 life great yeah nice to meet you at last yeah i've been chatting for quite some time and look have been looking forward to this meet you bro so great to get into like the topic of micro dosing and what it can do for us in this global awakening and yeah i contacted you or um suggested this topic because of um my intuition is that it is more accessible to people that have not yet had like a full-on awakening experience with insugin and so my first question to you would be like what has your experience been so far with like the different dosages or from ranging from like a true micro dose to like a real full-on and theogenic release experience yeah dope yeah i love your channel conscious development it's great bro the for all for those that are watching that haven't checked it out you can find the link in the bio it's great he just had frank yang on it was such a good conversation between you i loved it yes what a great conversation so good yeah and i'm glad that we got linked up for this and i totally agree with what you just suggested which is that entheogens especially micro dosing are in many ways exactly what is the tool that we can use to decrease the separation conditioning that has been accumulated over time um so in the dance of the one which is what this reality is that when we accumulate separation conditioning it can be really hard to unwind and soften ourselves back into awakening or into remembering that this is the one dancing with itself and that you are that you are the entirety of it um and so it's how does one do self inquiry or um types of meditations concentrations and meditations in order to unwind said separation conditioning um much more difficult in many ways than it is to just ingest a single gram of magic mushrooms and then to and then to have that experience which is in many ways just a decentralization of one's identity into what is the field that's it i mean really in essence like you created a um a boundary and um then you turned it into like a self for many of us including myself in this process we turned it in this boundary we turned it into a self-referential system over and over again which is i am a separate person amongst other separate people and that everything becomes about that self-referential process um typically things like uh i need to seek happiness and peace and i'm going to do that by accumulating external things like experiences or relationships or material possessions substances this type of stuff and so then and that's all to try and heal that illusion of separation conditioning um nothing is ever separate and it's never been separate and everybody is already awake and everybody is already the one and yet there's the appearance of people being asleep which are people that have forgotten themselves at the as the one with the separation conditioning so for me the process of just ingesting a single gram of magic mushrooms which i think is the most simple micro dosing um entry point um so like a single half gram or a single gram of magic mushrooms um and it depends on many other things like the strain it depends on the concentration of psilocybin and psilocin the psychoactive compounds that are within it but in generality speaking um that's what i would recommend and it's just a universalization or a decentralization of your identity so rather than that egoic self-referential separation process you become the all you reorganize the all so you relax much of the constrained neural circuitry around your identity and you liberate yourself into oh i am everything that is what i am and i'm infinite and that's what this shows me so that would be my answer there that's so great um that actually kind of refers to my own entrance into like psychedelic experiences for myself it um it was like nine years ago that i had like the first magic mushroom experiences and it started like you said like i i was very naive at that point i have to say as well i didn't know much about spirituality about what this deeper understanding of the world actually can evolve into or how it can change how you perceive this very moment and so i started also kind of um from the perspective of a full and theogenic experience i started kind of low with this like half a gram or a gram experience but then after two or three experiences of that i quickly increased to like two and then three grams and just to give maybe people who haven't had this kind of experience um a perspective of what to expect um i would share my own experiences with these different levels um because when you don't have the spiritual knowledge the background and you don't know what to look for in my experience it was not possible to like dissolve this whole ego structure with the first trips on the micro doses or on the like let's say um minor doses it's not like a true micro dose would be like in my understanding something you can function on during your day like maybe 0.1 or 0.2 grams where um you just do your normal regular stuff but with like half a gram or a gram the first trips they were just colorful nice experiences for me but then after i had like the big awakenings in trips now the same dose of half a gram or a gram is a completely different story i don't know how is your experience with like dosages depending on what your level of insight was when you think think back now has it also changed your sensitivity to the substance yeah that's a great insight so basically if you take like a visualization where you have like a hundred percent of your separation conditioning that is in store and in place up here and then you can say that that's like being asleep and that over time the awakening is just the eradication of the separation conditioning down to zero percent um that entheogens the way that you could see the way that they play is that if you take like a half gram or a gram let's say to start at a hundred percent um you might get exposed to very like clear insight to the interconnectedness of everything and then you might start questioning your identity being separate and so that shifted you from a hundred percent separation conditioning maybe down to like 95 percent or 90 separation conditioning and then over time like you suggested also you might increase your dosage maybe to two grams or three grams of a magic mushroom experience you might also play a little bit with five m e o d m t or l s d there's plenty of other substances that are psychoactive that are entheogenic to try and just quickly would like to say entheogen means unleashing god within or unleashing the divine from within um so we're not talking about some sort of a mystical experience that one attains but we're talking about you recognizing yourself as god as the one as infinity and as all of this being that dancing and so bringing it down over time with these higher doses what happens is maybe you're at like 75 percent separation conditioning and you take a larger dose well first of all you're going to have like you said all that insight that has already compounded since you brought it down from 100 percent to 75 percent and then you're also going to have the larger dose and the larger dose is going to show you more um more of the dissolution of the ego structure like you were also mentioning and so um this is why they're very powerful things and this is why um whatever the 1960s or so counterculture um this is why that happened as well um very powerful movement but then also the powerful pendulum swing back with the war on drugs um because you can't just dissolve people's ego structures because then there's not going to be consumerists um and um people that are uh working at uh corporations as um asleepingly as the economic machinery and those that are in power would enjoy um so yeah so this is sort of you could say like the generality of it is the slow unwinding and softening of the separation conditioning from 100 percent to zero and the way entheogens can play into that they're very much like um gateways or like um they're they're good parts to the to the journey of awakening I would say yeah that mirrors my experience um you mentioned there in the beginning um that we can also later talk