 It is five o'clock and I am calling our special select board meeting to order and we have Sarah Seidman on the Zoom and Bridget on the Zoom. We have Dorenda here and Bridget on the Zoom. Don't let me forget Bridget. I think is that your wife on the Zoom, Jay Drury? I'm assuming so, yes. There's other people down below. Okay, I can't see them. Can you read them? Thank you. Paul Sermonera. Yeah. PCEO. Who is PCEO? You need their names, right? Only if they talk, right? Only if they talk. Okay, only if you talk. Shelly. Yeah. Steve Jufrin. Sandy Levine. I think that's it. 11 participants. Okay, there's Sandy. She just popped up. Okay. Does somebody need to monitor that? Yeah, I'll sit here. Oh, you do? Yeah. Okay. So do you see the same thing? Yeah, I'm letting it in. Okay. Do you want me to just move the controls over you? No. Okay. Unless you want, I mean, can you take notes and control at the same time? Yeah. Okay. We need to approve the agenda of tonight's special meeting. I do have two amendments to the agenda. First of all, I'd like to recognize Sarah, who has a few prepared remarks for us. And then I have a few prepared remarks, our town clerk, our select board assistant. Yes. And I have a few prepared remarks, not really prepared, but a few remarks before we start the general discussion of the meeting. So with that, are there any other amendments to the agenda? Is there a motion to accept the agenda? I'll move that. Thank you, Randy. Second? Oh, second. Thank you, Liz. It's been moved and seconded. All those in favor of accepting that agenda, please say aye or raise your hand. Aye. Aye. Any opposed? Okay, we've accepted the agenda. Thank you very much. So, Sarah? Yes. You're up. All right. Roots down. It's 5.1 minutes. In fact, I think I'll stand. So this is written with the best of intentions. Just want to remind the board of where you were two years ago and how much you've achieved. You've governed through a pandemic and labor shortages that would have disabled other communities. Instead, you came together and found solutions in these darkest of times. The highway department. If you'll recall our longtime road foreman surprised everyone by resigning in the fall of 2020 and what followed was pretty turbulent. A road foreman lasted only 18 months. A member of the road crew retired. Another died. Remaining members of the road crew showed up at select board meetings frequently to gripe. And they weren't the only ones complaining. I lost count of how many times I had to ask residents to be patient with the roads because the town was facing an epic labor shortage. You made some smart decisions, starting with bringing on Vic is the road commissioner and pairing him with Gary Lamell to work as a shared road foreman. You increased the pay for the highway department and offered to pay for CDL training qualifications. Fast forward to today. Eric is coming up on his year anniversary as the road foreman and the roads are in the best shape they've ever been. The phone never rings with complaints. Instead, people stopped me in the grocery store to praise the road conditions and Eric's responsiveness. The road crew is at full capacity and staffed by almost all middle sex residents. The one Montpelier member lives literally on the border. If they're grumbling, the board doesn't hear about it. Gone are the select board therapy sessions for the road crew. Any town would love to be in this position. The fire department. In February of 2021, the town hit a low when the historic Methodist Church across the street was obliterated by a fast moving fire. Responding fire departments in nearby communities complained to the board about our fire department's response. It's no secret that until then relations between the select board and the fire department were tense. Peter figured out that regular communication might go far toward improving this important relationship. And so monthly meetings with the MVFD began this January. The MVFD was welcomed into the town family as an official department. The monthly updates are enlightening, morale is up, and so is the fire department's membership. All because instead of throwing up your hands, you took action. The budget committee. Once upon a not too distant time, the budget committee consisted of a group of citizens who attended a few select board meetings and basically rubber stamped the board's annual budget proposal. Now the budget committee meets throughout the year and maintains a capital improvement plan, a capital improvement plan. Never before has the town inventoryed its assets and calculated their depreciation and replacement costs. This happened because responsive board members, like Liz, listened to the concerns of the voters at the 2020 town meeting and applied for grants that kickstarted the process. Today, Randy chimes in regularly whenever a purchase comes up to check with a capital plan. This kind of forethought and coordination will have a positive effect long after we're gone from this town hall. Listers. In the spring of 2022, I wasn't sure how we were going to come up with a grand list. Fortunately, the board made the wise decision to hire Nemerick to do the 2022 