 Okay, so I'd like to call the meeting to order. And with the recording secretary, excuse me, call the roll. Yes, thank you. Chair Bailey. Yes. Vice chair minor. Here. Member Ronald. Here. Sorry if I said that wrong. Member Atkinson. Here. Member staff. Here. And member Hennett. Here. All right. Let the order of flex that all members of the committee are present. Great. Thank you. It's so nice to see everyone. I have not met all of you. I have not yet met Elias. And so I think it would be great if we could go around and go around. Here we are, you know, and zoom. I'll call out your name. How's that? And you can just say your name and who it is. Okay. I'm going to call out your name. Which city council member appointed you. That would be a great way for us to get to know each other. And there's another person on here that I don't couple of people. We don't know. So if everyone would just do that, that would be great. On my screen up on the left corner is Shelly. Shelly, you want to start. Sure. I'm Shelly Riley, the budget manager with the city of Santa Rosa. Great. And then Jan. Thank you. It's nice to meet you. I have not met you either. Thank you. Likewise to everyone. Donica. Hi, good afternoon. Danica road arm. I was appointed by council member. Last year. Great. And our vice chair. I'm event minor and I was appointed by Tom. And Monza. Hello, man. Here was appointed by Victoria Fleming. And Elias. Yeah. Hi everybody. I was appointed by Natalie Rogers. Welcome aboard. And Mark. Hello, I'm Mark staff and I was appointed by Chris Rogers. Nice to see you, Mark. And then I don't, we don't see a recording secretary, but can we hear from her for him? Yes. Hi, my name. My name is Alisa and I work in finance and I'm the recording secretary. And Alisa answers all my questions and I'm Shelly does too. And I'm really grateful for them. So thank you for the work you do. And our host, who is that hiding behind the host? Hi, my name is Tricia Mason and I work in finance as well. Great. Nice to see you. Thank you. Thank you everyone for the quick introduction and for, for being here. I really appreciate it. I have some housekeeping things I have to go over with you and I'm reading them because I do not know them by heart. The house came in handy to start with is to remind committee members to keep their audio on mute unless they are speaking. The staff will remain muted until they need to speak. And as members of the public join the meeting, you will be participating, they would be participating as an attendee and their microphone and camera will be muted. And only today's panelists will be viewed during the meeting. If you are calling in from a telephone and choose to speak during the public comments portion of the today's agenda for privacy concerns, the host will be renaming your viewable phone number to resident and the last four digits of your phone number. So now I'd like to ask the recording secretary to explain how public comments will be heard at today's meeting. Thank you, chair Bailey. So at each agenda item, the item is presented. The chair will ask for committee members comments and then open it up for public comment. The host and zoom will be lowering all hands until public comment is open for the agenda item. Once the chair has called for public comment, the chair will announce for the public to raise their hand if they wish to speak on the specific agenda item. If you're calling in to listen to the meeting audibly, you can dial star nine to raise your hand. The host will then call on each or on the public who have raised their hands. Public comment will be limited to three minutes and a timer will appear on the screen for the committee members and the public to see. Once all live public comments have been heard, the meeting host will read email submitted. If you provided a live public comment on an agenda item, but also submitted an email, your email comment will not be heard during the meeting. Additionally, there's one public comment period on today's agenda to speak on non agenda matters, which is item two. This is the time when any person may address the committee on matters not listed on the agenda. And I will turn it back over to you chair Bailey. Chair Bailey, you're muted. That happens all the time. I'm sure there's tons of skits on Saturday night live about it, right? Okay. Okay. So we are now taking public comments on item two, non agenda matters. This is the time when any person may address the committee on matters that are not on this agenda. If you wish, if you wish to make a comment via zoom, please raise your hand. If you're dialing in via telephone, please dial nine star nine to raise your hand. Do we have members of the public available? I see no hands raised at this time. And there were no email. Comments received. Okay. So shall we just move on to item three? Yes. Okay. So let's move on to item three. And item three is approval of the minutes. So I'm assuming that those of you have been to the meeting, the meeting last time have read the minutes. And so I'd like to ask for someone to make a motion. To approve of the minutes from the meeting on November 2nd, 2020. And someone like to do that. I'm motion to approve the minutes from the previous meeting. Great. Thanks again. Do we have a second? I second. Mark seconds. Great. Thank you, Mark. Now let's move on to item 4.1. 4.1 is the fiscal year. We have to take a vote. Oh, thank you. I forget that part. I did last time too. I apologize. So thank you for the reminder. Can we have a vote please? Who's all in favor of the accepting the minutes? Thank you. Is that all? Yeah. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you to everyone who was at the meeting. Thank you. Can I move on to the next one now? Yes, I think so. Okay. So. 4.1 is the fiscal year 2021. 22 measure program budget. We need to review and approve this. By motion. So. We need to see the presentation. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. I'm just going to kick off with a really quick introduction. To measure O since we have a couple new members of the committee. So measure O sales tax is originally passed back in 2004. As a quarter cent sales tax for public safety and gang prevention. The revenue and program started in April of 2005. So the funds are allocated between. The fire department police department and gang prevention and intervention. 40% goes to the fire department and police department. And 20% to gang prevention and intervention. Currently the sales tax revenues about 10 million dollars per year. Last year we did see a slight drop off of about 5% of revenue collection. Mainly due to the pandemic is about nine and a half million dollars. For our next fiscal year, 21, 22, we are again projecting about 10 million dollars of collection of sales tax revenue, which fits us back to what we collected in fiscal year, 18, 19. But as you will see later in the presentation, even at this $10 million amount, we're still looking at the next fiscal year. And we're still looking at the next fiscal year budget because the expenses just can't keep up with the current revenue. With that, I believe the fire department is first on the slide show. You can move the slides up. Probably to slide three. And I will turn it over to the fire department. Okay. Can you hear me? Yes, we can. Thank you. Okay. This is Jim. I'm Jim Aaron. Thank you very much. You're welcome. Thank you. And you will be describing the financials for you, which is on, found on slide for looking at in front of you there. This is where we're comparing the 2021 budget to the 21, 22 to kind of look at our changes. And for us, we had our salaries went up by a hundred thousand dollars and it's principally done through overtime. We've got regular overtime that's been running. has increased by $53,000. And that's in order for me to get the three months, the three year average actuals and I, and I budget up accordingly to catch us up for years are over time and measure O has been under budget. So I've been moving it up slowly to so we can actually budget to actuals. And that's, I've done that again this year's and we're at about, we need about $53,000 to do that. The other big bump on the salaries is $46,000 in strike team overtime. And that's when our guys go out on wildfires. And those are reimbursable. So it's kind of in and out, but it still has an effect on our salaries. It makes it look like our salaries are higher. Because we do have measure some of our measure O fire people are actually go out on wildfires. And that's what you're seeing there is the salary, the contract overtime based on that benefits went up by 87,000. And it's essentially in three areas, workers comp went up, health insurance went up. And our biggest bump was in the annual required contribution for the unfunded liability on CalPERS that we're all familiar with. That went up by $47,000 of the 87. The final pieces in service and supplies and that again is it only went up $13,000. About 5,000 of that is based on our fleet maintenance costs for the for the apparatus or the vehicles in measure O. And the other was an increase in our insurance policy for liability and auto insurance that measure O pays for. So that has increased as well. You see a small decrease in administration, which is our overhead. So overall, our expenditures are projected to go up by $197,000 or a 5.7% increase. And like I said, most of it is in salaries probably 188 of the 197 is in salaries and benefits. If you go to page five, that's essentially that was that was the page one was a graphic with the pretty numbers on it. This is just the words that kind of explain what I already kept told you. There's really nothing on here. These are just more bullet points related to those numbers. So if what I'll do is hand it off to Chief Westrop right now and he'll go over the funding or the employee, sorry. Jim, it looks like Vice Chair Miner has a question or her hand up. I'm not quite sure if she wants to address that now. Okay, really quick. You stated for the strike team over time, which will be reimbursed. What, what, how is that going to be reimbursed with funding? What we generally do is for strike teams, we, we get reimbursed from Cal OES. The, the, the state reimburses us for that. And traditionally what happens on strike teams is we send people out, we'll send out an engine, for example, with four people on it. And the, before that we, we do a salary survey to kind of give them the costing of that. And when the guys show up at the strike team, they fill out the time card there on the scene. Their, their time is tracked. And the state reimburses us for that based on the time that they've worked. We also get reimbursed for the people that have to cover for them while they're off shift, because when you're called out on a strike team, you're not on engine two anymore. Now somebody else has to come in and work for you. The strike team reimbursement also covers for that. So all that comes from the state. And as you can imagine, that varies based on how much activity we get for the year. This particular year that we're just closing right now, we made our best guess and we said, ah, maybe about 800,000. Well, our strike team revenues closer to two and a half million right now because we've been very busy, not through measure. Oh, I mean, overall for the fire department. So that can happen. The good news is it's, it's, we get reimbursed for it. So it really is financial statement neutral, but it shows up on the expenditures here. So does that answer your question? Does anybody else have any other question? Okay. So Chief Westrop, do you want to talk about personnel? Sure. Thanks, Jim. Good afternoon, Chair Bailey and members of the committee, Scott Westrop Fire Chief for the city of Santa Rosa. Real quick, want to go through and talk about what Mejro does for the fire department and what a benefit it is to our organization. So currently Mejro funds 10 firefighter positions and also provides paramedic service on 10 pieces of equipment. We're on on some of the equipment throughout the city. So currently the the 10.0 FTEs that Mejro funds is three paramedic captains, three paramedic engineers, three paramedic firefighters and then it funds our training captain our training facility. In addition to these FTEs, it also provides 25% of the funding necessary for emergency medical services battalion chief who oversees all aspects of our paramedic and EMT program, which is about 65 to 70% of what we do on a daily basis. Next slide, please. So in talking about infrastructure, Mejro has historically funded the construction of our fire stations. So as we've talked about in previous years Mejro built station five, station 10 and station 11. So station five in Fountain Grove, which was lost during the Tubbs Fire, station 10, which is the building that we're in in the southwest and station 11, which is near the junior college. There's also allocations in Mejro for the relocation of fire station eight, which is in Roseland. It needs to be moved strategically down to the area of Herne and Victoria and future construction of fire station nine, which would be in the southeast, sort of behind Costco there at the base of Mount Taylor. And then funding for the replacement of the portable buildings at station 11 with the permanent structure. So the junior college station on Lewis Road is currently in portable buildings with a permanent garage facility for the equipment. But eventually we want to move the station to a brick and mortar type station in the front of the property that we own there. Next slide, please. And as far as equipment goes, sort of the third tenant of the fire department's use of Mejro funds, a specialized equipment for emergency response. And today Mejro has been able to purchase two type one fire engines, which is the large fire engine you see traveling up and down the street on a daily basis is our frontline equipment. A type three wildland fire engine, which is the specialized, sort of shorter but taller wildland firefighting engine that we have out of our Calistoga road fire station for command vehicles and a swift water rescue trailer. Next slide, please. And