 My purpose in life was to spread entrepreneurship and venture capital around the world. I just know that that was why I was put on the earth. I think that most governments should abandon their own currency because they are so far behind. Bitcoin is so much better than most of those currencies. They should just be adapting Bitcoin or maybe some other crypto. Fiat's just not as good. Maybe some governments will create a currency that can actually compete with Bitcoin, but I doubt it. They'd have to hire some really good people and get them really working hard on creating a great digital currency, and then they'd still be tribal because they sort of say, well, no, we're the government and we have our tribe and our tribe does whatever we tell them to do. Well, now that tribe can move. The tribe can do business anywhere in the world. The tribe can decide that maybe there's a better way to go. They only have 1.4 million people in Estonia, but they have 100,000 virtual residents. And having that, that's sort of the beginning of governments competing for us. And with that data, you can have something called a smart contract. You can build a deal, a contract into software. All that data can be combined now and can be extrapolated and all the deep learning can happen. And that can make it so that the diagnostics that artificial intelligence provides can be better than what a doctor provides. It's interesting, well, if you run the numbers, Andrew Carnegie had 1% of the wealth of the entire world at one point. So clearly the gap is narrowing between the poorest and the richest. At Draper University, we've had about 1200 students. They've come from 86 different countries. They've gone off to start 350 companies. Those companies have all been outside of here. When we start Draper University, I always get everybody standing around the pool. And I say, okay, well, what do you do when you're going to start a business? What do you need to do? And they say, well, you've got to build a product or you've got to find a customer. You've got to say, all those things are very relevant. But what you really need to do is take the first step and then I take the step and we all go into the pool. And they realize that it is kind of a leap of faith. And you need that leap of faith if you're going to do something extraordinary with your life. Boom, what's up, everyone? Welcome to Simulation. I'm your host Alan Sokian. We are on site at the beautiful Hero City in San Mateo, California. We are now going to be speaking to Tim Draper. Hi, Tim. How are you, Alan? Thanks for coming on for round number two. Terrific. Thank you. My pleasure. I'm so pumped for this. For those that missed the first episode with Tim, you can find the link in the bio below. Tim, let's just jump right into things. I'm so fast. They saw the first one. They still want to come back for more. Yeah, there's so much more to unpack. Tim, I've been so fascinated with this question. It seems like one of the most first principled questions that young people should be endeavoring into when they get birthed into this world. What are your thoughts on the purpose of this human experience? Well, it's really interesting. I think we're all sort of energy sources on this planet flying through the universes. And we seem very small in relation. But I think we have a mission, and that is to explore new worlds, to think in terms of how to improve the world that we live in, how to help each other kind of adjust to this world and its changing environment. I think it's really... Also, I think we should all have fun. This is a wonderful experience we all get to share, and it's not always great, but it's wonderful, full of wonder. And it has a big impact on what we do can have a big impact on future generations, both positive and negative. And the positive ones, think of all the incredible things that great entrepreneurs have done, and they've overcome extraordinary barriers to do so. And most of the barriers are cultural, because culture doesn't like to change very quickly. But the entrepreneurs are trying to take us to a new place. They're trying to change our world. There are so many awful articles about Steve Jobs, but think of what he's done for all of us. Same things happening with a lot of the great entrepreneurs now, where they're getting sort of victimized. They're being attacked. And I think that what they're really doing is they're changing culture, and culture doesn't like moving. And they're moving humanity to a new level. And we're all going to be better off because of them, but a lot of humanity fights them all the way to the end. Cool. So the purpose being that we want to make this world that we've been birthed into better. We want to explore new worlds. And entrepreneurs typically take on this burden of genius to make the world better and to move society in that direction. And I like that a lot, Tim. What about your purpose? So my purpose in life was to spread entrepreneurship and venture capital around the world. I just know that that was why I was put on the earth. And now a lot of the world already has it now. So I feel like my purpose is evolving. And now I just want to hyper-accelerate it. I want to educate people, get them thinking about becoming entrepreneurs, see how creative they can become. Because we have new platforms that will accelerate new changes. So if somebody comes up with a new way of doing something, the word will spread around the planet faster than ever before. So they can create huge changes in our world faster and better than they ever could before. So this is really, it's a very exciting time for me. And my guess is that it will get more and more exciting as we're able to do more things. Let's see this from the perspective of, we were talking about this big human experience. That's