 Good morning, everyone. This is the November 4th meeting of the elementary school building committee. And today as I think it's everyone knows and Margaret will go over the agenda we are focused on the out of doors and we have several guests that will be introduced as we go through this and I just wanted to say at the very beginning. Assuming we have time, I as chair invited the three residents that have put forth a Community Preservation Act proposal to help support the fields at Fort River. And I made that decision because directly germane to the committee and I thought it was important people see the content so they're on today for presentation and questions and answers. Let's start the meeting as always by making sure since we're conducting this virtually that everyone can see and be heard, and I'll just go around in the order of the screen and just let me know that all as well Phoebe. Yes, hi. Mike. Present. Allison. Hello, yes. Rupert. Chacha. Here. Simone. Here. And Angelica. Here. Okay, I am going to turn the meeting over to Margaret and then she will introduce the Nunesco team. I want to remind everyone that we're on the every other meeting schedule, time wise, and we'll do that later in the meeting as well. So thank you very much. And I'm ready to start the meeting, Margaret. Can you enable screen sharing and sharing screen. Who do I, how do I do that? I just click share. Sean, how I, I think you have to make Margaret co-host or something. Something like that is there's three button. If you hover over her face. And then I've never had that. If you want to make me co-host I can. Okay. You just click the three dots and hit me. Okay, so make you co-host. Yes. She's always been able, she's always been able to screen share before, but good, Sean, this will teach me how to do this. You're co-host now, Sean. Is a, I think you have to just make Margaret co-host as well for now while she's sharing. Okay, here you go, Margaret. I think we must have our, our IT team may have put this in as a safety feature because I noticed it in another meeting also. Okay. So, just to recap what Kathy just said, we're going to focus on the site design. We are, we have some guests who are going to talk about CPA proposal that they made. And we have one invoice to look at. So with that, I'm going to turn it back over to Janisco to move on with the presentation. And I'm going to, we're probably going to turn it mostly over to Tim Cooper, number two, Bill, can you wait? This is Bill Brown. Bill Brown is with Brown Sardinia, our landscape architects. And he has been working closely with us, obviously, since the inception of the project. We do want to say that at the very beginning, I think Tim has the presentation. What we want to do is kind of walk through where we are with the overall site. Oh, so do you need to be. Yeah, I also need to be allowed to share my screen. Sorry. This is okay. I think it normally happens quietly in the background. No, no, it doesn't. We haven't had to do this before for someone change the settings. So it's been a, it stops you from being zoom bombed. If you're in total control of screen sharing. And I see Ben has joined Ben, you just, can I call on you just to make sure we can, you can hear us and we can hear you. Ben. Okay, great. Thanks, Ben. So, so I just, just I'll let we'll, we'll get into the exciting stuff. I think what we just wanted to really say, as we start this discussion and we look forward to hearing the, from the three folks that submitted the CPA. But ultimately, it's a school and we're really excited about what we're going to be able to do to enhance all of the activities inside and outside of the school. So it was really important for us to be able to move the project forward, especially the site design, as it relates to the stormwater management on site, understanding the relationship for circulation on site and I believe we, we spent a little bit of time talking about that last week, but for last time, but we'll walk through that again. And then what we just want to point out Tim, maybe you just want to go to a slide is that we've identified an area north of the school activities for community use. And we do not need decisions today, we do not need decisions tomorrow, we will prepare the area, and then how it's striped how the fences go, if their fences, etc, going forward. We don't need that information at all right now so we will continue these conversations with the community to make sure that it is the best layouts that will meet the needs of. I don't want to say all because everyone has their unique requirements but that satisfies the community at large so I just want to say whatever is represented in these graphics are just so that people can kind of visualize the area the size, and that we will continue to work with you on how these the fields to the north are actually or ultimately laid out. So, we'll continue this conversations look forward to the conversation with the three folks related to the CPA, but I just want you to know. This is absolutely just diagrammatic to give you an idea of the size of the area this is not final nor we needing a final decision anytime soon. So, Tim, I'll turn it over to you. Thank you. I'm quickly going to turn it over to Bill Brown, but just to say that we have these site plans that we're going to go through that show the entire site as Donna was alluding to, then we're going to zoom into the outdoor play and learning spaces around the building itself and then just review the site circulation as it is, but, and then quickly review as we've adjusted the site plan push the building a little bit to the south introduced this bend into it will just show what that means inside the building briefly after we walk through the site plans, but with that, I think I'll hand it over to bill to talk about the organization of the different aspects of the outdoor learning and play around the building. Thanks Tim. What I wanted to do is start with site circulation from Southeast Street into the site and on the northern part of the site. You can see that there is a sidewalk currently on on the project we are installing a sidewalk that connects to the left side of the campus that's part of the drop off zone for the students and for parent drop off to the north of the fields we have another path that connects through to where the fields could be located, and then off to the wetlands to the east as well, and then coming south around where we're connecting to the playground area. And as you go around and continue the path you can circulate through the outside of the school area, and then back around to the school, and then back out to Southeast Street as well. So there's a good circulation system throughout throughout the site. What we're looking at with regard to the parking areas and drainage, there's. Integrating stormwater management into the site in a way that it can be used for educational purposes as well. So in the parking lot that's to the west of the fields there's two drainage areas where the stormwater goes into there only a foot or two deep. It helps clean the water and then gets into the drainage system, and then south of the school, where the drop off is for the buses there's an island in there as well all the water is going into that area. It's being cleaned and then taken off of the site, and we've used these areas even in parking lots for demonstration areas plaques areas for learning for the students so they can understand how stormwater reacts throughout the site. Now, north