 Hi Gabriel and Hayed and I want to say thank you very much for Gabriel for standing in for Bruno Cobata who is the boss man in that. But you're standing in because you've got a background with Becker. What is your background with Becker? Well thank you very much Brian. Yes my background goes back to the early gleam in the eye discussions before Becker was even named as Becker and so my background has been to help generate some of the thinking behind what has now become the Becker joint venture. So this is to establish a capacity, a platform and I think gosh we don't half overuse that word platform within this region to establish biosciences capacity is that correct? In simpler terms indeed it's to establish first class laboratory facilities and the technical capability to enable scientists to conduct research on the problems in the region and for the region. Why here in Ilri? Because even now Ilri has the best laboratory facilities for biosciences within eastern and central Africa and so as a result of the many years of investment both in the physical facilities but also the human and technical capacity. And NEPAD when it was looking to establish the centre of excellence identified Ilri as the appropriate host of the hub facility. Okay what's been your role? I noticed you took that lovely photograph of you as a young man. You hid it in your top pocket. Well thanks Brian. My role actually goes back to three years ago when I was appointed the director of the biotech team. At that time there was nobody actively taking care of the Baker process. I was asked by the director general to help move that forward so I was doubling up as well as the you could say the interim coordinator. One of the things that puzzles me though with your roles and the roles of others is that we've been for long trying to help contribute to the capacity of the national research systems. We have down the road what was the East African research organisation at Maguga. Why wasn't it put there? Now that's... Brian, you've got all quiet. Brian, first of all I think it is not fair to ask Gabriel about the old East African community but let me just try to answer that. The old East African community is no more. They are not in any shape close to what Ilri has and as Gabriel said earlier the principle behind Baker was not to create new institutions, not to build Baker motor but to create processes that will allow using the existing platforms or existing facilities allow things to start happening. I understand that but the whole point is that how does that... how do we make sure that this is not a competition and what is the role of what is the feeling of Carrie and Leary and the lab down into Mecchi and other places. How do they view this? Yes, I'm not at all behind the door and answering questions about the East African community and existing facilities and indeed previous regional efforts which have failed and we don't underestimate the challenge of developing a biosciences network within the region and indeed the evolution of the thinking has gone a long way from saying this is a biosciences facility located at Ilri to now this is a Baker network within the region of which Ilri will host the hub. There will also be a series of other nodes and other participants. So indeed Carrie, Isipae, other institutions in the region have been very much involved in the design process part of the steering committee and now part of the implementation. Great. Now we've got this platform and the idea is that there we bring up all these facilities and come on guys open the doors they all come in and off you go with your research. My question is does one size fit all? You have a platform that meets all the different types of research that could be done? Maybe both of you could ask that. Indeed no, one size certainly doesn't fit all and that is why the evolution of the concept has been to develop a network to make sure that there are different capacities both in different countries different institutions and it requires the whole critical mass to be mobilized in order to actually achieve some good outcomes. Yeah and at the hub which is what's hosted at Ilri the idea is to focus on one things that are normally very expensive and people I mean individual institutions would not on their own be able to have their own. Secondly to have generic capacities to do research that cuts across crops cuts across different crops to livestock to pathogens and so on. Well that brings me to the point in the document it talks about agriculture bioscience research for agriculture. Why not livestock agriculture? I mean Ilri is already at risk of losing its identity with the East Africa and the West Africa CG centers. I mean why don't we hang on to our livestock side here? I think that is precisely the problem that most people have in perceiving what this is about. This is not about Ilri. This is something being created with Ilri being a player and livestock is just a component of this thing. So as I have said earlier it is generic so that in fact Ilri can benefit from it but it is not a livestock platform. But my question is shouldn't it be given Ilri's role Ilri's brokering role in this process. I mean should we not be looking after ourselves a little bit Ed? No we should. Brian we should we should and we are looking after ourselves but we have made it very clear that Baker is not Ilri and Ilri is not Baker but Ilri is a partner in the Baker platform and Ilri will have access to that facility by expanding by actually allowing other things to happen at Ilri. In fact we are placing ourselves even in a better position to be known as an institution that is very very much outward looking forward looking and is understanding the concept of generic technologies. Okay I notice reading in the various parts of the documentation it says the function is to catalyze joint venture research and also the Baker secretary will champion bioscience research in the region. Isn't this a little bit too broad and too idealistic? I mean what if you compare that with let's say food disease genetics so food feed crops, vaccine against x and y or resistance. I mean isn't that a little bit more tangible