 everybody. My name is Neil Kenny Geyer and I have the distinct pleasure and privilege of moderating this amazing amazing panel here and I'm just I'm gonna remind us what we're gonna focus on in case you know you as we all get on airplanes you know how they say just in case you got on the wrong flight so just in case you thought you were going to another gathering this is the one that is really going to look at the role private investment can play in first of all doing no harm in fragile contexts but more importantly in advancing peace and it grows out of a world economic form global agenda council with the very uplifting title called fragility conflict and violence but the report of that title the report of that group agenda council focused on the role that private investment can play in really stabilizing and accelerating peace in very fragile contexts we've got as you can tell an absolutely amazing panel here starting first and foremost and I think we're all completely honored and delighted to welcome President Santos of Columbia as we know he won the Nobel Peace Prize and was just awarded by Klaus Schwab the the forum's global statesman award and we don't we won't do this for any of yourselves but I want you to just stop with me in a second and and we were talking earlier and I was saying you know we look at the state of the world today and rising fragility and you know peace in Columbia will always be so important for the Colombians but it has a special place in the world today so I wish you join me in just welcoming President Santos then I'm gonna move around and and to my left is Rania Alma shot who is the senior advisor to the chief economist of the International Monetary Fund she also served for a decade as the deputy governor of Egypt's central bank so Rania welcome and then immediately to her left is Sipo Mila Pettiana who's the chairman of Anglo-Gold Ashanti and a leading philanthropist and activist for political reform in his native South Africa and then over I have the pleasure of introducing Philippe Lourau who is the CEO of the International Finance Corporation the IFC and then immediately next to Philippe is Peter Brabac he told me not to pronounce his last name so other as but Peter is the chairman of Nestle you know a long and distinguished global business leader and also for for any of you who are interested in the chairman of Formula One Racing so so we do have an incredible incredible panel so I'm gonna I'm gonna start off with President Santos and and first of all if I know everyone here who particularly didn't have a chance to hear you speak earlier would love any quick update on the peace agreement and what I was struck by you you talked about how you know conflict and war had been such a break on Columbia and on the economy and then if you could comment on how maybe private investment can be an accelerator for peace absolutely first of all thank you thank you for having me in this panel for the country that consider private investment as partners growth like we do in Columbia and if it happens that we are coming out of a conflict private investment is absolutely indispensable it is needed because the opportunities that open up in terms of growth in terms of investing in the areas where the state was not present in terms of taking the infrastructure where is needed the state by itself is very difficult to be able to do that especially do it quickly so this partnership with private investment becomes a key tool to be able to give quick results and the experience that we have for example the the the development of the rural areas that have been affected by the conflict and the peasants need to get together with large investors they they don't have the capacity by themselves of bringing technology or getting new markets getting to the markets so private investors go there and fill this vacuum and then there's a win-win situation in every in every respect to my right well there's a company that has been present in Columbia in very difficult areas Nestle has been there and we know that Nestle and many other companies are seeing a tremendous opportunity right and as from the government point of view this is ideal because they bring what is needed they partner up with the government and the the country the process is the one that we benefit we we think that the piece will add to our growth there are different studies and different models the economist use but there will be between 1 and 2% more growth because what can be developed is huge and it's I sometimes compare it to the the Wild West in the United States in the 19th century there's half of the country which is very fertile very pretty completely untouched and we can develop that of course in a sustainable sustainable way but the potential there for Columbia for example to become a source of food in a world that is starting to look where is the food gonna come from you had the Chinese president yesterday I've been talking to him many times they're worried how we're gonna feed our people in 30 or 40 years where is the food gonna come from Columbia is one of the seven eight countries that the World Food Organization has has mentioned as a country with tremendous potential to increase the production of food but there you need private investment the government by itself cannot do it right thank you if I may if I may follow up and you know I think we all know particularly those of us who work in South America and Latin America Columbia