of the school we do have the play fields. And as Donna said there's, there's options in terms of how the fields could be laid out. One of the important things to know though is that we are raising the fields from the existing grade, a foot to a foot and a half. We are installing roughly nine inches to one foot of amended topsoil so that we get good grass coverage and then we have a sub drain system below the fields to get water off the field so that the fields can be dry. The problem with fields is in your, you recognize this on this project is that water is very close to the surface so we're going to take the water off of the field so that they're playable more quickly, especially in the fall and in the spring. So around the school area we do have our drop off, you can see where the drop off is the ventures to the school. To the north of that we have, we do maintain fire truck access around and through the playgrounds. So starting at the drop off the loop for the buses on the bottom of the page, you're able to circulate around in each direction so that fire trucks can get around. And as you come into the play areas, you are able to access the door into the cafeteria. Okay, larger scale. You're able to access the doorway into the cafeteria. There is an area outside the cafeteria where there's an opportunity for tables and chairs for the kids to eat outside, you can do art projects outside on those tables. It's a nice flexible area. And between there and what's labeled as play there is asphalt play areas in that area and in that zone that we have the opportunity to either have games, planted paste surfaces with maps of the world or there's many many options. But there is an opportunity to use that space of the play space, especially in the winter when you've been plowing to the left of the area that's marked as play is the younger kids playground area that will have the playground equipment. And what's nice about this scheme is that the field area that's labeled as play is between the younger kids play structure area and the older kids play structure area to the right. And, you know, younger kids need less space than the older kids. And we think that the area that's between the cafeteria and play could be dedicated to younger kids games that could be played on the asphalt. I'm sorry to, I'm sorry, Bruce rather, I'm sorry to interrupt you but I know just for the host of the meeting Alicia who's a committee members waiting to be let in I think she's in the attendees. So I'm sorry to ruin your flow but I know Alicia would be interested in hearing this so sorry to interrupt my apologies. Yes. So I, we think that the younger kids will basically be concentrated sort of outside the cafeteria area and then their playground area and they can also use the play the older area as well. Because we know that they're going to be having lunch at different times and there's not going to be a whole lot of overlap between older and younger kids. As you move to the east, there's a larger sort of circular area that will be the older kids play area. And then to the right of that there's an area that has two half court basketball courts. And in addition to the half court basketball courts that will have their will have more active play like four square and things and games that you would use balls with or things that you would throw with sort of in that area. And between there and the building again there's an opportunity for other games and to be played on the asphalt play area between the school and the playground area and the area where the half court basketball courts are shown. To the right of the school there's two full size basketball courts, but one thing that's nice about that is that side of the building it's a faces west, there's solid walls in that area. So it'll help mitigate the noise it's associated with with the basketball courts. So as we circulate north of where the half court basketball courts are, there's a path that connects to where you see the words nature trail. And then to the right of the basketball court basketball courts there's a blue area. That is going to be a rain garden area, and it's only going to be nine inches to 12 inches deep. What it will do is that it will collect the rain water that is on the playground into that area, and there's a path around there that connects around to where the full size basketball court is in the circle that is shown there is sort of an classroom there's an opportunity to have a class out there in that area sort of between the forest floor nature play area to the right and the rain garden that's to the left. There's also access to the darker green area which is the forest floor nature play area. So it's a closed area that we planted with a variety of trees and shrubs. What we talked about doing is when we cut down trees that we're going to be cutting down on site is that we would like to be out there when that's done so that we can get you know large stumps and branches and things like that, that we can integrate into this area to great places for people to sit, potentially have a classroom out there. So it's a nice sort of natural buffer and natural area, you know the faculty and the kids to enjoy. Now around the basketball pool size basketball court to the south, there's another rain garden. And again, these are not deep they're not going to hold water. They will hold water for very very high rain events, but they will dissipate through to the subsoil very very quickly so they're not going to be a hazard. So there is another rain garden in that location. And to the left of the basketball court. We have our formal classroom and flexible classroom area, you can see sort of looks like a sale structure. We have that adjacent to where the cultivation classroom is where we'll probably have a shed will have raised garden areas. Large planting areas, and we intend around these two classroom areas to have pollinator gardens and different types of plant material around in that area. I think that the, what's really nice about the scheme that there's is that there's plenty of circulation and connections throughout the site and I think there's a lot of opportunities for even classrooms to be out especially in the, in the the forest floor play area and the flexible classroom and the pollinator gardens for you to feel like you're away from sort of a hustle and bustle and all the activity. That's going to be happening in the more active play areas. These are just some, you know, examples of the character of the different areas, like, you know, the rain garden. Again, it's something that you're going to be able to walk through and use it's not going to hold water. The character of the forest floor, you know, using logs and branches and things like that to promote, you know, worms and all kinds of things that kids can look for and ants and things like that. They're part of sort of the decomposition of the forest floor places for kids to sit on stumps. And then examples of what the cultivation garden could actually look like and the formal classroom flex space with the potential for a structure in order to provide shade. I just wanted to add that this scheme, unlike what we've been showing what we've been calling the lazy river. That element is still there. The rain gardens duplicate that function just the way that the water is flowing through the site is a little bit different and with the rain gardens to the east of the play areas. You won't be crossing that feature, you know, it makes the play space a little