 Okay, well, thank you all very much for joining us today. We're going to talk about the national digital strategies, and we're lucky to have great speakers today. By the way, we were going to bring with us the Prime Minister of Portugal, but he had something else, so we're not going to have him today, but I think we have a little bit of technical data, some plays around here, the Minister. We have a very big, great leader, BT, and then we have the largest bank in Russia, but we also have two political leaders, Mr. Kagame, who is the President of Rwanda, but who also is a Chair of the Broadband Commission, and therefore somebody who's been promoting the more extensive dissemination of digital competencies and capacities, and I leave for last, but not least, our hostess, and what I mean hostess, I mean of the whole country, of the whole thing, you know, the President of the Council of Ministers of Switzerland, Doris Leutard. Obviously, we're speaking about a power, a potential, and in some cases, a question that is perceived as a threat, because when you're talking about the low-skilled working force of many countries, you don't always have this reception, this open arms to the digital, because there is this question about robotics and there's this question about displacement that is being discussed in practically every single, and which, by the way, was last year's main issue here in Davos. So we have also the issue of being focused on, for example, in the G20. The Germans have launched a digital project that will be delivered by the leaders in the G20, except it's a very short time to deliver, because of the elections and everything else. Already last year we did September rather than November, and this year we're going to do July, early July, rather than November. So you're really having four or five months less to put together things, to put together papers to do the thing, and therefore, it's not going to be such a finished product, if you will. It's going to be more focused on how do you do digital for the productivity, mostly for the manufacturing system, but we in the OECD, by the way, have embarked on a long-term project, actually a two-year project, to look at how digital affects and can affect the economies, people, education, health, and skills, skills, skills. And skills is a dividing line, because skills is where technology and digital can actually compete with the labor force, and at the same time, skills is the area which has the greatest potential in terms of delivery and improvement, and therefore allowing the labor force to have the necessary skills to deal with the new technology is including the digital, which then can become, let's say, both the means and the ultimate goal of dealing better with the digital. But it's one of the things where you basically say, do I get on or not? No. It's inevitable. It's unstoppable. It's just moving on, and whether it's in banking systems, whether it is in your broadband or whether it is simply to make the wheels of whole government work better, or whether you get to the sectors like education or like I said, health, et cetera, that these things are absolutely just unstoppable, inevitable, and therefore one has to embrace them, because we really do not have an alternative. The Germans started calling it, what, 4.0, and now it became kind of, that became viral. Everybody's talking about 4.0. It was also Klaus Schwab that wrote his book about the new revolution, the new industrial revolution, the new transformation revolution, et cetera. We have incorporated that into our PIAC, our adult skills program for, again, an integral element of productivity and competitiveness, productivity being under fire practically in every single one of the countries. So let me just start by asking some of the members here some questions about the issue that brings us together today. Let me start by President Lloyd Hart, Switzerland's challenges are rather different, let's say those faced by Russia or those faced by Rwanda. Switzerland is among the most advanced economies in the OECD in terms of digital development. And you've been directly involved in Switzerland, also because you were in the economy and you were in a number of others, plus having been the president before. So I suppose you feel quite comfortable in your chair as president this time around. And what is Switzerland seeking to achieve with this digital strategy this time in 2017 and beyond? And what you have learned from the experience so far, the pitfalls, the risks, but also some of the opportunities you may have found in the process. Well, yes, I think for governments, the approach was for a long time LWB, looked a little bit what happens in the industry, what happens in the different sectors, and we discussed what is the role of governments, happy to regulate, what happy to regulate, people are they well prepared, are SMEs are they aware of the changes? And now we have lost you, we developed a multi-stakeholder approach because you have to really cover all sectors of your economy, you have to bring in the private sector, you have to bring in science, you have to bring in also your education system. And we made a change of paradigm because so far I think it's available for all industrialized countries, I think we focus more on data protection for many years, and now we have to change for a data policy, so that we are aware all these data flows, all these data are a new fortune, have a value, and how can we also here deal with what is possible, what has to