 Hello and welcome to Seabase late night. It's almost almost 11 and My name is Luke. I am the communications officer here at Seabase and if you've watched the Farplan closely you might have noticed that Someone else should have been in my place today. So a Dimitri Kleiner should have been here He became ill a few days ago and couldn't be here. So I'm Standing in for him right now Dimitri if you're watching this get well soon Today's topic here at Seabase late night is device control as a fetish and My guest today is a real-life virtual tech dom. Please welcome with me The queen of device and phone control goddess Anisa Thank you for being here with that. This is your first public appearance as I hear Yeah, thanks for being with us here at Seabase late night. Thanks for having me So I'm thinking the question that most people have out there is what does a tech dom do actually? I was wondering if the name explains itself a bit Basically, I Dominate men through their devices. I mean the profession of a dominatrix is not new device control as a Quite new fetish. I say it developed started in California in 2013 and Yeah, so basically I get paid for breaking into devices as computers bones home networks social media accounts even Basically the the more the technology develops the more opportunities For tech kinky play. Yeah, can you like can you tell us a bit what typical things? You do to your subs It's really hard to say what's typical because the variety is Endless and I was I'm You know whenever I think it's starting to repeat there's something new coming But there are some even within I mean, it's a super niche fetish We are talking about but even within that super super niche niche are some trends such as Team viewer for example, so some people get aroused when they even hear or read the word team viewer because they are thinking of Tech domination or when they don't know much about it and they're looking forward on the internet They are not looking at Google, but they will search on Twitter and They will search for team viewer device control Tech dominatrix and I often ask myself or maybe I should ask team viewer directly if they are aware of their fame and yeah certain target groups so like can you like Like can you walk us through like some of the things that you do during a session like maybe like Talking from like a big inner perspective so for someone someone who first contacts you Online so people come to you online and ask you to do these things to you So what do you usually like do right? I mean the very first thing that I do is Talk about what they like about their experience level what they want to experience Very important what their personal boundaries are I'm very suspicious of people who say they don't have boundaries that tells me they're actually beginners And then I still try to find it out. So basically we do a setting for for a play and I'm Because I want the person of course to I want to have a very clear chat that the person has consented and In my end after the person has paid for this for this to happen Then we do what we agreed on basically and I mean sometimes of course it might lead to The person's really enjoying it and we're going to continue it and do more stuff Okay, can you go into a little bit of the details? What are you doing exactly like that? So I think you're doing right. Yeah, sorry. You're not you're not sitting on someone's computer. You're Sitting I'm sitting at my I'm sitting at my at my at my room Someone is interested in having a team viewer session Yeah, that Implies that the person has a team view or any desk on their computer And I have that as well and the first step would be that we that we connect and That is already a moment of excitement. There is someone as you can imagine There is someone else on my computer which to most people is super frightening For some people it's exciting my clients And then you go like you go through the browser history or you go Look into like their secret folders That really depends on what we What we talked about as preparation like And they say, oh, do you are you going to snoop around and yes, I'm going to snoop around and Then there are probably folders hidden in the computer, but they're hidden in an obvious way with photos I might find I don't find hard I find hardly anything embarrassing, but it's photos that are supposed to be embarrassing that I'm going to find and Comment in a way like oh look what I found there So, yeah, so it takes screenshots you Do you lock people you lock people out of your their computer? If they if that's what they ask for they're going to get that I mean for example some After you've gotten I mean if you like one thing you always want to go to the next level So on team viewer, I might set myself my own password go to the advanced option and change the settings Which still can be undone if they are still the admin So I better make myself admin on the computer make them standard user Then they can't do the team viewers Then they can't change the team viewer settings settings anymore and from there on I have access to their computer at any time I want Which again most like 99.9% of the people find scary some people find it super hot and Yeah Do you think it your your your your subs like feel like their devices are some kind of like part of their body like intimate part of their I Was asking myself that question a lot because I mean I certainly enjoy what I am doing. I think it's a great job But I always you know, I thought is this how How do they get pleasure from something that happens