about I think is um that there are other substances like LSD, 5MEO, DMT and in my own experience lately I've also tried 2CB um so let's keep that in the back of our minds because I want would like to come back to like the differences between psychedelics later um because I find it it's also something not to overlook um because it's for me it's the flavor of how the experience unfolds nice um okay then now we have like um your model of like let's say you we all when we get to this let's say we start at our own 100 percent ego identification also important to just say that not everybody because given if your birth to like very awakened parents um or if you're birthed into um like a indigenous tribe that is very interconnected with life um the uh the separation conditioning it may not even start at 100 percent it might not even form in the first place because you have to you have to remember that when you're birthed to asleep parents and asleep culture then it goes from zero percent and it goes to 100 percent when you're like whatever 18 or 25 and then you go and from your 25 until you're 30 and you're seeking or whatever to decrease it back to zero so yeah that's one way to look at it okay so some people will struggle more with this than others okay and also culturally there are differences like I think back or when I think of India I would imagine there are more people who have like who are not at 100 percent ego structure oh nice oh cool so you might say like generally um per person in the u.s there might be more ego structure than per person in India yeah cool yeah I would I would guess like um because it also shows in our like cultural behavior like how much we are focused on what we think is real like in the u.s in the western world it's our perception that objects have their own inherent reality that manifests in our behavior of putting so much energy into building all of that stuff and accumulating it in our lives because it gives us this feeling of having something real in our life because we have confused that to be the case um yeah there's a lot of functions that are tied into the self-referential ego structure yes yeah yeah because you mentioned that in the beginning it's basically this um self-referential and self-reinforcing cycle because only when you believe in something to be real will you invest energy into it yeah and so only when you see there is this separation between you and what you perceive will you like think that these things have some inherent existence apart from the whole flow of yeah reality um okay and so to come back to like this um initial question of microdrosing and how it can help us to see this um inherent unity of everything that is how would you say it's like would you say there's a difference between for example let's say someone is going with a microdosing experience every week and he does that for like 50 times over the years or or over a year and compare that to someone who is going to decide to like do a 3 gram or even more trip when we say like let's say here with magic mushrooms um in your or do you think there's a difference between how those two paths will unfold yeah um I would also start by suggesting that and I know Frank talks about this quite a bit as well but that um entheogens are like one of the main um tools on the belt but then there are other tools on the belt like for example concentration and meditation um like vipassana is a great tool so is just the normal like do nothing meditation and like sort of um go beyond the thinking mind um yep into what is the space that allows the arising and disappearing of the thinking mind um and then see how that's the same um for all of us like that space is the same the I is the same um before our name um and so contemplation is really important like self inquiry so self inquiry vipassana do nothing concentration meditation um in in addition to entheogens so that way it's like you're tackling awakening from the many sided mountain um and all of those things are like compounding onto each other in the process um and that's kind of what I did the last like five years and that sort of helped me a lot um then in terms of like if you do end up doing entheogens more frequently I mean for me um it's been like every six months or something um yeah the last like five years and um and yeah I would say that that's a pretty good um like timeline uh for people that at least have already um went through great um insight into unity um because it you know for people that have went through great insight into unity it makes sense to sort of like do it a little bit um at a longer period of rest between um to sort of let your new um insights sort of further integrate um but if you're first if you're like really really fresh and you have no idea and you feel a lot of separation conditioning um yeah it could be good for you to maybe do it once a month um to start um like a half gram or a gram every month to start now doing it every week is a little bit um you could do that um I've I know people that do that but you sort of also want to ask yourself like um you know the intention is to integrate what you learn so that's the key thing is like if you're gonna feel interconnectedness if you're gonna feel oneness if you're gonna feel service to others if you're gonna start feeling that um to take the week to take the month instead of the week for you to actually maybe do something with honor in service to other people um in service to the whole um that that would potentially teach you another important lesson or two or three in the three week break normally then trying to compound it every week so that's just some of my take on it yeah what about you um I agree with all that you just said um because in my own journey it has also unfolded in this like slower process you could say or not really forced process where I gave myself the time to let my lived reality catch up to the insights that I had and it just feels so so much healthier in the beginning it was like more of a kind of let's see how how deep this can go and how many insights one can have but then you come back and it's like so much and you have to somehow put it all in its right place and you need just time to figure that out and um what you mentioned there with um the practices that's also much of the emphasis of what I do over on my channel I mostly talk about these practices and how you can have these insights also with contemplation with meditation and here's really where I see them both like micro dosing like true micro dosing um up to half a gram of mushrooms let's say maybe even point one point two where I see they really shine is in the combination with meditation and especially contemplation because compared to like a three gram trip where there is no choice anymore you just have to surrender the smaller trip in my experience you can also use their power beautifully to direct to certain questions or topics you want to contemplate and really um where one person would take like one point one gram and go about their day as usual and get like really nothing spiritual out of it if you approach it with the right mindset and go deep with it in meditation that combination I found is super powerful and it's also in my experience is able or it's it's possible to do that on a weekly basis because it just takes your meditation that little bit deeper and doesn't like give you material to work on for weeks and um yeah so it's all about the dosage um but would you say at a certain point if someone only does smaller doses they hit a certain plateau or they cannot have deeper insights and that maybe higher dose would be necessary yeah totally totally it would be like for me to say like why don't you go hike um a mountain but um let's say the mountain is uh you know whatever 3000 meters um but I tell you uh um only go uh 300 meters up the mountain but then only go 300 meters up the mountain again next week and then only go 300 meters up the mountain again next month and one year from now only go 500 meters up the mountain so you know you kind of like feel into that um in your own process um and like you're only going to see so far 300 