 Indications have emerged that there are underground moves by some within the ruling APC to prevail on the national leader, Bola Ahmed Tinibu, to cede his yet to be declared presidential ambition and step down to a younger candidate come 2023. A former member of the National Working Committee who did not want his name mentioned warned that the party would have to navigate the Tinibu bend tactically due to his role of the former governor of Lagos states that he played in the measure of the APC and the election of President Buhari in 2015 and 2019, respectively. It was also governed that the President Mohammed Buhari was being very careful not to take any action that would amount to embarrassment to Tinibu as there is also a strong indication that the presidency has set up a team credible with credible personalities to look up for an acceptable successor of Mohammed Buhari or the platform of the ruling party. Well joining us to discuss this is Muiz Bani Reh, he's a senior advocate of Nigeria. Thank you very much for joining us sir. My pleasure. Good evening. Interesting. Let's start by looking at this statement. You heard me and the introduction. There seems to be a loss of conversation around the former Lagos state governor. In fact, last week, if not earlier this week, we heard about the fact that the AQT APC members were divided as to the consensus candidates because some of them seem to be on the camp of the former Lagos state governor. And we see that he's the party leader, that's what he's called. But why the whole arguments and agitations as to whether he would, I mean he hasn't even declared that he wants to run for president. That is my position as well as I have to say I have not declared that he's running for presidency. And to that extent it would be speculative for anybody to start thinking on his behalf. So for me the coast is still very clear for all aspirants and I wonder why people start talking now about the consensus among the aspirants when even the party structure is here to be established. Now we also know that the APC has, I spoke to an APC party man. I think the national state publicity secretary of the APC, I think from one of the states in the south and he did say that they all have agreed to a consensus candidate. And I remember the speaker of the House of Representatives talking about the fact that they might have to put it in the constitution for all parties to adopt the direct primaries system. But then of course political parties all have their constitutions and they can decide what type of primaries they want to do. But the APC is mostly known for their consensus style of picking candidates. Do you think that that will work well this time around knowing that 2023 is going to be a very highly contested election especially within parties before anyone emerges? But let me first correct the impression that the party is just trying to include in its provisional direct primaries. That is not correct. As I talk from the section of the party, from the section of the party that has always been that provisional which allows both the direct and indirect primaries and consensus. So there are three ways basically through which somebody can actually imagine as a candidate of the party in APC. It's either the direct primaries is done or alternatively you are. Well I'm just going to say what I said again. It's not the party that the speaker was speaking and he was speaking generally about it being included in the constitution of the country not necessarily that of the APC and the PDP seemed to have been kicking against it because they're saying that every party has a right to decide the different modes of in which they would conduct their primaries and that the constitution should not be prescribing that to them. That's what I meant. But even at that, the electoral act which is a knack of the National Assembly already provides for each. It's there. There are three ways even within the party. We'll take a quick break and when we come back we're having some interference. We will continue with the senior advocate of Nigeria. We're still talking about the internal politics in the APC. Stay with us. Well we're back and we're still talking about the internal politics of the APC as we look to 2023 and we're being joined by senior advocate of Nigeria, SA and Moise Bannere. So before we went on that break we were talking about the internal politics in the APC and like I said my question was what I was speaking to was the speaker was talking about inputting this into the nation's constitution rather into the electoral act bill so that all the parties concerned would now align. But the PDP kicked against it saying that they have a right to either decide whether they want to have a consensus candidate or they want to have direct or indirect primaries. But the APC guest I had that they said well I mean if that's what the house is proposing that they will go by it but really can that really work within parties especially now like I said it's a highly it's going to be a very competitive election come 2023 even within the parties the congresses might be very heated as to who would emerge so should we be talking about direct indirect or consensus candidates and how will that play out? Well like I said to you what the speaker said is no news at all. He's already in the electoral act the electoral act was enacted then in progress of the constitutional approach that enabled the national assembly to do so. So more or less you can say it's part and parcel of the constitution already that a party is a liberty to choose any of the three more but I can tell you for free from my experience and when I was in APC that likely consensus never worked in fact what people think consensus was more of a position at all levels within the APC itself and it can never work and it can't even work now you can of course right now as we are talking APC is supposed to start its congresses tomorrow. Tomorrow. I can tell you there are a few contradictions they have no register to do any congress. So they are saying they want to do consensus but what consensus is supposed to be that all parties must agree must