 Let's take you to Taiwan. Their handling of the coronavirus pandemic has attracted international praise. The country hasn't reported a domestically transmitted case since the 12th of April. And the total number of infections stands at just 475, with only seven deaths. Audrey Tang is Taiwan's digital minister. She has been praised as a key figure in that fight, a former child prodigy. Renan Hacker, an entrepreneur. Audrey has a lot of strings to her bows. And I'm pleased to say she joins us now from Taipei. Audrey, thank you for being with us. What role did tech play in helping to suppress coronavirus? Well, the most important technology is definitely soap, followed closely by hallucinations, race, death, alcohol. But in Taiwan, we especially use digital technologies. In three pillars, I refer to it as fast, fair and fun. The fast part is collective intelligence. People watch the daily live streamed CECC, Centroepidemic Commencement Press Conference, so that any new developments can be amplified daily. And when we render, for example, the mass production from 2 million a day to 20 million a day, there's a lot of civic technologies that produce maps such as this, that you can see the nearby pharmacies. The green one are the ones that still have muscle in stock. The yellow one a little bit low. The red one, it doesn't have any muscle in stock, so that people don't feel panic and everybody queuing in line can see the smart refresh every 30 seconds, so rest assured that there is actually adequate supply. And finally, the fun part also very important, making sure that all the CECC daily press conference gets translated into dog memes by the spokes dog, that's on Chai of the MOH staff, the Minister of Health and Welfare, and that went viral. And when the clarification and science went viral, the conspiracy theories won't. Do people in Taiwan trust the tech and trust the people who then hold the data? Well, that's because we do not collect new data. We only use whatever we had in place before the pandemic. So do you believe that this is a model that could be replicated elsewhere? Well, of course, so when I call it the Taiwan model, you can learn more about it in TaiwanCanHelp.us, it is essentially looking at what you were already doing that already has public trust before the pandemic and repurposing these techniques instead of advancing whole new techniques and mechanisms. Do you think it's important in some countries though to try and rebuild trust? Do you see that as being an issue when it comes to using tech and a health crisis? Well, definitely. And I have a tweet saying in Democratic Taiwan, ministers trust you. And so it's more important for the government to trust the people than for the people to trust the government. For example, when there's anything that really happens in the grounds, for example, there was a medical mask rationing where the young boy only get pink medical masks and their family calls the ECC at 1-9-2-2. That's our top three line saying that the boy refused to go to school because he afraid he would be bullied. The very next day, every medical officer, including the commander Chen Shizhong, started wearing pink medical mask. And so the boy became the most hip boy in the class because only he had a mask color that the heroes wear. And this kind of rapid iteration, I think it's much more important than any single piece of technology because this ensures that social innovation can amplify to the entire society. Yeah, that is absolutely fantastic, that story, Audrey. But I know you're a digital minister. You moonlight as well as a hacker and you've been building bridges with the hacking community. Has that been integral as well and very important in terms of the tech that's being developed? Definitely because we look around the world and we share the model. For example, this mask map that I just showed you, the one with a lot of triangles, early in months after its development, South Koreans are using exactly the same map because they were demanding, their civic hacking technology community were demanding that their government release the API as the mission to machine language that enabled this kind of mass rationing in South Korea. And I personally also helped the Tokyo Metropolitan Government to hack, to change, sent the dashboard of the visualization of the Tokyo pandemic, the stop COVID dashboard. And so I think the more people join, like on the US, Taiwan coronavirus hackathon, the co-hack, the TW, the more privacy enhancing technologies there will be for everybody to look into the open innovation model and to learn from it. It's so interesting to talk to you. Audrey Tang, thank you very much for joining us. Thank you. Thank you.