 We've already got an active panel in discussion here. So I'm going to be an interesting panel to try to keep in tow. OK, diversity in practice. And we really do have a diverse panel here to talk about how diversity, quality, inclusion in organizations, in our thinking, can be implemented. We've got 45 minutes, and we really want to make this a solutions-based discussion. So what works? What have we learned that can actually work? Now, we've made the argument that diversity ensures better growth, is fairer, more equitable societies, and trickles down in so many other ways in our societies. Workforces are undergoing major changes. We know that. Everything from digitization, fallouts from COVID-19, change societies, and so forth. Hiring DEI teams have actually increased by 169% from 2019 to 2022, which means the message is getting there. But we want to make sure that those teams are best equipped, but also it's not just left to the people doing the hiring. How do we make sure it's across the board? So one of the initiatives that the World Economic Forum here has is the initiatives with lighthouses. And Lorenzo, we're going to come to you to discuss that a bit, but it's part of the center for the new economy and society that the World Economic Forum does here to think about what are scalable, sustainable, quantifiable, and significant initiatives. Those are the four ways of making sure our initiative is actually working, and how do we take it forward? So for this discussion, we have with us Lorenzo Simonelli, who is CEO, president, chairman of Baker Hughes, Caroline Casey, who is founder, director of Valuable 500. Michael Essner here, who is chairman of Egon Zender and Lor Mazalot, who is a partner, head of EMEA for impact practice at Bain and Company. So key principles for an inclusive organization. Lorenzo, I want to ask you particularly about the work that you've done in Baker Hughes, but also thinking beyond just your direct remit when it comes to your supply chains. Well, it's great to be with you. And first of all, at the end of the day, diversity does lead to better growth, better decisions being made. And at Baker Hughes, when you're a global company, it's very important that you have a DEI initiative, not just for our employees, but also for our employee resource groups, our customers, and also for our suppliers. And in particular, when you look at the Lighthouse initiatives, where we took a big leap was actually in diversifying our supply base. We work in over 120 countries, and we felt that it was important to actually diversify our supply base and look at where the best opportunities resided in being able to fulfill the services that we provide to our customers. You know, we spend billions of dollars in buying products around the world. And over the course of 2022, we started diversifying, and we spent over 200 million with diverse suppliers that we'd never encountered before. We think this is scalable, and it can also be used as a way in which to ingrain not only in your organization, but also from an ecosystem, diversity and see the benefit of it. And that's something that I think has been recognized also by the WEF, and the Lighthouse examples are opportunities for others to take those forward as well. And I think you'll hear, you know, supply diversity is just one of many. At Baker-Husdor, we look at it as a program which is made up of many different pillars. And supply diversity is just one of them, and we're very pleased with the outcomes. What would you say is one of those tangible outcomes? Tangible outcome is also the way in which we serve within the marketplace we're in better. As you think about diversity, it's also being local to be global and being able to have the practices and the insights. And at times, if you are just looking at things from one paradigm, you don't get the benefit of the other paradigm. So the supply of diversity has allowed us to really get into the nuances of what it means to actively participate in certain new markets and also innovation. Because you can find a lot of innovation from new suppliers and also as you look to grow, you've got to continuously look for efficiencies and that's where we've benefited. And so we've been able to reduce lead times, we've been able to increase fulfillment and customer satisfaction. And all of that yields to growth. So Caroline, we've heard specifics from Lorenzo in terms of ecosystem, thinking not only how your own organization is impacted, but your wider supply chain and where you actually work makes a difference for your society. I want to ask you to speak to us about your experience. You've been for years in this field of making sure that there is more accessibility and inclusion even in our conversations, not just in our hiring, but in our conversations in our mindset. So in the last two decades, what would you say we've learned? What's worked? Okay, so I haven't been doing this for the last two decades. So I think I'm age as well. I just wanted to follow up from what Lorenzo's saying. One of the things we're definitely noticing as a real area of investment and genuine real depth and commitment is around the supplier diversity and procurement. This seems to be something that's really emerged in the last 18 months. I just want to give a bit of context. As the founder of the valuable 500, which was actually founded here in the World Economic Forum, it's the largest CEO coalition of 500 brands and their CEOs and the biggest in the world working together to end disability exclusion. Now that gives us a very unique viewpoint into like what's been happening. Like what's, you know, five years ago doesn't seem long, but things