is a real leader in realizing impact investment for social progress and since we are at the World Economic Forum and this is in many ways the conceptual home of multi-stakeholder partnerships and I'd like to ask you Mr. President how you and your government are fostering multi-stakeholder partnerships today to support and accelerate the peace process there are many projects that we are we are put in place that are already in place and especially the ones that we're planning to put in place in the future because of the opportunity that we have now and there are projects that are geared towards the most vulnerable part of society the poverty in Columbia and many of the country of the world where there's poverty like the one we have in Columbia is concentrated in the rural areas so if you focus the most vulnerable parts of of the society then your dividends will be much higher we established in Columbia a different way of measuring poverty this is a system that was developed by Amitah Sen the former Nobel Prize he's a professor he was my professor at Harvard and the LSE but he developed a organization called the our foundation in Oxford University for human development and it's called a multi-dimensional approach to poverty and it's not the monetary measurement of how much you earn it's basic necessities how are they being fulfilled and we started using this indicator six years ago and it has been extremely successful modestly apart Columbia is a country that has lowered poverty more than any other country that America 12 and a half percent in five years and because we're using that type of approach to instead of trying to increase which we have also the level of income is to supply the basic necessities of the families simple things right that have a much higher return in terms of social dividends as one other question that I'm going to move around it's been my experience that Columbia spawns an unbelievable number of young social entrepreneurs you know maybe more than anywhere else in Latin America today when we you know we think of young social entrepreneurs you often think about Kenya in the Horn of Africa right and what they have done and I know they are building social enterprises that are helping to solve many of the issues there what role did they play in the peace process a very important role because it's these type of entrepreneurs that have a social mind and become a an important factor of uniting communities right that have been divided and we've been we've made a tremendous effort also to to in a parallel form to modernize the country in terms of access to technology and we have managed in that five years to connect every single municipality with fiber optic and broadband and with these social entrepreneurs in the very remote most remote areas you're starting to find some incredible experiences and examples of peasants in their very remote area using technology to improve the livelihood of the community and it's like a snowball effect this is something which has been extremely important yeah I you know I would just a remind all of us here you know Columbia has spawned all these social entrepreneurs in times of conflict we can only imagine what's going to happen now in times of peace it's going to be fantastic Ranya if I could turn to you you so so much of your career you've had a focus on stabilizing and growing emerging markets so first of all I just like to ask in general based on your own experience what role do you see the private sector private investment playing in helping to promote peace and number two especially given your own background with the central bank what role can the central bank play in public policy in general in reducing risk of private investment or even more incentivizing private investment thank you very much and thank you for inviting me to this panel something which is very important to keep in our back in the back of our mind is that fragility is not only about violence and conflict fragility has different sources it could be ineffective economic institutions mismanagement of economic policy which leads to poverty and inequality so fragility is not only about a conflict which could be resolved through peaceful mechanisms or unpeaceful mechanisms but it is the role of public policy actually to try at the very onset to through what I would call building a very clear institutional policy frameworks to avoid states going into fragility and this is extremely crucial if we want to incentivize the private sector and why is that the private sector and we have both the IFC and international companies here is looking for states that have transparent accountable and well communicated policies because that by itself reduces the risk of coming into a country and that incentivizes the private sector to come in so when we say a policy framework what is very important is to have very clear objectives and the state able to translate how it's going to use specific instruments to meet these objectives there's a tendency when a problem comes up that the you know the public policy sometimes resorts to very short-sighted procedures to solve a short-term problem but these procedures in themselves actually exacerbate what might be the sources of fragility so what I would say is that policymakers have to be very mindful when it comes to communicating transparent policy frameworks and I put frameworks here over and over and because sometimes it is overlooked and as we are here in Davos