 So welcome everyone. I think it's time to start back. So how can diploma students efficiently navigate their careers after graduation? Apart from hard-working, rich soft skill are needed. This roundtable today aims at providing hints and recipes to answer this question. So welcome, ladies and gentlemen, and thank you for connecting from all around the world. My name is Stefan Kedemoy, a 2011 alumni in Konezmata Physics. I come from Cameroon, and I'm presently postdoc at the University of Duisburg Esen in Germany. To chair this roundtable today, I'm not alone. I'm with a great lady, a great networker, the one who initiated all what we have been living since yesterday. Nushka, can you complete your introduction? Thanks, Stefan. That's very kind of you. Yeah, as Stefan said, I'm Nushka Chamba. I'm a graduate of the high-energy physics program in 2017. Right now I'm a postdoc of astronomy at Stockholm University in Sweden. And as Stefan said, we are your hosts for this roundtable, and we are very happy that all of you are here, and we believe that the panelists we have gathered are representative of ICTP alumni from various, who have taken various career parts, and we know that no matter where they're gone, they continue to impact society. Stefan? Yeah, so I'll continue by saying that sharing scientific knowledge is the common heritage of mankind. These are the words that fed the spirit of Prof Salam throughout the struggle to find ICTP. Today, this was in the early 60s. This was the spirit of unity and sharing that gathers us today on the occasion of the 30th anniversary of the diploma program. For 30 years now, many have been privileged to come to ICTP, to access part of the heritage in the fields of mathematics and physics, and use it to develop various areas, from academia to industry, politics via economy or banking. Today, we are honored to evidence ICTP's contributions in building excellence in the world, with the panel made up of former diploma students, with inspiring career paths, and who are impacting the society in various parts of the world, and in various disciplines. Thanks, Stefan. And with that, I'd like to welcome our panelists. We welcome Dr. Ron Giuttiana Barry Malala. She's a graduate of the Earth Systems Physics Program in 2007, and now she's a researcher from the Department of Oceanography in the University of Cape Town in South Africa. She is actively involved in CLIVAR, which is a project of the World Climate Research Program, and she is also one of the lead authors in the recent Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change or the IPCC report on climate change. Thank you for taking me, Andrea. Sorry, Stefan. Go ahead. No, no, go ahead. So, can I continue? Go ahead. I continue with a very bright mind, a very sharp scientist. We have with us Professor Fredy Cachazo, originally from Venezuela, who graduated from iEnergy Physics, or HEP, Diploma Program in 1997. He's now the holder of the prestigious Freeman Dyson Chair of Theoretical Physics at the Perimeter Institute in Canada. He's the winner of several prestigious prizes for his profound work on quantum field theory and string theory, including the New Horizon Prize in 2014. Thank you so much, Fredy, for connecting. And it is also my pleasure to introduce Dr. Mboba Jain from Senegal. He's a graduate of the Mathematics Program in 1998 in ICTP, and now he is the Vice President in Finance and Corporate Services in ECOWAS, which is a bank for investment and development. And after more than 20 years of experience in directing and leading several projects, literally around the African continent. Thank you also for connecting, Dr. Thank you. Another good spot that we got today. Decision-making is one of the main factors of the scientific lack that we observe in the developing world. So this is why we are so honored and pleased to have Professor Rapapa today. He graduated in Koneswata Physics in 1995 and is now a member of the Senate and a former Education Minister in Lesotho. He has many years of experience as a professor of physics and chief executive officer to Lesotho Water and Electricity Authority. Thank you, Professor, with such an honor. Thank you very much. Finally, and of course, last but not least, I introduce Professor Rena Bell Reyes. She's a graduate of the High Energy Physics Program in 2006, and now she's in the Philippines, and she's working at the National Institute of Physics, but also a chief technical advisor at Pinting Lab. And this is a United Nations Development Program, and his goal is to support the government and the recovery of the COVID-19 pandemic and other crisis situations through data analysis. And like Stefan, my co-host, she's also a host of a local TV show called Sciences. We are very delighted that all of you are here with us. This is how it's going to work today. So we plan one hour for a general discussion. So it's already, let's say, 52 minutes left, and then this will be followed by a separate breakout rooms for each of our panelists where audience members can ask their individual questions. So pray that you fall in the breakout room of the panelists that you target. Thank you, Stefan. And without further delay, let's begin our discussion. As we mentioned earlier, we have gathered five alumni, and they've all built very diverse careers after the diploma program. So in two or three minutes, we'd like you to tell us how ICTP shaped your career and what impact it had in your Directional Outlook. I would like to invite Professor Rapapa to answer first, and then we will ask each panelist in turn. Professor Rapapa, you have the floor. Very much. I really want to thank ICTP Director and Management for this opportunity. I must admit that now I'm the member of SINE, which is the upper house of Parliament in the SUTU. I have been a Minister of Energy. I had been a Minister of Education, been chief executive of a regulator. I've been a professor of physics at