have changed. So there's three really big areas that we're seeing happening and I'd love to hear what you have to say about it. One is when we launched the valuable 500, we were trying to remove this siloed approach to diversity, equity, and inclusion. And so we, you know, because that's where it's competing against each other. And finally, we're starting to see this concept of universally inclusive cultures and this issue of intersectionality, because that is there. But how do we do it? That's another thing. The second is the issue around languaging around diversity, equity, and inclusion. You know, we go through phases, don't we, of what it is and what do we call it. We're seeing a far greater move around the issues of accessibility for all, representation for all, inclusion for all. And where is that positioned in the company? So we all know that most of the conversations have been within DNI. But now that push is moving it up, not just to the C suite, but to the board, but that's not enough. It's really trying middle management on how to manage this. So I think we're becoming much more real. I think the organizations are willing to take more risk. And that's fabulous, because none of us can get this right. When I sit here as a woman, I'm 52, age, I am a woman and I am registered blind. So when you look at that and when you think about a leader and what a business has to cope with, how do we manage that in a cohesive way that actually allows for the company to benefit from the different experiences that we're having. So they're the three kind of big shifts and changes that we've been seeing. So Michael, I'd like you to pick up on that, this idea of we think of boards, we think of C suite, and then middle management. You work on leadership, you work on talent and thinking how organizations can be set up to succeed based on who's in there, in their talent pool, so to speak. Tell me, how do you reflect on what Caroline's saying? I'm a permanent learner and I learn more and more, the more I am in that business, how important diversity is, that's the who is in an executive team room or in a boardroom, but that is very much about what you have on the agenda and even more how you bring perspectives, different perspectives to life. And I think that's the art of good leadership, of modern or effective leadership. I couldn't agree more, looking at your statement, Lorenzo, what you pointed at, given the value of diversity and coming as a white man of advanced age from a continental European background, perspective on diversity was very much for years on gender diversity. Growing into international roles in my own firm, I expanded my own perspective on people of color and the perspective on black and Hispanic minorities in the United States. Then I learned engaging in LGBTQ activities of colleagues who are passionate about that, that it's also here about allowing people to bring their full selves to work and not hide and cover or feel ashamed of anything. And then we touched on the topic of disabilities, made aware by a colleague who suffered a stroke and engaged in business communities where he found there is so much people with hidden disabilities. Disabilities meant actually. Exactly, 80%, I think 20% of the workforce has some disabilities, 80% acquire it, exactly over lifetime and are not born with it. And also here that comes a lot of prejudice is a long of wrong perspectives with it. What that means, how effective that people can be versus, so whatever. I think it doesn't end. I broaden my perspective, I learn a lot and the artist to not only be politically correct and have representatives of various minorities or groups in your team, in your house, at the board, because many things start at the very top, but even more so, and that's a matter of culture, of how you moderate a meeting, of how you lead your team, of how you bring it to life. And that's another topic. Well actually, it's an important topic because you can do the hiring, you can put in efforts and systems, but how do you make sure those voices are actually really heard? And also, how do you deal with the fact that I have several colleagues who now say to me, I am a white man of European background and maybe my voice isn't as relevant, which is we're almost having to do something reverse and light news are only actually equally relevant. So how do you balance that in actual implementation? I love that you said that because we did recent research that showed that in general across 11 countries, less than 35% of employees feel included no matter their background. So really there is an opportunity across the board. What's important I think to understand is that same research revealed that the drivers of inclusion are very different for each group. We found some that were universal. Everyone wants growth opportunities that excites and entices everyone. But then if we look for example at women, they care more at behavioral, they look at behavioral drivers as more important. They want to see empathy in their leadership. They want to see inclusion in meetings intentionally. So that's one thing. And if we look at people of color for example, they look more for structural enablers. So I think understanding that distinction and how you cater to the different groups in an important way is critical. And another risk to potentially keep in mind related to this is if you're in a global role that diversity does not look the same across different regions given the local context. Although the challenges are often similar, we do see that the local color that comes into it is really critical in terms of the practices that are applied and the level of maturity as