 Well welcome we're going to get started here in just a minute, but before we do maybe I'll just Tell you about our card system that we have back there for those who want to speak tonight So the card system is broken up so we can get allow everybody to speak it doesn't look like we have a Real room fool, so we should be okay, but If you pick out a card the green cards are if you want to speak We'll give you a minute with the green card the yellow cards We give you two minutes and the orange cards will give you up to three minutes So it just would help us kind of plan the time for the evening, but it doesn't look like we have a Huge audience here, so it may not be too too much of a problem So if you just fill out one of those cards or grab one of the speaker cards, then We'll call them up in order So we'll call up the first the green cards and then the yellow cards and then the orange cards All right, very good. Well. It is time to start the meeting now, so we'll call this November 7th planning Commission meeting to order and if I could get a roll call, please Commissioner Ruth here Commissioner Newman here Commissioner Kristen Finn Commissioner Wilk here and chair Welch here. Thanks, and now we'll do the pledge of allegiance Very well, thank you for Attending here this meeting is cable cast live on charter communications cable TV channel 8 and 18t you first channel 99 And it's also being recorded to be replayed on the following Monday and Friday at 1 p.m. On charter channel 71 and Comcast channel 25 Meetings can also be viewed from the city's website city of capitol.org our technician tonight is Kingston reviewer Rivera and Just as a reminder if you have phones if you could put them on vibrate motor science that would be appreciated and With that we'll start moving forward with the meeting First we start with our oral communications any additions or deletions Yes, so there were 16 additional material emails They're at your dias there and they're in the back for the public to view very good and that bicycle community We have anybody here They have a pretty good network of getting the word out. So I think all 16 came from the bicycle community, but Thanks for that Public comment, so this is our public comment period This is for someone that would like to speak about an item that is not on tonight's agenda And so that would be anything outside of the capitol them all We'll give you an opportunity to come up and speak to the Planning Commission address us Okay, seeing none. We'll just keep moving forward. It's time for commission comments nothing staff comments Actually, I'd like to take a minute just to introduce our team this evening we have Eric Phillips with us from our city attorney's office and You've heard over the past couple meetings. I keep introducing that we've hired new consultants to work on behalf of the city related to the mall project to my Right, I have Matt Otteson. He's a planner with RM design and to his right is Scott Martin An architect with RM design and John Schwartz our planner extension of working as he Owns JHS consulting and is working as an extension of staff for the mall project. Great. Well, welcome. Appreciate the help Okay, so when we want item three approval our minutes and we have two sets of minutes One set from October 3rd And I don't know if we need to do it separately because we Have somebody missed a meeting but So if I can ask for approval of our October 3rd Planning Commission minutes Second motion is second all those in favor. All right That passes and now for 3b for our special meeting on October 17th Second all those in favor. I I and so that also passes and yet unanimously So now we're going to move forward to our public hearing section of the meeting which is on the capital of mall I just want to give you a little bit of an idea how the the night will go As far as how we're going to roll this out So first we're going to have John as Katie just introduced Schwartz of and he represents our city With JHS consulting so he's going to give a basic overview of the project After that, we'll have more loan guyer who is the applicant for the mall to give us an overview and history of the project design And then we're going to have stakeholder agencies and technical review feedback with John Schwartz Then we'll move on to our RM design who have been in part of this process working with my own guyer representing the city on kind of making sure we're staying on track architecturally and And then after that more Lauren guyer will have a chance to follow up with anything that they think they missed after hearing RRM to discuss it We'll bring it back to the planning Commission for questions that we may have and then after that we time for the public hearing for you to speak And after we hear from all those who wish to speak tonight, then we'll bring it back to the Planning Commission for final comments and direction. So that's the general plan So with that, I guess I will turn it over to John. Great. Thank you. Mr. Chair and members of the Commission. Can you hear me? Okay? Again this item tonight is a conceptual review for redevelopment of a substantial portion of the Capitola mall property Conceptual review provides an applicant an opportunity to obtain early feedback on a design prior to submitting a formal application In this case we're alone guyer is Seeking guidance and feedback on preliminary design for about 31.4 acres of the 46 acre Capitola mall site Mr. Chair ran through that sort of the outline for the item tonight. I'm gonna skip over that I'm just gonna touch on briefly the site itself. I think everyone is familiar with the mall site itself But it's 46 acres in total. It's in the regional commercial zone Designation the site is located west of 41st Avenue between Clair Street and Capitola Road Currently there's about 640,000 square feet of retail uses on about 10 parcels on the mall property Which is surrounded by a mix of commercial development with some residential to the west and southwest In 1975 the area was annexed into the city. The mall opened originally in 1977 was expanded in the late 1980s to include four department stores in about a hundred shops and restaurants The existing mall building has a height of roughly 35 feet and a current tenant base of about 68 or so tenants The existing target Macy's and Cole's buildings are larger anchor retail type stores that would remain on the site It's a little small. I apologize over the last decade the city has been focused on the long-term viability of the mall property and Set out to create specific policies goals and actions to ensure or to incentivize and guide redevelopment at the property The zoning code which was adopted in 2018 implements that recent guidance to incentivize redevelopment The site again is designated for regional commercial use This is really intended for retail and services for capitol residents visitors to the area the designation allows a maximum floor area ratio of 1.5 with an allowance to go up to 2.0 if certain conditions are met I'm going to just give a very quick overview and not going to get into the details more long I will get will go over the project in a few minutes But just at a basic sense the project again is proposing redevelopment of thirty one point four acres of the 46 acre Mall property the concept includes a new open-air design with a main street commercial district Approximately 339,000 square feet of retail space including a theater a mix of entertainment and fitness and retail uses The project also proposes up to 637 residential units In fact, I should go here. Sorry. Let me back up the commercial space is shown here in the blue boxes and The 637 residential units would be built along 38th Avenue Within a seven-story building any five-story building The main components of the project include demolishing The former Sears building a portion of the existing mall and the former Takara restaurant had The project also includes various transportation improvements The idea is to build out a grid street pattern here shown with the arrows through the property Would also be pedestrian and bicycle improvements as well as other infrastructure Sewer and water and such this chart just shows a little basic Comparison of the some of the development standards that apply to the property the maximum column shows the under the existing designation the maximum FAR Open space and height limits the proposed project is seeking a plan development zoning to basically to allow for Clustering of the residential in one portion of the site and raising the height to 85 feet in that portion of the property So again, the applicant is seeking what we call plan development zoning The purpose of a PD zoning is to allow for a high-quality development that deviates from the standards in the city And zoning district regulations It's intended to provide flexibility For an applicant to take advantage of unique site characteristics and to hopefully develop projects Which can provide extreme public benefits for the residents employees and visitors of Capitola PD zoning is required. It must illustrate how the development would be superior To what is allowed under the existing designations and how we will achieve the substantial public benefit Examples of such public benefits. I won't read this list, but they include things like affordable housing public spaces green building and sustainable development preservation historic resources jobs Transportation options particularly pedestrian and multimodal transportation facilities and improvements Public Park space or habitat restoration So in terms of process Again, this is a conceptual review process tonight We are hoping to obtain guidance and feedback on the initial application from the Planning Commission tonight The City Council meeting next Thursday. We will obtain feedback as well After that the applicant will take the direction and guidance that they hear and hopefully refine the project and finalize their application We currently expect the formal application to be submitted after the new year probably sometime in January Once that formal application is submitted the City will conduct its Usual thorough review and processing of that application that will involve detailed staff review coordination with stakeholder agencies and interested parties a Second more detailed design review by our consultant RRM who you'll hear from in a few minutes and Then also the environmental review process which is required under the California Environmental Quality Act Will be required at that point We the city has contracted with a due deck to prepare an environmental impact report for this project Given the size of the development and the interest and issues associated with it. We expect a full EIR to be needed due deck is Beginning work on that EIR now that the bulk of the work will really take shape once the project application Is finalized after the turn of the year Once we go through all of those review processes the project will come back to public hearings for Consideration we expect currently that that anticipated the completion of that process will be around this time next year I'm going to just touch on again staff and the applicant are requesting guidance on the following main questions or issues the architectural design massing articulation of the proposal development The layout and circulation both within the site and the connectivity to the surrounding properties and adjacent areas The mix of the proposed uses What are the desired public benefits and affordable housing? So with that I'm going to turn over to my own guy to go through the project and then we'll come back and talk a Little bit about the technical reviews Thank You John Chair commissioners my name is Steven Logan with my own guy or partners And so I'd like to introduce a couple of my teammates that are here with me today of Dave geyser Andy Neff and Baron Karen. I had her on our project team supporting us through this Development moving forward and so what I wanted to do is touch base really quickly on I know we've gone through a couple of these slides in the past that talks about ownership and the reason why it's It's really key to hear is that we only own 31 of the 46 acres that are on site But when we bought them all we bought the light blue part of the mall which included coals and the interior portion of the mall Sears was separately owned Target was separately owned Macy's was separately owned the Olive Garden piece and the two banks and The Ross parcel as well So this just goes to show that we were very limited in our in our ability to Put together what was part of the general plan and part of the visioning for for the mall moving forward and so I Know we purchased them all from Maystich in April of 2016 at that point in time we own about 45 percent of the entire property and Like I said Sears Target and Macy's all have site plan control over an REA governing Document as well. So they they do have approval rights moving forward and while touch base on that really quickly in a second So Back at the end of last year Sears approached us as they have with a lot of their boxes and had decided that they were gonna Go dark especially at this location. So it gave us the ability to get them out of out of the mall And gives us the ability to Own a bigger portion of the site We now own 67 percent of the site and as I mentioned earlier Target and Macy's do have approval rights over over this process And so we have been talking to them about getting their buy-in to the current plan that we will show you here in In a couple of minutes So next John talked to quickly about schedule We had an initial community outreach meeting in January of 2018 the feedback we got from that It was very Underwhelming because we basically showed a remodel of the existing mall And so we went back we took a lot of those comments back to our team to really think about it and then Once the Sears piece came to us. We decided that it was now time to put together a plan to share with the community The second community outreach meeting happened in June of this year and roughly 150 people are show attended that meeting So it was a great conversation to hear back from the community about what they really wanted it to see as part of the plan And we'll and Dave will walk you through some of those ideas moving forward The month of November is a conceptual review Hearings we will then submit a formal application in January The environmental review process will roughly go between January to next fall We hope to get project approval through the Planning Commission City Council by next fall We will then start construction documents Spring of 21 And start construction in spring of summer of 21 It'll take roughly about three years to build the project There are a lot of details that need to go into that project on a construction aspect But that's roughly we think it's three years part of it could be phased depending on how much housing wanted to be built at one time But high level that's where we're at with the schedule today Just things so one of the things we wanted to talk about and and and we'll walk through this is that we really took your visioning document in the general plan and Really use that document to plan our development and key uses of that were public gathering places amenities Renovation of the mall pushing buildings to the street and adding some housing And so we really took that plan and when we walk you through the design of the plan moving forward I think you'll really resonate with with some of those ideas moving forward. So Good evening, I'm Dave Geiser. I'm the in-house architect from alone guy I direct our design and construction Portfolio-wide and have been involved in this project since its inception And again, you heard Stephen talk about Studying your your visioning documents and what the effort planning efforts that have gone into this project previously and and using that to Educate ourselves into how best we might be able to Re-envision the mall as he mentioned our very first planning session. We only own the mall So our efforts were redesigned into the mall itself and part of the exterior and again I think that fell flat