just so beautiful that we get to experience it. Do you feel like it's divine that we're given this opportunity to endeavor into consciousness and explore our passions and make the world a better place? Do you feel like this is a divine rock orbiting the star that we all get to share? I don't know really if it's a divine rock. I do know that there are all sorts of interesting spiritual things happening around us. I know I get moved to do things. And I know that they are not always going to be popular, but I get moved to do them anyway. And I'm sure a lot of entrepreneurs feel that way, that they are moved to make some big impact. And actually recently I've been sort of feeling like I got to get the world to understand what the big sociological change is happening, what this new change is going to be. And I got an early window on it because I got all excited about Bitcoin very early. Well, it's decentralized. That means that it pervades the world without having friction on the borders. It means that the borders become less relevant. The borders were set up because we were all tribal. And all of those tribes were set up to protect the people inside the tribe from the other tribe. Well, now any of us who do any kind of international business or even business across state lines understand that tribalism is certainly less relevant than it ever was before. And so when we see people talking about trade wars or walls or whatever, we sort of say, oh come on, you're going cross purposes to the rest of your population. Your population is benefiting from all of the trade, all of the openness that is happening between these countries. And so why are we doing this? So I look and I say there's even more coming. And that is that a decentralized planet doesn't just mean Bitcoin. It doesn't just mean decentralized currency. It could be decentralized services. Government services can be provided cross-border. Government services are generally just an insurance policy. They're set up like an insurance policy. They provide us healthcare insurance or workman's comp insurance or pension insurance or whatever. Well, those now with Bitcoin and the blockchain, which is this perfect ledger in smart contracts, can be done completely virtually. They can be done across-border. You could have your social security provided from Chile and you can have your healthcare insurance provided from Canada. I'm the third virtual resident of Estonia. And Estonia has already recognized that they can provide services across-border. They only have 1.4 million people in Estonia, but they have 100,000 virtual residents. And having that, that's sort of the beginning of governments competing for us. They are accountable to us and we can, if we don't like what one government is providing, we could potentially go to another. And the best of governments or the small governments, the ones who can move quickly, are adapting very quickly to this and they're starting to provide better and better services to attract more and more businesses and money and citizens to their region or at least to their virtual region. And then the bigger countries are having a back wave on this. They are having a bad reaction. And I look at some of these things like the trade war or the wall or whatever, the tensions that are being created by various state departments. I look at that as a reaction to the fact that a lot of these governments have services that are so antiquated they're not needed anymore. And they are trying to justify their existence by creating more tensions. And we don't need those tensions. We're so much better off without them. And I liked it 10 years ago. We were very, we had a very open border with China. We both benefited in a huge way from that open border. Now tightening that, trying to put a line between those two countries, both the leaders are hurting their own populations. So this beautiful endeavor into consciousness that we have on this planet is now becoming decentralized. The amount of friction in between financial service or the friction between any type of exchange of goods or ideas is just becoming more and more frictionless. And that's helping us be more creative, execute more effectively. This also ties us into what you were saying a little bit ago with your role, your divine purpose, being in a sense you're kind of this, you're like riding this wave of like fueling, you're like kind of throwing little fuels under people's entrepreneurial booties so that they can go and continue endeavoring into their success as optimally as they can. And so that's one thing that I feel like more and more venture capital now being more easily accessed in Asia, Latin America, Africa is now starting to empower entrepreneurs to achieve what they set out as their divine purpose. So I like that a lot now. And I think you can start a business from anywhere and that the world, anybody with a smartphone has access to a search engine and that search engine can provide them with whatever information that they really need. And that brings everybody to sort of the same level in order to start the business that will take society to the next level. And so it is a great flattening of the talent of the earth. Everyone around the earth can now see, let's say, you're into biocomputing. Well, you could be, you can catch up with the rest of the world just by kind of going online and figuring out where you should be in biocomputing. And then you can figure out where everybody is and then say, well, what's the next step and start a business and get it funded and boy, can you get things funded easily now? There are funding sources throughout the world that all want more entrepreneurship in their region and so people anywhere around the world can start something. This is really an exciting time for that. Yeah. And let's