the university, but all of these things are because I was a diploma student condensed metaphysics 1994-95. I was only a degree holder amongst my colleagues. They all had honors degrees in physics or mathematics, or even some had MSc degrees, but I managed to survive although it was a little bit more hard. ICTP instilled in me the hard work, dedication, to remain focused. A lot of discipline, and it also pushed me into reading a lot of books different from science, management, and all other books, and also teamwork because you wouldn't survive the program without teamwork. So I did rise academically within the National University of SUTU to the level of professor in physics simply because I started at ICTP. From ICTP, I went and did a PhD without masters in between because the ICT program, the University of Manchester, when it assessed it, it found that it was adequate that you could go into a PhD program directly. And that hard work and discipline, I've been a member of different governing board of different institutions. Some of them academic, some of them government institutions, some of them private. So all in all, the discipline within the program and the hard work that you have to go through has made me who I am today. I'm now the member of CNAID, which is the upper house of parliament in the soup. And my aspiration now is to also become a member of parliament elected in 2022. And I hope that after 2022, I will still come back to you to tell you that because of the diploma program, I am a member of parliament now. But all in all, really, the program has made me who I am today. A person who can meaning to contribute to society will continue to do that. I have other community outreach programs that I'm doing because to me, ICTP has been my second home away from home, even if I'm no longer in the academia. ICTP is always a foundation for my life. And I would really appreciate that all other students can go to different career programs. In the end, it will make meaningful contribution in all life that they do. Thank you very much. Thank you. Thanks, professor. Anyone, Rondro, Freddie, for wanting to follow? First of all, thanks, ICTP, for organizing this special thanks to Nushka and Stefan. So I'm going to start with I wouldn't be where I am now, and I wouldn't be doing what I do today, which I'm enjoying a lot if I was not by ICTP. And of course, I'm still a mid-career scientist, but every step I've gone through so far, it has a blueprint of ICTP. So ICTP was actually a turning point for my career, due to not only the help and support provided by the institute and the scientists, but also because of a high level scientific environment that we get to be exposed when we are in Trieste. So I was one of the first Earth System physics students when it started in 2006. I graduated in physics and geophysics in Madagascar, but three months after we after restarted the diploma course, I made up my mind and shifted into climate science and physical oceanography. And I received a lot of support and encouragement from the Earth System physics group, which I really appreciate. Then I continued my PhD at the University of Trieste with a collaboration with ICTP. And here I am today, conducting research on African climate at the University of Cape Town. So if I am to give credits to those who significantly influenced my career path, it will go to ICTP and your system physics group. Thanks. Thank you, Rondra, for your answer. Freddie, would you like to say a few words? Yeah, sure, sure, sure. In fact, if you don't mind, is it possible to share my screen? I think, do you have permissions to do that? Can you try? I have permission to do that. Okay, great. I mean, the reason I want to do it is that since we were asked the question of how the ICTP influenced our careers, so I decided to just show very quickly what my career looked like. So I started in 1991 at the University of Mont Bolivar in Venezuela, then went to the ICTP, then I did my PhD at Harvard, I did a postdoc at the IAS in Princeton, and then since 2005, I've been a faculty member at Torimeton Institute. And as I said, the only reason I wanted to show this is that so in order to explain the importance of the ICTP, we can ask, well, what would have happened if I hadn't gone to the ICTP? And I think it's fair to say, and I'm almost 100% sure, that most of what happened after wouldn't have happened. So the ICTP was actually the key to connecting me from my undergraduate to the rest of my career. And why is it true? I think it's very easy to explain. And in fact, here, I'm talking to an audience where most of us have experienced this. So I'm basically repeating something that we have all lived. When we came to the ICTP for the first time, for most of us, it was our first experience going outside of our countries, in my case, Venezuela. And I have to say that in 1996, the internet wasn't as developed as it is now. So I didn't even speak English very well. In fact, my English was very, very basic. So when people, when I tell people that they have to forgive a little bit how my accent is, is that I say that I went to Italy to learn English. So they have to, they have to be patient with me a little bit. But of course, we went to learn, I went to learn English and physics. But not only that, I mean, the ICTP was the place where people would believe in you. It's the place where you realize that you belong to a community or that you started to belong to a community that was incredibly vast and that involved people from all over the world. And I think there is something very nice that I like, that Jeff Harvey, a professor at Princeton in Chicago, said not long ago. He said that he realized that people in physics, and I saw it when I met my, when I got to meet my classmates, that we belong to a community where we feel closer to each other than even to people who are from our own countries and say people that I've met in Venezuela. So