 Mr. Speaker Hopefully you'll give me the opportunity to just highlight some individuals from my constituency that have recently passed You all probably heard of the very sad situation in front of the Miku police station Where an individual Was attacked by somebody from behind gentlemen who was attacked It's called Joseph Joseph from Duga Must be very heartbreaking for the family what transpired. I certainly wanted to Express my public sympathy and hopefully the house would join me in this sadness of his death Was very obviously unexpected a healthy gentleman and was just attacked and there didn't seem to be any rhyme Or reason as to why he was attacked. I also want to Highlight a very special person to me one of the persons who I first met when I went to Miku South She was a 102 Veronica Veronica Severin who Was an amazing amazing woman and I'm going to miss her very dearly. I know her funeral is on on Friday and yes Mr. Thomas James who was an individual who Contributed significantly to the government of solution Considered him a very dear friend and I very much appreciated his commitment to the development of the overall constituency I too once again Lend my voice of support and sympathy towards the people of Morocco Very very sad what has transpired. We saw the same thing happening in Turkey with the earthquake at the last Count I believe that we're certainly surpassing 2,500 people who have perished so far and there are many more that are probably going to perish in that and again Morocco has been a very good friend as the Prime Minister has indicated to us both in terms of the fertilizer support that they've given to our farmers for many years the the Scholarships and I was very happy to hear that none of the students that were in Morocco were affected by this But obviously they probably are a bit traumatized so again My sympathies go out to the people of Morocco and certainly I'm very much appreciate the support the government has given Hopefully to the students our students that are over there and I really wish Morocco well in its in its recovery Mr. Speaker This bill very interesting bill in that the Motion thank you The Saudi fund is making available to the government of Saint Lucia 75 million dollars It should be also known that the same sum of monies have been made available to several if not all of the Karakam countries as well, and I very much appreciate the Saudis interest in the Caribbean and their their expansion on the international scene, and I think this is very Worth while coming. I'm also very grateful. I'm sure the member from view for itself would also be grateful that unlike some of the other development agencies that have insisted that this money go through the CDB process that they seem to be allowing the government to Negotiate with them on a bilateral basis, and I think that that's very very very good Um There's an old saying mr. Stupid man. I wish it was not really an old saying it was something that became very very famous in the Murder case with OJ Simpson. I think we remember when Cochran stood up and he said If the glove doesn't fit You must acquit And I would say to you that that's where we are in many ways. It's a speaker You know today is a good day But it's a day that's worth of some reflection. I've sat back and I've listened to two contributions in the house who continue to seem to perpetuate a Story that certainly the facts don't Rise to those to those things And that's why if the glove doesn't fit You must acquit if the evidence is not there to support and substantiate the allegations cannot make them So mr. Speaker, I would like to take the opportunity I'd like to take this opportunity mr. Speaker Remember what guys recently please allow the member to make his contribution that this situation clearly started after the fire and The initial decision that was made by the then Stevenson King administration was to Repair the damage theater that was burnt and Also to take the time to fix up some of the existing buildings But certainly not to really expand the overall services that were being provided and To move the persons back from the stadium as quickly as possible and then there was talk to build a new hospital for sin juice and Several locations were identified Work commenced about a year before the elections and Members on the opposite side have continued to allege then That when they came into office That works had only been 30% completed Although they were claims by then Stevenson King and our administration That works had been almost 80% completed and could have been finished Okay, so you can go back in history and look So mr. Speaker The then Prime Minister and I will and I will then go through when he came in dr. Anthony Was faced with the dilemma as to do I continue to work on this particular project or To proceed on building a new hospital and I believe that they would have done the analysis hopefully To look at all the different locations and a decision was made to Continue and expand the existing sin juice That's the decision that was made and when you look at the and I'll get to it the exit report of Shanta King One will discover the reason why many people do not go in an attempt to refurbish All buildings and I want us to remember when we speak about old The sin juice building is 80 years old mr. Speaker 1942 is when that building was first opened 80 years old 81 so the Prime Minister Decided and we have the the shanta king report mr. Speaker and if we go to page four of the shanta king report we see What was in the mindset at that time? And it said the goal of the project initiated was to rebuild sin Jude hospital to reinstate the core and ancillary health services previously offered To the public in keeping with the government's health sector objectives and expanded where necessary The design was expected to produce an effective and efficient health care facility According to the modern-day requirements. So it was to take the burnt-down building and to try to Modernize it as much as possible, but the intention was not to expand it at all the initial policy decision in April of 2010 Prime Minister Honorable Stevenson King and that's why it's so great that we have these things documented We don't really have to go back in debate and and question what's right and what's wrong. It's documented and now that's historical The government of solution initially took a decision to develop a two-pronged approach to the implementation of the solution The Senate Jude Hospital reconstruction project a short-term solution Temporary accommodation for the Senate Jude Hospital This would entail the reconstruction of the surgical wing on the old site as well as the renovation of the other two buildings and Other required ancillary buildings The facilities would be made fully functional to allow Senate Jude Hospital to relocate from the stadium and Operate until the new facility is built on the new site In black and white about my words. That's exactly what the intention was The medium-term solution construction of a new health care facility for sin Jude Hospital on a new site This would entail the planning design and construction of a new 90-bed health care facility First in Jude Hospital at a new site at Bolsen Ju in the vicinity of George Odlim Stadium and Future site of the National University Upon relocation of the salute sin Jude Hospital to this new facility The old site buildings would be utilized for one for other medical medically related purposes such as medical research Ready for this one or Medical school the rationale for constructing the new facility is as follows It would facilitate a synergy with the national vision plan and act as a catalyst for redevelopment of the South in general As functions would