with that, that's the end of our presentation. We'll turn it over to the committee for any questions that you may have. Committee members have any questions or comments? Yes, I do. This is that I had a question in relation to the relocation of the fire stations. Where are you in that process? I know at the last meeting we discussed that as well. So I just wanted to get an update if there's one one of them was looking for land, another one you was trying to. So where are we in that process and how far out can we expect to see those facilities come to fruition? Yep, great question. And thanks for that. And I do remember we talked about that. So so with station five, I'm sure you've all have seen in the paper the replacement station that we're looking for for the station that burned down here in the Tubbs fire. We're in the we're in escrow and we're in the sequel NEPA process with purchasing the property at the corner of stagecoach road and Fountain Grove Parkway. There's obviously some funding issues with that because that fire station is coming at a very high cost largely that's due to the land movement that has to occur to build a fire station on that property. So it's moving along well and actually it's going to be released pretty soon but that there there is a funding opportunity that the city has been granted for fire station five. So we should see full funding of that of that project here in the upcoming weeks. I can't get into the details just yet. So I don't get ahead of the our elected officials and the media cycle but so there's some good news for station five which is the the Fountain Grove station. The other stations are a bit in flux. You know, one of the issues that we've discussed is that the cost of building a fire station is outrun. How much we allocated particularly out of Measure O. So a fire station right now is a thousand dollars a square foot all day long. It's just the it's just the state of building a commercial building particularly in northern California particularly in an area that's gone through a disaster. We've talked to partners up and down the state with different organizations and they're running into the same problem. It's it's a thousand dollars a square foot. So it's you know the cost of building is outrun the revenue that's generated by Measure O but we're very cautious with that and move things around to where if we do have the opportunity to build a new fire station we would use that as seed money to move forward with with that construction. So you know station eight is certainly high on our list of of stations to move. It's strategically advantage advantageous for us to move it a little bit further south that would still serve the community of Roseland just from a little bit more southern border due to the fact that station 10 where we're at on Corporate Center Parkway is is less than a mile away as a crow flies from station eight. So it's sort of a double covered station and this is strategically it's just been getting the wheels in motion for a long time to get us where we need to need to be. And then station 11 you know we have the property we're on the property it's just a matter of of moving forward with funding and building it the problem I have with that is there's no real strategic advantage to build in that station. So when we only have so much capital it's where do we put it to make the most advantageous moves for for our service to the community. So it's certainly on our list of things to do and where it would be easy as there's no sequel process necessary in that we already on the land lands already flat it's already compacted so there would be some cost savings there and then station nine in the southeast that's probably my highest priority station to build the problem is the other stations that we're talking about we would move the current staff and equipment to the new fire station so there would be no personnel costs associated with that to build station nine which we own the property we've owned it quite frankly I think as long as I've been here which is 21 years we've owned the property and they're actually landing construction materials on it right now for a project going on down there but the problem with station nine is that it comes with it would require additional FTE so we would need nine additional positions to actually staff that station and just for generally generally speaking a sort of a thumbnail view of staffing a fire station it's about a million and a half a year in in fully vested costs to run a fire station so with the current financial picture of the city I'm not really sure how how prudent that is right now so we're sort of looking at moving the stations that we currently have staffing for as a priority and if we get into you know we're currently looking at putting a new fire sales tax measure countywide fire service sales tax measure on the ballot which would would help us out a lot that would build nine and 12 and come with staffing so so we're just trying to prioritize based on the picture that we have right now and and do its best strategically for service to the community okay just one more question miss in relation to the increase in housing and the population I know the last time when we had our discussion we talked about the reasons for moving some of the stations was because of the population increase and so with all these stations that could possibly come forward all that has been taken into consideration you know for the next you know 10 15 years with the increase in housing it has so we have a deployment analysis and strategic plan and in those the consultants that we use to build those plans put in those those variables so they put in the increase in population they put in what they project the population is going to be up to 25 30 years out I would sit you know my issue with those plans and it's not really an issue but they were both written in 2016 and unfortunately the the landscape that we live in and the world we live in has changed significantly since 2017 so I really want to dust those off we're going to be diving into a new strategic plan before the this year closes out and so we can look forward into you know a little bit better as to what we're looking at and obviously the significant investment and uptick in and development the city is putting forward is changing that landscape as well so so it's factored in their event but I think we just need to take a better look at it and we need to adjust it to today's numbers and today's problems this community faces so I definitely I definitely see that there's some changes and we need to we we need to look at those numbers again it's just a matter of having the the capacity to do that and so we'll be using a consultant to get all that information but it's a great point and you know as we see Dutton Flats and Dutton Flats get built there on Dutton and Third it's it's like wow you know that that's a very visual increase in both height and size of what the city's looking at so we need to be able to react to that as well. Hey I just wanted to hey Scott I just wanted to follow up with you about Yvette's question in terms of priority of the stations still station five eight and nine I may maybe you said I didn't catch it in terms of the priority because it seems like they all have their own uh list of checklist of things to get done but which which is the priority which of the both majority that of the money is going towards which uh station. Sure that's a great question and so we can take station five off the list because that's going to be that's going to be built outside of Mejaro that's going to be built with outside funding coming into the city so station five is really off the list so really what we have in front of you for for Mejaro is station eight station nine and station eleven for me the priority and in our teams working on this we're kind of coming up with a cost well it's not kind of it's a cost benefit analysis of each station you know based on a number of different factors and we'll have sort of an all the cart menu for council to choose from at some point but for me the priority would be station eight because there's the most strategic advantage in response times to move that engine further south to her and victoria area generally speaking because we're kind of double double covered in the central core of roseland so it would provide better service to the south end of roseland and also into the west end of south park so it would get over the her and over cross a lot quicker so to me that's where we have the most strategic advantage station nine as much as it is what i want to build and and we need to build it just comes at that that ongoing annual cost which is the problem with that one so if you know if i was like you know had the keys to the keys to the vault and we had all the money in the world which you know would be a great situation for all of us to be in that would be a priority because it provides that strategic advantage and additional staffing but we're just not there so the station 11 is probably the lowest priority because we have a fire station there it would just be increasing um that fire station from a portable uh triple wide portable building to an actual permanent structure so for me and this is just me me talking is my priorities on this list would be eight then 11 and then nine if we could get the the ongoing funding for the staffing and there's a bunch of others we gotta build too so thank you thank you for your service as well thank you to the community thank you any more questions from for the fire department at this time okay do we go next to the police department is that right yes give us just a moment to promote people sure i got cut off there you guys uh we all on okay great so uh uh chair bailey and uh committee members uh good afternoon thank you for having us here reyner navarro chief of police and i'm here with uh pam laurence our administrative services officer she's gonna start off here we're gonna provide you the information on the police department's portion of the measure old budget um she'll have a quick slide and then um and then i will she'll bounce it back over to me um and i'll follow up with an overview of some of the significant changes um in the in the impact toward department and um how mezzaro has enhanced our community safety and some of the future challenges that uh that we're going to be facing so with that i will turn it over to pam right good afternoon everybody thank you for being here pam laurence aso for police um this slide shows you all the numbers just like the fire department's does um as you can see with the reduced revenue as shelly mentioned and our increase in staff costs we froze two police officer positions this year we will be eliminating three police officer positions in fiscal year 21-22 in order to reduce our staff costs by 536,000 you can see a small increase in our services and supplies budget of 52,000 that covers our downtown substation lease our insurance and our vehicle maintenance and replacement fund we had a small decrease in administration or overhead cost of 3,000 and our total proposed budget for fiscal year 21-22 is four million two thousand seven hundred and fifteen dollars i will hand it over to chief navarro to continue with the slides thank you pam so um as uh as pam mentioned uh we've seen a uh reduction in the measure measure revenue uh and that's had a significant impact on our services when miserable was voted in uh the revenue was used to enhance police services through adding staff uh it's a little bit it's different than uh what fire is done with a lot of equipment most of ours is goes straight straight to putting staff on the streets or in the necessary positions to respond to call for service and these services their direct services to the public and as pam mentioned in january we froze a couple of officers froze two officers and this year we're going to have to cut those plus another one and those positions are going to be coming out of the school resource officer program that we had up until last year there are there were five officers in that based on our ongoing staffing issues throughout the department with both measure o and the general fund the the the remaining two sros have been brought back to patrol and so we will be cutting the three sros positions as of this fiscal year in measure o pam also mentioned that there was an increase in services and supplies that includes uh two motorcycles and three patrol vehicles that are in our measure o funds and one of the things to think about here is that we have a separate vehicle replacement cost program within measure o that is outside of the general fund and so those costs have been rising uh year to year the next slide please so as you can see we have again 16 staff members throughout the department who are funded by measure o the lieutenant that you see here oversees our incident management team he over also oversees our traffic bureau and is the liaison for our homeless services and really meets with non-profit programs or our organizations several times a week the sergeant is currently overseeing our downtown enforcement team and he's also heavily involved in working with our partners to address homeless issues we have officers from measure o assigned to our downtown enforcement team our traffic bureau as motor officers and then also within our patrol bureau on different patrol teams that work throughout the throughout the clock we also have we also have FET FETs field evidence technicians and community service officers they are uniform staff members who are civilians who are they're they're assigned to patrol teams and they go and they answer the cold calls for service non-emergency calls such as traffic accidents old burglary reports that sort of thing and so that alleviates some of the staffing issues for us it helps our patrol officers get freed up to handle more emergency type calls for service and then we also have a communication supervisor who provides necessary management to a very busy dispatch center they that that supervisor handles quality control by auditing phone calls that come in to make