meters up the mountain like you only see so far like when you look um when you look you're only going to see so far but when you go 500 meters up when you go a thousand meters up when you start really going up um so when you start doing two three four grams of magic mushrooms when you're really starting to you know get up almost to this heroic dose um you're seeing like the end of it you know you're seeing the the last bit on the mountain um you're going the um the 3000 meters up but the thing about um that is that it's like a gondola ride the entheogen is like a gondola ride because you go um and like a magic mushrooms is like a slower gondola ride than like five m e o d m t is a faster gondola ride so you're you're taking this gondola up and then you peak the top and then the gondola goes back down and so what i'm suggesting with the analogy is that um you want to wear this like heroic dose or these larger doses would take you after you sort of build up the courage with the micro doses and you start tasting more and more of the one that you already are and awakening to that that what you would like to do is you would like to rebaseline your identity your conviction your realization all of it you would like to rebaseline that in your moment to moment direct experience as the top of the mountain without entheogens and that's where contemplation meditation self inquiry um that's where all of these things come into play like you know when frank talks about this he talks about it like there's a contemplative um fitness that that ai that's just running all the time um and like that's sort of what it ends up being like is like you just you run as the entire universe you run as infinity um and everything is just a lesson for the individuation for its um unique expression everything is seen as just a school everything seen as just a lesson um everything seen as just one not like separate people telling me things but rather it's myself telling myself the thing that i need to know for me to decrease my separation conditioning and for me to feel more oneness um and you see that same thing happening with like the decentralization of the banking and energy infrastructures around the planet is it's a shift in identity from separation conditioning from centralization to planetary collective awakening decentralization um so you so the mountain analogy is important here if you're going to take these micro doses over periods of time you're only going to go you know 300 meters up repeatedly but then you do baby step your way up to gain more insight of what is seen from the mountain and then the joke is that you know when you do get to the top you were at the whole time um that's the cosmic joke and it's hilarious yeah yeah on that level that you were speaking from um you also get the insight that when you take something or when you take a psychedelic again that it didn't even happen that it doesn't even that it's not a thing you are not on a trip or not it's all it's one thing and it's just there it's just you could say an opportunity for you to see what is already there it's kind of you allow yourself for that experience to unfold but it's not in the substance there is no psychedelic that is like doing that apart from the flow of experience which the psychedelic is a part of yeah you're one of one of the ways to visualize this is that you're you're god with like a stylist you know you're the painter you're infinity you're the painter um you're using your will and your choice and you're choosing you're willing the asleepening process you're willing it you're building your own you're with your own stylist but you're not doing it consciously you're doing it unconsciously or subconsciously you've designed your own escape room and people think that they're victims to reality but they design their own escape room infinity designed its own escape room for itself and then the liberation like bintino bintino massara talks about this like a unfreezing of will like you have all this will that's frozen in these like subconscious separation conditioning patterns and what you're doing over times you're regaining you're unfreezing that will and it's becoming more and more liquid and more and more air like and you recognize yourself as this god painter infinite stylist and then that's it like that's it like you feel the like the the vibration of what it is and that's your state that's that's your new state of being without without anything else that needs to i need to ingest something or and nothing nothing like that you just are it moment to moment to moment yeah yeah that's such a beautiful description um in my own experience it unfolded as the recognition that psychedelic trip is no different than my regular state in the sense that is it is all my creation it is all my wish and even the like you could say the confused state before knowing myself as the oneness is the same beauty it's the same and that that gives so much peace you know and it could also give to listeners here i feel a sense of yes you are on that path on that spiritual unfoldment that is happening through you but it is at the same time perfectly where you are it is perfect to be in the place of not knowing of not perceiving what is it is a paradox in the end but it is still god's will to experience all parts of itself and to in order to do that it has to confuse itself totally with a with a particular role with with the individual human absolutely yeah that's just how realities are created yep it's there's no say you could even say it's the most important feature of realities is the ability to fall asleep and to wake up yeah if it wasn't for that what would we what would we be talking about you know you'd be it'd be like it'd be like if you landed in Grand Theft Auto or video game and you were immediately level 100 with access to everything and you started the game it wouldn't make any sense no yeah that's also why um why i feel micro dosing is so great and it was overemphasized i think in the sixties to take only the full release though i think it was also um then revealed in the overall reaction of the society that this approach was maybe a bit too fast as it was maybe for the individuals that were i can only imagine but many of them back then without like proper knowledge in the western societies were challenged by these insights more than they maybe could handle and bringing that kind of unreflected experience into society was only there or could only happen in that backlash could only result in that backlash of making all of these substances illegal and so learning from that i think now if you could say i don't want to call that way but you could see it as like the second revolution of psychedelics i think we have learned from that to go slower like on an individual basis but also as the community to say okay for myself i feel more comfortable starting low and then i give myself the time to integrate really everything i experience and i see this as a five or ten year or maybe even 20 year journey and i don't need to rush and because as we just said it is god's will to experience every perspective and so um there's nothing wrong with wherever anybody is staying uh is standing in their understanding of the whole of reality yep and it's all you so the faster that you remember that it's all you that the more that you don't have judgments about your other selves it doesn't make any sense um once you sort of wake up to that it becomes your radiance of love and acceptance for the entire creation exactly as it is because there's still um like you can feel it still in the majority of the collective's um energy is that um i don't love and accept you because you think differently than i do like that's still like a very common way of being um especially like political parties um and even it's seen in um so basically seeing through i mean i was going to say like it's seen in like sports as well like sports teams clashing like it's seen in all this type of stuff um but seeing through the separation is the key to awakening but not um seeing through it and then stopping intellectually because that's a different um it's