended there every time they sent me to the headmaster he would give me a cup of tea we would have some chocolate biscuits and we would sit around and he would ask me why all of these different things and I would give him answers to why and that was basically you know that was the cycle I was in then I just ended go to school for the last year or so of it you know I there was no one there who could keep me in school and and then they still let me into college and that's when my parents relationship was breaking down and my dad was terrible with my mum and my mum was on the lowest like place she could ever be my sisters were just old enough that they had left the house left the home so I ended up like just trying to like help my mum for two years go through the most horrible relationship and then that's really the first time when investigating began because I had to find out who my dad was having an affair with the name the woman in the court documents and I went through library polling things I went through his phone book and I looked at all of the numbers and I found all of these little like coded words and I found all of the things that looked a little bit suspicious. Why was he on the sly about it? He had been caught having loads of affairs over and over again and my mum had always said to him no the next time that's it it's over and this time I was 17 it was like 1997 and so my mum couldn't see a point of trying to keep the family together anymore you know she was like I don't want to be with him anymore he's just all about himself so she wanted to get out of there and there's a load of histories there was a load of histories in my family really complicated things that I didn't know about with my family my mum sat me down one day and told me some things about her life that I had never I still can say by proxy that happened to her throughout her life. She was kind of eccentric as I've heard you told her before she was kind of eccentric with religion and spirituality kind of mixed in in a bunch of weird ways most definitely she had had in the sealed knot she had had a friend who she got really close with she was a really nice girl she was a sad girl but she was really nice and she did a tarot reading for her this must have been about like 79 or something she did a tarot reading for her and it came up bad and the girl killed herself like a week or two later and my mum never forgave herself so she was like in denial about her affinity for this society we had all these books all around but we didn't have like any like it was just church and she didn't look at the rest of the stuff after that until the divorce happened and then when the divorce happened it kind of like just opened up and then she started going to psychic readers all over the place how did you feel about that I mean some of it is really interesting because I find it I think it's a bit of a hit and miss like for them it's a bit of hit and miss there's a load of people out there who are of course scammers and they say loads of things and sometimes they're right about something and at one place she had turned up she had taken my auntie along and there was a guy who claimed to be psychic and talked about my auntie's dead daughter who had died just like a year or two or three before it was devastating she was 18 you know she was the princess of the family and that really like I think that sparked my mum to be like look for all of her ways away from the bad relationship and other things into spirituality and she started attending spiritual church which of course people who were in the know people whose family attend such things they know they call them spooky church did you go check out the spiritualist church because it's a big deal in the UK you know in here even in where I live in California I was never no I used to I listened to a couple of the readings that she got the private readings but I never went to spiritualist church and there was I mean there was a few reasons but I remember my mum saying listen at the spiritualist church I've offered to put together the compilation for the music the hymns we're going to be singing of course their version of hymns and what was it again it was Robbie Williams Angels and I just called to say I love you by Stevie Wonder and she had me put it down on a tape and then I gave the tape to her and she went in and they played that at every session they played the same tune and I just called to say I love you and I just like I couldn't do I would be laughing I would be in hysterics the entire time so I kind of left that you know I don't like the poo poo anything I can't disprove this unfalsifiable I mean the evidence is pretty overwhelming for after death communication in terms of scientifically like we've interviewed a bunch of people you can take that to science you can do a quadruple blind study you can get people and sit them down and not have the people do it and score it independently I had some freaky occurrences happen yeah it's not about that I mean what it's about and the way it connects to all this other stuff we're going to talk about is that you know this has been kind of one of my things is what's slipping through the cracks here is the metaphysical part of this you know Prometheus where Bell and Saga right and Kim Kardashian and you know so some of these people are trying to tap into that energy and we can say whether that energy is real or not you can be agnostic about that but you cannot deny the fact that they are in the belief that there is this alternative energy that will aid them you know that's what Pizzagate was about we talk about we talk about energy upon a low like level of intelligence normally I mean human beings in general because I mean when we talk about when we talk about like sexual compromise cases and things like this I really find that I'm bringing out a five part series that kind of goes back through it's a lot of things that happened in the 50s and 60s no one's truly examined really well that's like the takeover from being normal people then having their establishments taken over by gangland members then taken over by those guys taken over by intelligence and a load of people just died in the wake and then that led to the downfall of the British Government and naughty women inside Kennedy's bedchamber and of course in amongst these stories that they come from the Profumo Affair the downfall of the British Government in the early 60s is one guy Stephen Ward society asked you about he was kind of the guy who was hung out to dry taken to court and eventually took an overdose and died completely completely I mean he had known some of the most important and powerful and influential people and not only in government but also in the intelligence services and he had put himself about and he had put himself in the right places and he was a really interesting person if you actually read a lot of the testimony about people who had experiences especially girls who had sexual experiences because you talk about all of these different girls that went after these different people around at times Stephen Ward would go and chat up a load of girls and then say well do you want to meet my mate he's a politician who's got loads of money and he'd go alright then and then he'd cuddle off down the road and he'd introduce him to his mate who's a politician or whatever else you know but when they had a relationship with him it was completely different often when they went off with other people they had these weird stories you know spanking, sex with animals all these sort of weird things all around but with Stephen Ward he was about exchanging energy so he was about very much about anybody who understands more than just having sex with somebody else knows that once you lay down with anybody