well and the language. So I think it's important also to see that perspective. Lorenzo, on the point of maturity, because again, you can introduce certain elements. You have to scale them. But you also the sustainability and maturity part. Is this about regular reviews? What does it take to ensure that it permeates an organization that continues to grow? You have to break it down into a process. And it starts, first of all, from leadership at the top because there's a culture that needs to be understood within the total company that DEI is beneficial. Then from there, you need to have some metrics that you look at. But over time, it's really being able to foster the employee resource groups. And where we've seen a lot of benefit is where the behavior changes amongst the individuals because that's where the real benefit comes, is internally when it's fostered by themselves and also they speak up. And the point has been made that different employee resource groups view diversity differently. That's very true. The engagement, though, is very important. So I'd say the one thing we do from a process perspective is the engagement that happens from a perspective across all the employee resource groups. And we fund that as well. Because that's important from a perspective of nurturing it. So there is a leadership buy-in. But then you need to have that participation across all of the different resource groups. Can I ask a question? So one of the things we're getting pushed back from is that the employee resource groups are huge. They've been really beneficial in getting the intelligence in the business, particularly around disability, for example. Because as you say, 20% of most of our teams have a disability and it's hidden. So it's a great way for the business to get that intelligence to actually connect to the marketplace. But there's another thing that's been kind of bubbling up. It's like the elephant on the table. What are we doing by creating these employee resource groups? They're like, right? This is something that we're hearing back from our companies is that they're nearly doing more work around their employee resource group and looking for financial enumeration for that. And then actually expecting the leadership to do a lot. And then how do you manage the multiple of different agendas? And then so we talk about allyship. Are you hearing any of that, the negativity of it? Or are you concerned about that? Because I do know that at the top of the business it's trying to manage all those different agendas. And if you give to one, you take away from the other. And then how do we manage that in a way that's good for the business as well as for the employees? Question, I guess. So we haven't seen the negative of it. But also the way in which we approach it is we put the onus on the employee resource group. And I think there's a very important factor from a leadership standpoint. The benefit of the employee resource group is so that you can drive equity, not equality, but equity, and be able to give the same opportunity across the board. And that's the benefit for us. Because when you think about changes that you can put in place, it is that the same opportunity is available irrespective of the diversity, the background, and also the challenges. But you make that in your benefits. You make that in your policies. And so there is an aspect of they see that we're making changes so that that equity is there. At the same time, we put the onus on them that they have to be participants. And so this isn't a renumeration for them. Because at the end of the day, it shouldn't be looked at as a task. If we're not benefiting by winning in the marketplace, we shouldn't be doing this. But we benefit because recruiting. The amount of benefit we get attracting people because they know that we sponsor, support, DEI initiatives is huge. But it's not us just saying it. It's the employees within the company. And that's the behavior and the culture. But we've differentiated ourselves by being able to have that aspect of we're not just in oil and gas. We're actually innovating. And we're innovating also through our employees. And you wanted to come in on this because I heard you. You really reacted to Caroline's question. You felt that you've heard of this negativity. No, absolutely. I think a lot of the organizations we work with often mention the risk of creating less inclusion sometimes when you empower too many of the employee resource groups. So that's something some of the leadership is dealing with in different regions. But I've seen that they've managed it by having a clear ambition that is shared and built by the teams together. And when that happens, I think there's more work that happens in a collaborative way. And you have a lot of allies across the organizations that think allyship is a big opportunity. It's huge. We've been hearing about losing momentum in this field. I think a couple of things that have helped is the opportunity of allyship. And then what you said, which I completely agree with, is bringing it back to the core of the business, to the benefits that we get at a human level, at the business level. We know that diverse teams are four times more innovative, bringing back that narrative. So it's not something we do again on the side and going back to where we were 20 years ago on the topic. And the narrative part, Michael, I mean, how do companies ensure that that is coming out? It's great when your own employees are excited and they share, you know, that's the best validation you could possibly get. But at the same time, how do you make sure executives, top leadership, build so the company goes beyond just