like basically being the mycelium like that's another way to say it is like you are the mycelium like you are the field like underground there's mycelium networks and you are them like you are the way that they in a decentralized way talk to each other and exchange resources with plants like you are that um uh uh and you be you are that you like you re you re you wake up to being that and not to um to being a separate person with a non love and a non acceptance for the rest of people that think differently than you do so you recognize that you are the all so just waking up to that is like i mean it's it's yeah it's incomprehensible because you also wonder well i never fell asleep also it's it's like one of the most interesting parts of yeah remembering is like i didn't fall asleep um so all of this plays really deeply into this process of like what do you want to do with your intention of micro dosing and the intention of micro dosing i don't know um people's exact personal journeys and what their intentions are in the in the process but generally speaking whether you consciously say it or not it's to dissolve separation conditioning yeah i have to say like the way you described it right now this analogy to the mycelium it clicked for me right now for the first time like i heard it before but now i see how you mean it i think and let me like maybe you rephrase it so you you can yeah reflect on that it's so before realizing the oneness of reality it feels like there is a conscious perceiver that's going on here and the conscious perceiver going on over there so here is called laureth over there is called atlas and all the other people in our lives but then when you realize it is more about the exchange than about the perception because there is no separate perceiver from what is already like experience then it's kind of like what you said the mycelium the mycelium is more about the sharing of nutrients in our case of experiences of concepts of understanding of feelings emotion so it's more about what is going on on the level of sharing this experience than it is about me perceiving something you perceiving something yes yes very well said like in in math one of the most important ways of visualizing this as well it's been talked about for a while is that everything's about the relationships so when you look at something like this network theory with all these with all these nodes and with all the little lines between the nodes that the data that is exchanged in consciousness with itself is why we do this yes the information and the energy that is exchanged but within ourselves and between ourselves is is the way that this comprehends itself it's the way that it dances with itself so another way of saying like what you were indicating is that being the mycelium means that you are everybody and everything that's happening between everybody and you are another way of thinking about it is like dissolving all of the barriers completely between all of the different people as well as all of the different animals and all of the different creatures all of that and being the entire planet being the entire solar being the entire galaxy the whole universe being that being that like being like the earth and the solar system that is here and the earth and the solar system on the other side it's you it's still you over there undergoing a dance it's still you over there going a dance and and then you also see that it's like an entire comprehensive like the mycelium extend itself beyond the earth to the whole universe and that's all doing the comprehension that's all doing the information and energy exchange doing work reality as information and energy doing work and so to to get this shift you have to again it's about this decreasing if you're not decreasing your separation conditioning if your direct experience from micro dosing is and and your integration afterward if it's not like you feeling less separation conditioning less like sadness and anger and unhappiness and suffering then something's happening in the mix where your your intention isn't set for the awakening but when your intention is set for awakening then you'll notice in your direct experience less suffering more happiness less separation more oneness more peace seeing that everywhere being that um yeah that's the core for me yeah that reminded me of um something that I learned from Rupert Spira um I love him it's um I think one of the most clear teachings or teachers um out there and his emphasis is always on if you want an answer and you look for some conceptualization of how to explain what is experienced to go back to experience because all that is can be never known is here in experience available and when you just mentioned that you see the whole universe everything as one it must be recognized here not in concept not in rational understanding it you see that here right now and one example of how this unfolds is my very direct experience if I speak from that right now there is no difference between me listening to you speaking and me listening to laubert speaking it is all one unfolding you could say it's unfolding in consciousness but that would be already too much there is no consciousness separate from this one unfolding and in there as you just emphasized is a sense of growing freedom or from that comes the sense of growing freedom because it is only the sense of being a restricted self that is then creating the feeling of limitation through having an illusory difference between it and something else perfect but when you and for me and also what Rupert Spira says this can really be seen all in direct experience and it is important to say what you or emphasize what you also just said is if your intention is right that you want to recognize this then your experience will give you the give you all that is necessary in order to recognize it yes yes because you are the stylist you are the painter you are god you are the creator and so you with your will with your choice you determine your reality and so if at the top of your desire list is awakening then you will manifest more and more of the direct experience of you awakening if your top of your desire list is trying to decrease your separation conditioning through substances and through relationships through material possessions you will you'll run into a wall repeatedly and you'll wonder why is this why am I experiencing like a oh well while I was you know orgasming or having sex or whatever that oh like I felt you know my sense of self wasn't there the people don't know those words and so they just call it like sex or orgasm or love or whatever even though it's a really perverted form of of when they use the word love but that that's basically what they're going for and so they're going for the the slipping away of the self but they don't know that that's the case and so the most simple way to slip away of the self is to recognize that I'm god I am the stylist I am the painter and I may as well put awakening at the top of my of my desire list for for being and then in that process what will manifest for me is for example it will manifest content like this it will manifest a connection to a micro dosing connection or a oh you know you'll stumble across Ramana Maharshi and you'll start inquiring into who am I you'll you'll you'll maybe run into um one of the like Bentino's meditation mastery retreat and you'll learn concentration and meditation and realization and duration so there's um if you if you put it at the top of your desire list it'll happen if you have it in like rank number 10 in your desires is truth and awakening then you see where that's going to go so yeah how do you combine the view from the human where free will seems to be limited where you cannot decide what is happening in society at large where you are subject to certain things in your environment that seemingly are not under your control with the realization that you are the one and that you are creating everything out of your own love for existence how did you like how did you like how how how do these two viewpoints go together and give me the two viewpoints again so from