because people were wanting to see more happen So it was really fantastic when they have had the opportunity to buy from Sarah Todd's the Sears piece Really, we just went back to the drawing board in terms of how could we re-envision of the mall? And so we gave a presentation in June to the community We had a great attendance there and our general plan of how this site is organized hasn't changed from then But we've had an opportunity since June to actually Generate a lot more details and refinements of that design, which I'll walk you through here this evening But people are going to recognize some of these plans from last June and site work because the site organization hasn't changed since then You'll see on the on the board We see the area that we're proposing to demolish of the mall We're leaving part of the existing mall that's next to coals There's some lease control there with some of the tenants that are there And so we're at this point in our beginning phase need to leave them in place and leave them open during construction So we thought we'd take advantage of Leaving part of the mall in place but again tearing down the Sears tearing down the main ports of the mall leaving a Macy's and Target and coals all open during construction So this was the conceptual rendering that we provided in June Which shows kind of the organization organization of the site once we tear down the mall We have an opportunity to relocate the main drive off 41st Street through the center of the project and create a main street That actually runs through that through the through the heart of the project But at the same time create other street grids that allow Not only access in and through the project But help alleviate some of the traffic around the site by giving people ways to circulate through the site Which aren't there today you simply have to drive around the mall So we'll come back to this a little later But this gives the basic overview of how we're organizing the site coals and parts of the mall are staying the same We're bringing buildings to 41st Street, and we're introducing housing Over-retail on the south part of the site. We'll still create this very exciting Open space that didn't exist before So you saw previously the slide and we'll try to get here Through this pretty quick again. You see the the relocated signal on 41st Street By the way, we're still working through we have some proposals from our civil engineer And how we need to reorient and reconfigure some of the mediums along 41st Street there and how those Intersect with our businesses across the street this conceptual we still have some Problems to solve their challenges to solve And how that's going to work, but we've because the T intersection today We think it will still continue to work as a T intersection going forward To create that main spine through the middle of project at the same time. We are also going to reinforce work on 40th Street their 40th Avenue through the front of the project and then creating a Continuation of 38th Avenue through the middle of the project north south that will pick up at the signal of the existing signal on The south end of the site and continue through the Claire's There's another street that it's hard to see on here But I think it was evident on John's slide where we actually had We're another driveway off of 41st Street, which is Here and actually that's going to drag through the majors under the parking structures and to targets front door Again east west through the site It's not necessarily a street per se because of the pedestrian orientation But it's an axis way in easement not easement but acts way through the site to provide ways for a vehicle circulation And so the way the sites and organize again is that we have over to you We have new 41st Street 41st Avenue Retail facing the main street through the new parking lot there and then our first phase of residential sits on top of that Five stories of residential on top of ground floor retail Next that in pink pink represents Where there's housing not over top of the retail but over that section we have a theater that sits on the second floor 10 to 12 screen theater that enters from the heart of the project where that where the town square is at the middle That's the entrance to the second floor theater that sits over ground floor retail on the other side of the main street We have a room for renovating the existing mall and putting new majors new tenants again Building on the main street experience and then once we get into the project. We see in yellow again Residential B, which sits on grade. This is not over retail where the yellow is But it sits over top of the shops that are facing the main street and I'll show you some sides to see how that works and then all that builds around the big central plaza here we're now Macy's and Target instead of entering into the mall enter into this great public square and so all that's highly monetized We'll show you some pictures of that Public gathering spaces and fountains and artwork and seating and gathering all that happens now at the heart of the project again All this there's zero open space today at the mall as you well know There's no place to go outside and so the idea is how do we celebrate these areas and create these plazas of public areas? That didn't exist before that act as a true of magnet to gather people there and then exiting through the project Click along here. This is the second floor that I talked about we see the theater on the second level in pink yellows representative housing and then we see targets target and Macy's in their second floors that exist there and the existing Parking structure for target that we're not touching either Signage is going to be a big key of the project. There's very little signage today and The the tenants that are going to want to come inside the project without exterior facing Frontiers and visibility are going to want signage Facing the streets so the people know that they're there So we're proposing additional signage on 41st Street and around the project and throughout the project This is one of the things that does not comply with your current Code so this is a this is one of those above and beyond things that we're looking for and so we're in the process of one Changing the name for the idea of the project We heard through our community outreach that we wanted to keep the name of capitol in the name We've done that and we thought because of the great center a square the plaza area the center a town square Name seemed appropriate for this. It's a working title today If you have suggestions or have strong with please let us know this is not set in stone But it's our working title for the product at this point But again keeping the name capitol in the project names it is something we're we're definitely looking to do and then preliminary design for project identification not only on 41st but on capitol and then we're Planning on renovating the signs that exist through the target and Macy's and Ross parking lots that we don't own They're not on a property, but we're gonna renovate those a part of the the project That's in the upper right hand and we'll build we're proposing to build new smaller signs 12 Tall signs that other entrances throughout the project again identify not only existing tenants that are there But our new major tenants that we're proposing such as the theater and some of the other majors We're gonna want that kind of signage All right into some of the visuals so this is the information we didn't have before and that we've been working on since June and What we see here now and and if you try to remember the project This is looking at the corner of the majors that are facing 41st And we see the five stories of rents atential sitting on top of the anchor tenant That will have on capitol a road on our left and the 40th Avenue in front of the project And we see a series of majors with tenants above We're trying to provide a design style that's contemporary, but also fits in kind of a mode that is Colorful it's it's got a lot of rich materials in there if you look in your packages You'll see elevations sheets and rendering sheets that have listed on there the different materials that we're proposing On each of these elevations we want to enlarge these elevations for this presentation So we've taken them out of here, but they're in your package So so each rendering each elevation has as material proposed materials and the idea is instead of just plain stucco buildings here We've got rich materials and metals and woods and we're still using some plasters, but using Materials such as your walk at the ground level that creates more visual interest. It's just a crate's a warmer building So this is then I'm looking down the main street that we're creating here on the right hand side This is another anchor tenant facing 41st We have to provide because of there's existing I don't know if you remember there's target Macy's signage up above now facing 41st They have the rights to those signs So we're proposing that we keep their identifications in those locations But trying to integrate those into the architecture and then on the the box It is the theater because theater box on the outside is really just blank wall we're proposing a Graphic there that not only tries to create a more of a vibe that we're trying to create for the center But also some visual interest and again, this is a placeholder. This is not it remains to be Design, but we the idea is that hey, we're trying to create some graphics up there on these wall spaces This is the theater entrance itself So at the intersection of 38th and the town square way that the main street center This is where the entrance to the theater The idea is to drag all the people that are going to the theater through the main square through the public space energize That town square area so if you walk into the corner up to the theater up above again Use a strong graphics and visual cues like cinema marquees at that entrance Using contemporary design for this Here we have then on 38th Avenue as I'm coming in from Capitola again I have my residential over at this point. We're trying to activate the ground floor with leasing offices And they'll end up having some kind of probably some kind of gym and other hangout areas in common area space We'll activate the ground floor with those type of uses down that residential street towards Capitola In fact, and this is a good time for Stephen to jump in just to talk quickly about the type of housing So we've we did a concrete report to go look at what type of housing is needed in Capitola in Santa Cruz County And it came back that you know multi-family studio one and two bedroom was really needed, you know with the occupancy around Santa Cruz County, it'll be market-driven We're gonna obviously affordable housing is gonna be a big component to this and will and we're gonna do per city standards And and discuss that with staff there. There's two other potential types of housing here It's into the independent living and senior living you can imagine putting 630 units out on the street at one time that the Getting them to be occupied at the same time might be difficult So we're talking to housing groups. We're looking at other types of housing as well. So not just multi-family Another view of the housing. This is again this at-grade housing on Capitola and 38th Street coming into the project again Trying to create a unique identity for the project that used a lot of different materials and colors Again, just to create a village type of feel a little bit different than the retail But trying to tie into the contemporary nature of the design So now we're on Main Street looking back towards the the east down Main Street This is a corner that's opposite the theater entrance. So here we have a row of shops It's under the housing on this corner I'm again using the housing over Main Street to help create a village type feel and at the same time trying to create individual tenant spaces in your village you have you know each individual shop and each They each have their own identity the idea is how to create that type of a vibe or feel for a village Not a village. We're not trying to redesign the village here But a real sense of of a town square by creating individual identities for the different tenants And and so that's what you see here And you'll see in some of the other slides that the individual tenants It's not like a ball where everything's the same and they only have control over a small section We're redesigning the entire building for individual tenants So this as you would be standing in the food core, I guess of the existing mall and looking back towards the target entrance This is now how we're opening that up and flanking the target entrance with other retail restaurant uses And enhancing the outdoor space with gathering spaces and outdoor dining And then conversely if I turn around look back the other way towards the macy's entrance again standing You know there in the center spot of the old mall today Looking back and how the macy's entrance is then flanked by shops and really the heart of the center with outdoor play space and gathering and artwork and benches and Maybe some graphic screens We're really trying to create a different identity for the shop individual shop spaces But create a really wonderful outdoor space for the community to gather Keep in mind too that this isn't while this is also for the community to come to and shop and hang out We're also going to have a lot of residents that are going to live here too. This is their home This is their backyard and and in products we've done similarly This becomes a neighborhood focus as well in a place where they hang out and go for walks and meet their friends And take their dogs out for walk or go jogging So this becomes a really vibrant community core here and a new meeting place in the city that didn't exist before So the coals is going to stay and so we're Trying to look at ideas on how we refer the outside of their building to make it look interesting We actually came up with the idea of we have artwork that we want to integrate into the design Perhaps and this is just a concept now is that perhaps we can integrate artwork into the side of their building Where it's just blank well now that maybe has the old begonia festival posters That can be huge frame graphics that we light up and and create visual interest along the side of the building Um, and so that's what we're proposing here and whether that idea changes But artwork will be the integral part of our project So into the landscape our overall landscape plan I think it was important to note that our open space right now our proposed open space is well over 20 percent Which is your requirements five So we've really gone the extra mile to create these outdoor spaces pedestrian passeos Places to gather And just soft spots in the architecture where where a lot of open space can occur Again coming off the new 41st avenue entrance we've brought some pad buildings per the vision documents We bring pad buildings to the street with outdoor areas to dine And we see these as being Food users some smaller shop space But really to to set where the entrance is and to anchor the main street as it hits 41st The first part of main street is where you're walking past The chilies on the right corner and are anchor tended on the left You're walking down main street towards the theater towards the square and we're introducing diagonal parking on this We feel that having a limited amount of parking on that main street really gives it a Downtown feel if you will but where there's cars interacting Single lane each way it slows the traffic down a lot of traffic calming that's happening here but really generous sidewalk and landscaping street trees and and Festoon lighting perhaps over the top of those streets that create a sense of place But that also, you know, you know that you're you know proceeding down shops on either side But towards a special area Which is here. So this is this is our town square. This is where all the action happens Wide streets plazas benches artwork fountains