 Welcome back, it's so watching the breakfast on plus TV Africa and we move on with our conversations right here on the program Of course, the ASUS strike is one that has given a lot of Nigerians reason for concern We have a guest standing by to discuss this Very all-important issue that has affected Nigeria's education sector and it's of course giving a lot of parents Reason to complain in fact parents Association has released a statement calling for more to be done by The authorities as far as the strike is concerned As soon as extended the strike by two months eight weeks. They had a meeting at the national sectariat in the University of Abuja Yesterday where this particular decision was taken before we introduce our guest Who is a dealer sherry chairman of the academic staff union of universities in the University of Lagos? Let's quickly go to the background of this term Well after declaring a one-month warning strike on February 14 in protest at the federal government's Failure to meet their demands the academic staff union of universities has voted to extend the strike for a further Eight weeks rising from an emergency meeting of its national executive council or the University of Abuja on Sunday March 13, 2022 at its national sectariat Asu president prophesied Manuel Osso Decay Said the union had concluded that a government had failed to satisfactorily address all the issues raised in the 2020 FG and ASU memorandum of action within the four-week rollover strike period and therefore resolved That the strike be rolled over for another eight weeks to give the government more time to address all the issues In concrete terms so that in his words students will resume resume as soon as possible now other demands of the union as listed by ASU include earned academic allowances the state universities Promotion arrears with health salaries and non-remittance of third-party deductions now since the beginning of the strike on February 14 2022 the government and ASU have met two times Joining us to discuss the development and its implications. Let's welcome Delia. She will who is the chairman of the academic staff union of universities in The University of Lagos miss Ashu. Good morning to you. And thank you very much for your time Good morning. Thank you very much for this invitation. It's a pleasure to be here Please give us a summary of what happened in the rescue of buja yesterday. I'm sure on Sunday, right? I'm sure you were there at that meeting Oh, yes, I was at the meeting. What happened is as described by the president of our union we met at the National Secretariat of our union situated in the University of Abuja where we took reports from our trustees and principal officers About the engagements that they have had with government so far in the briefing we were told that Government has not demonstrated enough will and the desire to meet the minimum demands of our union Although we have a couple of them like you have listed out, but some are very very critical To these ongoing strike action One of them is the question of scooping up the already renegotiated agreement between our union and government with a view to implementing it after the briefing from our trustees and principal officers neck discussed the items one by one and concluded that Giving the ongoing narratives and going giving the work that is still ongoing It is necessary for our union to Give government some more time to be able to put their hearts together In the interest of Nigerian students and the Nigerian University system Consequent upon that the National Executive Council decided that there was the need to extend the strike action By another two weeks another eight weeks, which is two months and that has been so communicated to Nigeria's Okay, let's also look at another issue that some persons are saying that this might just be a bone of contention The major bone of contention between the union that has won the federal government and he talks about the payment system You know the federal government is proposing the IPP is system and of course the union is talking about the UTA Payment system and some people are saying that The reason asu is really embarking the bone of contention despite all that's been put out It's necessarily the payment system Which you know the federal government doubts the transparency of the system in the administration of you know the universities Can you share your thoughts on this? Well, let me start by saying that ah Government is not proposing IPP is Government forcefully enrolled us on IPP is despite our disagreement with government on the suitability of IPP is for the Nigerian University system and Our union has been vindicated because in a recent report By the auditor general of the federation IPP is was described as a fraud and our union are challenged federal government to publish the report of that of the auditor general of the federation so that we can see in bold relief the Damage that IPP is have done To the Nigerian University system and to the Nigeria state as a whole Let me also mention that Is it's an up payment system Supposedly to cop corruption and waste in the salary and enrollment of government workers This has eroded Autonomy and the smooth operation of the university system since its operation It was as a result of the rejection of IPP is that government you the challenge at us That if we say IPP is is not good Can we provide an alternative payment platform for the Nigerian University system our union took up that challenge? constituted a technical team that has produced what is now called The university transparency and accountability solution utas which is a payment Platform and software for payment of salaries in the Nigeria inverse system that system had undergone series of tests by Nita and In fact, the user acceptability test that was conducted by Nita Utah's code 88% and then we challenge government that was IPP is subjected to any test IPP is was not only subjected to any test up to now. It has not been tested In fact the database for IPP is it's not domiciled in Nigeria. It's domiciled somewhere in the United States of America so Haven't gone through all of these processes While discussion was still going on and utas was seen being tested the director general of Nita went on air Misinforming Nigeria's and telling lies about utas the current situation if I may inform is that our technical team and that of Nita are currently meeting in their office in Abuja clarifying gray areas and explaining areas that they don't understand as a prelude to certifying utas as a payment platform for the Nigerian University system But you also have the federal government saying that the utas failed integrity tests and that's what the federal government is saying They don't trust you. We have we have said that is not true. That's that's a lie And that's misleading Nigeria's utas cannot fail integrity test because Utah's is a system that has been carefully developed by the best brace in the Nigerian University system and I am Informing you that Those areas that the needs that officials did not understand Which made them gave that verdict is currently being reviewed between our technical team and the needs that officials It is unfortunate That government officials like the director general of Nita who