else once you connect with someone you go into a point where you can literally just like be next to each other and exchange this feeling that grows and expands and it's not talked about when you're talking about sexual compromise cases we talk sex, sex, sex, sex but there's so much more to the energy that comes out of a human being and the different manifestations of it and the nuances between it and how it affects people and how it changes people's lives changes people's perception of what's good about a bed That's almost too complicated to approach from the way we are I'll tell you one woman that I reference all the time I wrote this book a few years ago called Why Evil Matters and the premise of the book is we don't deal with evil it's either evil is a social construct evil doesn't exist, there's no such thing as consciousness you're a biological robot in the universe or I'll tell you what evil is let me pull out my Bible and here it is so I interviewed this woman called Annika Lucas and she was you've had a horrific childhood my childhood was not perfect nothing like that Annika goes a level deeper basically an insane mother who sold her to as a sex slave at six years old in Belgium and remember the Dutro thing I did a bit of research on it it's quite amazing if you want to know a couple of little tidbits of what I know then and likewise because one of the things they know about the Dutro case is he goes to jail and while he's in jail the little kids that he has locked up in cages die because they're not getting fed and they go and you can find pictures on the internet of these kids so I'm talking to Annika and unbelievable kind of experience trauma kind of a yogi I'm a yogi she's into that now and has used that as part of her healing kind of thing but the thread there that's interesting is at some point I go but is this satanic and she goes yes it is satanic now I'm not a Christian Johnny I mean I was raised Christian but I don't believe that satanic in the biblical sense gets us there but there are these people that it's not about energy exchange it's about them specifically trying to do something and you know what I tie it to if I can to jump around because I really want to get here and I want to make sure we get there so let me fold this up because we could talk about this fricking for an hour unbelievable in your Schwab family values kind of thing it's a brief history of the Jewish persecution in Ravensburg where Uncle Klaus is from one of the things that jumped out at me is blood liable do you want to tell people what fucking the craziness what blood liable is back in the day people were very crazy about stuff so when something happened where people started accusing other people of being a witch or worshiping some sort of like black magic it was done with loads of these words that we don't really use nowadays but in this case in particular they were saying that the Jewish people were sacrificing babies to obviously their molek or their sort of devil that's what specifically this blood liable was about here's where you didn't take it that I want to take it and see where you go is that one it's about the Jews and then number two this is rebooted by the Nazis right so this is like 13th century they're going hey the Jews are doing this crazy thing because it's already been done for hundreds of years we've been sacrificing kids all the time the thematic element that they're building on here is not new that we're gonna get together and we're gonna to molek or whoever we're gonna take these and take these little kids we're gonna sacrifice them but now they're directing it at the Jews and we want to pick up on it like it's a Nazi thing it's not it's a Christian thing it's a Martin Luther thing have you ever read what Martin Luther the founder of the Protestant church the guy who goes and nails the guy who translates the Bible and the like pain and death and they threaten the same with Tyndall and translating the Bible into to English so these were like groundbreaking times where people were doing the things that they weren't allowed to do like so but so deconstruct that for a second so Martin Luther goes and actually has a chance to read the Bible and says hey all this shit that the Catholic church is telling us it isn't in there so he goes and says hey everyone should be exposed to the Bible but what the Bible tells us is that I don't want people to take this the wrong way it tells us what I think is this completely false narrative about this historical Jesus figure that really doesn't add up but the way that story comes down is that these Jews are the bad guys from Jump Street there's a one who killed Jesus right so they went to Pontius Pilate and Pontius Pilate said hey man the guy looks good to me but if you Jews want to kill him the stain is on you forever this is the origin of the whole Jewish thing we don't get back to that and we don't get back to that narrative looking whether that narrative is true and we have archeological evidence that it isn't true along with the fact that anyone who's looked at it logically says hey there's no historical evidence to suggest it well Josephius Josephius if I was pronouncing his name right Josephus well there's a couple of people who around a certain time in the Roman world decided to adopt part of Christianity into their own images for their own sort of brand and I think he's one of the people who helped colour that no I mean this is kind of my thing one of my things but Josephus is a really interesting character do you know any of the story of Josephus? just a couple of little bits Josephus is he's Jewish and he's a general and Vespasian who is going to become the next Caesar is sent over to clean up Judea and he lands in Galilee and Galilee happens to be where Josephus is the general so one thing leads to another this is Josephus' account I'll kind of give a little hint here Josephus can only be understood as a propaganda agent for the Romans now I've had leading historians come on, Biblical historians and just regular historians PhDs come on and verify that no one argues with that Josephus begins to write this he's basically turned he's flipped right so Vespasian comes in and says hey you're going to die or you're going to help me I mean that's our interpretation of it the way Josephus spins it in his story is that no he goes into a cave and everyone commits suicide and then he has this revelation and his revelation is that Vespasian is the Messiah that the Jewish people have been waiting for and he actually writes this down this is in war with the Jews this book that Josephus wrote and what so many scholars rely on is the history of that time because even though they'll all admit it's propaganda it's the best account we have of what happens so he's not inventing Christianity at this point what he's doing is he's trying to mess with Judaism just as a Psiop right so he's telling the Jews of which he's won that your religion you're waiting for this Messiah I tell you what one of your proverbs actually predicts that Vespasian will be the Messiah and here he is so it gets much much more complicated because then a few hundred years later we have Constantine and you know the funny thing not to digress too far but the reason we know a lot of this stuff about Josephus is because we have the Archititus you can go to Rome and see the freaking Archititus it's still there it's this big rock and it shows all these Romans and they got the star of David and all this gold and silver and stuff like that that they've taken from Judea with the sacking of Judea and then 300 years later we have the Arch of Constantine but you know the thing about Constantine what they say is that Constantine this famous story is Constantine is the father of the Christian church I