consent to the arrangement. I'm sorry I'm sorry I'm sorry I need to take you back did you say that the APC does not have a register as I'm talking to the APC has been conducting as we all know it's been in the news that they have been re-registering members where are they registering them what where's the register no registering is from a register you can register and go away I'm going to compile it is it credible the people who have access to it will value for the integrity of it before you can have a transparent process there must be a credible register and done by all the stakeholders I can tell you without fear of contradiction that there is nothing like that on ground as I'm talking to you it seems so bad that they do not even have congresses at the local government or what level they will conduct anything tomorrow most of the people that they even appointed or nominated as state congress committee team most of them just arrived a day before today and just take a good state they are the state that we're meeting to that I'm talking to you people have not even gotten from to feel nomination from not let it was screening much like they will knowing those who will conduct the respective elections in that they will work you know the whole thing is just a charm it's a complete sexual so I'm curious now because I want to know how the APC is planning to deepen its grassroots mobilization I mean they did we obviously see that the party hasn't been doing well in this regard so now that we have the congresses tomorrow now you're saying that everything is a sham the party has come out to say that they're certain they want to go ahead with this congresses now if the congress is according to you is a sham what do we make of the candidates that emerge at the end of the day and let's not forget about the booni issue that is also a front burner but I'm a very very strong opinion that if the party had been wise they ought to ought the process immediately because they are in a cloudy situation now the situation that they are now called for is a total overall of their processes and structure before they can even progress for that the more they progress the more they themselves which will be catastrophic at the end of the day so for me I believe I saw I've seen a lot of common opinions of people all across the border on respect of the Supreme Court judgment few days ago and the question I kept on asking is that even from the atole general either where is the judgment they're analyzing I can tell you that today the judgment the full judgment has not been out maybe by Monday we'll be able to get copies and read it and you as a lawyer start commenting or speculating on something you have no right so for me I will have thought that like I said a professional manager or a reasonable manager of a process of this nature will certainly call it I will I will put it now we temporarily out the process for them to have a clear picture of what is going on around there before they can progress because at the end of the day if ultimately what we have had that is a quick one set is correct they are just wasting resources and time on any all this company that they're undertaking and that may eventually endanger all their subsequent candidates if not the previous candidate that are still within the net so I mean this leaves me with the because I wanted to ask I mean what what direction they would have gone was speaking you know the candidates but at this point like you said it's clouded everything and and one would wonder why they're still you know bent on going ahead with this Congress but but going forward I mean the ABC has been making very bold statements about you know taking over for the next you know eight years they have also vowed to probably make the PDP some form of a a regional party but but really with all of the things that we're seeing can that really happen if the PDP if the APC is not able to put his house in order and we also know the PDP is also is also facing its own peculiar problems with their governors cross-captaining and most of their members moving to the APC do we also see some form of a disintegration if the house is not put in order and the right choices are not made anytime soon apart from my reason certainly there will be implosion within the APC undoubted that there will be implosion as time progresses they come on away from is a reality that will come to face them at the end of the day so no doubt about that no doubt and and and going forward if you were asked to give your two pens on what the APC should do going forward what would that be and taking the president out of the picture because yes we know that he's the president and he also you know represents the party but taking the president out of the mix what should the party be doing going forward what they ought to be doing what my expectation is that by now statement from that decision of the Supreme Court is to await the full judgment get a copy of it assemble legal consultants to get out to analyze look at it and then be able to fashion out the road map for them so and call your dear after they need to call your neck the neck has to take a position on it and that is the way to go and that's certainly and imminently called for the orphan of this forget they are going on all right we want to be reckless you to attend this impunity and arrogance there's a way destroys entities bodies or individuals and the kind of arrogance or impunity that they are trying there is a beating now I can tell you for free we ultimately on them because it's just a matter of somebody I've said all people around the country today knows that the situation is a bit dicey a normal person who is not reckless a manager of woman and materialism should know that in the situation of this nation you need to stop take stock before you progress for that well it doesn't from what you're saying might not be looking good for the APC except they take a U-turn movies binary is a senior advocate of Nigeria thank you very much for being part of the conversation all right well that's it on plus politics tonight we'll see you on Monday I am Marianna come have a good evening