bit more continuous a little bit more together and the site is zoned in a little bit more efficient way. Tim, the only other thing maybe if you just want to go back to the big site plan. Thank you. Is that our goal is still to daylight the culvert. Towards towards the south, which the school department is really excited about as well as potentially also being another learning feature. And as well as keeping the path, the way that it currently is out to Pellum street or road to the northeast so that will remain available for the community as well. And we did have a really wonderful meeting yesterday with school department and Jen Reese who really manages the outdoor learning came to us with a list of this is what I think I want. And we had those features already built in so we're really really excited we're in sync. It's probably the most cost effective way to approach outdoor learning, taking advantage of all of the natural site elements. Providing flexibility shade, a couple of things to note. As relates to that would be to perhaps provide a little more canopy structure over the cafeteria for outdoor learning opportunities when the dining or lunch area is not being used for lunch, so that that could also be another learning area as well. Is there anything else that Jim might have mentioned Mike if you want to jump in or or Allison. But I think, thank you captured it. Perfect. That's all I have to say. Is this a time for questions on the site worker, should I wait. I think this is a good stopping point for the site we have a few more slides on the plan how it's affected but this is a good point. A couple of curiosity questions I know we spent a lot of time thinking about how to mitigate the high water table. I'm curious whether you anticipate that there will be times when we need to actually irrigate the playing fields. And if that's built into the plan. And I'm also curious if there at some point to hear about which areas will have walkway lights and field lights etc. I can address the fields. We are have carried in the cost estimate irrigating those fields. So that is part of the project budget. We actually started working on the lighting plan this week. And what we are we are not showing any lights currently around the field area but we did discuss the potential to look at installing conduit for potential lights in the future. But we have begun to develop a lighting plan obviously the parking lot is going to be lit. This area is going to be lit as well. And then what we've looked at is some lighting poll lighting around the school, primarily sort of poll lights in this area. We don't want to provide we don't think we want to provide you know complete lighting around the whole school but we really want to provide safety lighting, sort of at the perimeter of the school and those locations. So just to add to that, a couple of things when when we met with the town agencies the public safety folks we started that conversation about how we will light the perimeter or the exterior of the building so we'll continue to have those conversations over whether that's building mounted, or, or, you know, if we do put polls out we understand, we don't necessarily want to encourage playing in the back of the school with the basketball or maybe we do and maybe we provide lights out there so we'll continue that conversation. And the other thing as well as it relates to community use of the fields, we will have any lighting that is connected to the fields to be a separate meter than the rest of the building because we need to manage and maintain our EUI. And for every little, every little energy savings that we can have so that will be a separate meter and then there is conversation as well as to provide some piping for future bathrooms or whatever that that might. The community might also want to act. Go ahead Kathy. It's, I think Sean's hand is up and then I have a question after Sean. So, Sean. Thanks Kathy, is the tree line, the tree line to the east is that where the current tree line is is that where the sort of darker green area is. Yes. Okay so the, so the current softball field is sort of in the lower corner in the upper corner where the current fields are. The current softball field is at the lower right, lower right and then there's a baseball fields in the upper right. Well, sort of at the where the. Well, there is a baseball. There's really not a field there. If there was a field there at one point in time. There was a field up there and there's sort of remnants of an infield. Okay, doesn't look like it's been used for probably five years or more. Probably since the last time I played softball there, which was seven years ago. My question more is just around, I anticipate usage of the fields will pick up by the community. Once this project is done obviously it'd be nice fields, new facilities and so I just wondered, you know, are there ways where the, will that be a baseball slash softball field that's shown there currently, where it can be used for both. Well actually currently it's shown as a softball field. Yeah, so it would not be a baseball field that's correct. On the lower right of the site is a men's softball field that's currently being used of that so we've replicated that field so it could be used for men's softball, or any softball because the baselines are the same one. Yeah, so I'm just thinking maybe this is a conversation with the rec department. I don't know how often softball would happen there but just wondering if it, you know if there will be ways for the softball field and one of the other multi purpose fields to be used at the same time. Yeah, soccer practice or football or something like that. Yeah, sorry. Again, I'll just state that there's there's many configurations and many voices in the community that we are just showing this so that people can have a context of the size of the area but we are not in any way suggesting at this point in time that this is what's going to be there. We want to work with park and rec. We know soccer has an association we know softball has a very active participant group so so and they're probably others so all we're showing this is a representative of the area and that those decisions how we stripe it is they're going to be fences and they're going to be fence. We don't have to worry about right now. Okay, thank you. Yeah, thanks. Yeah, I'm just looking to see if anyone else's hands up but I'll ask, I'm going to start with. First off, I think this is a really exciting design. And it's very responsive way back when when we did the listening and community forum. There were lots of voices asking for outdoor learning as well as outdoor play. And I was happy to hear you've talked with the teachers so you know the teachers about this configuration. And I think. My question comments is, when are we going to be ready to actually do it as a community forum to say, here's our design and it's part of the committee to because I think some of these features will make people even more excited about the school. So that's just a comment question the other is on rain gardens and some of the other space. I have a kind of a Rupert question on this. When I see the one at Amherst College, or we saw sort of a culvert in at a school we visited. It looks like they're pretty low maintenance. So I'm asking, is that the case that they're sitting there and they're there you could study and you could use them. But it's a question of if it's a dip, and if it's got some rocks. So does it need to be maintained in any