More festoon lighting Really creating a place for the community and the neighborhood to gather We what we anticipate here or what we're planning on doing is that the not only at the at the bottom intersection But the top is having raiseable ballers that we can block the street off to vehicular traffic So the idea is that on a friday night or a saturday There's the event going on or the traffic the pedestrian traffic is so heavy We can close the street off to to cars and have people use the streets as maybe maybe there's a start of a 5k or maybe there's a Farmers market or an art show or a car show or whatever that we can then use this whole area for again to create more area For outdoor and public gathering and because we've created all the additional circulation throughout the site It doesn't impede any of the traffic going around Um This is probably a good time because I've forgotten to mention before part of our plan Essential part of our plan is relocating the existing transit station where it sits right now really blocks access to them all It's difficult in terms of cross traffic between the buses the pedestrians and so we've uh We've brought back the previous concept that they had to relocate the uh the bus the transit center back between the The macy's and the coals on the back end which was a back corner. Well now it's a front door to the project now It's really on that 38th avenue spine. We've met with them a couple times already. They're excited about That location they think because it's central to the mall and it's out of away from the traffic Um, they're excited about the concept. So we're working with them right now on schedule They think they can get something approved early, you know, maybe even next spring And that they want to be relocated earlier than later because they don't want to be a part of all the construction activity It's happening and because the access is in and out of claire's street It's they can they can operate independently there while the construction is going on They're very excited about relocating and I would just think it's going to be a great not only can we upgrade that A transit center to include multimodal We have bike racks and bike storage and those type of things are running starting to run electric buses There's charging stations So they're we're all very excited about moving them put in the right place for the project and and obviously that's part of our What we consider part of our community benefit Speaking of community benefits, uh ended on the right note Thanks, Dave. So what we what we believe is some of the community benefits Today is that economic value by adding new relevant retail and restaurants Not if in case, you know 60 of the tenants that are in the mall today are temporary tenants And so we would like to bring new relevant retail and restaurants quality improvements to the community Outdoor amenities sidewalk cafes improved outdoor walking and bike paths We did see that a lot of the comments today were about biking and I think you know as we start developing this Further along that we're going to have to incorporate more of that into our project Community gathering places additional housing for the community Dave mentioned, you know relocating the the transit center and a transportation system enhancing mobility through the site So um with that I will turn it back over to stat All right, and I should have mentioned this before I turn it over This is just a scratch of the service of the information that's provided in your package We're trying to limit our presentation. There's a lot of information in there And and I think you'll hear rm comment on some of that that we have that chance to take a deep dive into This is highly conceptual and we're we're anxious to dig in more and and develop the details regarding circulation and bike paths and all those kind of things those are details you have to come Um, but yeah, there's again a lot of information in your package We and the one thing we missed but we should talk about Is we're treating uh water quality. We're not only treating now every drop that leaves the site that wasn't done before and we're doing the the The amount of water stores that needs to happen on site as well underground And so and we're a lot of our designs yet to come because we haven't seen a lot of the studies We're still studying traffic. We're still studying arborist reports We're still studying all of those things that all come together. They layer into the project We'll be developing in a later time and you'll see in a future application. So with that, thank you Thank you, David and steven And thank you for mentioning the metro relocation because I completely neglected to mention it myself I apologize for that Also wanted to add that the future application is I don't think I said this either that the anticipated application Is going to most likely include in addition to the plan development zoning A vesting tentative map potentially a development agreement A design permit and a master sign program. So thank you for touching on the signage as well. Okay Briefly, we're gonna just spend a few minutes talking about some of the stakeholder feedback that we've obtained so far And some of the technical internal reviews that have happened based on the initial application staff shared the application with some of the stakeholder agencies who serve the site or are Interested parties in the area Some of the feedback is here is slides a little dense. I apologize for that But the staff is coordinating with Santa Cruz water Regarding the project given the size and nature of the project A full water supply assessment will be required as part of the project review and the environmental review So we are working with Santa Cruz water now to scope that work and and iron out the processing of that document Will become part of the EIR County sanitation district has weighed in they're likely going to be some increases to downstream sewer mains Um, this would flow to the east cliff pump station. It's currently anticipated that it could handle the increase in flows But much more detailed analysis will occur during the formal application review and the EIR process Staff has reached out to the fire district and Soquel union elementary We're coordinating with those folks and some feedback from those agencies is currently pending Again, they will take a deeper dive during the full application review But in all of our conversations thus far, we haven't heard any show stoppers from any of these folks Again pending further much further analysis Internal staff has reviewed the initial application as well Some of the comments and I don't want to spend too much time on these because rm is going to get into some specific feedback But just to hit a few highlights for you all Some of the main staff review comments about the initial project thoughts to consider at this point in time Possibly rotating the building pads that are along at the 41st entry there To create more of a connected pedestrian experience along town square way all the way through is an idea Um, there's some concern with the repetitive and massing of the building on buildings on 38th And whether they fit with the style of capitol and the development that exists Um, the taller buildings there also could Have some shade implications for the road open space areas and the shorter buildings to the north of town square way That will require some further study particularly the shading in in the environmental analysis Comments regarding the alignment of town square way and david spoke a little bit to this about the connections with the brown ranch and whole foods and Uses across 41st Um Request to add more landscape improvements elements along the frontages particularly 41st and capitol Making them more pedestrian friendly green and more improvements to to enhance the frontages of the site The development should include active public park space on the property We want to ensure that the public realm spaces are sized to accommodate the inactivity that's intended And one example of this we've discussed this with with marlon geyer as well Is the dog park area seems fairly small for the use that's intended. That's the kind of feedback we're talking about here Making sure that the uses we want are are going to fly Uh, we want to clarify that there are enhancements for all the different age groups that would be served on the site There may be residents with young families seniors young professionals a mix of of everyone We want to make sure they have facilities to use pedestrian activities recreational areas to use on the site And we also want to look at integrating public art within the pedestrian area and public areas staff also Hired cosmon companies to conduct a fiscal impact analysis of this initial project And i know marlon geyer has their own information and they can talk to that or we're trying to compare ours with theirs But i'm going to touch on the results of the cosmon analysis really briefly The project would redevelopment of this site would certainly improve the economic health of the shopping center itself Depending on the actual taxable retail sales. This could end up being a slight fiscal benefit or potentially a slight deficit to the city The annual incremental revenues that are expected based on this initial analysis would range from around 800 850 000 to 1.2 million However with the addition of residential on the property the project would increase the population of the city by maybe about 12 That increase would cause an increase in the city's expenditures to serve those residential units And that may range from 875 000 to up to to a million per year So what that means overall the net fiscal impact could arrange from a slight positive to a slight negative Some of the other points raised in the analysis Given the the recent trends downward in retail sales in general and and on this property There are poor projections of future retail sales as it exists today, which certainly results in a risk to the general fund What we're interested in diversification of uses on the site combined with potential financial tools That can help us make sure this is a positive fiscal impact for the city The cosmon analysis talks about potential tools to increase revenues from the project and also maybe help diversify the base A couple of examples of those are listed here. One would be building a hotel on the site as part of the project Another would be to establish a community's facilities maintenance fee or enact an entertainment tax The last one is very dense again. I apologize. I won't read this whole thing but the design permit is required for the project pursuant to the zoning code And this is intended to ensure we have a high quality design that is harmonious with around Surrounding uses and that we don't impact surrounding land uses to the extent we can To approve a design permit certain findings have to be made here That's consistent with applicable plans and policies Site the project is not going to be detrimental to the public health and safety And that the project complies with the city's design review criteria and maintains the character of the neighborhood in the area The city in in Pursuing design review for this conceptual application has contracted with an architecture and landscape architecture firm rm design group Scott and madder sitting next to me here and you're gonna hear from them in a minute We asked them to provide a peer review of the design To arrive at what how the project fits with some of these findings And a second more detailed design review again I think I mentioned this earlier will be done once the formal application is submitted and the full review process commences in january, but in the meantime We are going to have rm discuss some of their feedback and thoughts on the initial design we have Thank you, and staff is available. We're all here for questions if you have any Thank you As john mentioned, um, my name is matt oddison. I'm with rm design group. I'm a planner I'm here today with scott martin architect Very happy to be a part of this effort and assist your community in reviewing this very substantial project Just a quick presentation overview, uh, we're going to go over who we are as a firm Sort of our process and framework for designer view Get into our concept review hit on some of those bigger topics And then some some of the main takeaways, and then end with next steps and questions Uh rm design group is a multidisciplinary design firm. We have four offices across california We're fast approaching 150 employees, and we've been in business for over 45 years with architects So engineers landscape architects planners, uh, etc I should mention that um, we do work on both public and private projects and currently we conduct designer view on behalf of Over two dozen cities across california. So we like to say if it's been proposed. We've probably reviewed it from a design perspective In terms of a design review process To date here's sort of the steps that we've taken to get to this evening's meeting We've reviewed the conceptual designs middle as the applicant alluded to It is dense. We reviewed it from front to back to make sure we understood it In complete in the whole complete sense of the term We've reviewed relevant general plan and zoning code section specifically the 17120 point 070 which is the design review portion That really sort of guided our design review efforts We conducted a site tour with city staff To see what's on the ground there today and we met with Both staff and the applicant to hear sort of their ideas and concepts behind the design And then at that point we then prepared our conceptual design review This design review is available in your packet and I believe online as well So in terms of design review framework, we typically approach these from the perspective of how do you break A project down from a design perspective. I'm not talking about two by fours I'm talking about larger ideas of the design of a project. So massing layout of streets Articulation of buildings colors materials again, not the specifics but taking a step back and and focusing on the bigger design Focus of a project Typically, this includes site planning architecture landscape architecture and sometimes civil engineering Less frequently we review floor plans because it involves the interior of a building But in this case we've looked at them for this project One other thing to note is community character Is particularly important At least in our interpretation of the city's general plan and the design review Um specifically The small town coastal character is highlighted a number of times and We've highlighted that throughout our review To dive into a little bit of the nuts and bolts Specifically the general plan in its guiding principles talks about community identity the small town feel coastal village charm More specifically the zoning code gets into how a development Site plan height massing architectural style materials landscaping affects the unique coastal character and a distinctive sense of place As part of our site tour of a staff we we went across the entire city and we've highlighted some of the key kind of Elements that we found the Venetian hotel The trestles the six sisters And the various buildings in the village that all have that coastal character It's important to note that Community character is often difficult to define You can't point to one thing and say that is capitol, but often it's a collection of items. It's the placement of plazas Building the adjacency to one another the use of colors materials. So If someone asked what is capitol, I don't think someone could point to one thing and say that's it It's often a collection of items. So it's important to keep in mind So we started with site planning and this involved the street layout and the applicant touched on this and I think One of the things that jumped out to us immediately was the sort of lack of information regarding bicycle Connectivity the city does have a bicycle master plan and there have been recent improvements on 38 And so we've highlighted that in our review that there's opportunity to