believe kind of the narrative and Constantine comes to this river crossing and he's gonna have this big battle you know this story you know and he sees a cross in the sky and he sees that as a image and his conversion happens and he wins the battle and then he says okay we should convert and he converts the empire to Christianity that's not true you can just go through the archeology there's no crosses on the arch of Constantine well most of these I mean propaganda has been people think that we are different so much different now than we were a thousand years ago two thousand years ago and we might have all of these gadgets and technology and boxes and luggage piled up all over the place but all of it is pretty meaningless when you get down to the brass tax you've got only the ability to look better to someone to also create an idea that you're indistinguishable from magic basically that you're worth investing in and that they should give you all of their stuff and that's what we've got from history in Memorial is people who are trying to brand it. What does that say about the reset? One of the angles I was going to take on this interview is that your work inadvertently pulled me out of the abyss with the great reset which is pretty impossible to do because it's so dark and what they're doing is so obvious and so revealed but you know what pulls me out a little bit is just the crazy humaneness of Klaus Schwab and Henry Kissinger I've heard your excellent interview with Greg from Hireside Chats and you were talking about screwed up families particularly Klaus Schwab and how his family background it's like I get it and also on another level it's like you will own nothing and you will be happy is that tell me this is that the worst freaking marketing slogan in history? You couldn't shop that and come up with the worst thing and now they've tried to scrub it from the internet but it won't scrub because nothing can really be scrubbed the fact that they can make that kind of mistake that kind of misstep is a ray of hope the fact that Henry Kissinger is a bona fide freaking world war 2 war hero One second because Kissinger there he created the idea of really fundamentally of limited warfare perpetual limited warfare and he discovered that you have to create something that explodes and is dangerous and he kills to be able to get along with all of this other stuff over here while people are distracted over there and in a sense that's what Klaus Schwab and his gang do with a sentence like you'll own nothing and be happy it's so abusive and horrible that you start from a bottom I think to an extent but it's making people think no I want more than that and then they're instantly in this frame of mind of more than that is better you know it instantly flips into oh I want to own more than nothing and be happy there you go that's what I have it's trolling it's flexing and it's signaling and I got those from you and I didn't see that before I modified them slightly but one that you pointed out first of all it's signaling you know I'm in fucking Davos Switzerland hamburgers are $50 a piece you know what I mean? there's no I will own nothing but I'm signaling to my people that hey this is how we talk to these people this is what they mean but it's also flexing in that same way it's saying I can get away with this we can just rub it in their face it's flexing I can do this stuff and it's also trolling because you like to troll we all like to troll we all like to get a reaction out of people and he likes to get a reaction I think if you're not very good at comedy you you end up trolling and so most of the people who want power are very good at comedy and usually end up being trolls they may go together well you know the other place I was going with Kissinger is like you didn't go all the way there but if you go into the background of Kissinger freaking World War two hero I mean legitimate war hero not like any bullshit like legitimate battle the bulge you know before battle the bulge he carries a gun into battle he's there you know I would say totally psychologically scarred from being right in the center of load of battles and afterwards he's the guy who's kicking in doors and looking for the Nazis like he's heading up to like groups after the war he's project paperclip he's project paperclip but right at the end of the war the first people through your door was Henry Kissinger and his boys if you were generals and stuff hiding away so you're going to stop oh we're going to find out but very quickly your project paperclip but this is a 21 year old kid this is a kid who leaves Germany three days before crystal knock I mean you can't forget that either and he comes over to New York and it's this segregated thing you're Jewish you walk on the other side of the street because those kids will beat you up you know and he doesn't speak English I mean there's so many things to admire about this guy but he goes totally dark I mean we're going to talk back about you and how you wind up with Chile but man he don't land you know Henry Kissinger you don't make any stops in Santiago right because isn't he still a wanted criminal down there listen he's a criminal he should be a criminal in every single country but he was tried he was tried in Chile wasn't he or they tried I don't know too much about the last thing I looked about Kissinger in South America was him helping to fix the Argentinian World Cup how did you wind up with Chile and how did Whitney wind up in Chile too how did you both Whitney was here first she had started to make a life down here and we met and we went to doing we're basically into the same sort of stuff completely like not only writing but how we research and then all of the other things in life we get on really well with so we just hit it off really quickly and it was a case Covid broke out Covid broke out and all of the process started and it came to a point where we realised that if I stayed in Britain I was going to be stuck in Britain so I went over to Chile and through Covid I've been kicked out of the country at times where I've not been allowed in is better to say where they pretended their embassy was open in London and they wouldn't let me back in but basically I'm applying for temporary residency down here at the moment because the last time I went back to Britain I was just I was so disappointed everybody's in a state of shock there it seems to me they're all walking around with this dumb look on their face going oh no everything's fine everything's fine everything's fine over and over again and hoping that everything's fine the stories I was hearing were people who just haven't come to terms with what just happened over the previous two years the kids were out of control there was fires going on in the park outside the house I was staying at and I'd lived there for like eight, nine years beforehand and it's always been a really nice place and it just turned into a place where gangs of kids were roaming around and being readywells as we say being bad, being like I was when I was young and but the thing is his Cardiff isn't batches Britain anymore you know it's not the same but it went up in the world a little bit you know it got a little bit of prestige a bit of money invested in it and it was really sad to see so Chile has just become a better place a much better place to hang out, a much better place so anything particular about Chile or how did you wind up there just me and Whitney we just we hit it off so we lived down in Chile now we got a kid we live amongst the volcanoes so life is pretty groovy down here you know is just just seems like the right place you guys live in Santiago no no no no that's a pretty rough place I went I did I did an audit there recently when I couldn't go into