way and it is that a challenge. And I'm going to ask my third question and then you can respond to all of them. I really like the layout and my third is the one I am always, I think, asking is about cost. Have, when we did the specs for the school and got cost estimates, has this kind of a site plan for the school part. Was that already included, you know, have we added anything that adds, adds costs beyond. And, and I know you might have had a contingency factor, you know, so that as you flush it out so we're within the budget that we had budgeted for this. So before we get super excited about everything we see. Does it have cost implications. Those are my comments questions. So I think maybe just maybe not necessarily in the order but Bill, feel free to correct me if I'm wrong but these rain gardens should, should require no maintenance right natural plantings that will be supported in these rain gardens. Right Bill. So, so, so the really no mowing, we actually do not want you to mow these areas. These are supposed to be natural habitats and and we'll make sure that the plantings there can be supported in in these swells so you should not worry. Rupert cross that off your list you don't have to mow them or plow them or whatever. So the other aspect as far as cost. We, now that we have a defined program per se, you can see we're trying to really utilize all of the natural elements of the site with very little additional cost as it relates to structures. I don't recall Tim, if we had an actual line item per se for this in the past Kathy, but we, when we cost it out, we'll take a look at it some of it will be probably furniture and equipment some of it might be furniture and equipment. We can pull that in. But this schematic design pricing will be much more detailed and yes there was this design contingency that hopefully we can factor in. To all of this and we just have more detail right we have more detail on the site. We've done the borings we've done the test pits, we've done the well testing. So we'll have a more detailed understanding of where all the costs are going at this next cost estimate. It just push you a little bit Donna on the green space between the little kids playground and the big kids playground. At one point maybe it was in a design subcommittee. We talked about a potential artificial covering. Yeah, would be, but but has that has that been removed, you know, yes. So thank you for, for bringing that up because like that's coming on our radar. There's so many conversations and elements to this. What we've decided would make the most sense is to right now. In an area, the students can play year round similar to what would be this artificial turf but the material would be the same material that we would be putting under the play structures. It is not artificial turf, it would need and is able to be cloud so that it can be used year round and it's a softer material that will allow for fall and for less injury to the students right so it won't be hard surface or black top. Some people call it. I call it paved area but some people calling it asphalt they don't have such a negative reaction to asphalt but this will be a softer play surface that kids can play on year round so so yes we have removed the artificial turf from the conversation. Thank you. Thank you for bringing that up. So I'm just looking for any other hands. One, my beginning comment is I, when some of this one as a committee we endorse or have our questions answered the point at which we can start showing some of these pictures to the community. I've done one district presentation we have five in town, but whether we would do an evening session that's more anyone in the community. Thank you very much. You mentioned Jen Reese, the teachers who are looking to the outdoor play and learning how much this has been vetted with the group, the users. So just a sense of when it's ready to start doing that I know we're pretty far from construction. We're ready. I think I think that would be a really good time. Okay, start community outreach. Tim we don't do we have more elements as it relates to the building today as well. We can do a quick update on plans and then we have an updated 3D on the outside just to show that the 10 degree band in the building is subtle. Anyway, so yeah so I think you're right Kathy, we have support from all of you know the school department we know what the layout is of the building the circulation has been established. The play areas and outdoor learning has been established so I think it would be absolute perfect time to start having those community conversations. You might be about to discuss this and it looks like a positive change and maybe it happened last time but it looks like the bus loop maybe changed a little bit in terms of where service vehicles will go versus where buses will go. That has evolved. So the southern loop now has a little bit separation or better separation between where the service area is where buses drop off we've moved the stair in the center of the building to the south side to acknowledge that there is a, you know, a large number of students will be entering that way and so we've separated a little bit from the service entering and then we've adjusted the geometry of where the vans will drop off to move it closer to the front entrance and to allow a cut through. So that with buses stacking to the east end of that loop, the vans can still get through because they have a different dwell time and they're more intermittent. Thank you. Any other questions on this part of the presentation. I'm not, I'm not seeing any hands and hopefully I'm not missing any. And I. Okay, then we can move on. Quickly, this is a cyclone that shows the vehicle circulation overlaid but we talked about that in the beginning as shown buses service all the south and then parent and car drop off will be through the loop dropping off at the front door. And then moving into the building to highlight the changes since the last time with the bus loop being a bit more developed to the south we've taken the center stair. And move to the south side of the building that actually gives us the flexibility to make this geometry change in the building as a whole. The stair being a bit more flexible than any of the program space to absorb that angle. So students will be able to come in from the bus. And go straight up the stairs to their classroom if they're on an upper floor. And then we're beginning to work on details for shielding the service area. This shows the dumpsters just south of the recycling area. We probably will move them even further away from the entrance and shield them more just because of the way that the geometry of trucks picking up and dropping off will work. Another change in the building that has happened since the last time we spoke we've taken the first floor of the building which we were showing us 17 feet actually 17 foot for and push it down to 16 feet to save volume that we will have to keep cool and we'll save some money in the envelope, but it will also just reduce the height of the building. So the only effect that would be observable from the inside for an occupant of the building is that the library which happens to align almost perfectly with the cafeteria above. There will be a few steps or a ramp to get into the library and the library along the rest of the building will be all of the floors will be level and once you get off the stair or elevator on that floor everything will be flat. But this allows us to deal with a