talk about how, as in a sense, we have more and more of the wealth that's being created around the world. We have the first instances of trillion-dollar companies. We have a $100 billion plus net worths for people. And the basic needs, the standard of living across the world is also slowly increasing. Do you overall see that hierarchy having a gap that's closing or do you see it kind of skyrocketing and the bottoms trying to catch up but do you see it being exacerbated? It's interesting, well if you run the numbers, Andrew Carnegie had 1% of the wealth of the entire world at one point. So clearly the gap is narrowing between the poorest and the richest and the world's middle class is growing at an extraordinary rate. So more and more people are living at at least a good level. There are still places in Africa and San Francisco where people are living in squalor. And I think that those kinds of things really need to be changed. And it's interesting, by putting the band-aids on them, we're not helping. By just saying, hey, we need more services for the homeless. All that does is attract more people to that place to be homeless. What we really need to do is create fewer regulations so that businesses can thrive and then they can go build low-cost housing so they can build a better system for delivering food. Regulations are really hampering and hurting and San Francisco has the worst regulations, I think, of anywhere on the planet and they have the most homeless. So whatever is happening there is the wrong thing that should be happening and the freest places tend to have the fewest homeless. Some places, like Socialist Russia, seem to have fewer homeless but they in effect created an entire population of homeless because people in Russia are in effect starving by comparison because it's all top-down, it's all government-controlled. We do not want the government controlling things. Our government already has half of my money. They have half of the economic value of the country. I don't think we're getting half the services out of that half. So I think we really need to shrink our government and that's true all the way around the world and the smaller governments are thriving because they're attracting all the businesses they have the wealthier populations because they're attracting all the businesses. So some of these smaller countries, Malta, Gibraltar, Switzerland, Singapore they're starting to get very wealthy populations because they are, well Singapore didn't used to be free but it's a very free market economy and they're doing things to attract businesses and they have very few homeless in any of those places. So I think the good news is that the rich, poor, differential you can spin the statistics any way you want generally the world is getting wealthier and people are living better. Yeah and at the same time that there's this opportunity for those that have accumulated quite a bit of wealth to be able to procure whatever sort of augmentations to their intelligence or the metabolism that are now slowly starting to evolve more and more. I mean just the simple way even in the past that you could have kind of like someone that was maybe a servant or a maid or an assistant or whatever that would basically do the routine mundane tasks for you so that you could focus on your creative best whereas people maybe in the lower, middle parts of the hierarchy still also have to do the lower, more mundane or routine things as well. So there is this interesting amount of... I actually think that everybody has those mundane tasks and everybody does them. Well it's pretty obvious like when Bill Gates went on the Ellen DeGeneres show and he couldn't like name any of the grocery store prices he hadn't been in a grocery store for so long. So there are a few people that are sort of missing that but think of what he's provided to the world. Oh yeah of course. I mean that guy has made extraordinary things happen to the world and there's some argument that says if he had kept his money in Microsoft that we'd be better off than him taking half his money and giving it away. There is a pretty good argument for that. If you continue to build a business that has that kind of impact on the world that that kind of a spread of wealth in the world that that could actually be a bigger deal than taking half of it and giving it away. Although in giving it away he has done an extraordinary job. He's focused very much on the numbers. He's focused very much on where are we having the most impact. Where are we doing the best things for humanity. And so I really admire that guy for that. So I pay more power to him. Let other people do the shopping for him. And think of that. Other entrepreneurs are making a fortune delivering him his groceries. You know I mean Instacart and DoorDash and Uber Eats they're all delivering him his business and those entrepreneurs are also making a fortune. So we're providing those services more and more and more easily. The mechanisms at once wealth is accumulated for propagating further reshaping of potentially regulations to propagate market advantages something that people are very hesitant of. You know you listed like making the government very decreasing the size of the government. This is something that is very much so in very interesting topic to many people that could it potentially be that having a way that maybe people that accumulate lots of wealth can then redistribute that amount of wealth through entrepreneurship and through creative endeavors rather than just giving it away to there's so much cool nuance there. But one thing which just seems to remain certain and it's that when you're a young lion you love capitalism because you're hungry you're out in the world and when you become an old lion and you've reaped many of the rewards of