 Well it gives me great pleasure to introduce the last speaker of today. Just before I do that I've recently just heard that living DNA is now accepting transfers from family tree DNA and from the other companies and not only that but it would actually help contribute to their Irish DNA Atlas project that they are running themselves. This is still working, yes. So if you do want to transfer your autosomal DNA data to LivingDNA for free then please don't see them at the LivingDNA stand just here. Right, well here are the representatives of LivingDNA as well so just look out for the ladies and gentlemen with we are all made up of all of us written on their sweatshirts. So last speaker of today is Paddy Waldron. Paddy is Chairman Emeritus of the Thayer Ruth Society. He is an intrepid genealogist and he comes from of course County Thayer where Listoon Varna is well recognized as the matchmaking capital of the world but Paddy has now actually thrown DNA into the mix so if you thought it was bad beforehand prepare to be shot. Ladies and gentlemen please welcome Paddy Waldron. Thank you, Morris. Can you all hear me? Thank you all for coming. Welcome to everybody's here. Welcome to all those who are watching on Facebook Live. I hope some of the people whose family trees are going to be mentioned here might be watching from Chicago and Cincinnati and all sorts of places. I have put my notes up on my website if you want to just take down that address if you hold up that info forward slash GGI 2017 there's also a link on my Facebook page and in the Genetic Genealogy Ireland Facebook group where the live streaming is going out. This is a bit like my first experience with Toastmasters. Morris asked me back around July would I like to give a talk and then he sent me the program which had the time of the matchmaking and they're using all the silver DNA and white DNA and I figured well I'm going to try and make up a talk on that topic with short notice it was at least six months notice which I think you get in Toastmasters and then about three months later he wrote to me and said you never sent me your title and I said I thought you'd send me my title so anyway I said I talked about the title that he made up for me. So as he said I'll say a little bit about matchmaking is that big enough for do we need to blow it up a little more? Can you read that down the back? You read that down the back? Yes, the other comes up from the back. I told a little bit about matchmaking and as it is today I'm going to go back to matchmaking as it was in the period in which our ancestors lived then a few other lessons about using DNA to do novel things with ex chromosomes a little bit about the theory of six degrees of separation submarine and then I'll go on to the white DNA results that we've got from the Kyrgyz project. So Liston Varna has this annual matchmaking festival which has been held traditionally every September for many many years. All the Kyrgyz farmers from the harvest was in we'll go up to Liston Varna to find a wife and they're already planning for 2018 you can visit the website yourself. People come to Kyrgyz to find their ancestors from the past as well as their spouses for the future thousands of people come in search of their Kyrgyz roots. Winnie Daly is the famous traditional matchmaker generation matchmaker in Liston Varna his live website is a little bit still but his face will pop up there in a moment he has this magic book which he has inherited from his grandfather listing all the eligible men and women that he tries to match up and there's a pub in Liston Varna called the Matchmaker Pub and according to his website he has his office in a corner of the Matchmaker Pub and on the back row is my good friend Michael O'Connell Michael and I well I'm an official administrator but Michael should really be a co- administrator of the Kyrgyz Roots Project I didn't even know you could do these diagrams until I saw Margaret and James put them up earlier today the Kyrgyz Project has existed at Morrison's suggestion since he came to give us a talk in there in November 2015 and it's been slowly growing on that live feed that says we have 842 members there is one big lip here in March which was when FT DNA sent me out a box of 50 kits and instead of putting them in the DNA Outreach Ireland Project which they usually do, they put them in the Clare Roots Project actually most of those ended up being used in Mayo when I gave a talk in Mayo so we had to take them out of the Clare Roots Project again but we have our office in the corner of the bar in the Stella Maris Hotel in Kiki and we entertain there the people who come and search in their roots that is a picture of the Lynch family from Sacramento in California who came over last November there are seven siblings in that family they have all tested the various DNA projects various DNA companies they have no idea where their grandfather usually came from they got the DNA results back and it didn't take much looking at the DNA results before we were able to tell them your grandfather must have come from the town and the Mogene and County Clare because you have a lot of third cousins with Lynch ancestors whose ancestors lived in that town and we were able to confirm that by looking at OD matches as well which was another side so you are definitely descended from Michael Lynch and Mary Odine who married in about 1820 because you matched the cousins on both the Lynch side and the OD side so this is Michael and Maureen who on the other side is the cousin of the Lynch and this is Michael here and the group of six came from California to Clare as soon as they discovered that their ancestors were from West Clare this was another group that we met in May some of these people on the front happened to be here just for a family gathering organized by somebody