 like to start this last session with a summary of what I think in some ways is an overview of what we've discussed some of the challenges and ways forward as well. I have to say I'm a bit in awe a bit overwhelmed in one way in that I'm doing this whereas Kathie Manduka has the knowledge to expand perhaps and better organize but I think the overriding commentary to all of us is that we need a pipeline and the sooner that pipeline starts the better with links to high school. I know that UTIG and industry in Texas has set up the geoforce program that not only motivates students into geosciences careers but that also brings diverse students and and encourage supports them through high school and into university with a bit of a mentoring program as well. Many of us are involved with high school students. I can say that I had a high school student intern with me and we can do whatever a university student could do in research but they have a shorter attention span I'd say but well they can make meaningful contributions to science as well. So you know increasing the pipeline what we do with that pipeline is overarching and to all of us. Advising becomes an important component of all of this and obviously moving more into the intro classes and also perhaps use early examples of careers some of these career videos that John Taper was talking about as well and then engaging fully engaging our students through establishing context and engagement we saw a wide range of examples in all of the talks today with early examples of geo examples and developing geological and geophysical examples to be implemented in physics classes chemistry classes math and biology and here's where we could be more inclusive because HBCUs don't have geosciences departments so instead we'd want to attract physicists or those thinking about engineering thinking about alternative science careers to consider geophysics as well so again having these kinds of geological examples that could be incorporated could only increase the diversity in our field and then obviously the curricula instead of looking at the content based movement using a backwards based approach to redesigning curricula and as Kathy Manduka said very that the most effective way is to provide more practice and quantitative skills in a in many diverse settings the greater the diversity then we achieve a full transfer of learning for our student outcomes and I think I just want to also open up the opportunity you know some of that some stubborn folks and saying that we've done things as that we have maybe some of the field geology folks who are are considering making major changes to the way that we learn so it seems that this is a really timely discussion um that we could think about as well so anyway I just wanted to open the discussion then with that bit of our recap here um so I just I guess what I'd say to all of you or any of you who would like to comment we haven't mentioned explicitly increasing diversity um we have a comment that came in from one of the and I'll point out not only do we have diversity um in terms of student demographics but we also have challenges that have come in um one of the students oh so Warner Cribb I had a question and a comment the pressure at state universities to have students graduate faster it's compounded by the increasing number of community college students we see who expect to finish their four-year geology degree in two years and those have to work full time to pay their tuition other expenses and so do not engage in the REU program or research experiences that we offer in the classroom so this is a tough problem in squeezing the program if employers want more quantitative skills then how do we help them or how do we get these employers to talk to state planners um to to change that trend to uh one that's more reasonable in terms of the outcomes so that was a question we hadn't answered that I think fits into this broader review as well and yeah the number of I think the number is 30 percent of students at state universities go to two-year colleges and and then attend state universities to complete their degree so it's a very different situation than anything that's been discussed by those of us that um that yeah earlier in this meeting so anyway let me leave the floor open and I hope I can see Kathy wants to answer I'm not sure why that how I signaled that I wanted to answer um but um I think you're I think that the last point you made which is that we're um always squeezing more and more and more into the curriculum and this looks impossible is a really important point and um we typically design from what we want to have students be able to do to what does that mean for instruction and I wonder if this is a good time to think about um a different kind of design for at the program level where we think about how much time we have and what's the most important things for students to leave with that we could reasonably you know what how can we best use that time um to to teach well the most important things and then to really um work hard on what Barb talked about which is how do we support that core with um the wide variety of opportunities that students need to be able to do specific different things I wanted to make a comment I I agree with what Kathy said but also one of the things that we addressed in the effort I've been doing is looking at the transfer between two-year and four-year colleges and really trying to get two-year colleges and four-year colleges the faculty to talk to each other to make sure that the two-year colleges understand what's going to be required in their sort of local university for the second year even some schools have started having exchanges where faculty in the four-year colleges will come in and talk in the two-year colleges and vice versa and running field trips together having different kinds of projects together