thinking about the new narrative there is a social contract a new social contract which has to be I think on the minds of everyone and that includes all stakeholders being part of contributing to that framework. If I may follow up you know you served a very critical time in Egypt in the central bank it was during the Arab Spring and afterward how did you think about then using bank policies to create a more positive environment you know create jobs for young people to think about a more peaceful future. I think the first thing that was on our mind as a central bank in these very turbulent periods because it was I mean it started in 2000 and you know it's the anniversary the sixth anniversary of the revolution is on the 25th of January so it's a week away. I think that the key element was to repeat the message that the central bank is independent and that we do not have a political stance. We are an institution that tailors to macroeconomic stability we did not want the public to lose confidence in the banking sector and thankfully we avoided any banking run. Of course we had issues related to you know typical drawdown and reserves capital outflows but overall there was a very important effort from our side to step away from politics and that was giving us very much confidence with the public as well as with international community whether it's IFIs or the private sector that was in the country and decided not to leave. Thank you. Sipo, Anglo Golda Chante you know you've got a long history of working in really fragile places. Places that struggled with good governance often often with conflict and yet you've succeeded very well. What's been your secret how do you think about the principle of doing no harm there and then I'm going to follow up after that. Well thank you very much but I can't resist the temptation of congratulating President Santos last year. He received us very well in his country and Archbishop Desmond Tutu who published a book No Peace Without Forgiveness, autographed a copy which I was very pleased to share with him and now he has joined the community of peace and Nobel Peace Prize laureates. Well let me say this that we come from a perspective that says doing no harm is a minimalist approach. In fact one of our core values as an organization is that we must leave communities where we invest better off than where they were when we started off. That begins to set a journey which says when you get in an environment you need to understand the developmental challenges of that environment and understand how you can partner with the various parties there. Unfortunately as gold mining business the good Lord has not located these assets in exotic places like Davos. You find them in all kind of places which may be difficult, may have difficult challenges. So we tend to follow good geology rather than good geography and in that context therefore we have to do that and we take a comprehensive approach which looks at enabling and introducing our standards as a company that operates in the developed world like the United States and Australia and in underdeveloped communities. There is a huge variation. The regulator framework in developed world is very clear, it's well articulated and in others it's not. We operate on the basis that the standard that we apply in Australia is a standard that must prevail in the DRC, is a standard that must prevail in Guinea. So we tend to use that as a base and our operators work within that framework. So that's what we do and we've worked hand in hand with governments in different places. I could give an example. We have a joint venture in the DRC which is one of those post-conflict environments which includes another major mining company. It also includes government but importantly it includes civil society in its very established quite vocal forms international civil society which works with locals and also it involves locals so that we hear directly what the locals expectations are and that has seen us do some interesting things. For instance in the DRC that's an approximately $2 billion investment. We have looked at issues around skills development. In most jurisdictions people go in and have experts run operations ad infinitum. There we've had a very clearly articulated strategy of ensuring that we generate the best engineers in a country where education is not very high and we have high levels of skills development and secondly we have procurement processes that ensure that the development of local entrepreneurs as a result. Our hydropower investment for the mine provides 90% of energy for the region and that is an abled emergence of other entrepreneurs like banks and telecommunications. So the socio-economic infrastructure that arises as a result of that intervention there has been phenomenal and this is what we do in other jurisdictions as well. Can I just mention something which I think is very important to see if we can find a way to work together with more efficacy to get more results. Usually countries with confidence have illegal sources of money. Drugs or illegal mining. How can we work together with the legal companies to fight the illegal market of for example gold. In the case of the whole of South America today are having an increasing problem with illegal mining. Not only gold, other. I think it's like the drug traffic. It's a global problem that has to be approached globally. Is that gold or gold or whatever. It's sold here in Switzerland or