capitalism it's paramount to not try and go back and reshape the regulations to propagate your own advantage. This is a very important question. Right that has been a big problem because the people who vote are older and they are pushing for their agenda and the people who we've elected I mean look at the average age of the senators in the US my God they are old. They're older than I am and I'm not so sure they're thinking in terms of how well do we educate our population how do we encourage free markets they're thinking about things like how cheaply they can get their pills and how they can live to be more than 85. That's a pretty interesting thing. It is the average age and the United States is one of the most diverse countries in the world a melting pot and our representation in terms of diversity is quite low in the Congress but other places in the world are more homogenous it was interesting just recently coming back from China and just seeing how there is no propaganda around diversity in China it's kind of interesting we have propaganda around diversity in the United States you need to be diverse in this way or that way. Why force that? It's already happening. I always think I look around here we've had at Drapery University we've had about 1200 students they've come from 86 different countries they've gone off to start 350 companies those companies have all been outside of here they go and they spread the good word they create businesses wherever they came from and they come from all over we have a great relationship with Senegal with Saudi, with Taiwan and each of them send some of their top people to come to Drapery University to start businesses they have an application process in these countries that's quite rigorous to find it's very rigorous to get that student and we're looking for the best of the best and what's great is that it comes in all shapes and sizes and we love that we had a great moment at Drapery University we had 12 people from Saudi in the spring and I was about to do the graduation speech and I said, hey, a bunch of people are missing and one of the Saudi women said, oh, they're out praying and I said, get them in here and I said, come on, bring them all in here we'll all pray and so then we all did the Saudi prayer and it was great fun we got everybody doing it going down on their knees and up and they chanted and whatever and then I said, anybody else have a prayer they want to do and the Israeli woman puts her hand up and said, I'll do a Jewish prayer she does a Jewish prayer we all do the Jewish prayer and then three Hindus get up and they say, well, we'll do a Hindu prayer and kind of a Hindu chant and we all did the Hindu chant and then two Catholics got up and did some moment of silence for and I thought, you know, look, we've all got the same deal here it's one big world and first I thought only at Draper University and then I thought, no, this is going to happen everywhere the geographic borders are falling the governments are trying to sort of isolate us and segment us and make us feel like we're not diverse enough or whatever that's nonsense we are all going to be completely mixed up and completely diverse and getting rid of our tribalism and opening up and becoming global is going to be step one and then it's just going to be one big open world and I think governments will be more like businesses they're going to have to compete they're going to have to be accountable to their constituents, their customers and it's high time they did because government really hasn't had anybody challenging them because they sort of say, well, no, we're the government and we have our tribe and our tribe does whatever we tell them to do well, now that tribe can move the tribe can do business anywhere in the world the tribe can decide that maybe there's a better way to go and in that case they've got to start thinking, well wait how do I attract people from the other tribes how do I grow my government against all these other governments that are attracting my people so I think this is the beginning of something really extraordinary and you heard it first here at Draper University the global decentralization movement and it was so cool hearing about how people are able to share their different diverse prayers I love stories like that and when you hear the press going off about oh, we have to have more of a certain type of people in this certain thing all the press is doing is showing their own prejudice they're showing that they have a problem and they're trying to overcome that problem but the rest of us all know the people who work for me are of all shapes and sizes the people who come to Draper University all shapes and sizes we've never even thought about it but we just get the best of the best and they come from wherever they come from it's been so cool actually making friends with people from Saudi over the summer it's been a lot of fun having that opportunity while I've been coming through that's opportunities that you really have to seize because then your xenophobia or bigotry just collapse immediately because you realize that you both have very similar principles around love and family and compassion, entrepreneurship making the world a better place okay, let's break down this ideal blockchain infrastructure for the decentralized protocols around the world because I think we now have so many of these you've been listing now governments, we want them smaller with less regulations although some people may want bigger governments but what's great is they can pick and so another question would be if we had this ideal small government but this government wants to have some sort of decentralized currency but then also we have the private decentralized currencies like Bitcoin, Ethereum then we also have these new giants