and, and we feel closer to people that are even from, from cultures that are very different from ours. And this is something that was life changing. The experience at the ICTP was something completely amazing. And not only that, of course, also the physics that we learned, the program, we all know this is a very tough program. So it's a boot camp that ended up giving us the confidence that we could do anything else in the world. I mean, even when I went to Harvard, I knew that many of my classmates at Harvard were very brilliant students and so on. But, but I knew that the preparation that I had from the diploma, well, I didn't know it at the time, but now in retrospect, I know that the diploma was a big boost and, and it was actually spectacular for me to come with this preparation. And I have to thank everyone at the ICTP and, and especially Professor Sarmardi, who is not with us anymore, for actually believing in, in all of us and, and helping us reach or try to achieve our potential. So that's, so I'll stop sharing now on my screen. Thank you. Thanks a lot. So, Dr. Evar Eklund of the University of Paris-Dauphin, and I will tell you why, and Professor Ambrositi, because they supported me and a colleague of mine called Professor Ndala Jitay today, who is in the University of Gaston-Berge. We came to ICTP for a three-day conference, and they supported us, give us an opportunity to be in the 1997, 1998 diploma course of mathematics. And I really want to take this opportunity to thank them, because without ICTP, I will not take the carries that I have taken, and I will tell you, and I will elaborate why and how. Before that, I would like to tell to the students and alumni that ICTP does not only produce scientists, and when I came, I was very fond of doing mathematics and physics, but I was also extremely keen to be an investment banker. From ICTP, I had the opportunity to join, to go to Germany, to redo a master in financial mathematics, to do a PhD in financial mathematics, with specializations in artificial neural networks and financial risk management. And during when I was completing my PhD thesis, I was hired by Commence Bank in Germany, and Resner Bank, and follow a banking carrier in corporate investment banking, spent six years till I became a director in Germany, and I moved to London to become a corporate investment banker with credit suites for seven and a half years, before moving back to, in Africa, with Barclay as regional managing director for corporate investment banking, in order to play more in developmental impact in the continent. Example of transactions we have done, Mozambique, $4.6 billion oil and gas deal, Sechel, $97 million telecom company deal, Madagascar, $12 million, but with a huge impact, because it was a pre-export financial deal, where more than 4,000 small-scale farmers was involved, and a very recent 20 megawatt solar power deal in Sierra Leone, and over these 20 odd years of banking carrier, I have also relatively my life, to create some companies, more than six companies, turning over a couple of million dollars a year, creating more than 150 jobs, permanent jobs in my hometown, and producing a couple of millions of chicken every year. I take this opportunity to thank ICTP, not only for making me, enabling me to be who I am today, but giving me the opportunity to have to play a developmental impact into the continent, and I would like to ask the alumni that ICTP is offering more than just be a scientist, it's unlocking people's potential in order to basically follow your career dream, because I'm struggling to believe that once you know and you can do mathematics and physics, you can learn anything, and I would like to thank ICTP for giving me this opportunity to become who I am today, till my country trusted me, till the 15 countries of the ECOS region trusted me to become the finance vice president of the development bank of ECOS. Thank you. Thank you so much, Doctor, for your words. I resonate so much with what you said that ICTP does not create only scientists, but I mean, really if you think about it, change makers and learners and leaders, and I mean, already we've heard a little bit from our panel and we, you know, I'm completely blown away by all of your words. And we also now, we have to hear from Reina if she would like to share her experience. Sure, thank you. It's wonderful to be here. It's really amazing to be in the same virtual room with fellow alumni and so many people that ICTP lives have touched. Yeah, and in a way our stories are very different, but also the same. When I went to ICTP, I was straight from finishing college, very young, young then. It was my first time to be, to be independent, to be far away from home and know even the, you have to take care of yourself. So that's really memorable time for me and for all of us. The good thing is that you're not alone. You're in the same boat as these other classmates and I reconnected with some of them here tonight and it's been great as was mentioned. It's like you feel this bond even after so many years, you know, that bond is still there and it's great that hopefully with this we get to reconnect and get to regularly interact again with each other now that we have our own careers and now our progeny, our students would also now work together maybe. And so we're making this community grow even more and grow stronger. So yeah, that for me was also life-changing, being able to meet people from different countries, cultures, and being friends with them and finding out that also we're not alone. The plight of scientists in my country is shared by them as well. And for me, I think for many of us, it was just a treat. Like for me it was like I actually get paid a stipend to learn, to do what I love, to study physics and that's like a really amazing opportunity. And then of course became the foundation of continuing my career to PhD in Astro Physics at Princeton University