Paris or whatever and I think there's a need for much better collaboration between private companies with the governments to fight that source of illegal funds that feed the conference. And that's the point isn't it. You often find those overlapping and reinforcing one another. The illicit flows, the illegal trade and the support for conflict. It's a very important question. In fact the International Council for Mines and Metals is seized with this matter and we've had extensive conversations President Santos would know as we briefed him last year. We have a pilot project in Colombia where we're looking at separating illegal miners and small-scale artisanal miners. And here's an issue. In most jurisdictions you would find that you actually have small-scale artisanal miners who get criminalized when we come in because countries tend to be attracted by the fact that you're a big player, you're going to have a big impact on the economy and all of that in sideline. Small-scale artisanal miners. And our approach is that there is room to create a legal framework for these small-scale artisanal miners to get the benefit of a partnership with an established miner so that they can mine safely and they can take care of the environment and they can ensure that they comply with good labor practices of decent work, etc. etc. And in that way that enables us to isolate the illegals. And the language that prevailed in the mining industry for a long time was to lump these small-scale artisanal miners, people who are looking for a living, with illegals. And you would find in fact that illegal miners syndicated international criminals who are quite sophisticated and to deal with them you need collaboration with government. And the first step there is to ensure that governments recognize that you can treat the locals who are true entrepreneurs decently and create partnership and empowering relationships with established mining players. And that's what we do. We're trying this in Colombia, in Ghana, in Tanzania. Of course it's a pilot project. We hope that it will work. To a great extent it depends on government being prepared to come to the party with a regulatory framework and enabling us to work together on this. Illegal mining is a problem for established mining industry, as it is a problem for governments and communities. I will tell you something that an interesting example is that in Ghana, we had our mine run over by illegal miners, in our view, a situation that was permitted by the previous government in Ghana. Because of the nature of the partnership that we had with the local communities. They were so incensed by all of this and they were on our side. They came to our defense. So it is possible as a result of working well with the communities and showing the benefits. Because they knew that the water that they have, the energy supplied in the community and the schooling for the communities around them, in part, was a result of our operations being there. So they felt that illegal miners constituted a serious threat to their benefits from that operation. Great. Thank you, Sipo. Thank you. Philippe, I know the IFC is entering this space. In some ways, it's been encroaching in it for quite a while. You're a leader in moving the institution there. So tell us how the IFC thinks about its own role here. And also, take us down to a more practical level of how we can get it done. What does it take? Well, thank you for inviting me. In fact, it's true that we have a new strategy in IFC where we decided to try to lead forward on the fragile states, fragile and conflict affected states, which is not easy on private sector. I remind you that IFC finance without government guarantee. So we take the sovereign risk plus commercial risk and it's quite risky. So attracting investors to Iraq or Afghanistan is not that easy, but it's feasible. In fact, in Iran, we just did on a purely privately financed basis a new power plant in Kurdistan region of Iraq. In Afghanistan, we set up a private telecom company that prospered extremely quickly, by the way. So there are a lot of opportunities. The problem is if we want to scale up, we need to rethink the way we approach the work we do. And I call that going from going with the market to creating markets and financing project to creating projects. We need to step up that. So creating markets, what I have talked about, is very important. This is the environment. So we have to work with the government. We want in IFC now to leverage our colleagues from the World Bank across the street and the IMF across the street to create this condition at the regulatory framework, the macro level, because otherwise it's not going to happen. So that's one thing, but that's not enough. We need to also create the project and work with entrepreneur locally. Because there's a lot of entrepreneurial talent. In fact, I was in Burma, I signed the deal. But before signing the deal, we had to do two years of technical assistance, accounting, governance, environment and social standards. So two years before we're at the level we're comfortable to invest because we have our own standards. So it means shifting from waiting for the project to come to you to be a little bit more proactive. But that means a lot more boots on the ground, being close to the client, putting more in advisory services. So that's the few things. The other thing that is needed is the risky instruments. We have to be more innovative with our