 So we're here in London at the Gemini PDA headquarters and who are you? I am Davide Guidi I'm a city of planet computers Welcome Nicholas to our planet computers labs. So what date are we today? 15 right 15 of March 2018 and How is it going with the mass production and the shipping and everything it's going it's going very well We have been extremely busy in the past Few weeks especially We got the first The first batch production out so the first thousand units and we and we managed to ship 1000 already almost yes almost a thousand out and how many more backers are left We have a total of 4200 plus units So we still have a long way to go but luckily Chinese New Year is now over So we will be able to ship and to manufacture into ship the device is very much much quickly right yes, so 1000 that's awesome. So that means I was checking your Twitter just before actually it's exploding with users and Doing all kinds of stuff and like right here. This is one of your posters It shows the the heat map of where the customers are there's a lot of a lot of guys a lot of guys and girls over here in Japan In Europe and Western US correct Australia. Yeah. Yeah a few a few yes It's it's really device that was missed really for a very long time And we find that a lot of people from all over the world really are interested in this device What are they doing right now? Because they got it for a few weeks some of them they they got them just now they're getting them So they they're running Android like that's your default thing right you have to enter it. Yes. Yes. So here we have several Examples some of them are final Production run some of them are prototypes and they run different operating systems here. So this is the This is the fourth one that is shipped to the backers for the moment which contains only Android and We are we provided Alternative firmware and a flash tool for the backer who wanted to Create a dual boot device. So all these are running Linux all kinds of different Linux over here Yes, this is Android and correct This is this is Android all the others are dual boot versions and they have been contributed by mainly by Open source communities and it was an effort led by Nikita Ukrenkov our Russian hackers who's this guy who? he's a he's actually a Russian student who got in touch with us and asking to help and We started working together He has some very specific deep knowledge about Linux and he helped us very much Having some different kind of flavors. We had internally a Debian version prepared But actually as you can see here, so what do we have here? What do you have? So this is Debian Debian right here. This is Debian. Correct. This is Yeah, this is Debian running Alex Qt Nice. I think it's called UI this is Ubuntu This is the Ubuntu version. What kind of Ubuntu is here? 17.10. That's kind of the latest It's one of the latest. Yes, and it's running the GNOME shell At the moment so this is a kind of mouse and this one. Yes. Connect to our USB-C mouse so you can go and click and Interact with the machine Yeah, I'm just gonna click in that corner there. All right, so you got Debian Ubuntu This is Sailfish Sailfish Jola Correct and is it smooth? It's it's actually quite smooth It's a quite It's very interesting because it's one, you know, we didn't we didn't spend too much time on it. But it's actually It's already a very good porting. So hardware is GPU acceleration We have we have pretty much most of the drivers working including 4G connection and telephony support You have 4G you have the mobile working the GPU accelerated. Yes, GPU acceleration 4G audio video Telephony support so we can we can place calls from Sailfish on this device and of course it's kind of every day. So We are gonna work more on that and provide even better support, but it's already It's already very very good Can you type something cool? Yeah, sure. This is a Linux machine so you can type things like top to check, you know, your processes and stuff Yeah Is this kind of like mind-blowing the awesome or what what's going on because this I don't see this very often Just one more. There's one more you. Yes. This is this is really experimental So this is a credit system called post-market ways and the only reason we have it is because well first because we can and secondly because It's you know people who own a Nokia and 900 like like myself in the past will be very nostalgic nostalgic to see this this this desktop Image because that was the the main one for all the memo me go and and and so on Operating system is an experimental version, but it's you know, it's it already works and it's quite interesting shows you The potential of this device so right now we just have five different in excess. Okay, the main Android You have these over there, but potentially what's happening right now the source code is everything outside Yes, so basically, you know since the beginning our idea was to so this device comes from actually a need We we really needed something like this a device You know kind of hacker dreams kind of little device you can bring with you which enhances your Your your Possibility of doing things right and this device is Is really interesting because we have not used to have anything like this anymore It's it's tazin it fits in your pocket. That's the main thing It's a device with a keyboard that fits in your pocket and since the