re-appraisals. We would have been in the tank were it not for that decision. Shelley and Annette applied and were thrown into the deep end that spring. Amazingly, they immerse themselves into this tough job, reaching out to the state, attending numerous trainings and practically memorizing the Lister's handbook. When property owners come in to ask questions about their appraisals, our Lister's extend themselves to be helpful and courteous and folks leave satisfied. Zoning. Kevin Thompson, coming up on his three-year anniversary this fall, has been a zoning administrator par excellence. He reviews new applications every week. He tries to assist without over-assisting prospective applicants. He works well with the DRB, which now meets, if necessary, on a said day, the last Wednesday of the month. Their hearings are professionally run, their decisions are timely, fair, and thoughtful. Gone are the days of delays. Zoning is often the first interaction new residents have with this town, so having a smart, capable ZA, like Kevin, is downright blessing. Finally, we come to the financial department. By the fall of 2021, the town office was decimated. The bookkeeper, who was also a Lister, quit. The assistant clerk, who was also a Lister, quit. Thank God, Derrinda, had the necessary bookkeeping skills and knowledge of municipal finances, not to mention the dedication to keep the town afloat. Somehow, she managed to pay the bills, write up the orders, and do payroll in between her other jobs, including putting together a budget and handle November tax payments. Today, because you, the select board, came together and agreed to increase the pay for town employees, we were able to hire a top-notch bookkeeper, an assistant clerk who's also a town resident. This office is a well-run machine with checks and balances, organization, and pleasant communication. The annual auditor sang the praises of Cheryl and Derrinda, and rightly so, we are damn lucky to have them, just as callous. You have a lot to be proud of. So does the treasurer, who assisted the board with many of these tough decisions. You are truly dedicated public servants, and you should be commended. You, the board, and you, the treasurer, deserve the utmost respect. You deserve to be treated with respect by the public, by the employees of this town, most importantly, by one another. Thank you. So before we begin the regular discussion, first of all, I would like to apologize to the other board members, and especially Derrinda for the chaos at the last meeting. I did not impose the control I should have on that meeting, and I think we all agree things got out of hand, and I hope that won't happen in the future. I would suggest, and Sarah has provided us with yet another copy of our rules of procedure, there are a couple of things that I think we need to do, and I'm more than willing to listen to what other people think. But I think one of the things we definitely need to do is when you want to speak, raise your hand, wave your hand, do something to ask to be recognized. Just don't start talking and don't respond to other board members or members of the public directly. If I fail to recognize you, and sometimes I may not see somebody out of the corner of my eye, other board members or others at the meeting can remind me that somebody wants to be recognized. But I really think that is an important element to bring good order and quorum to our meetings. The other suggestion that I have, and we don't have to decide this tonight, but Derrinda and I had a conversation this week, and one of the things that I have been concerned about for a while is it is very challenging to come to a board meeting at 4.30 in the evening, and we're all passing the orders back and forth trying to review them and have a chance to review them before we sign them. In the not so distant days, the procedure was that orders would be emailed at least 24 hours before the meeting. So we had an opportunity to look over the orders, call and ask questions if we had questions, and we didn't spend time at the board meeting worrying about the orders unless there was something exceptional. What that means is that the different organizations in town need to submit their bills and their payroll, what, Derrinda, a day earlier, two days earlier? Yeah, when Cheryl gets here on Monday morning. So 9 a.m. on Monday morning of the days there is a payroll. That way Cheryl can prepare the orders, she can email them out to us. We have a chance to review them, and that will eliminate confusion and some of the back-and-forth questions and issues at the board meetings that will also allow board members to contact either Derrinda or whoever it is if they have a question or concern about a bill. So I'm proposing, we don't need to decide that tonight, but I'm proposing that we do that. Lastly, I just want to emphasize that over the years, for the most part and almost always, we have managed to deal with the town's business in an appropriate, calm, and reasonable way. We don't attack each other personally. We don't get involved in three-way conversations. We don't introduce hearsay about what members of the community are saying