be expanded to use as a teaching facility It would be used to facilitate health care tourism and serve Sint Lucien's Caribbean nationals as well as other foreign nationals with specialized health care services the speaker that's going back to 2010 the intention was to operationalize the old building move the patients as quickly as possible back into that building and Proceed to build a new building and as I said there were several sites Further to the government of St. Lucien's commitment to the rest construction sin Jude Hospital planning of this critical project commenced immediately after the fire The associated construction works commenced on September 9th of 2010 with a groundbreaking ceremony There was also the first anniversary of the fire This provided an opportunity for the government of St. Lucia to communicate the broader vision of St. Jude Hospital Which was in keeping with the vision plan of for the south of the island? renovation works at the original site was expected to be complete for reopening of the facility and relocation for the George alum stadium by September 9th 2011 it was supposed to be a hundred percent complete Due to the nature of the project, this is the great part Due to the nature of the project it was initiated in phases to allow for simultaneous design and implementation Although the main building damaged the fire was this surgical building government took the decision to undertake a wide-scale renovation of the facility as Other components were in a state of disrepair as the buildings were originally built in the 1940s and Continue to pose a risk to the operations of this important health care facility at the look that location This included the graded electrical infrastructure asbestos roofing material and all buildings asbestos lag pipelines inadequate water storage and a water a wastewater treatment general dilapidated building infrastructure all All the buildings of the facility were stripped completely leaving in some cases only external concrete works The renovation works also facilitate a reconfiguration of the hospital layout to improve the delivery of services in some areas of extension The buildings were facilitated during the implementation of the works additional requirements emerged and and after thorough consideration Government approved and agreed to explore the options for Financing and an expansion of the scope of the works which would include the additional components listed below several revised policy direction so after the election As a result of the change in scope and associated cost it was determined that the approach to the renovation of the existing facility and Construction of a new facility at Bosen Joe. We just we go on the point of clarification Remember cash with this like the member for It's a point of Are you are you healing member? Yeah The member was reading from a document and he said On pit seven document, that's where he's reading from He said Revised policy decision. He omitted August 21 PM honor of Stevenson King Let me let me repeat that again. Well, you know, I thought I thought I thought after I heard the presentations today that Stevenson King and Yourselves were synonymous. So I mean my my apologies I Revised policy revised policy direction on August of 2011 So after the decision was made to fix up the old hospital And it was gutted and it was determined how much work would have to be done Before the elections because the elections took place in November of that year Stevenson King is an administration made a policy change as a result of the change in scope and associated cost it was determined that the approach to the renovation of the existing facility and Construction of the new facility at Boson Joe be revisited in this regard a new strategic approach had been approved by the former Prime Minister King in August of 2011 this new approach allowed for the renovated facility to be retained and And a smaller specialist hotel. So sorry hospital to be constructed on the new site as The result the approach was expected to guarantee the reinstatement of St. Jude Hospital Completely at its original site with new and improved infrastructure The preliminary design for the specialist facility was initiated with the commencement of needs assessment to inform the design Etc. So Mr. Speaker the decision was then made To abandon the idea of moving the people in in a smaller facility and because of the Extensiveness of the works when you can imagine an 80 year old building An 80 year old building even if it was gutted. It's an 80 year old building. Okay With limited space and so the decision was made to expand that facility and To broaden the scope of services that it originally was offering So mr.. Speaker this then continued and if we go to I won't get into all the Administrative and cost Problems that were associated with the building. We've already heard about that. We go to page if we go to page This is because I'm not gonna have enough time Are you gonna give me gonna give me more time? Are you gonna give me more time? Are you gonna give me more time? Mr.. Speaker Mr.. Speaker Mr.. Speaker the shanta king report and I will get to it the total project expenditure When the new administration came in for the five years and they continued The program of expanding the hospital and decided to expand it even further So they take the special technical hospital and actually make it now The real hospital a new modern hospital is what the intention was and so in the five years mr.. Speaker including the two years with Minister King the total project expenditure as of July 31st 2016 was 98 Million four hundred and fifty one thousand dollars But that did not include Bills that were still outstanding and had not been processed We now know in the report that that amount came to a hundred and thirty million dollars was spent on the building yes A hundred and thirty million dollars is what had been spent on the building Okay, the project costs consist of payment of invoices and certificates from the contractors So speaker if we now go to page 18 mr. Speaker Issues challenges and constraints So again, I think this is summarizes many of the things that are Mr.. Speaker on a point of order I Sit here, and I'm trying desperately to contain myself and to listen to do the The contribution for the member from the member for Miku South But mr. Speaker he continues to mislead the house He indicated That the Shanta Kings report said that the Original St. Jude cost X amount and he goes on to see we now know That it cost a hundred and thirty million What is the source of his information? That is misleading the house mr. Speaker. How how is that? Because he referred to the shanta kings report initially Indicated what the tabulated amount was and then goes on to say we No, no, he also said that that figure did not include some outstanding bills Yes, but mr. Speaker. He must not mislead in the house Well, mr. Speaker you must give the source of the information at the very least But I understand that but the lack of the source of information Cannot amount to mislead in the house. Well, well if you so rule mr. Speaker I have to accept your ruling But can you ask the member to make the source of the his information available to members of the house? very well Mr.. Speaker speak on a point of order Member for castries north the member for Miku South indicated That up to the time of my leadership as prime minister the expenditure was 98,451,344 No, I think he said to the foot the first of July 2016 Okay So again just to help my colleague mr. Speaker if I can I didn't read it, but I'll go ahead and read it It says please note that all expenditure for the all financial years Confirm that by the PMU and the accounts