sure that we're providing quality service to our community they also take calls they're on the floor with the other dispatchers due to our staffing shortages and they handle emergency or handle calls and then also emergencies such as when we have issues like the fires and and any other natural disasters and then they also handle all the equipment upgrades so we have upgrades related to our CAD system they are handling those project those projects and managing those throughout the year next next slide please so our measure O funds again provide enhanced patrol services where you really see this is in our areas of traffic enforcement and in our downtown enforcement team so they augment our traffic unit to provide traffic traffic enforcement which in turn helps reduce the amount of traffic accidents that we have and and hopefully traffic fatalities we also have again with the downtown enforcement team it allows us to enhance or increase our patrols in the downtown area the railroad square area Prince Memorial Greenway and along the smart railway in addition to that our measure O officers they played a very vital role in the areas of patrol and responding to emergencies for example our school resource officers they became our incident management team to deal with the the recent the glass fire that we had and then also throughout the year dealing with the COVID pandemic they put several protocols into place and they managed cleaning equipment and making sure that we had all of our protocols in place here at the department to to to assure that we were safe and maintain as many things in place to ensure that we were providing safety to to our community and that included providing masks for community members when we go to call for service and it's just been without without those without those positions it would have been very difficult to be able to handle these ongoing emergencies throughout this last year next slide please as far as challenges go again measure O's are critical part of our police department budget you know its staffs are downtown enforcement team traffic and patrol positions we have to have these funds which are necessary for that dispatch supervisor and and also for that the management within traffic and then also the special events which handles our incident management team and then also the liaison for all the special events that we plan on seeing or foresee coming back when once we start opening up again as a community we are running out of measure O funds and we're not able to maintain the staffing levels and that's what you're seeing here with the proposed budget for this for fiscal year 21-22 and what you know moving forward we're looking at we're trying to strategically plan to see what we what we need to do over the next few years as we see measure O sun setting in 2025 and there you know we are going to need to plan on cutting another most likely cutting another position next year and then really trying to figure out what we're going to do in 2025 if measure O is not renewed with that that ends our portion of the presentation both Pam and I are available for any questions you might have yes I have a question so I know in previous meetings we talked about the radial upgrade and so I wanted to find out an update on that and what other equipment there was a few other things that was coming out of measure O fund and then the other thing was with the recent mental health issues and things that's going on in the community you know I I know you guys are working on the cohoots model and so I wanted to find out if any of the measure O funds will be utilized in that cohoots model and how are you funding that thank you vice chair I may have you repeat some of those as we go along here so I think the first thing was about equipment so we had so the radio infrastructure we went through several phases of building the radio infrastructure up we have completed that project from we've got our we've got the lease on the radio system we've we've dealt with updating our our radio towers and so the the only thing left right now is we are trying to identify some funding streams for a service user agreement but that's not something that measure O we're not looking at measure O to do we don't have enough funds for that the there were a couple of other equipment things that we were looking at I think the last time we met or maybe the time before we had talked about rescue vehicle that has been put on hold we don't currently have the funds to address that particular need right now there are we there are limited there is limited access to the current one that we have we we have one through the Homeland Security Grant but it's actually owned by the Sheriff's Department and lend out but so we have limited access but we don't have funds for that one right now and was there any other equipment questions that you had no I just wanted to find out I know he was working on the radio so you answered that question and what other updates you were doing because there was talks about the building and stuff like that and then in relation to the radio I know we talked about if it was solar if the power went down and stuff like that and so is that something that was considered in this process? Pam I saw you on click you want to I can sure and so we did look at solar and it's it's extremely expensive and we weren't sure at the time when we were looking at solar as a backup whether we'd be staying in this building very long and if this building could handle that we did look at grant funding for it but have not received that we did receive a Cal OES grant to fund a generator to back up this building to back up the entire building so that we just received a couple weeks ago so we'll be going forward with that then my other question was about the cahoots yes so cahoots so we are looking at cahoots right now or a cahoots style model of mental health reform or responding to these calls for service it will not be funded out of measure O again most of our funding for measure O goes directly to staffing and those staffings those positions are currently filled so in order to in order to fund a program in the future we would have to reduce staffing to address that we're currently below staffing you know our last staffing model our last staffing study was in 2018 and the the recommendation was to have 188 officers we are currently at 100 we will be at 175 allocated officers or sworn staff once we hit 21-22 fiscal year so we don't have the funding to move anybody out and it would require moving positions out of measure O into a general fund into the general fund in order to be able to fund some type of program like that Mr. Staff I see your hand up am I acknowledged by the chair am I able to or Danica did you want to go first all right I'll jump in Chief Navarro and Pam thanks as always for taking the time um I had a question on the implementation plan and I was looking ahead as you I mean I was looking ahead to fiscal year 24-25 and I noticed a big jump up in services applied and so I was I was curious to know what that what the thinking was for that year so the way the implementation plan works is at the end of 24-25 in April when it is its sunsets we have to use up any remaining money so that money we have set aside and not because we'll have to have moved staff out by that time and to hopefully purchase either something needed for the building or possibly the the rescue vehicle or something like that and something larger that would would help us with the community possibly you know it's hard to say in three years exactly what we're going to use it for but that that's why that jump up understood thank you and I guess one final tangential question um when do we get to see the low rider how do you get rise in that I uh you know what she we talked about she goes hey are you gonna bring up the low rider um so uh thank you for thank you for reminding me so we are uh we're currently working it's really a project that uh our officer community engagement is working on we did set aside a vehicle so we had a vehicle that was being cycled out of our fleet and uh we we basically uh took that uh donated it to uh the this project and so they are currently working on it I don't know what the timeline is right now but uh they are um I know that there's been work on the budget but the car has been taken out of our fleet and um you know part of it is um you know I think getting it you know stripping some of the things that need to be taken out and then getting it prepped and ready to go for um for for the uh the remodel on that cool thank you yeah we hope to see it I would love to see it by the you know this year sometime but uh yeah and I think everybody else is hoping to see that too um in fact it just one more thing they're actually going to be calling it the Mary Lou uh uh dedicating it to uh Detective Mary Lou Armour who passed away from COVID last year so thank you my question was actually about cahoots more and I I don't want to take us too far down that road since I understand it's not funded out of the metro funds but I am my question is how is it being funded and where are those conversations happening where I can engage more on that because I am really interested in getting more involved in that particular effort sure that's a great question we've been working very closely with the the finance team for the city and uh we are you know looking at a pilot program for this first year and we're working on uh you know clarifying some of the measurables for the next uh the next two years as we go forward uh you will be hearing more about that as we uh prepare as actually when we provide the uh the uh information during the budget hearings I believe that's going to be in a couple weeks may 18th and 19th and uh you probably hear uh you may hear more about it then um but uh we're working on uh we're currently working with the finance team on that um and uh the uh Captain John Creedian is heading our effort in that particular area uh we are having a lot of discussions uh outside also with our non-profit stakeholders and uh looking at how to best uh you know create that pilot program and it's going to be uh it won't be a 24-7 model immediately we're hoping we can get uh spool it up into a 24-7 model uh in the next few years okay can I ask you a question sure I think it might be good if you could give us some dates of when um Captain Creedian is doing his presentation he gives a great presentation about everything they're doing and that would be a great place for anyone on this committee to to um connect up so junior where we could get dates about where he's speaking and we might be open to the public uh that's a great question chair Bailey I I don't have the dates off the top of my head I do know that he's going to be in fact he may have given one today for operational team for the violence prevention partnership um he's uh you know I you know I I think you know one of the I'm on the uh I'm on the committee for the health action uh uh for the county and you know one of the things I was I'm I'm going to reach out to see if we can provide a presentation there and so uh we're you know I can get the dates for you and we can get that information over over to you and then you can disseminate it to the committee members if you'd like that would be great thank you sure are there more questions I I have one question for chief Navarro yes sir uh how you doing first like to thank you for uh the your service and to the community especially especially during times the fires so grateful to be able to uh you know evacuate my family because you know the forces out there helping us to navigate putting their lives on the line for us I really appreciate that um with the examples and the recorded videos that a lot of us became familiar with over the past year through the decades of the use of excessive force in law enforcement has any of the measure 8 funding since the last time we talked been used to at least look into provide training on uh officers to put themselves in a better position during these circumstances thank you uh that that's a great great question sir first of all um flag your family safe and sound after the fires um you know we don't uh our our measure is mainly um used for salaries and so you know when when we do send officers training or they're you know that's they're funded through their own um you know when when we're when we're providing their training uh that way uh we don't use measure uh uh dollars specifically for uh a specific training or program but we have done a lot and so I encourage you to uh to listen in next week we're providing a full report on on what we've done over the last year at the city council meeting uh we will provide our report back on May 5th so the next the the second day and we've done a lot of but we've done a lot of training in um in how to respond to demonstrations uh how to manage demonstrations we've uh you know we've worked with an outside consultant to look at the the the the demonstrations from last year uh use of force and uh and also complaints and so we've done a lot of work that in that area and that is helping us uh provide uh you know again additional training uh moving forward in changing policies and procedures so uh we've done a lot of work there uh but none of the funds from measure row um I'm not sure if I'm if if there's uh if I'm missing anything but there's nothing specific uh related to that we are looking for grants and we have been awarded some grants that we're working on uh in the area of cultural awareness uh in implicit bias and um in working on a uh we're creating a curriculum with a non-profit organization right now so we can implement that and teach not only our staff but also uh to to be the the trainers on a regional level uh throughout california thank you any more questions or comments re uh for chief navarro sorry thank you for the oh yeah I had a question okay who is that oh there you go it's alias go for it yeah uh thank you all for that great presentation yeah I wanted to say um I feel a little uh uncomfortable with the answer chief I think uh looking at you know just looking I know I