little less volume to heat and cool. It allows us to maintain the ceiling height that we want in the cafeteria to have performances on the stage and to have be a space appropriate for assembly. And it still maintains the ceiling height and what we want in the media center. Hey, Tim, it's Margaret. So you said it was gone from 17 for to 16 what 16, even so the floor elevations right now are 16 feet for 14 feet. Yes, the 16 inches last that's great. Yep. And continuing up through the building on the third floor the stairs to the south. There have been minor changes here just some tidying up of the plan to remove some of the ins and outs over in the mechanical area and where you will access the rooftop equipment here. So Tim you want to you're pulling up a. I was going to pull up the exterior video. Yeah. So a lot of this will look very familiar. There are some developments. We are working on engaging the building with the canopy structure itself here recalls what you've seen on the north and south before is still a work in progress. But we think that we can make the canopy itself seem like more part of the building and less of an afterthought, and we will continue to work on that design. We're showing some plantings in here, but they're not they're only representative to show what is lawn and what is a more substantial planting area and we're not showing the trees that are shown on the site plan so that obscure the building. As we move to the north of the building the circle right in front of you is the where the smaller kids play area would be we're not showing any equipment. Not yet, but this is just to give you a sense of scale and how close to the building it is. As we move to the west on the north side of the building this area with the line around it would be that soft surface play area that Donna mentioned here would be moving to the larger kids play area, all centered on the north side of the building. Then this oval would be the hardscape play area with two half court basketball cars. This is just representative of the planning but there would be a planting bed around that basketball court and then as you get further to the west, the larger planting here is just to show the area of where the rain garden would be. This circle represents that elevated classroom that Bill mentioned that where you can have outdoor learning talking about all of the floor and fauna that exists in this rain garden. As we circle around the west there'd be basketball courts. And you're directly over what would be the forest floor play area or outdoor learning area now. This is another rain garden. And we are circling around to the cultivation classroom. These would be raised planner beds. Pollinator gardens around them. Shade structure for a formal semi formal outdoor classroom. And moving around to the bus loop. With the stair on the south side of the building now will probably introduce a bit more glass to the facade. Somehow tied into the canopy that we've been showing at the kindergarten area and you know, delicately separate to the sun to the extent that we can the service area from the entrance for the kids getting off the bus. It's a little washed out here but here we are circling back to the front of the building. There's a lot of PV. That is a lot of PV. We don't know if there's. We hope we get that much we don't know that we will yet but this is just an aerial view to show you, you know the elements that bill and Donna, we all have been talking about and how they relate and how far they are and how they surround the building. I see Alicia's hand is up. Thank you. I am wondering about the ceiling height on the first floor versus the second and or third floors of the building. And I'm also wondering if you can give a description on the like estimated cost difference between the soft play area services and the grass. So the ceiling height to an occupant of the building in a typical classroom on the first second and third floor would be the same. The structural floor to floor height will be two feet higher from the first to second versus the second and to third and the third to roof. That allows us to give a space for some of the larger mechanical equipment that will feed the large spaces on the first floor and it will allow us to pop up the roof with with that ramp to the library. And then your second question. Is the play surface that we've been talking about without playground equipment is, if you're comparing it to what we have mentioned in the past, a synthetic turf there about cost neutral if I understand your question correctly. I think she was asking versus grass Tim. It wasn't the all weather surface. Is that correct, Alicia. Yes, thank you, Kathy. Yeah, there's a substantial difference between either synthetic turf or the playground surface versus grass. The issue really is is because there's so many children that could potentially be on it in a small area is that they would turn to to mud or dirt fairly quickly. So that's why we're proposing to use a resilient service. So what we'll do is as as we all are extremely cost conscious with this project is where we're pricing it this way, and then we should be able to have a quantity, which would be associated to a cost as well when the cost estimates and then we can make decisions on what makes the most sense is these students really are going to be out here year round. I'm sure Mike that's just where you go for it. So I see Sean and Mike's hands are both up. My questions back on the other presentation Mike are you asking, are you going to talk about the play surface here. Oh, wait my turn. I'm good, Sean. Go ahead. Okay, Tim, can you pull up. Can you go back to the other presentation go back to the roof view. Sure. I'm asking this question because I recently had a nice tour of the library and saw some of their roof issues. The area where the sort to the north where the roof sort of angles in against maybe is the media center or above the gym. How will that area drain is it going to be angled in a way that it just runs off the roof will there be roof drains there that because we again some of our buildings in town have areas like that where kind of collects between two surfaces and it and it doesn't have any rail currently and I'm just curious are there different options for drainage there to where maybe it is more money up front but make sure that the drainage is, you know, last longer and avoids any types of issues in the future. Nope. So we have essentially two slope roofs. One at the administration space and one at the media center and they're a little bit different and at the low end of the administration. So if we fall onto so most likely will be a gutter and downspout into the system fairly straightforward and simple at the media center you do have slope with the flat roof at the bottom where you will be collecting on essentially it'll run to a flat roof and it will go to a drain, which is the same system that will get the water off the rest of the roof it is watertight it is sound, but the short answer to the question is essentially it will run to drains that will collect the water and will be piped out. Okay, and are there. Again, is it just, is there sort of a standard type of drain number of drains that you use for, you know, based on the surface or their options where, you know, if we wanted to be 100% sure in the future there's no. So like, for example in the Jones Library roof. It doesn't seem like there's enough drains and then when the drains that are there they get blocked with