sending out a newsletter once a month? It's a very good question. And my answer is I wished it would be. And I think leadership is role-modeling. We are here in Davos where we heard years ago that it's no longer about shareholder capitalism but about stakeholder capitalism. So corporations of all kinds have a role to play. Better leadership for a better world is not just a nice purpose. It's, I think, more relevant even. The Edelman Trust Bermuda, just a new release coming out a couple of days ago, showed how trust is shrinking, is diminishing in public institutions, political leaders, but growing even for corporate corporations, corporate leaders, for what reason ever? So I think there comes a responsibility to earn, re-earn the license to operate, license to execute your business, and to profit at the same time from the positive factors. Just looking at the fact, whether it's convenient for your team, whether it's convenient for teams in different nations and cultures, I think it's not enough. It's role-modeling. It's really making a case. It's bringing it from political correctness to real action. And that's what you, I think, should expect from leaders. What you should make them aware of as good as possible as a board to the executive team, from the executive team to the C minus one leaders level and down into the organization. And we have made clear that based on a book a colleague has written, it comes from a minority on search 2.0, which was not process and technique, but awareness for all kind of aspects of DEI that we bring that to every client meeting, every client briefing. We don't forget about asking questions on that, raising the level of awareness. So role-modeling, awareness creation, walking the talk, not misunderstanding, it is something that you have to do, but that has an effect that you want to do, that you owe also, I think, to the greater society. That's all the things I could mention here is what I think is important. Caroline, can I ask you, during COVID-19 when everybody had to work behind the screen, building those relationships, and then now some workforces have been hesitant about going back into a workplace where they're meeting on a regular basis, I found that it really harms building a culture, it harms understanding what other people are going through. So if you already have the relationship for a few years ago and then you're working together, that's okay, but to actually build and to develop those relationships, especially with people who have either disabilities or particular issues that it's very hard to bring up in a Zoom call, let's say. How do we deal with that? How have you seen that change in the workplace? You know, we're so formal around here in this room, right? But Anne brought something up before we came in, and we're talking about the power of people wanting to be in coalitions and collectives. And I was, aside from all the business learning, it's about us connecting as humans, right? And that's what we were saying is that there's a real desire to connect. And one of the things that really happened in COVID, and I don't know how anybody else felt, but I felt nearly blinded again. I got used to a world where I can feel you if that makes any sense. And then there was a screen, and I couldn't see the chat and everything. And then the big fear is, how do I create a connection with you? We were trying to get 500 of the world's biggest CEOs, you know? And what I really noticed, and I don't know if anybody else is the same, there was a surge of that humanity that came out of us, that need to learn to connect with each other, because we were all a bit like, how do we do this, right? So there was a near vulnerability if that makes any sense. And so when we think about this issue going forward, and if I could be the ruler of the world for the day, if I had a choice, I think I'd put every leader, regardless of where you are in the business, through therapy or self-awareness, where are you? How are you? Because we forget that this is a human conversation. We can talk about all the pieces, but this is how we behave exactly as you say, right? As a human being. Being radically curious. I've got it wrong. I don't know. So that's the thing, the COVID piece really, I think brought to the surface and to grasp it. And therefore, how do we keep that going if not everybody's coming back into the workforce? It's really difficult. And that sense of silo and being on the outside, and am I in the cool crew? And then that brings into it. I'd love to hear what Anne is saying about, that is why collectives like the valuable 500 or the coalitions is that connectivity that people I genuinely believe are yearning for it. I don't know about anybody else, but this has been my favorite Davos. I don't know why, but I actually feel like I'm slowing down and I'm looking and not running around the problem of pleading, pleading, pleading. It's more about hearing and asking and connecting. And I don't think we can ever underestimate what's happening because inclusion is about see me and hear me and make space for me. So that's really powerful, Caroline, but at the same time, companies are also having some trouble with this idea of the see me and hear me of individuals who have either strong political views, strong views on particular cultural issues, and then they want to express them and they feel it's their right to express them. And of course, with social media, everyone's now a publisher because you can publish your opinion, you can have your voice out. And that point about hear me, see me, I matter as an individual. I'm part of this organization. The culture has to allow for it. On the flip