extend that network and connect to it in the site The grid pattern Is is a solid approach to breaking down what currently is a site that is almost impenetrable. You have to kind of Zig your way through to get from one side to the other unless you stay on the streets at the edge 38 avenue in its current design configuration does do a lot of zigs and zags And if it is a in primary street, there's opportunities there I think to refine that to make it a little bit more approachable We also heard about the connection to target traveling east to west In our review of the project, we had some initial concerns on the tunnel like appearance in portions of it I know from the 40th avenue or the area that is just West of 41st, there's been a great Uh, sort of design approach there where they've pushed the building back They've introduced the appearance of a street introduced some landscaping sidewalks to make it more pedestrian friendly I think as you start to travel West through the site, uh, you lose that pedestrian orientation And then we just had some Clarifications on sort of alignment with surrounding context particularly along 41st and the driveways across the street Speaking specifically to the tunnel concept. We wanted to touch on that a little bit more as I alluded to They've pushed the building back on 40th They provided sidewalks street trees. These are all things that help make a street more inviting to pedestrians On 38th, um, for example, um, it's a little less inviting. It's a smaller entrance There's not a street, uh sidewalk. There's no landscaping other than what's already on 38th So it seems like there's some opportunity there Block length We took a quick analysis on the village. I think it's a very Identifiable experience from from a block link perspective in the city Typical block links in this area range in the 300 foot range And that's creates that walkable experience where you get to the corner and you say, oh, there's the next street And there's the next street In looking at the the the current Orientation of the mall site. That's a little bit more auto oriented where you're approaching 600 feet and above I think the current project has done Some a great job of breaking that down to make it more walkable But they're perhaps as opportunities to continue to look at how to make the street grade a little bit more walkable pedestrian emphasis As the applicants spoke to there's a ton of amenities along town centerway and 38th I think those are all phenomenal Street trees pedestrian amenities seating lighting Among others I think there is an opportunity though to expand that right now It's focused in the core of the project But how does that project connect to the surrounding fabric of the community capitol? 41st Claire's I think these are opportunities to kind of really embrace that community context And then there there are some Paseo opportunities That the applicant has introduced one along town square way But there seems like there could be some other opportunities to again enhance that pedestrian emphasis In reviewing the site plan There was a number of sort of pad buildings along 41st And while the applicant has articulated those from a streetscape public realm perspective in a very A well thought manner it seems like there's some additional Opportunity to connect sort of the main activity area along town square way to 41st Again that idea of connecting to the surrounding city fabric And really attaching those different development areas within the project Parking so the applicant has proposed to Restripe the existing surface parking a number of the surface parking areas are planned to go away In lieu of replacing them with structured parking. Those are shared with resident and retail While the applicant has largely hidden those within the development there are some areas that Currently are visible from the exterior. We've highlighted one here building B the west elevation That would be visible along capitol in claris Again, that's an opportunity to perhaps look at ways in which that could be screened or Minimize the appearance of as one passes by We also looked at parking. I think parking particularly along A retail areas provides that presence where you could quickly jump into a store So you had dry cleaning and you wanted to drop it off or pick it up There's that opportunity where you can pull in you can grab it and take off in a fairly quick manner And the project has proposed a number of diagonal spaces along town square way and a few along 38th, I think there's an opportunity perhaps balance that ratio a little bit better And look for other opportunities to expand that to create that more urban main street downtown feel Such as along 40th portions of 38 and then future direction Acknowledging this is a larger site not all of it is being sort of enhanced at this point Leaving a notion of what Could happen in the future. I think some of the the topics that I've touched on Allude to sort of that future idea whether it's sort of creating that main street appearance along 40th but but extending These other ideas where it really informs any future development that could occur So at the end of the day if once this site is in the some far off future fully developed It feels like a cohesive development And with that i'm going to turn it over to scott martin I appreciate that matt commissioners good evening I'm going to do my best to struggle through technology and I can only guarantee i'll fail somewhere So, um It it's been a pleasure working with merlongao working with the city Exploring your city and getting to know it a little bit better It is clear in your city policy and goals that you hold your community character to a very high standard And we're excited about how this project can start to embody And distinguish itself within within capitol As matt said one of the first things we did was was a city tour and When you start talking about architecture, you know when I still talk to my mom about what I do for a living She says are you doing spanish style houses or what he and I tell her mom I have the project. She can't even name a style anymore And I I think that's that's one of the real unique community character aspects of capitol is it's a very eclectic mix of architectural styles This is not santa barbara where everything's white Mission style with red tile roofs. There's a there's a great sort of community fabric that embraces that coastal californian history and builds upon it in in new ways that create Ultimately, especially what you see in your village a unique series of architectural moments And I think that's that's what this project wants to embody and I think it's heading down that route and We're excited to see where it goes Especially from a commercial standpoint for for those of you who have been out to the mall You've seen Some of the 1980s at its best Very large boxes very repetitive forms I think the applicant has done just a fabulous job with some of the commercial architecture In a delineation and articulation of breaking down Those boxes into smaller more manageable more pedestrian friendly more human scale elements the use of materials The use of colors the sort of this enhanced corner that was talked about by the applicant at the Cinema really is distinctive architecture. It helps to find place as you walk through the project Anybody you could tell anybody you meet me at the cinema and they would know where to go So so we really appreciate that and enjoy that I think there's some room to to continue along with that and hopefully we'll touch upon how that can be Extrapulated into a mixed-use environment Thinking of this as a holistic project and not just a commercial project We feel it's the residential portion of the project that really sort of lacks that same same distinctive architectural finesse There's portions of the building that that continue on for 700 feet That's rather long and continuous without a lot of wall plane change roof plane change that there's nods and elements of Pulling buildings forward and pushing them back and and we're looking for ways to to enhance that even further Create distinct architectural moments along those larger building elevations Even in the commercial massing there's some nods to multi-story I think this is a great view that shows more than one Parapet line. So I think that's that's a great start towards creating distinctive retail spaces That's what the retailers want themselves. That's how you're going to create more viable retail We've seen other examples of projects like this that that actually try to even capture a little bit more of that second floor In that that two-story appearance as retail Massing is very tall. Everybody want even your starbucks now you go up At least 20 feet in your ceiling So those building forms can start to expand quite tall and create large foreheads and blank space So that can be just filled with signage So finding ways to either add some roof elements like they've done on the corner here or Some two-story architectural elements to help it feel again more more eclectic and more of place More so with the residential and commercial mix, that's really where we're finding a disconnect in the architecture many of the the mix use Visualizations almost appear like there's a commercial building with a residential one just stuck right on top of it There's a lack of sort of vertical integration We've looked at some of the Some of the most successful mix use environments in california And that residential portion wall over top of commercial can still have elements that come to the ground There doesn't have to be a cutoff and a setback at every level But finding ways where a building element can can go up two or three stories four stories then set back finding ways for The the top the the mid portion of the building and a base to all relate to each other without necessarily making wall plane changes I think that's where we're looking for the residential and the commercial to come together a little bit more To create a distinctive architectural character between them Same goes for neighborhood compatibility Just as an outsider looking in when you look around the context on capitol road in particular and you look To me context means the adjacent Urban fabric the adjacent figure ground how much building is occupying the the street frontage Compared to what is directly across the street the proposed project right along capitol to the road it is is quite abrupt moving from the public realm directly to a seven-story tall building there are some Finistration and articulation added there But much of it is within a couple of feet of each other from one level to the next It's it's what we call a furring or small pop outs without intentional derivative massing changes We find even in in your town in in this village in in other cities There's there's a Placemaking aspect that that lets us remember as matt mentioned how to get from one street to another. There's a way finding element That distinctive Unique architectural character building forms and public places can help Sort of guide us through the great greater projects or the the greater urban fabric Will you have that in your own town and we're we're looking for more of that in this project I I want to know when i'm when i'm at a corner It's it's something distinctive It's something where I could tell somebody meet me at the x and I don't have to even use a street name Because I could say the lighthouse or the town square or the cinema So we're looking for for more architectural delineation at those way finding opportunities There is some concern along 38th and The sort of pedestrian engagement with the the program in the middle Towards the tunnel there there is a active ground floor. There's some leasing offices There's some public uses, but there's also even out at the corner Right at ground level. There's some bedroom windows. There's some living room windows There's a sense of privacy that that that seems to not quite be established yet And I I think the the talented architects will get there, but it was something that we noticed in in our review Quite often on a on a major public Street like this like that we're trying to create We'll see some sort of transitional element from public to semi-public to private We've seen that done through the use of stoops. We've seen that done through raising that floor Off of the actual sidewalk elevation. So it's just a different datum point Porches Small walls and walks. There's a there's a number of different mechanisms and I look forward to seeing Those sort of articulations come back at at the next level of design Again, I think there's a great sort of palette I think I think David mentioned this there's there's a lot of architectural materials It's a very rich palette, especially at the commercial realm That dilutes itself a little bit when you get into the residential And what we're looking for is a little more compatibility between the two a little less distinction Once again finding building forms that can go up more than just about to the retail But carry building elements above Finding even though this is one building. It's a series of facades. It's a series of architectural moments along a longer facade that help sort of guide the human at a different scale and different elements along the street and Feels less arithmetic The applicant talked about the opportunity for art and some of their graphic applications We really think that idea is Is great in nature Inversed in public art and has a a tie should have and can have a tie back to capitol It feels a little applied right now and we're looking for a little better integration in how that might be utilized Less of a sticker and more of a a thing a place an instagrammable moment if you will Briefly we just touched upon floor plans. There seemed to be a couple This isn't usually what we do in design review. So there just seemed to be a couple that lacked sort of some natural light opportunities And amounts there's building code that will cover minimum requirements and whatnot, but there is a natural environmental connection that That capitol has and we want to make sure that this project from a residential standpoint isn't bracing its Location in its place and we feel like that indoor outdoor connection that natural light connection could be enhanced in a couple of the units Jumping into the the public realm and sort of the landscape architecture component. Um, I think one of the strong Areas of the project is that the applicant team has focused in on breaking these areas down and theming them The tides and the estuary and sort of letting those themes kind of inform the design elements that appear within the project within the public realm I think there's some opportunities to perhaps enhance or build upon those for example As shown on the screen. This is the tides portion on the town square way They have this boardwalk concept that comes out from the building A great connection to the coastal connect character of capitola But perhaps there's opportunities to accentuate that whether it's sort of the appearance of a beach scene Or a pirate ship playground those ideas again tying back to the coastal character even down to the landscape used And then the name town square It evokes a certain idea in some in people's minds I think that the the current proposal Is is beginning to head that direction and have a strong component where Definition of place where the community can gather or farmers markets can happen We've provided two examples I've actually been to both of these and there's a phenomenal farmers market up in arcadia, california northern california It's active one of the most active i've been to And then passo pass the robles down the central coast. They've got this town square I've been to some concerts there. They have some summer concert series again this sort of idea of Creating a place where the community can gather. I think there's opportunities to expand on that concept As scott touched on the building intersection corners do provide that opportunity for wayfinding and that carries down to the public realm There's already examples of this in the village We've highlighted