about us or about other members of the board or other town officers. We conduct the town's business at our select board meetings, and that's what we should be doing. And I am going to be more diligent about stopping those conversations if they start to occur and just more diligent if I can be in running the meetings in a morally fashion. So with that, I'll open up the meeting to the other board members and we can deal with our situation. Yes, Liz? So I was thinking about this procedure of the chair recognizing people speaking, and I'm wondering if the reality is that in order for us to be effective, there is going to be conversations that happen, right? Like somebody may think of something as like, oh yeah, I'm thinking of that too, and then I might make a comment, and Vic might make a comment. And those things are natural ways that meetings are run. It's not entirely natural to be like, okay, I have a thought, I have to wait to be able to say it, and I need to want to respond to just in a process of, it's not natural, right? So I'm wondering if we can think about your role as chair is to recognize when it's starting, when there may be a potential for a heated conversation or something that goes beyond the business at hand, right? Like if we're just talking about roads and like, oh, but I thought it was blah, blah, blah, like I don't want to have to raise my hand to say, Peter, I thought it was blah, blah, blah, right? Because I might forget that thought. I want us to be able to have a constructive meeting as a team of five people and feel like we can go back and forth in a conversation without having to be recognized by the chair in order to say a word. But that it's your job, Peter, and that we as board members need to, when Peter says, okay, I need to rein this in, that we listen. Because if we don't, then we're going to have to go to this process where we raise our hands to be able to say a word. No one's going to want to be on a board like that. It's not cohesive. It's not, it's not a community. We're a community, right? Like we're here to help our community members. Somebody like Derrinda or, you know, Sarah, you know, you should be able to have a conversation around the things because these are very town related things. So I think that, that's what I'm asking is that we don't have this be so structured that we have to be recognized by you every time we want to say something. Now the people on who are not board members, yes, I believe that they should need to be recognized if they can't just chime in. But if you're a board member or you're a part of, you know, and maybe we decide that Sarah and Derrinda have to ask because they're not board members, you know, asked to say something. But like I feel like we actually work really well together until we don't. And that's where your job as chair is to make sure that we don't get to that point because we're people, right? We're humans. We have feelings. We, you know, it's not, you know, we're, we have relationships with each other. So that's all I need. So I don't disagree with that. The problem is we need as a group, as a group and as community to be polite and respectful to each other because what is not good is when people start interrupting each other, start talking over each other, you know, all that kind of stuff. As long as you wait for a pause in the conversation and then say something, I think that's fine. I mean, we've got, we've got a long way to go in terms of formalizing our meetings. So I'm not saying it has to be a hard and fast rule, but more than anything else, I want people to be respectful. If somebody's speaking, let them finish speaking. If there are multiple people who want to talk and they don't seem to be getting a chance, wave your hand and I'll recognize you and interrupt the other, the other person. I just, I just want to be sure that we can do the town's business in an orderly polite way and not with personal, personal remarks and repetitions of hearsay from outside sources and things which cause problems and bad feelings. So I think that's finalist. And I think it's fine if, if Sarin Dorenda want to operate on the same rules that the select board is operating on. That makes sense to everyone? Certainly does to me. We'll try it. I mean, we can, we can change it. I mean, I don't like, you know, I've always said one of the things I liked about our board meetings was that they were relatively informal. And for the most part, all the years, this has worked. So I don't want to have a knee jerk reaction to, to one situation, but it does mean we need to make a little, a little change to the, to our procedure. So we're following our procedure. I think that's fine. Other comments? Anyone? Randy? No, I would agree with Liz's take on that. And it really comes back to relying on the chair to step in and, and cut that stuff off. Because I do agree that having the fluid conversation and the back and forth, if it's done in the right manner and the right tone has its place and it allows for a more natural conversation. But there's, there are absolutely times where I believe that it's going to come to a point where, you know, people have differing