for the descendants of a couple who lived in one more near Kilrush in the 1800s there is me at the background and Mary Allen here had actually found me through the Ireland reaching out project which I am also involved in which is another way that people find where an Ireland their ancestors come from and get local help from local volunteers we find nowadays most people start out with the DNA and find the parish in Ireland through the DNA rather than through the Ireland reaching out but the principle is the same thing it's nice to have local people there to give you a welcome and share the local knowledge when you arrive and this third group we found when Tom Quinn put a post up on the County Clare Ireland genealogy group in Facebook which now has over 3,000 members a little less than the genetic genealogy Ireland group which I noticed went through 4,000 this morning and Tom just gave a stop online of his ancestry and we very soon worked out a pedigree several generations back for him he turned out to be related to the lynches as well and he arranged to meet up here in the Stella Maris he's not in that picture we forgot to take a picture before he left but this lady Maria here in one of his close DNA matches we all met up together in our office important thing when you go to a pub or hotel or somewhere to meet up with people and bring your laptops to show up look at the DNA results you'll eventually have to plug in so we sit in that corner because there's a double plug socket behind the curtain I'll come back to that anyway if I tell you Mr. Barnett the other man who I have swabbed is my friend Tommy here he is on his visit to the List in Varna Matchmaking Festival here is Willie Daly who we saw earlier and he matches up the man and the woman who appeared through from either side at him and Tommy actually met the real Willie Daly on the same day on his visit to List in Varna he's told me I can use these pictures I think he knows they're up on Facebook but his Facebook account is rubbed by some of his so-called friends this particular friend when he saw the picture said I believe Mr. Daly is a matchmaker not a miracle worker sorry but the comment is cut off there well as I said I swabbed Tommy he has a fourth cousin in New Zealand a wonderful man called Murray Gannad who has transcribed the parish registers for part of the whole parish and annotates it in a document that I read to about 4,000 pages of local family history and Murray contributed some money to the DNA project and said Murray I think his closest cousins would care of our fourth cousins for so long since his ancestors went to New Zealand but he said can you find me a fourth cousin I asked Tommy would you be willing to swab he said well as long as the guy in New Zealand pays so he gave me his DNA and I uploaded Tommy to the Get Match website and his top match was an adoptee living in the States coming in on Facebook Live welcome Nicole if you are and it only took me a couple of hours with the book I had on Tommy's family history to identify her birth parents and it turned out that they got married about a year after they put her up for adoption and she managed to meet with her father and mother shortly afterwards sadly her father died about a year later and she had to cancel her planned trip to Ireland to meet the rest of the family because that was the week the father died he daily may not be American worker but Get Match certainly is American worker when it comes to Tommy so matchmakers were part of tradition in Ireland for many centuries marriage in Ireland was not a romantic enterprise it was an economic enterprise it involved juries and fortunes I met another discovery recently through chasing DNA matches I had this story of an immigrant from America who came back sometime after the U.S. Civil War not sure that part of the story was true either but he came back anyway with a fortune and he bought a farm but I think this is a misinterpretation of what happened there was a farm which a wealthy farmer had bought for his son the son died of TB so the father said would we give the farm to the daughter as long as she marries somebody who comes in with a big dowry or a big fortune and that's what the use of the fortune was as a dowry not to purchase the farm and he married a woman who already had the farm which had come from her brother who died young of TB well there's the tradition of Miss Dunbarna after the harvest season really the matchmaking as you would see from the old pirate's records took place in what was known as Shrove Tide that's the period from little Christmas days Mulling the mom of women's Christmas as we call it in Ireland the feast of the epiphany the 6th of January that was the time of year the matchmaking started and it had to be all over by the start of next so you would find on Shrove Tuesday of every year huge number of marriages and most Irish parishes and if you're not sure which Shrove Tuesday was but there's two ways you can find out you can look in the parish register and see what day the most marriages are on but there's also an online easily asked to build calendar calculator that you can use and we've always had the problem of shotgun weddings but we have it more today maybe than we did in the past and DNA throws up lots of surprises some brides were pregnant when they married some of them were pregnant by their husbands some of them were pregnant by other men but when they found them in that situation it was probably because the man was somebody that they could not marry because of the economic circumstances that would have been frowned upon and I have at least three cases one in 1908 where the marriage took place in January the son was born in June something fishy about the dates there and the descendant did a DNA test and didn't match a second cousin once removed as she