instrument. And in my way, in my view, we should reopen the use of official development aid or DA. Because if you give a grant for one dollar, one dollar, you have one dollar of projects. If you risk with one dollar and you put it as a 10% of first loss guarantee, you can multiply. And that's the billions to trillions. That's the only way. So we need to be much to rethink the use of what we call blended finance. So that on the financial side, you can start the risking. And then the risk appetite, you'll see much more entrepreneur that will be willing to put their money at risk. Because at the end of the day, it's all about risk return. And the last point is, we're talking about jobs. You want to do, with you beyond no harm, do good, create jobs. If you want peace to last, you need the jobs. I know it's not very sexy to say that, but it's fundamental. Need jobs is SME, small scale enterprises, 90% of the jobs are created by SMEs. I know again, this number is very well known, but it's good to repeat it. Now, how do you develop an SMEs network in a post-conflict situation? Again, you have to work with the local banking system. And there are ways to assess the risk, which is very different from working in developed countries. We have the tools, but we have to develop that. But that's also with a lot of technical assistance. Technical assistance also to the SME themselves. As I said, this Burma example, that's an SME. A lot of technical assistance, advisory, I don't like technical assistance, but advisory services, holding hand. And for that, you have to be present. So you have to be present physically. Sometimes you push and it doesn't work. In South Sudan, we had a big conference, we had the high hopes. We had a huge conference on investment climates and we had proposal on concrete reforms, et cetera. And then there was a relapse. But you have to start again. The first time you have another opportunity, I'm looking at the president. Yes. Never stop, push, continue. Another opportunity, go for it. So I mean, I know it sounds a bit commonsensical, but to do it on the ground is important. And things are quite surprising. I mentioned Iraq, I mentioned Afghanistan. We did a project to link, and on top of that is sustainable energy. You know, they have excess hydro power in Kyrgyzstan, in the Central Asia, Kyrgyzstan and Tajikistan. They have a huge deficit in Pakistan. So the idea and very expensive. The idea is how to bring a two cents kilo water hydro power from Kyrgyzstan and Tajikistan to the north of Pakistan, where the cost was 20 cents a kilo water and blackouts. So we did the line, a transmission line. But you have to go through the most conflict affected part of Afghanistan to do that. And that I would run what you said, which is how? Community. Exactly. Because everybody told me it's very simple, you put the lines. That's a transmission, it's very simple, it's a line on the pole. It's very easy to cut. So you have a terrorist group, you cut it, it's very, very simple, it goes very quickly. The only way to protect it, and it works, is to have a long the line development program for the local community, where in fact it becomes their interest to defend that asset. Right. And it has worked. So it's a same experience. So all these has to come together. And every conflict, every country is different. So you have to adjust. And we just created a tool called the conflict analysis tool. Because we need to bring political analysis, as well as the private sector perspective, the regulatory macro. So we're trying to devise this tool, I think we'll be ready in a few months to do it more systematically and apply it to the local conditions. Great. Thank you. Peter is going to comment right now on how Nestle thinks about this. And also Peter, love to get your comments. You've seen a lot. You've seen where business can really make a difference in terms of supporting a peace process. And you've probably also seen a few places where it doesn't work. And so we'd love to draw on your experience. But also, then we're going to turn to this great audience here. So I want you to get your energy up, your good questions. And let's get a good conversation going. So I'm going to open it up as soon as Peter has a chance to comment. Peter, please. Well thank you very much. Thank you for the invitation. And congratulations, frankly, to the award. It was very emotional. I think we were talking about fragile states. I think Colombia is a very good example that that's not necessarily the only place where we have such a situation. Because I wouldn't have called Colombia a fragile state for the last 50 years. I think it was a very well-established state, as a matter of fact, it's a very well- developed economy, education systems and that. But within, you had a fragile area. And the thing which is common to all of it is because the moment you say fragile for whatever reason, fragile it is, you have poverty. This is the one common denominator for everything which is fragile. And the second thing is very important is that unfortunately, this poverty is expressed in this fragile areas mainly on the level of the use. And this is one of the reason why you have in these areas as the use has no unemployment. It's extremely important. They are extremely vulnerable to become part of whether the guerrilla or whether it is the narcotrafic or whatever it is. It is because they are the most affected part of it. Okay? So I think this is extremely important