wanted my first question I wanted to ask is does that current budget reflect the the I see the 1.6 million bump in funding from the general fund that you all received from the city the most recent one uh adopted I wanted to ask is that reflected in the presentation uh this presentation has to do with measure row so um that's that's what yeah specifically measure row funds okay great yeah that's what I was assuming because yeah I heard the answer about the much of the measure o funding um that Pam had brought up in regards to much of that being used for salaries but I do know you know with the police budget making a third of the general fund you know of the city you know maybe just throwing ideas out there maybe transitioning some of the measure o funding to and you know maybe add some of these uh implicit trainings to the officers I think uh you know that that may be an idea just and I just throw that out there because I do understand much of the money is already you know line items for salaries but I think just to be comfortable you know we'd be funding you know funding employees but just making sure that we're not employing you know you know I mean funding employees that maybe not you know standing up to the conduct in which you know we've seen in the past I know there's a human rights violation report that you know we're still waiting on a response for that so so I just want to you know verbalize my my feelings but hopefully with this most recent report that that like that we're speaking to what we'll hear some things but but um but that was just my specific question yeah I look forward to to that and then my last question I wanted to ask is um well no actually actually you answered it with that that answer from the other brothers so but yeah so yeah thank you so we've you know we've had discussions in the past regarding you know how we utilize the the funding in measure O so in order to be able to create programs and whether it's training programs or a civilian type program it's you know measure O funds can be you know we it can be changed based on you know what the committee or in council would like to do with it in order to do that though with the funding that we have in staffing it would have to be we can't supplant positions so we would have to move the positions out of measure O to create the ability to fund any type of training or programs with that we are you know it's not that we're not doing implicit bias training or we're not doing cultural awareness training we have we have we have regularly we provide implicit bias training to all of our staff and we we do it once when the staff member is hired and then we also have implicit bias training at the very least every two years and we are working on trying to create more exposure in those areas of implicit bias and cultural awareness training through additional grants so we do we also provide crisis intervention training and we we provide you know so there's training that is ongoing through the general fund training that we have thank you for that I think that those are good ideas I just hope that you know with grants being so scarce hopefully maybe you know maybe that is a discussion with the measure O funding some of it could be allocated specifically for programming because I wouldn't want you know a training not to happen because we couldn't find a grant you know but but yeah I appreciate your answer and we got time that's the good thing thank you okay any more questions for the chief okay let's go on to said recreation parks yes give us just a moment here to promote people thank you in the meantime I think it would be good to remember that there is going to be a report out did I get that right chief that it's on May 5th it'll be a report out at city council about what the work you've been doing that's correct May 4th and 5th there is a report out so I can tell you that the first day will be I believe the human rights commission is providing a report there'll be an after-action report and then a report on the use of force and administrative some of the administrative investigations from last year and then on the 5th community empowerment plan and then the police department will provide updates in how we've responded to each of those reports thank you and you can find specific information about that on the city website about how to connect into those meetings that's correct yes okay so anyone who is interested in that I really encourage you to try to to see those thank you let's move on to recreation use services good evening chair Bailey and members of the oversight committee my name is Jason Parrish the administrative services officer for the recreation and community engagement divisions and we want to start out with a couple pictures of what we would normally be doing where we not in a pandemic unfortunately the guidelines to maintain safety among the kids and among our staff has has forced radical changes in what we're doing and so this is what we're hoping to give back to let me start out with that and so if you could please advance the slide so what you're seeing are not going to be a lot of changes it looks like there are some minor reductions taking place in salaries and benefits and that's simply because we've had some of our more longer serving staff we had a retirement as well someone received a promotion and so this just reflects that the new staff are just coming in and getting their feet under them so those are the only major changes that are taking place overall in the program budget if you could please advance the slide so no major budget changes have been implemented and again as I said the measure OU services section will be refocused on transitioning back from the socially distanced school of recreation program model back to our traditional neighborhood based operations as restrictions allow so what that looks like is when the pandemic first initiated the measure OU after school programs where we're located in either eight or 10 Burbank housing sites identified through the community scorecard as being the most impacted neighborhoods where our services could do the most good so those went to a virtual tutoring model and then as the definition came around the pandemic for how we can continue to provide youth services which require congregate services we started up with a better together summer camps that addressed over 120 kids we had 10 cohorts eight of those were located in the Burbank housing sites and so in a single group we could only work with a dozen kids at a time with two staff members so we were trying to make sure that we had as many services as we could possibly because we know that the kids that are engaged in our after school programs or in our summer programs sometimes have the most life challenges and sometimes might be on the wrong side of the digital divide and so every day the kids would come in we would take their temperature the staff would make sure the entire location is sanitized multiple times a day and we also ended up licensing with the state of California as a daycare center because a lot of the kids would be in there and during the normal period of the school day so we were also able to worry work with the kids during that entire time and connect them up with the redwood empire food bank so that every one of the kids as they were in the programs had lunches provided to them as part of the program every day while they were there to make so that that we can make sure that nutritionally they were providing being provided for so in September that transition to what we call our school of recreation program which is from the Better Together summer camps and with that we were providing direct support for all of the kids so that they can continue re-engaging in school and continue their education and would have the program employees they're able to assist them through any of their studies and provide tutoring the employees themselves were being trained by the school districts to deal with some of the issues that the kids might be experiencing and to help enhance our own services that we are providing for the children so and I apologize there seems we have some missing information here overall the neighborhood services measure program has four regular employees a supervisor two coordinators and a recreation specialist and what they do is work with over 21,000 hours of seasonal temporary employees about a third to a half of which are former program participants who are coming back and working with the kids now and so they're the ones who keep the various field sites going and ensure that the kids themselves are constantly engaged in different activities and that and now I believe Geraldine Holm with the violence prevention partnership or let me ask if there are any questions on the recreation use services programs yes I do have a question in relation to the pivot that you did in relation to COVID this sound like it can be more of a viable program moving forward so is this something that you may consider continuing doing as far as like providing the child care services because in those areas those services are still needed so it took a pandemic to bring that forward so will it stay or what is that going to look like moving forward at this point our plan is actually to not move forward with the daycare model and the reason for that is the resource intensity required to provide those daycare services and again this is under licensing from the state of California as a daycare it it doesn't allow us to reach out to the number of children that we would normally be serving and especially in COVID while we're hoping that some of the restrictions may lift as we move down the color tier it still requires a lot of resources for ensuring that the facilities are clean and what I can say is thankfully through this entire experience that we've gone through so far we haven't had a single infection COVID positive infection that was the result of one of the cohort sites so we had a number of employees as well as participants who would receive a positive test as contact from their personal life but those were able to be held back and so in that case we would have to shut down the programs for a couple weeks and again we are very conscious of the issues with daycare in our community and especially what we've experienced with the with the kids in our programs but to be able to ensure that we're reaching out to the broadest group of children that we can as well as families it's something that we're not planning on continuing and if we had a certain date on when that would happen it would be a lot easier to do this program okay and then one more so you know in this natural state you know you're reaching out to hundreds of kids so moving forward for this summer what is that going to look like is it still going to be you know the lower numbers with the students or do you plan to go up a notch because we're moving to you know the next year what we are working towards is can is again moving towards a summer camp program model and whereas before because some of the restrictions have lowered overall for interaction and recreation and this is a statewide impact to the recreation industry itself whatever municipality is we're going to maintain the small groups of students but we're also planning on having more of them across the board and because we don't have to put the resources required into maintaining sanitation and the increasing or I should say the lowering incidents of our positive COVID tests within our community we're using that as a way of broadening out services again to a greater number of children and we're we're having to make an assumption that the stand that the we will move into the yellow tier and having to contingency plan at the same time of if there are further complications with that so yes we will be broadening out small groups but a greater number of groups across the board thank you vice-chair minor any other questions hi Jason how you doing today very well mr. Atkinson thank you it's thank you it's incredible what you're doing with uh for the kids and with the kids uh we've the community we appreciate it the last meeting I just I asked if there was any any science that you had incorporated science programs it's great building teamwork through sports yeah I I was a professional elementary basketball volleyball coach myself I love it it's great for the kids but what about the science has there been any science the reason I asked is we may not think about it but sometimes in a in a community disadvantaged community you may have health care that access to health care that's a problem because of language barriers so in in lots of times when uh the the research by the pew pew center I think that's what they call has has has shown that uh if these uh kids from the community are trained in the sciences in the scientists uh and they go on to become physicians they're two or three times likely to come back to the communities to serve so uh you know when it comes to the health just incorporating science programs is is can translate to a better overall health for the community so have you incorporated any science so for our COVID based services with the school of recreation um that has been based upon the uh the children's daytime curricula as far as what they're learning which I'm I believe does incorporate science uh education in it and what we have been planning on for when we can return to a more normal service is um as you as you might imagine um most of our recreation employees themselves are not uh science educators and so what we've been working on is being able and we and we have done this in the past with uh specific other programs outside of measure o but is to bring in science educators um I know the Lawrence Livermore lab has a really excellent uh program out of out of Berkeley and um we're exploring how we could bring those contractors in to be able to uh provide one or two day workshops on different science topics so that's part of our longer work our longer term return to normal planning thank you Jason thank you there any more comments or questions for Jason okay let's move on oh yeah one so I was right