expected to match and then a few more persons were tested and it turns out that the first son may lie on descendant does not match on the wife or on the son the husbands may lie on descendant the other is half the group four so we can be pretty sure in that case yes she was pregnant when she married but she didn't marry the father the second one I found out was in 1943 in England that came about when the son and the grandchild tested and they matched as half-nevue rather than full-nevue and there's another case in Dublin which came about when there was an inheritance to come from a half-brother and the half-siblings were all tested to prove they were half-siblings and one turned out not to be a sibling at all that was in the 1950s and some of this goes back to the the rumour tradition that the local landlord as they called it in French the draugie-senierre or just pre-menopters but maybe women might be infected by the landlord rather than the husband there was a famous knight in Dublin called Rither and the mom for his womanising this is an article from the Irish Independent recently about a colourful family in history of lechery, infidelity and fanciful feats and this man was rumoured to have had his way with most of the pretty girls in the parish on the night before their marriage but he had various public mistresses as well so there were probably other cases back there there's another public figure in there I'd rather not make it mention any names but it is rumoured that if he did a YDNA test he would match the local landlord because one of his female ancestors was working for the local landlord or had an encounter with the local landlord around the time that she married somebody with a completely different surname so I'm going to go into a little detail here on an example that only cropped up earlier this week sorry I should have loaded up the map before I took the drink I was sitting at home Monday opened the house wouldn't blow down during the hurricane and as Monday as I started up my browser and the home page is my ancestry DNA matches with the most recent first and I had a look down through them and I saw a name that I recognised and I said I'll have to try and figure out the relationship so this is Wes Clare he probably told me that panel I can close it live on Google Maps we did need that panel because the map was gone so let me open it again this is the Loupehead Peninsula you're doing great which is a very powerful part of the world because it has both the US president as a local golf course owner and the US vice president as a descendant of Evergreens from the same parish within a splitting distance of each other now I've killed my map here it is so here he's doing great village here's Trump International as it's now called here's the parish of Calard where my Clancy ancestors lived here's the townland of Clough and Beguist it's 13.4 kilometres away I was intrigued to see the chart that Jean-Pierre put up earlier today of the average distance between the birthplaces of husbands and wives in British marriages between 1855 and 1955 and I thought of 13.4 it's close but there are different parishes these people would have got to Mass and do a big village these people would have got to Mass over here in Cree so it wouldn't be that much mixing between them it was quite a distance to go the Clancy brothers to some people the Clancy brothers are a great cult group I hope some of them have some I'd love to get their DNA from my Clancy Y DNA project but these Clancy brothers are my great-grandfather George and three brothers they all lived in the townland of Calard which we saw on the map a little while ago Thomas had eight children George had nine children Michael had 15 children Henry had 11 children that's 43 Clancy first cousins all living in the same townland at the same time going to the same school so I think the teacher probably had children remembering all the Clancy names today there's one Clancy family living in that townland still farming so the pattern I noticed Thomas married a woman called Nora Nolan from Tom and Beg East 13 kilometers to the east and Henry probably the youngest brother married Nora Marnen from the same townland, Tom and Beg East 13 kilometers away to the east found as far as you'd expect anyone to go to find a wife in those days of matchmakers so Nora Nolan's great-great-neighbored and to Nora Marnen's great-great-neighbored popped up on Monday as DNA matches 28.3 centimorgans shared across three segments that's the sort of relationship we should be able to find a common ancestor so let's look and see what was going on in Griffith's valuation in Clot and Beg East here's the page from the parishes Tim McDouan we scroll down and here's Clot and Beg East and here's Michael Marnen whose daughter, Nora, marries one of the Clancy Brothers Henry and here's Michael Nolan whose daughter, Nora, married another of the Clancy Brothers Thomas and they're listed right beside each other and down here another man whose descendant is in the DNA database is John Tuberty he's a great-great-great-grandson I think is Ryan Tuberty one of our leading television and radio broadcasters who did a great piece of DNA on his St. Patrick's Day program this year so we'll probably find out his relationship with these people as well so we know they're listed close together since that means they're living close together let's look at the map here's number two I remember who was living in bridge one that's why I have a paper of notes with me as well number three was Nolan's and number two was Marnen's so when I drive up here the directions of the Marnen house today are followed by signs for Nolan's because Nolan's have a tire business or something so there are signs to the house and there seems to be quite a distance between the two houses but in fact they're side by