America when Whitney did her book to around America with a couple of platforms I was like I stuck in in Chile because I couldn't leave or I'd have to have all of these tests to come back so I went right up first of all to Santiago and I did some police auditing so I got out the camera and I went round and I looked for police to video to see how they reacted to the whole process of being filmed which is what police auditing is about and I I ended up getting attacked by a couple of tramps while I was there there was a couple of tramps you're on your way to getting thrown out of there, aren't you yeah I know but then I went up to Areca which is right in the north of Chile by the Bolivia-Peru border and I stayed up there for a couple of weeks and it's like the most run down rife with drugs no one's employed, the beach was beautiful but completely empty because it had been completely decimated over COVID and I walked around and I videoed around there for a bit and that was a really like hush, huts up on the hills people don't have anything they don't have not two pennies to rub together so the north of Chile is much different than the mid and the south because of course when you go south you get down to the penguins in Patagonia you know you've gone too far if you see penguins but in the middle you've got some really nice places, loads of lakes you've got a run of volcanoes so there's a volcano near us which is always smoking it looks beautiful it's a really nice place to live and it's a bit of a when you have things like volcanoes and stuff you've got you're around ski holidays and exploring holidays so you've got loads of tourists around here and that attracts lots of funny people but lots of nice little restaurants and things Chile is pretty the people are interesting but they seem really like they're outside all of the troubles of the world and we like that but in the same way sometimes when COVID happened every man, woman and child was covered with a mask and looking down and scared about did not want to have to argue What kind of trauma does that put into a culture and that's Henry that's Henry's candy he did a lot in different parts of the world Henry Kissinger supported different regimes and pretended that he wasn't sometimes so like in Pakistan they pretended that they were tough on Pakistan at the same time they were helping Pakistan with everything and Kissinger was setting up with Jackal Braith for Benazir Bouto to be trained through Harvard and eventually put into power where she would act like she was anti-American but in actual fact she was and what happens to her anybody who works with Kissinger for long enough gets the boot eventually apart from Schwab Well you know there's so many ways to go with this that I haven't even gone but one of the things I wonder is if you look at Kissinger and you look at that awesome article that you did Dr. Klaus Schwab or DRF taught me to stop worrying and love the bomb which is right out of Dr. Strangelove and you identify the guy who really is Dr. Strangelove and it's not Kissinger which is interesting because a lot of people used to think it was Kissinger and this is give people the thumbnail sketch on this because when we're talking about Pinochet and we're talking about the stuff that he does in the CIA it's not as crazy as it is normally portrayed and it particularly plays into the maybe not as crazy part of the World Economic Forum not to say that the World Economic Forum isn't evil of a first order but it's like there's like this twisted crazy logic to it that is kind of revealing in a way that you do it. Give us the quick thumbnail sketch of this. Okay well it's really interesting about Kissinger is that he takes people and he gives them the right people to help him go along but in a sense everything Kissinger does isn't Kissinger's really and in this case there was a seminar Harvard's International Seminar that was originally set up by William Yandell Elliott who was a advisor to six presidents and was a real big CFR Grand D. Council on Foreign Relations. Yeah yeah 100% I mean by 1967 International's Kissinger's International Seminar was outed. Humphrey Dorman himself from Harvard had to go into the Harvard Crimson and publish Oh look yes between 1960 and 1966 Kissinger's International Seminar was funded by the Farfield Foundation by the American friends for the Middle East and by the Asian Foundation and they don't mention the first 10 years and that's really important. Yeah and as soon as he got exposed because he was about to be exposed by newspapers so they just came out with it. Now what I released the other day Guido Gohmann the CFR and the German Marshall Fund really explores much fervor onto that so the moment that got exposed they went away and said well we got to find another way to run leadership courses which was Harvard's International Seminar Kissinger's International Seminar was it was a young global leadership program one of the first that America had run so it's been running them for years run from 1950 to 1967 1972 the German Marshall Fund is creating eventually you get the Marshall Memorial Fellowship you get the TILM leadership network you get a leadership lab you get other ones come up and that was again set up by Kissinger and he put Guido Gohmann and Stanley Hoffman who were both underlings Kissinger working at the Harvard University Guido Gohmann especially put into the position of the German Marshall Fund and they were given a very special assistant which is a woman called Abbey Collins who's not mentioned in the first articles I've written about the International Seminar but she ran the International Seminar she completely run it at the end she was the woman she was an Asian-American who basically ran it for Kissinger once it was completely off the ground so the last years especially while they were being funded by CIA can't do it it was by Abbey Collins and she went straight over to the German Marshall Fund afterwards basically and they continued the same thing which still runs today and leads on here's the part I want you to draw out kind of big picture part is that this crazy mutual destruction kind of thing the way you lay it out it actually kind of makes sense until you kind of cross-correlated with the fact that we almost blew each other the frickin up we did I mean it almost happened it was it got crazy it got really crazy CFR put in loads of working while this International Seminar started running the CIA were doing loads of things so they were starting off their coups over in the Middle East against Soviet infiltration and they were doing other things but they were and they were starting off the seminar but they were also concentrating on the nuclear arms race and these people were really really worked out that the Soviets could just launch a bomb and everybody's dead and the Soviets are like oh god the Americans could launch a bomb and everybody's dead so they were both really scared everybody had all this propaganda this duck and cover sort of stuff coming out at this from the TV screens from the newspapers constantly and they had really pushed up the rhetoric and in 1957 when nuclear war and foreign policy got released from the CFR working group that Henry Kissinger released it and it kind of said okay what would be better than all out nuclear war is that we have this slow perpetual warfare let the guys in Cardiff go out in the alley after a few pints and they'll get it out of their system and then we can go on and tomorrow we'll do the same thing that is a thought and with Herman Kahn he was like well they're not going to fire on us we're not going to fire on them for every finger pushing down on the button there's like 14 hands pulling that finger up there's so many safety mechanisms and it's just very