getting the two-year college students to you know interact with their freshman cohort which they will hopefully become you know juniors with and really try to increase that and that also has a one-way people have been really increasing the diversity because there's uh the demographics of two-year colleges actually reflects the demographics of that particular area. To ask one quick question um we're Sharon do we lose diversity in that transfer from two-year colleges to four-year colleges? Is there a motivational factor where we're losing diversity? Actually um we're I don't know the answer to your question that way the other direction we are increasing diversity certainly the schools like the key El Paso and Texas A&M and schools like that that have established programs with junior colleges have seen that the diversity students incoming is higher but I don't know whether we were you know how it works in terms of losing. No I just meant that if we had stronger links would we make it would we encourage more um do we lose students in the pipeline from two-year to four-year colleges because we don't have enough interaction with or we could potentially increase that part of the pipeline. I definitely think you could increase it. Cindy there's a question actually from Maya Tolstoy in the question box I'll go ahead and ask it because I think it follows on to this discussion pretty well and she says my understanding is that students from underrepresented groups and underserved communities are often interested in doing things that will have an obvious way to go back and help their community. Should we be thinking more about emphasizing and teaching geoscience skills that might address that? I mean I do think that if you think things that get to the motivations of students that respond or responsive to the motivations of students are clearly going to be more successful than things that do not so I think that that definitely definitely does seem valid. Yeah that's one of the things we're trying to do with our our just you know so it's just developing programs so I don't have data but I'd be interested anyone actually has data and other papers that do say that. There are but I don't have them pulled together I need to do that um I will say that from integrates experience which was grounded in this idea that not just more diverse students but more students in general would be interested in the geosciences if it was clear why it was relevant and practical has made a lot more progress in in at the introductory level and actually the the faculty survey data show that in general we are much better at the introductory level in teaching students in the context of societal issues than we are at the majors level so I think if we want to use the strategy or explore the strategy we have to think about not only how we get them in the door but what's the role of the strategy and keeping them in the in the program so. Yeah and Maya has a follow-up if could people provide examples of topics that might work well in in doing so. The integrate site would be a great place to look which has best get-see modules on it so. Kathy there's another question oh go ahead. I was just going to follow on I was curious from what you just said is there evidence that we're actually losing major students because of this lack of kind of connection with societally relevant issues. There's evidence we lose there's evidence across the STEM disciplines that we lose students in the upper division more we lose more students from underrepresented groups than we lose from geoscience or lose from majority groups whether or not that's tied to the lack of societal connection isn't as isn't as I don't know the I don't know that there's a study that shows that but I do worry about a sort of bait and switch where we where we encourage people to study the geoscience as an introductory level courses by showing their societal relevance and then we they move into a curriculum that is is much more abstract and not aimed at that outcome. More get-see modules at major levels. Yeah comments that I would agree comments that have come in are saying that there's a ramp up there's a challenge for students who have gone to two-year colleges when they come into transfer students who come into the upper level and more quantitative courses that they struggle with the math the level of the math coming from a community college to to a university and but there are examples where that can be overcome and are there good examples advertised is there information we can share what you know one of these comments came from Andrew Newman and Maya commented that this is a challenge at Columbia as well with transfer students. That's a problem that the SAGE 2IC project has been working on extensively and they have a big website a piece of which is about transfer and supporting transfer so that would be where I would go to look. So that's SAGE 2 you said and SAGE 2IC so 2IC is short for two-year colleges. Okay and as far as everyone is who's listening to we're going to come up with a list of the websites that have been mentioned or been cited in the talks we'll ask the speakers to give us some of these websites so that everybody has access to the information that may have briefly flashed across the screen as we went along so I'm just we're keeping notes as we go. Can you put a pro note to you she had raised her hand. Well Kathy answered before I did I was about to mention SAGE 2IC Heather McDonald and all her other colleagues who've been working on this for I think over a decade now. Okay great yeah I think another thought that's relevant to this but also not only to this is sometimes because in many cases our curriculum has sort of evolved by random mutation at many universities but long chains of prerequisites are actually can be very problematic and I found this was the case at Michigan State where