be controlled, data flows, we have to enrich the citizen, the simple citizen who must be the owner of his private data, how do we do that? And also the web now have an initiative where Switzerland is very much engaged, well is this some element of WTO, of future trading agreements, what is the role of WIPO, on intellectual property rights, so I think here we must be aware that our citizens feel well with all these changes. And finally what also President Kagame said, well a lot of ministers are talking about self-driving cars and smart houses, but finally this needs huge investments in broadband infrastructure. That's the base for all these changes, and last but not least, how can we really also educate our people, especially the not very skilled people, that they don't feel I'm again a loser, so first I was a loser in globalization, now I'm a loser in digitalization. This seems to me really a threat, and here we must be very aware of these bad feelings, and Switzerland tries to involve also our citizens from the beginning, that we really change our education system, and they have a profit from the beginning of all these new nice gadgets on the market. Thank you President Kagame, you are the chair of the Broadband Commission, which brings together authorities, also practitioners, some of the companies that are doing the broadband and who are operating, but also the international organizations that are trying to organize the trade, as a tool of development, for leapfrogging development stages, for reducing the distance, and for reducing the time that it takes for an emerging developing country like yours to move into modernity, to move into better standards of living, etc., and of course now that this is an SDG target, sustainable development goals, that's goal number nine, and target nine C, very specific. The question is there's still about, I don't know, four billion people offline. We're not talking about something which is generalized. How are you looking at it as a leverage instrument, as a lever for development, to accelerate the process in your own country, and of course in the region you know better, which is Africa. In a sense, we are starting from the very low base. None of this started, and we want to move as fast as possible, knowing the benefits, even with the dangers of ICTs, but we know the benefits outweigh the dangers, and the dangers can be managed and we focus on that. Let me start by saying we also believe from the outset that innovation will always be driven by the private sector, but government has a role to play in as far as integrating technologies generally, but also digital technology into policy and understanding how this affects the general population. So the social implications are well understood. So we have to work between the private sector, the drivers of innovation, and the government to make sure that the benefits are accessed, but also are distributed equitably among the people that we lead. That's where we come from. And we started by investing in a couple of areas. One, it is the infrastructure, as the President of the Swiss Federation has already mentioned, but infrastructure alone is not the way to go because the infrastructure that is put in place has to be used by the citizens and serve the public servants as well, and therefore make it available to make people aware of the existence of the possibility. You also, in our case where we have started from, we also have to mobilize, educate, simplify the understanding of how, what benefits ICTs bring, and also change the culture, in a sense, because once you have taken the national development strategy and integrated that with the digital strategy as a way of increasing productivity, as a way of efficiency, as a way of, you know, driving the economy to grow for the benefit of the people, cultures have got to change because it comes with openness, it comes, things are out there and maybe some people have not been used to that. So we have found that working together with the private sector, with all levels of our government, things are gradually changing, and the investments that have been made in the area of infrastructure have definitely created a lot of benefits, and we are seeing more understanding, more access to information that people did not have before, and therefore that has increased the productivity of all the processes the government has gone through. Let me go to our private sector participants. Gavin, you know, you are one of the leaders in the industry here, and at the same time there's a lot of demands on the industry itself, but also on the companies that are leading the charge, and of course governments have sometimes maybe inflated expectations about what can be delivered by the technology, they probably think it's like a panacea that everything can be resolved, etc. How do you look at this process, the interaction between the industry, progress in the technology itself, and then the applications down to the economy, to the business, etc., even to supporting the governments themselves? Well, digital strategy, digital policy, a digital framework, I think is critical in the development world. It is a fantastic enabler for prosperity, for social mobility, for education, and if got right, it can fundamentally change the prospects of any country. I think in the UK, the government over the last 10, 15 years have done a very good job of this, both conservative and Labour government, so it's been both sides of the party, if you like, both sides of government, promoting