 The most part. Can you expound on why Ben Shapiro is wrong about nationalism being a good vehicle for a nation state to advance their interest since he's too chicken to debate you? Well, I'm not going to say he's too chicken to debate me. Maybe he's too busy to debate me. But what does it mean a good vehicle for a nation state to advance their interest? First, I believe in the nation state. I don't not believe in the nation state. I just believe that the nation state is less important than nationalists believe. I also believe that the nation state in most places. There are too many nation states. I said this in the last show. They're just too many nation states. And to the extent that nation states isolate themselves around ethnic characterizations, then it makes no sense. I am. I'm a big supporter of America. I'm a big supporter of a melting pot. I'm a big supporter of a federation of states that is America where states have some autonomy, but limited autonomy. But there is a federal government that over a large geographic area dictates federal law and mandates the protection of individual rights. So America, as it was conceived of, that is the model I believe in. And I think ultimately, if Europe had the right ideas, that is the right model for Europe. I don't believe in Europe having these little states. I'll get to that in a minute. But let me address this issue of being a good vehicle for a nation state to advance their interest. Well, what are the interests of a nation state? The interest of the nation state, the only interest of a nation state should be the protection of the lives and property of its citizens. That is it. The protection of the individual rights of its citizens. That's all government should be doing. What are the interests? Are they? So the only interest of government, the only interest of the state is as a protection agency. It's as a police military judiciary. And as such, its only interest are self-defense interests. It's against aggressors from the outside. Put aside the internal, what needs to be done internally from the outside. And yes, you need nation states. You need governments to provide that kind of protection. But do you need tiny little governments on tiny little populations? Or can you have a government that provides that protection over a much larger geographic area like you do in the United States? I think the second is much more viable and much more beneficial than the first and provides much better protection if you think about, I mean, I agree with Marcon. When Marcon said Europe should have its own army, I agree. I think the United States should withdraw from NATO and leave Europe to defend itself. If Russia is a threat, then the Europeans, the Germans and the French and the rest of the Europeans are rich enough to field an army to defend themselves against the Russians. The idea that the United States should spend money and lives to defend rich Europeans from a Russian threat or from a Chinese threat or from a Muslim threat is absurd. They are rich enough. They have enough people to defend themselves. So I'm all for European army. I think that would be a good thing. So I don't know what these national interests are other than, again, the protection of individual rights. And in that sense, again, I do believe in the nation state, I think. And I said on my show nationalism that I believe in nationalism in a sense of Americanism. Americanism, to me, is the elevation of the individual above all else. It is individualism. It's a spectrum of individualism and an idea that the rule of the state, the only rule of the state is to protect the individual to protect his rights, to protect his right to life, liberty, property and the pursuit of happiness. That's what nationalism means. That's the only meaning in which nationalism means anything to make America great again is to get America out of our lives, to make America great again is to divorce the government from my private life. It's to free me to make choices about my life to get the government out, out of my business, out of my business business, out of my personal business. To make America great again is to return to the principles of the founding fathers. It's to return to the concept of a government that is there to protect individual rights and nothing else. That is what Americanism is. And that is the only legitimate form of nationalism. So what European Union should adopt, what Europe should adopt is an American type nationalism. That is an Americanism. I believe Americanism is universal. I would like to see Europe become America in a sense, in a sense of a centralized government that does only one thing and that is protect individual rights of its citizens. I would love to see Europe become a federation of states with one federal government, but not a federal government run by big bureaucrats in Brussels, but a federal government that fielded a European military to protect itself from threats from countries like Russia. But other than that, other than that, established laissez-faire principles across the entire European Union, protected individual rights across the entire European Union, and then let states, just like in the United States, have some flexibility over certain issues like sentence saying, specific sentence saying, specific things that were legal or illegal, and ultimately, you know, certain regulations, minor regulations of business or the way contracts were established. But that ain't going to happen. That ain't going to happen. But here I am in Slovakia, a country that by European standards is poor. A country that divorced itself from the Czech Republic, I can't remember when, 20 years ago, after the fall of the Berlin Wall, there was a Czechoslovakia, which was established 100 years ago post-World War I as one country. But no, that's not good enough. This is European nationalism, ethnocentric nationalism at its worst. That's not good enough. We Slovaks are not the same as you Czechs. We want our own country and you can have your own country. This is called Balkanization. I think it's a disaster and I think it's bad and I think it's bad for the Slovaks would have benefited from some of the free market policies that the Czech Republic instituted that Slovanian never did. Slovakia, sorry, Slovakia never did. So nationalism, when it's focused on ethnicity, nationalism, when it's focused on tiny little groups is a bad and dangerous thing. Nationalism, which is focused on individual and protecting his individual rights and providing the security for those individuals to live and pursue their happiness. That is the only healthy type of nationalism. But I don't know any nationalists like that. Me and five others. Almost all the nationalists I know are collectivists. Almost all the nationalists I know place the value of the group, whether they admit it or not. Place the value of the group, the state, the nation, the ethnicity of the group, the ethnic group, the tribe above the individual. And that is not just bad, that is damn evil. That makes them no different than socialists. Socialists who place the war being of the of the proletarian above the individual. But the war being of any group above the individual is wrong, is nasty, is evil, is no good. Well, this starts with the individual. Politics should be about the protection of the individual's right, the protection of the individual's freedom, freedom of action, freedom to pursue the rational values that are necessary for his life, for his survival, for his thriving. That is it. That's what the nation state exists for. And if it doesn't exist for that, if it exists for some ethnic purity, then it shouldn't exist. So whether it applies to Great Britain, whether it applies to Slovakia, whether it applies to the Czechs or the Poles or the Hungarians or any of them, if the purpose of the nation state is to maintain their ethnic purity, if the purpose of the nation state is to sacrifice the individual to the state, if the purpose of the nation state is to regulate and control the economy, if the purpose of the nation state is to do away with the liberties and freedoms that are right as individuals, then those nation states should not exist. Then I'm against them.