department however accounts department confirmation is pending for financial year 2016-2017 for a period ending in July 31st 2016 and report that speaks to the additional amount of monies was both in the FDL report as well as in your own report That was written. I think over a year ago a year and a half ago So mr. Speaker this part is very important So we've heard today financial resources number one. This is on page 18 Financial resources not available at the commencement of the project to facilitate the vision articulated in the policy direction and Everybody's admitted to that And we get that and so Having this loan now is a welcome opportunity To start afresh, but you know that you're gonna have the resources to complete the project, but that was not the case in 2011 and Was not the case all the way through until 2016 Project was initiated as a result of an emergency and did not go through the normal project development cycle of similar projects which which is historically five to ten year period to physical implementation And I think that we all understand that there was a fire. It was need for a hospital Nobody expected nobody went into the stadium thinking that we were going to be in the stadium for 13 years No one so all the the political rhetoric that goes along with that nobody intended that to be the case and The PMU admitted that they were working in what we call parallel Trying to find money Trying to work on a design and trying to expedite the project as fast as possible That's what the PMU unit was trying to do Mr. We have we can disagree to we can agree to disagree This resulted in initial policy direction of basic renovation on old site And new development of a new site through it You know, it's just amazing to go back and to read these documents Mr. Speaker Because we've allowed The politics of the situation to cloud everybody's minds and to and to and to and to suggest To suggest Mr. Speaker that there was some devious movement of foot This is 2016 written by shanta king This resulted in the initial policy direction of basic renovation of an old site and New development on new site through a public private partnership The International Finance Corporation of the World Bank was engaged to work with the government to facilitate the financing and implementation of a new facility IFC counterpart miss Michelle Auti initially Initially both short and medium-term solutions were being implemented simultaneously So when they understood the deficiencies of moving into the old building and what it would actually be able to serve The decision Mr. Speaker Was made now to look at building a new hospital under a PPP Project implementation commenced on the original site in September of 2010 with minimal funding to facilitate only the short-term solution Planning design and construction had to be undertaken Simitaneously by breaking up into sub components, which is not normally the preferred mode of implementation But was necessary in an effort to progress quickly So even though they knew they didn't have a plan missus speaker Even though they didn't have a final budget missus speaker Understanding the urgency of the matter they proceeded to do things as they could project them change in policy direction August of 2011 resulted in replanning exercise to facilitate Permanent reoccupation of sinchute hospital. However, so that's different Remember the initial plan missus speaker Was to fix up the old burnt building and moving it to it temporarily and when they moved into it temporarily Then the decision was made to build a new facility and to have a permanent occupation of that in 2011 that plan was changed and the decision was made to expand the old facility and to make it so that it could become a permanent solution To the hospital in the south My words missus speaker 2016 However financing was not available to meet the requirements of this new direction as such the PMU developed a strategy to Disaggregate the outstanding works into smaller components and into thematic areas to qualify for target sources of funding such as water Waste water components renewable energy components medical equipment components this resulted in the project management unit preparing various proposals For funding Mexican government German government World Bank United States government and Taiwan's needs go. So what does that mean? They could not get the financing for the whole project So what they went and did is look for specialty areas So the Germans came in with the renewable energy the Mexicans came in with the morgue and the ambulance center Everybody was coming in with specifics and guess what part of that specifics that they provided equipment So from a very early stage mr. Speaker Equipment was being provided to a hospital that there was no Anybody knew as to when it was going to be completed and that equipment was put into containers to hold When the hospital was ready Some of the hospital some of the equipment some of the equipment mr. Speaker was actually put into operation at the stadium Mr. Speaker Construction the site from 2010 to 2014 was directly related to the limited funds Available through the government of San Luzha Republic of China Taiwan German government Australian government with a change in the implementation strategy There was a greater demand on the government of San Luzha to mobilize financial resources to facilitate the implementation of works during the period 2012 and 2015 The availability of funding the funding that dictated the pace of works on the ground So when we used to go and see that the minister was going there and saying works coming on great We're gonna be opening up the hospital very soon Mati Okay, lie Lie Lie And that's why every single time up until the elections in 2016 Okay, all we kept on seeing was a rollover date as to when the hospital was going to be ready So mr. Speaker Mr. Speaker it seems that members from the on the opposite side one in particular mr. Speaker seems to be suffering from jet lag Mr. Speaker In November in November of 2013 A request was made to the Taiwanese government for a loan to facilitate the completion of the hospital This loan was processed and approved with the signing member member for Mikusov. Just remember members whilst I'll tolerate interactions Which are clearly designed to deal with the bill I will not tolerate interactions that are meant simply to disturb the member on his feet Thank you very much mr. Speaker Phase one included all areas which could have been completed with the Taiwanese loan funds Which would permit sin Jude Hospital to relocate from the stadium This included all buildings in the entryway as well as the critical structures As well as other structures that would could be constructed Based on available funds Also in phase one was the German funded component for water and wastewater components which was implemented In keeping with the strategy of submitting multiple funding proposals The PMU submitted a request for funding For the implementation renewable energy solutions for the hospital. Sorry This was approved for submission in January of 2014 And was submitted to the focal point for the relevant project of the ministry of sustainable development Phase two included the mexican funded component phase three included components that would have been delayed If the requisite funds were not available for implementation with phase one isolation building Decontamination building accommodation building training equipment other equipment maintenance contracts general and medical training And I think for the layman mr. Speaker Even though there were three components three phases here Clearly the hospital would not have been able to be functional if in fact all three phases were not