 George Bruno with the 21 convention the European edition we are in Warsaw, Poland, and I'm having the conversation with Robbie Kramer welcome Thanks George good to be here. What did you talk about my speech was on executing the perfect first date Not necessarily only the first day, but basically the progression of dates Yes, you would want to go through to you know start a relationship with a woman whether that's a casual thing or something more long-term is serious and Prior to you know giving I give a very detailed step-by-step process You know there's so many great speakers of the 21 convention that talk about the overall theory Amazing ideas and a very thought-provoking conversations and I wanted to give something very detailed and very applicable that people can go out immediately implement and Start you know trying to have some better results in their dating life There's a lot of thought leaders out there, but there's not a lot of action leaders, and that's kind of like where you're coming from Yeah, that's always what I've tried to do with my business and her confidence. I've always tried to take these These concepts that are a little bit tougher to apply and find very step-by-step ways to implement the advice without you know the stuff from back in the day all the pick apart of stuff and You know the very original kind of trainings were very tactical And that could lead people the wrong way So I never want to try to give you know What that one-size-fits-all approach? But I like to give the theory and the scientific approach to break things down so you can Go out and use that So a man's not going to go from zero to sixty in three seconds. There are steps Correctors progression Walk us through some of those steps Yes, the thing I see the guys that really screw up on dates Especially when I first started dating I had a lot of anxiety around where to take the girl what sort of venue to choose You know how many places I should go how long should the date be like there's all these questions and It can be overwhelming. So I always recommend that you know you can if you have a plan and you know what you're doing that gives you a lot of peace of mind and you can just focus on the connection and the important part about the plan is remembering that you can essentially end the date anytime on your terms and Whether that's just 30 minutes you grab a beer and you walk in a park Which is a great start to a first date or you go to a little pub and you spend 30 minutes there That you know you save money Obviously, you know, not a big investment on her part not a big investment on your part You're just having fun getting to know each other and the thing that most guys screw up on dates is they forget that the most important thing Is the physical connection? Yes, so they may end up at a table You know eating dinner across from a girl trying to you know create a connection with a mouthful of food That doesn't work or they go, you know the stereotypical like dinner in a movie. That's the worst date ever. Yeah So I always have a plan in mind to make sure that physical connection moves along because if it doesn't You know, you don't know where you stand. You don't know what's going on the best way to do that is to keep moving and So my dates typically like I said they start somewhere like a cafe Grab a quick drink grab a coffee and then I like to walk and talk because walking and talking. It's uh, it's easy It's uh, you know, you're not stuck at a table, you know in a boring setting. It's very, you know The walking also does release Some anxiety physical anxiety because everyone always has a little bit of nervousness when they first meet Yeah, and it kind of melts some of that anxiety away. I think yeah, exactly and then from there Uh Basically, I'll I'll move to a more Intimate venue so more like a hookah bar That's a you know, easy fun place to go or just any sort of lounge sit on a couch Get to know her a little bit better. How close should a man sit? Well, if you're sitting on a couch You'll be right next to her. Yeah, which is ideal and that way the physical connection can grow if she likes you See facing her no sitting side by side and Also, are they touching are their knees touching exactly knees are touching arms are grazing You know you crack a joke. She's gonna go like that. Yes. Yes, right? Yes, and uh as As the connection and you know gets deeper and deeper. She's probably going to you know stare in your eyes you'll be giving you all the signals that you want to kiss her and typically You know on most of my dates that can happen within 30 minutes to an hour and I'll move in go for the kiss. Yeah, if she likes it great. Yeah, not I'll try again 15 minutes later Yes, and you know if that doesn't work out then I usually just end the date Yeah, because she doesn't like me, you know, and I'm not I don't want to give up the impression that you know You need to do that within a certain amount of time frame But you should never be scared to do it And I think that's a big question for a lot of guys at least from my first start is how do you go for that kiss? Or how do you you know, how do you make that connection happen? and It's more about the proximity it should be easy to happen So it's really about where you're sitting, you know, like like we said sitting next to us. Yeah, and And then from there Once you kind of get the kiss out of the way That's that Imaginary line that's cross like now. We're definitely attracted to each other. There's no question about that you know, there's no friend zone and sort of thing that would happen and You know, you're not spending a bunch of money going on more dates where you don't know if she likes you And you feel like maybe she's you know, because you're just wasting your time spinning your wheels So after that you I like to do some sort of in couples activity And essentially what that it makes you feel like you're already a couple and couples have sex and that's the fastest way to Essentially make the connection Where you're you know, that relationship will go somewhere because kind of a catalyst. Yeah sense. Yeah, exactly It helps the situation So taking a gal out for dinner first and having two hours of food in your mouth Probably is not a a good thing to do, right? Definitely not. Okay And I like the idea of moving because that does release a little bit of anxiety I like the idea of doing couples things I like the idea of having physical proximity and making it easy if a move is going to be made it can be done easily, right? Yeah, that's the biggest thing is you know, it should If it's not easy, it's it's going to feel like yes, you know, you're crossing this giant barrier