side, it reflects an organization. So I want to ask you how you balance that. Yes, because that is such a good point and that's where employee resource groups are a great place to actually allow it. But can I just say, to see me and hear me, it's not at the expense of another person. It's not the scarcity of what if I hear your voice it shouldn't take away from my own. So how do we enable individual expression and individual belonging with collective grace? And because actually inclusion is difficult, it requires us not to be selfish. And actually you're in an organization, you have an opinion, but this isn't your family. You do owe to the organization who you chose to come and work for as well. So it is a hard and fine balance. And this is why this conversation can be quite emotive and very difficult. And that's why we have to continue to learn. Okay, so how do we strike that balance? Anne, any thoughts? I was actually going if it's okay to pick up on the earlier point that Caroline made around the COVID effect, if that's okay, because I think there's a couple of important lenses there. I think the period we spent in the pandemic also expanded the definition of inclusion. We started talking about who's online, who's in person, how do we create a sense of inclusion around that space? And it created the need for more human connection. And part of that I think we saw in the rise of the coalitions, which you mentioned, which helped different companies that were dealing with something completely new, share learnings, share their humanity and find solutions together. But also in creating third spaces within organizations, I have never seen so many executive coaches rise during to talk about inclusion because people have the need to share, to speak, to find that space. So I think that has created a massive shift. And it will be interesting to see what sustains and sticks, right? Versus what changes after, because I do think we're redefining now what inclusion means as we go. I think also putting the two of them together because it is very much about inclusion. It's very much about being heard, being seen, but you do have a delicate balance. And that delicate balance is inclusion being seen and being heard doesn't mean everybody has to agree. And there's a separation of being heard and being seen and what a company stands for. And I think what was mentioned around, each company has its ethos, has its purpose statement. That's something that at the end of the day still needs to be the foundation. Within that though, there is the aspect of being seen, being heard and being inclusive. But it shouldn't take away from the fact that the company stands for something. Otherwise, you do get into a lot of debates and at least what we try and do is seen, heard, inclusion. We stand for something though. And it may not be for everybody. That's a personal choice. But at the end of the day, we have a code of ethics, we have a behavior, we have a view of culture. And I think that also resonates from a diversity of companies. You're gonna have diversity of companies as well. And that just makes it even more. But the inclusion is very important. Michael, I want to bring you in. How do you create systems? I mean, when we're talking about all of this, you also need to make sure it's systematic. So the hear me, see me, allow me to express myself. We've talked about employee resource groups. Beyond that, how do you do it in a systematic manner? That continues to stay true to the mission and values of the organization. Well, I'm not an expert on processes. And I come from a group of artists calling themselves consultants. Have opinions on everything. And of course, not the same. So my balance act is alignment on diverse perspectives all the time, rather fostering or motivating people to speak up more even. On systems, nonetheless, I think it's about cascading it. And that's where we said it starts from the top. If you don't have leadership supporting it, if you don't have leadership role modeling it, how should you ask your next layers and the broader organization to look up to it and to live up to it? I think it's about installing very simple straightforward system integrated in business agendas, make it part of OKRs, objectives, whatever, things that you take up in a performance review or that you regularly put on the agenda for team meetings and division meetings and whatever. There are very sophisticated ways and very process oriented and process competent companies doing it. I think it's about awareness, cascading into the organization, making it a topic that is a life and integrating it in some way into what you are measuring and not just business performance purely. I have no better answer. There are more experts for that, but that's my perspective. Caroline. One of the things we haven't spoken about is accountability and how we really look at accountability and the issue of target and performance-related pay. And I also think are we also educating our shareholders as well because there's a huge pressure point with business. One of the things that we did with the valuable 500 we're asking all of our 500 companies to report on disability performance. Can I just tell you that is an outrageous concept? And we got five harmonized metrics. And what we heard back, and these were the 380 of the companies gave those five harmonized metrics and they actually welcomed it. Because, and you know what's good is we're talking about, could you just report? It doesn't matter how bad it is, but even if you report, at least we can make that baseline level to which you can reflect on and say, this is our improvement. I do think, oh, when I first