 All right, well, we'll go ahead and get started as it appears to be about the appointed hour Good afternoon ladies and gentlemen and welcome to the final panel Discussion of the day sea lift special. Thanks to LMI for sponsoring this very important topic Thank you shipmate My name is Buzz Buzbee I'm the happen to be the president of the National Defense Transportation Association Former commander of military sea lift command and in general lover of ships and sailors who sail them We have assembled here this afternoon The principal government stakeholders who figure prominently in the sea lift equation And as you can see, it's not just a Navy thing There are a lot of moving parts across the joint force and a significant role played by a commercial industry in our sea lift Capacity and that's just on a normal day That in the budget challenges faced by the government the economic challenges faced by commercial ship operators and the growing potential that the next large sea lift operation will take place in a contested environment Not just the benign environment. We saw during desert shield desert storm Well, now you're talking about an issue that gets to the top of the pile of a lot of people's desks our mission today is to help you understand that we need to have a fundamentally Fundamentally different discussion about sea lift and we've maybe had in the last ten years or so It's probably one of the least understood parts of the defense transportation system But it is the key enabler To moving our nation's combat power forward and then sustaining it We have a lot to think about and a lot to discuss But we have the right folks here to do just that. We'll hear about their requirements We'll hear about the assets and we'll hear about future plans And then we're going to want to hear about you About our panelists after they conclude their presentations I'll note that we are one panelist short up here general McDew was to be here today and Literally just moments ago. I got called away for a matter of state that Was obviously pretty important because I know he wanted to be here and wanted very much to talk about sea lift See he's very passionate about it. Those of you there at the luncheon today heard him discuss it He he has made it his number one priority Which is pretty amazing for a trans transcom commander as far as I know was the first time that's ever occurred So he's he gets see left and is very sorry that he could not be here and sends his Sends his apologies However, we do have somebody who can fill in and speak to the area that he was going to speak to which was primarily the sea lift requirement and That is a panelist that was going to be here anyway, and he's now going to be doing double-duty And that is a one. Mr. Scott delisio who heads up the strategic mobility and combat logistics division better known as up nav N42 Mr. Delisio was appointed to the senior executive service in December of 2006 and has 25 years of federal service He's responsible for providing sea lift and combat logistics planning programming and policy guidance to the deputy chief of naval operations Fleet readiness and logistics and for to the deputy assistant secretary of the Navy RDA ships and to the director of for logistics joint chiefs of staff for a fleet of over 100 ships for those of you who still not May not have a good sight picture about What Scott does just think of him as the young John Caskin There's the old John Caskin for for comparison sake As a platform sponsor N42 is responsible for planning and setting policy for our Navy's Strategic sea lift and combat logistic forces for the next 30 to 50 years They also provide subject matter experts for all sea lift and mobility issues studies that go on throughout the Navy So with that, please join me in welcoming mr. Scott delisio By the way, I've never ever called you the old John Caskin Matter of fact, there's a lot of things that you told me that I am living the dream right now. So can you guys hear me? Okay? So if general McDo we're here He would tell you we need more sea lift He would also tell you that we need new sea lift He's He and I suffer a very same fate and it's going to be very difficult for me to do his part in my part because that makes me a little schizophrenic because As you know resourcing is not always making the co-com happy But we have definitely forged a partnership Transcom is able to play at a level of detail that they they find painful, but they enjoy and My partners here are going to talk to you about the results of what we're able to do together So general McDo wants to move as much of the force as he can whenever he needs to Very simple requirement sounds like it except the force is massive and our force Is not necessarily big enough to move it all in one shot Then you add a few other neat features like getting shot at cyber attacks Ways of the world that most of you see in your every day life somebody hacks your account Just imagine if your account was an engineering plant on a ship So very important things going on The general's question is what are you doing to mitigate the risk? So let me start with resourcing variables And I closed my notes because it's gonna be tough to be general McDo with my notes Age of a vessel is a variable and our force is getting fairly old The type of vessel is a variable. We don't have all the same type So when you see warships, you know, we try to get close to the same type as much as we can We don't have that luxury when it comes to auxiliaries and seal it ships We have some but for the most part we have a lot of configuration periphery proliferations. Excuse me If parts needs they're different on almost every ship because of age because of wear and emergent capability that we have We have ships all over the world We have mall over the United States all over the world, which means different capabilities for repair And yet they all have to be ready. They all have to locate They all have to load and in the case of the auxiliaries there on the pointy end They have to win in order to bring the heavy load in for sea lift So you get sea lift ships are around 60 plus ships in my portfolio. I've got over 160 ships total And that is not my phone So back to general McDo I Want to move it. I want to move it as fast as I can I want to go heavy and I want to take as much as I can Over to you resource sponsor. What are you going to do? Well, if you went to the last panel, I thought one of the speakers had an interesting Comment he said we're in an age where we manage what's left And it just so happens that right now I have to keep everything we have pinpoint ready because it is what we have left it's a large force and Somebody's gonna ask me. Well, and it's time to recapitalize isn't it? Yes, it is and So with the general he I'm sure he would have probably outed me at lunch But with the general we we are starting to work a comprehensive plan to figure out how to rebuild sea lift And so some of you have a vision of what that might be Because if you have maybe some knowledge of what a sea lift ship looks like What we're going to build is the sea lift ship for 30 years from now Not today's sea lift ship. So it has capabilities and it has Let's just call it quirks about it that you don't see today that make it more capable For the 30 years we have to go forward So now let's get back to resourcing The force we have is required. I can't let it go and it has to be ready so age of the ship the type of ship and Those things that we need to do to keep that ship ready, and I'm sure you folks will talk about that a little bit about What it's that hard it is to do on a constrained budget But the budget is constrained over a hundred and sixty ships not just sixty and the hundred and sixty ships is constrained because it competes with every warship in the planet and So the question now is how do we build a comprehensive program to rebuild sea lift? and that's what the partners and I with general McDew's Influence are going to have to do over the next