beginning we wanted a really Flexible machine, so we wanted to create something open and for this reason we we already Announced that we are gonna open source two key parts of the of the product one is the kernel and the second part is a bootloader and We are gonna do this in the in the next few next few days or weeks And and the reason is we want to allow people that are not happy with Android or with the Linux version We provide to actually port pretty much whatever they want to this device So if you have the kernel if you have the bootloader you can pretty much do whatever you want with the device You can run chromium OS Maybe you could run the AOSP Android and tweak it whatever way you want The most important thing is you're free you're free to choose what you want And you are free if you have knowledge if you have the will you are free to port anything Mandrava Linux yes, why not and all these different flavors of Subuntu and let's say that the smaller the smaller kind of OS is maybe there's some some like some smaller variants of maybe what's called the Red Hat they have this open source OS is too and stuff. I mean everything here is open source, right? Yes, the other very yes a pattern Android the other one is all in a solo open source correct and How is it so smooth when you when you're in here How can it be using is it using the the binaries that are accelerating the GPU and everything? So technically this situation is the following so there is there is one library in particular equal lib hybris Which has been developed and it's a quite an amazing library because it allows Linux to reuse some functionality which are designed for Android basically that means that When Linux you know when Linux boot when the operating system is up and running there is a Linux container Which initialized some small Android bits and in particular the GPU acceleration The 4g connection and so on and basically exports this functionality down to Linux so our operating system like Yola like selfish can actually have GPU acceleration so have very very Fluid animations and it's very responsive because of this and hopefully this This trick so it's not it's not running on the Android kernel It's not There's not something I thought it was something like that But it's the Linux kernel that has all the Android binaries in some kind of layer That's correct because Android kernel in reality is a Linux kernel with some Android extra bits and what and basically what this library does is Exposing the hundred parts for Linux. So there is no Android driving here. It's just Linux There are just some drivers which are initialized in a kind of Android container and then provided to To Linux so right now I pushed you off button and if I just boot it up again What's gonna happen? Yes, it's a dual boot. So basically the the way we design it is If you boot up the unit normally it will boot up in Android But if you press the button, yeah, this is what's happening now So I just rebooted the unit and this should boot up in Android now But if I boot and at the same time I keep press this button It will actually boot into in this case selfish. You have a really cool boot up animation. Thank you All right, the planets around the planet. Yeah, so you can see planet and then powered by Android So as you would expect under it will now boot. Here it is With the longest battery life in London, I mean, I'm joking, but very long battery, right? 4250 or is it you see this is again, it's a device that has to be useful and If the device stops working half a day through then what do you do with it? Nothing? So we wanted a device that's you know, it's it's portable It's smallest light but also that you can rely on and we are quite happy at the end we managed to get 4200 milliampere hour battery and We think it's good enough for for most of the biggest in the market The shows we keep it running like eight to seven to eight hours Continuously with the screen continuously on and attach to an HDMI Or better usb-c to HDMI adapter and it runs for seven eight hours and is this the latest one this one Or is one of the earlier prototypes? Let me check this one. This is possibly no This is not the latest latest doesn't have any sticker on it. So let me just find it possibly is this one Yeah, this is the one they're getting the backers right now. You can see is the latest version so you can see It's it's it's basically the way that's been designed nice So when you have it closed they can still run different things and yes So if you look you have so you can see for the fully has two usb-c one per side So nobody else does this in one and the other side There is an extra button here, which is a kind of smart button and it's used on off. It's no It's not on off. It's used in different way When the machine runs Android if you just press it if you invoke the Android system so you can dictate some commands But you can use it when you are receiving a call you can use it to actually take the call or if you if you keep it pressed to to reject the call on the other side we have the Jack mini jack for the headphones and another usb-c port Nice to usb-c. I see a little light in the in the usb. Is it There's some this some that maybe the display is running is a boot to this one, right? Yeah, so Yeah, so all this power management. Yeah, all this power management stuff is gonna be eventually