that are coming up around the world the Amazons and the Facebooks and the Tencent and the Baidus they're all trying to come up with their own sort of also decentralized currencies so that's only one aspect of it so I'm just curious that aspect but then let's also talk about the like the decentralized medical aspect people are really interested in being able to have a constant stream of my biometrics being run up to the cloud and being constantly processed and predicting pathology so I can live longer things like that so let's go first we'll go into the currencies of the world I think that most governments should abandon their own currency because they are so far behind Bitcoin is so much better than most of those currencies they should just be adapting Bitcoin or maybe some other crypto it's much more efficient governments with their own currency and if the currency is not really providing that good a service they tend to be more corrupt and that leads to more corruption there are countries around the world whose currencies drop 30% a year just against a base of global currencies and if that's the case give it up you'll get rid of corruption you'll get rid of you'll attract all the entrepreneurs to your country and you'll just be better off everyone in your country will be better off except perhaps the person who is corrupt at the top making those decisions so I think that there is now a competitive system for currencies you have Bitcoin and then you have all the Bitcoin knockoffs and then you have currencies like Libra and then you have the stable coins and you have a whole variety of different currencies we now can choose from and we're going to be all better off because those currencies will be more frictionless keep better records be transparent they'll be a cross-border they're open they can be used for things that the fiat currencies can't be used for micro payments for instance or payment across-border without having to give western union 16% of your money fiat's just not as good now maybe fiat will create maybe some governments will create a currency that can actually compete with Bitcoin but I doubt it they'd have to hire some really good people and get them really working hard on creating a great digital currency and then they'd still be tribal I know that Iceland I think created their own currency I think it's called the Aurora Coin and they said okay you can only spend it in Iceland it defeats the entire purpose and so sometimes you're just going to have to governments will have to let some things go in order to compete for the next century and so this is a real... that's pretty interesting it may be an interesting time now you talked about healthcare I think healthcare is going to change a lot too and let me break it down Bitcoin is this currency that can be used anywhere everything's kept perfect track of on the blockchain and so that keeps track of currency but it also keeps track of data keeps perfect track of data and with that data you can have something called a smart contract you can build a deal a contract into software and that means that when an event happens the payment happens or the event triggers money moving from one place to another or data moving from one place to another well now you combine that with artificial intelligence artificial intelligence is really what very clever computer experts have done is they've put probabilistic assessment into data and they call that deep learning and what they can do is they can go out there and say hey, what kind of relationships do different things have well the first of these was with 7-Eleven they found out that beer and diapers were often sold together something you never really think but now you can come to your own conclusions as to why beer is always bought when somebody buys diapers but they decided they'd put the beer next to the diapers after that and they sold a lot more of both okay take that technology to healthcare let's say you've got all your medical records up into the cloud and I've got all my medical records up into the cloud so do all the rest of the people in the world and it's not just our medical records it's our blood test results and our genetic history and our Fitbit results and what we ate for breakfast and what airplane seat we were sitting in what hotel we stayed at who we met what conference we visited where we go and sit at work where the air conditioner is all that data can be combined now and can be extrapolated and all the deep learning can happen and that can make it so that the diagnostics that artificial intelligence provides can be better than what a doctor provides we have a company called CloudMedics and they actually provide they do this and they only with the doctor data they took the doctor test which is like patient comes into the office has a knee problem and a headache what do you do they... the average doctor gets about a 75 well they got an 85 and when combined with a doctor got a 91 on the test which means to me that you kind of would rather have data doing your diagnosis at least before the doctor comes and does additional analysis for you that's going to change the way this all ends up being though very securely privately decentralized no silos ongoing conversation about how all this data ends up being funneled up there you know the press brings it all out it all everybody's outed eventually so holding on to your data is going to only be a temporary thing in the future I think anyway but let's say people are really concerned about privacy they can anonymize the data that goes up there and then anonymize it bringing it back to you so you anonymize it that's who you are it gets compared with all the other anonymized data up there and then it comes back to you in an anonymous way and says here is your diagnosis this is where