a digital agenda, and having the right dialogue with industry, having the right dialogue with content providers, to ensure that actually the outcomes for customers, for citizens, are very good, and you can see that in the numbers. The UK has the most developed Internet economy in the G20. Over 10% of the economy is dependent, or it relates to the Internet. E-commerce is over twice what it is per capita in the US, which is something people don't know. So it's whatever they've been doing, they've been doing something right, and if I sort of reflect on it, there's probably three things I would call out in particular. One is regulate to promote investment and competition, but in two things in particular, only intervene in the places where there is truly a bottleneck, number one, and number two, make that technology agnostic. So focus on the outcomes around particularly coverage and speed and resilience, but not pre-define which technology can be used. That, governments are not technology specialists. The industry should be playing that role. They should be in the position where they're continuing to innovate and drive new standards. And if they do, there are quite remarkable things that can be achieved on the same basic infrastructure. So I think the government have done a good job of that, overall, but occasionally in the UK they'll take a particular shine to one technology, but it should be the outcomes they're focused on. What do they want in terms of coverage? What do they want in terms of speed? I think the second thing is around adoption and inclusiveness and take-up. So take-up of the Internet is very high in the UK, but there are two groups in particular that are important, I think, to call out. One is there are still 12 million of the 65 million citizens in the UK that are online, and they do skew older. And it's important that government promotes the sort of programs that help the older parts of the population become, encourage them online and not see it as such a threat or a barrier. And then the second area is around, I would say, around tech education, tech literacy. So the government made tech literacy and coding part of the curriculum in primary schools. Very important coding. And that is because they recognize the new language. Exactly. The same as reading, writing, and it's a lingua franca. And so it was a very smart move. It was the Conservative government a few years ago. And we're beginning to see the benefits now. Because in every country, there's a shortage of people with tech skills. And it's no longer going to be part of just a few people's jobs. If you look forward, it's going to be part of everybody's job. So we've been helping them teach the teachers how to code through BT. And in the last year, we've, last two years, we've been able to help 28,000 teachers learn how to code and then teach over a million kids over the last two years. And that will be 5 million within the next three. And that's really important. And it's important because it also promotes tech literacy to boys and girls so that they both see it is both gender see that is a career that they want to get into. Because that that is a particular issue later in life that it skews very male. And that's not seizing the full attention of technology. Then the final thing, and I'll stop on this, is around safety and security. And it's a theme I think we're all talking about. That's that's an issue I wanted to pick up with you a little later, but might as well do it now just to headline it. It's it's on security. It's a very dynamic picture. And it's critical that the government play a role in making the network safe, promoting safe behavior online and ensuring that the networks are secure. So it is both. It's an education responsibility on one hand, but it's also working particularly with all the players across the value chain to ensure that the networks are safe, resilient and able to respond if they are attacked. And that's a role that government need to play, I think, and in the UK, I think it's a very good job. Sure, you're basically you declare yourself kind of satisfied that in the case of UK, at least, the government has been conducive, or at least has not blocked progress. But at the same time that in those areas that do not depend on the companies themselves, the government has been, let's say, constructive in terms of allowing for education to be spread, etc. Yeah, very much so. So they are aware they're very aware. Nobody's complacent. We're not sitting here smugly thinking how good we are. We're looking forward and recognizing that if we don't keep evolving as a country, particularly with Brexit coming shortly, in theory, anyway, that we will will lose this very good position we have when it comes to using the internet as a way of promoting both social policy, but also prosperity. Good. Maybe we'll get back to the Brexit question in a moment. But German graph, you run and have been running for quite some time now, besides being a minister of the economy and, you know, the trusted advisor to the president and the prime ministers. And now you you you you turn into a banker, and now you're the largest banker. And of course, you work, bankers being, by the way, in terms of leading edge users of the technology and using. But at the same time, you are working in the context of a national digital strategy, which of course is set by the Russian authorities. And at the same time, you are in a position, perhaps a unique position, where you can also actually help define and