optimized because Once you make it open What would you like the community to do to optimize? The Linux here. What can they do? Because right now this trick is only for the selfish The Android speed up or is it available for the other Linux is you see we are still working on it very very much so We managed to to do already some of the work What really needs is a bit of love for you know polishing some rough edges basically but We in the latest days we managed to get Accelerated GPU also on Debian and you boom too We still miss a few drivers like for example the USB-C to HDMI But we hope to have them like very very quickly Is a it would be nice if you could do the the HDMI with a secondary display? I mean I even think the dream would be to have Android as a default on this display and then have one of the other Linux is on the other one, but that's a lot to ask right, you know, it's a There are so many things. It's a device that it's a it's a very important to different people in different ways and It's very difficult to do everything, but we need to start somewhere and I think we now have a kind of product a version one which is already very very interesting and From our side, we're just happy that the device can be tailored to different needs and and hopefully very soon we will see more and more operating systems running on it and And an improved software. So this is your cable right here. Yes We have a few accessories So this is the USB-C to HDMI cable which allows you to connect to a big monitor and It allows you to output full HD This is a USB-C hub and this is quite an interesting Thing for us because you see it. Yes, we can see it. We just open it for you Yeah, we don't But the ones you're gonna ship. No, no, okay, so And class is very interesting because okay, it has normal usb-c Sorry usb-a connectors, but it also has a internet port. Nice. Is it a gigabit? Um, no good question. Yeah, possibly. So there probably is gigabit Ethernet support, I guess on the soc, but these are blue. So they're usb-3. Uh, correct That's cool. And with another here you can use for charging the power delivery Um, there is a charging port is not yet enabled. So you cannot use it for charging and Connecting at the moment. Can you charge it on both? typesies No, the ports are slightly different. I'll explain On the on the left hand side port This one can be used for connecting to a pc. It can be used to charge the unit and it can be used to connect to a usb hub And the right hand side can be used to connect to a single usb peripherals like a mouse or a keyboard And can be used to connect the usb-c to hdmi cable Nice, so it's not for hub here only this one is not for the hub, correct But one one unit by one unit or the hdmi, correct Which is awesome, which is great And you have a very cool hdmi cable that doesn't have a converter and everything So so you're not doing a display port or something like that. It's like It's something out. It's a passive It's a passive cable so there are no components inside and it's just Routing basically the signal through Just getting the the type c out for an hdmi. It's totally awesome. This is the gold. Is it real gold? Yes, this yes, this is actually real gold This is golden. So this is just golden color and you can see the difference This is this is not gold. This is is actually real gold and and so and you have backers who ordered the real gold Yes, we decided to create only a very very limited number like 30 And we sold Almost all of them. Yes. Well, and this was $1,000 or how much for the gold one? Yes, I believe a thousand dollars. Yes. Nice. So they'll be very happy to have some gold in their pocket It's gonna be cool. Is yours gold? No, no, you're not a gold. No, no just using using all these you're you're doing all the What is it that you do? What do you do? Well, um, you know the team is quite small. So we do a bit of everything and Well, we just Personally, I'm just on a technical side. So anything related to You know software And and and many other things. We have just a small team. So we have to cover several roles actually and the bootloader definitely unlocked Yes, I mean we it's more than that. We will provide the source code so the the unit is Unlock in the sense that you can actually You can reflush it the different firmware, but we will provide the source code. So source code for the bootloader means that um It will enable people to do things which are which we are not currently allowed. For example, I don't know booting the unit on booting linux on an external sd card or even from a portable usb c stick So they're all like edge cases and if you have the bootloader you can really decide what to do And you can do more than dual boot. You could do triple Technically, you can do pretty much what you want and I hope somebody figures out how to do An android here the latest best the android. I think they're number p right now They're getting to p but whenever the software or eight would be cool. So have android right here and then On the external display And now the both at the same time somehow maybe somehow it will work. So hopefully Um, the guys at the media tech they're supporting you hopefully right and it's not just the open source or the open source community And uh, and you're a russian hacker and and you are hacker yourself, right? Well, we Yes, whatever whatever hacker means, but