side and one has an avenue coming in from that direction and the other has an avenue coming in from that direction and they seem further away from the road than they are in practice so these two women came from spitting distance of each other and they moved 13 kilometers away and married two brothers and the Tuberty house was number six over here so what else can we find out about these two families well we have a pedigree of the Marnen family which I got this summer written by a nun who's no longer with us and given to her sister another nun who passed it on to her niece who passed it on to me and up at the top here she wasn't even sure was he Michael Marnen or Mort Marnen this is the Marnen and Rick's valuation but he married Eleon O'Brien and talked about the Nolan family Mrs. Nolan is buried in the middle cemetery further over to the east again than one might expect and the inscription says you can read it on the Claire Library website if you follow that link here lies the remains of Eleon Nolan Eleon O'Brien who departed this life February 15, 1855 aged 64 years erected by her beloved husband Mr. Michael Nolan for her and posterity so now we have evidence that both Mrs. Trancy's both called Honora both from the same town and both had mothers called O'Brien we haven't found Mrs. Marnen's grave we don't know her first name only her surname appears on the handwritten pedigree we also have a couple of user submitted family trees of this family one says that Mrs. Marnen was not an O'Brien at all she was Anna Maroni and that's put up by Bob Mowler who has been to Cochambeg to see whether his Michael Marnen whose children immigrated to the US was the Michael Marnen who lived in Cochambeg and there's another lady who has put up this tree again saying that Hayley Marnen is the brother who stayed in Cochambeg and that his father was Mary and Mappany now Maroni and Mappany are two different readings of the same type of document because I have seen the original type of document and it's a bit blurry but one has Anna and the other has Mary Ann I don't know and actually the first time I went to Cochambeg he used to visit my third person once removed Brendan Marnen I was sent up with a DNA kit he had to spit three times for ancestry before they managed to get all the SOMA DNA results but eventually they got a good sample but I had to swap them in case we eventually had to go to Family Tree DNA to do the SOMA plus so that we could do the Y DNA and there was above Mowler's insistence that I did that and these two trees have now been discredited because Brendan came out not matching the descendants who thought that they went back to Michael of Cochambeg they went back to another Michael Marnen probably of Cameroche so what have we got now we're looking for patterns in our data research of any sort is about spotting obvious patterns or surprising trends in data we can also do data mining which is digging a little too deep some people do with their DNA data finding patterns that are not obvious but here we have a pretty good pattern we have two next door neighbors their sons and lower brothers they were both O'Brien's they were possibly related they both called daughters Honoras daughters were typically called after the grandmother when the two Honoras called after the same grandmother if so the two people who showed up as matches this week Brendan and Michael could be fourth cousins and Brendan and Michael are good friends and to know they were related so what I did then is I went to my genealogy database which I keep in Ancestral Quest there is me with my ancestors back five generations everybody needs one of these databases the offline software is far more powerful than the online family tree websites like Ancestry so in my notes I have put a tag saying getmatch and here's my getmatch numbers I've done that for everyone that I have found on the DNA databases so I filtered this and put it in the filter show any individuals where the note speed has a getmatch tag there are 992 of them and 967 of them are connected in some way by marriage to me but what we can do is come to Mrs. Nolan whose number I have here some for the two O'Brien sisters who I want to go to and I can say now show me all the people who are descended from Evan, Nolan, Neo, Brian's ancestors select them 999 generations of ancestors 999 generations of descendants it has found precisely three who are in the DNA databases gives me their names Michael is the man who just got his results and I don't know if I'll have a getmatch yet I'll be meeting him tomorrow to get him on to getmatch but tell Mike Mahan is on getmatch then I did the same things for Mrs. Marnen who is 113913 which is great to find her and search and and that will give that select those who are related to Mrs. Marnen and in the DNA databases sorry it's jumped to the wrong one here select okay there are 17 of them seven of those are on getmatch so now what I'd like to do is take the one descendant of Mrs. Nolan who is on getmatch and the seven descendants of Mrs. Marnen who are on getmatch and see do they match so I created this autosomal matrix blow that up a little bit for you I think so it's selection okay it looks different without projecting so here's the one DNA person we have on getmatch who is descended from the Nolan here at the seven we have we're descended from the Marnen you can see that all these are fairly hot cells they're all those relations except for about two cells but here's the Nolan descendant that we had no idea was related to the Marnen descendants until last week and he's showing up 26 centimorgans, 40 centimorgans 18, 10, 23, 14, 10 it's pretty good for fourth cousin fourth cousin once removed I adjusted them all to a fourth cousin scale in other words I doubled the numbers for the fourth cousins once removed so I'm not comparing