actually even for the students who come who start at Michigan State they don't really get into any majors or they very rarely get into majors classes until their junior year in their sophomore year they would take intro but nothing before that and so you really only have two years with the students and I although that seems a little odd to me it can't be unique and it's a similar issue to the transfer students that where you only have a couple of years so we we probably do need to give a little more thought to really the sequencing of what we require and not not requiring too many long sequences of take this then that then that then that. There's another question that came in and I think it links to well I would imagine most of us have experienced this and trying to teach remotely that we expect our students in some ways to know more than we do the technical board have those technological skills they don't necessarily but in a gym gym nap comments again at a state university in a rural state we're seeing a significant increase in the digital or or exacerbation of the digital divide especially with socioeconomically disadvantaged students so that's existed we probably didn't know how severe it was it's now readily apparent we we should be considering that as we look forward as well and you know well beyond COVID-19. Anybody want to comment about how we can ways to work particularly with the the internet um internet isn't available to all particularly in rural areas and but even so we still have we also have technological uh challenges where we're probably seeing a lot of students who rely completely on uh computers on campus um so you know now that we've learned this what what do we do as well yeah I mean my experience in the last year is they all have smart devices and they all have these devices but what they may not have is good internet when they go off campus and you know on campus again it's not an issue when they're on campus but what they have available when they move go off campus or when they go home or if especially now when they have to work who knows they might have to work from their grandmother's house it's yeah it's a real issue right now but I think it it just it was always was an issue it was just being I think kind of hidden by the fact that they were spending a lot of time on campus where where that the divide was not so uh so marked so the um in the immediate moment the high schools are all facing the same challenge and they're working very hard at figuring out how to provide access to all of their students and so it might be possible to work with the for the students in all these different places because your students have now gone home to lots of different places to have them to see if there's a possibility of working with the high schools to figure out how to how to get access to the internet I know in the small town in Idaho that I'm from the library is now providing drive-up internet access where you can park your car in a place and get everywhere and I have students working for me using drive-up internet libraries but I think that the bigger opportunity here and this goes back to your question about what is the opportunity with COVID-19 is that COVID-19 is is is helping us to see things we couldn't see when students were on campus not just the digital divide but you know it it provides all sorts of opportunities to see a different side of how your your teaching is working and and I think it to the extent that we can really encourage faculty to think carefully about how they can determine what's working and what's not working in their classes and for whom we'll get information that we wouldn't get in a normal semester that can then be translated into improved teaching in whatever situation we end up teaching with when we come out of the other side of this could Kathy would you could start host a comment page on and you know it is restricted to a certain number of words or feedback you know bullet points but but a bulletin board for folks to comment on observations and challenges that we recognize now from from COVID-19 um that's a good idea right now they're hosting a listserv for online teaching that's getting pretty good traffic and I wonder if one thing we could do is to start to introduce some comments about what people are learning about what's working and what's not working on to that listserv that's got several hundred people on it now I mean I'm not sure what they it was over 300 people I don't know what the current number is another idea like that would be and agt's been holding webinars and I know they just had a very large one on teaching online and maybe um encouraging them to run a follow-up that would look at it would talk about what you can learn from your students in this um in this moment or learn about your teaching in this moment that's transferable to the future wouldn't that be an agar right and agar for the field or the the web I was just gonna say like I'm on the webinar committee I'll send an email to worry right now if you know if that's what you were suggesting Kathy for that is what I'm suggesting and and Karen was I think we lost Karen she was on here earlier but um yeah definitely sorry breath I should have remembered you were on that committee and just come on Kathy Karen still here Karen it's still on oh good she can also help she can help make the point that that it's a useful thing to do that there's interest in doing it I guess that's what Karen could do she's the current president of nigt okay so Karen is in a status she can't talk but she does have a message here on the q&a box she says yes I think they will also be programming at the eer about this and uh earth uh earth educators rendezvous I think that thing that's important right now is that in the next semester where we are for sure teaching in this way helping encouraging faculty to to to really use