the quantum encryption world really picks up steam as we continue the quantum computing revolution the second one that's happening right now sure I think actually I just look at quantum computing is just the next level of computing it's just going to be faster, better, cheaper all the great things and the things it will allow people to do none of us can imagine I think there are going to be things that those quantum computers do that none of us can guess what they are but they're going to be great Crick it's trying to imagine the big game so that's part of health care part of health care, the diagnostics part of health care is going to change in a big way therapeutics of health care is going to change also because in therapeutics data is now becoming really interesting and relevant people can do all these experiments in wet labs which used to take years and years and years and now they can put a camera over the top of it and determine what's happening to each of those little vials in a wet lab and they can't even run the simulations that's even the that's just the first part we have companies called Adam Wise and Verge Genomics that can run put a disease up on the screen and run all the drugs that are off patent against it and then they can find out that something for Parkinson's might be good for the Ebola virus or something for Alzheimer's might be good for ALS and they'll just run all these things against the disease and then they'll see one that hooks and then they go oh wow we can do that and this is a drug that's already been tested by the FDA I actually think that those companies eventually are going to do a better job of predicting safety and efficacy than the FDA ever could and so the FDA will use them as ways of determining whether a drug is going to be efficacious or safe yeah do you eventually it might be that that becomes the FDA it becomes artificial intelligence FDA where they say well no this drug isn't working because we've run the simulation and it's no good I mean eventually you got to put it into animals and humans this is where these things combine the quantum computing technology the super intelligence the simulations for the healthcare hopefully with a great deal of ethical and moral and philosophical intent behind the advances of Alibaba Tencent, the Chinese government Facebook, Amazon, the US government Google, Apple etc that if you can plop these little ethicists and philosophers into teams that are building the super intelligences that at least then there's a period of reflection for the engineers and the designers and the ops people of like okay well maybe there's a way to actually work with the team at Amazon to decrease the silos of these data points so that we can actually learn more and predict more about your optimal life outcomes so there's a bunch of really interesting things that are at play on that big picture and overall like the future of how that information goes up on a distributed ledger I think is fascinating and who ends up being in ways of monetizing my own data potentially and deciding when to open up these valves to let data flow do I own it who owns it but just that whole that whole technology stack is going to be really fascinating moving forward in the future I think people are going to own their own data and they'll provide it anonymously maybe for free because they want society to benefit from it but if they want it to go out to somebody who's going to advertise to them they should they can probably figure out how to be paid we have a long way to go between those two things though Tim right now we don't own any of our data and you're saying we're all going to own all of our data and that gap is something that a lot of people are wondering how it's going to be closed you know it's not going to be closed by regulation it's going to be closed by entrepreneurs like data wallet coming up and saying hey take back your own data join us take back your own data and join our service and our service will allow you to then take that data and sell it out to whoever you want to sell it out to I tend to feel like giving out the data is a real benefit to me because I end up I don't drink and so I sit there and I watch football games and I'm sitting here watching three quarters of them are beer ads and I'm thinking you know you guys could do a lot better than selling me a beer for us and so that can be very targeted and I would much rather see something that's relevant to me the beer ads not relevant to me let's talk let's talk on the future of just in general humans and what we're going to be doing if we're talking about super intelligences we're talking about quantum computing we're talking about these designer virtual worlds that people can immerse themselves in and design them and play in them what is the role of the human when super intelligence can just run all of the creative computations much faster than we can and just create things with nano technologies just what is the future of what we do yeah it was fun my son said said AI is going to take all of our jobs so what do we do then and what's great about it is it's like you know if everybody was a farmer which they were way back when and the hoe came out or the tractor all of a sudden you know now it's like 3% of the world is a farmer the other ones all had to figure out what else to do well we're very creative we humans and we will come up with all sorts of new things to do and I can't imagine how exciting it'll be when let's say only 3% of us are doing the things that we're doing today and the other 97% are doing entrepreneurial things that could have a big impact on the rest of us so I'm very excited by that I mean if you can get a machine to do something for you during the day do it because then you can have you can go out and you can create