year We're going to have to put our program on the table and over the next year We'll have to figure out how to get resourced So now what's the important piece? Keeping the current force ready to go We have a budget in place right now that does that You'll see a little bit of an increase in the budget for currency lift vessels and auxiliaries for that matter So we're starting to make sure that material condition doesn't drive us to a ship that we cannot activate These folks on either side of me will get a chance to activate more often to prove that their ships actually are ready to go because we are Entering into a sense of urgency that's a little higher than we're used to so Then you say well, how much do sea lift ships cost? Well, I'm going to walk you through a list of things And you probably didn't think about this but sea lift as a resource everybody thinks ships So we talked about age of the ship We now have dry dock results. We've got to pay attention to We have certification partners that are under fire ABS Coast Guard these are our partners that keep our ship ships certified and safe and ready to go to sea So if they're pressurized, we're pressurized It'd be a hell of a thing for me not to be able to have a ship sail because the certification agent had been cut to the point Of not having us as a priority pretty important stuff Schedules schedules top everything if the ship needs to be put in a dry dock Then it goes if it needs to be put out on a mission the question is which one takes precedence Right now the dry dock does in the future. We may not be so kind to our ships and we may have to go cash flow and timing I can tell you all about resourcing at the Pentagon. All I need to do is burst into tears for about 10 solid minutes And you pretty much have the picture ship support engineering talent engineering spare parts Repair and maintenance capabilities, and I'm talking not just in the office. I'm talking about in the shipyards all over the world tooling test equipment Training Exercises and activations have to rise because right now our results are not where we want them to be So we're going to have to exercise more Does anybody know what the difference between fully operational and reserve means? So fully operational means you're out there every single day for deployed We have ships that run with the strike groups in the args and they fortify those War fighting capabilities pointy end no kidding getting shot at and we do it with merchant mariners every single day I Have command ships that are hybrid crude. I have submarine tenders that are hybrid crude So that means that not only is the uniformed fighter there, but the hybrid merchant mariner is there as well Same heat then we talk about location So the mariner wants to know where am I going? How long am I gonna be there? Is there any industrial support where I'm going? It's the water deep enough big ships Can I get everything I need? Do I have to get my parts through customs? And stuff today that does that's almost for under our DNA if you're fighting a war you're like, okay I think I'm gonna clear customs pretty easily Maybe not so much if the country you're working with isn't participating things are a little strange today and Those things cause resource problems and variables So general McDews says hey, that's great. I got it. You're gonna have to figure that out and The next class of ships is gonna be needed and needed soon John you and I've talked about shipbuilding quick got to do it soon We also got to keep our mariners our mariner health is important or we won't have anybody to man the ships when we build them So if you got a chance to listen to the last panel There's some pretty There's some pretty dire pieces of information in there that you should pay attention to if you didn't get to go You ought to go back and look at the slides Because we continue to admire the problem We haven't solved it and So now it's time to solve the problem where we won't have a sea lift capability because the mariners won't come anybody worried about port costs Canal passage that's kind of sporty when you have a really big ship full of a war fighting machine We got to pay attention to it worldwide concerns no warning activations and Trapped the task to bring the fight. I don't think everybody realizes sea lift brings the fight heavy so the resource that I'm talking to you about today and I've spent almost no time on it in the Almost five years. I've been in the seat is this these are not even ships. I'm talking about I'm talking about the people of the maritime administration and I'm talking about the people the military seal of command and And then I'm talking about the user community that I think Nance is gonna help us with a little bit Those are the resources that I'm trying to keep alive and We don't keep them alive. I don't have ships anymore So I think general McDew would tell you By the way, if I'm sitting in for him, I understand I was great at lunch But he's a he's a good friend, he's very concerned He's an avid supporter of this and I know because he spends a lot of time yelling at me to get the resources Protected and up so that we can do our job And I know if I need to help he'll come and give it to me and the folks around me and buzz I think I'll hold it at that Right. Thank you Scott appreciate the remarks and now some some hope there hopefully for the future of Of our March of Marine and recapitalizing perhaps you're about a little bit more about that later Our next panelist is a general McDew's bar time component commander. He also happens to be the Navy commander of military seal of command He owns assets. He's gonna talk about those things that Scott was just talking about Rear Admiral D. Mcmuborn is a 1982 Naval Academy graduate and has commanded an air squadron Three aircraft carriers and amphibious ship two carrier strike groups and enable service training command He knows a little bit about ships even as for an aviator He took command of MSC in August of 2016. Please join me in welcoming Rear Admiral D. Muborn Thanks Buzz and thank you all, you know, I came with a thesis That is that I'm sea lift is integral to national security and I would start, you know, sort of developing that thesis by Taking us back to World War two and a battle that We call now the battle of the Atlantic not really, you know a battle in the classic sense And then it wasn't fought over a single place in a single period You know in days or weeks, but really measured in years, you know from 1939 to 1945 and spanned the entire Atlantic Ocean and it was really You know a battle against our wills I would say our will our will to to move supplies and goods in order to to Reinforce the war in Europe and of course the Nazi will to prevent that and and and we kind of know the outcome of it I think that Winston Churchill he observed in his memoir that the battle of the Atlantic was a dominating factor all through the war And and so, you know, we started with about 1340 ships is what the stats are that I looked up and when the war ended we had a merchant fleet that was These impressions that he left me now as I walk the north of waterfront are very powerful And especially in the job that I'm in now is I think about that same Atlantic Ocean and what the future may hold For the mariners, right the very mariners that work for MSc I guess it really it gives me a sense of duty and obligation that maybe I That is quite honed by his service. I I also, you know as was mentioned I had the opportunity to command three aircraft carriers one of which was the Dwight D. Eisenhower and in that tour I learned this quote from Ike that I thought was something again that is it means a lot to me He said that history does not long and trust the care of the freedom to the weak or the timid You've heard the quote I'm sure and again It's something that resonates and that you also have heard that if you seek peace prepare for war And so I carry those two things in it and the images of my dad with me as I've