about the click so yes uh thank you so much Jason for your amazing work appreciate it and yeah I appreciate uh better than mine to bringing that up uh I remember I had learned you know that little race car with the tube activity where you learn about momentum so yeah things like that are definitely great exposure I was gonna ask is there any way to figure out the demographics of the of the youth that you are serving on your website or anything like that I am not aware specifically of a a report on the demographics uh on the um uh that our youth programs are serving right now but that's something that I can uh talk with our program staff and see about getting back one thing I do know is that it's a constantly changing uh dynamic in some cases uh it requires the families themselves engaging with us as with a number of different after school programs and so um I will ask about that and see if we just have the general information our we are guided by uh the overall community scorecard that identified the neighborhoods that we have the greatest need for the type of after school services and so I'll get back to you awesome great thank you yeah and I know I said demographic such a large thing but I was specifically talking about race but yeah awesome thank you for that I appreciate that okay thank you okay shall we move on to the uh violence prevention partnership hello my name is Gerilyn Holm and I am the administrative analyst for the violence prevention partnership and community engagement I thought I would address um a few questions that came up prior to my presentation time um so uh the first thing is regarding the low rider patrol car that is part of the community engagement division um Magalia and Gustavo are working tirelessly to finalize agreements they will be ordering parts soon for this vehicle also as many of you may know this is a partnership with the Sonoma County Low Rider Association where they will be providing um the hydraulics and paint um as an in-kind sort of service so I wanted to address that real quick and then um I will be supplying Alisa with um a link to one of the CAB meetings where um Captain John Cregan presented on CAHOO so that might be easy for all of you just to kind of go in there and you know be ahead to that presentation and if we could go to slide 21 please so as you can see there is a slight change in salaries this is due to merit increases and the we received a grant from the Sonoma County Probation Department which funds a limited term community outreach specialist position and for benefits the increase is largely due to insurance costs services and supplies we see a reduction and this is due to COVID restrictions and the transition to Zoom meetings uh you will see a reduction in the Choice Grant program and the decrease reflects a reduction in the projected revenue uh but this amount still is still 35 percent of the revenue as required by the ordinance and then the very small reduction in administration is our overhead and if we could go to slide 22 please and as you can see there's no major changes and um we still have all our choice grants um fully funded and um you will not see the community scorecard um funding in this coming fiscal year uh this is something that we we do about every five years and so um we're in progress of um beginning the early stages of the community safety scorecard for 2022 and we won't see this cost again and if anyone has any questions yes um for the scorecard so you're saying we won't see a lie item for that until 2022 is when we'll see that oh the line so basically the funds for that came out of this current fiscal year which is 2020-21 so we won't see it again in 2022 or the future for as well the remaining term of this sales tax and um do you have a I know we talked about it our last meeting so is there any projections on when we're going to see the actual product no we're still working with upstream investments on the timeline um we hope within the next month or so that we have um a more comprehensive timeline that we can share with the committee okay thank you are there any more questions let's go ahead hi one yeah uh nice to meet you darlin thank you for your hard work I wanted to say uh I got a chance to attend your y'all's great uh uh presentation with dr washington I seen the measure o there so I see you know I've been the fund I wanted to ask uh well I see your your your budget is with those talks to that like result and any like thoughts around allocation of funds or anything of that sort um so our community engagement and violence prevention are heavily involved in equity and inclusion and so our funding for future talks and events um is definitely going to go towards those types of training to keep the conversation open and continue and to educate our community based organizations and um our agency which includes lease fire on um on the current training and real quick um the goal for the um for the community safety scorecard is to hopefully have it out by uh we're hoping by the end of this year but it may go into um 2022 any more questions okay so we need to go on to a voting process here do we have a motion to approve the budget for fiscal year 2021-22 someone like to make a motion for that I make a motion to pass the budget right in a second is there someone to second second you got a one of us I don't know which one can I do both if that and I can split okay thank you both for doing that before we move on yeah I had a question okay so yeah so I know seeing this is not my first meeting so I hope the others are so they they show us do we talk about it or we we just go ahead and approve it right right now yeah so all the questions that were asked earlier were the input and now we vote on it was there something you just said that wasn't answered for you uh well yeah I was I thought we so we don't discuss this amongst ourselves at all we're just go ahead yeah because I mean I yeah I did I had some reservations about the police budget I think the but you know I don't know if they're still here but I just I didn't feel comfortable with the answer in regards to much of the money is specifically for salary and none of it can be used for training because of an allocation issue but I didn't I didn't feel comfortable you know being able to approve a budget to to pay for someone's salary but they may not be adequately trained you know so I just thought that that was that was something that I had reservations about and I I didn't feel comfortable with that answer did anybody else feel any type of way about that but you certainly bring up a good a great point um I that's all I can say about it at at the at the moment though what I can tell excuse me what I can tell you is that we have a really specific job on this committee and that is I can read it to you I have to remind people every time because it is we get to hear everything they're doing but we don't get to evaluate what they're doing what other than to say that the revenues that they've received are being spent on the things that they're entitled to spend the money on and then it's really up to the city council and and and to to make determinations about that but if I see the chief Navarro's back do you want to add anything about that chief uh cheer really if you can uh I missed the question I apologize okay well I know that Elias had some had some questions about how the money's being spent and would you like to repeat your question Elias yeah yeah um I wanted to I think it's it is for a chief specifically but I mean in regards to us on a committee I I think we would have to you know brainstorm because chief what I was saying is pretty much reiterating the same question was just the allocation of funds specifically with salary you know obviously I was just hearing her say we have no control over what you would use the money on uh but what I was voicing was I didn't feel comfortable with with your answer in regards to the money is obviously specifically allocated for salaries but the thing about the training is being uh much of it's funded through grants that you know you're applying for and happen every two years or even between that but is there any way that some of that training could be used for like increasing community engagement or more implicit bias training or is it just like you know yeah so our uh the grants that we're seeking and the ones that we've sought those are in addition to training that we're already doing so we don't do um you know the implicit bias training is already incorporated in our in our training plan for all of our staff both sworn and civilian we continue to add on training uh you know we have uh you know there there there's more and more mandated training every single year so uh but we are um you know I'm committed to providing more training to our staff regarding cultural awareness and implicit bias we've had those discussions over the last year with our with with several community groups and the grant is one of those ways one that we just received and we're working on with its community matters we're working on that uh to enhance the training that we have and actually bring in more training so we are constantly seeking on how we can better train our our staff members in uh what you know what I really call soft skills right it's how do you talk to people how do you treat people with respect um how do you how do you treat them with fairness and transparency and and giving people a voice I mean we we that's what we train our staff on and yeah the the the the funding for measure o again you know it was a different uh it was a different approach uh when it was implemented because we you know we needed to have more staffing and at this point you know we don't have enough we don't have as much staffing as we um should have uh related to our our last staffing study so it's really a matter of uh you know if if that's how we use measure o in the future um then that's we can definitely look at that but it does come down to how do we how do we address this especially with 2024-25 coming uh down we've got uh significant issues with uh losing a lot of a lot of staff members from our from our department no thank you thank you for that uh oh yeah thank you go ahead I would like to also add that you know our our um requirements if you go back and look at our ordinance it is very detailed and what we're supposed to be doing we're considered oversight committee so we don't really have that say so into the budget if you want to um delve into that that's a different format and so you're more than welcome to you know go to that format but for us we're here to look at the budget make sure that the monies are being spent according to the ordinance so if there's any questions that you have go back to the ordinance and and see what you have um that we're capable of doing and then if you're not comfortable with it then you don't have to vote you can vote you can abstain you can say no so those are the duties that we have before us so if you have any additional concerns just go back to the ordinance and take a look at that now thank you yeah and now thank you for that because yeah I'm look you know I know you know I've looked over the ordinance and I think that that response in regards to you know I think with the the reduction in in uh in uh in employees you know I know that you know just as you voice you will be transferring more calls that are you know nonviolent or mental health crises you will be transitioning that over to the the mobile crisis unit so you know which oftentimes you know obviously I know right now it is to send one sworn officer there but you know obviously over time and training that will be reduced so it seems as though you know the momentum is going in that direction but I do uh back back to your um to your statement um what was her name the chair sorry chair um a lot of new names today but uh what I wanted to say was um I think uh my bad I lost my channel I had written it down um well seeing as that how it is I wanted to say that yeah I think my vote would would probably be in the neighborhood I know we're all going to be voting but I just feel uncomfortable supporting something that you know we're we're providing for salaried employees which is great but if I'm not if I'm not able to be given a guarantee that there are additional implicit trainings attended occurring because chief you know we've spoken before and you have told me that you know we are increasing the trainings but you know I haven't seen proof but I know much of that training is confidential you know and when from community members that have you know submitted complaints about conduct we're not able to you know hear what what type of repercussions there they they receive and that that you may be thinking that's a different conversation but for us for me personally just be voicing how I'm feeling I can't support uh you know funding for for the salaried employees that I'm not uh you know assured that they they are having increased implicit trainings and and I and I have some type of proof of it but I'll I'll leave my point at that yeah sir I mean I think the best information I can give you is that all of all of our officers are trained um uh to uh to the same standard and so and you know to really it's the implicit bias training should not go directly you know just to the specific officers that we have that the funding is there for the officers and we are providing training through other mechanisms such as grants in our general fund okay were there any more comments I was just going to say something briefly as a person who's also pretty new to this committee and also has never served on a committee like this before so Elias like I hear you in the whatever you know questions about what our role is here but also just and I wanted to acknowledge that maybe this isn't the space where we discuss what measure O is and how we're using that funding right our role is to make sure it's being used in the way that it's supposed to be using but I do think that there is space and value in identifying other spaces that we are able to discuss what measure O mandates right and whether or not we want to