apples and oranges I worked out the average is 31.4 centimorgans shared the shared centimorgan project by Blaine Battinger that lots of people have talked about found an average of 35 centimorgans shared between fourth cousins have I proved that the two of Brian's were sisters and that the descendants of fourth cousins I haven't proved it but it's very strong circumstantial evidence but there's more that we can do here if you find two women that you think were sisters you'd love to know do they have the same mitochondrial haplogroup so you can trace down female line descendants from both women and I did that and I found one of my cousins is I won't hear from the audience he was going to come today but he's getting I get paid a free kit for doing this talk and that's going to be used to analyse Owens' mitochondrial DNA and that will tell me what was the mitochondrial DNA of his great-great-great-grandmother Mrs. Marnon then we need to find somebody who descends in the female line from our next door neighbour Mrs. Nolan and get their mitochondrial DNA and there were three sisters from that line called Maloney who ended up in Chicago I mentioned the Vice President earlier his great-grandmother the American Vice President's great-grandmother was a Maloney from Dune Bay family I'm not going to go into this story if you want one story about how I managed to figure out that photo and that photo taken 60 years apart with the same woman and there were people looking for what happened to her and people looking for what became of her she's the daughter to the married Maloney but anyway I put that family tree together and her descendants are only a favour and they have the mitochondrial DNA I'm looking for so I hope we can persuade some of them to do it and do quite a hundred DNA tests come back as matches I'll be 100% certain that those two ladies were sisters if they don't come back as matches I'll tear it all off and start again there's more we can do because it's India's down there in the back she has no marines of love but she has spent her last two years putting together the family tree of all the marines in the world and when I checked her tree for the marines she has Timothy who got the home farm and Mary the fancy and she speculated there's this woman Mary who might be a sister, she's a marine and she's from the right parish she's in the right age group there's only two marine families in the parish and this seemed the more likely one and I said well let's see can we get mitochondrial DNA from Mary's descendants and see that she really belong in this family and thanks to Rory O'Shea who's over here who's the descendant of Maria or Mary the Carrick and we're waiting for those results to come in and that will give us a clue as to what mitochondrial DNA to expect or not expect from the other tests when they come in but I'm actually fairly sure now that Cindy's guess is wrong and that that woman is from the other marine family at the other end of the parish because I did a little bit more I added Rory's cousin the Carrick descendant to this matrix and he would be a third cousin I think to most of these people but when I did the numbers anyway I was expecting to get an average of 35 this time I got an average of 6.6 so purely on the autosomal results I think we can already throw out the hypothesis that Mrs Carrick belonged to this marine family and she belonged to the other marine families at the other end of the parish so let me jump ahead to another completely different case another adoption case that landed on my lap a couple of weeks ago and this again arises from my little visit to the marines in Lohanbeg East Jim Hammer I've got permission to name him here if you read his Wikipedia page you would see that he was adopted any baseball fans from among the Americans in the audience anybody ever hear of Jim Hammer and his wife has decided it's time to try and trace his birth family you can read all about his life story there so he's a very distant match to me 6 centimorgans across one DNA segment I don't think I would have heard on the radar except that my cousin Brendan has 65 centimorgans shared across five segments so that was enough to attract Jim's wife's attention he is a little bit of a problem with his adoption records his adoptive father died and his adoptive mother remarried and Hammer is his adoptive mother second husband surname so his present surname doesn't match the surname he was even when he was adopted he's fishing in all the gene pools he has a closest match of 273 centimorgans which is predicted to be first cousin once removed or second cousin or maybe second cousin once removed I tend to use this table recently on the plain messenger table I'm a statistician, I love probabilities this is on the DNA Geek website and for every level of shared DNA it gives you the probability that the relationship falls in the various categories siblings, grandparents, first cousins first cousins once removed and we were looking for 273 there so that's where I get roughly 20% of first cousin once removed 50% second cousin 20% probability second once removed get matchy has the same person this is closest match family tree DNA sent off a sample only a couple of weeks ago we're still waiting for the Y DNA results we tried to transfer the file from ancestry DNA to family tree DNA and we keep getting error messages there's actually a small number of ancestry DNA files get a raw data file with about 10,000 missing SNPs out of 600,000 family tree DNA rejects them there's this long thread in the family tree DNA forums somebody has recently actually written a little program to fill in the blanks so that family tree DNA will upload it go to the source of the glitches but we get around it eventually there were some disparaging things said earlier in the weekend about the mind heritage