shape the national digital strategy by being a very important user and being so important that you can basically then suggest ways in which the broader public can benefit in the exchange with the practitioners or the technologists, etc. How do you see your role there? And at the same time, what has been your experience in that sense? Thank you very much for your question. And I would like to speak about these two, your two questions. The first first, first of all, I can say that we have a great opportunity in the current situation to improve our to improve our states. Yeah. Because such huge opportunities which we have now, I think we have a unique moment now. If you look at the share of GDP, which we can call the digital part of the economy, the largest part of digital economy has great Britain now. It's around 10 or 11%. It's not dating. But now you are number one in the world. If you speak about the Russian situation, we have only 4%. If you look at 2025, this share will be around 50%. It means that the all participants, which will be successful in the way of digital transformation, they can get abnormal advantages. And if you speak about the banking sector, it's one of the most conservative industries in the world. But what we can see in the banking now that it's a 100% disruptive situation, because in the next five years, we can see such a lot of changes in the banking sector that we can never see during the last 50 years. And now we have worked very hard on the way on digital transformation of our company. We have one of the largest European banks. We have 130 million customers in Russian Europe. And Turkey and if you look at our future, now we have 330,000 employees. But in 2025, I think we will have half of them. And if you look at our services, now we have a lot of offline services. 98% of our relations with the corporates we make digital. But only 50% of our operations with private customers now have in the digital area. But I think in eight years, it will be around 100%. And if we speak about the speed, I think we must be prepared for real-time services. And we must be prepared for that. What we must do for that. And in our case, we must change our technological platform. Because what's, if you speak about the banks, bank now is a big IT company. But if you look at our existing IT systems, this is the old legacy and very complicated systems. And we can't compete with such very important computers like Google or Facebook or WeChat in China. Because the very fast young companies have very good skills on the digitalization. Now we can say that without creation, the new platform, with our self capacities, it's impossible to be a digital company. And you can hire Gavin to help out. I'd be very happy to. And the second question is the mobility. Because the customers would like to have an online service. And if you speak about Russia, we have 150 million people, but 200 million mobile phones. And 60% of them, these are the smartphones. And this is a very good conditions for making mobile business with them and making mobile and online services for them. And it's impossible to be successful in this way if you don't connect your services with governmental services. That's why we're working together with government to build a new national digital strategy. I think it's a good examples around the globe. But one of the best examples which I have seen is the Singapore. This is a program that I run, the second program, five years long program, which they call Smart Nation. And it's a very good example about the collaboration between private sector and the government. Because without this type of collaboration, it's impossible to build digital national digital strategy. And we can't say that we can't build digital environment. Okay. And I would like to speak about the last question. What kind of gaps we have? And what kind of problems we can have in the few years in the next future? First of all, we must work very hard with the educational system. Because now we speak about three different type of skills. If you speak about the digital economy, the hard skills or professional skills, I think that we have enough experienced leaders and enough experienced employee in our companies. But the second one, this is the soft skills. Based on the emotional intelligence, collaboration, problem solving and leadership. And I think it's a big gap. For example, in my company, it's a first goal. And now we work very hard with many great universities for establishing the special programs to improve the soft skills in the companies. And the third part of these skills, this is the digital skills. And if you look at the professional education now, nobody teaches the students of the digital skills. But I think it's universal skills, which will be very important for each professional and depend from the area or industry in which they're involved now. And the last topic about the threats, I think if you speak about our experience, the first problem in our relations with the government, this is the or regulation. And for example, now we have such a disruptive technologies like blockchain or virtual currencies. If you speak about the central banks about the virtual currencies, they tried to regulate it immediately and say, excuse me, could you have a little bit more time for understanding what kind of outputs we can get from these new technologies? And if they, when the technologies will be ready, then you can regulate it, but not before. Okay. And the last topic, this is the cybersecurity. This