here stockton avenue and monterey on this idea where there's seeding Landscaping a little curb curb change something that happens that informs Someone that this is a changing element in the public realm It's also an opportunity to meet your friend if you're heading one direction or the other whether on a bike or walking And then solar axis john touched on this I think our concerns are are mainly focused on the Common spaces in the in the residential Although there are some concerns along town square away Shown on the screen here. You've got a common open space courtyard c in building a that's located generally here We're concerned that there's going to be a lack of solar access there In other areas of the project that the private common open space for the residential has been pushed to the edge Or carried down to the ground plane Great opportunities for solar axis. I think some refinement there could be merited And then lastly public art, I think As you drive around capitol like we did on our site tour. It's all over the place murals The surfboards and the medians. I mean it's phenomenal I think it really helps accentuate the character of place And I think there's some significant opportunities to both embrace that in the public realm and sort of on the buildings as we discussed earlier Civil engineering a little bit dry and we've touched on Some of this already but sort of clarifying that connection and sort of the street width and alignments to their surrounding city context refining the grading In having our civil engineering team review this there was some areas where the grade seemed excessive Clarify storm water drainage Some of it has a very heavy emphasis on sheet flow or water across the surface Towards buildings. I'm just getting some clarification on how that works And then we heard from the applicant this evening But I'm sort of verifying with metro that the transit center location and its alignment is appropriate Some main takeaways just to kind of wrap up Pursue opportunities to further express unique coastal village character in a distinctive place throughout the project Look at refining street alignments and block links enhancing pedestrian connections to the site periphery site context Minimize parking structure appearance look for curbside parking opportunities expansion And then leaving future direction for the collective unified development division Further refinement of the commercial architecture enhancing the residential architecture to create greater variety Introduce pedestrian scale elements at the residential Integrate currently separated residential and commercial portions of the project More appropriately address project context along capitol a road refine articulation and detailing to create individuality in the buildings embracing those primary intersections on and on I don't want to belabor it but Um Next steps We'll continue to meet with city staff and the applicant to provide any clarifications on the concept design review that we provided Once a formal application is submitted as john alluded to RM will work with city staff to conduct a more thorough design review of the revised project Thanks, we'll be available for questions during the planning commission comment Thank you. I'll take over for just a minute here while our chair returns And I think the next step was to have Merlin Geyer Respond if at all and I would encourage because we have a lot of people who have been waiting a long time and probably want to Might be more beneficial to use our time to get some public input We look forward to work with rm and dressing all their comments great Thanks for that ed So I think um in light of what ed says probably we have a few people looks like you want to comment here So I think what we'll do is we'll um first ask any planning commission questions to The staff or do we just want to jump in? I think we should let the public get at this point. What's the public getting are you okay with that? And then we can ask a question So, uh, we're going to start off with those I believe let me have to make sure Chloe will set me straight if i'm wrong The green cards the one minute cards. She's taking her edge. Yes. So that means i'm On track here So if you just want to come up those of you that want to speak to have a green card We'll give you a minute to share some input and and just let me say thanks for coming out We didn't know how many people are going to get but it's it's good to see you here to get your input I'm sorry. Can you give us your name and I'm sorry. I am Marie Weiss And um, I will fully admit i'm beach biased. I would love to see the hotel idea for the village scrapped Let's put it here I think that's a great place for it. I think adding shuttles and metro and all that stuff that's already kind of infrastructure there would be great I think that would be fantastic as far as the design goes I would love again. I admit i'm biased. I would love to see more of the venetian style Six sisters style kind of reflected kind of what he was saying Rather than this progressive contemporary style. I think that's kind of Not really what capitola looks like And i'm the only other concern I have was those outdoor areas and the main street, which I think is a great idea Feels kind of hidden Inside towers. So I think most people wouldn't really know they were there It'll be hard to find it looks it doesn't look like it's really accessible from the main drags It seems like you'd have to really kind of meander to find it. So great I think thank you And I failed to mention that if you come up and give us your name so we have that for the record, that'd be great Hello, my name is elizabeth conlon. I live on 47th avenue. I would just like to state my strong support for this project I regret that it will be completed five years from now What we urgently need six hundred and thirty seven units in this area now I think not only is that new housing urgently needed So that young professionals like me Who live and work in this community can have affordable options to build our lives here I think that the shortcomings that were raised like pedestrian access Are not a reason to hold up or stall the project Based on the number of residential units that would come out of it You know, I walk around that mall area. It's not that far from where I live all the time I don't see a lot of people. I mean, this will make it slightly more friendly But let's face it. We live in capitol. We'd rather go walk on east cliff So I don't think this is ever going to become like the premier walking area Thank you Could we ask the um public to write their name down also at the Yeah, we have the roster up there I'm sorry. There is a little roster too if you could sign your name. So if we have that for our records Hi, my name is jessica evans and I live in the city of santa cruz I'm a frequent visitor to capitol and I like to Bring my kids to capitol. We typically ride bikes to capitol every couple weeks throughout the summer and we're really looking forward to the Sanctuary trail coming in and I just want to remind The architectural firm that on 38th avenue between brummer and portola. We're going to have the Sanctuary protected bike path coming in so 38th is going to be a Very important connection to the community bicycle infrastructure Throughout the whole county. Um, so I would ask um and reiterate the importance of creating more Bicycle and pedestrian infrastructure in a more welcoming Space at 38th for the entrance to the project for bicyclists and pedestrians who will be Approaching the project from that corridor To come in and to visit um and to access the amenities. Thank you. Thank you jessica Hi, good evening. My name is tina andrietta I don't live in capitol right now, but I did for almost 30 years I would like to see more bicycle Bicycle and pedestrian paths that also connect with the rail Line right there at 38th. I concur with the woman that was behind me jessica Um, I would like the um architects to instead of driving around Write a bicycle and walk around the community I would also like the whole perimeter to have a wider bicycle and pedestrian path I ride my bicycle along um capitol road 41st clairs and um I Almost get hit a lot More trees local trees The only area that I liked of the the design was the macy's to me all the other ones look like dead zones Cards are right up to the um building. I'd like to see more green area more park area More area for people to sit more areas to park your bicycle. I think more people are riding their bikes their bikes I'd also like you to consider This is probably way off base, but a little kitty Bicycle, you know the jump bikes like they have on migrager that that was voted down right here in capitol Along with a little skateboard park. I think that would be important and um lastly I would like to see maybe over highway excuse me over clairs To trader joes and also over to Whole Foods Have a over ramp so we could ride our bicycles and walk and um More people want to walk and bike it let's get get out of our cars and When it's more lush it will be more inviting That will want to get out of our cars and to walk and to ride our bikes and to have our dogs And our grandchildren And that's what i'm advocating. Thank you. Thank you miss ingot Any more green cards one minute cards No one more Okay, okay. How about uh, oh see that was uh, we're on the yellow cards for two minutes Hi, my name is Erin Bernal and I am a resident of capitol I was a member of the general plan committee And a couple of items within this proposal struck my attention Particularly with regard to my history and participating on the general plan of the 85 foot request Is a stark contrast to every single bit of building in this city um And the other thing is the uh proposed density for residential Oh I think it's important to keep in mind that on capitol a road There are sizable parcels that have been identified as opportunity sites for mixed use development Which would include residential So as you are thinking about 637 units at the mall It's critical to consider these opportunity sites on capitol a road As well as parcels that have been identified for um, excuse me for infill development And then going outside Of this neighborhood. We also have opportunity sites identified in the Bay avenue area So keep that in mind The anticipated population growth of 12 and having that all Um come together in one small area. That's a huge impact It's important to review land use goal number five within the general plan That talks specifically about size and scale and maintaining integrity of character Um for the city, which is a very important and often cited element throughout the general plan Ooh Did you get that with my voice? Thank you, Aaron. Yeah That's it. I'm just gonna send my name. No, you did you have something else you want to finish with? Or are you done? I thought you were done. I'm sorry. No, that's all right I'm I'm done. Okay. Yeah Thank you everybody and my name is Andrew golden crance Um, I'm here with an organization called copa. We represent 28 nonprofits throughout the county faith institutions school districts community organizations And one of our core values Is affordable housing? I personally am a resident of aptos. I'm a member of temple bethel Which is a founding member of copa and we have 60 of our congregational families who are capital residents I'm struck by the beginning of the staff presentation Where you said the first public benefit that you identified was housing affordability And we know that the county is 11,000 units short of affordable housing The median income household income in capitol is 69 thousand dollars And so i'm wondering for 637 units of market driven housing. Who gets to live there? Current residents of capitol won't get to live there The teachers that I hire and train for a living won't get to live there Nurses and firefighters won't get to live there And so I really want to stress that for a project of this scope that Pardon me that to achieve a substantial community benefit You want to make sure that this housing is going to have the maximum number of affordable units for people who currently live here If the goal is to attract technology workers from over the hill Then you are inevitably looking at more people sitting on the freeway Locked up in traffic trying to get back and forth to work and I don't see anybody arguing that that improves the quality of life around here So I would stress and we are happy to work with staff with commissioners with city council members over time To find strategic partners that will help us to increase the affordability quotient for the maximum benefit for The people who are already here. Thank you very much. Thanks, Andrew You can go ahead and step up He's signing his name great Hello chair welch members of the commission. My name is ken thomas. I'm a copa leader with a pc united church in Santa Cruz. I'm also a long-term county resident As andrew was saying copa How we work together in relationship as we Share stories among our member institutions within the Monterey and santa cruz county area And from those stories come up pressures on our families and our neighbors and our loved ones And one of the stories that we hear over and over again is the lack of affordable housing um, and copa is very much in favor of Producing housing of all types throughout the county, but especially housing that would Benefit those that are most vulnerable in our community um with this project. I urged the city to and the public to Uh to to really work toward The production of low and very low income housing Usually in the affordable housing Component moderate rate housing is allowed to satisfy that requirement, but we would like to see further Housing that would be Created for people that make less money 80 percent or less than the median income And with that i'll end and again, we're we're very anxious and We want to work in relationship with everybody on this and We wish all the luck. Thank you, mr. Thomas Okay, any more yellow cards out there. How about orange cards? Here's one Hi, i'm charima koi 21 here resident and homeowner here in capitolah And I know the planning department's mission statement includes Preserving the historical character character of capitolah The new library doesn't reflect the charming six sisters look at the iconic Mediterranean look of the risk and mansion in venetian hotel The new capitolah mall proposal is the typical formula of mixed use tall building with the street through the middle Malone geyer They're very proud of their many successes where they have developed land in los angeles mountain view and other cities We're tall buildings and high density housing are welcome We do not have the infrastructure to accommodate 637 residential units and the 1100 cars that come along with them The proposal does not look like capitolah at all The contemporary motifs look like any newly developed land in america the village look presented here in no way looks like capitolah village There's more streets the grid Main street time square city look urban downtown major public streets We can do better than that Say no to santana row Thank you My name is rory johnson i'm a 40 year resident of uh capitolah almost 40 years And I live right across the street from the mall And I have watched when I moved in there were cows across the street So I have seen the development of the bombs uh Well branch and all of that And so I look with great interest at this I'm basically in favor of the whole project. I think that uh Any walk through the mall these days, uh, it's a lonely place and needs a little peppy energy I like the idea of the road going through I think that's an excellent Change up And The apartments on 30 I live right on capitolah road. So literally I'm like right across the street The 38th and capitolah road apartments Um That is not a good look that is way too much across the street are One-story little things. So that's a major bump I'm not opposed to high buildings, but I think you can do a lot with architecture And I don't see This looked like a cut and paste Thing for the architecture And generally I would say all of the architecture We