opinions on things and it can't be a back and forth between whether it's two members of the board or the public in the board. That's when there needs to be more directed conversation at that point. So I think, and it might not just be you. It might be somebody else on the board saying, okay, let's have a little bit more directed conversation here. Yeah. Yeah. Bridget? Muting. I think that I think that all works fine. I agree with both of you, Peter and Liz. Victor? I concur. Okay. So the question is, where that leaves us now? We have a treasurer who has, I would say, informally resigned, but maybe she's formally resigned. And what do you have to add to this process, Tourinda? Well, I went away from last week's meeting very upset. I believe I was, I was called out for doing my job as I was elected to do. And this is not the first time. And I know we've been through these conversations before. And, you know, we go on a good track and then something falls apart again. But these comments were made in front of my neighbors, my friends, the community that elected me. And I think it was very wrong. And yes, I have formally resigned. I've been asked to reconsider. And based on the actions of this meeting, I will do it from that. But I mean, I hope people understand what the role of the treasurer is. I believe we do more now than ever. And no, go on. I just, I want to reiterate, too, that our role, you know, as Rita said, we're elected officials, right? And this is our role is like what we're going to do in the best interests of the town, right? The town has entrusted us with money. It's entrusted us with taking care of the roads with all of the daily things that you need to run a town. And there isn't much that we do, it's like for people, right? Like, I'm not running the roads. I'm not doing them. So what am I doing? My job is to listen. It's to do oversight. It's to ask questions. It's to make sure that things are being done correctly. That's, that is our role. And, you know, a treasurer, by default, if they're not asking questions, if they're not going drilling down and, you know, really making sure that they understand what's going on, maybe we call it a little nitpicky. Well, that's their job, right? If they're not, they're not, as far as I'm concerned, they're not doing their job, right? I would, you know, I think that, you know, somebody like Darinda who is asking the questions, that's great. I know that she's doing her job because she's making sure that everything is done properly. Same thing with Randy. Same thing with me looking at the orders, right? When I'm looking at those checks, I'm not looking to see, oh, is someone stealing money from the town? That's not what I'm doing. I'm looking to see, oh, has it been done properly? Oh, how much are we spending on, on sand or whatever, right? I'm becoming an informed person. I'm not just signing something. The same thing with Randy. I'm not going to go look at the hours if Randy's looking at the hours, right? I don't think we need 10 people looking at the hours. But that's, that's our job, right? Is to make sure that we're stewards of the towns of our taxpayer dollars, right? And that's our job. And so, Darinda, I do hope you will reconsider because I think you do a fabulous job. You're important. You're needed for this town. You know the ins and outs. And you do ask the hard questions, but that makes you the good treasurer that you are. And I'm sorry. And I, you know, I can't promise you that we're not going to, that this isn't going to happen again. I don't think any of us can promise that, but I can promise you that we as a board will work towards the goal of being kinder and more respectful and more professional and treating each other with, as Sarah said, the respect that we are all doing because we are servants to this town. Thank you. Anybody have anything else they'd like to add? Okay. Thank you. Darinda, what would be the process to implement that with the orders if we chose to do that? Can you just do that? I think you can. And that makes good sense to you. Does everyone else agree that that's? Are you talking about getting them in an email 24 hours? Is that the process you're talking about? Yes. Can I clarify with you? Just for me, just for a second. So I've been trying to make it my practice to come in at 4.30 so I can look at the orders, right? We come in at 4.30, there's stuff going on, people have conversations going on, the orders are getting passed around. I never really get a chance to look over the orders. And it's impossible for me to look at the orders when I'm trying to run the meeting. And I don't think it's good practice to have our board members looking at the orders when we're trying to have the meeting because they should be paying attention to the meeting. Now the question is that we didn't talk about Darinda is, and I think I know the answer, but I want to know what you think, is what would happen is the orders would be sent out, but the bills would not be. So if you had a question on a bill, on an order and you needed to see the bill or you wanted to know something about the bill, you'd call the bookkeeper and say, can you pull out that