sort of scholarship of teaching and learning and and think about what they what they are learning and what they could be learning um and particularly thinking about it across the full spectrum of their students right so you know what's working and not working for different groups of students who are are um struggling in the we're struggling in the class before it went online students who are were succeeding students who come from a different background underrepresented minority students etc I have something related that's sort of a question for Sharon which is which is that we earlier someone mentioned uh about whether we could get more funding from industry whether industry could be working at a national level and from from my unlimited experience it seems like most um commercial firms are more interested in working with individual universities but I'd be interested whether Sharon can comment or whether when looking at the overview are there are there industry are there companies that want to work at a broader scale than just with with a single institution to try to initially try to address this need for some extra funding perhaps for for the for the students who don't have access to the digital resources uh from what we've seen it is just as you said most companies are wanting to work with individuals um at specific universities or with specific universities where they're hiring the students uh we have a lot of had have I don't know what we still do a lot of industry support from the petroleum industry for our geoforce program uh and that's the only reason that thing has actually been running for a long time and been very successful but with the price of oil chances are strong it's going to be you know difficult to get funding we've tried getting funding from other kinds of you know industries with very little success but usually the industry is more interested in where they're hiring the students from giving them data sets working with them one-on-one uh things like that um I know AGI certainly has made an effort to get uh industry support for broader types of programs and uh with some success but nothing like individual universities do so we have we have a couple more questions Matt Pritchard who's on the committee uh asked said the speakers made some great suggestions on how to add quantitative modules to classes what are some specific strategies to help convince our colleagues to do this and to think about adding them to all courses in a curricular I like Barb's comments about overcoming tyranny of content and focusing on outcomes instead of courses but there are a lot of people who are resistant to change yeah um is there an article that describes practices for transforming the curriculum are there other disciplines that are doing this better than us Barb could I could I make a comment um so I think I think it's incredibly difficult to proselytize at home um because faculty members are well trained they're intelligent they put a lot of time into what they do in the class and to have a colleague come in and say no matter how politely and nicely you phrase it it comes across as well I don't think you know what you're doing and so I I think there are there are people who are willing to come and do a consultation and bring somebody in from outside who's thought a lot about either curricular reorganization or thinking about how to redesign courses if the focus is going to be on a bit more integration at the societal impact level or combining quantitative problems with societal impact problems and putting them into petrology and min and structure and hydro or something like that um get somebody who's got good ideas and who can shake a few trees and can come in and inspire your department altogether rather than you being in the role of saying here's where I think we ought to go um I think it's it's tough to proselytize at home so I I was just going to I was just going to say that NAGT does a great job with their traveling workshops in terms of coming in and helping I've got a lot of responses from departments that said they've had them come in it's made a big difference uh another thing uh that that has been said by many department chairs is that when they provide the opportunity for faculty to have professional development to go to the earth there's katers rendezvous or you know early career um events that's certain that those things really have made a difference because the people come back individually a summer uh actually including that in their teaching in their annual evaluations for people asking whether you know have you tried these methods and you know giving incentives for doing those sorts of things the other thing we found is that uh quite a few departments have said that uh having this community sort of vetted list of the kinds of things students need to know uh being able to show that to their faculty and say look employers think these things are important the community thinks are important that that has made a difference as well but I will say from experience that it's very difficult to change things from in your own institution it is I mean even if people aren't fundamentally resistant to change they still have classes that they've prepared and when you scramble everything everybody has to to scramble so there is a natural uh sort of level of some some sort of resistance at at some level but uh but on this sort of topic actually Karen added we've already heard a little bit about NAGT's traveling workshop program she notes that there are three there are application deadlines three times per year so departments can essentially bring that program to their to their department there were there was another question uh comment earlier when we were talking about getting at we were geoforest sharing was talking about geoforest and talking about industry and we were talking also about state universities with