come into the job here at MSc and putting it all together then the obligation to protect the mariners of the future if there is a battle of the Atlantic too and making sure that if we do seek peace that we're preparing for war and That history does not entrust the cure of freedom to people who are weak or timid and that is that I can't afford to be Weak or timid right because I do feel like that. It's my time at least in sharing with all of you in this room And and we're entrusted with the cure of freedom MSc is a fantastic organization. It has a global mission. We empower global warfighting capability We support the joint warfighter anywhere in the world across the full spectrum of operations We provide assured on-time logistics 24 7365 and I think that the the mission of MSc is Represented at least in me to me by this image is over on the left-hand side It's an image that I created when I when I first got to MSc I'm a very visual learner and and so for me to have an image that kind of represents a Lot of elements is something that that I find kind of powerful So we created something that that would help me tell the story of what I saw as my vision for MSc During my tenure if you would allow me just to kind of describe this picture as I see it metaphorically You know the picture first of all I would say it it is a picture not a painting Of one of our CLEF ships as she was I think it was taken maybe even from the ship of one of our coalition partners I'm told but the ship is what it represents to me is obviously a ship that that's it, you know mighty It's in great shape, you know, and it sort of represents You know readiness and the need to preserve that readiness that wholeness And also, I know you you can't see them But if you could zoom in you would see all these mariners right men and women of conviction Who have given some portion of their life to the service of their country and something that they believe is greater than them some calling and And it and those people those young mariners those mariners old and young are out there, you know Doing what we asked them to do very professionally, right assured logistics anywhere in the world And then the other thing it represents to me is as you can see the Seas are boiling they so obviously there's there there is something about The system that they're in of you know that that there is a challenge, you know to the seas That that ship is in right now and and what I would ask you to do is is if you can Imagine with me that that you could you know zoom out a little bit and my question to you You know given the state of the world and that this is sort of a metaphorical representation of MSc where is the storm and To me this the storm is actually to the right-hand side off the bow of the ship that the ship is sailing into the storm and And that's represented sort of by representing the challenges that the ship or that MSc faces the industry faces today The first of which I think is mentioned a lot It was mentioned by General McDew and Scott just now and and even buzz in the opening and that is that you know We are sailing in contested waters The debate whether we will ever sail in contested waters again or something is I think over With if nothing more than what happened with the swift and the Strait of Bobham and Deb and the fact today You know that that we have put out advisories to the mariners that are sailing those waters And then of course, you know, there's things that are we're still seeing piracy off Somalia you say that and and then you have the rise Of near piers or piers in the Pacific or Putinism or expansionism Things the resurgence in Russia as well as the challenges that we're seeing in cyberspace And then on top of that we add challenges You know whether it's the budget or the health of our mirror force the world economy and the list goes on and the seas in which that we operate I think then Getting more contested or they're more challenged than ever before I Produced a strategy when I got to MSc It was called the voyage plan and it's as its name implies it is a it is a top-level document about where we are And where we're going I invite you can google it or whatever you can find it online or on our website and And it basically describes what I think where MSc is going over my tenure and in there I put I listed what I called the four pillars That those tenants or those elements on which the entire organization I think rests each and every day It's our people our platforms our processes and partners and I think that the first three are pretty self-explanatory That we couldn't do what we do without them. It's the fourth P the partners. It's why I'm here today I'm here because of you the partners that we have Whether you represent, you know, the shipbuilding industry or repair Maritime unions operating companies the maritime schools laboratories analysts think tanks advocacy groups federal state local government agencies all of you partner with MSc to Sure that we can do what it is Trying to that we do around the world with assured maritime logistics So I need your help. We need your help in solving these complex challenges that face MSc For example, if you represent maritime unions, the question might be how do you train Mariners to be ready to operate in a contested environment? If you're a shipbuilder, maybe how do you build a platform that's ready to last for 30 years and survive in combat? If you're a ship repair industry, you know, how can you improve your ability to get ships out of your yard on time? Right because we are getting more and more demand If you're an industry and what innovation? Can you that will that will come from you to help MSc meet its global mission? If you're in the military, the question might be how do you incorporate seaborne logistics into planning and experimentation? Right and wargaming with realistic maritime logistic factors such as attrition How do we harden our cyber interfaces, especially with industry? And how do we do this great collaboration and information sharing while still keeping operation security at the forefront? The bottom line is that there's a lot of questions for all of us and I tell you what if you've got ideas I have time to listen The motto at the bottom is United we sail and I created that Because I think that it had a couple of you know, it's short and sweet and I can remember it But it it has elements in it that matter a lot to me my tenure really and is all about unification unity of focus and unity of effort and Acting I believe that if we act as one with a clear and a shared vision of our in-state and perform as a championship team We will not fail Ready relevant and resolute United we sail United includes you Thank you. I look forward to your questions and I have a team here from MSc if there's really hard ones I'll have to phone a friend, but thank you for your attention Thank you, Admiral Our next panelist is the other government sea lift owner Mr. Kevin Takarski is the US Maritime Administration Associate Administrator for strategic sea lift He is a 1984 graduate of Fort Schuyler Holds a US Coast Guard license and was selected to serve in the senior executive service in 2008 As associate administrator his responsibilities include government-owned capabilities in the Redder Reserve Force and the National Defense Reserve fleet cargo and commercial sea lift capabilities in the Maritime Security Program and through cargo preference programs He also deals in emergency preparedness and response ship disposal Supporting the nation's seven Maritime academies and workforce development You support civil military planning for the North Atlantic Treaty Organization as chairman of the transport group for ocean shipping Please join me in welcoming Mr. Kevin Takarski. Thanks Thank you very much and thank all of the the audience here for Participating and sitting in on this late on a Tuesday afternoon. I think we're standing between you and a reception But but I really do appreciate this is a bit of a homecoming