to a postdoc in cosmology at Cabin Institute of Cosmological Physics in the University of Chicago and then decided to come back to the Philippines and contribute to the community here as well. Maybe just to share right now, actually in addition to being a professor of faculty at the University of the Philippines, I also consult for as mentioned UNDT analytics lab and also do science communication work and science outreach. And one program is actually a physics meetup that's supported by ICPP's Physics Without Frontiers. So I think these different roles I could also trace back to my experience in ICPP that it's not just about the science, not just about learning the formulas and discovering new things in the science realm, but it's also about the society and the community that we're part of and that we want to contribute to. So I think that now looking back, having that like both halves can be traced back to my ICPP days and sort of having these roles to play as well today. Thank you. Thank you. So it's nice about hearing about the building capacity and science communication. It's so exciting. So now we continue in the field of building capacities. So we now talk about technical skills to spread the spirit of Salam. That's actually because Abdul Salam and vision diploma students would return to their home countries to spread the knowledge and skill they had learned at ICPP. So can any of you tell us what do you see as the best way to build capacity in your region, wherever you are, and independently of the fact that you are physically present or not. So let's keep the time now because we now we are just left with 30 minutes. It would be nice to be very straight and do it in one minute. Look, I don't know if you guys remember the program called TOCTEM. UNDP has a program called TOCTEM. It's transfer of know-how to expatriate nationals. And people like myself, we went back home and while being a corporate investment banker, we were also teaching at the university. We started the finance program of ICTP the finance program of the University of Gaston-Berger and where another alumni even of ICTP, Dr. Professor Galadita and another alumni of ICTP, Dr. Dibri Fal, all those things are coming from ICTP and we went back home and basically transferred some of the know-how that we have got across our career. This would be another way of going back home, you know, sharing the knowledge, but also the food, the financial foods of the money we earn in our international career, reinvesting it back into ASC. Thank you so much, Dr. Galadita. You're so inspiring. Anyone else? Can I come in? Yeah, go ahead. Okay, thank you. Thank you very much. I also believe in the best way that we can build scientific capacity in our region or particularly in our countries. The first thing that I always believe in is that ICTP should always continue to link with the universities, research institutions and scientists throughout all countries and all regions. I think you are doing that but maybe need to increase the level at which you are doing. One other thing is that all ICTP participants, whether they come to workshops, they come through ICTP programs, as long as you are a friend to ICTP, you have to always engage in mentoring science students right from the high school up to the university level. I think all participants should be encouraged and they should also feel part of ICTP in ensuring that they mentor students from high school to the TESHA. If you have one or two or three students, in that case, you are making a meaningful contribution. So maybe annually or by annually, each participant can report back to ICTP on what they have done over the past year or two in ensuring that the spirit of science spreads across small levels in our different countries. In doing so, I always believe, like Dr. Stead, that whatever we do back to our country, whether we are in the country or outside, as far as science is concerned, we should always make sure that we provide an assistance in science development in our country. And I think most of the ICTP diploma graduate are exactly doing that. It's just that sometimes it's not well-documented. If it's well-documented, it also encourages other students to participate in ICTP programs. Thank you very much. Yeah. I mean, this is an issue that was brought up multiple times during the regional meetings on how to better share our expertise and also communicate with other alumni. So I'm pretty sure that people from the regional networking are working on this. And that's certainly part of the reason why this alumni reunion was connected. So thank you very much. Is there anyone else in the panel who would like to add? And then we'll have to move one, sadly. But if there's anyone else who would like to add to this question, it would be great. Reina. I could add something very quickly. Okay. So as I said in the answer to the previous question, in the 90s, the internet wasn't very well developed. But now in 2019, it was very well developed. But we didn't know the full power of the internet. But after thanks to COVID-19, if there is anything good that came out of it, is that now we know the full power of the internet. And the reason I mentioned in this is that so following up the dream of Salam, the idea of creating the diploma program was precisely to create, to help to help populate back the scientific community in developing countries. So if we were able, but we can ask, I mean, as we know very well, it takes many resources to fund students at the ICTP and to bring students to Italy. But now with the internet, we have been given this experience over this year to be able to reach out and to even have this meeting that we're having now and to connect to people remotely. So perhaps it's time to think how the diploma program can be multiplied and made to reach many, many more students around the world. And of course, I mean, you might say that one of the main advantages of