 Hi, this is Hosepin Parthian. Welcome to a special edition of Tier 4 Let's Talk here at KubeCon here in Netherlands. And today we have with us once again, Roy Devon, CUN co-founder of Finaud. Roy is great to have you on the show. Thank you Swap so much for having me. Good to be on the show in person. Yeah, it's KubeCon. So tell us a bit about your experience at the show. Yeah, so KubeCon is always an amazing show and I think now it's in Amsterdam and the event sold out like a month ago. So it's amazing to see like a 10,000 in-person attendees, you know, the places is swamped, people are working and like in-person shows are, I think, finally back to break over there. The topic of this month is mostly about, you know, cloud complexity. And when it comes to complexity, cost becomes a very big factor. When you're here at the event, how much discussion are you hearing about the cloud cost because also companies are becoming more and more cost efficient and cost sensitive? Yeah, so cost management is, you know, it's one of the biggest topics, you know, on the planet at the moment like 2023 is a rough year for everyone. And lots of companies are now in focus to save money, to be more efficient, to, you know, it's okay to continue to grow at all costs, but like as long as you have a viable motion behind us since you had to do that. So we started to see like more and more companies starts to ask us questions about, you know, the financial availability and how we can translate the Kubernetes cost into something that is more actionable and how we can get cost saving recommendations and how we can allocate the cost and how we can understand our profitability. And, you know, Kubernetes just brings a new set of complexity into those existing problems. So the cloud providers is charging us by the instance, but we're actually running pods. So we need to do that, that translation and Kubernetes gets lots of great stuff, you know, into the picture, but also a significant level of complexity and overhead. So we start to see, you know, Kubernetes cost us, it's a huge, huge stuff in that keep you on. Right. Can you talk about what are the factors that kind of make it harder, you know, when it comes to Kubernetes cost, hard to manage? Kubernetes is essentially another level of obstruction on top of our cloud, right? So the cloud provider doesn't know that we're running Kubernetes, even if we're running, you know, EKS or those kinds of services, they're still not actively managed the Kubernetes environment. And when we're talking about resources, so what's native to the cloud providers is the instances, storage network, you know, these are the billing factors that they know how to charge us. But when I'm running Kubernetes, I'm using partial of, you know, using those resources partially for each pod that I'm running on the cluster. So now we need to like isolate a specific pod and understand like what's its consumption directly out of the resources that the host can provide and allocate, you know, the proportional section directly to the host. But then start to get more complicated because what if the container is requesting more resources than what it's actually used? So how do you allocate it and what do you deal with all, you know, resources that were never allocated to any pod that is just wasted on the cluster? So there's a bunch of calculations that constantly need to happen on Kubernetes cluster in order to, you know, to deviate the cost to the pods. And this like adds a significant level of complexity. Now, when we talk about this Kubernetes complexity and cloud, talk a bit about what role is Finaud playing, you know, how you folks are kind of, you know, helping organizations with taming their cloud cost. It's very common to see companies running on multi-cloud and multi-services and multi-whatever, right? As long as we can pay money for it, we usually are. And Kubernetes is, you know, as you mentioned, a commodity layer between different clouds. So we can help companies analyze their entire cloud spend across all cloud providers, but also like third-party solutions like Datalog and Snowflake and Databricks and those kinds of very expensive kind of software. And we can help them, you know, break down this cost into Kubernetes resources and then allocate it, you know, to what's the price per team? What's the price per whatever, you know, business unit of feature or product that we're running? We can help them create budgets and anomalies and track down, you know, cost and cost savings on the business side of things and not only the technology one. Then we can help companies, you know, and this is something that we just announced that is also supported in Kubernetes. We call it cost governance within Finaud. So it doesn't matter like if we're running a Kubernetes pod or we're running a EC2 instance. We can use all Finaud capabilities as if Kubernetes was, you know, originated directly from the cloud provider. So cost anomalies and budgets and cost allocations are all supporting Kubernetes as well. And our cost optimizations, we call cost guard also now can optimize Kubernetes environments. So we talked about it before and the distance between the requested resources and the actual usage of each resource. We can identify that gap and actually put a dollar sign on it. So, you know, just change from two gigs of RAM to one gigs of RAM because you're never using more than one. I can save you, you know, that amount of money per month and then you can take, you know, active optimizations decisions based on that. And again, it's multi-cloud and multi-environment and multi-everything. So Kubernetes and namespace can be spun across like three different clouds, but you don't really care you're running that kind of abstraction, right? So with Finaud, it's very native and very integrated into the solution. And every single feature that we have in Finaud is also supporting Kubernetes at the moment. As you said earlier, that cost is becoming a very, you know, important topic. How much discussion are you seeing here about, you know, when you talk to, when you forth come to your booth or when you walk around, where you feel that, hey, yes, people are talking about cost, you know, efficiency. They are looking for solutions or they do know, hey, solutions are there and they're in the phase of how to successfully implement there. So when it comes to cloud cost or cost, you know, where are we today? So I think, you know, lots of companies are in 2021 and, you know, early 2022, no one cared about cost, right? So everyone, we're building a cost management solution and people are like, yeah, but, you know, we can spend more money on cloud that won't care. I think the reality changed. So every company is starting to look at cost management. And people, we see people like walking towards our booth and then like coming back, oh, okay, Kubernetes cost. Like it's one of, it's a might-to-do list for this convention. Like I want to learn on cost management vendors. So I think, you know, it's a very big, very big topic, especially, you know, in this, in this KubeCon and in this economy. And it's something that companies can no longer, you know, overlook and just hope for the best to start to need to deal with, with reality and to deal with what's happening. And Fianna, it is perfectly positioned to help with that. Right. Thank you so much for taking time out today and talk about, of course, the new announcement and the cost efficiency. Thanks for your insight. We'll see you again once again remotely. Yeah, thank you, Swap. Always a pleasure.