to their computer? I could I was like, okay people obviously merged with their devices I mean many people have a very attached feeling towards their phone and when they have misplaced it or they know They forgot it somewhere they experience phantom pain So it kind of makes sense to my understanding, but it might also be connected with arousal Okay, and do you feel like you are transgressive to these people? I not I don't feel transgressive towards these people at all like I would if If this would be done to a partner kids employees, I would find that super transgressive Because it's going to be used Not on it's I mean like when an employee I use it on their employee It's not really consensual because what can the employees say, you know, I don't I don't want it I take another job, you know, you're in a bad situation So I find these apps Like when they are used in other contents, then I am using them I find it transgressive, but I don't find transgressive what I do because I do consensual play amongst adults Yeah, and how do you make sure everything is actually consensual? Like how do you how do you make absolutely sure that it's it's always the same. It's communication communication is key and sometimes I mean we either communicate through chat some even prefer to To see me on Skype while doing that. So Basically, I always say, okay, the next step is going to be this. I'm going to do that Are you fine with that? They might ask questions and that is also from what I mean There are some subs that have been been with me since I started this and this is exactly what they really appreciate and value But I tell them what's going to happen and it's exactly what's going to happen. That is important Like it's not only my personal You charge them. There's a contract in this case But there is no right like I mean there is of course no written contract because You know the guy gets online at night. He has the idea. It might be something to try out. So the contract is the chat Where you say, you know, let's do this and that and it will cost you the same that they pay and Then you fulfill your part of I fulfill but like I will basically do as promised and yeah, yeah Okay, let's take take a step back and look at how how you became what you are today So did you have any previous involvement in in things like BDSM at all? Well, I'm definitely not an active member of the very versatile Berlin BDSM community, but I mean I grew up in Berlin and live in here for decades and the city has always been Very kink-friendly and some people from abroad even call it capital of kinks and also when they hear about my job They're like, oh, this is only possible in Berlin. I think the nice thing about my job is you can do it anywhere That's so great about it But I mean Berlin gives me definitely a very open-minded surrounding so that it does feel great when going out like late 90s and stuff the kink scene was also super present present and There were It was more like a playful context, but I would say there is BDSM Relationships that go far beyond the typical cliches What people think, you know, like when people hear BDSM they think of shiny Shiny rubbers rubber and leather stuff and people beating each other up, but I think it's also it's also a lot about communication relationship structures Even tech domination, so I think there's a lot There's a lot of a lot of other aspects that are involved in BDSM than the very obvious Yeah, what do you see so and like from this point? How did you get into this line of work? Like what I do now. Yeah, it really doesn't have a doubt I mean it does have a bit to do with my background Because that but the background of Berlin brought me that openness for sure because we need to be open to do it Otherwise, you know, if you have like if it would Polite with mobile standards it would become difficult, but I can actually have a different background of work. I Have originally a creative job that I still do and really enjoy doing When I've been working freelance for 20 years and everybody has done freelance work in Berlin Most people I know they had they went through ups and downs Like let's say you have major clients that don't pay or let you hang by for a few weeks Then it can get it just can get really awful and there was that moment Oh that not just the moment, but there were these moments where eBay Klein and Sagan That's like classified ads or like Craigslist saved my life because I have a studio and there was always stuff to sell And the thing is every woman knows it like when you put shoes Any piece of garment textile even an exercise ball on classified ads Some guy is going to text you and say oh Can you take a picture of you wearing the shoes sitting on that exercise ball and I was always like oh no Have leave me alone. I'm not going to take your pictures And at that point in life I was super broke and someone on eBay Klein and Sagan was actually offering me money for taking picture of me and old Shoes I was like, okay, how much and we couldn't agree on the price But the conversation kept my mom. I was like wow their people had a really desperate for photos of used shoes and sitting on exercise balls and I saw the community of these people must be bigger than the community of eBay Klein and Sagan people and I started to look in the internet and I found many many platforms And I saw it you know, okay, you know, I will subsidize my lifestyle by selling used items But that was only a very small aspect actually Because what I realized very early on is it was not about the used item. It was about