need to hold uh hold them to a better standard They they are coming to us a little disadvantaged because They're mall developers. So that's what we're getting And we have our community here that um Would like to see something very unique and very different I'm also the chairman of the arts commission here in capitolah and I would uh Encourage the developers to do their own project A public art is not putting paintings on the walls is a very specific guideline that Uh is in place And we would love to meet with someone from the project to make sure that they understand that Public art is a very specific thing that they're required on this project and it's a fairly substantial amount of money with What they're doing So I would encourage them to come to us with uh with their own project We can do it through the commission, but I'd love to see them come up with something And uh You know the capitol the 41st avenue area in terms of capitolah has always been like the other Okay capitolah is the village 41st avenue is like the other place the and um, we have a very unique opportunity right now to Change that with this development And specifically with the name of the development You know we have the village And we have an area the upper village Where gales is and that kind of pulls the village and it kind of pulls the upper village. It kind of makes it part of the community Okay, I have heard nothing about this presentation that is pulling this project Connecting it to the community. It's still the other Okay, but with a simple, uh Appropriate naming of the project. I think we could change that Uh west village Now becomes Uh the village the upper village the west village now it becomes one village Just with that one naming It becomes part of that where are you going to go shopping? I'm going I'm going shopping at the west village And you know, you're going to capitolah And you know where you're going in capitolah And I would really encourage a further thought Uh, we're kind of getting the mall developer name And I would love it if If we were thinking about capitolah In the village Great. Thank you, mr. Johnson, and I I'm sure that they would be interested in working with our our Cultural commission to uh, yeah, we look forward to that Okay, any more People that like to share comments. Oh, there we go Hello folks, uh, I'm ron berk Like you former planning commissioner. I really appreciate the time that you folks have put together to Give it something that's got some feasibility to it Um Change is definitely overdue the mall is definitely overdue. It is a dulling place. We've got to do something with it So welcome to Um, we're welcome to do something here. I like the vibrancy of the project Uh, it addresses needs an internal plan update. Um, the committee I was part of Open air space between buildings community open spaces. It's approachable Relocate in the transit center away from 41st avenue A development somewhat spread out some landscaping over just hardscape and distribute circulation. Those are all really wonderful things I do have some concerns though. I think they've been largely echoed and I apologize if I'm repeating something here as I've already said There's a lot of scale and basting of the block buildings is very large It doesn't really belong in capitolah that that kind of massing the mass is begging for tiered setbacks and breaking up into sections uh the needs, um Significantly more building articulation capitolah also is not urban. It's it's lacking in some identity It doesn't really identify with capitolah at its core We need lower heights and not shadow spaces You should consider a destination identity including a hotel And it was a really good idea to help balance the daytime and evening traffic and people just staying in parking It's missing a lot of ways the character and charm of capitolah, which has been eluded to by several people It needs more unstructured space with meandering pathways natural elements Parking that's a whole separate issue by itself. I won't go into everyone talks about that It's not an island the circulation ingress and egress of the property from the surrounding area Needs to be seriously considered 41st avenue aside from highway one is the busiest thoroughfare in the whole county It's already got problems of its own Adding to that it's not an island. We have to seriously consider those impacts Um We need to also limit the sight line distances of the roads that discourage speeding through traffic People will go through the community if they can to get someplace faster And also it might be a good idea to diversify some of the revenue-generating businesses for the city Including professional businesses to balance again the evening and the daytime activities Incremental incremental costs to the city with excess housing I think that's incomplete thought there Make sure what I really want to make sure is that this one single project does not consolidate all of your rena numbers And affordability housing in just one location. Those need to be spread out throughout the city So I hope and strive for the collective best for our city And remember Mike Termini told us told us though. You're not elected. You're appointed You are the ones that form the fabric of our community visually that we see So we leave it up to you to make the right decisions for us as a community This is your one chance in our lifetime to make sure the project has done right and please don't let us down Thank you Okay anybody else We are going to have other opportunities at the city council meeting coming up, but you're here already so there we go I didn't plan to say anything, but here I am my name is Laurie Hill and This project's time is due And I appreciate the presentation tonight. I appreciated the presentation. You did it them all You're you're you're pulling us in you're drawing us in I really appreciated what you gentlemen had to say because You're the brains And you have a way of putting the right words on some of the thoughts that we kind of conceptualize This thing about making sure that there's natural light in people's living space You know, you can see that in these projects. We can't by just looking at the drawing. So thank you for that kind of work I valued it Affordable housing. Yes. Yes. Yes. A lot of affordable housing at the site. I mean transportation is there It's an important part of this. We also know it's a delicate balance between residential and commercial in order to make this project affordable to the developer and also make it work but i'm also sensitive to Making sure that the revenue that is produced at this site covers the expenses that the city is going to be incurring To support this site and we know that housing doesn't always bring in Enough revenue to cover the city services that are necessary for it. So I know it's a delicate balance But to make sure that our city services get the funds that they need To serve the site and to and to best serve the community Public art is really important to me. I appreciated everything that Roy Johnson said I would like the public art to reference the area's roots And the fact that it is sitting on exactly where the begonia The begonia fields were Acres and acres of begonia blossoms. I would love to see some reference to that in in the public art And I am looking for a rotational gallery space For art. I just I just put help put together the capital of plein air event that was a capital arts and cultural commission Item and you know one of the things that came up as well, you know, where could we Show our art for sale after the event so rotational gallery space would be great And thank you for your work and I know you have a lot of work in front of you Thanks, lori Okay, anybody else All right seeing none then I guess I'll come back to the commission and I should go back to um I'm sorry. Um, one more long guy or do you would you have something you need to respond to? It was said by or is it something we can uh, I guess clean out of you as we have our questions. So is that all right? Okay Okay Okay, great, then I'll bring it back to um, looks I think we're back to planning commission to have discussion and Questions Some questions if you have questions first and then we'll have our discussion questions for both staff and marlon geyer the I'm curious from a lone geyer. I guess first question is Where did you come up with the number of 637 units? Was that driven by something? I believe that's exactly 20 units per acre That's the maximum number of housing units were allowed to have on the site per the current zoning guidelines So your goal was to put a your preference was to maximize the housing You know on the site that was the goal we gave to our architects was you know, we're allowed 20 units per acre here on site That's what it's owned for give us a shot on what we think that looks like on the site and that was that was a starting point Um, did you have any questions or concerns about the the cosmon? Financial analysis Rebuttals anything well, I think it's I think it's early on to um, and we've been working with cosmon And we also have an economic analysis done as well Um, it's just early on and type of retail is going to drive that economic process as well. So Um But we will work through that wouldn't have a problem with our math or their assumptions or anything. We will work through there Did you um We responsible for the uh san antonio center in mountain view. Was that one of your projects? That was me Yeah, so I I'm glad because I took a trip up there to take a look at it and I don't have some comments I just want to make sure that was yours. So I it is. Yeah, we just completed phase two on that project It was that was a phase project from our acquisition in 2010 through recent completion of phase two Just this year So I talked to I went in one of the apartment buildings and talked to staff there and they were unaware of Your name Well, we recently sold the apartment complex to brookfield and so they are the new owner and they probably don't know my name Well, I mean or below guy, right? I mean, right? It's a new it's a new management company that's been there for less than a month the The amount of parking that you have the physical Lots is that appropriate is it excessive Is that there's a room to cut into that? It actually represents a significant reduction from the park in this there today There's a parking of five per thousand a parking ratio on the site today as required by the the rea The agreement from all the major tenants on the site We're proposing to reduce that a retail parking ratio down to four per thousand and again That's likely the minimum that companies like coals target Ross macy's will accept as a parking ratio at the center So we see it as a great reduction in addition. We're looking into a shared parking analysis that we'll look at not only The entertainment uses as well as regular retail uses and trying to Uh Show demonstrate and as a part of the the environmental analysis How we can share parking on site? We think that four per thousand is a pretty good goal to get down to from five per thousand today And and again, we're trying to internalize a lot of that parking as well and disperse it throughout the site the the Because we're using some of the parking areas for housing and other entertainment uses and other major tenant uses um We're trying to we're trying to Create the parking field that's out in front on 41st where it exists today By the word is not restriping that we're completely redoing that in order to if you saw on the plan previously We're actually installing planters and there's water quality treatment down the centers of all these parking areas So we're trying to capture and redo all that parking But our parking ratio what we see is a great reduction from what's there today The minimum is going to be required by the anchor tenants that have site plan control The reason I ask is i'm not sure whether or not There's going to be excessive parking in other words, there's going to be plenty of parking or whether or not There's going to be Spillover into adjacent neighborhoods are adjacent A shopping centers because there's not enough parking supplied. I don't know we don't see that We think that we think there's adequate supply of parking and and the parking that we're providing for the apartment There's plenty of parking available for them as well If there's if there's a need for we additional weekend parking We find that those residents tend to fill up the surface part not fill up and use some of the access parking that's around the site But we don't think there's any spillover concern whatsoever Thank you, and I just have one question for rm rrm So I uh I'm dangerous because I have one One lousy textbook that I read and it seems like your your Recommendations like match up pretty well with what's in here even though this was written in 1961 I guess it's still appropriate My one of the questions that had struck me as odd though was your block length concern Because when I read the block length section of this it seemed to be more of a concern of Um The evolution, you know, you want to be able to have Not dead zones and have It really had more of a new york. Yeah, how is this gonna the city going to evolve and I didn't think that applied to this Approach is is that Did you talk a little bit more about block length? Uh, certainly I'll I'll do my best and I'm a huge jane jacob's fan. So, um, I that's a great read It's um, I think still very pertinent to Any urban fabric in any city today? The the block length is about the pedestrian experience and that that's ultimately You can look at a number of of developments and and the the city Geometry and Say hey 600 might work and in places it could depending on what the experience along that 600 feet is I think where we saw concern Especially the long 38th where it's a primarily residential environment. There's not a lot of engagement for the pedestrian Beyond the leasing office and some some vehicular circulation So it's um, it's not a very pedestrian friendly environment and that's that's the ultimate goal I think there's some great strides that the applicant is doing to take what is Would be defined as a super block anywhere else as the mall and look for ways to start to slice and dice that already I think there may be even further opportunities for that to make sure the pedestrian Um, it is engaged along the way I I hope that addressed you. No. Yeah, that that does. Thank you Um, I think those are all my questions Okay, any questions for Either r.m. Or On the on the theater Being the focus of the central part of the town square You know, we read about theaters just are really having a difficult time in this day at age What do you propose if the theater doesn't make it? If it's not a viable business that continues to operate there We've seen a great change in theater operations over the last 20 years And we've been doing this for with Malone guy for the last 20 years And we've seen a great resurgence in the theater and how they They do their marketing and what they the experience that they provide and the The bigger chairs the fewer people per audience to reserve seating the amenities they provide in terms of sound systems Just a different type of environment. They're providing has led to a resurgence in theaters And they're having great success these days. In fact, we're finding theaters are are Wanting to be as a center point of most of our redevelopment projects and they're successful doing that But they're just one component by having that entertainment feature offered at the center We're seeing a resurgence of nighttime and weekend activity That then also helped to support the restaurants that also want to be at the site These restaurants want to be where these entertainment venues are And so they build on each other and now it becomes now becomes a place to be It's not for entertainment and for dining and for activity So we're seeing these these theaters these days really be the driver of a different component the retail is changing And so we see less of the large format retails and more of an experience driven These lifestyle centers that they're trying to