to understand that when we are talking about fragile, it is always the same identification that we have. And it is clear that from a business perspective, if I'm talking in general terms, first of all, we have today about 1.2 billion of people living in fragile situations. Okay? Out of that, 600 million and more are young, it's a young generation. Now, think about 600 million of young people who are lost for the society in the future just because they're living in this situation. So this is the reason why, frankly speaking, even for a private company, we are not doing any social things. We are just looking also from a business perspective, 1.2 billion of people, 600 million of young people generation. This is a very important market. And therefore, we have an interest. We have a business interest in order to help that business and value can be created again in this fragile area. It was interesting to listen to President Santos when he said the peace agreement, if it can be carried out like he has it in his mind, and I don't see any reason why it shouldn't carry it out, might have an impact of 1, 2 percent of GDP grows. Well, for any company, that's quite interesting, I must say. That's an interesting part. So I think we have an interest as a private company to help to overcome this fragile situation. There's no doubt about it. So it's not only philanthropic. It's not. I always have tried to say, you know, we are doing this in order to create value, both for our shareholders, but also for the society we are living in. Because it's a good business case. Then you are willing to invest. Now the second thing is, which comes up, and I think that was mentioned here by Philippe, in most of those cases it is very difficult for the private sector to invest and to create because of the the risk is one thing. Risk can be managed by the uncertainty of this situation. And therefore, whatever the multi lateral institutions can do in order to create a better governance surrounding is extremely welcome. Which also means that if we want to be as a private sector effective in this fragile areas, I think we cannot do it alone. Let's be quite clear. It can always be in partnership with. So partnership with IFC, but also in partnership with the local. If we are, and I'll mention a little bit what we are going to do and what we are doing just in Colombia now, well we do it together with a Federación Nacional de Cafeteros, which is the one who is the community in the things and community has been mentioned before. Extremely important that you are part of the community. If you're not part of the community, I think you will not be able to do something. So in the case and I know I want to be short, but if I take now following the peace agreement that President Santos has been able to achieve, we have, we are working now, to work in the area that was the domain of the FARC with a new coffee project in order to bring forward and help the farmers to be able to hopefully change from perhaps truck coca production over to coffee production again, where Colombia has a relative advantage, the best to none in the world frankly speaking. And we have, we are launching now in February already, just immediately reacting to this peace agreement. We are launching a new coffee which we are exporting from Caceta, exactly from the region, which is called Aurora de la Paz, that will be the name of the product, and we will sell it worldwide and helping therefore 35,000 farmers, small, small-scale farmers down there, with whom we have been working over the last couple of months, and the product is ready, we're going to launch it. And I hope that this is one sign again. It's good for my business, I say it straight away, but I hope it's also very good for the peace process, for the people, for the farmers, who find a new way in order to create value and also create jobs for the for the young population. Great, that's fantastic, thank you. Let's open it up, and all I would ask is that you identify yourself, and that you ask a question. Please. Hi, my name is Daniel Buriti Camp. I'm a double shipper from Colombia. I'm a social entrepreneur. I'm here at Davos because I create as a camp of reconciliation camp. I bring together former guerrilla soldiers from FARC and victims, and they are able, after a week, to work together to create a camp for low-income kids. And I'm talking with them my feeling is that they are scared. They are scared because they have a fear to be rejected by society. So my question is how do you think that private investment can help us Colombians to build a new social contract, where all Colombians are included? Let me turn first to President Santos. Thank you, and this this example of the young social entrepreneur. It's a very good example, and what he mentioned is a keyword, scared. How to build trust. Trust in your own future, trust in the future of your community. And I was speaking before we started with the chairman of the slayer about people. People still are scared that the peace process won't work, or they don't even believe in the peace process. They say no no these people at the end they will go back to what they were doing. 