yes, we work with technologies. Um, yes, it's you know, it's always a trade-off It's very difficult to say To to to put a stop, you know in we we have a lot of ideas We receive a lot of suggestions for the backers and A lot of suggestions make sense It's just always a trade-off to Decide when to stop it to actually release a version rather than wait and make improve the product even more You have only 24 hours in a day, right? How many emails are you getting right now? Uh, well comments and everything a lot a lot. Yes Well, hopefully this uh, people are Not worried about the shipping or anything because they can see that lots of people are getting it right so Yes, yes, yes, we we we should already a lot of unites and uh, We started receiving a few a few comments a few reviews on the net It's quite it's quite. Yes. Some good reviews. Yes. It's quite encouraging. Um, mostly good, right? Um, yes, I would say mostly good. Yes, the only ones that are negative are the people that don't even have one They haven't tried it and they're like just don't understand why you would Release a pda in 2018, but I think pda is a future You see it's uh, I don't think it's a product for everybody and I think it's uh, You know it's a product for people that needs this kind of devices and You know, there is a philosophy behind it and it's uh And it's that there are devices for media consumption and there are devices for actually creating something and uh, we believe that, um You want me to yeah, sorry. Yeah, you believe that's what sorry and we believe that uh There are some kind of devices which are here to say like tablets which are perfectly um They're very well designed for consuming media like watching the movies or so But this kind of device is designed to be creative and to be um Yes, and to be productive on the move and you cannot do that with a tablet or with a phone You really need a device with a keyboard device that is designed for actually allowing you to to do stuff And it's actually really great to type just with your thumbs on it, right? It's like a much better than a blackberry This is the proper size keyboard like to do some thumb typing. Yes, it is. Uh, it can be used for thumb typing So if you can use it, uh, you know, if you're standing up Uh, and it works very well when you put it down because you need a very very small space You see this on very small mouse Bluetooth mouse is no point too, right? Yeah, and if you have a small if you have some space you can put it down and you can actually type Possibly with all the fingers if you can do that. Was this the latest? Which one was the latest? Sorry this one? Uh, I believe so. Yes. Yes. So let's go and uh, I'm gonna go in here I don't know this uh, that's not this is special office app, but um So yeah, it'd be interesting to see If it can be fully smooth fully hardware accelerated, this is running on the x27 which is, um, as far as I remember it's a It's not the deca core, right? It is a deca core. Yes. Deca core. It is a deca core device. Yes. So it has two It has 10 cores it has three clusters of of processors of cores and um And basically they're used, you know, it uses one processor or more based on the load. So in the worst case if a lot of If you're doing something very CPU intensive 10 cores would be used at the same time So is it 272 and 8 53 as far as I remember the the arm cortex and all that that stuff Actually, it's yeah from this one, right the technical specification. Yeah. Yes. It's a two a 72 four cortex a 53 and another four a 53 at a different And you have a t880 which is a pretty awesome GPU But even though the GPU is not open source yet still Hopefully all these banners in that trick. What do you call it already the the drivers? So the library is called lib hybris lib hybris. Who did that? Is it a new thing? It's uh, I'm I'm sorry. I don't remember the name of the of the guy, but it's actually yes one guy, which if I if I'm not wrong has been then hired by Other you won't or yola to develop because it's basically the library, which is at the basis of Of the yola sailfish and of what was even to touch Nice. So the library is open source and And that's what we have used isn't a big thing that That library is a big install or it'll it's it's a clever thing the library Does that have to be adjusted and adapted for each different linux distribution? Optimize for each one. One thing you have to do is you have to optimize all the short keyboard shortcuts, right? Hopefully there will be ways to get all these to work. Yes. It's yes. Yes, exactly so that's one of the thing and You know on the linux side things are slightly more complicated because for example when you have when you get All the key mapping right Then you have to be careful what window manager you're using because some like high like for example gnome shell Can recognize correctly all the shortcuts, but other window manager They might not have the same kind of power. So they don't have the same kind of functionality and some For example brightness up or down or volume up or down shortcuts Might not work. So we are still in that process of connecting all these little bits together to make to make To make the unit perfectly user friendly and on your website, there's a flashing tool that's required, right? Which is Right now runs on windows, but can you run on something else? Maybe or yes so the