unlikely that we're going to have this but it's like a stalemate so that kind of led people to realise that Henry Kissinger's like previous four years before summation that oh we should maybe have this perpetual limited warfare that goes on all the time is much more likely to be the route to everything is going to go from this point on and yeah but the idea that we could all just destroy us each other and Herman Kahn is an extremely interesting figure worked for the Hudson Institute heading up the Hudson Institute he really funded a lot by the Rand Corporation he wrote, he worked for the State Department between 1966 and 1968 and he wrote this amazing paper two papers at the time one was an ancillary document about educated leadership outside the normal university processes so like a young global leaders course but also his more public document was called the year 2000 and he was looking at all the technology that could possibly be discovered up until the year 2000 something that Klaus does when he becomes Klaus is yeah he's introduced to Herman Kahn as Herman Kahn is writing this this young technocrat and I feel that Kissinger knew that the technocrats were going to be of course he knew they all knew the technocrats to use their power and a totally kind of straight up level way which you also play out like this stuff is really dark so I don't want to kind of it's not like I'm trying to sugar coat these people I'm just trying to help us understand them better because I think your thing about if anyone takes out trolling flexing signalling and just says is there any truth to that it softens this thing up a lot I think in a way that we can kind of more human in a very negative way. I mean, like criminal human, but still human. But the other thing I was gonna say is like, you do that with Schwab when you say he takes over daddy's business, but he's kick-ass good at it, you know? And one of the things he sees from Harvard and all the rest of that is this technology's coming and we're gonna apply it in our business and we're gonna make a shitload of money because we're gonna make a better, we're gonna make a better business because we're on top of it. We're doing good stuff. We're doing Harvard Business School kind of stuff. Hey, Klaus knows that wherever he is at this point, he's got, at that point, he's getting loads of, he's got loads of degrees, loads of extra degrees on top where he just turns up at a place and suddenly gets to giving a degree. He's invited Kissinger's International Seminar, so it must've been that he had such a really amazing amount of qualifications. He's got a ton of degrees, but he's also smart. I mean, he's on his game too, right? Yeah, no, no, Schwab's a really intelligent guy. He's got all of these degrees. He needs going places and he gets invited to this seminar, which is a real big deal because it puts him on the world stage. So it doesn't matter which companies he's in to Schwab. Schwab's going to make a big thing himself, wherever he is, he's gonna be successful and he had learned that he was interested. He was a technocrat from the off and I think that's partially because Kissinger and other people said, right, you're a technocrat, technocracy is the future. You go get your prize and your prize is this world that no one else is aware of yet. You're looking, when I go troll through the archives, I'm reading these stories where, look, this computer can come up with this answer. Oh, this computer can come up with this answer. Then it's suddenly, the computer's revolutionized financial industry. Then it's revolutionized the world with the internet and internet commerce and information highway and then it's something else. And they were already aware of this because of Herman Kahn's research and Kissinger had given Herman Kahn and John Kenneth Galbraith his mentors for Schwab. So Schwab already had the person with him that was going to take him to that place where he was going to be at the king of the technocrats. And I think that crown is going to, he can't live forever at the moment, but maybe what they really want and what he's talked about and what other people around him has talked about is storing your consciousness up into the cloud. And all of these ideas that come with the transhumanist. So he's become from a technocrat to a pure transhumanist. And I think that he doesn't matter how many crimes he's committed or how many things he does wrong. Klaus Schwab is going to get away with it because when he dies, a new person who will be the anti-Klaus but will agree with nearly everything Klaus Schwab says and does will be the person to take over, to take over the dream of all of these people who see this technology around. I think Klaus Schwab fitted like a certain era. He was the right man for that certain era and he did a really good job. Maybe here's a couple of things I wanted to bounce off. Yes, we're kind of eventually we'll run out of time here that Klaus is moving quickly. But I see some wrinkles in the playbook. I heard you on a higher side chat and I think you made a pretty compelling case that I often make, which is like, if you want to count these guys down, you're like, they haven't even begun to pull out any of the trick plays. They're just running the basic stuff but there's different stuff that doesn't line up. Your piece on the Russian thing. Let me pull that up, okay. But what blew me away here is Putin's in the club, right? He's a global leader guy, but now he's out of the club. Now he's getting scrubbed from the club because of Ukraine doesn't exactly fit with the program that they're trying to run. And it starts revealing maybe the Cardiff thing in the alley where now suddenly a couple of my mates come up and like, no bro, we stand together on this thing. And one guy says, no, we're not gonna play that way. So the globalist thing kind of breaks down. Would you play out in this article which I'll try and bring some pieces into this conversation so it has some context. But like they are like doing a flip where they're taking the World Economic Forum crazy reset stuff and they're doubling down on it. They're taking it way to the next level of we're just gonna surveil everyone and we're Russia and we can get away with this. And meanwhile, the Schwabians and the CIA which is this really about USA USA, they're pumping the brakes and they're going, whoa, whoa, whoa, wait a minute now. So this isn't part of the program, is it? I mean, that's my read of it. I think that it's a case that if you as a nation, as a people, as a Russians in general are be constantly being undermined by this West. And it's got to a point where I mean, you had floods of NGOs round every single country that surrounds your country. And it's taken, they've taken political control and nearly every single one of those countries. And you've got no, he's like, you've got the cultural borders. That's all you've got left. And they're all frayed and they're at breaking point and they're pushing further and further. Well, you've got to realize that you're on the losing side and you've been on the losing side for a long time because you haven't been watching what the other guys are doing. You've been watching, there's just nothing you can do about it. Yeah, I mean, it's about controlling the currency and we own the currency, USA USA. If we want to continue to own the currency, USA USA. So now when Russia says, well, maybe you don't own the currency, maybe I can get together with China and Brazil and India and maybe we can come up. That ain't gonna fly. But the part that I want you to particularly hone in on, which this article does, is they're on board with the World Economic Forum, technocratic craziness of all this stuff. Completely, completely. I mean, they- But now they're on the outs. So