52 years of war changes a lot of minds and to change that it's a very very difficult effort, but I'm sure that when you start delivering the goods and people see it. I tell a lot of people in Colombia you still don't believe that the FARC are going to lay down their arms, because they still have the arms. But we are this last weekend we were seen on television the FARC coming out of the jungles, coming down from the mountains with their with the rifles, with their armaments, and going to these zones where they're going to give the arms to the United Nations. Still people don't believe. People oh they're coming they're coming to my region and they get scared. They need to see tangible results. That's where I think the private sector if Nestle goes and tells his people listen I'm going to buy your milk or your coffee or your cocoa or I'm going to finance this new land and come here and work then they'll say my god this is true. It's unique change with the mentality and the and and build trust in the process. Once you build trust and confidence then things start to work. Unfortunately lack of trust is one of the problems that is what is happening worldwide. The lack of trust in the institutions, lack of trust in the leaders, what you're seeing all around the world. I'm becoming a salesman for a very good book of the he I think he's here that was because we were going to we were going to meet. I called him I had never met him but I read a book called enough said by the CEO of New York Times. He was a former BBC's general director Mark Thompson. Talking about this issue about how trust has been disappearing and this is this is something which is key for the communities to build and to work together and the private sector if it helps to build this trust by providing tangible results then I think this is a great contribution. Right great thank you. Can I say one thing? I mean Peter. In a similar situation western not similar situation in a in a fragile situation South Sudan the Philip was mentioning before we are working we have been working in South Sudan also on the coffee site in order to help in this very difficult area together with you you have helped us with the 3.5 million loan which we correctly would be discussed before and we have been developing the coffee sector because I mean South Sudan and the Uber is where the coffee was really I mean that's where it came from. Now and as you were mentioning in the middle of the effort that we have done and we have launched a new product also and brought it brought it to the world war comes back and the question that that you are raising we have been trying now we cannot physically go into this region just now so we have started with the farmers you can imagine they started to see and suddenly everything falls back. The only thing what we have been doing and that might be at least we have used social media now in order to keep contact with the farmers and what we did physically before by having agronomists visiting them we are trying to do it now via the social via the social media to continue to help them in order to improve their yield and the simple this so that is it gives them at least a feeling that they have not been abandoned from one day to the other game because that's exactly what they are what what they are really worrying about I mean I remember when we started even in Colombia when we started this milk instead of cocoa the problem was they they didn't believe us very much because normally two months later the FARC were there again and destroyed what was left to blew up our factories and then then they had to go back so that this insecurity so now we are trying with social media to give them the feeling they're not alone okay and telling them the moment we can physically we will come back we will continue to work with them you're not alone I think that's at least it's a help it's not the solution but at least that's great so thank you for what it's worth I just want to say this that the book by Archbishop Tutu is titled no peace without forgiveness the signing of this peace deal is a start of a journey whether journey is going to end up is going to depend on how much premium Colombians place in that that includes corporates that operate in Colombia because part of the integration process is to afford people that are held with suspicion an opportunity to be integrated in society to be trained to get back to work to get back through education to be schooled to be integrated exclusion and marginalization is a fantastic seed for instability in any society so the political leadership has created a fantastic framework to give Colombia a chance a new partnership has to be created where business has to play a very important role in assisting the uncertainty amongst those who are returning from the from from the bush to feel that they are welcome and they can be integrated and I think the rest of society will find it easier to follow on the lead that we as as private sector in that environment will provide it's not going to be an easy journey it's a difficult journey I can give you a lesson from the South African context which was very different from the Colombian setting Mandela left as a peace dividend but that has been betrayed to the extent that those that were marginalized during conditions of apartheid many of them still feel marginalized today and they begin to question the efficacy of that peace project exclusion is a big big enemy to peace and stability absolutely one of the fundamental draggers of that for sure great point another question or yes please and then I'll have time for one more just be ready thank you very much my name is Kumagai and I'm a chief economist at the Daiba Institute of Research in Japan and I have one question to