is a topic, this topic, I think very important for all of us. Now, in our practice, we have 98% of cyber crimes. And it was 100% changed during the last 10 years. It's impossible to have efficient organization without big part of cybersecurity. And we need to build a special mechanism to mechanisms to international collaboration. Okay. Great. I was going to address that particular question the second round, but I'm happy that you did that. President Kagame, do you find that the international scene is propitious, pertinent, appropriate, conducive, cooperative with your aims to disseminate the question of digital in a country like yours? Or do you find that there are impediments, there are blockages, technological, political, financial or otherwise? What would you need? What would you ask for on behalf of the developing countries in the world to say make the most out of the progress on the digital sphere for the purpose of accelerating development in your countries? Well, I think that you will find the problems almost everything. So this is not without problems. But I think we focus mainly on the solutions and the benefits and then try to get rid of the problems. But we have found good understanding with many partners who come together with it is governments or the private sector. Because much as we want to make these investments in these technologies, it's not necessarily done in a way of just giving anything for free. People try to work around business models that with the investments made in many cases, you can have returns. But try to do it in a certain way that it becomes affordable to the majority of people, especially when we have been talking about connecting the unconnected, the big number you mentioned close to four billion that have not been connected. We are therefore talking about a huge potential. We are talking about a big number that if connected, in the end, they actually contribute to the good returns looking at the numbers in the world without necessarily having to make it very expensive for people to access these technologies and use them for their daily activities. So there has been a lot of cooperation. I'll give you a quick example. In our case, after making the investments in infrastructure, we have laid fiber over 4,000 kilometers of fiber across the country connecting all the districts or different parts of our country. We have entered into a partnership. This is why I was talking about public-private partnership that could benefit this kind of strategy. We partnered with Correa Telecom and they have helped the country develop. We now have 4G LTE network in the country, which we are rolling out across the country. What we did with them was, therefore, to make sure that the other providers have access to these at all sale prices given by Correa Telecom so that all other providers do not have to make the kinds of investments in the infrastructure, but rather one entity made the investments and the others by wholesale from and that made it cheap, made it accessible and we are seeing very good progress. In fact, if you look at where the country was in 2005, we only had 3% of our people having access to internet. Now, in 2016, last year, we have 33%. There was that huge leap in fact in 2020, we are expecting to have universal access on that. So I think there has been cooperation, there has been good understanding and there has also been increased awareness of our people, not just in Rwanda, in the region of East Africa, where we have also 4G partnerships among ourselves. When we are talking about development and the aid and support, etc., we normally think about water wells and you normally think about schools. You normally think about the sanitation and things like that. Would you go out there and say, I'd like to get support from you on broadband, on access, on technology, do you find responsive? Do people understand that you are trying to move a country like Rwanda into the 21st century and therefore that the concept has to change in terms of what they have to provide? Absolutely. I think there is increased understanding and people also have been changing their attitudes. Exactly. Shifting from aid, we get in Africa being that of just you know, fixing grants for specific projects. Yes. And I think we've been talking long term. We are saying no, we need to make the investments that we lost that can be scaled up to you know, touch people's lives long term and also enable people to actually be able to provide what they want for themselves. Okay. And we have seen a big difference, especially with the international institutions. We have gone to the World Bank or have gone to the African Development Bank or even partners, countries like Switzerland and other countries, when we go to them and say, you know, we have this project. This is the way it is going to work. And we can even agree with them and say, let's put in place a mechanism to measure the problems so that people providing their money are assured that the money did what it was. There will be accountability and also, yes. Absolutely. So there is good response we are finding with the purchase. Okay. Dersloy, whenever we speak about Switzerland, we feel that all the problems are solved. You know, there is a kind of some kind of a, you know, place out there where people are happy and, you know, they obviously not necessarily the case. But in this relatively, let's say, cutting edge society of Switzerland, cutting edge economy, what it is that you feel that keeps you awake at