leaves and whatever and then water can pool. Obviously when there's snow it kind of piles up. So there are options. There are options. There are drains that are paired with overflow drains and there are drains that are single and there are any number of sizes to accommodate. But typically our roof details we don't include overflow drains because we don't have a purpose that would hold the water on the roof so if you did have an overflow would just flow off the roof. But in a situation like this where you have walls on the side, we would probably include an overflow drain just as a measure of redundancy. Okay, thank you. I just want to follow up on Sean's question when I was worried about wetness on this site and called, I called over to the maintenance person in the East Hampton High School that had built in a similar area. And the one thing that they were looking at, and it was for the second school they were building was that we were getting more frequent on gusher kinds of downfalls of rain. You know, so it was, and that they were going for bigger drain pipes in the new school they were building because the experience and the other school is they weren't big enough to handle the flow. It was, it was a climate change issue, you know that they hadn't experienced this, you know, several inches all at once. So it's just, Tim, I don't need an answer from you but that it was an insight from them on when I said, would you have done anything differently and he said actually we're retrofitting now, because we didn't. It's because we hadn't seen those kind of rainfalls before. So we're for the second school that I guess is now open. We're building that into the design. So it was just an observation that I would never have thought of. So, Mike, you had your hand up if we want to move. I think I'm fine. Thank you though. Any other questions. Can, can I, I'm, I've got one. Just on a when what happens in the schedule. I think Donna, or Tim, at some point you said that we're because of the distance. When the school opens, how much of the playground and outdoor, including the dining area, how much of that place will be available to be used. Do you have enough space to be putting some of that in, and then the taking down at the other school and the building of the fields and I'm asking sort of like 2026 2027 kinds of questions. One thing we didn't mention has shifted a bit in the most recent iterations of the plan is so if you can see this dashed line here that that is the southern extent of the existing building we've actually pushed the play structure areas and the outdoor play area south. So that they would be up and running on the day that school opens. It looks pretty tight here but that's within construction tolerances. And then that summer transition between when the old four river closes this will be cleaned up and in the fall of the first year school is open these playgrounds will be available and everything north of that will be. That'll be contractor access demolition of the existing building construction of the fields to the north. And so that demolition of the building will be happening. Is that correct sometime in the fall of 2026 spring of 2027. Is that correct. I mean, more or less, you know, in terms of timing or or summer. You know so it. I'm just looking for when which piece gets done not a X month. Yeah. Yeah, the demolition of the school should start in the summer of 2026 and hopefully be close to complete by the time the school is occupied. It will be but but then should not extend into the spring of 27, not, not say that the site will be completely done, but it will be probably still. And then the site won't be completely done because then you have to put the soil and put the drainage and everything for the fields correct. Okay. And then and then we do want to know that there is like, typically bill feel free to chime in at least one season of growing right for the field so the fields will not. Bill it's a. You know, I think that probably the following year in the spring is when they would actually be seated. And I wouldn't expect that you'd be able to play on them until probably the summer of the following year. So you need a full year growing for the sea. Thank you. That was exactly what I was looking for in terms of timing. Thank you very much. Any other questions on this and then Tim I don't do have interior to show us to or. We did not anticipate. Okay. Okay, I'm looking for any hands. So, so I should ask, is that are you at the end of what you plan on presenting today. Yes. Okay. And I see that Jonathan has joined us so I just want to make sure Jonathan can hear and be heard so Jonathan is with us. And Jonathan I don't know how much of that you caught but the slides are all posted so it's a pretty robust. So, I joined around nine and I have no good excuse except that I've been I felt like I've spent the whole week off by a day and didn't connect first thing this morning. So that's, I'm still off by six hours so it, but that gets me up early so it's. So I don't see any other questions so Margaret do we have invoices next or do, or should I bring in the CPA. I think we have to do invoices so let's do the invoices. You're muted. I have a quick voice and it should be quick and I have it pulled up so let's do that quickly and switch to that. Okay, and let me just ask for bill Donna, if he doesn't need to be here for this or but you're welcome to stay because we're turning. We're going to have a five minute presentation from about the proposal that would help offset some of the costs of the school project by funding some of the field work so I'm just going to quickly pull up the invoice so the one invoice we have today is from Dinesco design and I thought it might be helpful if I started highlighting what the the invoices for as we go so there's there's two pages here there's a pay the first page is Dinesco's billing. Second page is their consultants billing. So again we're in schematic design. Their request for this period which is consistent with their billing is 333333 and then on the next page, there's a big list of consultants who you're starting to become familiar with. And again, for this period, there's some wetlands permitting, traffic engineering, and quite a bit of geo environmental work that's going on which is related to the foundation design and the geothermal design. So the total when you look at that in total. It's this is the consultant member this is the total they're billing for just a little under $60,000 and attached to this I'm just going to quickly scroll through the pages is their backup so there's pages from Dinesco. Sorry pages from the consultants. This is Horsley Whitton or the civil engineer. Where's they went. This is Dinesco's related piece that summarizes the traffic engineering. And I think behind that we have the traffic engineering and voice itself. There's lots of pages here. There's all traffic engineering, engineering, Dinesco's summary. And then at the end, as always, we have their workforce participation. So that is that if there is a motion. I make a motion to approve the invoice. Second. And I, before I take a vote, I have one question that I wanted to ask, and it wasn't about what we have been billed but where we are Donna Tim. So you said we've been out looking at the wetlands and I, and I know you did a walk around with our conservation commission staff. Are we good to go or is there issues around and read or anything that we should know about. We should be good for filing the and read