the communication And the time spent with a person like no one on the internet buys an item without having getting like an idea of I learned that pretty quick and then I discovered a marvelous universe of Handsy kinks like that. I was like really excited to explore for example Giantist fetish has everyone ever heard about that. I certainly haven't Play giant fetish is one of the that in this like three years ago. It was one of the fastest growing Niche fetishes on Pornham, it's basically the women is over dimensional and the the guy is like Pretty tiny so they call themselves tinies the ladies are con considered giants and what what I found really mind boggling is It's not a fetish that you can live in real life. It's only an imaginary. It's not it's not a Big woman with a very small man Yeah When I had photos of when I had photos on my Twitter and there was like a giant as fetishist Interestingly many of these people have their work in computer graphics. I mean kind of makes sense because they do the They send you like a nice collage. They made so when you when I put a photo on and they would send me in return because they're like the photo a Collage where my feet look super huge and I'm stomping their hometown No, like that would just be one example and some people find that exciting Okay, and then then you duck deeper into the internet and Is there is there like learning material that you could I was I was really yeah, I mean I I mean I was really looking for people to talk about it I mean, of course my friends love to hear my stories But it was really hard to get like professional advice and I thought why I'm Probably not the only woman on the internet doing that and I was searching YouTube and and I came across the personality that I find Super inspiring. I know that many of her videos are controversial to say to say the least but Especially her early videos where she explains every fetish like where it comes from and if you are an online dominatrix how to like how to How to deal with it basically so she she did a lot of how-to material and Corona just started. I was staying at home and like doing night classes, you know, like every evening I was going through the videos the YouTube university and Yeah, you were talking about earlier, maybe we can show this on the screen So you you sent me this yesterday, and I watched like one or two videos and like It's really hard to you like you will probably be very offended I think it's her personality. You will be really really offended by what she's saying Just as a if you if you want to get into this Yeah and then you learned about this and But also, I mean she also did she does really good advice for how to organize yourself when you get into the kind of field of work She she tells you how to tell good subs away from bad subs how to Recognize abusive behavior in communication very on and so she gives really good examples and tells you how to deal with it And that really helped me in the beginning because I mean I'm pretty confident about what I do now But I certainly wasn't two years ago It was try and error a lot and it was still before the pandemic and did the pandemic have an impact on your totally, I mean the pandemic on me had a very positive impact because Because the word calmed down there was I Really enjoyed The calming down effect. I had just discovered a new interest that I want to spend a lot of But I just want to give a lot of attention and also I had already started in the fetish world the business started growing because you know people were sitting at home and Looking for online things to do and then also in that time I came across that field of tech domination I was I was and I was amazed I was like, oh, that's like incredible and that's like so Was like science fiction and I decided I wanted to do it even though I had like literally no tech background And I told also one friend could hardly believe that I wanted to do that But I mean in the beginning the subs they really since they there is hardly the demand is so much So much higher than supply basically the subs who kind who have that kind of fetish they're absolutely willing to help so So I just you know started learning by doing and got better at better at it over the time. Yeah So what parts of the world do your subs come from? Um Yeah, I mean, I think to answer the question is best to visualize to visualize it And I have homework and research sub who prepared a map for me that we could maybe Maybe we can show on screen So Basically where you have the bigger but bigger red bubbles you have a higher density and so on so you notice that there is like a Center in like Central Europe now in Germany in the beginning it was more in the US like Austin, Texas where's big tech scene, but also New York in California, but also Colorado and Missouri some in Canada even Australia Taiwan Malaysia Neighboring countries in EU so it's pretty international Yeah, and What kinds of like? Backgrounds and what is what's what's like the age of yourself? You it's a huge age group. It's the I'd say it starts in the early 20s. Mm-hmm. Yeah, and It goes up to like mid 60s What kind of backgrounds all kind of backgrounds, I mean some in the 20s are students others There are some that are truck drivers others work in medicine. There's an retired retired State officials people who were even people who work in cyber security are amongst myself community. It's very versatile Yes, that that is one of the things that surprised me a lot that there are people out there like work in cyber security and In their