President Santos and political leaders are always cautious about the election results and I think in general if political leaders start a war his or her approval ratings increase increases on the other hand if you seize the war your approval ratings might decrease how do you cope with or get over that difficult problem this is my question you have a perfect example I was minister of defense very effective I was talking about this earlier on leadership in times of war is relatively easy the bad guys are over there the good guys are around you you rally the forces and if you're effective you show trophies people clap and your ratings go up that's why I was elected president when you get into peace process that type of leadership changes dramatically has to change leadership in times of peace first the mere fact of sitting down with your former enemies brought down my polls 20% simply by sitting with them but when you start discussing concessions to them your polls will go even further down and the leadership you need there is to change the mentality of the people you were talking about the book of Desmond Tutu that's exactly learn how to forgive learn how to think differently with respect to the people who killed your daughter or your son this is very difficult but it has to be done if you want peace and many times people resist and this is natural this is normal to forgive is very easy be very difficult to hate is very easy but changing that is a different kind of leadership and it creates a lot of contradictions and that's why the polls go down but anyway you have to persevere that was interesting in the wider session president Sanchez you did describe though that what kept your spirits up and actually you know the folks who really helped contribute so much to the peace process were the victims the ones who had suffered the most that's a that was a very good example that's a lesson that I learned from this process many people asked me what what did you get out of it personally I said a lot of things but one of the most dramatic was I was absolutely convinced at the beginning that the victims because they are victims were going to be the ones that would resist most a peace process because a peace process will has to have an ingredient of forgiveness and the victims who were very very hard for them to forgive the atrocities that these people committed but as time went through went went by and a professor at Harvard a professor Hayfitz at the Kennedy School he told me at the very beginning you're you're going to you're going to take a path which is extremely difficult and you're going to be feel very abandoned and very frustrated talk to the victims and that's what I did and I started talking to the victims and said tell me what happened to you these are the most dramatic experiences I mean as you said my god how how could you survive after all that suffering and and then when he said but please continue president because I don't want other people to suffer as I have suffered that gave me the whole energy to continue so it was a very good experience on feeding in a way from the the victims to continue wanted to come in quickly I just wanted to say that President Santos provides a fantastic example of responsible leadership which is what Wef this year is is talking about and I want to take that and extend it to economic policy because it's responsible leadership to be able to do the tough economic reforms at the time of strength where i.e. when you're not at the end and you're very fragile and therefore you have to take tough decisions I think that's extremely important to highlight as as one of the titles that Davos has and also to tie that with the private sector it is very important also for governments to realize that the private sector lifts the burden by providing the jobs that we talked about to to basically pull those out of poverty it legitimizes the state if the private sector is introduced within that framework that we talked about where the objectives of the state are are are sort of transparent as well as the leadership which is I would hope is always a responsible leadership right well we're coming to that time it feels like we just started I know we could go on but we all have tight schedules here so I would I would like I want to want to thank everybody for coming your energy's been great thank you and and also I just I want to thank this terrific group of panelists I want to say something at the end about President Santos but this it's just been good I think what you see here is really that multi-stakeholder partnership government with leadership private sector international organizations I'll humbly represent civil society but I think it takes us all in these efforts and and at this point as we know in a world of rising fragility where the World Bank tells us that conflict is the number one driver of extreme poverty today not a driver not among the drivers but the number one driver we're all called on to step up in ever more powerful ways and I'd like to just wait President Santos I give you the last word to say whatever you want but I may pose a question to just say what can we do here to help you accelerate the process even more well my friend to my right to go and invest more in Colombia the IFC give me more credit the mining sector can go there and buy more and invest more in gold and in terms of the monetary international multilateral institutions give us a bit more room and that's good