more you can do more you can have more leisure time you can have more more time for thought you can figure out new ways for those machines to help us so I believe that humanity moves up there are these there are temporary tragedies and those are people who hey I spent my whole life being a buggy whip manufacturer I'm the best buggy whip manufacturer in the world and then they come up with this automobile you know what do I do I reinvent myself and I'm 55 or whatever that kind of thing that will be there will be those tragedies because AI when people use AI to do venture capital I'm going to have to go figure out something else to do but I'm kind of excited about that opportunity you know so that so that the mundane part of venture capital is done by AI and then I can filter it down and I focus just on the ones that matter you know the self-driving car Uber has been fantastic for this gig economy and getting people off the street making sure everybody's working and that is really exciting it's been fantastic well all those people if there are self-driving cars are going to have to find something else for the gig economy but see the regulations are trying to kill the gig economy which is just ridiculous they're trying to make it so that everybody has to be an employee of Uber you go out and you drive once a week or twice a week somehow Uber is now responsible to you forever it just makes completely no sense and I think that's driven by very powerful public employee unions who are saying you must all be the same I believe people the beauty of the world is that people are different and they come up with different things I don't think the beauty of the world is that we all are automatons and are all doing exactly what the public employee unions are telling us about by the way I like private unions I think that battle should always rage on between the private employee and the management but public employee unions why is our government unionized and growing I mean it's like they've just decided that they're all going to live better lives than the rest of us it's getting to be more of a you know the old dictatorships strong socialist governments we don't need that we are way better off if we go out and we create our own world make it great and have let the thousand flowers grow yeah everyone's own unique creative potential being maximized next time we talk we'll get the full dive also into your passion about trying to restructure even break apart like this full state of California and figure out how to separate it up and figure out how to optimally run a governance I'll ask you some more questions about that it's consistent with me because I'm saying governments have to now compete they have to be accountable to their people and so I'm saying hey California has this weird monopoly because they have the whole coastline that's relevant I mean the Oregon and Washington have a coastline but people aren't hanging out at the beach there so they have this beautiful part of a state that they control and they really need something to break that up and make it make it more competitive and we'll talk about maybe some of those dynamics and also some of your other governance principles maybe as we do more rounds together on the show to many people are wondering what would be maybe one of the most profound things that you've learned in your adventure of consciousness and here's what I've learned taking that step trying is the most exciting part of life and I think everyone benefits from the idea of trying stuff and so whenever you're in a quandary whether you think this is a safe thing to do or or something that other people will think is a bad idea do it anyway I think we're so tied up in safety that we're like bubble boy we're over protecting ourselves and I think we need to take more chances and try new things and that's the beauty of life life is so much more fun when you try something new the world opens up to you you try it and you go oh that didn't work we'll have to try something else so I believe that that's one of the keys to life to a happy life is to keep trying new things keep trying to do something that and also to have some sort of a mission in your life even if it's going to change go have a mission it's fun because then you know that you will take those chances toward a purpose and if you have that purpose it in effect justifies it to yourself that you can go ahead and try these things I would say take those when we start Draper University I always get everybody standing around the pool and I say okay well what do you do when you're going to start a business what do you need to do and they say well you got to build a product or you got to find a customer all those things are very relevant but what you really need to do is take the first step and then I take the step and we all go into the pool and they realize that it is kind of a leap of faith yes and you need that leap of faith if you're going to do something extraordinary with your life I love it too thank you my pleasure it's such a good ending such a good piece of wisdom for us at the very end take that leap of faith everyone into your mission into building the future everyone thank you so much for tuning in we greatly appreciate it do check out all of the cool links in the bio below to Tim's work check it out and support them join them in the endeavors have more conversations with your friends, families, coworkers people online about all these topics that we talked about today on the episode and also support us help us continue doing cool things like coming on site to Hero City for these interviews you can find all of our links in the bio below and go and build the future everyone manifest your dreams into the world we love you very much thank you for tuning in and we'll see you soon peace