matching algorithm which has thrown up a lot of false negatives for people who are expected to be in the second cousin or first cousin once removed range but Jim has got a good match with 358 centimorphins shared DNA of my heritage and it looks genuine because he's from the same family as his other matches his close matches include a number of descendants of Thomas Moroney and Mario D married in about 1850 and he already had something that his birth father might have been Moroney so that all began to make sense but then when these close matches were persuaded to upload their data from family tree DNA or ancestry DNA to get matched that put the cap among the pigeons or the fly in the ointment or the spanner in the works as other people have said over the weekend because he shared 1.7 centimorphins on his ex chromosome which came from his mother with one of the Moroney descendants he didn't share it with her sister if it came from their father he would match both of them because two sisters get exactly the same ex chromosome from their father so it must come from their mother because a mother gives her daughters different recombinations of her two ex chromosomes so now we know there's a Moroney ancestor on the mother's side maybe there's a Moroney ancestor on the father's side as well get matched as another lovely chick you can run are your parents related it says no they're not related so maybe just the whole story got garbled or maybe there are unrelated Moroney's on both sides Ancestry DNA does not give you this information about the chromosome if you send your DNA to Ancestry and don't copy it to get matched you are missing critical clues like this I don't know why Ancestry doesn't give it but it doesn't and Jim actually has a page from the birth index for New York City which has a male Moroney born on the day in which Jim celebrates his birthday and the mother's surname is just given with the Sandex code K530 which matches names like Kennedy and we have now identified a Kennedy married to a Moroney and we're beginning to wonder is that where the Kennedy and Moroney surname is it's a work in progress but one reason I like this was Jim's wife sent me an email the other day it's official DNA is my cocaine I've got to have it we're all addicted and Morris is gone now but over the course of the last week the next conference has got to be genealogist synonymous with those of us who are addicted to DNA I'm talking about you missed the punchline it's official DNA is my cocaine I've got to have it that's for an adoptee's wife in the US so she'll join genealogist synonymous too when we set this up so I've never believed in this thing about six degrees of separation I showed you a couple of pictures earlier Tom lives in Maine Maria lives in England there's Maria with us in the Salamaris they both have holiday hopes and kill key they discovered that there were DNA matches when the results came in they're on chromosome 20 for location 2 million to 44 million they have a shared segment of 60.7 centimorgans 6,677 snips that's indicative of a pretty close relationship they know their ancestors they both have ancestors from the town of Kilki they can go back to their great-grandparents there's no surname in common there's no geography in common on the other sides of their family they could be fourth cousins and 60.7 centimorgans has about a 1 in 500 chance of surviving in two fourth cousins but this is what I said about data mining this is the extreme tale of the distribution that has jumped out and hit them in the face it's not a randomly selected comparison so there will be this is the 1 in 500 case I was in the detail of the distribution so I said let's see can we find is there anybody else who shares this segment we read the matching segment search and get matching these people and I came up with this triangulation involving a gentleman called Pete and I said oh that's interesting because Pete happened to be he happened to be staying in the same hotel at the same time on the visit from Cincinnati that's a lot less than six degrees of separation we still haven't found the common ancestor of the three of them but they happened to be in the same hotel on the same night one from Maine one from Cincinnati, one from London and they triangulate on this DNA segment so what have we learned from these autosomal examples as genealogists we combine our family histories by matching up three categories of information we have the oral traditions that are passed down through the generations that 100 man and pedigree would merge or Michael married to O'Brien that sort of thing or the letter that my grandfather got in the 1940s from my grandmother's uncle listing the four fancy brothers and their wives and their 47 children which I could not approve from the pirate's records because those four brothers were born before the start of the surviving pirate's records then we have the archival sources used by the tradition of genealogists the census returns the pirate marriage and death records the church records published genealogies and so on and then we add the DNA evidence today's DNA does not work on its own you still have to do the heart slog and it would usually reconcile the oral and archival traditions it would sometimes recruit them there may be NTEs not the parents expected what do you have to do to get the most out of your office on the results I have a page on my website in which I go into details about the house and the wives which would give you all the links and I'll be in a talk on the 20th of November for those who still in Dublin to the Irish genealogic research society on this you've got to upload your pedigree chart to Ancestry DNA so that people who see your DNA match see what you know of your ancestors see that you're interested might find another ancestor for you and will be