I think for us in the sea lift community to have you here with us as a Admiral buzz you mentioned my role in the Maritime Administration in the Department of Transportation About 75% of our work is really to make sure that we've got a sea lift capability To be able to support the nation and so when I say that I mean federal ships as part of that portfolio The commercial industry and maritime education and training to include the support to Seven Maritime academies as well as our industry training schools with that You know thought I was gonna have Admiral or excuse me General be due here. I was gonna kind of be sitting between a guy who's got a resource requirement or resource Control if you will as well the guy who has a requirement that's pretty high And that's oftentimes the balance that we're having in the sea lift portfolio It changes in the evolving nature of our business Because we'll never have everything that we need whether it's funding or the modern ships and the capabilities that we have So we strive with the resources that we have which includes the people and the ships to be able to maintain That nation's a portfolio So I was thinking this is 2017 it's been 40 years actually When the nation decided that we needed to have a surge sea lift capability And so it was the Department of the Navy there's no transcom then there's Department of the Navy and The maritime administration that came together and said we need to take some ships That are coming out of the commercial industry that no longer have the kind of capabilities They saw a decline in the commercial flag fleet and to be able to set those aside and park them in our reserve fleets And we're going to maintain them in a higher state of readiness We're going to maintain them where we never activate them We don't have any crews on board, but yet we'll have been five-day readiness So we got tested in Desert Shield and Desert Storm. We did okay Not as good as we wanted But we drastically and I'll say revolutionized what we did with sea lift from Desert Shield and Desert Storm So if that's what you think of and what you remember from sea lift, that's not what it is today It's dramatically different in terms of the investment that we've done and how we maintain that portfolio But it's interesting when you go back and you go back a little bit farther in history and the Spanish-American War And what happened that we didn't have a sea lift industry to be able to call from And we had we struggled with being able to support our forces deployed overseas So Congress said we need to change that a little bit And so actually when they started the implementation of moving government cargo on Commercial vessels to try to retain a capability within the commercial fleet. So when I look at sea lift You can tell me my my my dialect I'm looking at commercial and federal that have to work together and we've got to support both together So I've got a role in DOT that works on supporting that and that does include Trying to sustain the fleet both with a cargo and as well as with the direct stipend payments for that So the RF's been been going been around for for 40 years And my my colleagues and I are working to extend it So that we've got ships in our fleet that are going to be around for about 55 to 60 years And while the vessels generally we've acquired them and the model was that we acquired ships that were used but good They had Still some unique capabilities with them. We invested a little bit in them But the big thing that we did and that we changed after the first Gulf War is we put mariners on board those ships mostly engineers Now the deck II recognize that we're kind of in a maintenance mode For for these sea lift assets and that really has that's the readiness enabler Is those individuals that are part of our crew on board those ships today now? I got a challenge with them too because they cost money and Mike my cost and the balance of the program is how we we right size the right positions on board the ship to maintain that Within the resources that we have to be able to pay for dry dockings and as we're seeing our our cost to are going up significantly In the industrial base just to maintain these assets with that With that capability Let's go to the next slide, please So we as I mentioned we look at the the ships that are in the US flag trade And the the industrial bit our US flag base the 81 ships that are an international trade if you're in the last panel I'm not going to repeat all that but 97 ships also large ships that are in the Jones Act trade And why do we count those ships? Particularly we count them because we're looking at the mariner base that that we're going to draw from when we activate these ships When I need 1900 mariners in four days I've got to find people on the beach and that beach Comprises of those mariners that that are in vacation relief that are coming off of sailing on those roughly 200 ships So we large vessels meaning they're holding the credentials to be able to meet our baseline needs You heard General McDew talk about that at lunch today. We are we are on the edge We are on the edge of having enough for the mariners for that So tied to that one of the programs that we do and supporting the maritime security program So I support 60 ships in international trade to sail under that flag Now there's about 11 others that do it too because they're able to to find some cargo and to continue working But that that that size has continued to to decrease and we lost 20% of that fleet US flag fleet just in the last five years alone, so we're working on strengthening the MSP We want and we've asked to Congress for full authors or full Appropriation to the full authorized level of the MSP program, but I know we had to talk with General McDew In our leadership in the agency. I'm really focused on what's MSP 4.0 going to be The program that we've been doing for an essence the last 30 years I'm not sure that's going to meet the needs going forward into the future I'm not sure it's going to be as flexible to the desires of transcom For the types of ships and the ability to be able to adapt that fleet On short notice, so we're already thinking ahead of 2025 because it's going to take us that much time to be able to figure out What is the next solution for retaining our US flag commercial fleet? So that's available to be able to meet DOD's needs And then I'm also going to be able to have it sized large enough so I can get enough mariners for the fleet for that I think that on this slide I would ask you a question on that. Do you think that matters? Do you think that matters as a maritime nation? That when we sit in the international realm we're representing 81 ships in the international community against the 50,000 flag vessels that are out there. I think it matters Not all you get to see power in that but also tell you I think it matters from a sense of having a low-cost flag presence Where we don't have to send a greyhawk and if we had more flagships that were flying and moving in the South China Sea And having a greater presence That's American presence in those areas where we don't have to To send navy-grey hull ships to be able to exercise freedom of navigation I think I think it matters quite a bit for economic security International security and as well as our national security Next slide So we've talked about about looking at our mariners and where they come from in our commercial fleet I'll tell you we're on we're on yellow and a stoplight chart flashing into red zone right now With with the the available pool. We're looking at how we're going to be able to meet our mariner requirements We're broadening our aperture. We're looking at the strategic sea lift officers So this is a pool of graduates from our maritime academies that have a service obligation most of them Stay current with their license for about eight years and then they get out of the reserve program But it is a pool. It's a pool mostly of entry-level officers But there are some in