daytime, they work at preventing all these things and then for fun. Yeah, but like But I think I think I think this is how fetishes develop actually right the bigger the taboo the The higher the desire, you know, that would be pretty cliche psychology, but I think Yeah Okay, now let's get into the the details the technical details Which probably most of our audience is very interested in is what kind of software Do you use and what's your experience? Um, I mean, I mainly use the software that is maybe not the best option But that is most well known amongst the subs like team viewer already has a cult status in that scene I person there's also any desk, which I prefer Over team viewer so I use these softwares as remote control to connect to phone or computer and Once they are the next the next step might be depending what they agreed on parental control there are different a lot of different one leg studio and Half it is the kids logs and saw felt is the one that I I personally like because with one account you can Control two devices, which would mean for example sub has phone and computer. You could control You could control phone and computer and split the screen time and so on What I also I mean some are also that a recent trend which was which wasn't that massive of a trend when I started is Keyloggers are becoming popular like our goddess. Do you install a key loggers? and Yeah, I mean when agreed on it. I do install key loggers as well Yeah, and when we talked before you also told me about like software that actually Give you get like frightened you. Yeah, exactly Because I thought okay, I work in that field. I have to keep up with technologies and Always looking on Twitter what other ladies do and some are very inspiring and then I noticed oh my god There's like a new user spy software out that looked really scary. That's it's a group They are either called M spy or flexi spy and They I mean they can be bought in app stores and I was Very surprised to see how far they go I think it must be like the Pegasus software But only for users as a market version because basically when you install it on the phone You have total surveillance. You can record any surrounding noise You can use the back and the front camera You can listen to every phone call and you can read all the texts. So I Read of my hours Wow, you know that goes very far I post it on Twitter that I'm looking for a guinea pig for something new that and of course there was a line of people queuing up who wanted to do it immediately and I think if people want to play with that kind of stuff, okay But what frightens me is that this kind of software is targeted targeted at parents and employers Mm-hmm. Yeah, that's certainly you don't something I wouldn't want to do Definitely By the way, if you have any questions You can ask us questions using IRC Maybe we can show the The addresses here so you can ask us questions using the channel RC three dash C base on Hackend on and also you can use the hashtag RC three C base on Twitter or mastodon and our single angels will Relay those methods or your questions to to us if you have any Yeah, more questions We'll we'll get to the those later And by the way, have you tried any free or open source software? I would be totally open to it But I have been like in preparation for this talk I was looking at how many computers I've been on and it was like a bit more than 400 In just two of these I remember the Linux computers So for some reason the Linux computer isn't with the Linux community is not that much into that fetish, but Surprise, but I even but I had to I had to I had to I had to use this with Linux computers And I found them a free open source Control which is called no many no many it was so if there is free software and And there's a sub with the Linux computer. I'm absolutely open for using it, but So also do you use any kind of like specialized hardware? Yes, I mean Specialized hardware I Mean I'm just thinking about like when you call an item hardware because into I mean interesting it is When you look at the fetishes that are related to device control, right? There is a chest that he fetish. I don't know if anyone has ever heard about it chest that he means Basically putting your dick in a cage Google or duck duck go Chastity cage and marvel at the variety of items, which I'm made either of plastic or steel And like in the old-fashioned way would be that you put it on takes a key You might mail it to my post books But you might also meet a mistress and give it to her in person and then you decide to live in Chastity for I don't know How long you know beginners and people find it hard some people find it hard for eight hours some people live in Chastity for months and of course sometimes the dorms are far away and wouldn't it make sense to have a You have a remote remote control Chastity cage So a few years ago there was development of of a device called cellmate So a cellmate is like it's like a cage that can be controlled via app And people wouldn't have heard about it if the cellmate Didn't get hacked. So there were people wearing that the Chastity device and Yeah, yeah, and it got hacked and they got basically blackmailed not only there were in that awkward situation of being in that cage they also got hacked and and hackers blackmailed them and it was it it was quite a big thing in the news and Because obviously the support of the company wasn't Available for for a certain amount of time and we have an image that frightened it frightened people out We have a screenshot of an article describing