Yeah, and it'll just make the situation awkward. Yeah, you know backfire Should a man ever ask a woman can I kiss you? Definitely not Saying anything or telegraphing that you're going to kiss her is typically a no-no. Yeah, I mean if she if she likes you She's probably gonna kiss you anyways, right, even if you screw it up, right, but It will put her in a position where she feels uncomfortable and that'll ruin it. Yeah, yeah So the best way to make that first move is to make this go for it. Exactly There's a little a little kind of test that you can do I heard this way back in the day. I don't I don't remember from who but if you attempt to whisper in her ear and she moves closer than Likely because she's not really sure what you're going if you move in right? You know, they do that after yeah, and she Follows suit. That's a that's a good little tell Do you how how soon on a date? Do people know I've talked to women who've said oh, I know within five minutes if if something's gonna happen Or if I'm gonna spend more time with them I like the idea of coffee or a drink because it's a small commitment And if it goes well, then you can you go to the lounge or you do something that's gonna be where you're gonna be for a few hours, right? You don't do the two-hour dinner commitment thing exactly because that can be the longest two hours, right? No chemistry Yeah, exactly and you're never you know, you're only you're not offering any sort of lung You know date you're not it's like let's grab a drink And she doesn't know that you have a plan to keep moving and to go from the park or do a cafe to a lounge And then from there to like an arcade or somewhere where you can act like a couple and be kind of childish and be like kids together Which really makes you feel like a couple and cements that connection So you're just you know, you're continuing to move you're continuing to get deep in that physical intimacy and At the end of the at the end of the time she'll be like wow, you know wasn't expecting this It's it's kind of like a cool little adventure you can go on How long does it take for a woman to size a man up and how long does it take for a man to size a woman up? You mean like to you know when you first meet and you kind of you know Well, you know men are more visual of course, so we'll see a woman and we'll immediately know like okay I'd like to you know, yeah, we've heard yes, you know Then you kind of find out later, you know as you spend more time with her if she's the type of person you'd You know want to do more than just sleep with her or maybe you know, she would turn you off in a way Yes, you know something about her personality. Okay, never mind And for women, I feel you know, they they have a different You know at first obviously they're concerned about safety, right? So guys will a Lot of the time I see the mistake happen where guys will take a girl out on the first date You know at the end of the date one in the kiss and then they'll invite them back to their house for like the next date and women You know, they won't feel comfortable going back to a guy's house that early a lot of the time Yes, even if they invite them over for dinner or yes, and and so they'll either not respond to the message or they just won't go, you know the flake and The guy will think oh, well, I guess she didn't like me. It's like no She just wasn't comfortable, you know moving that quickly some women doesn't matter, right? Totally fine, and you can you know, yeah kind of run through that but To answer your question in terms of sizing up You know it takes in my experience like within the first 20 or 30 minutes They'll kind of get the feeling like okay. He's cool. He's normal. I find him attractive He hasn't said anything really stupid And the important thing too on a date is you want to be talking as little as possible Get her to talk get her to share ask her questions about her life because everyone likes talking about themselves. Yes And it really gives her the impression like wow this guy's interested in me. He's a good listener a huge mistake I see guys make because they just ramble on and they talk about themselves and she's listening she might be polite and You know, you might feel like the date's going well because you're just blabbing away And then you try to kiss her and she's like, oh, no, you know, I don't like to move that fast And then you text her the next time and crickets. Yeah, I see that that's probably the biggest mistake I see guys make is they they try to oversell themselves where in essence, you don't want to be selling at all You want to be just finding out who she is asking your questions deciding if she's someone you'd like to have in your life and The physical connection will kind of take care of itself as if you give it an opportunity You know if you're next to her if you're walking next to walking is the best because it's just it's dynamic Across the street, you know, you can do the arm out you can small you know, put your hand on the smaller back to go through a you know a door or something like that and You know, this is all stuff that that happens should happen naturally Yes, but for a lot of us like for me the the idea of going on a date in my early 20s I'd like never been on a date until maybe 25 or 26 Yeah, I just didn't know what the hell to do. Yeah, and especially now with online dating, you know You meet a girl on Tinder and then you're like, okay, do I what do I do? Well, I don't know Yeah, yeah, it's looking me like I said overwhelming is a first date different All right, I'm gonna describe two scenarios. You meet one gal out and about Club bar store coffee shop And you that's woman a woman be you discover on Tinder Which is what a lot of people do that the swiping apps, right? Our first dates the same with both Women good question. Yeah, I wouldn't change anything really, you know, the first 20 30 minutes you meet them somewhere easy Somewhere easy to find park coffee shop and You take them through that same progression the only time I would change the scenario around is if I'm Looking to give off the impression that I definitely don't want a girlfriend and If I'm the type of guy who has a big social circle and I meet a girl and I want to you know Deepen the connection with her and see where it goes Instead of taking her on a one-on-one date if she feels comfortable enough to meet me out with my friends I'll tell her to come out and bring a friend and I'll just integrate her into my so social circle Yes, and that way there's no pressure. We're not even on a date, you know We're just all hanging out. Yes, and we're getting to know each other She's basically getting to know everything she needs