bill from RB Technology and either email it to me or tell me what my question is. It's quite a bit of paper if we're going to email out copies of all the bills to everybody. So that's the one hitch about doing that. Possible to send out copies of the bills. That would just be a monumental time thing. The other issue is normally the process is the payroll tries to be completed by Monday, but the payables are done on Tuesday. If you're wanting everything done by Monday, then that is Cheryl also handles the public coming in and all of that. So there is a real depending what there is on to process that day, how long it'll take her to actually get it done. Well, let's try to see how it goes. But can that work for you guys? If you have a question on a bill, you call her and say, if you want to see the whole bill, she can scan it to you. I mean, compared to the number of bills we have, we have relative questions. I sort of personally like to look at the fiscal bill, but I could do that here after the meeting. There's not going to be. It still can be. Yeah, I'd still like to see it now. And you can still review it at that point. Nobody says, you know, you can. So the blue file would still be available. Yes. Well, let's try it and see how it works and have people like it'll help me a lot. But because right now I feel like I really never get a chance to look at them and I sign them. But, you know, and has often been said, signing the orders without reviewing them is not really doing anything. So I'm a bit concerned with the added ask on the town staff and their, you know, their capacity to get done in a timely manner with with how they're producing it. And maybe it's because I don't understand enough of the process. But if we're asking them to speed up their process by say, it's, you know, a day and a half to get us, you know, stuff a day in advance so that we can comment and all of that. I guess I just want to be sensitive to the the ask on their capacity. But here's the real issue. Okay. What they depend on is the people from the town, Eric and whoever to get their stuff in in a timely manner. Right now, there's a lot of follow up because people aren't submitting their time cards in a timely manner. They're not getting their stuff to her in a timely manner. And she's sitting there dialing for dollars trying to get the stuff. So our policy is going to be if it isn't here by such and such a time, either the bill is going to get paid or heaven forbid somebody's somebody's payroll is going to get deferred to the next payroll. There's a due date when it needs to be submitted to the office. And if it gets here on that due date, and she doesn't have to spend time calling them and badgering them to get their stuff in on time. And I don't know how frequently that occurs now, but I know it occurs some. I would think it would almost be easier. Yeah, as long as I take some time, as long as we hold, we've got to we've got to we've got to stick to our guns and be ready to stand up people and say, you know, I wasn't paid last week and I turned and I only turned my time card in two days late. Well, guess what? Late is late. I mean, I as long as it worked, it worked for a long time when we did it in the old days and we had relatively few every once in a while it was a little problem, but we had very few problems that I recall. So I would say as soon as you can doesn't have to be for the next meeting. But if you could sit down with her and and set that up and maybe send a notice out to to everybody who submits stuff to you advising them of the new schedule, if that works. Yes, Bridget. I was wondering if folks talked with Eric at all about the time card error that was that Randy found last meeting. And then to following up on that, I would almost think that the way I've done payroll is that if I don't have the information by the cutoff time, they just don't get paid. So that natural consequence really it has a large impact. I think that the town has to be ready to follow through with that. If we say that you're not getting paid, if you don't get it in on time, you don't get paid. And two, I think that if rather than just have to render speak with folks regarding payroll, that there be an actual meeting of sorts so that we can talk about expectations on our side, they can talk about their needs on their side, and everybody gets on the same page because the consequences, if they don't get it in are pretty significant for a family. So I think that maybe we formalize it a little bit. Yeah, Randy. I think the other piece of this is pretty assumptions that making assumptions that she's even sitting in that position anymore. Well, asking her to do this, asking her to do this. No, no, no, I know, but she did say once she was willing to continue this evening. So as much as that hasn't been formalized, I just wanted to say no, no, no, no, no, I agree. I agree. Yeah. I think that the process needs to be put on paper and it with with a current date outlining exactly when, where, how, and if they fail, what will happen? And that way everybody knows. I mean, I know that I know that per se they know, but it's more, it just gives everybody an opportunity