make different choices about that um so my question earlier was where do we where should we go to talk about who it's my question now is where is the best space for us to talk about what it is that measure O actually mandates and engage in that and whether or not I guess we are able to as members of the measure O oversight committee I don't know if there's also rules but I'm a lawyer so I'm all like what are the rules um so that I just I pose some of those as continuing discussion around what Elias raised thank you I appreciate that in terms of um rules about this Shelley do you have rules about this that I should we should know about so there isn't any specific rules we could send you the ordinance as it was passed and it does lay out what the committee's um responsibilities are and I think that will help and the permissible uses of the funds right because we are limited onto what the funds can be spent on as well so I think with new members I apologize in advance that you all don't have this but we will surely um send this out to you um and I think that will give some guidance as well now thank you thank you Shelley yeah because I just to be clear to I am aware I remember when this was passed and I made sure to read made sure to read over it before this meeting and I do I do see things that I don't believe are in that in the measure O that the funds are being used for specifically with the neighborhood empowerment you know things really to improve community engagement uh you know at risk I know back in the day we would call it at risk gang affiliated youth you know trying to improve police relations with the community and you know and hearing that much of the police money goes towards salaries you know I do see you know a big a big disconnect there but yeah but thank you for that Shelley I'll uh you know um yeah you can still go ahead and send it I guess we'll read over it and then I mean if we're passing it today it's fine if we pass it today though I don't see you know the the use really you know is it possible for uh for measure O to maybe get some additional training outside of this meeting in relation to that I guess I need more specifics on what kind of training you would need I don't know I guess maybe more of a discussion about you know like what we're seeing in the budget and how if we feel some type of way about the passage of it I mean maybe having that conversation outside of this because that if this this is this is the area to have that discussion right um and I don't know if a separate meeting will get us there but you let me know we could always not vote today if you guys just decide and we could push this off to another meeting um we are just under some deadlines right that the um the budget adoption is in June so we need to have a consensus by then and everyone was is within the right if they don't think that they're getting that now from this meeting or the chief or whoever else isn't answering all the questions to vote no and and not approve the budget going to council that could definitely be done today too um I guess I just need some direction from you all and what you would like to if we do go to another meeting specifically what you would like to see in that different than today I'd like to make a suggestion in that well first of all typically what I do is I get to meet with the individuals who are new members before this meeting and that didn't happen this time and so I know I met on the phone with um is it Danica or Danica I'm saying it wrong I think but Danica Danica sorry thanks Danica and um usually answer a lot of these questions um ahead of time so that we know you know we see it and and all of that and so I can understand where it would be confusing if you haven't seen a copy of the ordinance and and been able to read through it and measure you know match that up with the presentation that we're getting from each of the departments um so I wonder if what we could do is well I don't know do you feel like you need does how many people on the committee feel like they need to have another meeting where they have after they've read the ordinance so they can compare what's in the ordinance to and and remembering what our goal is or what our job is we have a very specific job keep that in mind um do you want to have another meeting I guess we need to vote on that uh to discuss that after or do you feel comfortable in voting for the budget as it is now and either voting no and what we could do is we could take a vote on the approval of the budget now if it doesn't pass at that point come back for another meeting um that that's also an option if everyone is in agreement they'd like to come back and have the police department or whoever reworked their budget and come up with a different scenario we could do that too I I guess um I'll let you decide I think one thing that we need to say though is about the implementation plan anything the implementation plan is something that has to have approval if there's changes of it changes in that and certainly then we have to have approval from the city council is that right and then if we change if we want to change where the money goes and very much like if we want to make a big change in that then we have to take it to the voting public because they voted for a specific thing so it's it's there are processes for each one of those um I don't see us changing measure oh prior to us right well we have so many decisions to make right the council does do we go forward with us um extending the sales tax measure if we do is it going to stay the same or is it going to be different so that's another piece of this if there are things on in the public that if the public says no they wanted to address different issues in the community that will happen at that time when we take it back to the public um that's what you were remembering Elias last time there was a lot in the paper about that a lot of education about that um almost 20 years ago now um so I guess I would suggest that we vote now to see if we can if it passes and if it doesn't we have another meeting but what would be the best way for each of those the newer members who don't feel comfortable with this to get educated and brought up to speed about where we are would that be to meet separately uh with the chief or should we meet as a group uh I think what I would propose is you know obviously we're going to hear from the other members but I do not believe we should vote today because I do feel very strongly that much of the the wording in measure O does you know allow room for increased community engagement and with that broad language there is a you know discretion on the part of the police department to include uh you know whatever we're calling it called just civility implicit biasing implicit bias training for these employees because strictly the money going straight towards salaries I think is really is really uh you know opposite to what you know the main purpose of measure O was when it was passed so that's what I'd love to hear from other members but if you were asking me personally how I feel I I feel best if we did a vote today we had a meeting just to make sure things are lining up and then with the and then both Helen and Shelley a clarification for me just to make sure I'm under I'm understanding because even though I've been on the committee for a while heaven knows the rules get confusing my understanding has been Ellen I think you made this point earlier that our job here is really to look for things that would be illegal under measure O that would not where where funds are being spent in a way that are clearly out of line with the legislative intent of the measure not whether we think there might be better uses for the fund I think that's outside of our purview and as I've listened to the as I've listened to the discussion I I certainly heard other ways for the funds to be used differently but I haven't heard anybody find an example of funds that were being used inappropriately which I think is our only task here unless I'm unless I am mistaken I think you're right that's right I think the the problem has been that there are a couple of members that don't have a copy of the ordinance is that right or do you have it my understanding is you don't yeah I have a copy and I do believe there is a mark where you just said you know to use those words exactly I don't know if you have in front of you if you're using a specific legal term but you know from what I've heard today I do believe there is uh you know whatever would you call it legislative error or something you know a legal happening it's just whether one of the departments is is using funds in a way that's clearly out of line with the with the intent of the measure as it was voted on and I wanted to confirm with Shelley and Ellen that my understanding of our of our role is correct but in terms of a vote if you if you felt differently if you felt like some of the funds were in fact being used with a way that in a way that was out of line then then you could vote no but that still might be a reason for us to take a vote here and and gauge whether others on the committee agree I'd be glad to read the police permits permissible uses for the police I'd be glad to read that directly from the plan if that would be helpful would that be helpful okay the well like I said I I read it before but I think if you just read that specific part it kind of you're kind of you know you missed the whole point of the whole thing and what its purpose was when we were you know having many issues with gang violence and a lot of violence in the city but so I don't think you're even a specific part would you know help with that but if you would like to well it's just that it that is the goal of this committee right now if we want to change the the plan that is not our job to do that that is the city council's job to do that to work with the public to make that change it's not the job of this committee to do it is that right celly I'm listening yeah yeah I'm not talking about changing measure oh yeah that's a whole that's a you know publicly passed measure right so yeah I'm just speaking to I think whatever what what is already written in there would still warrant a discussion from us in regards to if we do believe those funds are being held to the standard of the purpose for that measure do you have specific things that are not in your mind that that show that they are not yeah I mean it's like I just said the the fact that it's specifically just going straight towards salaries I think that is you know a slap in the face for you know you know the reasons for that past okay and then right now that's a permissible use right so that's that's there and then the chief explained that the trainings are coming from general fund funding and from in being um enhanced by grant money so your question was the answer that way I'm not sure how we can fix that on this committee well us being the individuals that are paying for the salaried individuals that are receiving training every two years and what's currently happening with what we've seen from the conduct the police department I think it you know it behoove us to make sure we discuss if we believe we're not perpetuating a misuse of funds that are inadvertently resulting in the harm of the community that helped get this ordinance passed in the first place can I clarify a couple of things one I think one of the outstanding questions is whether or not our job is to ensure that there is nothing illegal happening versus whether or not we approve the that those funds are actually being used in their intended way and I think that those are two different questions um I just pulled up the ordinance from my reading of it our role is not to just simply ensure that there's nothing illegal happening but is to uh yeah you know ensure that the revenues are spent or appropriated for the purposes and uses set forth in paragraph a so that is a different consideration than just illegality um and two I think you know yeah obviously there's different opinions about whether or not those things are being met but I but I it does seem to me that it's worthwhile to continue that conversation given questions being posed here about what what actually is the role I understand that this maybe hasn't been the way this space has been used in the past but clearly we are having a different cultural conversation right now about use of funds in this exact space and so perhaps it is time to reconsider how it is we use this space and to take the time to make sure that we are answering all of the questions that are currently being posed well I think it's important to do that also I just not sure the right way to do it and you know further the best way to do it so everyone gets their answer questions answered and then we it's probably more time to what our role is excuse me so it's probably more time and more meetings and more conversations which um you know I know everybody feels like is hard to a lot given everybody's busyness but oftentimes I think in this space um in the criminal legal system in general and in many of these conversations we often don't arrive at the best solutions and answers because we're trying to get there quickly and so I do just encourage us to take that time to probably have more meetings and more discussions about the role of this oversight committee and what approval of the funding actually means so the best way to do that would be to try to take a vote now and then see where we land and then proceed from there does that sound right we have agreement about that I would like to hear yeah I would like to hear from other members with anybody because I think if we if everybody does believe there there is nothing wrong currently I don't see why we don't have a discussion when you know I'm voicing that I think we do need to have it you know so I feel like everybody thinks everything is is fine we should still have the discussion and then vote for the budget afterwards but yeah I'd love to hear from other members what what are folks thinking to comment from other people I have a question what wasn't there just an amendment to