Amy from Horsley Whitton walked with her and jock. The survey should be finalized this week and then she will have the materials that she will need that she's not creating herself to file that. That will be whatever the MSBA requirements are that we have done those steps will that be will be at the right point then I'm not I don't know enough about what I'm asking, but hopefully that was clear. We are on schedule is the is the simplest answer. Okay. Then are there any other questions. Are we ready to vote. And this is a motion to approve the invoice. So, I'm just going to do it by the screen Allison. Yes. Rupert. Yes. Ben. Yes. Jonathan. Yes. Sean. Yes. Mike. Yes. Simone. Yes. Alicia. Yeah. Oh, I missed. And I missed Phoebe Phoebe. Yes. And Mike, did I do Mike. I already, I did. You did me. Okay. So if I missed anyone, tell me. So it was unanimous with just one person missing right now. Margaret, you can do the. Well, it's, it's Paul here. Two people missing. That's what I have. Okay. Okay. Okay. Any other comments before I bring in the CPA team. Okay. Then. I'm going to take, I just want to let the, the broader audience know there will be public comments after questions after all of this. So right now, I need to know. Okay. Sean, would you all like to be brought in? If so, just raise your hands. It looks like the answer is yes. Okay. Sean, can you help me bring them in? Great. I think. Did we, is Maria in the room? Yep. I'm here. Okay. Okay. So at my request, I invited them to join us and they sent us a one page description with a second page that shows the budget on and the origin of it. And I've asked them to do about a five minute presentation and then all of us would be asking questions for further information for clarification. So you're on which whichever of the three of you are leading off. Kathy, I was going to share my screen and we have a PowerPoint presentation if that's all right with you. Yes. And I think with this new piece, we have to allow you to. Kathy, I made it so panelists can share their screen. So Maria, do you want to try to share and see if it works? We're going to give that a whirl here. Can you see my screen? Yes. Yes. Fantastic. So I'm going to make the, I'm going to make it larger and go in this mode. Great. Thank you guys so much for having us to your meeting. So the title of our CPA application, if you want to find it on their site is the Fort River Community Recreational Fields. And this is a picture of the existing condition. So we have the old building. We have the three softball fields, the large one with lights down here. This is a smaller one. This field actually has been in use in recent years, not with COVID. And then we have the other multi-purpose fields that are used for both soccer and ultimate and anything like that. So to give you an idea, this area of this grassy field is approximately somewhere between 350 and 400,000 square feet. What we're looking at now with the new designs that you've got are showing that the fields would be more consolidated up into the north into this area. And I'll talk a little bit more about size later, but this kind of square area here would permit the continuation of the existing amenities. This is four ultimate fields and you could fit two, not three softball fields, but that I think would be okay into what would be an approximately 200,000 square foot area. I'll talk more about that in a moment. So why would you support athletic fields at Fort River? These are heavily used by multiple organizations and there's over a thousand regular players plus their families and parents. And there's also a lot of informal use by the community. If you go there on any given day, you will see lots of people using these fields after school hours. During the school day and after, students are also, we hope, going to be using these fields. So it's a benefit to the kids and to the community for school-wide events, field days, multicultural fairs. This is not just for athletics, obviously. And the plans that you have developed are going to allow for restoration of really valued facilities. These fields are much needed in community-wide use. And my heart went pitter pat when you guys talked about having, allowing for conduits for the plumbing and electrical to allow the replacement of a comfort station and lighting, which are both highly valued by users, the community users. I don't know if you're familiar with it, but there is an open space and recreation plan, which was updated in 2017, and it calls out specifically for many things, but specifically for improvement of the Fort River playing fields and community use. And of note, the Fort River site is the only town-owned site with recreation in an environmental justice neighborhood in that southeast part of town. I'm sorry, the east part of town. So why CPA funds? You are very familiar with the fact that the MSBA is going to cap the site cost at 8%, and there is much more than 8% of the direct costs are going to be needed for sites. It's about $7 million that won't be eligible for reimbursement, so that would be borne fully by the town. The CPA funding would decrease the amount that we would need to ask taxpayers to pay when we have our debt exclusion override vote, and we think that by decreasing the amount that is asked, it will improve the chances of success if we can have something to help offset that final number. The timing is critical for this because the debt exclusion override vote is going to be in May, so it was this CPA funding cycle that we would need to apply for and get funding for in order to explain to the public, yes, we are trying to decrease your costs, so that's why we needed to make the application this year in CPA. So a breakdown of the budget, and I can pull up some other slides that give some more detail. The athletic fields themselves, the improvements there, as you know, there were two cost estimates. It's AM Fogarty was estimating about 160,000 square feet based on the initial diagrams that they had at that time, so that was in June, and PM&C took the same basis of design and diagrams and thought it was more like 185,000 square feet. What we did was to pull directly from the cost estimators line items that referred only to athletic fields, and we pulled together all the topsoil, the seeding, irrigation and all that, and we used their average of what was available at that time, and that averaged to about two and a half million dollars. That's taking the direct cost and adding on all the contingencies, the labor, all of those costs, so it really went from about one and somewhere between one and one and a half million up to 2.5 by the time you get to total project costs. So that's where we derived that the field lighting. We wanted to use something that a study that was done we wanted to again go to primary sources and we looked at the Western and Samson development for the proposal at the high school, and they listed fields, lighting as costing about $360,000 so that's where we came up with that estimate. And then finally for the comfort station, it was in a, the JCPC, the Joint Capital Planning Committee was looking to put a comfort station at Kiwanis Field, and estimating that it would cost in this order of magnitude, and that's how we came up with the total ask. So where our ask from the CPA committee is $3 million. So, just again, I really appreciate the presentation today that was super and I'm really so we are one one iteration behind you on the proposed site plan. But I wanted to give some ideas about