our perspective from the human perspective it seems what we can decide with our free will is very limited and on the other hand when you have the realization of oneness it is clear that still everything is coming from you but not from the human so where is like the where is the all-encompassing free will where is that is that originated somewhere or how would you describe it let's see if i understood the the question um yeah so for me the way that i see it is that um intelligent infinity creates first awareness it creates will it creates choice it creates the ability to perceive the ability to know its creation and then it creates love and light and so everything's composed of awareness love and light um and you can think about it like the electromagnetic dance that everything is subatomically is that love and light and awareness dancing with itself playing with itself um so again information and energy you can't go any you can't take reality down any further than information and energy you just can't and so that's what awareness love light is um now in terms of the human the human starts with how i see it it starts with frozen will it starts with subconscious unconscious patterns habits that are more primal that are more animalistic now this doesn't mean that there's not you're not going to find the um you're not going to find the occasional sage from uh you know 10 000 or even 100 000 years ago you might you might find an occasional sage back then um but um so generally we're we in a pattern of becoming self-aware and then um so intelligent infinity becomes self-aware through this vales veil and then um in that process it unfreezes more and more of its will and choice from its conditioning and its patterns around separation um and ego and personal bubbles um and it shifts more and more towards um having like air-like will so it like it feels more and more of its stylus like basically right now only by being like silent and still can i like really feel the stylus like really clearly and that's also what's meant by you know nirvana the complete cessation of all movement that you feel that that you that you are that that you are that absolute permanent changeless reality that is what gives rise to endless change to infinite creation but so when you're still when you're totally still like right now we're using words and we're exchanging words but when you're super still when you're super silent you can feel the air-like stylus you can feel that you have this will and choice to whatever you want next whatever you want next whatever you desire next um but if you're reactive and if you're um moving at a pace of in taking a stimuli and subconsciously or unconsciously getting triggered and then moving in that behavior pattern um more of your will is is frozen you're not conscious you're not awake to the stylus the air-like stylus so that's one way to to put that um but again it's really important that the absolute and the human become transcended like the distinction between the two becomes transcended um so even um um uh a creature that or you know a human that is still very frozen for you will um is the same as um the sage that is um solely meditating on god all day um okay so would you say that um you could express this also as a cutting away of the of the drive you you could say you know from our perspective it seems like they are coming from the past so our conditionings that are usually in our like for the regular like let's say normie they are driving our behavior and in that sense or to the degree that we have these fixed concepts of how reality is going to behave in that sense or to that degree we are unfree yes and on the flip side to the degree that we can remain present in the presence of what is there is less and less conditioning yeah and in that falling away of conditioning arises the freedom for it to unfold in an infinite or as an infinite possibility yeah that's yeah that's what it would feel like yep um but then at the same time it is in the presence that it seems to be free no in the presence it is free and from the perspective of putting that presence into time closing it between past and future that it seems unfree yeah so for me in in my perception it's mainly the concept of time that yeah yeah liberate yourself from that and and you'll and you'll be like that's probably one of the biggest um conditionings it's time yeah yeah yeah destroy that um with love light and um and you're so much freer time time is one of the biggest ones along with separation yeah time is one of the biggest ones yeah did you do any per specific um meditations contemplations in order to dissolve the self sense of solidity in the concept of time or the concept of time well well yeah so I would say that for for the vast majority of awakening um like if you would to pair micro dosing um I would pair it with self inquiry um you can also pair it with um just classic concentration and meditation but I actually think that self inquiry can basically take you all the way I don't even necessarily think that you need um micro dosing I think self inquiry can basically take you all the way to awakening um so for example with time so basically you can use the intellect to go beyond the intellect in a sense you can use um like rationality and logic um to kind of grok um your nature your true nature you can grok infinity um so like one of the most simple ways to do that would be to like recognize yourself like this is like you can just jump straight there you don't necessarily need to like like investigate time like from like kindergarten to fifth grade to ninth grade to college like like you can go straight there by just by just doing a um like you know you see yourself as um like the grand theft auto character and instead of identifying with the grand theft auto character you should be the xbox or the play station that is playing infinite games um and so then you see oh shit well I'm not just a character my identity is actually the very fabric of existence of eternity or infinity itself like that's my identity and then you sort of liberate yourself from the time trap faster but like if you do want to take it a little more gradually for people that are that are listening um um I've made a good amount of content on this but like one of the most simple ways is to just recognize how much of an illusion all of the symbols are on a clock like the symbols on the clock itself are just a bunch of squiggly lines that are representative of how we measure the earth spinning that's it the earth rotating on its axis is one earth day and then we label that with little squiggly lines and another one is that you take like the earth that orbits the sun every 365.25 days and you're like well that's some fucking arbitrary ass number like one year is 365.25 days it's just arbitrary numbering um to represent something useful for us um so that we can you know more easily you know you and I can meet up for this show at a specific time and it works in that sense but so if you sort of like for generality to like liberate yourself more and more from what was like another one is you know biological impermanence is another one like oh shit like I'm this impermanent biological creature and because of that I'm locked into believing that I'm the body and and um you have to like the neti neti method or the not this not that method of declining the body and declining the thinking mind so that you can then recognize yourself capital s god infinity and then you can include the body and the thinking mind you can include it after you can see god as the body and you can see god as the thoughts totally and you can radically love and accept them as they are but you can't start at impermanence you have to start at seeking permanence seeking what is infinite seeking what your truest nature is and then recognizing that ah that pure potentiality which is my truest nature is actualizing itself as these seemingly different fireworks in a dance with itself and then I will eternally be doing this and then that's where you liberate yourself from the impermanence and then you can include the impermanence yeah that's so