tool it's it's called sp flash tool and Yes, it runs at the moment only on windows It's it can be compiled for linux. So we are planning to to provide very soon a linux version This goes along the side again this kind of idea of having a Device that can be tailored to your needs So we decided to instead of forcing the user to have a dual boot device And to have one flavor of linux, which was our initial idea Since we discovered we can run more than one flavor. We decided to To give away a tool and some instructions. So a user that wants to Install a second operating system can do it And so in on our website at the moment, we have we have the drivers. We have the flash tool software and we have At the moment two kind of firmware one is the android original and the second one is the Is a dual boot linux debian and android technology preview We will We will have more firmware coming very soon Nice, so that's a it's kind of like mind blowing you doing all these things and you are just like an indiegogo project It's kind of awesome, right? Yeah, I mean we it's truly stable The keyboard the keyboard is the keyboard is important for us. So We try to have like like a very good keyboard is the keyboard is not Actually the cool device is completely useless So the keyboard is actually the most important things It's uh, it's easy to type. It's so can you type um, it's easy to type. That's you you write that So which which OS is this one? I don't know. I think we are inside Liberia office mask to create this is the debian, right? Yeah, let me just go to a text application because I don't know what we're doing there And I think I managed to restart the machine Oh, okay, so yeah, so the the linux stuff is uh, oops, it's a work in progress And this is this also the latest keyboard right this one I can Let's see if there's any kind of like text editor or something Yep There was no spelling mistakes at all Perfect You used it, right? You you the you may be the guy in the world that's been using it the most Uh keyboard Post I'm not sure actually, uh, it's is true that since um, probably a month. I'm using it as a my my main device Uh, but I had a previous generation of keyboard, which is not as good as the one that the backers had and You know the one that we released the backers actually very very good We're very happy with it. Um It just tell one or two stories about what we're seeing on twitter happening right now that japan stuff. What's happening? What are people doing? You know we have been we have been It's quite interesting because There were people really missing this format So there were people used to have, um devices like the palm like, uh, the sion or the nokia communicator And we you know, we received email very Very interesting emails of people telling us. I don't know one guy was telling us Oh, well guys every couple of years. I'm using google to search for, uh, nokia communicators Like devices and every two years. I'm disappointed this time. I found you. Oh, how amazing. I'm going to back your project immediately right and these are kind of, um You know, it's it's very interesting is is a device that fits a need And there are lots of people that need a device where they can type and they can be productive Wherever they whatever they go And why they're so happy with it in japan? Uh, that's a very good question. I think number one market, you know, you know, it's it's a country where they they they're really They're really into gadgets and they're really into this kind of devices, especially typing devices Maybe for japanese language a touchscreen is Is it it's much more important for them to have a proper keyboard? Maybe i don't know how it works Probably or probably just they see, you know, they understand the fact that You know with the device like this, you can actually be productive on the go You know, you can do things like, you know, you could do everything on a mobile phone if you want to But you can't really do easily. I don't know things like doing a spreadsheet Because it's just a touchscreen. It's very complicated. But with a with a keyboard becomes actually very very different Proposition and it totally works on the japanese cdma and on the american cdma and on the gsm networks Is one device for the world? Yes, I mean we we support a number of we support both cdma and lte And we try to support as many uh bands as possible. Uh, the bands are actually Here these are the lte bands that we support It's a device that can be used worldwide. Uh, we don't support all the bands available in the world I don't know if there is a phone that supports everything in a single version but we try to do our best and Definitely can be used pretty much everywhere Dual sim hardware dual sim, right? Um, so we have one sim, which is a normal Sim slot so you can put a micro sd. We have support for Something called a new sim, which is an embedded sim And that is a kind of chip and it will be used in the future to do Like very interesting things like downloading a mobile phone number directly into the chip so Basically removing the need of a sim the plastic actually sim Maybe you get into a new country and boom you can choose your carrier. It just loads it in maybe Oh, yes, I mean it will open up a lot of possibilities. So you can imagine, uh, you know downloading You know going to another country and just downloading a phone