completed It's impossible How would you operate a hospital without those basic services and basics are supplies? Challenges with the original main contractor sir old donnelly. That's been very well documented. I'm not going to go into that We speaks about the Change over to sadu. It speaks about the contracted that they had providing consultancy equipment and materials in storage This is 2016 2016 mr. Speaker During the implementation of the project it became necessary to store construction materials and associated equipment All materials and equipment stored are the responsibility of the relevant contractors until incorporated Into the works are installed Halcro group limited to provide the details on equipment and materials in storage on site and off site So materials were not only being stored on site, but they were being stored off site medical Procured through the project currently in storage include Equipment supplied by whole year construction the storage of the equipment and the furniture from its company was communicated to the project steering committee The equipment and storage has been reviewed periodically by the consultant referred to the recommendations by Halcro Over the last two and a half years They have been a number of requests from senjud hospital being aware of the equipment storage Based on the request from the senjud hospital a number of pieces of equipment have been transferred So again, that's just to reinforce and to provide the evidence mr. Speaker of what I was saying was correct Equipment had arrived equipment was in storage The problem was the hospital was not ready And that equipment was being stored mr. Speaker not only on the site It was being stored in containers in canada containers in new york stored in containers here in st. Lucia Was being con was in containers and in warehouses of the suppliers So mr. Speaker To come now and want to make this suggestion that in the last five years that There was new equipment. There's no new equipment That's all the equipment that we've been talking about all the way going back from 2012 to 2016 Supply and installation of medical equipment initially the project scope did not include the supply and installation of medical and specialized equipment Over time as the scope changed and there was a need to include key pieces of equipment over the years Various pieces of equipment have been catered for with respect to replacement upon transfer of the new purchase However, due to the delay and completion of the works the equipment needs to have increased due to equipment in use at the stadium so After purchasing equipment and sending it to the stadium Now there was a realization that we'd have to go and repurchase new equipment by the time you moved into the stadium Proposals were received from accreditation in canada, which never happened development control authority planning as of july of 2016 no planning approval since the establishment But this says right here I'm going to say on page 24 remember from castry from From view for itself It says the application was recommended for approval However, the ministry of physical development form that the board has requested a Presentation of the project prior to approval the PMU has agreed to the presentation And was awaiting information on the schedule subsequently the development control authority Was was no i'm saying I'm saying What what did I say it was misleading if I threw you mr. Speaker It is it's saying up until july of 2016 no dc approval was given No, no no approval had been given No, mr. Speaker and this is this is mr. Speaker Mrs. Speaker Remember mr. Speaker Mrs. Speaker Mrs. Speaker, this is mr. Speaker. This is a report that was written in august of 2016 Okay, so this is after his administration and before we took over the project And the fact is is that up until that point the PMU I want to make it very clear the PMU department That was operating in the prime minister's office in the prime minister's office Admitted that they had no planning approval before July 16th 2016 none And it it highlights several attempts to make it happen But because of the inadequacy of the information that was being provided planning approval was not given Who says that you say that you say that you say that you say that you say that mr. Speaker You established with this in jude hospital Yeah Mr. Speaker we then have again further evidence Of how much the project had cost and the significant delays that were made Mr. Speaker this is all very very relevant to the loans mr. Speaker I Mr. Speaker It's a letter on march 30th 2016 It was a letter from the permanent secretary to the then the honorable prime minister And minister of finance Reference is made to the current contract between the government of san lucha Reference is made to the current contract between the government of san lucha And how crew group limited to facilitate the design procurement and supervision services Associated with the san jude hospital reconstruction project this contract expires on march 31st of 2016 There were various delays with respected implementation of the works ranging from the availability of funding to the remobilization of contractors Also delayed was the approval of the mexican grant to facilitate the completion of phase two of the building Which includes the construction Of the morgue building as such there's been delays in the completion of phase one and two of the project Which is expected to result in the return of san jude hospital to its original location consequently consequently Consequently the revised completion date is estimated at september 2016 which would allow for transition to the new facility to commence by december 2016 It's expected that the defects liability period would Consequent upon the continuation of the works there is need for continued supervision Of its various works and supplies contract given the The circumstances related to the need for completion and transition into the new facility It would be practical to continue with the services of the existing firm with supervision Additionally a change in a supervision Consulting firm may result in addition delay The new award would result in a revised estimate design supervision of 15 million dollars Total project cost is estimated mr. Speaker This is a document from the permanent secretary in the prime minister's office on march 30th It says the total project cost is estimated at a hundred 2016 I said a year I did This is because my my members the members are definitely suffering from jet lag The total the total project the total project cost is estimated. I don't know. I don't know Is estimated at 178 million so in march 30th 2016 The then prime minister kenny anthony was advised by his permanent secretary that because of the delays And changes in the design That the cost of the project now was going to be 178 million dollars With a supervision to cost ratio of 87 percent therefore in accordance with the powers Mr. Speaker, I I think I've been in this house I'm rising mr. Speaker basically on a point of order I mean I've been in this chamber for the last 17 years or thereabout and I believe even if the Member for miku south is a relatively new comer He had occupied the prime ministerial chair for over five years And to come in this house mr. Speaker And to be basically reading to parliament That goes against the general rubric of debate and it goes against the Standing orders so as a member to at least make his contribution He can refer to the text but for the last half hour or so mr. Speaker We has been reading from a report that he never wanted to see that he literally hid when he became prime Remember if he wishes to take his hour to read the report that's his business if your point