this device here. Maybe we can show this I'm also hearing that we have some some technical difficulties, maybe Is is the stream working? Okay, so Yeah, so this is this is one of the device. Yeah, that is exactly the cellmate that we're talking about. I mean it looks very technical Probably from just looking at it. It's really hard to figure what it's about. Yeah, it's it's like a cage Yeah Big word of Kings You also you also order cameras for people. Oh, yeah, sure I mean we didn't talk about the opportunities of home surveillance yet I mean some people are like when you start with the vice-controlling they might they might want to expand the fetish and And then, you know, I Normally I choose and order them cameras like one or two per room and then they put them up in their room And then I make them buy a safe and which of course is remotely controlled via app And then I make them put the car keys in the remotely Controlled safe so they can only use their car by permission And also like when I have when I have access to the home network I change the TV program if I don't like it. I Put on the music that I Want tell the sub not to sleep in his bed and rather on the floor or pick up the dirty socks So basically What you do is to give I mean obviously people Instead of being controlled or Surveilled by anonymous power. They're rather prefer a person doing so. I get Yeah So I'm think I think we're done with the with the questions that we have prepared and Maybe we we start getting we start getting Questions From from the internet But just one one question that that just came to mind is Do you do like do you like your clients? Do you do most like do the most of them like ever see your face? everything over chat or do you talk to them or do you it depends on The Level I mean for a team viewer. They don't need to see my face, but some some I mean some for example are have a foot fetish and instead of seeing face I like to see feet while doing team viewer, but it's all it is It is Possible, but I would normally do that with someone that I Get you know, like normally the first one or two sessions. I wouldn't I would just do via chat and then see how things evolve Okay, so I'm getting the first questions here Yeah, we touched on this like in the beginning just a little bit, but the questions. Did you have any legal issues? Do you doing this? What what ways do you do what what ways? Do you protect against legal issues and yeah, it's their record that you keep I Know that I could be better at Keeping records and thank you for reminding that I need to improve on that But of course, I mean I do have the chat where Where I've where we you know It's like a list of what we are going to do and what the person is paying for which is like basically a contract only that Chat is not really a contract, but nevertheless it's there But in the beginning when I started I was worried about that a lot I was like, oh my god and because it did happen it did happen that I upset people and they got angry and Then I thought well what are they going to do they go to their local police officer and tell them You know some internet dominatrix which would which would mean that they talk openly about their weirdest things that no one Which is to most people hard to understand So I just figured you know Well, relax about it because it's very unlikely It's just very unlikely and I mean luckily I've been living in Berlin all my life and If I probably need legal help, I would somehow get it So I'm not I stopped I said I had that I had these concerns these thoughts a lot in the beginning But I thought the one thing is it's more important for me to learn Communication strategies like what to do if someone is really annoyed, you know to like wait until that moment is over Find out what's behind it and so on so because basically it's more about like learning de-escalation techniques That's also like the question about clients work machines That might have access to like business secrets trade secrets. Yeah, I mean I From what I what I saw it was the private computers and I mean I Would say that I do have access sometimes to information that I shouldn't have But I simply don't touch it because Because it's just not part of it, right and I think if someone wants a computer takeover and he uses the machine for work I mean, yeah, like what can he I mean, you know, like I think when I see that that there is work files I'm I would definitely mention it and say, you know, are you sure about this and how should we deal with it? And but people who have super sensitive work. They have definitely More than one computer at home and they use one for play and one for work. Yeah, yeah, definitely I think good hygiene If you if you if you if you're into this Yeah There's a question here about like Issues that having access to data that involves like third parties So, I don't know what if what if yourselves have a family and you record their family on the cameras and Things like that. Yeah, but I wouldn't I mean, how would I record the family on the camera? I would you know Oh, you mean No, but I mean the thing is with the cat I get it, but the thing is the people What I noticed from my experience the people who do that with the cameras are Definitely subs that live on their own so It's never I've never had the case with third party involved and I would definitely find that Personally a no-go. Yeah, unless the whole family agreed, which even if they couldn't effect So it wasn't a situation that never happened, but thank you for raising awareness In case I