how do you do that? How do they take it and they go, oh, this is great. We have more surveillance cameras than anybody. If we can lock down all our people, we can take this to the max. Now what happens when they become your enemy? I think there's a glimmer of hope there where the globalist thing kind of breaks down a little bit where you kind of are pointing at them like North Korea and going, hey, nobody wants that. Let's make sure we're not that. So by Russia going over the top, is there a wedge in the globalist agenda? So with Russia, what they've done is they like the guy who runs Bird Bank, I forget his name. He's the guy who's basically pushed forward. The same thing that Elon Musk is talking in America, like the everything sort of app, have everything on one app, all your bank, all your bills, all your shopping, everything you do on this one thing you don't get to go outside this app. That's the start of real serious social control. And it's been snuck in over here. And I see that as cultural. In a lot of cultures, they have to sneak these things in. In China and Russia, you don't have to be so sneaky because the people know you're sneaking. So you just stomp around and they're not in control anyway. So they're trying to get ahead of what the Americans wanna do and what the West wants to do. They're trying to get ahead of them. Now, if they do, that could be a winner. That could be a winner, but the society they're creating is one which is everybody looking inwards and not outwards. And that doesn't necessarily suggest that there's gonna be massive global war or conflict because everybody's more likely to be stuck in their one place and people not wanting people to move around. And we want other people probably to be scared of the people who are next door, the different countries next door and just keeping that fear with their information. And what we see in Russia and what we see in China is a race to what the American model was mapped out by these people in the past, by these technocrats like the Western model. And we see a lot of the fight between them is now like battles to do the same thing first. And that's why I think Ukraine's happened because it's got down to the point where friction's rubbing together. The kid, that's the breaking point. Ukraine has been flooded with more NGOs than any other country in the region. They knew that it had really strong Russian regions and would incite a split, a potential civil war. And it's perpetual warfare. You're not seeing proper warfare over there. If you're seeing proper warfare, Russia's taken Ukraine over in a week and a half and just rolled in or if you see proper warfare, that is what you would see. And you're not seeing that at all. You're seeing they take a bit and they lose it again. And over here, they take a bit and they lose it again. And that's Kissinger's perpetual warfare. And they are all playing under the same game, but they're all competing still. But the winner, the taking all, isn't actually all. Globalism, just like the first one to get to globalism will probably have a little bit of say on how it goes in the future and that it will be beneficial to them. But in actual fact, they don't know either. They're just trudging towards the thing they think they need to trudge towards because that's what they've been told. And they're in the mindset and everything around them's telling that's what the other people are doing. So they're playing a game and that game may be destructive for us down here, but it's a slow process. It's going to go on for a long time. What do you think of this? What do you think of this? Yeah, I see what, and this is, I've talked with a few people in the independent medias and behind the scenes as well. And most of the feeling is we're going to see, the thing that we're going to see next is some sort of fake war between countries because all of this stuff. Bro, this ain't fake. I talk about fake nuclear attack. I'm talking about this going to be. Maybe, or see it shining. I'm an AI guy, artificial intelligence guy. So I was in the PhD program for artificial intelligence. I left to start an AI company. I started an AI company way back in the day when we were doing expert systems. Sold it, became a one percenter after a few investments. I know this stuff and I don't know it. I don't know it like really, really know it, but I know it enough to kind of fumble through it. No, bro, the AI thing is real now, right? So the machine learning thing is real. You cut off these chips from China. It is the oil embargo against Japan that starts World War II. I mean, it is full on. Yeah, but you know, you know that no one wants to risk the biscuits. They know what it leads to. They have, it would lead to the thing that they had. And this is what always comes round in my mind. It always leads to when you look at it tactically, strategically, you'd end up saying, well, the only way is to make our own people afraid and believe everything like that's going on. And it doesn't really matter anyway. And we'll fake some form of big nuclear war going on in the far off distance. And everybody's crapping themselves because, oh, finally, it's here and people don't realize that thousands of nuclear warheads have been detonated on this earth already. Take the nuclear thing out of it for a minute. This is about our crypto versus everyone else's crypto, right? The United States currency is a crypto. It's a fiat currency. It's a crypto, right? But we want our crypto. It's our crypto. We want to have control of it. So what this is about to me, the thing with China and the thing with Russia is don't mess with our crypto. It's our crypto that runs the world right now. As long as we can keep that in order. So China stepped out of line a little bit and it's just pulling on the chain and going, no, you're not going to do that. And it's CBDCs are going to wipe this all away. And well, as long as as long as our crypto comes out on top from a United States standpoint, these guys, the guys we're talking about, that's what they care about. Because as I see it, the global thing is kind of is kind of showing how it doesn't. It doesn't really fit. I mean, Klaus Schwab is not really a globalist. He is working for the fricking CIA is what he's doing. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, this is a technocratic push to get to a technology arms race as quickly as possible. Really, that's this technological arms race where we're in something that's been going on for a long time. Once we once we got this is why the atomic age was so important. Once we got to that level of technology, it was a real like signal to everybody in charge that all of the rest of the stuff is coming and very quickly because technological growth is basically exponential. And if you can believe that, if you truly believe that, the route we're heading in 10 years is insane. It's crazy. Well, what we're what we're going towards. Now, I'm really intrigued to say and ask you, well, you know, what do you think we're going? Are we going towards are we already at quantum enabled computer computing? Are we already at quantum computing? I heard you mention that on the on the higher side chats. And it's like, I was like, bro, you have it. So a qubit is the way we measure quantum computing. And they've made exponential growth in that just every month. They're increasing it. And they say that a hundred qubit is more powerful than all the supercomputers in the world. Does that all mean what does that all mean? Every what it means, what it means, CBDC, every single crypto, every single piece of technology that they're about to fight over. Every nuclear just becomes water. It will Johnny Johnny. Well, Johnny, you put your finger on it on one of the articles you wrote. Again, brilliant. You