of order is That what he is reading is not germane To the bill it is not to the motion Then you need to say so but when it is not just say that he's been reading Mr. Speaker, it's not it's not a breach of the rule. I I stand corrected mr. Speaker and that is why I always defer to your wisdom and so far as parliamentary procedure is concerned Mr. Speaker We are debating the borrowing of some money to continue the construction of st. Jude We are here to debate the terms the conditions and everything else in relation to that loan and here we are Having a member of parliament referring to a report of 2016 and just reading it in its entirety Carrying absolutely no relevance to the motion before us today mr. Speaker Fair enough. I remember for microsoft You have been given great latitude in making your presentation, but You would have to tie it to the motion before the house Which I must confess You have not yet done So please tie it to the motion. Oh mr. Speaker I thought that you know after listening to the presentations of the prime minister and the minister of health That the debate had been broadened, but I'd be very happy to comply mr. Speaker And I will soon get there and just to say to the member that we've actually moved on from the report And we're speaking we're speaking about a letter That was written to the prime minister in march Of 2016 We are now it is being estimated that the cost of the project and that's how we're going to get We're going to tie everything mr. Speaker. We're talking about how much money we're borrowing today And what we intend to use that money for And that's the purpose of parliament and that's certainly what the purpose of the opposition is is to question Not only the terms of the loan, but the use of the loan And and the members on the opposite side mr. Speaker have gone to some extent to explain what the balloon is going to be used for And their and their justification and by reading the report I wanted to certainly emphasize mr. Speaker that the words that i'm uttering are not my words These words are words that were written all the way back in 2011 and in 2016 So in 2016 mr. Speaker very importantly That we now have a document that says at that point that it wasn't going to cost 98 million dollars It was going to cost 178 million dollars and that the project would only be hopefully Operational meaning moved ready to be moved in to then operationalize in december And my point of all of this information will be made very clear so mr. Speaker When we got into office member of ks3 service Thank you mr. Speaker mr. Speaker i'm standing at the point of order since the member is providing such information from This documents i do not have a copy but can you make it a document of the house? So i could follow in entirety because i think he's He's representing snippets of the documents and not the documents in entirety I again want to remind members Of the rules of making documents documents of the house The opposition is not so obliged I would be happy if he would make it but i cannot direct him to make it So mr. Speaker i do know for a fact that all of these documents that i've been making reference to are documents of the house And i'm sure the parliament office would be very happy to get you a copy At the end of my come my presentation i'll be happy to make my copy available to you if you so wish So mr. Speaker when you say a documented house, is it this current house? Yes, sir We had the debate we had a long debate when they presented I have to the best of my knowledge i have presided since august 2021 And i have not seen that document so if it's a documented house it'd be a house prior to this one no When we had when mr. Speaker when we had the debate on the um interim report by the by the government All of these documents were made documents of the house, but i'm happy to make them available to the house once again mr. Speaker sure mr. Speaker Upon getting into office And this is where really we we start remember you have 15 minutes left Just one mr. Speaker of all the interruptions and i started at half past I will i wish to remind you of the standing orders which are clear Pellucid and unambiguous And so far as time is consumed The ruling of the presiding officer shall stand my records will show you started at exactly 1220 and the handset can provide that I would like more to sure half an hour Mr. Speaker i move that standing order number 32 10 You vote to be invoked to give the members 40 more minutes One of the members the question is that standing order 32 10 Be invoked to allow the member from microsoft an additional 40 minutes In which to complete this presentation I now put the I now put the question as many as of that opinion see I As many as of a country opinion say no If in the eyes of it the eyes of it Thank you very much mr. Speaker and thank you to my colleagues for the opportunity We did an hour We always did a few we always did mr. Speaker Mr. Speaker mr. Speaker despite despite the politics mr. Speaker the member from from view ford south has a very special place in the politics of solution And i'm very very and i'm very happy that we show him the respect of his maturity Mr. Speaker Mr. Speaker Here's where the real issue starts coming in mr. Speaker and really now relates to where We are today And the discussion and the motion that's been put forward in front of the house So we know That when we came into office in 2016 we had a A building a development That with the best intentions i'm not going to sit here mr. Speaker and cast any aspersions That anybody had any other any other goal other than doing what they thought was the best for the south And and that's fine so We had the benefit in 2016 as you have the benefit in 2022 To have history To where you don't have to guess anymore There's clear evidence of more detail and factual information as to where we are And that's important It's important to know that what do they say that the Repeating the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result Is insanity So we saw that in this report Attempts to Refurbish rebuild an 80 year old building And at the same time Marry the needs of the south and also the role that this facility was going to play Caused the development to continuously to grow in size So not only we were dealing with the changes Of standards, but we were dealing with the change in needs And as a result of it We had already spent a hundred and thirty million dollars And the expectation according to the ministry of finance in march of of 2016 Of then the then prime minister minister of finance was that it's going to take another 50 million dollars on top of that to complete the building 180 million dollars So when we came in mr. Speaker Work continued But work continued at a very slow pace Because there was no financing in place to allow the work to take place on an a steadfast way My government at the time After a lot of heartache trying to figure out what to do which included Do we just downsize the ambition of that old building? And try to go back to the original concept of just operationalizing it as fast as possible Very mindful of I think that the member from labry used to refer to the stadium as the hellhole Mindful of the suffering that people were going through in the hellhole Which is only a tribute to the workers Because the hellhole is the building itself It's not the workers. It's not the doctors. It's not the nurses They're doing an incredible job in that hellhole But it's also gotten to a point where we call it stadium fatigue Psychologically that's where we are stadium fatigue. We were at stadium fatigue in 2016 We're just at a depressed state of fatigue at this point So we commissioned a study mr. Speaker. Yes the