challenges um and trying to push students out the door um in an already rushed program but we had a um um matri erwin commented that we we have to be ahead of companies not let them lead us and he says that she she says that as a corporate lifer so I wonder you know we we've mentioned something we've talked about industry and our industry partnerships as far as career goals I think uh almost all the examples we've heard have been oil and gas and a bit of mining but we also have been we're we're talking about preparing students for um geospatial skills so for computational skills and geophysical skills are we are we getting examples and are we getting feedback and are we interacting um it okay so there's two two points here the one that was raised by um matri erwin there are one about um being ahead of companies um but also in the ways that we're engaging and interacting and again being the leader in terms of motivating new new initiatives are there things we don't know about so I'm commenting as someone who's done research for the meeting and is pretty passionate about seeing some of these changes but um there are many things I don't know about so so um I just wanted to comment that when we did the graduate uh employers workshop for earth atmosphere and oceans uh and those were people hiring phd's and masters we had the whole gamut we had you know nasa and noah and um scripts and major research labs as well as weather companies and you know oil and gas companies and mining but we had and in both the undergrad and the grad we had a lot of environmental we had people who were working on geohazards we had reinsurance people and we had the broad spectrum and I think one thing that came across uh that really surprised everybody was there was such a commonality in what they thought that was important for students and it surprised them because it was very similar to what the uh academic community had uh came up with in terms of what they thought was important there were just I think the difference between the employers and the academic community particularly the undergraduate level was the the depth of quantitative uh and computational skills that the employers thought were needed but we have you know certainly at the graduate level we have done a very broad spectrum but I also think we shouldn't let uh employers drive everything I mean they are so absolutely ridiculously pushing data analytics and yes it's important for our students to know it but we shouldn't be turning our entire curriculum over to that yeah I'll just add uh Bill Walter um had pointed out that the again the national labs were mentioned the national labs hire a variety of students um undergrad grad and postdoc uh generally for summer sessions of course this summer is up to who knows but um but uh but that is another another one of this this list of potential employers. Sharon I I just want to double down on what you just said because and it goes back to what Barb said which is is that our only goal is not our only role is not to um that the all it is not the case that the only thing we are doing is is preparing the workforce um or preparing the geoscience workforce and and I think when we as as departments when departments think about planning um really having that first level discussion about what is the department believe it's um you know what's its goal what's its role in in in the institutional in the institution what's its role in the in geoscience so that we we get this sort of more diverse set of outcomes than just preparing the workforce and that I think will help this necessary discussion about what are we going to do with the two years of time that Jeff has identified which is what we really have with our majors. I guess I would say that uh in terms of data analytics I think if we are letting students take their own data and analyze it within our own problems that is very rich and that can mean just going on to google earth and taking topography cuts across mid ocean ridges let's just take trend sex let's test our ideas um that can be building our own data acquisition systems of various types but we can do this all within geoscience very easily and I would also point out uh this is getting easier to do if you do want to go more technical for instance google collaborate is also a very nice tool that uh is a very well maintained python notebook if you do have internet access you can use it anywhere and built into it is pytorch and all the machine learning so they've kind of set us up to do this when and how we feel like it when when we want to however again any data analysis where people are engaged with the data to me is going to be rich in the end I don't think we need to bend towards other problems thanks john I agree but I think what we by doing that we're actually helping to produce students who are more prepared to go on and do the specific things that employers may want so uh yeah I agree it's not our job to we're not just workforce trainers that's part of what we do but it's not all of what we do but but if we I think we're actually potentially moving here in the same direction I mean if we are producing graduates with more quantitative skills who have experience dealing with data or dealing with modern tools and so on then they're better prepared to actually take the next step uh in an employment situation jeff uh this is pernoti I would I would second what you just said in in creating these um career compasses and by the way I shamelessly you know harassed all these employers that were at the undergrad and grad um um summits that Sharon alluded to um if I could actually just write one of these without ever talking to an employer I would have all the right categories it's just the nuances of each sort of sub discipline would be different so if if you were to create one for me for your specialty you know say if you are an environmental