night vis-à-vis the technological development, digital, et cetera, that may be removing the cutting edge in terms of advantage. Because at the same time, you have to remain always on the cutting edge to be competitive. Yes. It's a relatively small economy, very open economy, therefore very dependent on being able to use the best and the latest in order to stay in that situation. How do you, you're running the country now. How do you look at that now? How is this challenge challenging you? First, I'm very happy that you think we have no problems. I just said that this was the impression. I mean, like the Costa Rican is like to say, we are, we are the Switzerland of Latin America, things like that. Everybody says they're the Switzerland of someplace. We want to tell them that the president of Switzerland loses sleep over these things too. Well, we like to be also on the top rankings on innovation and on competitiveness. So I think what Hernan Greff mentioned for me. I'm going to go to the audience immediately after. So please prepare. Yes. For me, one question really easier. What have you to regulate and where we can really wait and see. And in our strategy, we position Switzerland as enabler, enabler. So the government really has to care. I think there's a consensus about education and research, public money here. We have a role to play. I think here, Switzerland will doing fine because I think especially with vocational training in this sector of people who have not an academic level here, we have to improve their skills. And and and here we will we will focus. Second, what really drives me is also data data policy because well, I don't see a lot of competition between companies. You're like, well, we have Google, we have Facebook, some big companies who are quite champions and they got my data. They have such a knowledge, such well, visibility on every citizen of the world. And I would like to have more competition, more companies which I can trust first and which I can really say, OK, even if they get my data, there's no nonsense, there's no abuse. And I have also something to say. And here, I think here also we have a political level of how can we create also a framework on data policy that the owner, the simple citizen of these data has at least some control or must agree on, well, on on a safeguard or must agree on on. You can have a referendum, which is a very Swiss solution. I don't recommend referendum. That will be, this must be Internet knows no borders. So this must be an international solution. Now, even when when UK looks on national solution, this does not work on the on the on the long. So here we need, I think, really a comprehensive international framework we can trust. And well, we know cyber security isn't it? We have a lot of hackers. We have secret services from some powers which attack our systems, which attack a lot of data. It's an industrial interest and a political interest. So here, I think also companies as well as politicians must work together to have the security of data, security of well, of our citizens finally also. And I like to see more competition here because when it's only two free big players, the risk of abuse is much higher than we have. OK, there's some companies who have the skills, the knowledge and the technologies. Yeah. OK. Now, OK. Over here, over here and later over there for the time being these first three. Yeah, thanks very much. Neil Dunn from BT. My question is for President Kagami. Firstly, congratulations on your Fiber program. It's a model, I think, for the developing world. I'd like to ask you what you think we need to do, not to connect the next billion people of that four billion, but actually the last billion, because I think when we've actually democratized things in the past, any other utility that we fully democratized, we've seen social impact and economic value unleashed in a way that we couldn't even imagine. So what do you think we need to do to connect the last billion first and how do you think philanthropy and markets can actually work together with government to achieve that? President Kagami. Definitely, I've said this before, cooperation is extremely important. Governments, private sector, philanthropy. And even citizens want to contribute to this. They want to contribute when they have understood what there is in it for themselves. But the most important thing in this coming together, governments have to play their role as well as the private sector plays their role. Governments will have to make sure that we are thinking about indeed connecting people. Therefore, in our national development strategy and the plans to execute that, we have to integrate it in every sector of our society and make sure that every stage we take is actually taking care of this. And in fact, make it part of the budgetary process of any country and include that this is embedded in every sector that we consider for this budgeting. In fact, that's how Rwanda came to think about, for example, investing in the fiber across the country, as I said, the area role, but that is not enough. How do you take it to homes, to premise, to rural areas? And also thinking about how people are going to afford that and how, as long as they have access, they need also to be able to afford that. So the conversation that goes on between government and the private sector and then the philanthropy bringing in what they are good at and contributing to that makes a huge difference, as we have seen in our own case. Okay, thank you very