create an environment that people want to go hang out in And having an entertainment theater as a part of that is is as a center focal point of that strategy And if they go I guess we just don't see them going away. We see them an integral part of our redevelopment so obviously, you don't know what your tennis will be right now, but But to include family oriented type entertainment Whatever that may be. I know you have the dog park Yeah, but what what else do you propose in there? What what kind of commercial? Structures where you have that can accommodate those kinds of things We're just now beginning to scratch the surface of of the leasing activity Because we have the target the macy's the cold and we will have a theater There is strong tenant demand from the soft goods retailers the type of tenants that would be in this kind of a redevelopment as well as The the smaller shop the local mom and pop type tenants that are also drawn to these We have a lot of opportunities for smaller local businesses to be a part of our center as well Local restaurants, but also national tenants to create a really good balance in here So so we don't have any tenant names today that are coming that we announced or so-and-so is coming We don't have any we just we don't but that that will be our next process as soon as we Really finalize where the buildings are going to be where their frontiers are what signage they have Then we'll start and by the way, this is all conceptual I mean the idea is that we'll have a tenant. Yeah, I need You know, I need a bigger space. I need a smaller space, but we were really wanting to Then we start massaging the plan and start fixing how that Works for those tenants and I talked about the facade changing as well for those individual tenants So there'll be a lot of changes as we begin to talk to these different tenants on the main street It doesn't appear that the area is wide enough to accommodate Like outdoor restaurants things of that nature Yeah, the scale is hard right because we're looking at something and so we see something on the screen But what we have are is there, you know thousands of square feet The the sidewalks have been designed not only with extra space On the corners and where we anticipate having restaurants and on these plazas We've actually designed if we can blow up into those landscape plans and I think you have blow-ups in your set too You can see we're identifying outdoor eating areas specifically built into the landscape design To accommodate those outdoor eating areas at one of the corners of the main street We actually cut into the building to create more kind of a covered but yet outdoor dining area So we're really focused on on creating those Where's the right place for the restaurant to be and then creating the outdoor dining Rounded but still plenty of space for people to circulate on the landscape or the the hardscape around those dining areas Integral parts the outdoor dining experience are parking garages resident only no they're shared We're working on the the amount of sharing But the idea is that the ground floor and potentially even the second floor would be for the retail tenants And then the the the area above or again depending on How we structure the the the residence or who the residence is is it senior or is it Whatever to where maybe there's even less of a parking demand We can work on shared parking agreements with the residential as well shared their share What's the phasey? Wish I knew the I've got it We've got a general idea that that the target the coals the Macy's they say open during the redevelopment as well as the perimeter The Ross the parts that are not owned We the The residential over the retail component That has to that's the longer build. That's probably what he talked about. That's the 24 to 30 month construction It just takes longer and so and that construction has to get done before we can open the ground floor retail tenants So that's the longer part phase One and then setting to phase two phase one We can see actually doing the demo and building that main street Early or at least the theater component of it the pads out on the street and the area in front of Macy's And and target potentially we those are single story wood frame buildings Those can go pretty quickly as well as the redevelopment of the parking areas around there and the relocation of metro So that's kind of the phase big phase one and phase two is the continuation of the residential Then there's a second phase residential up against the target there That would be the third phase residential and that's really market driven demand when when that comes online We can't bring that many housing units on the line at one time So that's got to be phased but the first phase of the residential will be the one with a retail tenants facing 41st Okay, thanks Courtney um, I think First of all, I really enjoyed reading all the feedback you guys had for the whole development It was I agreed with almost every point and I really enjoyed your package as well. I liked all the renderings it um A big question in my mind In reading through everything was why is the the housing concentrated primarily in one area? Is is there any way to pull it out over? um The the the buildings that you have acquired so like the the coals and and I know those are leased right now But is there any way to within the renovation put some more housing over there and decrease the height? We can't build over coals And we can't build on top of or on top of the maces or target parcels So so that was a constraint of ours that we couldn't build over Um for finding for the lease reasons. I mentioned earlier with the chilis and the ulta. We need to leave them in place They have long-term lease control So that prohibited us from tearing down that section of the mall to build over top of there So what are we left with we're really left with a seratage That we acquired uh next and so it just based on site constraints We still needed the the the retail tenants that we want to bring that want to come to the center That are are going to phase 41st. They still need parking in front of their store, too So we still needed to park some kind of a parking field to satisfy those tenants Demands for parking so that really left the the area kind of in between the target parking structure Which has to remain can't build over the top of and and where we're kind of stuck by needing the parking for the retail And and fate then also constrained by where we take the main street So we were after looking through this and going through by Really a lot of different schemes trying to figure this out That was where the the the residential needed to land to work within the constraints of the rest of the site Okay, but again, we take to heart the comments received in terms of massing and and design and blockiness the need to Create, you know more sun angles and and address some of the architecture We get it Next next go around, you know, we'll we'll be we'll be addressing all this potential step backs and all that We'll be addressing all that um I think another level of that question would be just the overall a deeper dive into The experience of living in a place like this. It's very foreign for people, you know, that have grown up here We don't we don't live in seven story structures. So um In coming home per se at the end of the day, you're parking in a big structure You're parking in this expansive parking lot. You're walking to your home, you know, you're walking down this very Haul, you know a hallway possibly to get to your apartment. I'm curious as to You know, I think you guys mentioned it in your review um The lack of outdoor space the lack of engagement with the outside world, you know And just in in really developing that as the living experience of actually participating as an inhabitant in this structure So so that's certainly something we look at and try to design for the way these parking structure design Is that you're typically your parking spaces on your level if I'm on the fourth level my parking stall is on the fourth level So I drive up to that level and I'm not walking through a hallway. I'm just walking straight into my My unit that faces out. So the idea of the having this wrapped product for this parking structure hidden from everyone else Uh that allows easy access for that pedestrian if I'm grocery shopping I show up with my bags. I walk out on my level straight into my apartment that is now facing Outdoors and so plenty of sunlight. Yeah, there's probably a few units that need some work But those are few and far between the majority of them are, you know, brightly lit The idea that people then they don't have to take care of a yard But these these apartments are highly magnetized not only magnetized with with uh, there's barbecue areas and fitness areas and and other pools You know, the residential b has a rooftop A rooftop deck on top of the parking structure with a pool areas and cabanas with ocean views Out, you know, so it's after space the other area has a courtyard carved out facing 41st with outdoor barbecues and a pool And so these are magnetized areas in addition to that Hey, I don't have to get my car to go to the store or to work out or to get a cup of coffee or take my drag I walk out my front door and I take the elevator down the ground floor. I'm there It's right there if I want to want my dog or dog park or restaurant It's all right here So those are the highly magnetized areas that draw people to these type of units and they're they're very successful And and they're not for everybody. There's a lot of people that would rather live in a single-story house The nice yard and garden all the people don't want any part of that They want someone to take care of all that for them They want the amenities and they want they want this kind of living and so it's it's different It's different for some of us older folks, you know, gee, I can't imagine living there But the amenities make up for the loss of having a yard Is there any potential to Utilize the height that you guys are trying to achieve the seven stories and some type of architectural fashion to where it would be Not so just stacked up and down and I think that was addressed in your review as well But it's a math and exercise. Yeah, and how can you step and create pushbacks and planes and separate levels and step backs from streets and Yes, you can do that. And yes, we As far as charging stations for vehicles, I think you touched on that with We didn't even scratch the surface on all of the sustainability features going into from low impact development Utilizing solar and recharging stations, you know, there's the california green initiative that we know There's standards that are built in for not only bike lockers and bike parking and locked areas but also then You know Shower facilities for the people that are biking there and around and and all the other, you know The lead equivalent that is the green building standards all those get built into the project Terms stormwater treatment and permeability of services and all all of that gets built in that That's a we'll be taking a deep dive with staff on all of that to make sure that we're that we're hitting all the marks with that But it's a it's a big part of what not only the public expects, but our residents expect and that we provide I think that's good for me right now. Thank you very much How are we doing there commissioner do you have any questions? Are we doing questions? Yeah, we're just doing questions No questions. Okay Any any other questions? I think we have to give them a rest. Yeah, great. Thank you. Thank you David and uh, all right Comments you've been sitting there all for quite There you go I just wonder what we should do here because we've been here two hours and The diminishing returns when a meeting lasts for too long Um, so I'm maybe I'll hit a couple points, but I you know, I hope We don't go on for a couple hours here tonight if we are going to go on for a couple hours We should probably take a break or Uh, I don't know how much my comments are pretty brief. I don't know. All right. Well, let's give it a try So big picture. I did take a break though. So Big picture. Uh, I think it's a terrific, uh response to the need to Re-envision that property and I've been involved from the standpoint of chairing the general plan committee involved in the preparation of the new zoning ordinance I feel that this is a really uh, excellent effort to Accomplish what we were most of the things that we were trying to accomplish in those processes At least it's a great start. I'm not going to get into the the uh, all the details of the design I think it's too early and I don't they're professionals here that are way better at that than I am so You know, I kind of look at the more policy issues I do think that the way the staff has gone about this Is terrific in terms of hiring experts to interface and we've got we've got a team here and it's a collaborative effort That's what I like about it. A lot of our big developments have been You know, really contentious and I see this one so far at least going through and a much more I mean, there's some people who aren't going to like it. There's always going to be people But it seems to be processing in a very in a great way I have issues with the name and uh as in Roy first of all Capitola is never referred to as a town Los Gatos is a town. I think maybe Los Altos might be a town, but we're a village. We never use the word town so To suddenly have a town square It doesn't it doesn't work for me. It's also not a town square. We don't have any official Buildings there. We don't do any hangings there. We don't It's not really a town square in function We don't we're not a town in name So I think we need to work on that a little Come up with and all my other reason is is that that scott's valley has been working for 10 years on its town square So, you know, we don't need two town squares in the county of Santa Cruz So anyway Portable housing is a big issue for me And I think you responded to the first time he came here and we talked about that and all of a sudden he came back With 637 units, so I think that's great as far as the affordable component I think it should be rental for sure Don't get into any of those. It's for sale My recommendation affordable Units because there are too many problems with them So we need to have a lot of affordable rental units and I think you can be creative In terms of how you do this The that's what happened when the bills of capitol, which is a project on 46 Came through and it had an affordable housing unit and they kind of came up with their own plan I think you can work on something Uh creative, but I think it's really important and that's a key element of the project as far as I'm concerned As far as the you wanted feedback on the public spaces the standard for The height exception Is pretty vague and I just looking at what's evolving here. I think you're going to satisfy it quite easily So I mean to me it's not really a big issue Okay So I don't know Run a little long. I'm usually pretty short, but this time uh This time I think I have a few things to say because I mean staff asked us to comment on the rrm Issues and so I it took some time to actually do that and First of all, the big picture is um The the cosmot mont analysis disturbed me a lot It looks like we're going to lose our downtown or our excuse me our village town square our village hotel Uh swenson seems to be backing off on that now. So our uh opportunities for fiscal Um solvency are becoming more Concerning so when I look at this mall, I say wow, okay Here's our opportunity to get healthy and then the analysis says no, no, no, this could be a 75k year loss And so I just as soon we redistrict this agricultural and turn it back into begonia fields If that's the if that's the answer and so Before I would want to go for this i'm You mentioned you're working with uh with with that and you're going to try to figure all this out, but you know I would want to know that the city council has already created this area as a community facilities district So that you know, we are in