tempted to contact you you have to upload the pedigree chart and your DNA data to get matched and to Family Tree DNA if you've had Ancestry DNA do the lab analysis you've got to make sure all the DNA kits you manage are matched to the correct person and the correct family tree and that way you make life much easier for yourself, much easier for your matches and make it much more likely that you're going to make contact with somebody who has a provable relationship with you and who has information that you didn't already have so I should have about 5 minutes left in which I'm going to run through completely different topic the YDNA results from County Clare I think we saw 840 odd members of the project on the live feed I did this a couple of days ago when they were 837 if you have an ancestor who lives in County Clare you're welcome to join the project you just go to that page and if you're not already a member there will be a button over here beside the room that says join and you click on it there are 370 men who have YDNA results out of those 837 members and I have grouped them hard-sloved manually just learned from James Irwin from out there that now automates the whole thing I've colour coded them the green ones are half the group E the blues are half the group G the whites are half the group I the turquoise are half the group J the pink are half the group or 1A the grey is top level or 1B various subgroups of that pretty much everyone is half the group or sorry it's on the right side so I wanted to go so out of the 317 sets of results 88% of them are in half the group or 9% half the group I and an odd stray and a few other half the groups within half the group or 98% of them are or 1B a few strays and or 1A and one person who they can't assign to either or 1A or or 1B because he has some unusual STO results that is 86% of the project then is in or 1B that's higher than the 81% that Margaret reported earlier for the Ireland YDNA project these are people reporting they have some ancestry from there that doesn't necessarily mean they may line ancestry as Claire, my name goes back to Roscoe and I'm in the project so if it's not I have the time to get everybody who wants to get in I let everybody in who claims they have their ancestry in the or 1B group there are M269 is the top of the half the group there's 20 people who we can't decide which half of it they belong to U106 I belong to there's only 4% of the or 1Bs in U106 P312 again the most common half the group in Ireland 88% of the or 1Bs belong to that and then we have two brothers who are in S1194 which is a tiny little branch since it's the same level as those two within the P312s 89% of them are in L21 which again is the most common half the group in most of Ireland and within that we get down to the interesting level how did they break down into these known half the types that were identified some years ago as being very common in Ireland we expect a large proportion to be the Dalcashian Irish type 3 which includes the O'Brien's descendants of Brian Baroo and their families Brian Baroo from Killaloo and County Clare there's 28% of the men within the L21s are from that branch I'm surprised there's as many as 20% from the M222 that's the so-called 9 of the 9 hostages YDNA which goes back to the northwest of Ireland Nealuk in Donegal there are two other organized Irish groups there's only 6% in the South Irish group and only two people in the Monster type 1 group I would have expected to live more than the Z513 Z253 that's the decent one is that are 255 255 the 513s are mostly thanks to Rory recruiting O'Shaes the surprising one is the L1336 the second early best medieval historian in County Clare we've decided these are the Kirkham Rose surnames from way up in northwest Clare and they include the Marnins Dabarons, Donnellons, a couple of Cunninghams, a few O'Loughlins that sort of surname and then there's a few Strayes the interesting thing is how many common surnames there are for more than one person has joined the project and they come from completely different one and half through five, one and half through four I managed the cancy project which you can follow that link to visit we have some cancies are Kirkham Rose cancies some are Dalcashian cancies and there's one Stray, Thames's ancestors come from Wexford who's a North 1A and discussing this with Luke there were cancies up in northwest Clare and Kirkham Rose there were cancies down in southeast in Margaret and Fergus and there have been connections between the two families since the 1400s and Luke and others have assumed they're the same family but it now looks like they have different DNA signatures and they were not in fact the same family I'm not going to go through all of them OD is another project I gave a talk here last year and I discovered in the recording afterwards the first man up to me at the end of the project was James OD who's made it here today and he pushed his card in my hand and said I want to talk to you about Freddie Kerr who was an old family friend from Kilkeen so I had to bring him to the next administrator with James of the OD DNA project and we're looking for ODs because there's a big gathering coming up next May in Dysart OD and County Clare for the 700th anniversary of the battle in Dysart OD and the results are a bit all over the place one is half the group of OD there's five Dalcashians there's three who we can't place more recent than P312 and we sent out a pokey mail to all the ODs on the Family Tree DNA database during the week so a lot of others have joined and when this conference is over I'll have time to analyse those new ones but then there are other surnames where there's no variation the Curries and the Curries there are four of them in the project not known relatives I think they're all Dalcashians Pusex, all Dalcashians