brought this piece to the front about how their first which flies under the radar. No one was talking about this. You wrote this two years ago, which is security. So right. So the first thing you want to do with your AI is hack everybody else. So you want to do promise software 10 point. Oh, where now everyone has their pants down and everyone can be looked at. I'll pull up that article for people after the show so they can see it. But it's phenomenal. But then you take that. You know what what Elon has said? And here's another thing like I don't know what the. I don't know what to make of Elon, but I don't know how you read the Twitter files as anything other than a step forward. I mean, it's like there's no. I don't see the alternative motive play there. And let me let me put that aside. Let me put that aside for a minute because I want to get back to the to the AI. I think what I sent you and maybe I'll share this with people is I did the chat GPT thing and Johnny and it's like it's like a joke. It's like hilarious. But what it points out is something that Elon said again, I'm not a big Elon guy, but you got, I think take take the complicated aspects of people and stuff like that. But what Elon said is we're all going to need our own AI. And I think he's right because chat GPT is down the tank. It is down the tank in terms of its bias. You type in chat GPT and maybe I'll do this session and add it to the video. Great reset. It's like, I don't know that you do. There's a classic one. You do chat GPT, you will own nothing and you will be happy. Chat GPT says, I don't have I don't know what that is. I don't have. I don't have the AI overload. Don't don't don't exactly. I mean, you just I mean, it's so it's so transparent. All you have to do is go over to go over to Google and, you know, it's like, OK, here it is Forbes, you know, here it is where they tried to scrub it. The original Twitter post way back machine. But then interestingly enough, like I said, you go over to chat Sonic another AI and type in the same thing and it lays it all out. It says, oh, this is people are really upset about that because, you know, it's Orwellian and all the rest. So Elon looks pretty prophetic there. We're going to need our own AI or own machine learning to sort through the completely controlled, but if they're that far ahead of the curve where because the pitch they're making about the machine learning chat GPT is that, oh, it's it's out of control now. It's just, you know, doing its own thing. Well, apparently not. Apparently they can rein it in and focus it to say what they want it to say. They can. Yeah, they can. I think what we're seeing is lots of phenomenon all over the place that look good, look like the real thing. And this doesn't look culture and society. No, but I mean how it acts and how it how it functions, looks like it's working. That's the same in culture as well as it is within technology. It's like mimicking all over. It seems like the bread and circuses moment of a civilization. That's where I keep coming to the conclusion of we're coming to the end of ideas for this period of our human existence. And we're going to need some other ideas if we're going to get over these. I do this dicks. I don't know. Whatever you want to call them that running society with Elon Musk. I've got to say out loud. I I this parts of me that like him and his parts for me that hate him. But I can tell you if you think he's a prophet, it's only. And this is to everybody is only because you haven't read certain things that if you had already read, you'd be like, oh, yeah, someone else said that. Someone else said that someone else said that someone else said that. Well, he is very good at is having people map out and game out and think himself and analyze the situation, how it's going to play out eventually, especially when it comes to technology. You understand why I don't do all that. But but tell me this like when we try and pin this stuff down. This drives me nuts about the conspiracy community. And I'm not tagging this all on you. But like one of my goals is to kind of hold the conspiracy community accountable and not just go into this. Oh, Elon Musk. Oh, did you see this? His parents. Oh, you know, bro, you know, that's so bullshitty. What could explain the Twitter files from from a conspirator? I don't see any. OK, I don't see any. I'll tell you, I'll tell you, I'll tell you, I'll tell you. Quite simply, you've got a load of information that you need out. You've got control of all and you're not Elon Musk. This isn't Elon Musk. This is someone else. This is intelligence. They are in control of everything. They've got their men in here, their men in there. They they can pull a string here, pull a string there and they can they get to a point where they end an operation or an operation is going to be exposed. They are looking at all the chatter. They see all of the chatter all around telling them that this is about to be exposed. No one else has seen that chapter because these guys are listening to lots of things and they decide we can expose it in whichever way we like. But the best way would be to flip the ownership of the company, make the people in the company that you want to keep running, look like the heroes by releasing the information. You kind of whitewash it. It goes out of it. This happens. This is like intelligence resets. I feel this with Snowden as well. And I do feel this with Snowden that you got to a point where that operation needed was about to come out, about to be known and you needed to release it. So why not have somebody then you can put out that then become central to all of these people who are looking over there and not looking at what you're doing next, because these programs are always stop gaps. They always are looking over there. No one's looking over there in a way. That's evidence for what I'm saying is that, you know, they were successful. Evidence that they're successful. You can't have it both ways. You can't have it both ways. You can't come out in with Twitter files and just verify what has been rumored for this whole time, which is the fourth estate just doesn't. We've been in you. Have you ever been in you? I mean, the thing is, is all they're doing, all they're doing is saving Twitter as an entity by having the people. But it wasn't about Twitter. I mean, the the the renovations really weren't about Twitter. They were about Google, Facebook and how they all work in content. And what's happened? What's happened about Google or Facebook or the rest of them? Yeah. And unless they decide that that point has ended and they need to refresh it and they have someone else come in and it's like a rebranding. So all I see with Elon Musk buying Twitter, all of a sudden doing the Twitter files, everybody knows all the truth. Matt, Tai Ebi and and vice their heroes. It's all a narrative that you've chosen. I mean, Tai Ebi, he's a guy who just like hates the conspiracy world. He hates he's he's he's not on the side of the people, in my opinion. Maybe maybe. But what take your other thing? I mean, let's say let's say Elon does want to conquer the world from a business standpoint, which he clearly does. I mean, he's he works incredibly hard at Tesla and has made unbelievable technology breakthroughs with that company. And I think it's told bullshit. I don't know why anyone would drive into him given to him given to him. If he given to him, you know what, like, look, I'm not a Twitter. I'm not a Elon guy. I don't know. But you know, PhD or undergraduate degree, physics, undergraduate business degree from Penn. You know, he's not a slouch guy studying Stanford. There's something there. There's something there. Oh, there's something here. So right. Stanford, he drops out. He