fact making a lot of money on this You've got the hotel We know it's going to be a successful one because that'll get us all a lot of t o t um Or the analysis says it's it's largely related to the size and so you know you go from 637 units to 437 units or some other number that says okay now this projects Gives us a lot of you know a lot of income and To me that's the big issue um With regards to my overall impression of this I was I was also concerned with the concentrated population there and the sudden 12% increase in our population All the unknown issues that could Um that could create just by that sudden change in our In our population um I um I know you went to a trouble of creating a uh try to create a smaller community of a visual uh Area that's very pedestrian friendly and whatnot. I'm a little concerned some of the comments. I think rung true that this is uh Uh, it kind of faces inward that it's all on this town square way That capitol road is kind of like shouldered out perhaps and that uh, there's not a lot of A lot of reaching out to the surrounding areas. Uh, I I I agree with that comment I think a lot of um rrms comments are like I mentioned before are are based on a common Urban urban design truisms Which to me boils down to just the notion of eyes on the sidewalks, right? That's kind of her thing eyes on the sidewalks so I'm looking at Your 40th street frontage um Yeah, you have residential over that, but it's not really connected to the street You know, is that is that a sidewalk? Is that an area where you know? You talked about stoops and You know are there going to be eyes on the street now Eyes on the street aren't just the residents looking over the street, but it involves multi-use which you've touched on that So we want we want people there Using different things you want multiple ages, which the portable affordable housing thing Would uh would address we want to be there all hours So that people are coming and going and you want multiple incomes I mean Jane Jacobs talks about old buildings, but effectively that just means low income. So um I would just in general in terms of a general comment take the eyes on the sidewalk thing to heart and and go with that Having said that however, I then visited san antonio center and I said well This is great I went in and and looked into walked into the apartment complex Which seems to be very much this seems to be very much based on that And I was very impressed It's very welcoming. Like you say, there are a lot of areas for for people to gather I saw a lot of a lot of people using it I was there at four o'clock in the afternoon on a wednesday and there were people there with their laptops tapping away And everybody felt very comfortable so So I guess I you know, there's eyes on the halls so to speak So I think the residential limit of itself is is okay Like I say, I was very impressed with it I did take the time to interview people while I was there And I was concerned about this eyes on the sidewalk thing. So I asked some people. Well, are you are you concerned? There's there seem to be some dark alleyways or you know service entrances and this and that Do you feel comfortable walking around here and the answer is yes, there's There's no fear of being mugged or crime or this or that that people very feel very comfortable in there even though Maybe all of the you know specific details of this book aren't adhered to so So I I that so that doesn't concern me as much They were concerned about the traffic That they can't Cross san Antonio or El Camino or whatever that As that it's It's not connected to this surrounding area. So when she said safety says, yeah, I'm scared to heck to death across the street because it's just not You know, I have to jaywalk here and there because there's no proper crosswalks and this and that so, um I thought that was an interesting Comment so we want connectivity to adjacent business And then you want to be able to get across the street to the aisle property and the king plaza and You know, by the way, it's no longer the bamboo garden. It's now the conal palace or Anyway, people are going to want to go across that street and eat there because it's great Um The bike passed that I talked to a biker and he says Yeah, I ride my bike, but I walk it through here because you don't ride a bike through a parking lot. It's too dangerous so So that I think all the biking comments were valid uh The dog park was a huge hit. So I highly encourage the dog park. It was busy I talked to the dog people They said, uh And i'm sorry i'm getting into the details, but they're designing this dog park As I said, so they said don't break it up in the middle with all these patios and things they dogs need to run They want to slip on a little Anyway, and uh, one guy said it would be great if there was a Little dog park and a big dog park More shade they had a lot of questions about the dog park, but that was that's a great thing the dog park um I don't know should I go down all of the specific issues that rrm came out? I should have mentioned this just to keep us on track a little bit I was supposed to say this I did and they have the slide up here So to your left peter are the five kind of components questions we're supposed to be looking at Right. Also, I think it might be helpful If you agree with the comments of rm's findings within the design review just to Say that you agree and if there's any points that you didn't agree with or that you'd like That are different from what rm gave feedback on to highlight those points that are different from their report So I I had I didn't agree with all of them um I think in general that when they started going into the mixer of detail the mix the mixture of materials and colors I think that's getting too deep into the fashion east of world And we should let the architects do their job and and I would um, You know, I I wouldn't Press those issues as a as a commissioner um Yeah, the massing I think that was already an address. I agree with that especially on capital avenue And Leave it at that. You talked about you touched on all these other things. So In general, I think um It's a great project If we can handle the finance thing, then I'm all for it I agree with the With the review that our rm has presented. I think I would like to see um In addition A consideration of a hotel um More circulation path for outside use just between shopping centers adjacent shopping centers adjacent um neighborhoods also All up with the next one when I remember but um, but yeah, I I do agree with miss points that rm brought up You can always jump back. Thank you Yeah, I too agree with rrm. I think you guys are spot on on the comments I set up here 40 years ago in 1975 and six and seven when we were approving the mall out there at that time capitol is Soul economic driver was the village and a handful of merchants on 41st avenue that weren't very many at the time So we saw it as an economic machine that was just going to allow us to do so many things We developed every park in town. We built the community center the gym Spot and restored the wharf did all kinds of things And so I think that is the key to approving this thing. It has to be an economic driver like the original one was And right now I have to share my concerns with commissioner wilks That we have to find some way to Incorporate into that design Changes or whatever to make that economic machine work for capitol and My own personal opinion is probably a reduction of the housing units I'd love to see a hotel in there because I think that would generate Substantial revenue for the community would take the pressure off the village site and Moving it moving that direction I just there's three main concerns I I share and that I hear in the community that rl rm rm touched on and that's the massing along capitol a road That just that long stretch of multi-storey buildings there that aren't broken up That's a major concern. I think in the community that I've heard uh traffic, which would probably be Reduced somewhat of the housing number of housing units were reduced and uh, let me see oh in the overall height That kind of touches on the massing there So, you know, I'm sure the eir is going to address traffic We had an opportunity to underground the utilities back in 1977 and it failed on a 3-2 vote I'd like to see an attempt to do that. I'm not sure if that's possible Based on the costs One concern I have that rm didn't address is the proximity of the new entrance the main street to 41st avenue intersection and Right now and I was sharing this with staff I think the intersection at cap road and 41st avenue probably operates at about a level c And there's nothing maybe less. Okay, there's nothing that backs up From a from an adjacent stop light that jams up into that intersection like it does further down from the freeway declares So I'm just concerned about the traffic and the proximity and I sure it'll be addressed in an eir But uh, that's that's a concern. I would like to see addressed and then for staff I would like to encourage staff to work with the county To take down the barrier at 40th avenue and open it up. I think that would be just a really big Traffic bonus to leave some of the congestion on 41st avenue and especially when this mall gets finished You know that was put in there at the suggestion of supervisor dan forbes back in the In the 70s when the current mall was developed to protect those six houses there And I think the time has come when that barrier has to be taken down So we need to lean on the county for that 2025 completion date has now moved to 2030 Those are my comments I just I have a concern about the sign. I just don't I just don't like it at all. I'm sorry That um, just having a More aesthetic approach to incorporating it with the rest of capital. It would be preferable I I concur. So I think we're done. I don't have anything to say. No Actually, I really don't have a lot to say I have a lot of notes I even put posters because I it makes you look like you did your homework. I heard so, um I I really am happy that we have rm and john on board to help And I hope you guys are working. It sounds like you guys are working good together Because as I read through their document, it's pretty much spot-on to You know my my perception of my thoughts of what we're going to end up with Maybe it's one cabinet and maybe I'm not really totally understanding I hear a little bit of this pedestrian on 38th avenue concern and my thought was Uh When I I'm totally out on the whole square concept Yeah, that doesn't the town square doesn't fit town doesn't fit the square doesn't fit And uh, and I really don't think we need open spaces so much like, uh, you know, we looked at the past robles and Those because I think we'll end up more like Santa Cruz And we don't want to look like Santa Cruz where we have a place to sleep during the day and And uh, you know go to starbucks and stuff. So but I what I really think we do need is more of a opportunity that To maybe close 38th at the tunnel and And all the way up to town square whatever you're calling that road now We'll think of village road whatever that's going to be And open that up a little bit. So it's more bicycle and pedestrian only and you know We hear this a lot about our own village down here close off the espanade make it only pedestrians This is a great opportunity to do that in and um, I won't get into the architecture my wife won't let me pick paint colors from my own garage So I think there's some really good people that can help you do that We have some people here that can help you do that that's out of my league, but As as we traveled around my wife and I we went to different shop And so there's no one this was coming up We've kind of looked around and and a couple of places that we experienced that we really enjoyed was this restaurant Area that was open with a like an open area that had a theme A water fountain water park you've got this concept of boardwalks and The tides and the estuary will make a little water feature that looks like an estuary Make the boardwalks so they don't go to target because that's not really a boardwalk But maybe they go out to a pier that goes to the estuary that is surrounded by Shops and one thing about capitol. I think I think you're right. Um, I don't know if it was Scott or math that said it but It's hard to put your finger on exactly what capitol is It's kind it is kind of eclectic, but one thing I can tell you that is it's very Much of an outdoor town santicrews is Go to go along pleasure point someone mentioned we don't need any more walking area, but What we do need is gathering areas You go to any place that has outdoor seating on a sunday and you're going to wait in line You you go along 41st avenue at the end down there by Portola and 41st and some of the restaurants you have to wait to eat there Even in the Esplanade. It's a it's a very busy area. Let's make this What do you call it west village area? Let's make the west village area an area that You're going to go to the theater, but you have an outside seating restaurants a whole area that you can Hang out together and Maybe get out of the weather if you need to but we have pretty Average weather around here that allows us to be outside Most of the time so for me, I'd rather I would I don't think we need all those roads crossing through This is just me thinking but more of an area that allows Some thoroughfare. I I understand having the village road that goes to clairs from 41st, but Maybe the one at 38th ends And on the public benefit side And I'm glad someone brought this up the bicycle because it's someday. I hope before I'm gone We have this rail trail then and it'd be great if the rail trail came right up 38th avenue right into that bicycle pedestrian corridor To go to starbucks or whatever's going to be in there So really I think that's all I had to say. I think everybody else kind of has as I have a lot of notes here, but my Neighbor commissioner over here to the right of me is going to keep me on on track here Yeah, the materials and colors I I I don't have anything to say ariam. It's a good job there I think the massing is it was a concern. I don't have a concern about the height as long as you can articulate The buildings. I think You know, I noticed that the the open area that you do have is in front of macy's which On one hand, I like it because the sun can get in there and people like the sun Uh, the downside for me is that's also where the transit area is and I don't know About having to how you mix that but I'll let you guys figure that out Santana row. I don't think we need a Santana row. I really don't I mean we we came we thought about that for years and Capitola, we're going to have the Santana row concept Restaurants along the street where cars are parking and driving Um, it doesn't appeal to me as much as having that open area that's closed off with a Central theme and the waterway in the middle or something like that is more appealing to me. So With that all in my talks and my wife will tell me what I missed later what she wanted me to say. So Any other comments or questions? No um, the next meeting is Uh with the city council next thursday Just following thursday, so you have Uh, for those of you in the audience have more time to Get your information together and go talk to the city council And uh, we look forward to working with you folks in the future. So with that I guess do we need to do a director's report? Do you have anything? I'm no director's report. Just for a second. Oh I wanted to make a point to thank marlon guyer for going through all this trouble and I know this is a The difficult process you've done it before i'm sure but um many times, but I want to I just Personally appreciate you're going through all this and working with us. Thank you very much Okay, uh commissioner comments. I will not be at the special meeting later this month We canceled that meaning right? Yes officially, but you're not going to miss anything. Oh, you canceled it? I didn't cancel it somebody did We'll send out an official notice. Okay. All right with that the meeting's adjourned. Thank you very much