lawyer I could write this for you and you would just tweak a little bit uh there's a lot of commonality in this and it doesn't matter whether someone is interested in an academic career or they want to be uh you know technician for some geophysics company or whatever have you you know there's lots of common threats I think one thing that really surprised me when I work with the employers was how broadly they thought about education and you know that they were really involved in thinking about systems thinking and geo uh you know systems thinking and you know just they didn't just say oh well they need to know this this this and this they need to be able to do these certain things they really thought about that the whole picture as to what students needed to you know to solve problems and to you know think critically and so I was really impressed I expected you know much more okay you know we want you to learn this there was more we can train students to do when they are hired to do the you know nuts and bolts we want but we want them to be able to think and create and innovate and solve problems. I'd like to add one more point that is a subset of the students that we're working with that um you go back to the comment about that go back to pipeline and pipeline to graduate school particularly in geophysics has heavily relied upon REU programs we sometimes attract students in geophysics without math beyond the two semesters of calculus it's very challenging and often the student has to do some additional take some additional courses before starting grad school or no credit courses while they're in grad school whereas um you know through the REU programs students realize the either to get some programming skills or acquire those in that course of their research experience and also say by doing digital signal processing learn why they want to learn about Fourier analysis and take more math but now this summer it's going to be a challenge with the REU's but also we realize that we're we're at a limit are we excluding in some ways one of one subgroup and that's the state university students who are only there for a couple of years and are probably already working part-time or maybe even full-time while they're at university and they can't afford to drop that job to do a an REU so without without that research experience how can we give enrichment that would enable students to to to pick up those additional skills are their examples of shorter term projects not an REU necessarily but ways to to get the research bug instilled in students at state universities I guess I would say I don't see any difficulty I tried to this morning outline a number of ways that you could do that uh within classes within uh you know modules or you know short term kinds of projects and there's a lot of things that you can do that don't require an REU and I think a large number of universities and colleges across the country are doing some a lot of these things I mean even you know what Barb was talking about with this small schools and the you know faculty working with individual you know students on projects and things I mean you they learn and they get those research experiences um and I guess I would say it's it's really dual well I don't think Barb's students that were working full-time while they're at university right and you don't have that group you know no we don't but um they even though they are not working full-time um their time is pretty full so if they were doing a research project it would probably be part of a half-credit course so that it wasn't on top of what they were doing and so departments might consider substituting um an elective for sorry substituting a research project for an elective which would mean that the student wouldn't have to take an extra course spend extra time in the summer or spend extra time away from a job or family to do the work and it could be a half-credit thing it could be a quarter credit thing could be a quarter credit thing for four semesters um and you could imagine how how much someone might be able to advance the more they the more they learn about geology and to be able to do somewhat different things in each of those semesters even if it's you know it you could I could imagine this it wouldn't be ideal but I could imagine setting up research-like experiences for students um that aren't aren't quite as exciting as the as the real thing where you really don't know where you're going but the faculty member doesn't know where they're going but still I think there's there are possibilities for that if you're willing to exchange and I think I think there's the message here is if we want to do x we can't just add we want to do y we can't just add and so we have to do that curricular and course evaluation that Kathy was talking about at the at the at the matrix level basically saying what is what is the bottom line here what is the really most important component of this particular course and does it really matter if by jettison these other kinds of things and that's undoubtedly true for a curriculum because if you looked at well when we did the teaching structural geology workshop back in 2004 we asked um we asked everyone who was coming 70 people who teach structural geology we gave them three choices for a list of 80 topics and said uh you can choose either I never teach this I always teach this can't imagine a course without it or I'd give it up and of those 80 topics there were only about 20 that everybody said were absolutely essential and you could do the same thing at the curriculum level if you lay out 12 curricula they don't all match right and you could say well why did they make this decision for this course we never teach it we never require it so I think if you're willing to think broadly about what goes in your courses and what goes in your curriculum and what you might jettison in