there and a fair number of them are already counted in our pool of the Actively sailing there, but we want to look at that and see how we can make sure that we can tailor that and we tailor them for the Sea lift community if you can move to the next slide There you go. Thank you. It fits with the the visual on talking about mariners And know that is not General McDew in merchant marine khakis It's actually my friend Fred Wally who's one of our merchant ship captains up on the the Cape W's in Baltimore He's been with our program for probably about as long as I have There's been a number of activations in that with us. He's a good role model for someone who comes from West Africa Who came via the UK into the US and the US merchant marine and I understand he's gonna be our newest ensign in the strategic sea lift officer program He knew some friends a former administrator of ours, which is it was kind of neat So we don't have enough we're looking at What other options we have available to us so we activate steamships? I've got 20 23 steamships in the RF program I have more of twice as many steamships as there are in the commercial fleet Where am I getting the mariners and the proficiency? So we're looking at things like taking engineers and doubling up when we do have a steamship activation because I need to work on a Proficiency of some of those first assistants and those second assistants so they can get more steam time to be able to upgrade and retain that Proficiency it's a small investment. It's a small investment that we need to do on our on our soft tissue if you will We're also looking at How we can work on the training working with the maritime labor unions? We visited with them to see if there may be some things that we can use from a shore side Simulator training base to be able to try to increase some proficiency to actually tie directly back to our sea lift capable vessels And I'd be remiss if I didn't mention when we talk about training that we are looking at how we're going to recapitalize our school ship training fleet the Empire State SUNY Maritime College is 54 years old the Kennedy from mass Maritimes turn in 50 and that's how we're training our the world's finest Merchant Marine officers around ships that are 50 plus years old I think that needs to change a little bit too. We're trying to work with the Congress. We've got great congressional support by Cameral Both sides of the aisle. I just don't have support near that place near the White House. I forgot their name is But we're working on that We're trying to get the attention to it because it matters that we've got the the base And and that we're making the the future investment For for our mariners and it's not lost on me that if you looked at payscale.com Recently the rankings in that that came out for the two thousand universities and colleges in the country a couple of Maritimes schools are right up there on the top Above Harvey Mudd and above the Ivy League schools in terms of earning potential so the nation likes these graduates Rewards them with very well-paying careers and that it's a smart investment. I think for the future I'm going to finish on one final historical note Last week was the 75th anniversary of the sinking of an American vessel called the city of New York And on ship was sunk in March of of 1942. So we weren't in yet, but it sank Merchant Marine crew on board that ship. There was a doctor who was one of the crew members dr. Conley and he Was was injured pretty bad getting into the lifeboat had a couple broken ribs in that But he was able to tend to a number of the in the injured crew They lost about I think around 20 crew members were killed on the vessel had passengers He delivers a baby in a lifeboat and it became a story of that. Well, he did he passed away in the 1950s But at the American Merchant Marine Veterans Association in Reno last week We presented to his son and his grandson the meritorious service medal, which is the highest medal for the US Merchant Marine Thank you very much Thank you Kevin Our final panelist here this afternoon is Ms. Nancy Harnett Executive director of the Naval Expeditionary Combat Command His hundred entered government service in 1985 and was promoted to senior executive service in May 2007 in her current role she oversees a portion of any CC called the naval expeditionary logistic support group Navi Lsg is a vital enabler of maritime prepositioning forces and joint logistics over-the-shore operations They support maritime forces ashore providing expeditionary cargo handling services for surface air and terminal operations tactical fueling Ordinance handling and reporting in support of worldwide naval joint interagency and combined forces Please join me in welcoming this Nancy Harnett. Oh good afternoon everybody I'm very honored to have this opportunity to talk to you and tell you a little bit about any CC and our forces and How we support the sea lift mission and how we are also a consumer of sea lift because that's an important piece of How we operate so any CC the Navy expeditionary combat command is a type command Our mission is to organize man-train and equip the Navy's expeditionary combat forces Which includes the expeditionary logistics support group that buzz referred to we also have the EOD folks We have the Navy's construction forces the seabees and we have the coastal riverine forces We also have a few smaller things such as the Navy expeditionary intelligence command and expeditionary combat readiness center So the the forces themselves have been around for a long long time the seabees just celebrated their 75th anniversary There's an article about them in today's show daily if you're looking for some good reading The type command any CC has only been around since 2006 though so part of our mission at any CC as I said is to To organize man-train equip to bring commonality as much as we can to these forces, which are very different But the forces themselves They really have a unique niche in many Navy operations including the sea lift operation The Navy's expeditionary combat forces that I mentioned they can operate and sustain themselves They can protect themselves in austere and challenging environments. They can provide for their own security They can also provide security to others, which really is part of their mission They create the expeditionary infrastructure that are required by naval forces to conduct and sustain operations So as far as the sea lift mission goes any CC's role in Helping the sea lift mission is really that part where you're trying to get the stuff off the ship So it can be at a place where it can safely and reliably Sustain those who are ashore and sustain what needs to happen from the shore and back out to sea So that the chart that I have up there on on the screen is a picture that shows the Navy support element whose job It is to support the maritime Pre-positioning offload and follow on sustainment operations and the reason I've depicted it in blue and green is to kind of explain that All those forces don't belong to any CC only the ones that I am showing in green We report to the commander of the Navy support element who is part of the Navy surface forces surf land or surf pack As their administrative control But the other blue pieces there on the chart you have the beach master units The amphibious construction battalions and the assault craft units all three of those belong to the surface forces as well When any CC participates in this mission, we participate with those units So it's the Navy naval cargo handling battalions and our coastal river reinforce whose job It is to provide the seaward defense of the operation and possibly the port that we might be going into The Navy cargo handling battalions their job. It is to unload and unpack ships To build the logistics points ashore. They also build and operate fuel sites ashore They also have a mission to protect airports and to do Aircraft unloading, but that's not quite what our topic is today So