commission the study cost a million dollars And when you put a million dollars in context of 180 million dollars mr. Speaker I think it's money that's well spent And I would I also appreciate the comments of dr. King Member for microsoft. I appreciate the lessons of history What we are faced with today do Is the fact that the current administration has made a decision And that decision has resulted In a motion being brought today for borrowing You must bring your statements to that motion and you're not doing that what you're doing Is giving us a history of the thoughts of your government There is a time and place for that debate I think but I don't think a motion to borrow 208 million Saudi arabian reels is the place for it Please bring your comments To the motion before the house Thank you mr. Speaker, and I'll be so guided um The point of the history mr. Speaker was to bring and put in context And I'm making the comparison as to where we were in 2016 which in my mind is exactly where the government is today In making the decision to borrow the 200 million dollars 75 million u.s. Dollars to complete san jude's And the point here mr. Speaker Is is that the the government today while in opposition? And I have the numerous articles mr. Speaker Which I'll be happy to make in the house John peters in 2017 What has happened that sin jude's is a disgrace? It's the worst i've ever seen it in my 34 years of engineering in terms of contract administration It is a mess of herculean as it says proportions It was sad as a professional engineer reading such a document and to see how state funds have been so wasted Mr. Speaker, we have an article in the uh 2000 sorry In 2018 mr. Speaker, this was 2017 Yeah, 2018 mr. Speaker from the voice Complete sin jude was the cries of the of the then opposition architect mark hennicott also presented the slmda's press conference provided figures supporting the argument that the sin jude hospital If worked on it immediately Could have its most critical wings completed and moved into by august This is an article that came out in april And that the entire hospital could be completed by february of the next year You have an article which says from the prime minister the now prime minister and the then leader of the opposition Which is an article On sin jude's He says further the hospital which was six months away from completion, which could have been finished with the loan funds of 20 million dollars That were made available by the rsc in taiwan particularly drawn down. So he's saying That when we came into office The 20 million dollar loan of which 10 million dollars had already been drawn down 10 million u.s. Dollars Could have completed sin jude's It was 90 percent complete. Mr. Speaker. That's that's the that's that's what that is what you all keep saying remember You are hearing me, but you're not listening to me There is a history to sin jude But a decision has been made We can debate wrongly or rightly to complete a structure What we have before us is a motion to borrow money To complete that structure and you need to confine your comments To that that motion you're not doing that Say in what the then leader of the opposition said in 2018 and what the former prime minister said Does not lend to the motion before us. Please get to the motion So that you can continue your your contribution Mr. Speaker for your benefit, sir The issue at end here is is that as the opposition We're coming here to debate two things of the bill The terms of the bill We find the terms of the bill extremely accessible The source of the monies the Saudi foundation have no difficulties the Saudi foundation as I said from the beginning Very happy to see that Saudi Arabia is paying an interest in caracom and is now investing these kinds of funds into our region Because it's not just some lucha All the caracom islands have received the same 75 million dollar loan opportunity all of them So this idea that that y'all cared so much you went out and found the money You didn't go and find the money. The money was presented and you've chosen to remember for gas Point of on a point of order I remember for gas recent Remember on his feet I can I can tell you In nonsense terms That all the islands of caracom have not received 75 million dollars I can tell you from nonsense terms because I happen to have the information This is not this is not The members of all the men's car have not received 75 million dollars Member for Miku south your statement was that all other caracom countries have received 75 million The minister of finance has rebutted that. What is your response to it? My my my response members members if in fact the interpretation was that I meant all I said that some of the caracom countries If not all And the prime minister is a current sitting prime minister He would know better, but I know that there are other caracom states that have received The same funds and the same amount So mr. Speaker, this wasn't a special thing for sanduja This was something that was done that when the member was here. Did he not fly this in vincent? Okay, so I said said to I'm very happy the opposition is very happy for the saudi loan I'm we're very happy for the terms of the saudi loan We're also very happy that the saudis have chosen not to put the money through cdb and to facilitate a quicker Expenditure uh implementation. We've said all those things mr. Speaker the question that we have is what the government is Intending to use the money for and the purpose of going back in history Is to say that the government has a choice you're 100 right mr. Speaker This is the government it is their discretionary decision But as the opposition we have every right to challenge what that discretionary decision is and the evidence behind that discretionary decision Certainly do but not on a debate on the borrowing of the 280 million So mr. Speaker Mr. Speaker, I I sat and listened to the prime minister and to the minister of health the minister the member from castries east and also the member From view for north who spoke about what the monies were going to be used for They've opened it up in the debate And so I would like the opportunity to express That united workers party your opposition. Sorry. Okay. It's not in support with how the monies are going to be Fair enough member. It's just how you phrase it. That's going to be the issue. No problem, mr. Speaker Okay So the the the the points of all of this is to show that when we came into office in 2016 We were faced with the dilemma of a building that it was estimated that was going to take 180 million dollars another 50 million dollars to complete and that was When they thought the expenditure was 98 but the expenditure was 130 So maybe even be more than than the one the 180 million dollars Okay, mr. Speaker so We also understood and once we completed the report and I have the report here mr. Speaker Which is the fdl report The report speaks to all of the deficiencies of the building Zoning issue several buildings located in areas on site where their functionality appears not to have been considered Cases in the west wing Where the sizing of corridors is significantly below the recommendation minimum size The effects aggress the ability of you know, mr. Speaker You know the members the members have a 212 page report and want to go to one line and I'll repeat the real line Right where it says is that despite all of these deficiencies That the building is salvageable and it's salvage and the building is salvageable at what standard and then the question becomes At what cost mr. Speaker? At what cost remember mr. Speaker the members on the opposite side said in opposition That this would take Clorox And 13 million e-c dollars Why are