great that just got me thinking about how this unfolded very practically in um my meditation sessions and maybe if I describe this this may help someone so um let me just uh say how how I very directly worked on dissolving this sense of being something happening in time um nice we all know when we meditate and we start we um usually most people start on with concentrating on the breath and then you sit there and you think okay I'm breathing I'm breathing in I'm breathing out and you let that be your anchor but then when you are aware of your breath you can also become aware that that is not the only thing that you are aware of right now you are also aware of your concept of breathing and that is happening or that is creating your sense of time if we like let's say only look at the breath and we can really crowd out all other other thoughts then in that moment of really being only with the breath our idea of that we are breathing is creating time and you can see that for yourself when you are separating the two and you are only aware of what is happening really right now that is maybe a sensation that you would would call breathing in but in that moment you thinking that it is part of a breath that is then followed by something breathing out and it was previously you were breathing in that is how in this very moment you create and in every moment you create a sense of time and when you can sort these two out like your concepts about what is happening right now from the flow of experience then you are you are stepping outside of time and you see that you cannot create time outside of this presence because every time you do that it arises as a thought it arises as a concept as a context for what you are experiencing nice yeah and for me I just had to look at this over and over and over again to like finally see very clearly that oh these are actually two different things because when you just start meditating it seems like one thing it seems like your breath is what it is but there is actually the experience and the concepts that are so entangled that it's not easy to see at first yeah and you can extend that even further to not only time but just go even take it all the way again much of this show is about taking it all the way as efficiently as possible and just take your name all the way like your name is just the concept so funny that you say that yeah I just did this today because in the past I often like repeated my name over and over again and back then it felt strange because there was something there was somehow a story connected to my name and it felt weird to repeat my name over and over again because then it was somehow no longer there was there was no longer this story with the name if you repeated often but today when I did that there was no more story no more it didn't arise anymore I don't know how to describe it but yeah yeah and so you take the two three four five six seven symbols that are strung together for your name and the five symbols strung together for my name and you just deconstruct it and then you're like oh shit it's just a bunch of squiggly lines strung together as symbols that then we use these vocal vibrations to get this this individuation's attention and then you recognize that your entire life like we talked about has been self-referential it's been self-reinforcing self-simulating and that you liberate yourself from that that construction project that you've been doing your whole life of separation conditioning and this little five symbol seven symbol strung together name and then you dissolve into being the one and you which you've been the whole time but you've yeah and so then the the other side to this is that if you put a name like we call the universe the universe you know we put a name to the whole thing right we put a name to it um and like if you called um this if you called this universe um like uh let's say 78 and then you call um you just you gave it a name you gave this a name that you can then deconstruct again you can deconstruct 78 you can also deconstruct universe the word itself with the strung together symbols um and all that's left is just the very fact that we are just that i am just that this is um is just what's left and it's not as um yeah and that and that's the thing is like we can use all these symbols and we can talk we can do this symbol exchange with vibration and whatnot and it's it's good and i've been doing it 784 um of these um shows and um you know i guess one thing that i'm really you know feeling like more and more after like four plus years of of doing this um is that like is just so truth is beyond the vocal vibrations and it's um so that's why like you know i've been messaged a lot the last couple of months about you know like well what's up with content and stuff like that and um well it just feels like i am truth more than i've ever been before and so now it's sort of about like honing in on it so much so clearly so precisely that basically everything that i you know speak or do or am or be um moving forward will just be even more precisely it um and so that's you know that's one of the things to consider as you micro dose like don't run off right away and tell everybody about your experience because you're going to get a lot of people that tell you that you deserve to be in a mental hospital or that you um and or like your parents will put you on pharmaceuticals or something you know there's there's a bunch of fucked up things that still happen in the modern day like if you if you have an experience of the is-ness and then you go everything is one and you start you know telling everybody that you're going to get slapped um and so it's it's it's something to remember along the journey is to basically take your realizations um and find the right people to talk to them about and it's going to be hard because it's still not that much of the planet is super open to talking about micro dosing and awakening on a on a consistent basis but finding that community where you can openly share about your micro dosing experience or about your realizations or about when you're reading the law of one and you're studying intelligent infinity or whatever um that you have people that you can talk to it about that can then reflect you where you may still have some separation conditioning because they've already went through those patterns before so you can accelerate the depletion of your separation conditioning from 100 or from 90 or wherever you're at to to 20 or below just by finding a really good as in buddhism the triple gem you have sangha you need the community you need this aspect to it as well you it's not just the buddhist not just the awaken one it's not just the teachings the dharma the path but it's also the sangha it's the community it's this lineage it's the all of the people all of the entheogens all of the direct path teachings all of the um shift from um a sleepening to awakening in the rapid um rapidization of that process um it's your best friend and so find the other people find the others there are no others it's hilarious but find them the ones that um do uh know this and surround yourself with them as fast as possible along the way yeah that was my experience i also in the beginning was more eager to talk about my experiences and insights to people and over the last years i have refrained from doing that because it is not communicate communicatable to people who have no experience of it at all who have no idea of what you are doing there um if they are open and if people approach me that and say hey i i feel like there's you have something there and i'm interested in that then i i try to find out where they are at and how can i how i can speak to them and what can fall on fruitful ground um but yeah in general as you said it's not possible to communicate it and so the sangha where you are with other people who just are there you can just be in silence and it's the most beautiful communication because if you are truly at the level with someone yes then yes then you say one word and it's enough or you don't even say anything exactly because you're vibrating at the frequency