if we go on to the next slide, I'll talk a little bit about What the rest of the NECC forces and how they support the rest of the mission as well So any CCC lift rolls from our other units Include the operations where we are helping to set the conditions for the offload Where we're helping in the actual offload and then beyond the offload So you see the pieces of our forces that I mentioned a little bit earlier our EOD guys They help when there needs to be water space clearance So underneath the EOD units we have our mobile diving and salvage units So the EOD forces clear areas of explosives obviously and render safe Any explosives that they might find the the mud suit guys as we call them They might be responsible for clearing obstacles and things So the underwater construction teams who you see with the dotted line up to the seabees Their job both they have a job in setting conditions where Installations might need repairing Port repair that kind of thing They also have a role in the actual offload When the on the amphibious side setting up the amphibious bulk liquid Transfer system the mud suit guys would help repair and sustain those So I already mentioned the units that support in the actual offload the expeditioner logistic support group the coastal river reinforces and then beyond the offload the the Seabees would help improve the seaports and the airport throughput So all of any cc's forces play roles here and there in the sea lift mission But as has been discussed many times The all of this was sort of designed with a permissive Environment in mind. That's not to say when I mentioned that EOD folks would be clearing mines and obstacles Obviously that's somewhat of a contested environment, but probably not in an operation where they're they're Actually being in a live fire kind of situation So the Navy's thinking hard about this this mission How are we going to operate in the contested environment? Not just out on the open ocean, but as we need to bring Bring materials into shore So at any cc we are Working hard with the rest of the Navy and the Marine Corps in concepts like the distributed maritime operations Latoral operations in a contested environment and the Marine Corps Expeditionary advanced bases where the idea is to disperse as much as possible Not to provide Fixed locations as much as we can that become targets as the Marine Corps says to get off the X So any cc's forces can play a role in that That the river reinforces with our mark six patrol boats that is one of our newest capabilities They it's an armored boat Not very big it's only 80 foot, but that's big for our river reinforces So they can provide much more of a force protection role in that kind of a mission The challenge there will be that we only have 12 of them. So that's can't spread 12 boats very far And and that's a similar challenge that we have with the rest of our forces. We only have seven cargo handling battalions Six of which are in the reserve force. So we have additional challenges with activating our reserves Getting them to to where they need to be But we have the capabilities and we're work as I said We're working hard with the rest of the Navy and with the Marine Corps and developing these concepts and being realistic about When and where we can be where we need to be I said at the beginning that we're also a consumer of sea lift. So I'll just talk a little bit about that NEC's forces by and large can't get to where they need to go by themselves. We need sea lift We also need airlift our heaviest the heaviest pieces of our forces are our Our cargo handling battalions and also the seabee equipment The seabees have two sets of equipment to support two battalions that are on our MIPS Ron ships So that equipment is forward that the personnel can fall in on however the rest of the seabees who are Either most of them state side a few forward deployed They will need Strategic sea lift to get the rest of their equipment to where they are They'll also need intra theater sea lift to to move the equipment around our Coast riverine forces as I said, we have the new capability in our mark 6 patrol boat But that boat is intended for 24-hour operations So it will need intra theater sea lift to get those boats to where they need to be The rest of our forces are somewhat lighter weight the EOD folks the underwater construction teams The rest of the coastal riverine forces boats and their equipment so they can either use airlift or sea lifts However, if we're we we know that in the the airlift Situation that there's just as much of a limited resource problem there as well. So So we're looking hard at the airlift and sea lifts needs as well, so With that I will close just to remind you any CC is is a very capable force We had to play a key role in the sea lift But we also really rely on sea lift to get us to where we need to be. Thank you. Thank you All right, thank you panel and that's now time for a counter battery. So open it up to the audience for Any questions you might have for any of our panel? Thank you all for what you do I know that funding is never easy and especially and forces that don't get a lot of lot of the daylight and media so my question is pertaining to what this hard to talk about Distributed lethality. It's been a concept that surface Navy Associations been talking about Admiralton's been talking about for a few years Well that obviously requires distributed logistics and On top of all of the things that mr. Delicio has already explained are the challenges how much bigger a load is that To achieve the distributed logistics that are needed to make distributed lethality into a real thing from the MSc standpoint from the Requirement standpoint is there a role you're hoping that may add place. Where is that? on your list of Things that haven't been funded properly. I know everybody's looking at me So here's what I would tell you and I think Based on the other suit I've used to catch you and you know this But we study the demand signal for combat logistics that Admiral Muborn's folks provide To whatever the sizing the fleet is and that includes the introduction of new ships Whether that be a large ship new destroyer whether that be a small ship LCS But these folks also participate in the con ops in the TTP development or the tactics and so since you can't always take a ship and Modernize it instantly to do what you need to do against a threat sometimes what you can do is you can change the behavior On how we operate those ships I'll be honest with you if you think I'm going to give you those here I'm not but I will tell you if you think we're going to operate like we're used to I Would tell you think again. We're a lot smarter than that I think you'd be really proud of your Navy if you saw some of the things we were doing today And I'll leave it there Yes, ma'am good afternoon, my name is Jessica glassy and I too went to Sunni Maritime. So shout out A couple points The first one you talk a lot about Labor Okay, I sailed on my license for a very short time as an engineer. I did go through the unions But I had some questions so here's some solutions right here's some ideas for you all One make it easier for folks like me to keep my merchant Marines license Make it easier if I'm gonna go shore side and work a power plant job because they pay batter And I can stay home and have kids Make it easier for me to keep my merchant marine license if you want me to go back to sea Make it easier for the merchant Marine officers who are doing reserve time. I have a lot of classmates I'm in my 40s a lot of a lot of them let their license go because of all the hoops to jump through to keep their licenses current Make it easier. You will have a bigger pool. You'll have a bigger pool of those of us in the Gen X range Make the training easier for them to upgrade or keep their quals Make it easier for folks coming out of the Coast Guard or Navy to come into the Merchant Marine They have the skills Make it easier Maybe work with those of us here in