much, Madame. Thank you. My question is also to His Excellency. My name is Nancy. I'm from the Dar es Salaam hub, a global shaper from the Dar es Salaam hub. From the where? I'm a global shaper from the Dar es Salaam hub. You're a global shaper. Yes, sir. Good. My question is- It's a good profession. The PhD in global shaping. Yes, sir. Sorry, sorry, I couldn't avoid it. My question is to His Excellency. So I teach kids how to code back at home, but then the problem that we face is that our education system has not been reformed too much any type of digital strategy or approach to help train our kids to be aligned and also be more competitive long term. What are your thoughts and what is it that we can do immediately to be able to take that leap? It's about education and let me then also ask you about that because again, in the cutting edge and in the developing country, the question of education and skills, please. Again, it's the same thing. Education brings government. Government is the main supplier of the public good when it comes to education. Government is indispensable, but the private sector comes in, philanthropy comes in. They always want help. They also want to help in these areas, especially for education, because in the end, education benefits just not the individual being educated or the government making sure that the citizens are educated. It also benefits the private sector when it comes to the skills that are required in different parts of the country. A mismatch between the skills necessary and the skills that are being demanded. Yes, we have to make sure that these align and we are really providing what their market is asking for. Okay, Doris, do you feel the Swiss are duly equipped with the right skills in order to face the music? I think we have huge density on mobile phones or on all these equipment, but the skills, that's really, I think, also my skills are underdeveloped. I'm another generation, sorry, that's it. That's also, let's see, a good example, as we had some... But you're not looking for a job. For the moment, no. You've got a pretty secure one, you know what? For the moment, but I have a good example. My mother, for example, she's 84, and she'd like to be in contact with her kids and therefore, value bought her also an iPad, and she learned this from my seven year old sons and daughters and other people. So I think there's interaction between a young generation and the elderly generation. And in our education system, our teachers normally are also another generation. So I think here we have to also look for young people, to educate the kids. So you have, but, and then you go like coding, like Gavin said, now it's part of the curriculum. Writing code is crucial. The Germans are no longer exporting cars, they're exporting code with wheels, you know? There's a, in a way, so. Well, yes, I mean, that is actually the case. So it's a big transformation. We have one, two, and three, and I think that'll be it, please. My name is Augustine Edwards. I'm an editor at the newspaper in Chile. It's about gender balance anyway, but just forgot. My interest, my question is really to the panel as a whole, with regards to what do they feel with, in terms of guaranteed minimum quality in the broadband service? Drug stores can't sell old medicine, which is an effective. Food stores can't sell rotten fruit. But in broadband, we allow for variations in quality, which is huge. Okay. My question is, how do they feel about having a minimum? Gavin, I think probably you should address that one first, and perhaps I don't know if the government has some to say. Well, it's an interesting question, because the government in the UK in the last year has defined that, and said everybody in the UK, and the UK has some quite different geographies, and it includes all the islands around the UK as well. Anybody across the UK can demand a minimum of 10 megabits per second by 2020. Now, by the end of 2017, 95% of the UK will have, thanks, Eric. Gee, they're cyber security. You're being hacked. By the end of 2017, 95% of the UK will have speeds of up to 30 megabits or more. Okay. And that will be widely available. So the issue is that last 5%, because they're the most remote parts of the UK, and they've established that 10 megabits per second, you can do high definition video, and when they map the sort of consumption versus speed, that's when it begins to flatten off. That said, my own feeling is, and the sort of modeling we do is that actually, that will go up quite rapidly over time. And we're certainly building towards something that runs into the hundreds, rather than into the tens as the minimum speed. Let me just make a comment that is part of the question. There is this question of average, and say, most of the population, 90% of the population doesn't need the cutting edge speed. So should you worry more about that, or is it that you have to provide both? The cutting edge is crucial to make progress in the cutting edge sciences and business and whatever discoveries, but there you have to provide for the most. Where do you, is there a trade-off or do you have to address both? You have to address both. And it's, people say, well actually do you need the bandwidth and this includes, at the moment, you probably don't. Too lot of it that is there. However, if you look at how networks are being used in the future, you will be able to do everything you, I think, need to stream over around 100 megabits per second because the technology around streaming is improving