number So you don't have to go to a shop and you could do everything Literally online and I imagine this, uh Multiple hundred megabit per second LTE already right is So maybe you can get the fastest LTE in any country you get to you want if the band is supported. Yes. Yes cool So that's that's cool. And this is just uh, march 15th and what's next what's gonna happen next week? What's happening the week after what's happening right now? Uh, right now we are well right now We are you know the hardware is done. So right now we are trying to improve to improve the software so I can tell you that we had some applications that we That you're already providing a device and for example the You know the sort of application bar So when you press the the planet button, there is this application bar that pops up and is customizable So you can put your own Yes, yes, and you can put your own applications there. So you can access them On planet you have things like the planet support. So you go immediately to our website and planet store You just click you can buy 10 more devices. What do you do in planet store? We will be able to. Yes. Yeah very soon And so it's basically this is just you know, just to keep in touch with us and a planet support Redirection immediately to the support website. You get the latest news. You can check you have a travel shooting If you have some issues, you can you can get information about the forum Yes, we do have a forum For developers mainly it's a developer Dot planet com go dot uk. This is the forum Nice There's also an xda forum xda developers. They have a category for you. Yes, apparently. Yes has been announced very I think yesterday. Hopefully some of these Awesome hackers like get interested and start doing crazy stuff They yes, yes, I mean this is you know, it's it's a device designed for this. So hopefully yes Hopefully you've made it so there's no way it's gonna break Right, no matter what people do It's it's quite difficult because of the way the media tech chipset is designed Even if the operating system doesn't boot Just by connecting the device to a pc The device will enter in a kind of So-called fast boot mode And that means that it can You know a new firmware can be flush straight away. So there's not too too much. Hopefully of a risk in that direction and um, what's called uh The the it I mean with the use that you've done over the past the recent parts. This like is very stable doesn't get too hot It's like, uh, yeah, it's correct. It doesn't disconnect like that. Yeah, you must have some bugs. No, what what bugs? um You know, so that's the most important thing is that it's it's a very stable, uh device Um, we usually on android at least we never experience our crash, let's say um We have we still have to provide more support for some applications So as I was saying we started for the app bar, but we have other applications, uh, which we are working on like the calendar Um, some they're they're like a subset of very important application, which we are optimizing for this, uh For this format. How does the window work? The market window work. You just press this button Okay, we got an app which doesn't support that Let me try this. Okay, and you can just uh, so that's That's already the best multi-window system. This is just provided by android and uh, yeah, it's uh It's pretty much, uh, which is awesome to have this on the on the horizontal display It's uh, yeah, it's it's it's very good because, uh, the display is actually, uh 18 by 9 so at 2.2 per one. So it's actually two time, um You know x and one y so you can easily have two application Nice one goes to the other Nice, cool. So all these uh users, hopefully they can send you a summary because you're very busy, but it would be great if you somehow they should Put all their feature request suggestions and just put them in all the Absolutely blog I tweeted Put a new forum send emails. Yes, and we are very happy to receive comments and suggestions Uh, as our team is not that big we cannot follow everything, but we definitely, um Read all the comments all the suggestions that that they are sent to us And uh, and hopefully with the right time we will uh, we will act on that. Yes And maybe uh, maybe you are successful. I hope that you can hire right you are Yes, we're actually in the process of hiring a few uh, a few people uh, because of the Yes, because it's it's going very well and uh We are now On the point in which we have a lot of work for ourselves and we need to we need to have more people Maybe developers, right? Maybe uh, some other people definitely customer support So support and uh, different developers as well At least one of two. So if you have any interest, please get in touch with us And let us know so you can look at the camera. You can say if you love linux if you know how to make the best linux on arm Absolutely, let's work together Linux systems androids if you like technology If you like to work in a company who does things a bit differently In london in london or it doesn't have to be in london, right? But you have a space maybe we in the office. Yes, we will have some space in the office We need to we need to work closely now Cool get get uh, super smooth super stable and indiegogo, of course, is awesome But hopefully the next level is like, uh, I don't know, uh, huge something huge. We'll see. We'll see. Cool