had never attended any of the meetings Whether technical or otherwise could go publicly on air to mislead Nigerians and mislead the people about an unfounded tale concerning utas. Okay, as I speak to you utas Has integrity it has not failed. It is a system that is homegrown that is sufficiently fortified to take care of the payment system and its peculiarities in the Nigerian University system I like to take you back a bit, you know, let's go back to the IPPS system And you have mentioned that it's it's a you know the that payment system That was imposed on you know, the university's a fraudulent system Can you take us through how fraudulent it is because it feels like this might just be the bone of contention between your union and the government? Yeah, thank you very much. The first is that as I speak with you Nobody in the Nigerian University system today under IPPS Can tell you exactly how much of she is going to end in any particular month Quite often you find a situation where The salaries of a particular professor is amputated and paid I mean to another professor. There are Wrong entries. There are most often salaries Belonging to a professor in uni lag can be paid to another one in Buk or elsewhere not only that the Human resource compartment and the payroll system Together being loaned together By the IPPIS office in such a manner that provides ample opportunity For those in charge of the system to enroll even people who don't work in a particular system On the IPPIS platform and they continue to receive salary in some months, let me be specific in the month of Of of November October or November last year A number of people were paid about three month salaries And then they have to start withdrawing it instead of one. So the payment platform had constituted You know a club in the wheel of progress of the Nigerian University system And you find a situation where when things like that happen You cannot even resolve I mean those little challenges in your respective universities You have to travel all the way down to Abuja to get those things resolved Which also provides an ample of opportunity for those who work there To fleece our members of their added money by way of kickbacks and damning Settlement for them to get, you know, they are they are challenges sorted out at the IPPIS office All right. Mr. Denashir the ministry of Education or the federal government basically Had said last week that um, they won't negotiate with the they wouldn't make gunpoint negotiations with the But also it's essentially saying that um, they wouldn't like to be negotiating under duress and the argument about making gunpoint negotiating negotiations or Negotiations under duress is that also, you know whilst the negotiations are ongoing between the union and the federal government Has embarked on a strike whilst they're still negotiating. What are you what what's your take on that? The question is why will the ministry of education wait until we embark on strike To commence the negotiation When the negotiations started last year under professor monsali jubril We weren't on strike The the renegotiation was concluded in may 2021 Between may 2021 And last month when we started the strike. What was the ministry of education doing? It is the ministry of education that is making a suit to negotiate under very Conductive conditions and circumstances If they have been proactive and they have moved up to their billion as those who super intend over education in nigeria I do not think that This strike will commence in the first instance let alone be talking about negotiating under duress So the point of note is that the renegotiation had already been concluded What is left is for government To tell us its own side of the story Put a counter-proposer before our union for the consideration of our members It is not true that government is negotiating under duress It is cheap blackmail and it's much of a group of people who are bereft of ideas About how to move the education sector forward in nigeria. All right In response of the federal government to to this new announcement that as we have extended the roll over by eight weeks It's the the minister of state for education. Um, mr. Chico make a wajuba who i'm sure you know very well Who is saying that um He's insisting that the federal government has met all your demands And that all the end allowances As well as revitalization funds have been released Mr. Shea yes The the first thing is to disregard the mr. Wajuba because It's more of a confusion in that ministry than any responsible public officer Interested in resolving crisis in all of what I have been explaining. Did I talk about the end allowances or revitalization fund? We are saying that we have a renegotiated document with government Scoop it up. Let us discuss the content of the renegotiated agreement as a basis I mean for increasing welfare conditions of our members and Ensuring that the university system works seamlessly A mean a junior minister is sitting down somewhere and and misinforming and misleading nigeria I think this item nigeria's told wajuba that is its likes are not the kind of people who should surprise turn over education in nigeria He has he has been more of a of a problem to the entire process than a solution And that is exactly what is currently displaying How can a union that is aggrieved that government have dedicated its own responsibility? and All the minister would have to say is that end allowances and revitalization fund Has been released. It's also a loud testimony to the fact that he is really not familiar With issues in contention under this this current strike action And it would be nice for mr. Wajuba to sit down and get familiar with the issues Rather than I mean going to press and making inferiority statements that will further degenerate the situation Rather than ameliorating all right very strong words for you for mr. Wajiba, but What are the contents of this this renegotiated agreement? So those who are listening and are wondering and I've read The statement by the minnesota state for education saying they've released the funds to you And he talked about the revitalization fund and end allowances meeting all your demands What are the contents of this renegotiated agreement? Let's just go back there There are four pillars in the renegotiated agreement The first is the condition of service of our members Mr. Wajiba is is saying what is saying because it's feeling part of public funds University teachers in Nigeria have been receiving the same salary in the last 13 years That is not a subject of concern to the minister of state for education The highest grade professor in Nigeria University Is today receiving a purchase home of four hundred something thousand naira That is not a subject of concern for the minister of state For you to hire The an assistant lecturer in the in any federal university in Nigeria His take home pay is not up to 150,000 naira We are saying that government should be negotiate this condition of service So that we can make I mean Teaching in the university attractive to best place Is busy talking about end allowances end allowances are mere symptoms of a failed system The meaning of end allowances is that government is unable to provide The requisite number of workers in