see a family so yeah There are more like questions about like your types of types of subs and types of customers and Yeah, your your customer. Are your customers mainly nerds or hacker? Are they usually more casual every day tech workers? I think my subs are of course There is I don't I wouldn't say that's hardly. I mean Nerds like when when does someone start being a nerd? I know this like one is this PhD student in mathematics Is that is he already a nerd? He's definitely super smart And I must say that I enjoy the smart subs more than the less less smart But we've talked about this before There's there's truck drivers, but there's truck drivers also and truck drivers, by the way can also be pretty smart and funny and So yeah, and also there's a question about like what's the operating? OS preference. I think we've touched on that quite a lot is make mainly windows computers team viewer on windows Yes, yes, yes It's mainly windows. Yeah Have you ever Did you ever get fooled That you like someone Didn't give you access to like the real machine, but like no no no no no no what actually happens this like when you I mean Maybe some females watching and like that sounds pretty cool That's something I all because I'm sure there are many women out there who have way more tech knowledge already So go for it But the thing is the problem in the beginning when you start out is that people try to get you on the computer for free Like they don't want you to pay for it. So the biggest the important the very important technique is Make the deal before you actually connect because just I mean some guys also get off on on Cheating on you. So basically when they manage to get you on the computer and they didn't pay. They're all very excited enough. So That is So it's definitely about getting getting like making sure that you're getting paid and I mean because people try to trick you to like to like They try to manipulate you in every possible way to not everyone But you know some do and the longer the longer you are out there The people start to like when they see that a person is established The people who fool you they they are after they are after the beginners So in the beginning you put up with these and when you learn the techniques how to separate Good ones on that Then it kind of works, but it takes Time and then you learn it So he's a little bit more about the the technical challenges Did you ever have to do some like actual hacking? When does actual hacking start? I mean like the guy from I mean that if the guy gives you the password to his computer on Or if we for his remote control software, I wouldn't say that would be hacking No, I nobody nobody wanted ever wanted you to actually like hack into their computers like On I mean the thing is the thing is I had the skills they'd love it, you know, so so basically Yeah, so that would definitely be worth learning okay, they'd love it Yeah, yeah, yeah, no like it's exactly in my profession it would so I mean I do I mean the good thing is that when you do it through the remote control the like ways and you kind of In case of legal trouble you have that agreement process, but actually Yeah, the subs would find it super hard Did anyone ever ask you to? Damage their technology in a way that he couldn't be Recovered well, yeah, the thing is I mean when somebody asked me to install key logger What is he asking for you know, you can take the damage pretty far and Yeah, but I think the question is more about like actually breaking things Can you but this thing is I mean people Like sometimes you play the limitation games where you Put out the parental control and you reduce the time, but that is still that is still I mean the computer is still running, right? So it's more about You know like doing like making it the net tighter and tighter and more uncomfortable So no less less internet sites that you can use that less time you have on your computer and so on so it's about Creating constrained restriction digital bondage so kind of so and then we are again at the question Is there a relation from computer and body? Yeah Did you ever use any smart home devices like well Home cameras we definitely talked about yeah, yeah, I know Curtains heaters No, I haven't had curtains and heaters. I have no I haven't had those one yet, but thank you for inspiring questions I will find I will because whenever I have an idea of what could be done I'm just going to look for you know, but I did I mean home network like TV TV and music Of course or sometimes you know print I use someone's printer and print out something Next question is pretty hilarious Have you ever considered creating an Alexa skill that allows Alexa to give commands to your user? Question is awesome, but of course I haven't thought of it So Here's here's here's a question. I don't know if you want to answer this online Yeah It's about like payment. Are you paid by the hour or a session? I'm happy to answer that basically You kind of Possession, you know, and then I tell the thing is I'm not a super techie nerd So sometimes things take longer than expected or the computer looks different and then I so I make I normally make a session price But when I make I also do Custom videos and then of course I charge But it depends on what I do basically so there are packages But there's also minutes for stuff and Do do some clients ask you for some kind of role-playing Someone someone on the internet is wondering what kind of role-play scenarios you could do this with this setup. I mean There's just so many wall plays like of