industry a lot of the my classmates also go into the power industry power plant industry Maybe it makes work with them on some of their training programs. They're similarly their sims and stuff like that And you would be able to help keep the workforce With the right quals and right training Again, this is Jessica's own opinion, right? This is for me Being in the maritime industry for, you know, 20 years and jump job hopping and doing different things Second I work for Kalana shipyard. So I do do ship repair Make it easier for us to figure out what you want repaired. We know you want to come out on time But sometimes you have such a huge laundry list. It's impossible We need to be able to have a better and open communications during the bidding process and lots of times You all don't want that because you want the lowest price possible The lowest price possible is not going to get you the best product and it's not going to get your ship out on time Be realistic about what you want fixed Prioritize and those of us here in the ship repair world will work with you We have folks who are experts at fixing ships if you could invite some of us to help you with these lists and prioritization We would gladly help you Again two cents just from the peanut gallery. Thank you for being here. Thank you for opening it up. Oh and pay MSc Again a lot of classmates we all like to talk and tell see stories MSc, you're not known for your pay scale especially with the other merchant marine mariners on other ships even the foreign class vessels or the ships here in our Our stuff lagged in our fleet and you're not not known to have nice time schedules You need to let those folks set a time six months nine months twelve months You extend a lot of the the times that folks are away from their families You need to make sure that you tell them they're going to be able to get home They're going to be able to get home especially the engineers you're you're burning some of them out Just delaying their low length of span of their service. So Sorry y'all Thank you If I could just respond to a couple things on there and right on thank you Jessica for those comments and that We have thought about very seriously about how we can make things easier for the retention of mariner licenses We recognize that that that is a big challenge particularly And and we're having a broader discussion with that Including with the Coast Guard who is the regulatory body and you know issuing on the credentials part of that So we today the maritime administration I think we're the largest provider of Reserve training for the strategic sea lift officer program We bring those folks in they're on the deck plate on our ships working with our chief engineers So we do thousands of mandays training today for the Navy to be able to support that it's good for us It's great for the the individuals because they're back on what their their initial training was wasn't being a virtual Marine officer And we and that's a that's a valuable opportunity for that the idea about about how to how to incentivize retirees or those who got out of the industry to keep their license we've looked at that and actually we had The last administration made that request a couple times of Congress to get some money To allowing us to do that to be able to set up some kind of training programs or even sponsoring additional billets on US flag ships that would be in my words They're a Marad billet, but we're using them as a training base so that people can go out there and sail for it's not an Added cost to the shipowner. I'm paying for it But then someone's able to be able to keep their credential up and we have a short string on them If we need and we can call them back and the last thing for Navy Coast Guard another in our Army personnel That are departing their services. We've had a I think great effort with military seal if sea lift command John Thacker helping us committee on re-transportation System called military to mariner and the services have made some great progress the Army the Coast Guard the Navy To to be able to take departing members giving them the the certification so that they can walk into the National Maritime Center And be able to get a mariner credential And it says some good ideas And I would add that mr. Chuck my guards thing right here in the second row has been instrumental In that effort from industry, so thanks for that John Kaskin As the old Scott de Lisio, I have a question for Kevin and the Abrol I'm an old cold warrior as some folks in the audience and although general McDew Mentioned that it's been 70 years since we worried about contested waters for sea lift When I was in the Pentagon We did studies the Center for Naval Analysis did studies on attrition going across the Atlantic Against the the Soviet threat at the time Even with escorts it wasn't a pretty picture, but at least it certainly was a lot better than it is without escorts and the Navy has Zero frigates today our allies they were going to contribute to support that those convoy operations with escorts They don't have large fleets anymore So how were we addressing the movement of forces back then in the Cold War? Well, the first part of the solution was having 10 divisions in 10 days in Europe For our station there in six had their hardware already in warehouses and all we had to do was fly the forces across the ocean The second part of it is that was NATO was going to be writing a list of 600 ships 400 which they would be making available for for their reinforcing sea lift This is before we had to build up our LMS ours and fast sea ships and all the rest of it It was a NATO program to provide the sea lift because even back then our requirement was like 10 ships in 10 days and that was what the ready reserve force was originally established So if we're going to go back to the Cold War of mentality now What in attrition is going a real possibility had there been discussions and going back to Reopening some of these old Mechanisms on how we were actually going to address that threat which was not to try to steam through it Is that one mine? If I could just at least suggest a little bit on the NATO side You're right today the the mantra within NATO is that each nation deploys themselves And so the dilemma that I see as the guy across the Atlantic is they're all competing against the same marketplace They have no assured access and so when I go there I talk about you need to have continued Contingency contracts like we have in visa you need to have assured access to sea lift They don't even like the word assured access and so I'm fighting not fighting But you know struggling with them to try to get to those points about how they can have those kind of instruments because you're right the number of ships today that NATO pledges to It's about why I shouldn't say zero the you there's there's one project. They've got five ships That are under under some kind of us of a string to be able to pull that so it is a challenge So when we look at going back and Re-looking at how we would do sea lift it's trying to take some of the lessons learned I think that we have today to be able to try to do that But you gotta remember these are NATO partners. They really don't have a fleet out there of their own flagships Very little and so they're their control part of it. They don't have they don't have that So that you're saying that's not one of the solutions is resurrecting the NATO sea lift lists and since they don't have the resources either What are the options for protection? I think what my understanding quick reading of the various four structure analysis the 400 350 ship Navy Was structured not to provide in the escorts across the Atlantic Ocean. It was focused on other Areas, I think it was the old 600 ship Navy that was large enough to be able to provide Escorts as well as fighting in other scenarios. So I will Have people coming up with any ideas on how we're going to address the the potential aspects of attrition Or is it still an