the university and those who are doing excess Workloads should be compensated for the work that they are doing How does that Measure up to conditions of service. So the first pillar of the negotiated agreement It's conditions of service. The second is funding for revitalization of public universities Universities have remained in terms of reagents in terms of library provision, etc So one of the terms of that agreement is that funding should be provided so that we can Bring to light This decaying infrastructure and that is where the question of revitalization comes in Government is in default Of 1.1 trillion Naira as revitalization fund the highest that was they released so far was by the president good luck Jonathan administration, which is 220 billion This government has also Has only released a purchase of 70 billion naira and the minister of state is saying that all the money has been released The third in the renegotiated agreement is what we call university autonomy And academic freedom. It is that university autonomy That ippr is That is other matters that are related to all of the three items that I have Enumerated above and they have to do with global best practices in making the universities globally competitive In terms of research and innovation and ensuring that our graduates are globally competitive Okay, but let's also Stay with these issues. I mean, we're still understanding some of the concern Nigerians a lot of persons have been taken aback with the fact that as we still talking about Implementation of the agreement that was entered in 2009 and just some days back Your national president immanuel shudduke who granted an interview to assist the station had mentioned insisting that the government should chose between Funding these universities or shutting them and that's saying that the government must implement the agreement of 2009 thus all of this fall on the first of all I'd like to ask has the government not implemented the agreement entered with the union, of course, which you're part of in 2009 Yeah, I think that what the president said Is that government should implement the renegotiated agreement in in the 2009 agreement Both government and our union agree that that agreement should be reviewed every three years Our government had remained in default because Since 2009 till date government has refused to renegotiate that agreement But our union Haven't gone on strike for nine months in 2020 First government to renegotiate The 2009 agreement That agreement had been renegotiated and concluded since May 2021 So what the president is saying is that government should scoop up the renegotiated agreement and commence implementation now in terms of Making our universities competitive what What is contained in the agreement is for government to implement best practices Globally accepted best practices in our university system to save it from imminent collapse and Our government our president is just putting government on the edge Fund your universities Like a responsible government will do or close them for that period of time when I mean you'll be able to make up your mind as to they had the question of funds to be released to the university and of course, I know That it is not in the interest of Nigerians and the development of Nigeria as a country for government to close down the university. So our president is just putting government on the edge. Okay, so but Having an extension of the strike by eight weeks. Where does this leave the Nigerian student? I will want to You know say that you're also a parent. So and you have all the parents were Worried about the fact that their kids would be out of school or children would be out of school For a very long time looking at the implication Devices and all the issues this would cost them financially, you know and otherwise Well, you see that's that's a very challenging concept, but my reaction is you see There is no game when there is no pain For us to keep the Nigerian university system All of us must endure this pain for a while If we don't continue to do what we are doing now We may find out that we don't even have a university for these children to return As I speak with you There are no public primary schools That are What's that name in Nigeria anymore? There are no public secondary schools That are enviable For even all of us to send our kids there If we don't continue to struggle in the manner that we are doing at the moment We may wake up and find out that Governments are destroyed, you know public universities and handed them over to their private Cronies and collaborators. So these struggles are necessary to keep the Nigerian university system functional to ensure it plays its strategic role in the development of Nigeria And my appeal to parents is rather than sit down and agonize We should all organize and challenge This vicious and wicked government that we have at the moment And hold them accountable You know to their electoral promises in ensuring that they fund education adequately as you may already be aware No, any nation can rise above its own level of educational development. Okay. That's why government must take education Very seriously. Yeah, I mean it's actually finally before you go of course the minister of labor and employment has said that ASU has been acting in disregard of the labor act and the dispute the trade and dispute act as well I would like to know if you're being paid your salary while you are Still striking. That's no more number two if the federal government doesn't I see to your fresh demands What will you do on the expiration of these two months? So two questions if you can answer that very quickly It is not correct that we're acting against labor laws and The minister of labor himself has not drawn our attention To any specific labor law That has been violated In terms of paying our salaries, you know, we convinced our strike in february We had already worked for the salaries that we have already paid It is incumbent on you know, government to pay us because They are the ones who are first in this strike action on Nigeria's if government have moved up to its promises and its Uh Agreements with our union this strike Was certainly beyond necessary and the third question is to say that We all need to understand the role which education plays Uh in any society Indeed societies that are making progress the world over and those who are investing heavily You know in their education system and it is our hope and and wish That the nigerian government would also Understand this historic responsibility of education in any society and change this attitude to education especially tertiary education In nigeria. Thank you very much For your time Dela Shiro Is the chairman of the academic staff union of universities in the university of ligus Thank you very much for this opportunity to share my thoughts with you Where I did grateful for your concern in the development of education in Nigeria. Thank you. Thank you Well, still the breakfast and plus TV Africa a lot to talk about as far as education is concerned But we'll keep our eyes on this one. Of course, you can be sure the leaders right here on this station We have a break ahead where we return mercy. We'll be time for us to delve into the past sector. Stay with us