the diploma program was that we have research dissertations that we had to do and we had supervisors and so on. And then how can we find so many supervisors? Well, but the answer is the same one. Now the ICTP is 30 years old and we have a big alumni base and we have tons of people who could be supervisors now. And if we all connect and we try to do our part and help the ICTP, maybe the diploma program is something that can be multiplied several faults. So that's one way of building capacity. I think that it's an opportunity that just a year and a half ago, I wouldn't have thought about it because I thought I would have thought that it was impossible to have a meeting online like we're doing now. Thanks. That's a really great point, Freddy, because it is true that now we're in the second year of the pandemic and it has really taught us how to connect with researchers all over the world. And I mean, when we proposed this meeting two years ago or like almost two years ago, we envisioned it to be an in-person meeting. But I'm completely happy in the way in which that this meeting is going online. So thanks a lot for making that point. Reina or Rondra, would you like to add a last comment on this and then we can move on? Can I comment quickly? Sure, go ahead. I think I just want to add that the ability of linking science to the country's need is also a good way to build science capacity. Because usually when we talk about physics and mathematics, people have this idea that we are completely outside of the world and we are not linked to the community. And it's like it doesn't become in the list of priority of most countries, at least in Africa, science. So like our ability to link science to the country's need, it keeps people to be interested, curious and then get involved in science capacity building. And that's one important thing that I learned at our CGP, that even if we learn the theories, we get to know the real meaning of these theories and where to apply them. Thanks. Thank you, Rondra. Reina, do you have any last few words for this question? Yeah, sure. Just quickly, I think along the same lines of what Rondra said, as a group of us are actually thinking about advocating for science, technology, research and development in the country. So we can actually do research to learn about the ways that we can improve the environment, the research and development environment for young scientists who are actually scientists throughout their careers in the country because that's really a way to keep to grow the community and keep people here and interested and also make a bigger impact to the country at large. So bringing the social sciences and the physical sciences together and policy research to make things happen. Reina, your answer leads super well to what I want to ask the panelists next and you next, which is about in each of your careers you've had to work with different cultures and different people with different priorities. So can you tell us what is it like to work with people from these communities and also from people outside of academia and how do you think your scientific background influenced what you bring to those communities? Reina, you're nodding along so maybe you can... No, yeah it's a great segue right because I think that's a big part of what I enjoy in my career now is collaborating with different people, different themes from different backgrounds like the development sector and the policy research groups, communication groups, like you work with a writer, a director and it's really humbling because then you realize there's so much you don't know but also I think the trick also is the openness and the fulfillment in learning something new every time and also recognizing that you can do things together that you wouldn't be able to do alone. So in this case I would be bringing something new to the table like I would see data, I would fresh ice because I don't have the same training as them and that makes the team stronger. So really yeah the collaborative aspect of working with different themes gives you an added dimension and still bringing the like the scientist hat wherever you go, my experience. Rondra you probably have something to add to this because you also work with policymakers right in your work. Rondra can you unmute yourself if you can? Yeah great. Well I think nowadays with this requirement of co-production, transdisciplinary, multi-disciplinary ways of working we really have to adapt and take it up and I must say it's challenging because we in academia we most often use our languages that the other communities can't really understand and we have to find ways to pass the message to the communities without altering the scientific value of what we did. So you mentioned about the report of the intergovernmental panel on climate change so I think I'm going to take a quick example of that. So that report is based on pure scientific research but it targets policy and decision makers. So one part of the report was particularly dedicated to the summary for policy makers so it's like the science was put in language that everyone could understand and they might be able to take action and I think another advocate of that here is Stefan I guess with a science TV show, science TV series going on in West Africa. Stefan where are you? Yeah I'm here. Okay. So I mean I will continue because I have a question for the decision makers in the room. So Professor Rapapa and Dr. Babuba. So they say strict I mean a linear relation between scientific development, technological growth and then economic progress and then why are developing countries not developing? Why is it so difficult to say Professor Rapapa if you are with the president of your country that Mr. President we know since 40 years that we need to invest only 1% of the gross domestic product for research. Why Dr. Babuba? Why is it difficult? So difficult that you just be addressed at the bank. Why is