all with a very low level identified half the group they're all close STR matches and those who have tested have the same SNP so I'm pretty sure they're all going to be A15201s the Marinans we have six of them they can all go back six or seven generations without finding a common ancestor they're extremely close on their STR matches and this BY19488 seems to be the terminus SNP for the two who've done the big white test and we've just got that approved by Family Tree DNA something that's available for single SNP tests so we're going to be ordering a few more of those in the next few days and Rory's O'Shea, six of them are L513s five of them are known relatives so people who've always acknowledged each other as relatives even though they've forgotten who the common ancestor is so that's just for the BYDNA geeks of the audience a quick run through what you find in there there's lots more on my website including my beginner's adventures in genetic genealogy which has been growing and growing for the last few years which you're welcome to read and I guess all that remains to say as the last speaker of the week is for me to ask you to pack Morris B for his great efforts over the last three days from the last five years and we might have a couple minutes for questions we have a few minutes for questions I think it's absolutely fantastic the work that you've done at Clear Roots Society and I wish every county in Ireland had somebody of your calibre doing this type of analysis because it really would help a lot of the diaspora Irish as well to reconnect with their roots here in Ireland and of course it would help a lot of the local Irish to actually find out that you are related to your neighbours and you just never really knew it Question here Hi, my name is Jo I'm from New Zealand and I'm from McInerney family from Kilrash and I've got 12 that I had to come and see you because you wouldn't know all about them Well I've dealt with a couple of McInerney cases recently and I had to put up a comment on our Facebook discussion more than 1% of the population of County Clare in the 1911 census was called McInerney's there are McInerney's in every parish and probably in every town then but talk to me afterwards and we'll see what we can do for you Comment from Denny? I'm just sleeping now with all this work that you've done How do you plan to do so much Sometimes I sleep during the day to make up for staying up all night Do you have an identical twin you haven't told us about? An identical twin you haven't told us about No, my grandfather was the identical twin Morris asked if anyone had double first cousins in their family tree and there were two Waldron identically twins and they married two sisters and they're descendants of both in the audience today and twins ran in the family on my mother's side as well I had two uncles who were twins but no, I'm just one person We have questions for Cindy Wood I will very quickly go online so nobody doesn't sleep Cindy has weird ideas about the right time to phone people so we needed to talk to Brendan recently and she said you can't phone him now it's nine o'clock at night he'd be going to bed so it's nine o'clock at night he'd be going out playing cards Any other questions at all? Any other comments? Okay, while it just remains although we have a comment over here I'm going to come around this way Lovely The general question How would you give over the difficulty of people who are reluctant to cooperate even for me? We've been very lucky to have been turned down by too many people so we took them so pushed them too hard some people you know they're never going to give up never going to give out the information I'm reminded actually of going to visit my great aunt our great aunt is a few of her great nephews here in the audience with my father many years ago and I was trying to sweet talk her into telling us some of the family secrets but we're trying to write out the family tree and we hope you'll be able to help us and she climbed up and wouldn't say any more so you don't tell them that you're writing it down you don't tell them that you're compiling a family tree you just do it as casual conversation and try and get the cubes out of them that way Michael has a question out of the back Michael has a question Michael always has answers not questions Since I was mentioned in the discussions I wouldn't say any more just to comment the comfortable writing down it's crucial to write sweet talk but another thing you could have is when you could record a tension spend on the resource and listen to the record and fill your laptop at your own time type in the information and start the work process and you just reminded me I was supposed to record a captation but I hope Jared has gone for a little length you'd be with us that's not like you but anyway, I have to say that he mentioned a couple of things he mentioned the standard matters there's a couple of more offices that are on the area but that's the general rule and he has got the environment I was always interested in history and local history and family connections and so on but many years ago I came to the conclusion that it was like I'd say let's go and pick it up and draw it and guarantee your hitter relationship and that's a good way of writing out and that's more less because it was originally in the other tasks people that were very famous and so on Thanks very much Well sadly that is the last we have time for for this year's I just remain for me to thank our sponsors Family Treaty and A, all the volunteers of the Family Treaty and A that have made this one of the best conferences that we've ever had and for you guys in the audience we've had the biggest audience and we're just going from strength to strength and lastly of course Paddy Ward for giving us a fantastic finish Thank you