came into space years ago, I was like, no, I don't want targets around disability. That's the worst thing I could ever imagine. I don't want tick boxing, but actually we have to put targets in place for the business to be able to aim for somewhere and for us to be able to see where we're learning and what actually works and what doesn't actually work and then have deadlines for that. And for us, it's the case of we're doing a thing called Sink 25 in Tokyo where we're getting our 500 companies to report back to each other, accountable to each other and to learn from each other. And I can't believe after being 23 years doing this work that actually targets that data and those deadlines are essential. Okay, so I want to show of hands of what we think about setting targets for inclusion. Are we four targets? Caroline's just made a case, show of hands, the panel and, artsmen show of hands for sure. Thank God, are some of you holding up your hands? Yes, yes. I will give you a summary of, I would say about 50%? The events don't want the target, right? It's the matrix. I was just gonna say, Michael, you didn't put up your hand, tell me what you were thinking was. I'll let my hand down, because the target for me is very formal, very mechanistic. The metric, then. Metric is something I accept, absolutely. Okay, metric. And for me, it starts with awareness. Look, ask your direct reports whether they are aware of handicaps, handicapped people in their teams, whether they know about their sexual orientation, what else is important to think about diversity and inclusion. I think people are, most at least, of good intentions. And too many simply forget, because it's not their business, or it's not on top of their minds. So if we agree that a target can also be, a soft target, it starts with raising awareness, bringing it on an agenda for a discussion, asking people whether they are aware enough and have them think, I think that there's impact, more impactful maybe, instead of putting very nasty KPIs on the leaders or on the team members, whatever, scheduled and motivate people to deliver in a, I would say, mechanistic way. My answer to that. Yes, and just, I'm going to let you come, but I'm going to open the floor for questions. So if you have questions, Indicate will bring a mic to you and introduce yourself. But first Ann, tell us your thoughts. One last point, because I think we talked about targets, but talking about the power of data in bringing to life the practices, one of the breakthrough examples I've seen is in an organization where they started gathering the data and they were able to build a live view of both the representation and pay parity in across levels of the organization. And today they're able to achieve 100% pay parity across levels and it's a life tool that everyone uses. And it seems simple and basic, but that has created cultural change that you were talking about earlier. It's created a common language and common motivation and ambition for the group. So I think using data also beyond the targets is also critical. You just said it much better than me. Actually, it is about the metrics, the data that comes from it. Thank you for saying it so much better than me. It's exactly what I meant. And that's, I mean, I think this is a key point. The framing, language. You said, Caroline, you're amazing because you articulate it so well. It didn't occur to you. Of course, you're not going to see the show of hands. So thank you for enabling me, genuinely by saying, I'm not going to know. And so I think that's really important. I mean, yes, you're right, easy. But I think also it breaks certain barriers that we usually have, especially in a workplace, to be able to tell people this is what you need to be aware of. And I think the onus should be also an organization, not on the individual only. Okay. You have to create the environment whereby somebody's comfortable. Sure. And that's the inclusion and also the aspect of making sure people are comfortable to be able to speak up. Yeah, absolutely. So if we have a question here, please. Thank you so very much, Claudia Romoyelman from our organization called We Are All Human that advances diversity, equity, and inclusion and tries to remind people just of that that we're all human. But I think that it's more than charity or diversity on that sense of CSR. It's about like having the goals in order to attract the talent that you need that represents the community that you serve. And I found I work in America, particularly with Latinos. And I don't think it is about the business case anymore, at least like for the last decade. But it's about how do you do it? What are the systems that companies and organizations can really implement in places? Sustainable development goals for inclusion if you want. Something that is really useful and practical where you don't have targets, but you do have VHACs, big, hairy, audacious goals where you can say like if there's 20% of the population that is Latino and there's some intersectionality, what percentage can I put forward particularly because that's gonna be the employee of the future, the consumer of the future. I think that the second piece is just to make sure that as the world is moving into these movements of ESG and anti-DEI and so on, that you understand that leadership might move forward in this polarization, but the employee is not. People will continue choosing to work in a place that where they can be themselves. People are gonna continue doing that. So I wonder whether you have any sense of whether we have created a system called the Hispanic Promise that has more than 320 companies that are adhering to that with 