all the time, so you'll have multiple ultra HD pictures through 100 megabits per second. The reason you will need more is because you will download huge files across the network. It's downloading, comes to that. Data becomes heavy. You're talking about cars, a big download to your electric car, it's a piece of software, several gigs of data. The network needs to be able to cope with these peaks in demand and that's why you have to build it to be a lot more than the average speed. So resilient. Resilience as well as another. Resilient but also big, just big capacity. Any other thought on this? We'll go back to the other question. I think that the internet of things, which we see now, that the forecast is that in 2020 it will be 20 billion things switched with the internet. It means that we need 100% new infrastructure and if you would like to make online services, we need a broadband internet in... I can't say if you speak about Russia. If you speak about our Far East, we need nine hour flights from... Yeah, yeah. Vladivostok to Moscow. It's impossible to build high speed internet in each village, yeah? But I think for 80, 90% of the population we must rethink how we can organize on the right way the whole digital infrastructure. Especially with the explosive numbers that you just mentioned in your initial intervention, where you're gonna go from 4% to 50 something percent in a relatively short period of time. Let me go over here. Thank you, Secretary General. I'm Fadi Shehade. I'm senior advisor to Professor Schwab on digital matters. Nobody's perfect. Nobody's perfect. It's okay, we still love you. I just want to focus on an important element of national digital strategy or policy as this panel is focusing on that. To date, most work on national digital policy has been about the infrastructure. And that's okay because the infrastructure is actually bounded by the country's borders. But now all digital is about data and data is transnational. It doesn't understand borders. The platforms that are running the data for the world are transnational. So now I ask the panel, how do we deal with the paradox of countries wanting to establish national digital policies when the real assets are transnational? 84% of the SMP assets are now intangible. So how do we do that? Let me ask our government and perhaps if you guys feel that you have any comment to make because it may also be an appropriate moment to speak about the Brexit implications, transnationality of the problem. President Luthor. Well, I think that's a good question. We need national policies because what was said about the quality of the basic infrastructure, this must be qualified by a national level. But it's clear as we have these services oriented economies with a lot of cross border linkages, here we must have an international solution. That's why I think WTO, WIPO should be involved. OECD. OECD. Sure, you will be there. Research after that. And I think we have the UN Internet Governance Forum. So who cares about these governance issues? We will have in Geneva end of this year an important also conference. And therefore I think these networking cooperation, regional cooperation, but also then on global cooperation is needed. Not only on researchers, on enterprises, but also on, well in the banking sector it's key. President Kagame, national against multinational, transnational, everything is now cross border. How do you deal with that? Very true, but I don't think we necessarily have to do away with national strategies. But we can integrate national strategies to get to where we want to be. So it's really a question of building blocks, to build something, the whole has to come together through different pieces. Exactly. So that because we see around some nations may not have those strategies. Okay. So, but they would think about doing that in order to simply go to that level where the integration has taken place. I think it's not either or. I think we have to make sure that we encourage nations to develop their strategies, but we're also good to encourage globally. Like you do at the Broadband Commission. Absolutely. Yeah, I'm afraid this is gonna be the last word because we run out of time and I received the, let's see, like that when you cut your throat, that means you can't do much more. But on the transnationality of the issue, and therefore perhaps some implication about the Brexit that you mentioned. I've got to sum this up in 30 seconds. Oh, well, 37. Look, it is one of the Brexit issues. No question about that. I mean, one of the many good things about the European community has been the digital strategy in being able to move data around countries. And as increasingly as businesses moved into the cloud, where the data resides is not necessarily in the country. And the more public the cloud services are. Often it can be split between many different countries wherever the data center is. So this is a very, very important issue. It is key to the Brexit negotiations, in my view. And the issue of how we maintain free flows of data in whatever negotiations. Are they even focusing on that now? I mean, they're talking about refrigerators and they're talking about things like that, but they are talking about data, by the way. I'm confident. But are they talking about the cloud? Are they going to share the cloud? Yeah, that's a good question. I'm confident this is going to be an issue that is pertinent to the negotiations. Yeah. Well, listen, let's give a big round of applause to our panelists. Thank you.