favor of something you really want there are places to put these in so I would just add quickly that um I think there's so there's a whole pile of people working on course-based research experiences so there's a lot of models particularly outside the geosciences for how research experiences can be put into um into into courses at all levels but I wonder if there's also an opportunity when we create this extra half credit course that Barbas figured out how we're going to do to do something that riffs on um John your virtual um coordinated REU program so that you could get people at different universities working on those in the in class in the course year um research projects with some sort of overarching coordination across them and community across them that might help support them and feed them into the graduate programs not sure Don can hear well iris iris and I this may be true for Beth too for in AFCO iris runs a you guys all know this an REU program that coordinates across sites so there's a virtual component that goes across the students who are all in different different places and you could imagine that playing out in a in a semester long research project or a year long research project during the academic year right I mean the way the way the program runs is it's a it's the students come together in the beginning of summer but then they all go off to different institutions for the summer so we've talked about and you know Michael suggested you could make it more virtual and I guess that's what you're saying is do the same thing but have that happen during the school year instead of over the summer beginning in the end virtual and not face-to-face right but the difference is what and where it gets a little trickier is then your you're also not the same place as your research advisor probably you're back at your own institution so that's that that's the next level of virtualness which I think we have to now get to right but often John that is what happens we we have these bright students in an REU and it's never over um right well you know well I'm still working with one in Argentina right now and it it there's students for life so um when it when that the mix works well but has the iris intern program being canceled then for this summer for this summer yes we we decided not to try to run it because we felt it wasn't we it was going to be too hard to actually create the kind of environment that we want to create for the students and there's just so many variables that we can't control particularly since they're every student is at a different institution so it was going to be just too difficult so yeah we've canceled ours for this summer it would just there's just a few individual students that we're trying to work with to place with individual faculty and I may not know all the details but at the Unavco side they made the decision to take the recess internship online um all of the all three of our internship programs online um but that's the largest one and they've hired a basically they're I think don't always like we're not traveling that much so we're gonna throw some more money at this um because we're not using our travel budget so they've hired um someone with an expertise in in online education to help them design it and they're getting computers out to all the students and they're gonna try to bring in the mentors and advisors it's and I think they're hoping to get some shovel ready project money from the CARES Act um maybe to help it as well but that's fantastic to help the research aspect of it they can run it as it is but they're hoping to be able to research it better with a little more money okay so um we do need to actually wrap up we have gone a little past our time but not too much um so um yeah I don't know Cindy did you want to have a final wrap up here hi yeah so um as I sorry I as there were there was one more comment that I should uh um mentioned by Matri Erwin she says I'll um we all read or reread timefulness by Marsa Bjornorud so I don't know that but I'll go take a look um I want to say thank you so much to everyone for your willingness to adapt and adjust and be flexible and to share it can't be candid in sharing best practice um which often involves worst practice and learning no I mean yes we we have we get to where we are through through risk along the way um and I think we are all in challenging times that with um and evolving times as that particularly as as um anything field related changes or travel related changes moving forward as well I appreciate all the feedback that everyone's given to anyone listening we'll collate the website information that was included and in the talks that have information that could be helpful or websites that could be helpful virtual trips that could be helpful all that information um I'd like to say um thanks so much to all the speakers and moderators oh Torsten Becker said that too um he's just joined us I think Torsten's also a member of the committee and I I agree wholeheartedly with his comments this has been a really fruitful discussion and one that's led to some suggestions and recommendations um for departments looking to make changes and to overcome the tyranny of content um so I think with that we'll um we'll leave you and provide like I said this um to anyone who registered for that we'll send out this list of websites and the rest of us then are going to debrief and the committees will debrief a bit and look to ways forward from the content of the meeting so thank you everyone and we'll be bothering you to ask for follow-up on any or check the websites and the web content or anything new that comes aboard as well right so the subtitle on timefulness is how thinking like a geologist can help save the world so you know at this point the world definitely needs saving so let's hope that we can do something okay so thank you everybody