 Hi, welcome to the USIP studio. We're here today with Dr. Asley Toya He's the deputy leader of the Norwegian Peace Prize committee, and he's here to talk to us a little bit about the American approach to peace building Welcome, doctor. Thank you so much. It's a pleasure to be here Could you just start off by telling us a little bit about the mechanics of the Norwegian or the Nobel Peace Prize itself? And how you select the laureates well the Nobel Peace Prize is one of five Noble awards as most people know and the Nobel Peace Prize is different because it's awarded in Oslo, Norway The committee has five members whom are each of us are appointed from the Norwegian Parliament in 1901 the first Nobel Peace Prize was awarded back then there were quite few nominations I looked it up. It was like four or five nominations Over time there have become a great many more democracies than there were in 1901 then The people who nominate tend to be members of parliament from democracies around the world and now we routinely get about 350 to 400 nominations The way that the Nobel committee works with these nominations to point to a laureate for the year is the way that you're making good soup you reduce and reduce and reduce so It's a fun and incredibly stimulating process where I'm lucky enough to learn about candidates and processes peace processes around the world and It's the greatest privilege of my career to be a member of this this committee. It's really important work here at the Institute We think about you know Different approaches to peace the history of peace building and peacemaking and specifically we think about the American approach to peace building Could you tell us somehow about the American contributions to peace and how that's played out in the Nobel Peace Prize? in modern years the United States has become associated more with war than with peace and I think that Many people have forgotten how important the American way of peace has been for establishing the role that the United States plays in the world today It's the most powerful and central country in the world and Over the years that have passed since 1901. No, no country has been Awarded the Nobel Peace Prize more often than the United States and I think that if we look on the American laureates You know from Teddy Roosevelt to Martin Luther King to Barack Obama and Ricky singer. I Think this is like a secret memoir of the American way of peace Alfred Nobel when he when he wrote this last well in testament He pointed to three sort of causes of peace one is the fraternity amongst nations second is Disarmament and the what he called that the the abolition of standing armies and And the third is for those who host peace congresses, and I think that these three tracks Fraternity amongst nations being a constructive and good a Partner in international affairs It has been incredibly important for the for the United States And even today the United States is is very often the country that intervenes Into conflicts and problems that doesn't really concern the United States with the aim of Avoiding bad outcomes, and I think that's something to be proud of I think that the United States has been a force for good in a great many Conflicts because of the sheer weight and what the United States can deliver in bringing about the end of conflict And I also think that when it comes to disarmament The United States has been integral in deciding many of the frameworks that we have for disarmament in the world today And I know it's easy to criticize the United States and to tar everything with a brush of Iraq and Afghanistan But I would argue that the American Way of peace has been much more influential in delivering The positive outcomes for the United States historically than the American way of war just to hone in on on that One of the the three elements you spoke about the peace congresses and this this American Contributions towards trying to bring countries to peace from war Could you talk to some of the examples? Maybe some of the examples of Nobel laureates or other examples of Americans or the United States as a country Working with other countries to to actually intervene and try to go from war to peace well, I think the the most obvious example here is After World War two the world lay lay in ashes and it was one country that constructed the international order We live in today the so-called Bretton Woods order was the United States It's not by coincidence that the United Nations is situated in New York, and I think This is something that is not to be underestimated How the international frameworks that countries and actors operate within have been designed? by will and mostly by through The United States and and the political traditions of this country. I think for a while I Think we got it wrong, and I and I'm not gonna lie to you. I think that we're all adults here I think that you know we had we had hopes for the era of humanitarian interventions that we weren't really able to deliver upon and I And I think that there is a great deal of cynicism now about the power and reach of the United States and I think this should be Put in front of the door of military solutions. I think that this idea to make war for peace Was a bad idea in the beginning and it remains a bad idea I think that the American way of peace has been much more about engagement and also about crafting and Shaping American interests in a way that is compatible with the interests of other countries and I think that If we were to look back on the the