area where people are just thinking about it and not yet come up with solutions? Well, I would say that we're in the nascent stage I would is what I would call it at least what my exposure to it has been so far, you know I on just this past weekend I read the 1987 CNA study that maybe that you're referring to you know And it was said and it was written in 1987 and it was set in 1990 and it looked at you know sort of a scenario set in Europe that you're talking about where and this is just after the wall fell and And then we're it's a secret document or else I could you know cover it here But but the gist of it was you know if we had to take an awful lot of movement move a lot of ships over to Europe We had to do it on short order What would be the possible attrition? Based on you know certain sets of conditions like how wide the slacks are or how much they're how much Convoy we provide and so forth and I agree with you. You know, it's a pretty staggering You know, it would be it would be a challenge back then and that was 1987 with Soviet era Well with the submarines of that day using torpedoes only so you fast forward now to where we are today with modern weaponry and And it would I believe that the battle of the Atlantic too would be extremely challenging and unlike the there are studies that are going on there are Conops types of planning that that we're looking at fleet forces that has for example is as formed of a team and It's looking at that in in in coordination with the CNA I was talking to you know, just shooting notes back and forth with mark ice over the weekend And he said that you know that they've now are Looking at updating that particular study. I'm talking about So I think the answer is well, I know that the answer is yes, but I say nascent only because You know, we don't have anything You know as mature as that as a study that that I saw, you know from 87 But there's a clear desire to want to want to do a review of that based upon Modern threats and and also the the loads on the ships, you know, it's it's probably it's probably not lost on anyone in This audience that when you take a row a row or two row rows that that I have like a Bob Hope class row Two of them will carry a brigade combat team And so when you're talking about losing one ship, you know in today's environment That's an enormous amount of combat power the loss of you know one ship and one soul is way too many I would never dispute that fact, but But nowadays, you know, I would think that the loss of a ship we're talking about that has an enormous capability is something that You know that has everyone's attention Including general Mathews and you saw it you heard it today at lunch, right? He used the attrition I didn't count I think maybe it's three or four times, right and when when and this is in private conversation We chuckle he says I he thinks he's the first transcom commander that's ever used that word and and it may be so You know, that is that the reality and on his watch is that to prepare for the future means you must think about attrition and I'm reminded in you know, I have this wonderful picture of the All the symbology taken on the 3rd of March in 2003 and it's a picture of we call it the cop the common operating picture There's 167 ships that are op-con to MSc on that day and I keep that graphic as a reminder Am I ready? You know am I ready to assume op-con of 167 ships? But I can tell you you know in my discussions with my with all the partners people are very proud of what they did in 2003 SMI as an as an American of what we can do in 2003 But I will tell you that's not the contested environment. I'm talking about right or we're talking about today, you know Sure the battlefield was contested, but not the seas on which those ships travel So there is I think there is I know there are a lot of work being done to analyze The problem and to come up with Innovative solutions like Scott was talking about with tactics techniques procedures hardware solutions if that's needed and And then the software solutions that is within the training of the Mariners themselves to give them the skills that they need in order to You know meet that challenge head-on Well, thank you very much, and I'm glad somebody's read that study that helped sponsor it a long time ago Let me let me give you one more just so the new John Kaskin can walk through something The the assumption that going back you don't want to relive history or make mistakes. You've already learned through I Would submit to you that if you think that the war is a single-dimensional kinetic event That's where you should think differently The war is a multi-dimensional event that has almost nothing to do with kinetic exchange If you even know when it started There are some people that think it started already And so What I would suggest to you is that not everything about the next war is going to be brute force or landing a brigade It might be out thinking out foxing and out tactic at tacticking your enemy on one or many planes So the studies we're conducting today are complex Some of them have to do a sea lift some of them have to do with space I Don't want to go into a lot of detail But all I would tell you is if if you believe that your Navy is sitting on its haunches doing nothing and Waiting to be told how to do this I assure you this is being looked at very carefully and the next war is not it the next war is brutal Compared to anything Anybody in this room is experienced It's brutal in Both directions Probably got time for one more captain I guard. Yeah. Hey, thanks for the shout out but about the M2M I just wanted to give a quick sort of update What's going on and there has been some neat neat progress? But for us for me, I was fortunate enough to be given the leeway to sort of pursue this because when I would Start working at Crowley. There was a requirement to hire some captains and some some officers and Then it heard what we couldn't hire from the Navy because nobody has the quals I mean sort of nobody lives that Everybody lives that but but the point is now it's kind of come full circle with us because at Crowley We're trying to hire and we can't because of the lack of credentials So we are just sort of doing this just just to find the hires now having said that the National Defense authorization act came out and And and some of the wording that came out of it came from a listening session to listening sessions last year with Congressman Hunter and Congressman Garamundi that led that and helped that and then Senator Blumenthal got involved And so the wording now says that that 180 days within 180 days of the National Defense Authorization Act signing that the Navy will report out that Navy and Coast Guard Will report out to Congress and and the Senate Armed Services Committee on progress and way ahead for credentialing which is good news except that Right now. I don't think the Navy's ready for What's what's probably going to happen if they come out and say okay? Navy cool website is the answer and it's not and so that's that's one of the things So what we're dealing with here is that is the National Maritime Center or how much do they validate and Bless on what veterans have experienced and how much does the Navy flex and change their schools? So there are dual qualifications. That's the kind of hard stuff. That's got to get worked out But the Star Center down in Dania has made some really good progress So so there's a lot of things happening in the right direction But but keeping an eye on on the 180 days will get interesting and I guess, you know One of us will write an article to kind of update everybody on what really happens, but anyway, thank you Thank you Chuck and unfortunately that brings us to the end of our discussion I want to thank the panel again very much like to thank the Navy League like to thank LMI for sponsoring it And thank you all for your your loyalty check for being here late on a on an afternoon prior to the reception Thank you all very much