we waiting? Why don't we open the hospital? That's all it would take It's 90 completed Move into the hospital And yet when we did the study The study showed exactly what your own study showed Let me read it for you When you go to your own study when you go to page page 18 Sorry It was hiding on me if you go to page 28 mr. Speaker of the The report that was submitted to the prime minister On by the SJHRP review committee 28th of october 2021 It says assumptions The state of completion of the works associated with the hospital phase one Which the review committee has observed at the time of the visit of the 21st of september suggests that many of the buildings And functional spaces are more than 75 completed. So we've gone from 90 percent now to 75 percent And that only two areas Which is the state require major work. I said mr. Speaker Mr. Speaker The leader of the opposition must stop misleading the house and the general public Because it was in the intimated earlier That the former senator was about 90 percent The report says More than 75 More than 75 90 is certainly More than 75 He's saying it has gone down from 90 to 75 Ask him to stop misleading the public More than 75 read it read it Mr. Speaker Regardless of the approach adopted a transition plan must therefore be based on but not limited To any or all of the following assumptions The government the senator shall be privy to and can terminate or vary all the current ongoing contracts B All construction documentation Including project drawings are ready available for review And for reference by others Phase one can attain full approval from the development control authority The transfer of the entire operations Um of the senjuts at the to from can commence within 18 months from the uh Stadium George George the George oddland stadium Finance for undertaking and completing all its down and being worse is available Installation of internal billing services including power lighting air conditioning cctv service fires into an approximately Are approximately 50 completed In general partitions within key buildings are in light weight and freestanding All outstanding doors and windows for the products are deemed to be materials on site Allow all outstanding floor and walls ceiling finishes are deemed to be materials on site It goes through a whole list of assumptions and the question is mr. Speaker How much is the the completion Of the new hospital of the old hospital the 80 year old building going to cost So if you're drawing down 200 million dollars And it begs the question All the reports say That going into the old building You're not going to have an efficient hospital You're not All the reports say the same thing mr. Speaker And so you're faced with the same dilemma that we were faced with in 2016 Do you proceed to continue to build in an old building mr. Speaker in which every time we proceed We find more problems every time that we now see expansion and solution We change the terms of what we want the hospital to be able to achieve Or do like us And go and build a new hospital Which was a plan before so if you have 200 million dollars Go and build the people in the south of proper hospital And revert back to the plans that we had all those years ago And use the old building as a training center as a university exactly what we said Why why would you want to go into this old building? Are you so what's what's the obsession all the evidence mr. Speaker speaks country to go in there So mr. Speaker when we talk about the new building Let's talk about the new building First of all they came out and said oh the cladding is not fireproof Okay, but the roof is easy It's easy a membrane. Well, what are we talking about mr. Speaker? It's a modern facility that just requires a membrane to seal the top of the roof Okay, without a roof Okay, how many how many concrete roofs do we see in san lucha mr. Speaker? Okay, and you put the material on the membrane on in order to seal it Nonsense you want to make it out make it out to believe that this is an impossibility. This is easy So first of all that's how you do it you have to clad it first before you put the roof on you don't put the roof on and then clad it Mr. Speaker, so let us let us let us let us speak let us speak to the technology That was being used. So first of all just so that we can get on the same page mr. Speaker Members on the opposite side, and I'm glad that they're laughing because it's not a laughing matter. Okay Here it is that in your own presence in your own in your own presentation You said that you're going to use the dialysis building and the rehab building What materials were used for the rehab building and dialysis building the same cladding? The same cladding that's on the main structure is the same one that you're going to use in the expansion of your own project So go come and tell me that you all of a sudden don't believe in the technology We talked about climate change. That's how the prime minister started off. That's why I had to giggle The climate change So the modern building has a technology to reduce the heat on the outside to absorb the cold on the inside So the condensation takes place in a cavity It also by making sure that the heat on the outside is reduced Before it hits the wall the cold wall on the inside. It increases the efficiency of cooling the building We also have another problem as a speaker the technology the technology in health care is changing so rapidly That buildings that you build today within a very short pace of time become obsolete So the new development that they have is to put all of the utilities in the ceiling And all of the utility wires in terms of electrical and plumbing are in the drywall So anytime that you want to change the configuration of the floor It's an easy thing instead of going around solution. You see trunking everywhere you go Why because it's all in the concrete buildings that technology has changed You have an earthquake proof. You have it hurricane proof All of those things are in a modern purposefully built design hospital And if you want to see what the and if you want to see what the completion looks like I will pay your airfare to go to k-man and you can go and see what the hospital looks like Okay, world class World class Okay, that is making a significant contribution to the development of the economy in k-man Because in addition to providing the local services the intention was exactly what the plan was in 2006 Sorry in 2010 Was to use the old building as a school And to make sure that the new hospital that we had provided services not only for locals But also became a regional source of Mr. Speaker I've heard members speak about um breaking down of buildings And let's remember mr. Speaker that during the period of 2011 and 2016 Several buildings were demolished. In fact, if you want to go and see the graveyard of concrete Just go by the heineken factory by the gas station and there's a burial ground of all of it there The two buildings that were demolished mr. Speaker One was the old dialysis and the other one was the old mortgvillage And and the reality was is that the dialysis center was built over a tree trunk And it was impossible to stop the leaking of that building every time it rained All that building would go and the other building mr. Speaker The ceiling and the walls were defective small buildings And we rebuild them with proper buildings. In fact, those are the same buildings today, mr. Speaker That this government now is going to go and use using the same cladding The same cladding Yes, but you must be there must be have a roof because you're you're using them You you you you you put it in This is speaker So the issue here mr. Speaker Is if you're confronted with