laureates There's one that I would like to to to point to and I think that you know many in America In America will find it almost a bit dull, but Martin Luther King This idea I think that the great story of Martin Luther King is the story of inclusion and I think this is an important lesson the The tendency that we all have towards alienating and pushing out Countries and and individuals that we find to be problematic Actually, the American history has been one of inclusion inclusion and to Through engagement and through actually supporting and standing up for the ideals that the that the United States and the Western countries stand for There has been huge success in making the world a much more peaceful place than it has been Historically and let's not forget that, you know, like let's not get too cynical here It's we haven't had a global war since 1945 and I think to a very large extent This has to do with this American idea of inclusion that Embodied by the racial struggles in the United States and Martin Luther King Which is by no means Completed, but I think that I would I think most people would agree that it has been worthwhile and even if some Ideals are never fully achieved We're not in this business in international politics to achieve heaven on earth We're always trying to avoid bad outcomes And I think that the American way of peace has really delivered a lot when it comes to creating a world That is more prosperous most more free But most importantly more more peaceful than the alternatives. I think it's great that we that you highlight some of these these great sort of victories for peace that the United States and Americans American laureates of the peace prize have championed and been successful But we also look at it in a light of some of the things that we must remember the lessons of the failures and some of the Mistakes we've made in the military approach and other things in the like and and that brings us to to here We are here and now with all of these lessons and the need to adapt to modern reality in 2022 We see that we have the war raging in Ukraine with the Russian invasion and we have the war That's that's has a truce recently in Ethiopia But we hope that that that holds and that the peace process continues and we still have you know Insecurity and wars all over what do we do in this in this world of major power competition? Some interstate wars seeming to be on the on the comeback with Russian invasion of Ukraine What how does the American approach to peace building? adapt and and and move into the 21st century and 2022 to meet the challenges we face Well, I think that There are two great ideals struggling for the future of American foreign policy now One is the Trumpian idea that the United States is a nation-state and should behave as a nation-state pursuing its own interests like everybody else in the world which is It's fine. It's a it's into intellectually Cogent the problem is that America became the most powerful country in the world not through being a selfish country. I think that For the United States to find a way going forth number one. I don't think foreigners like me should have too much input I think that's this is one of the most intimate and difficult processes of any country because it goes to the very heart of the American experience What I would say is that if America looked back towards its own history and his own Doctrine and look towards some of the people that that you respect the most the people that that you honor that you built That you built Monuments to in statues people like Martin Luther King people like Teddy Roosevelt people like FDR and Look at their approach to foreign policy and to peace and this idea What America shouldn't only stand for you know the flag America's always stood for an idea and the idea has always been global and I think that It's the time has come to Somehow renew the vows for for the United States the if you pardon pardon the image I Think that for the American Institute of Peace is the perfect place to remind Americans What was the source of American success? What has traditionally been the role of the United States in international politics and also to remind how the Cold War was One because I think it's a misunderstanding in many quarters That the Cold War was won through American force of arms that you just compete Reagan Competed you know the Soviets into the ground in Europe. We see it a bit differently We we look to to Willy Brandt the German Chancellor and his outreach policies towards the Soviet Union that made it possible for the Soviets to shut themselves down without Bringing the world to an end and I think This is something to be said for both I'm not I'm not saying that the United States should become a pacifist country but I think that To look back at some of the great successes the United States has has had and also perhaps even to reformulate an idea of American foreign policy that Would be bipartisan and that would play to the better angels of America's nature to use Lincoln's term I think that would be definitely worthwhile We are thinking a lot about this American approach to peace building and how we at the Institute can help Research and look at history and look forward to new new potential practices and policies and we really appreciate your insights and this Walk through history and also look forward to to what we hope to have to come Thank you so much for your for your time today, and we really appreciate you being with us today. Thank you so much It's been a pleasure