it so difficult to decide that okay let's put money to give some loans to university to make research. Where is the difficulty coming from? You as a scientist who joined politics and business? Okay. Go ahead. Thank you very much sir. One thing that I can say is we as scientists we need to think differently when we come to policymakers. We need to participate more in the governance of our countries. Absolutely. Two of us need to aspire to become ministers, member of parliament. Of course there are challenges when you want to become a member of parliament but eventually if you are part of the decision making process you will make a difference. I for one I've been a minister of energy and I've been a minister of education and most of the decisions that we have made we have always put times ahead of what we are thinking and ahead of what we are doing but if you have one or two or three people with science backgrounds at that level that will help you because sometimes when you are alone as a scientist among people who are thinking otherwise then it becomes a challenge. I think the challenge for us is to be part of the system rather than to be outside the system and that is the advice that I can give to some of the people because if you are outside people don't understand what you are saying but once you are inside people who always understand and I'm proud to say that during my time as a minister of education and as a minister of energy there are certain key decisions that the government of Lusuit have made which will have a long impact and we are going to achieve more because of that but if I had not been there and scientists are outside that thinking tank for the country then we will have this problem so I always think that slowly scientists are moving towards saying we have to be part of the system and then people will understand what we are talking about and I think we will eventually get there is to participate be among the key decision makers or at least be at the advisory level of the cabinet ministers or the president or the prime minister that's the case maybe thank you very much. Thank you so much yeah on my side I just want to add a few comments first of all a country like Rwanda has shown that it's possible in the space of less than 15 years the country has moved from being a genocide country to one of the very economically developed nation leadership is one of them but let me also comment how people like us who get the opportunity to join institutions like ICTP could contribute in shaping the development in their countries the honorable minister has taken let's say the more government type role but people like myself have taken more a private sector type of role and created more than hundreds of jobs in the last 25 years in our home countries while being a banker being the top among the top five poetry producers in my country creating hundreds of jobs for youth and women is also a way where scientists and ICTP alumni could contribute to the development of their country and there is a tendency that I see more and more what I call global applicants it's African who went abroad studied abroad worked abroad had accumulated a little bit of cash coming back to their home country investing in their home country that's also another way of impacting development and the tendencies that I am seeing is those young global African when they come excuse me the words they are less corrupt they want to do well by doing good and they are they have they really want to do the right things in the right way and more and more if we see this tendency I still gonna change and this is basically the way I I see things and the honorable minister said something very very important that educated people like us should get into politics but it's not an easy game right people like myself kind of do politics and I wish that I would never do politics but I want to contribute to the development of my country by creating jobs you know by stimulating and investing in the private sector I hope that this will respond to your question yes so do you dream one day to give let's say to give a loan for one million francs here for one billion francs here for to the University of Dhaka to Professor Wage for example to perform research of optics these are the type of thing that I mentioned now let me tell you something when you go private sector put things millions of dollars in silicon valley because they have the return what scientists must learn doing research for the sake of doing research those days are over they must do research for tangible economic outcomes and now when you link especially in the developing world when you link how much increase of maize yield should we grow should we consider you will see that the private sector people will be more interesting in financing the research and I give you another example there is one alumni of ICTP Dr. Gibril Fahal who is an accurate bio profession because we are in the poultry commercial industrial poultry sector we asked him to do some research to tailor made an insurance product for the industrial poultry and when this kind of practical research are seeing more and more the private sector may be willing to put money in the research I don't know if you are you're pulling what I'm trying to say yes doctor but I have the feeling that you are you are you are taking away what actually the person that you are you are taking away basic science because the way you are talking about practical things is like basic science has no place so I hope you are still around we can continue maybe in the breakout rooms so okay thank you yes yeah so Nuskia something to add I just had a quick comment for Professor Aksish maybe Sandro Scandolo and Paolo so we have seen from Professor Professor Rafaaba and Dr. Babuba that soft skill for leadership or management are very important for ICTP students these are things that we don't get when good ICTP and when you go to developing