measure O in terms of uh fund the allocation of funding so it wasn't a amendment but it wasn't to the allocation of funding it was to the general fund baseline which means the amount of money that the general fund contributes to the police services fire services gang prevention and intervention that's what changed it actually had nothing to do with the revenue generated by this sales tax it was more of a maintenance of effort of the general fund and what what was required to create that change so that was done by staff and put up to the voters right so it has to go back to the voters every change made to measure O needs a two-thirds vote I believe to change anything in the ordinance or otherwise to to make a change where uh some of the police the funding allocated towards the police department could be allocated towards uh training I don't I can't remember the names that they would call but the the training for to decrease the excessive force so to to to have some of the money allocated towards those that type of training wouldn't require the same uh process of having creating you know fill out some kind of paperwork getting it to the people having them vote so I am not the expert on this I would have to refer to our city attorney but I believe the answer is yes it is a change to the permissible uses so I would assume it would be yes but I would definitely want to talk to our city attorney before I said that in stone thank you thank you so let me just share um we you can kind of look at it we have a couple of different buckets of money and so some of the training that you guys are asking for is out of measure O per se it is coming out of the general fund so if you take money out of the measure O you would have to let's say pull out a officer to allow that money to be freed up in order to do the training the key here is that we want them to get the training no matter what bucket of money it comes out of so if and somebody can chime in and correct me if I'm wrong but when it comes to measure O if you want to take that money away from an officer you we would have to they would have to go back adjust their budget take a person out put it in the general fund then come back to us and say okay we want to do this training and we wanted to come out of the measure O funds and if it's not about just coming out of measure O funds we want them to have the training they're getting the training it's just coming out of another bucket of money so if somebody can clarify that if that sounds correct so it wouldn't necessarily be another bucket of money if if the direction is that the committee as a whole does not approve this budget and would like to see a reduction in police services to go towards training it would all stay in the measure O funds if the city attorney agreed that this was an allowable use depending on what training was preferred but wouldn't we have to give up some of the money that is already allocated because we are already at the max for the allocation so that's what I'm saying it wouldn't be additional money we would have to give up something to get the training into measure O that's yes yes is that within our power or is it within the power of the city council that we represent so so this committee approves conditionally the budget the city council is the one that has the overall arching approval you are just passing it on to them now if you all don't approve and we don't get any significant changes between now and when we go to city council we would tell the city council the coc did not approve the budget as stated and at that time they could approve it themselves without your approval or they could ask us to go back so I think we're getting a little off topic here I think that what we should do now is take a vote see where we're at and move on from there and honestly the voters have a right to either vote no or abstain if they do not feel like they want to vote at this time but I think we need to move forward with some direction I think everyone on the committee has a chance to speak to this already now unless there's anything else that needs to be said before we take the vote I would say if we could go ahead with that and we probably want to redo the first and second okay yeah I think the last thing I would say that you know I recently pulled it up and I do see a lot of leeway here for school resource services and adding programs and neighborhoods affected by high levels of gang activity which emphasizes positive role models promise all being community safety and I know you know much of the you know police departments are in those areas you know there's temporary sites in these neighborhoods that are you know quote on quote with gang affiliated individuals and I you know I didn't hear any of that all I heard was salaries so I think you know for other members on the committee I think it behoove us to to just to have a discussion because once we do approve it these opportunities of discussions that happen in the future aren't going to hold any weight because the budget has already been given you know all we can do is really add kind of comment to it but we have the power now to really you know have a difficult conversation and where funding could be allocated different ways and uh and thank you for that clarification uh Shelley in regards to measure open it could be still be used and with for a different purpose without changing buckets as a I know I was just talking about earlier but yeah that's what I wanted to say so we have a motion is that right or do we need to go start there I've forgotten where we are in terms of the process do we have a motion I should say we should start again so we'll need a first and a second okay so we need someone to is someone willing to make a motion to approve the budget for fiscal year 2021-22 am I able to make a motion to have a discussion before voting unfortunately this was the discussion I'm not sure well I didn't hear from much of the members so it just kind of fell back and forth between you know me and the chair the opportunity was when the police gave their presentation no I'm at amongst the members of the committee not not with the police department am I am I able to ask for a motion for that to have a discussion before voting well I just want to point out to you that we did hear from Danica from yourself we've heard from vice mayor our vice chair um minor I keep back her name's event so I forgot what her last name is we've also heard from um Monta so and but I'm specifically asking for a motion for a just a meeting before voting having another meeting that's my that's the motion you'd like to see is that we have another meeting before voting yes before voting um I don't know shelly what are the rules about this I'm not sure how to do that I'm not quite sure myself but we're using Robert's rules right well if he may if he makes the motion you would have to have a second and then we would have to vote on it and then if people say yes then we would have another meeting but if people say no or abstain then it's either we don't have another and then we can go to the vote I would say you're correct okay so um Elias would you like to make a motion yeah I would like to make a motion to have a meeting with them with the members uh before voting on this budget is there a second a second okay then we vote well my question is if there's no second we don't need to vote you have to have a second you have to have a second to move forward with a vote so if there's no second then it then it's new instead Danica seconded Danica seconded it you may not have heard her say that okay so let's go for a vote then who would like to see us have another meeting to discuss this prior to going to the city council or prior to voting on the budget I say no no before my mind is Elias can you can you just share just briefly the purpose of having another meeting please and what what you would like to get out of that meeting and what you would like to discuss uh I would like us to discuss the uh you know inadvertent harm we're doing to our community by passing this without any type of uh you know memorandum of understanding not in the text form but in this budget for how the relationship with our community and law enforcement will continue here I think we we're in a time that that's very reckoning and us as the individuals that are passing this on to the to the city attorney uh when that ordinance was passed there was a lot of things happening in our neighborhoods and you know uh people have not forgotten and me as someone that's been selected here that's representing a body of people in a certain uh area in the city where we're still waiting for measure o to to affect you know our neighborhoods that these things are happening to and I don't think just strictly salaried individuals you know is what folks were thinking when measure o was passed so I think if we can discuss you know bring up possibilities of other ways of allocations from the police department in areas that do fulfill the goals of measure o I think that's a conversation that is possible and can happen if we allow the space for it if we find some if we if we agree on a resolution then what uh well I think I think the chief and uh and uh let me go to her thing her name Pam I think they would probably obliged to hear it and possibly incorporate it in their proposed budget but I I say yes to another meaning because just to allow uh uh and Ellie Ellie is saying uh Danica to uh express uh uh uh more of what they what they feel and how they would like to uh find resolution to it but within a within a timeframe of course okay as a chair I get to vote two and I was going to vote no it's but that gives us three and three is that right am I doing the math right um and that doesn't seem I feel like this is I agree that this is a really important subject I don't mean to be dismissive at all to any of you I what I'm not really clear about is how to move um what the what the process is for moving forward in in us having some having effective change that that's where I'm a little I don't know so um I I would say since it's a three to three and that's not a good way to to end a meeting I would say I'm willing to have another meeting and I'd like to get meet with staff to get clarity about the best way to move forward so we have a good discussion which I'm sure we will but that also that we will have a um a clear path forward to um that would be satisfied does that make sense because I'm not really clear we go from here do we say yes do we say no where does it go I want to make sure that that we we have a way to do that um that I think uh based on what Shelly said if we're if we do not pass it it basically will be on our hands and it sounds like the city council will make that decision so I don't know if we really would need to vote at this point it would be up to the city council to make that decision and they can very well move forward without our our consent maybe I guess that would be a question we would have to ask I don't know but that's a question we need to know if we decide that we're in a deadlock right now and it goes to the city council because at the end of the day budgets have to be um you know we're they're working on a budget and if this doesn't pass how does that affect the overall budget and so either they can come back and say go back to measure oh and see if we can get a consensus or they can go forward and vote uh we would have to get clarification on that exactly that's what I need me to get clarification you're for sure that's how it works Shelly so we we can't we do have time the budget doesn't go until June middle of June um but I guess in order for us not to be at an impasse I think what you know we need to look at a few things on our end and and get specifics on what would change um everyone's mind to change the budget to get it to pass in the next month when we meet again okay so will you set up another meeting for us to do that is that what happens or do we need to make a request no we can set up another one I mean we voted on you all voted on it so it doesn't look like anyone is willing to I mean you we could go through the work of um doing another vote to see if we want to pass this as is but I'm pretty sure it's going to end up three in three so I think the next step here is to um have police rework their budget and get some clarification on some of the items um as far as training and things like that and we will bring something back it looks like the chief wants to say something well yeah so I just want to be I guess I want to be clear on what you're what's being asked of the police department um I know that there's been a lot of discussion about salaries and maybe it was the way I presented it but uh when when I when I talked about Mejaro going to salaries um basically the the officers are how we offer direct services to enhance public safety uh that Mejaro has directly gone to staff police officers civilians uh civilian personnel uh to answer calls for service uh answer calls into the dispatch center um to be part of specific teams to address community issues such as traffic which is one of our top priorities uh for it has been the top priority for the city um they're they're directly involved in the homeless issues so uh when when we're talking about when we're talking about salaries I I mean it's what it is it's just going directly towards our staff to provide these in these enhanced services so I don't know if that helps at all um so if if if you're asking us to come back I'm not really sure what I don't know if you want me to is the question that you have is you want to clarify what each of these officers are doing on a daily basis are you asking are you asking um you know how we how we would we work it because we're we don't have the I don't have the funding in general there's no I can't take people out and just pop them into general fund it's a completely different system and uh that that goes beyond I that's gonna that's gonna be a very very long process and I don't even know if we can do that so I'm I'm clear on what you're asking us to do Chief Navarro let me let me jump in too um Shelly with with