drops out of a fricking PhD program physics. I know he dropped out. But what's really interesting around that that phase is that there's like a couple of years which you don't get to see what he's done or you have no evidence of what he's done, like no one has any evidence. And I looked through a load of articles and I found that saying that he had worked for Microsoft during that time and I found a couple of rumors about what people have said, but there was loads of Microsoft leadership programs going. And Elon Musk, right, he's not in saying that he's probably not out for the best interest of humanity, isn't necessarily saying he's not an intelligent guy, a super high functioning intelligence that I can't quite understand in his realm and he doesn't have a place. What would be the best interest of humanity? I mean, that's back to Kissinger is is mass mutual nuclear destruction in the best interest of humanity. Kissinger kind of convinced as well. It maybe is in a twisted way. It kind of is. I just think that this is the conspiracy stuff that kind of drives me nuts. I don't know what to make of Elon Musk, but the openness, the two... That's Brandon. He turns PR. He's turning PR. But it's real, but it's real. He turns down the deception. When it comes up to 96, 97, 98, his mother's working heavily on other people's branding. And at the same time, her company's working, her son's working for a very successful company that's projected to be able to be sold for lots of money. So he's in a situation where he needs all of that branding help. And she's very good at that. She's very good at that. And he's coming. He turned from being this geeky guy in school with some of the pictures you see of him is like he's like super geek. It's beautiful. It's like almost it's almost like someone's drawn a character of him. Get like what you'd expect a guy like that to be like Bill Gates. Yeah, yeah. But but he really does have this carefully crafted persona that's so well. It's so well for us. I mean, yes, it's really nuanced and slight. But it's not that they want to go watch him. You can go watch him on Joe Rogan and you can go watch him on a million other places. He'll conveniently smoke a blunt on there to show his humanity to the world. I know. I know. I get it. I get I get I get the cynicism. I totally get the cynicism. I understand it. But the fact that we in the United States, we had the we had the president of the United States de-platformed from Twitter. Yeah, do you realize what a total mind fuck that is to people still can't wrap their head around? Yeah, you're going to say you're going to say it's the end of an operation. I'm going to say it's it's I don't see the purpose of ending that operation of an operation. It's the start of a new operation is what I'm saying. It's not the end of an operation. That operation is run really up above by exactly the same people. The Elon Musk gets his contracts, gets his tax breaks because he's working with the Department of Defense. He's working for the people. And he knows they're powerful enough to pick him out and throw him in the ocean and he'll be remembered in the footnotes of history. But that's all where he'll be. We'll be able to make his but his whole look at his style. Look at the way he's being built. He's turned from something to something really strange and significant that the whole world should take notice of. And I find it really I'm drawn to both the figures of Klaus Schwab and him as being the same cut from the same cloth at two separate points in two separate eras, like two separate points in history. So Klaus Schwab's coming to the end of his technocratic reign. And during that era, it looked like that. And I see Musk and the new technocrats in the building of the mega city being in the next era, and that's going to be people who are really they don't care about you at all. None of them see you as meat. They will see you as meat and they will jump through you. Yeah, we're going to we're going to wrap this up. If there's any way you can do this again, we should do it again. I'd love to. Hey, one of the things is is I've already seen positive change and I was expecting to see positive change, but I see it as also coins, but they can they they're also coins thrown by a guy passing in a carriage. Grab them in a space carriage. Hey, hey, the solution is this process of truth that you talked about from the very beginning when you come down from the the hills with the shrooms. It's truth. And I think truth is spiritual. I think doubt is spiritual. And I think we're all on this spiritual journey. And I think because of my research, because the science that we're all going to judge ourselves at some point, so we don't need to worry about some mean God judging us. We are going to judge ourselves with this. This life will end and our consciousness will continue, because that's what the evidence says, and it said forever. Every wisdom traditions throughout time. And recently they've tried to refigure it. No, maybe it doesn't. Maybe you need to be up in the Silicon. No, fricking go talk to every wisdom tradition forever. Your consciousness doesn't end with death. And there's something I'm completely down with that. I'm completely down with that, man. I believe I believe it just keeps going. I believe this. I believe there's a whole load of energy just flying around place. And we've got eyes to see things. And we've got a body to feel things and all of this. But see if we can't do anything about all of the energy all around the place. And it all means different things. OK, I tell you what, let's let's wrap this up. Would you think about would you think about that? How to take what you guys are doing and let's test it. Twitter says we're open now. We're open for business. Everyone can get this. We're no more deep platform. We're no more playing this cat and mouse game on YouTube. Oh, don't say that word. No, Elon says the door is open. Let's walk through the door. What do we need to do that? Yeah, I. I've been feeling I've been feeling I've been trying to that all the time. I try I but I don't know how far to push it. I think the way to do it is to be up front and saying, we're testing whether or not the gates are open. You said the gates are open. Here's the truth and we can just start all the stuff you've done. Tell me what what we need to take. Unlimited hangout to Twitter on the next level and run ads and say. Well, that'd be interesting. I'll have to talk to Whitney, but yeah, that'd be interesting because I mean. I don't even know what the Internet's going to look like in a couple of years time. So, I mean, most of the time we spend we spend research in most of free time. We spent research and all the rest of the time. Exactly. The kids so we are looking at taking a bit of time off in February, but that is something focusing on getting stuff out that really cuts through. It would be something that I really need to I need to get right. But we I mean, the whole thing is is that everybody's got to get together on this with it's going to be too. The size will become more and more polarized. It will be truth or it will be lies. You won't have another option. And by the end of it, everybody will know which side you're on. OK, you're awesome. We'll be in touch. Awesome, man. See you. See you later. Thanks again to Johnny Vedmore for joining me today on Skeptico. Check out his website, johnnyvedmore.com. I have a number of interviews coming up related to this topic. It's been quite an interesting little journey down this path. Very much in keeping with the Skeptico reboot thing. I'm just kind of following the data and following the deception. And let's see if you enjoy where it takes us for the ride. So that's it for now. Until next time, take care. Bye for now.