history And history has shown that the old site Is difficult and has been difficult And despite the allegations of 90 complete Or if you just want to go and put some Clorox and and and move in All that is through the window because I have to imagine mr. Speaker If in fact that this government could have done that In the first two years they would have You've not done it and to make matters worse You said that when we said it was going to cost a hundred million dollars to complete the building When we said that and we said we don't even know for a hundred million dollars because of the deficiencies You are now coming to the house to borrow 200 million dollars What does that say that we were right? All along now you're a hundred percent right mr. Speaker at this juncture It is for the government to make the discretionary decision. What is the best interest of the people of this country? And right now I know That if you wanted to move into the new modern building you can move into the ground floor 110,000 square feet mr. Speaker the design was done for 90 beds I don't even know how many beds you're going to get into the into the old building 28 buildings Are you going to consolidate the buildings? So is it that everybody has to leave the buildings to go all around the place? That's what st. Lucia is worth How does it keep with your expansion of the view fort or maybe you don't intend to expand in view fort? I heard the member from cast from view fort south last time say I should apologize Because uh, there's no agreement that they're not going to put a a pier in in view fort. Where's the pier? You all had a big a big announcement. I saw nobody from view fort there I saw miss secrets. Sorry the member from uh, self-suffer was there Absolutely and all the plans were there and ready to go and if we get and when we get back into government We'll make sure that the pier goes in there. I can assure you that I'll make sure the pier is going to be there You should have put the pier in since 1997 remember for mikus of what does a pair in view fort Have to do with the motion before us I mean you are You are right that technology changes What does not change is what is in the standing orders you must stick to the motion And if you're not going to stick to the motion, I've been very liberal But if you're not going to stick to the motion Mr. Speaker I'm just saying that maybe maybe the design maybe the design of the hospital Is been reduced because the ambition for the view fort has been reused that's all i'm asking If in fact you're going to put a home port in view fort If you're going to put a home port in view fort and have over a hundred thousand passengers going through the home port In view fort and given the opportunities with the crew that maybe you would have expected a growth and an Upsizing of the hospital. That's all So but maybe maybe there's maybe that when we come to debate it The government will articulate what it's what its assumptions are has the plan changed What's the final cost of the box? I want to find out Mr. Speaker, I don't know what the box is but I consider the modern building we spent a hundred and thirty million dollars Of which we still owed fresh start 25 million dollars And that we had to a 50 million dollars to complete the ground floor So hence that's the loan that was being put to the house the 75 million dollars at the premises Really it would have been about 300 million easy dollars not all No, yes No, but if you have to spend on a ground floor I was just going to say to the member I was just going to say to the member from microsoft That he wishes to entertain every aside And then he'll complain about time Though you're free to make the size but the member from microsoft should stay focused On the motion So mr. Speaker What we are now what we're now seeing unraveling here is the big lie Okay The big lie is is that It would have taken and it's going to take in excess of a hundred million dollars To finish the old building I don't know what that final number is going to be but in excess of a hundred million And the question is we have to ask ourselves Can we fix the problems sufficiently in the old building Can the electricals being redone can the plumbing be redone Can the hallways be redone can the building materials change Can those be done sufficiently to to guarantee and assure the safety of the public Do we know how much it's going to cost to fix those problems? Do we even know if we're going to get planning approval? Because we're up to now there's no planning approval because my understanding is you all don't even have a plan There is no plan right now for sinjud's two years in office Two years in office. There's no plan We don't even know how long it's going to take And I would say to mr. Speaker certainly from a united workers party or from an opposition perspective mr. Speaker Our ambition for view fort is very high We want to see the expansion of view fort We genuinely do believe that in order for some lucha to get to the make a quantum leap in economic in economic growth That we have to be able to develop the south Okay, mr. Speaker so The hotel developments sandy beach development into a village tourism complex Horse racing all of these things were tying in to the airport expansion to the hospital expansion the call centers and with the idea mr. Speaker That persons who have been migrating from the south to the north leaving their families That we were going to create an opportunity for mr. Speaker for them to come down And not only that mr. Speaker because we've not even discussed a major issue Which I know it's not the subject of this debate, but we'll be the subject of the debate When this government was in office in 2011 to 2016 And could not operationalize ok e What did they have they had a naming ceremony? And after the naming ceremony the hospital remained closed mr. Speaker for four years You know why because they could not operationalize it had never put a financial budget in place to operationalize it mr. Speaker And mr. Speaker I believe the same thing now is going to happen. They're going to build a monstrosity That is going to be an operational nightmare and it's going to Going to Extremely increase the cost of operations for health care and they can't even run health care today They can't run it today The hospitals are disaster the health care centers are disaster This idea that you're talking about universal health care and what you want to come now and roll out some things Okay So all i'm saying to mr. You know with with the horses at least we had a private sector person paying for the horses Okay, you you on the other hand are taking taxpayers money to fool the people and provide them with substandards in in health care mr. Speaker and so mr. Speaker I look forward to that debate when we can discuss how much is going to cost to operationalize once you have the plans Y'all don't even have the plans so mr. Speaker In closing I want to be very clear We support the load We're again a very appreciative to the Saudi Arabians For what they've done and for their entry into the karakam market We applaud and we're hoping that more countries will develop bilateral relationships with our islands And go past cdb because all of us have had our issues with the processes that cdb has And how long it takes to implement projects And I want to say this mr. Speaker We decided to build a new hospital Because we realized the amount of money and the amount of time it was going to take And the uncertainty to rescue the old one would be inefficient But you know what the difference is mr. Speaker We will continuously fight To save lives and livelihoods But we will never ever fight to protect the victory. I thank you mr. Speaker