respond with um in terms of next steps I'm uncomfortable with the idea that that this committee would be would be getting into to budget reallocation um for the reason that none of us have any expertise in that our role here is to really make sure that the funds put together by the experts in these various areas are being spent in accordance with the legislation we at least that's my understanding in terms of next steps um what I thought we had heard earlier that we needed clarification as to whether that understanding is correct or whether there is so really the question that I what I want an answer to is how much leeway do we have really if the answer is that we don't have any leeway that we're here simply to to oversee as had been my understanding that should solve our question because then a lot of these a lot of these discussion points are moot and those discussions are really best held with the at the city council level or at least not in this committee um and if the if the answer comes back that oh there's a lot of leeway that we're here able just to opine and and sort of give our ideas in terms of how these these budget should be spent then that that's going to I'm going to start requesting more meetings too because that wasn't my understanding and that makes me that makes me a little bit nervous. Agreed I think that we're trying to get clarity on all of those subject matters and and hopefully we will get clarity before the next meeting um and can send out a written communication and then the next meeting if the case is it is simply to agree that these uses are within the ordinance then we come back and it would be a simple presentation exactly what you saw here today and a vote would be taken if the city attorney agrees that there are some leeway in what we could do then at that point we'd have to present something that is passable by you all or go with what we have with the city council if there isn't time. I just wanted to yeah I don't I don't understand the the ask from about this additional conversation to be necessarily that we are all going to try to figure out how to reallocate the city budget in different ways I think we understand that that conversation would need to happen elsewhere but what I understand the ask to be is that simply going through a quick presentation and then voting to approve it doesn't necessarily feel like uh oversight and that there is value in us having a longer discussion about what these funds are meant to be spent on and whether or not we agree that they are being spent in that way it doesn't mean necessarily that we're going to come to the end of that and conclude that they aren't or that they are against the pervy you know what measure oh intends to do but because this is a public meeting and community members are theoretically tuning in though I can't tell how many people are there is value in having deeper discussions about those because whether or not we choose to vote to approve this budget right now or not it is also our responsibility to be educating other community members about the way that this fund currently works so that they can also make different choices about how we want it to work potentially in ways that I don't think will happen if we don't have more robust conversations about that so I don't think that the the ask is necessarily that we come and we figure out how to reallocate money but that we actually do talk talk more in depth about the use of these funds now whether or not they are in compliance with the current measure oh and then vote after we've had the ability to have more robust discussion about it the question I have is where will the information go and what happens to it you know we we come up with a decision and then I'm not sure this is the right place to do it I mean the way it's set up right now that isn't what we're set up to do I'm not against discussion at all I just want to hear from in terms of process once we have if we have another meeting that we have a discussion then do we does it have any power I guess that's part of it is where does it go does that power or does is there a better place for this to be happening yeah I think to answer that question yeah I think to answer that question you know to answer your question specifically you know chief I don't think there's anything I have to do right now I think we need to talk amongst ourselves and and figure out if there is anything we can do you know and I and uh we you know we'll reach out to you with what we come up with and you know we'll reconvene again and maybe your proposed budget will reflect some of the additions that you know the possible additions that we do recommend you incorporate you know it may not we may not come up with anything so there isn't nothing I have to do now I think that uh you know so but you know we will you know get back to you in a very timely matter you know you're basically asking a committee that has a very specific job right we all know what that job is you're asking this committee to redefine itself and we're not the ones to do that yeah I mean the definition it says review appropriateness of proposed measure oh appropriations for for upcoming budget so I think you know us is reviewing I think you know it does there is discretion in there to you know propose things to be incorporated in the proposed budgets by these different uh agencies well that's what we need to hear from the city attorney then because I was reading no I was reading the specific it's on our website what page is that on in the ordinance because I'm going through the ordinance right now not this is the measure of citizen oversight committee mission yeah I have the mission right in front of me also and I am looking at the ordinance I'm sorry so we're the I was coming from the ordinance and I'm going by specifically the ordinance number three number for the audience ordinance because the mission statement is not the ordinance you know we're here to you know do what the mission says but if you go specifically back to the ordinance that's what we need to follow so if you can go back into the ordinance and find something to support your uh what you're saying then I can you know we can all take a look at that and then have further discussion but come from the perspective of the ordinance yeah I could bring that to the next meeting for sure but yeah it's definitely in there which is it's there that's the reason a lot yeah it's section h of the ordinance that says that the oversight committee shall annually review expenditures to ensure that all revenues are spent or appropriated for the purposes and uses set forth in paragraphs yeah so yeah so citizen paragraph paragraph a cd and e and so if you go back to that it has the breakdowns right but then if you go to the permissible portion those are very specific and that's that's um section three dash two six point one two zero um section a a one a two and a three and that has the breakdowns of what the funding is um for so if you go back to that and if we're looking at what was presented then that's exactly what was done okay I'd like to call on Alan because he has his hand raised thank you uh thanks chair uh my name's Alan Alton I'm the deputy finance director um so one thing I just want to remind the committee that this is an agendized committee that has a very specific agenda uh for today and we're we're bearing off of that and so my suggestion would be that if you are going to hold a special meeting to discuss the um uh the the role of the committee as spelled out in the ordinance uh I don't know maybe a studies study type meeting or something like that this is rather informal so I think you could you could definitely do that you we need to have that um uh uh put on for a for a future meeting a special meeting here because we're I'm I'm getting a little uncomfortable that we are we're venturing far away from the the topics that were on this agenda um and with that I'll I'll I'll leave it at that but I think your next step would be to to figure out what you and if it is getting a city attorney opinion on on on what the permissible uses are in the ordinance it's rather specifically spelled out but if there's that information that that an opinion I think to have the chair direct staff to come up with that is probably the appropriate rate failure chair chair Bailey and this may be passed whatever you're just what would the committee recommends and or decides but I'm more than happy to have a sit down with each person on the committee in the future if there's any questions about operations in general uh both uh you know measure row and not measure row uh more than happy to talk to you about that and to help help educate um uh you on what we're doing here at the police department and talk to you about other other ways to get involved so I look forward to speaking to each and every one of you thank you so moving forward who would we have at this meeting then if that's the case I mean I know we would have the attorney the city's attorney but who else would be at this meeting that we're supposed to be venturing on because if there's questions that need to be answered we need to have certain people at the table that can answer those questions otherwise we're going to be in the same position that we're in right now so I would suggest that that if you have specific questions that need an attorney opinion that those should all run through the chair and she will get clarification and bring them back to the next meeting she will work with staff to get clarification okay so at this point you're any questions from the people that are on the fence needs to get the question back to the chair and then she goes and get that information from the parties that be and if they want to have additional conversation could that be set up with those parties outside of this meeting yes so my understanding I'm going to reiterate what you just said so that we're see if we're on the same page that if you have specific questions you'd like to send to me I'm sure you have my email but if you don't I can send it out to you later today or tomorrow morning and that you have questions you want to send to me about a clarification about what you'd like to accomplish in another meeting and the changes that you'd like to see happen then I would take that to staff and find out from the city you know attorney what the process is for all of this because it's I don't know what that is my understanding in the past has been that if we wanted to change the actual mission that we would have to go back to the voters for that and I don't know if that's true or not so we need to find that out okay and then once we get that information depending on what comes up I would send it the answers to you and whether or not another and then we would have to have another meeting to for sure to decide on the budget so that sound did I get it right doing people in agreement with where what I just said and everyone's okay and by all means if any questions that's why they send this information out to us in advance if there's any question or anything that you're not fully understanding please get that information answered prior to coming to the meeting because if there's further discussions that need to be have before we have our meeting that needs to be done before we have our meeting so if so at this point chair Bailey next steps and next step I want to thank everybody for all your all the patience and working through all of this and chief I hear you right that um anyone on this committee that would like to have a private discussion with you or a separate discussion with you you're open to having that with them um uh yes I'm so they should just contact you directly uh yes that's great okay and so um I don't think there's any more motions to take is that right at this point I'm a little lost in that part um so we know we just or maybe we're having a motion to say we're going to have another meeting or we're we're leaving to get more information what's the best way to do this Shelley well the motion that was on the floor was that we wanted to have another meeting so that is that's right so we have nothing else to do because right the vote is three three so at this point we're just gonna uh if there's nothing further or you need further comments at this point we can go ahead and adjourn the meeting at this point yes because the second item or the last item on the agenda is directly related to the budget as well so okay okay well then we'll like to end the meeting thanks everyone sorry sorry um we'll just need to make sure that we give public comment if there's anyone on here um just make sure that no one has anything and then we can adjourn thank you we're not taking public comment for the fiscal year 2020 21 22 measure a program budget if you wish to make a comment please raise your hand and if you are on using a telephone please dial nine to raise your hand do you see anyone there are no hands raised okay i'd like to thank you it's a public we're ever going to attend any measure own committee meeting this should have been the one i know the most exciting one ever oh hey chief i i was going to add on the in the in the chat but i don't think we've got a chat on here but yeah i definitely be reaching out and to have a meeting with you and if anybody else on the committee you know wants to you know tag team we can uh just send me an email i think i think we're all on email list so yeah okay great and alias i don't have your email do you have the email information for the contact information shelly for everyone on the committee yes could you send that to you could you send that to me to everyone if you could send to everyone that would be great because that way they can get me and i can get to them thank you so much appreciate that um so just make a motion to adjourn the meeting oh thank you i'd like to make a motion to adjourn the meeting can we have a second second second all right all right thank you everyone and um i look forward to for the discussion and welcome aboard to new members and thank you to the staff i know this has been a long meeting appreciate your patience with us bye everybody