course. There is like the classical parent kid situation that you play The strict mommy or the teachers and often the fetishist is combined with people have like tasks. I mean I have Research and workshops because many subs are into tasks. They want it's like I want something to do in my life And since I'm always like this I have so much stuff to do always I'm like, okay. I'll give you a task make a map or there was some guy in Australia He was really into long writing tasks and I was like, I'm not an English teacher. I don't feel sufficient to My English is sufficient to actually rate it but Since he was quite old. I made him write Four pages about every year he lived in so that was a big writing task. So a lot of creativity is necessary to come up with tasks Yeah, next question we actually Answered before in the beginning of the talk just to answer that one How did you come across the fetish? How you mentioned it's very niche Yeah, so basically I You got you got from like Sell you were broke. You wanted to stop on You got messages from people and you and you started making money by posting your your videos of shoes and I started and then the giant is content Content then also like, okay, whatever. I was really getting into Paint the niches niche and explore it like that was definitely the aspect that I enjoyed and when I came across the tech Domination, I was just super fascinated and wanted to learn about it. Okay. Next question is obviously from like a From from from an expert here I've got the feeling this fetish is declining five years ago Lots of people on poppin.de Were giving access to their systems now it's as common and now it's not as common anymore Can you confirm that it's losing popularity? No, I can't confirm because since I started it's growing and maybe it like it was the community that he mentioned maybe they had like a Strophoia, you know that that like a spot that there was like a spark But since I mean what is happening right now is that the people actually have less human interaction The families are getting smaller the the communities that where people interact are very small like One child is brought up by a single mother the single mother works the people in the internet become more important than real-life person my the my that inspiring Revenge the Persephone she means the phrase Parasocial relationships, which I think many people have with me because they can't they tell me things that they can't tell anyone else and What I never can shame anyone for whatever the fantasy is so I don't see my I don't see that niche declining at all I see it growing and Maybe it's changing. It's adjusting because when the technology evolves the play will change, but I would say it's steep It's going up. Yeah How's the gender distribution? Amongst myself Amongst your yeah, well, there are some well, of course, it's mainly male. There are some I had I had some transgender people Like I was some accompanying them through in their face when they were going I don't know the proper English term But basically when you go through that phase of changing which is quite long Women are very rare. I had that twice. Yeah, so I would say 98 male One transgender or other I'm sorry if I use the wrong terms Yeah, but predominantly Yeah, but but also transgender and one percent Female Um, is there any kind of online platform where the doms share their experiences? Twitter is very important for that and And also it used to be AVN, but AVN is going stars AVN they're going to demonetize Towards the end of the year, which I find really annoying. So basically a community where you find many doms They're also interact the first I was when I was a beginner and I was looking at different rooms and sites I have find it quite interesting to see like the front side Like the customer side view of like what the doms were posting and then they had like Dom chat rooms where they were talking about I don't know exchanging recipes and stuff. So yeah Yes, so but I mean I do I do I so but basically like with every stuff on the internet you find your crowd So there are some Ladies doms that I find very inspiring. They do amazing work. They do speeches They do research that they publish and and give good advice and that is definitely important Yeah, because in my immediate surrounding I have no colleagues as you can imagine So I think one last question is What are you doing to protect your customers? Like if you got hacked? Someone would have have access to all these That all these lives like what is this thing is I don't I don't store the information of the subs You know, I have access. Yeah, but I don't store it. So If someone hacks my computer that I use for for that kind of scenario, there's hardly anything I mean what they would find What do what would be there? I mean they see a number of they see any desk user numbers But what does it tell them? So I'm not sure if I answer the question sufficiently because I haven't thought about it to the full extent But I would say You know, there isn't there is no stuff. There is no personal sub stuff on my computer. Okay Yeah, I think we're done. Thank you Inspiring also the questions super interesting thing and thank you so much Hey, thank you and I don't have an idea what the next talk is and someone shout what the next talk is on this channel Yeah Yeah, okay Hello, hello, you need you need to kneel down before you're down. Okay Thank you so much I will switch to German now because the next talk will be in German is Everything is licensed under CC by 4.0 and it is all for the community