of god in most like simple terms you're vibrating at the frequency of god or you're vibrating at the frequency of the one or you're vibrating at the frequency of love light awareness of the is this that it all is without separation conditioning you're vibrating without separation conditioning um and so so take um your time in sangha or take your time in silence like we talked about where you just pause and you're just still and you feel yourself as the stylist as the painter as that paintbrush with unlimited will and potential to express yourself however you see fit and take that and just recognize it more and more every single day more and more you're with somebody ah take a moment and just recognize in that moment that you're the one talking to itself with this other person and just yeah more and more every day every day you know bintinho talks about it as two to five seconds every single day more and more you know and zhokchen one of the most common teachings is just recognize empty cognizance over and over again over and over recognize empty cognizance empty cognizance empty cognizance talking to itself and what talking to itself at a certain point i feel it becomes more like an instrumental song whereas before you try to intellectualize and extract something from the teaching nice the more you listen to it it becomes more like the end in itself like a song that has no words nice nice and that's what it feels like and when you at a certain point read books or hear teachers or be with them it's more what is not said in the words it's more what how the words are said or that they are there at all you could also say and in in a similar way i i just this weekend was on a trip to berlin for a 30s birthday of a friend of mine and you know these parties where you are involved in a lot of small talk you and you approach all of these people not from the mind but from the heart yeah and you allow them to just be as an expression of consciousness then you connect to them much deeper and i have found fascinating people that kind of were able to pick that up not many most of them were still a lot of them were consumed in their stories but a few and those were all women who were like more attuned to this heart-centered openness of consciousness and they they quickly like connected to that i could feel that and it goes you communicate then just on a different level it's not about the words so much anymore and you are connected in consciousness in the heart and it is beautiful to experience this flow of communication through the heart and not through the mind yep yep and and ramana and many other mystics i've talked about just as soon as um as soon as you really have this anchored um there will come a time when you just forget everything that you've ever learned and that's some fucking insane shit it's basically like um yeah it's basically like you know bentino had an exercise that he gave the no limits community where he basically said you know destroy all of your memory period like let go of all of your memories of that you've ever had ever like and that's like the most fundamental like emptying exercise you can imagine um and when you're that empty everything's just hyperfast refresh rate because nothing is triggering your conditioning nothing's triggering any memories nothing's triggering any ways that you've previously perceived reality everything is always fresh and new and infant like totally how would you do that well here's silence i'm saying like silence and stillness is how to do it because like a really simple one is somebody will be like republican and then all of a sudden you'll have this fucking big word cloud pop up about republicans and all your thoughts about them or like democrat the big word cloud pops up or africa although china the word cloud pops up mom word cloud pops up money word cloud pops up with all of your thoughts about that um and instead watch how magical it is when somebody says money and it's just five symbols strung together into a vibration and you just have no reference point to what that is and it's just let go of it the moment it stops the word yeah it basically dissolves into emptiness is one of the ways to to say yeah how would one do that with uh visual objects because for example i try to like tune into what you just said with the with the guitar that's standing there behind the camera and i see the guitar and it's not just the shape and the color i know it's just that in the experience but when i see this guitar there are also kind of as a context subconsciously vibrating all my memories of it and it's the same for when other people that you have some shared experience and past history with when they appear in your life you i feel at least you cannot see them as just a fresh new experience and there is this past and your memory always kind of vibrating in that experience how would one do that in this case yeah yeah so you're not um making it non-recallable so it's still recallable yeah but you're completely free so when the guitar appears you don't have the triggers come up of all these memories playing guitar the things that i still want to do with the guitar blah blah blah instead what happens is the guitar appears it disappears and then what you do from a fresh place is then you with your stylist you create whatever reality you want with that guitar if you want to go and pick it up and play you will if you don't want to you won't if you want to if you want to play the piano you will it's just it just becomes um like when somebody says the word mom like instead of have or dad instead of having the word cloud about mom or dad come up which is um i like these things about my parents i don't like these things about my parents um blah blah blah the whole stories the whole narratives instead what you do is you just see the concept appear and disappear and just dissolve and then from a free place rather than a triggered place from a free place then you can come as whatever you wish like ah yeah moms yeah cool yeah dad's cool you know whatever from a free spontaneous place that doesn't have any conditioning um enravelled within it and this is another thing that microdose will show you and i know we wanted to talk about um a little bit about lsd and 5m u dmt as well and the differences and what not but we kind of actually talked about that a little bit when we were doing the mountain analogy because in essence generally magic mushrooms and lsd will take you on the gondola ride depending on the dosage again this 3000 meter mountain that so on lower dosages they'll take you less up the mountain on higher dosages they'll take you all the way but they'll take you all the way on the gondola ride and then back down over a longer period of time whereas 5m u dmt is like the much faster gondola ride super fast and it also like we're talking like the difference is maybe 30 minutes 5m u dmt versus 6 to 8 hours magic mushrooms or lsd and so we're also talking about the rapid the rapid the rapidness of the dissolution of the ego structure so that's what we mean by that mountaintop and so and again we talked about integration as well being so critical here like you have to integrate what you're seeing at the top of the mountain in your day to day experience um otherwise um the intention of awakening is not present the whole intention of awakening is to integrate one this into direct daily experience doesn't get more simple than that yeah yes um the experience itself i have felt is can still be very different in content um the earlier very deep mushroom experiences of mine they have been very chaotic there was no sense no reference point no sense of any recognition of what was happening there was no for example um maybe this can give like a feeling of how insane such an experience can be is i was standing in my room and i felt in my throat this sense of thirst there was just this sensation and i was aware of it but there was no ability to conceptualize this sensation at all so while i was seeing my bottle of water there in the room i wasn't able to make any connection at all between i have to drink water for this feeling to go away like