for the people in the region? Indeed I've read these documents once or twice myself and indeed I believe it describes the purpose to look at the applications of biosciences to agriculture and the intersections with human health and the environment and indeed not only to catalyze but also to develop products near term to get them to market so the platform indeed can host projects. The intention is that these projects will actually deliver feasible outcomes. Okay now I quote again it says there needs to be a close functional relationship between the Becker scientific team and Illry's theme for it that's you to maximize research synergies and plan scientific work as effectively as possible. Sounds wonderful what does it mean? First of all I think there is a correction that needs to be made. It is true that the Baker platform has a greater link with the biotech theme because of the very nature of the platform. However it is envisioned that in fact there will be linkages for example with innovation systems type work to understand how else one might actually approach biosciences in the region what kind of innovative approaches, institutional arrangements one could do. So that's just to explain that it is not just biotechnology. However given the fact that most of the technology platforms that will be here will actually be biotechnology it therefore requires that we and because we will be a big user as a biotechnology team it requires that we have a very strong and organic relationship with Baker. Now what does that mean? It means that as hosts which is that that's what Illry is. It's a long time to get around it. As hosts we are given the responsibility of facilitating the secretariat. Now facilitating includes for example providing access to sequencing providing access to different capacities. Because those are shared and because they are within the labs it is important that the sharing processes, access issues are actually governed by a great principle. What is the role for other players? The private sector, the agribusiness, the pharmaceutical industry there's a very successful example that I visited in Western Australia which has got all these different players public, private etc. Is that what we're trying to mimic here? I wouldn't say mimic but indeed to look at the experience of some of these technology platforms around the world which indeed because of the way science is changing are becoming more the norm and indeed to be very open to a range of different players. Will there be other players that you anticipate will be interested? Absolutely. The range of players will include from the African scientists from national universities, national institutes and universities but indeed private sector partners, advanced research institutes so that indeed the whole spectrum of players that's required to conduct first class research to get a deliverable product can be involved at all stages of the process. Under this same agreement which is under NEPAD there are plans for three other labs within Africa and one I noticed that there's an advertisement out for the director of San Bayer which is going to be in Pretoria you've probably applied it. What is going to be the link between Becker and San Bayer? Would you like to answer? First of all I would like to know the website so I can apply but seriously the idea of the biosciences eastern and central Africa was premised on the understanding that it would not be limited just to eastern and central Africa but that the network would be a network involving different components so this is one component there would be one for southern Africa there would be one for western Africa to be based in Senegal so there would be one in Egypt and there would be one for northern Africa now this is the most advanced and in fact lessons are being learnt as to what kind of things should be done differently as they develop these others the southern Africa the idea again is that not all these different partners in the network will all be looking at one disciplinary area for example this is more agriculture and more biosciences there would be one on biosciences but maybe more to the medicine there would be more that is stronger maybe on some some overriding organ communicating or providing steering advice to them yes the overriding body yes perhaps is NEPAD forming a rather loose network at the moment and one of the challenges in working with NEPAD has indeed been should all these different nodes of the network proceed at the same pace but indeed there had been much quicker progress in Central Africa and a memorable exchange was between some of the other each saying couldn't you go a bit slower and Anesmo saying why don't you catch up with the rest of us okay my last question is actually for Ed now there has been theme four there has been a lot of criticism I think over as time goes on of theme four being the only theme in the institute that is supply driven that was part of the design so we've got we've changed to a demand driven themes but theme four is we've got this biosciences and so we're going to come in now with Becca which is pure supply isn't it time that theme four reorientated itself to become demand driven totally by the other themes and the other partners we have in the region first of all let me reiterate what I said earlier no no I don't want you to reiterate what I said earlier Becca answer my question now there is Becca seems to sound like we are saying Becca has been added to theme four and I said earlier Becca is not theme four I heard that now can I go the facilities I hear you I hear you now the Becca facilities will provide will provide a platform that we in theme four can use so we will be the demand on that supply that we just described so there will be okay so we will be part of the users of the supply that has been created through this process thereby allowing us allowing us to focus on those things which are not generic and which are only unique to livestock so that's part of the strategy and will you become more more of a servant if you like that's to the work of the other themes possibly Ed as a last final yes or no yes or no thank you both very much thank you