100 Latino organizations. And I think that that organizing principle from our community's minorities organizing and being proactive and thinking agency works. And I just wonder whether you have any sense of this push that you have with the anti-DEI movements and the anti-ESGs and whether you can stay put. Well, how do you make it to stay put in your principles of actually making this a growth strategy as opposed to a charity strategy? Okay. I mean, we've got three business leaders here who would have a point in, but what I would say is thank you for bringing up the economics as well and connection to market and consumer because this is what it's about. The disability market is 13 trillion. You can't serve that market unless you have the representation in the business. So absolutely. So then that brings it, how do we make sure that this topic that we're speaking to is not dismissed? And that is where it's placed in the business and that actually everything around representation, inclusion and accessibility is cross-functional. It is up and down. It is against performance measurement. It's not a little, it's not a silo. It has to be fully integrated. It'll be like nearly a contagion in the business. And that from, I don't know what you guys say but that is what we are seeing happen that it is cross-functional. And that's why when Lorenz is talking about it, procurement, there we go, right? So that is, I believe some of the moves that we can see that it will be sustainable. I also think there is a characterization sometimes that unfortunately externally DEI now is being misused as well. And at the end of the day, as a company, what we're trying to do is drive growth for all of our stakeholders but also drive inclusivity of everybody that is a participant in the community and our employee base. And I think that inclusion is really a topic that needs to be brought to the forefront and we're gonna go through some swell relative to the acronym of DEI. You're already seeing it play out in the U.S. But I think if you look at the inclusion aspect as a business, it drives bottom line results and that's what we're here to do. And that's why fostering the Hispanic community is very important. But just like fostering the African-American, fostering all of the diverse groups and that's where the employees resource groups come into play. Okay, we have another question here. If you could please identify yourself. Hello everyone, my name is Robert Beamish. I'm a global shaper based in the Ottawa hub. I have chaired an employee resource group for the past three years. And there's been a kind of an internal divide that I have because in one side we're able to advance representation for the employees that represent, I represent an indigenous employee resource group in Canada. We've been able to advance representation, have further inclusion of indigenous perspectives and knowing that we're contributing to the profitability of the organization. One piece that I'm concerned of and heard mentioned here was that the value of those contributions being recognized by the organization, really it's driving profitability of an organization as a whole. It's increasing the, it's aligned with the values of the organization but the people who are advancing it and that lived experience and knowledge that's being contributed to it isn't necessarily being recognized in the same way because it's good for this group. And so we will benefit on the goodness of this group to contribute to advancing our own causes. So when does this shift from the right thing to do? When we know as well, it's driven profitably. So how do we recognize those contributions, lived experiences and perspectives of these groups that are ultimately driving this organizational profitability and in line with these organizational values that we're talking about. So maybe I'll take that one just because I'm hoping and again, don't know the company you work for but ultimately from an employee perspective there is the shareholder benefit of which the employee should be part of. And if the compensation and benefit scheme is set up appropriately, that participation should take place. But I think your question goes also further from a community at large perspective especially through the employee resource groups a lot of companies have foundations. We allocate foundation money based on the way in which the initiatives come from the employee resource groups. And so it goes to the broader community at large from a statement back to the community that's being represented. So there's two ways the employees benefit because the company is growing and hopefully the share price is going up but then also through the foundation the remuneration back into the community itself. But can I connect back to what you said in your previous comment? It's actually an insight and innovation and growth. Correct. So that's what you said before as well and I think we forget that a different experience and a different viewpoint is what is the driver of innovation. And just I always talk about this anecdotally but we forget that remote controls were designed for blind people to watch television. I mean that feels like an oxymoron but that's the concept of universal design and bring those perspectives in because it's connected to growth because it is the innovation that that drives. That to me is where the connection is really valued when you see the profitability comes from the innovation. Okay we've got one more question here. I have actually two. Thomas Ogilvy Chief People Officer DHL Group one question around executive teams. So obviously total diversity in executive teams is not good but too much diversity