to, to understand the significance of it so that it isn't during chasing down time cards because that's miserable. Well, it definitely shouldn't be during the chasing down time cards. Right. So that's why I say I don't want to implement this without the proper, proper communication. I don't know that we really need to have a meeting if we meet with committee heads and people understand. I mean, it's basically just changing a deadline. It's not changing any other procedure. Maybe it's just put on paper. Yeah. Okay. I think because, you know, yeah, I don't know. Oh, yes. Can you answer a couple of the comments? First of all, Cheryl normally reaches out if a time card isn't in as courtesy. And I think it's just a matter of saying this courtesy will stop. That will just, and it's not, you know, it's not like it's a lot of people. It's the people who don't submit time cards on a regular basis. So I don't feel that it's their livelihood that's being affected. Right. So I think we probably can handle it internally and just say, you know, we've got to have these and, you know, and handle it that way. Who's ever sitting in that chair? Well, the other thing I would say, say, Dorinda, is at the select board's request, we're implementing this change. This isn't some random thing that we came up with because of our workload. This is a request coming from the select board. And as far as the payables, we try to pay everything because it's only every two weeks. We try to pay because there's bills that come in that have discounts on them. Right. So we try to process up to the last minute that we possibly can. But I think there's a way around that as well. Well, again, what we used to do in the old days, right, wrong, or indifferent, is from time to time we would show up at a meeting. It would be a special order with just a couple of items on it were things that came in at the last minute. And because of the discount or just because of trying to be polite and pay a bill, the financial department. Anything that didn't go out in that original email batch. Right. I mean, we want to be, you know, we want to be good citizens. We want to be good to our vendors. We want to pay our bills. We certainly want to pay our employees. But, you know, there's been concern about oversight. And I feel like I haven't been able to have the proper oversight because I it's impossible for me to review the orders in a normally manner. So other question to Bridget's question is the change was made to the time card paperwork was printed out and given to the appropriate department to take care of it and show the changes made. And the other thing I've noticed and I know Randy's noticed and and others have who look at the time cards is it may be a time to have a little review with everyone about how you fill out time cards correctly. I mean, I look at some of those time cards and I can't even understand what they're putting down there. I mean, I understand the hours, but the rest of it's very confusing the way they're filling out those time cards. And I don't know if we can improve the time cards. If there's a better kind of time card or you probably you look at it more than anybody else. Randy, what do you think? I think my first suggestion would be to standardize them for all employees. Everybody's got just a spreadsheet that they use. That would provide some clarity here. Absolutely. There's ways to make it more clear as to what you're looking at. I'm not sure if the highway department only uses paper copies or if they have it in an electronic format and then they just print that form out. But that's another way where we can automate some of the calculations that are going into those so that there aren't those small errors that is just like a arithmetic issue or whatever. So there's ways around it. Just I guess you just got to figure out what the end goal is and if people are willing to make the change. Yeah. Well, the goal is to make it more accurate, more efficient, easier to understand for everyone, for the financial department first of all, but for us also. And if it eliminates some of those pesky errors, that's a home run. So that's something maybe we can work on. You can think about it a little bit. I've been in favor for quite a while of having some kind of automated system. But I know the problems with that. And I don't know that the road crew really has access. I mean, not that they couldn't have access to the computer in the office, but they certainly don't have time computers. Yeah. But you know, you can do it these days. You can do time cards on your phone with those automated systems. You don't have to have a full blown computer. So I don't know. I don't think that's I don't think that's an urgent priority. But I think to the extent that the time cards be an issue, it's worth looking at. Yes, Sarah. Where PCEO is. I think that they would like to speak. Okay. PCEO for you. Michelle Johnston. Hi, this is Michelle Johnston. I'm on on Brook Road. I just I just have a question with regards to time cards and people reviewing them and overseeing them. How many employees does the town have where all these time sheets need to be reviewed, meaning you