country communication skill leadership or management skill are very very important I have never seen it in ICTP even when you come there and then you apply for such thing is always yeah people who do top science think that we should only do excellence in science this is not what we need what is needed is also this kind of skills so thanks these were my comments for you the decision makers including Aksish thank you thank you also this is really a very rich discussion and I really do hope we can continue it in the breakout rooms but to to wrap up this session I would like the panelists to share in 30 seconds what was your favorite memory during your time at ICTP Freddy would you like to to say something yeah sure so only 30 seconds so very quickly I'm sure we all shared that experience at some point but the experience was one day waking up and realizing that the people in my classroom were not classmates anymore I mean they were becoming actually part of my family I mean it seemed and my favorite memory I have to say is when one of our classmates Shweb he brought his I mean later in the program he was able to bring his wife and his daughter and I think we all became uncles and aunts of the of Oshiki of his daughter and and and it was amazing to to develop this this this connection and I really wish I mean I could see Shiki now I mean it would be she she was I think she was five years old at the time so she was running with us all all over the place all over the ICTP okay it's very sweet Rondra do you have your memory yeah my favorite memory would be running to catch the last bus every night to catch the bus the last bus every night like the midnight bus every night oh that's a good one yeah we've all been there oh that's hilarious Reina do you have your memory to share yeah on that I actually am one of the only ones who didn't live in the in the city so I actually lived right next to the to the to ICTP and I have to walk up the hill every night but they are really memorable you know like those nights that are cold and the full moon and and overlooking the Adriatic Sea cool that is beautiful dr. Mahboba hello I asked my good memories few of them were when I come to ICTP it was my first time to be in a plane so when the plane landed oh it was the biggest feeling of my life I do remember that secondly he like it has been highlighted before my classmates really become the pillars of strength for me and the second family in ICTP finally um we had one colleague all of them were important one colleague was from Teke and we were asking how do you say excuse me when you are in a packed bus uh and the the the colleagues who knew Italian they said to us just say Tiamo so our friend said Tiamo to one girl in the bus and the girl was few years so it was something that we never forgot thank you very much oh that's hilarious Professor Mahboba oh my um and dr. Mahboba look my my my my memory in ICTP right you know when you come from your country and you think that you are very smart and you you you get selected and you land it with very international smart people than you you get very quickly very humbled and I and I remember when I was sitting in the library and I say and sorry to to use that word am I not stupid I I always had best grade and now here I come I am almost the bottom of the of the group and I remember there was a lady from Madagascar her name was Lava and there is the guy that is from India I saw his name Gansambatta another guy William Oogaldi very very smart guy they always have top grades and you get humbled and you you burn a lot of candles in the in hours in the library and they always get ahead and it just tells you that you know when you compete you compete internationally and this you know ICTP has given me the the the the memory that the competition is not here right and by the way Gansambatta was from Nepal he's just correcting me in the chat and and and it just gave me some tremendous you know memory about how excellence is relative now I I I also miss the pasta that we used to have during the during the during the lunch that great oh this was such a lovely discussion I wish we we had more time but Ateesh you wanted to say a few words to the panelists yeah now before we break out into breakout rooms I just wanted to thank you all again it's it's been really one it's really heartwarming to see you know all these memories coming back I'm sure and it shows how people really feel connected to ICTP I think it's this is something that you cannot you know there must be something that really connects you to ICTP and we are very proud of this community it's a family as you said it's a big family so thank you very much for your inputs and your sharing and we will continue this connection I think this is not the last meeting just to make you feel more nostalgic I will tell you that it's a very beautiful day outside it's sunny Adriatic sea is nearby and I really miss I think while it is true that we can do many things online it would have been wonderful to really have you over on the terrace and we could have a nice coffee or something or a pizza in the city but next time maybe next year when we have the real reunion I hope some of you can make it thank you very much thank you so much thank you thank you to Nushka and Stefano I think they have done a great job and for their enthusiasm to really carry this this was a such a great interview and we very thanks for this we asked the panelists to and the participants to remain in in this room because we're going to create a 30 minutes breakout room for individual individually for the panelists where the participants can then continue the discussion or ask their questions directly to the to the panelists I mean obviously there were I mean there were so many so many things in in the responses of the panelists that we couldn't address so I hope we can continue that lively discussion in the separate breakout rooms so I think I