in executive teams can also be dysfunctional. So that's a little bit of Senda question. Is there a sweet spot in the composition of executive teams with the respect to diversity? And the other one is more related to the overall workforce. When is the job done? So what is in a way when you ask the people in your company is this a great place to work for you because that's the ultimate goal of we want to achieve that people say I belong to this company. So how can we measure this? Okay and there's a question right next to you. I'm going to take the two together only because we're running a bit low on time. My question is if we see the turnout it's actually quite a sad turnout. Not that many chairs aren't that full. So that just means that most of the companies and you know do not find this topic as extremely relevant or important. So my question is how do we communicate that there is a direct link between diversity, equity and inclusion that is going to enhance profitability to organizations because at the end of the day I think most organizations, that's the bottom line and that's what they care about. Okay, thank you. All right, so Michael, we can take the executive teams and how diverse you actually want them to be. Yeah and happy also to do just half a sentence half a sentence answer to your question here. I have not really seen over diversified teams. During all my work I would say it's rather on the other side and if you focus diversity let's say on gender diversity or on another element like whatever your race and other stuff. You're still missing out on a couple of other elements that would make a team really diverse and then on top comes what we call diversity of perspectives. And it's not that all European man of my age can make a diverse team by diversity of perspectives. I think perspectives is one thing and on top comes that you have people of different backgrounds with different fates, different challenges making it really rich. On the other side and that goes a little bit back also to a question I heard you saying my own narrative is not do it because you will be more profitable. I would say do it because it's important. Do it because you have a right. You have to earn your right to operate. You don't forget about your license in a stake holder world where you have a duty as a corporation and by the way it will profit from it on the economic side. But I think that would be a little bit also my answer in your regards. Okay and is the job ever done? I mean you know how do you address that? I can take an attempt at that one. The way we measure it is obviously you know yearly employee and it's something we actually do quarterly. We look at a normal net promoter score or whatever other measure you use to measure inclusion and how likely people are to recommend working with you and then a diversity one as well and compare that to see the difference. And what we find is the work never ends. There's new challenges that arise because you hire more people. We see the younger generations the 20, 25 year olds we're hiring have very different also needs and interests than some of the older generations within you know the different companies that we work with and within Bain. So I think you'll see that it's just evolving new challenges that we have to kind of deal with. I think the work doesn't end. I don't know if you agree. Okay we're running out of time. So just one word, one idea that you would want everybody here and who are watching to go away with when they're thinking about DEI make it easier to pronounce. When they're thinking about how do they ensure in their daily work they're ensuring that it's being abundant. Caroline I'm gonna go to you. You looking at me? Be radically curious. Be self aware and be accountable and responsible both of the things that you do wrong as a way to learn and not to point the finger to playing. Yeah. Michael? Create awareness. Do it because it's the right thing to do and because it's at the core of your business. Lorenzo. Open your eyes and foster inclusiveness. Okay so with that. We're very good with that. We do have the QR code for lighthouse cases. It's an interesting report. I recommend you read it. Just some things to take away in addition to these great final words. The importance of the ecosystem, organization, the place you work but also the wider ecosystem. This idea that a lot of people don't feel included even if they don't have the usual markers we expect for inclusivity whether it's their ethnic background or their religion or disability. Actually a lot of people don't feel included so how do we make sure they're being included, they're seen, they're heard? Owing it to the organization to be living to the values, the mission of the organization. If you don't feel it the best way employees can show it is by who are they choose to work. Good intentions. I love that Michael about ultimately most people want to do the right thing. It's about how do you empower, how do you put in the systems to recognize. Soft targets, data really important not necessarily putting in KPIs that are hard but definitely how do we measure because if we can't measure it often it's hard to know if we're doing better or worse and breaking up the silos. So across company in different ways not leaving it just for employee resource groups or HR. And then finally this idea that this is moving in the right direction. So there are a few things in the world that we could say is moving direction. Yes some of the politics is getting in the way but in general we have learnings let's learn from each other and let's scale up. Thank you so much for being here. Thank you to our amazing panel.