have department heads that review them. And then the time cards are given to the bookkeeper who secondly reviews them. Do you need that many people reviewing time cards when you have department heads to review them that should be overseeing their departments? So you guys talk about time cards consistently, so I'm just wondering why that is and what the issue is with time cards when you have checks and balance it is. But why do you have so many? So I would say somebody needs to mute. So I think it's this computer. Try that. How's that? Better. Thank you, Randy. So the process generally is generally is that department heads review time cards, approve them, and submit them to the financial department. At the same time, the financial department reviews them, you're correct. But they also get submitted in the orders to the select board. So I would say the board has observed errors, problems with the time cards. So have we been paying more attention to the time cards than we had in the past? Yes, we have. But you know what? You're right. I mean, it really shouldn't be necessary for three people to look at the time cards. But that all gets back to the situation of having the time cards filled out accurately in the first place, filled out in a format where the, I mean, as Randy said, it shouldn't be the select board finding math errors on the time cards. That's not a good use. I don't think that's a good use of our time. But it's been a productive use of our time. Hold on. He says we can't hear anything last two minutes on you. So it is when I muted this. Sorry. Sorry about that, you guys. Apparently we were on mute. Okay, my back. Can you hear me now? I'll go down, Peter. Thank you guys. Okay. Sorry about that. Technology. It isn't only the time cards that are challenged. Technology can be a challenge as well. What I was saying is our practice has been that the department heads collect the time cards for their departments, they review them, submit them to the financial department, financial department reviews them, and makes up the order. And then the select board sees the order when they come to us. So yes, it's true. There are multiple layers looking over those time cards. But to the extent the financial department finds out errors on a regular basis, the select board, mostly Randy, thank you Randy, finds errors on a regular basis. This all gets back to the process of figuring out a better, simpler, more accurate system to do the time card so we don't need those kinds of checks and balances. I mean, we want to pay people correctly. We want to pay them the money they're entitled to. But we also, obviously, are managing the town resources and we want to be sure we're paying people correctly. So your concern, I would say, is a valid concern and it's part of the other discussion about how we handle this whole issue. Does that answer your question? I'm sorry? She said thank you. Oh, okay. Okay. Anything else, anyone? So where does that leave us during that? Okay. I'm not trying to hold you over a barrel. I just, I've got to be comfortable coming to the table and sitting them all, everyone. Okay. Is there any questions that you have that are unanswered? So you will get back to us. Okay. That's fine. Thank you very much. Is there any other business we need to discuss tonight? Can I just ask a third question? We did not, we have not yet made any changes to policy on hours yet. So is that on the agenda for next? Yeah. Okay. I just want to make sure. I respect you. I want you to be here. So we do have an updated draft and you have some language you're going to do, Sarah, right, for the overtime business? I'm not going to touch that overtime part. I decided I'm going to be taking that back to you guys. That, that, I think you guys ought to have that conversation again. Okay. All right. I mean, that did not, I'm sorry. Okay. No, go ahead, finish. I don't think that was a protective conversation. I could really figure out in my minutes what was, what you decided it seemed to be that you wanted to wait until the full board was there. So why don't we guys, why don't we go for that again? Okay. That's fine. If that's okay with you, because I don't want to take it so. No, no, no, no. It's fine. I am anxious to finalize the revisions to personnel policy, but we can, I think we can do that at our next meeting. Yes. I think Eric should be very curious. Yeah. No, I know we weren't going to do it today. I just wanted to make sure, since I, I did read the minutes, but I just wanted to make sure that was on our next months. Yeah. Next, when is our next meeting? It's the 11th. The 11th. And then the following Tuesdays or two Tuesdays in a row. Yep. I think I got that one. 11th and 18th. Yep. Sir, do you want anything else for us? Yes, you. Okay. I am. Thank you for your, for your little speech. I appreciate it. Dorinda, take your time. If you have any questions for me or any of us, reach out. I think you heard tonight that we're very concerned to try and straighten this out and make it so you can be comfortable and we can all be comfortable, not just you, everyone. Okay. With that, I will adjourn tonight's meeting. Thank you all very much.