even the idea of water wasn't there i was standing in my room and i was pouring the bottle on the ground you know something you wouldn't do because such an experience on mushrooms especially they can show you a lot of individual um conditioning fears you have the fear of going insane right you you are conditioned to believe that sanity is something good and insanity is something bad and you fear insanity a lot and you that's what's keeping you thinking in the ways that you do and so different compounds can face can put you face to face with different conditionings and fears yeah that's my experience yeah yeah and and based on the strains based on the dosages they will unravel conditionings absolutely and they will be different flavors we also talked about that a little bit but they're going to be different flavors again the reason why i highly recommended magic mushrooms is because it's the most in my opinion just the most decentralizing or universalizing in the most kind of like soft gentle loving way in my opinion and have you tried two cb i haven't yet no two cb okay i haven't had like a major trip on it but the micro dosing experiences they were incredibly promising i would say um the the vibe they had i feel is very loving they say also it's a combination of mdma and lsd in its effect and so i feel i want to research that chemical more just to feel more comfortable recommending it to people because it doesn't have the downsides of mdma it has no tolerance you build up no tolerance to it and it it leaves the part to reason about your experience intact so oh interesting yeah you don't get that mind fuck component that you can get on mushroom oh you totally mind fucked totally yeah you can't reason while it's going on at the higher dosages you're surrendered like you said it's surrendered yeah in that sense two cb is more more i think it's a better entrance psychedelic for people who have very deep fears about losing their minds about going insane because it somehow leaves that ability to reason about what you experience right now in tech and that is i find very fascinating so i want to look into it a lot more in the future yeah while you were all you were sharing i just started kind of like researching it a little bit more yet comes in this uh i also have like in this powder form and you um you can just also ingest it like lsd you can snort it or even pluck it but um it's it's a very very gentle experience and because it's in this mdma like it has this um what's that what's the english name this um empathogenic quality to it i feel it's very um very friendly experience and you can surrender much easier to the insights you have because it feels so loving cool cool yeah it's really interesting um i think it's worldwide it's still um or not maybe not worldwide but yeah very it's not legal in most countries but it's a very interesting uh substance cool brah yeah i mean you are probably also aware of this channel actualize.org for sure leo yeah leo he is uh he had a trip report maybe three years ago or something like that and it is a very very um yeah very interesting trip for sure and um anyone who is watching i can recommend uh there is interest in that substance to check that trip report out nice nice yeah i'm feeling i'm feeling do we have anything yeah yeah i'm feeling like intention is like feeling like it's good like in terms of like coming to a close do you feel like there are other things that you want to um discuss um no i think we have pretty much covered a lot of ground i mean it is definitely not all um we didn't say everything about psychedelics it's the most complex topic there is probably out there so unravels the ego separation conditioning and how it then create catalyzes awakening like that's a very um we did a good job covering that as the essence of which which is the point like there's no other point to do entheogens except to unravel your separation conditioning so that you can awaken like in terms of truth truth like pursuing truth like otherwise you're just pursuing an experience which is still trying to dissolve separation conditioning and feel truth anyway yeah yeah it's it's trying that but you have to combine it with your intention to make it work yep really well and that is also why many people can take things like lsd or two cb in a party setting and don't get any spiritual insights out of it the intention is just not there and so whenever you go into a trip know that how you approach it from a mental set point is very important um and also yeah all the um safety concerns uh are don't just go blindly into like a high dose i think what we recommended here in this talk is very important to start low it's always better recommendations and then to say start with a heroic dose um i think that's uh irresponsible so yeah i'm also going to put in the bio um the healing hustlers um so it's two of my closest friends they're um producing some of the absolute best um magic mushrooms in all the united states and um i'll put the link in the bio below and people can um buy directly from them um so for people that want um and i know they ship all across the us and i think they're um they can ship potentially across um maybe um internationally so yeah so i'll put the link in the bio below for you guys if you do want to try a micro dose like a half gram or a full gram or if you've already um if you want to go 3000 meters up your little heroic dose um so but remember to combine it with a self inquiry and with meditation contemplation with other things that we were talking about here um and and yeah make sure you're doing this intelligently with um with well um educated um people with well educated people with um um also with with smart environments like your ambiance is intentionality like we've been talking about so many times your intention being for awakening that in itself will create such a good experience for you um such good insight and realization for you um so yeah yeah one thing i would like to mention is um if you go with psychedelics as you mentioned before you don't have to do them you could reach these insights maybe it takes longer but you can reach them through self inquiry meditation alone but if you choose to go with psychedelics be aware that there is the possibility of having so many great insights that you are neglecting your dualistic life because we all have to like work earn money that's still all not going away when you have deep mystical experiences and so having an experience a mystical experience from the place of having your life in order feels much better than starting from chaos chaos so um i would advise people if they don't go the slow and steady meditation routine for which you need to have your life in order in order for that to work long term um then be careful not to like overdo it too quickly and neglect because it tends to cause people to neglect their other responsibilities in life and at the end there is only this it is to be enjoyed and so live your best life whether you take psychedelics or not beautiful brother yeah i think that was a great conversation me too bro and also everyone can check out laritz's youtube channel um it's conscious development the link is in the bio below also um so check it out go and watch his content um he's uploading quite frequently and he's got a lot of great content on there and go and support him subscribe um like his content share his channel um with other people and also same thing goes for um our video as well like uh like the video um helps the algorithm like it subscribe to the channel if you haven't yet comment below with your thoughts on the video we'd love to hear from you and share the video with other people that you feel like this would positively benefit especially around micro dosing and awakening and what that process is like and what it is actually all about and um thanks brother would agree yeah thank you a lot for having me like for this opportunity really enjoyed it me too bro yeah great okay nice thanks everyone for tuning in we love you very much you and i will stick in the studio i'll just end the stream okay yeah bye everyone bye see you great