by meeting my friends because that will tell you This is this is the type of guy hangs out with these types of people. This is what he does and My social circle now. It's just a bunch of people that like to hang out have a good time Everyone's having casual sex. It's a you know, it's a very like I Don't know how to describe it. It's kind of like a It's strange it's like I'm back in college sort of that sort of vibe, but people are older It's very normal for if I invited a girl out She would meet me and my friends you might hook up with my friend She might hook up with me two weeks later And this is what you see a lot in in our dating culture. I described in my speech I called it the circuit and the circuit is essentially Bachelors, you know guys some some are divorced some are younger guys That you know have money like to travel and there's places on the circuit that everyone goes You know, they go to Tulum. They go to Mekinos. They go to Ibiza They go to fashion week in LA New York Milan Paris and it's basically this group of people that travels around in parties. It's Burning Man. It's a can film festival and Girls will find themselves on the circuit by Instagram guys will hit them up Message them a few times say hey look at my yacht. Look at this. Look at that come to this party and all of a sudden They're getting flown around essentially living lifestyle of partying and and modeling even though they're not really working it can be it can be kind of a toxic environment. Yes and You have to realize that's happening if you're a guy and most beautiful women that are You see on their Instagram that they're traveling and they're partying. That's what they're doing, you know, they're and You can You can integrate yourself into that environment, but you have to be careful because You know it can drain your your bank account pretty quickly. It can make you you can drain your mental health. I was I was basically doing that for a good year and Had an amazing time met a ton of amazing people some really amazing guys Fun relationships, but it can be as I mentioned it can be a little bit draining So that exists and guys don't realize that exists and they think like oh, you know this beautiful girl Whatever, you know, I'll impress her with the some trip to here or there and it's like no She's already done that because any times it's a it's kind of eye-opening. It's kind of like the red pill of advanced partying I'd like to yeah. Yeah, yeah I've had women say to me men don't date anymore. They just want to hang out comment on that Yeah, and women do too. They don't want to date either I think you hear that more from a Woman who might want to settle down who's looking to you know transition out of the party phase and start a family and If you do want to keep things casual, I always tell guys, you know be very careful To date women who are you know kind of at that age where they're looking for something more serious because You know if you go out with them and have sex and things will progress along She's gonna potentially you know be like all right. What are we doing here? Right, you know, we're hanging out hooking up But where's this going and if you want to avoid those conversations and have the bachelor sort of lifestyle date young women You know date women under 25 because you did that really won't come up. Yeah, you know partying Yeah, and if you're looking for something more serious, you know, don't expect a 22 year old to right to get off The circuit cuz yeah, she's gonna say yes to that next invitation to meek and us for sure. Is there a typical age where women Want off of the circuit Yeah, I tend to see that right around 27 28 You know when they start to feel the biological clock taking When is it appropriate to take yourself off of a dating site if you're seeing somebody Because you know if you meet somebody on a site, they're going back Regularly to see if you're still on there still looking right do both people have that talk and say, okay Let's both take ourselves off of the site It's a conversation that has to happen yeah, it's the elephant in the room at one point or another yeah, the The the trick there is if you have any anxiety about taking yourself off then you probably have anxiety about creating something more serious and If that's happening, it's a conversation that you should be having earlier or not even a conversation You should be having but a way that you're showing rather than telling right if if you don't want a relationship And you don't want to have or if you don't want a monogamous relationship And you don't want to have the conversation about you know I saw that you were active on you know your seeking arrangements site or I saw your active on tinder and you don't want that drama then You can It's a little bit tough to describe But you want to give off the vibe that You're just having fun. You're playing around. You're not seeing her more than once a week Because if you're seeing a girl more than once a week, it's pretty obvious that she's gonna Expect you to be her boyfriend. You know I heard back in the day a guy say if you're seeing a girl one more than once a week You're in love and guys will They'll meet a girl. They'll have great sex. They'll want to keep having sex, but they'll want to keep it casual They might not have other partners So they'll make the mistake of seeing her a couple times a week because you know if they're horny and Then a month later the girls like where's this going? He's like, oh, I don't know. I'm kind of focused on work right now I just want to keep things casual and she's like, what do you mean? Yeah, right so they give off that signal because they don't have other women And they're not actively going out and pursuing that Basically out of laziness So the important thing is to not be lazy if you want to be single and if you want to date multiple women then you have to have the What's what basically you have to make sure that you're not seeing them too often because you're just gonna give off that vibe Yeah Where can people find out more about what you do and what your philosophy is? Yeah So if you go to inner confidence calm you can find everything I have I've got a bunch of different E-books on the site that are free. I have a podcast called the leverage podcast, which I release episodes a couple times per week That's what I recommend that everyone should go check out because there's great content great Interviews on there. I think we're on our a hundred and tenth episode At this time so check out the leverage podcast go to inner confidence calm and you can contact me straight from there Robbie Kramer from inner confidence calm. Thank you, sir. Thanks George