what we were thinking of for how, how would this look for the athletic recreational fields. So, this is a notion that we had about how field lighting could be situated along the periphery to light the this this corner of the athletic fields, and this white rectangle would represent a likely spot for comfort station. Which would be near the parking so that the when the community came in to use it, they would be up here, and the community use would be really focused on that northern site there would be no need to traipse through the school part. But the kids that are coming in directly from school need to change and need to use the bathroom before they play so we thought that might be a good location. And then this is just some notions. Again, general design and I appreciate that this is all still in the works, but currently the ultimate program uses for ultimate fields and it's better if they're situated in this longitudinal north south direction. And this allows them to be grouped side by side adjacent to one another with some space in between, excuse me for the coaches and the players as they're waiting to go in. And that same area, then when softball would be playing could be it could accommodate to softball fields. Our thinking was that one, it would be good if it was this quote skinned infield which is basically a dirt infield just not grass here and then a second softball field could be accommodated down here. But it did would not have to be a skinned infield they could just be having bases there would require a backstop as as this has here, but would not require lighting. Another way to use this would be for the football and soccer and I put two big fields this would be enough for double the amount of football that's played there but there are many different configurations that the soccer association uses because they have full size games for you 12 you 11 and 12, but they also have smaller fields for like seven on seven, but there's plenty of room for soccer to be accommodated there. So, I want to get to your questions and I'm going if I can stop screen sharing so we can talk if that's what you'd like to do Kathy. That sounds great. Thank you very much. And please send us the chart pack, Maria so that we can post it will do thank you. So, I, we are open for questions. So I'm not. Okay, Jonathan. Great. Just a quick question. Is the CPA process still open. Because I did not see in your in your in your numbers, money for for design, and it might be good if you can still amend those numbers to include something for the design of those fields. So, the, the, the, the application process is closed that ended on September 30, which is why we, we got it in there. We have presented our, our application to the Recreation Commission, and we are going before the CPA committee on December 1 to to make our application to the CPA committee. The for the field improvements that increase from that the direct costs up to the total project costs would include this this development and it would be part of your process because as as you've talked about the the the design of the fields is included the $60 for the comfort, I'm sorry, for the lighting and the 200,000 for the comfort station would have some design money available. But again, these are these are estimates. I'm not sure that that would cover it, but we can discuss that further with the CPA committee. Thanks Kathy. If the so if the CPA committee recommends this project in December, do you have a timeline when you would want the council to act on it. We would want them to act on it before the debt exclusion override comes up so that it would be known that yes, you know, there is there is some money for this and so the the the ask for taxpayers is less. Thanks to the schedule for the council to act on has changed. I don't think it's set in stone anymore because the CPA process happens a little earlier now so there's a little bit of flexibility I think with the council in terms of when they act on the CPA recommendation so it's just something to keep in mind. Yeah, I appreciate that but yes it would be nice to have it locked in we're looking for support for this application on all levels but yeah having that final yes this money is going to be allocated I would honestly say the total cost is decreased by X amount would be fantastic. I'm putting my hand up but I want to first get to others so Rupert go. Just out of curiosity, I understand with CPA funds, you have to commit to a certain usage forever. And have you thought about the implications for this if we need to expand the school in some ways and how to avoid getting the hot water around that. Thank you. So, we did receive some questions from the CPA committee and that was that they did reference that as one of them I discussed this with the director of the Recreation Commission. He didn't have a problem with this with the committing the use of the field portion, not the, you know, nothing in that that's out southern part of the site proposal to recreation use that the thing that's important to remember is that. It's for recreation use but absolutely this is, we would fully anticipate and hope that the kids and school community would be using that area during the day and after school hours for outdoor outdoor activities and expansion. I haven't heard anything talking about expansion of the building per se coming into that northern area where the fields are situated. Sean did you have a follow up on Rupert's question. Yeah, it just actually reminded me maybe Tim you can show this next at the next meeting I know with MSBA. You're always supposed to kind of have like a piece of the building where you could add on additional classrooms right if you ever do have to expand. And I'm just curious where that is in the, in the current design now with all the nice work that's done around the building. Where would be that that expansion space. But again, you don't answer that now just maybe maybe for the next time that would be helpful. So, I'm, I will build on that question and then I have a couple others. I, the restriction to recreation I think another way you could be thinking about it. If you're when you're getting this is we have a lot of outdoor fields and space for the school so if some future date we were expanding the building. I think recreation is a broad term I know with the Wildwood school, we could have if we could have ever figured out how to walk over there to that area that CPA protected we could have put playground equipment on that Hawthorne property, you know, because it was with recreation fields or the recreation fields could the athletic department wouldn't be excited with it but it would, it could move up so you've got some expansion potential there. So my, my question was a little bit on staging so the, this is a big ask for the CPA committee, and I know you are well aware of this but there are two gigantic as for affordable housing. You know, so that if you've been a year if we've been a year earlier, we would have had more bandwidth. So if you were asked to reduce this for this first ask. Have you thought about that and one of the reasons I asked for the staging the to the extent there's a comfort station and lighting that looks to me like it's 2027. When that would happen. So you could say as long as the field is ready for that to have, you know, if you had the conduit sin. So just trying to think of where you have some give because in my personal opinion and I'm speaking, I have to speak as a member of the committee and I need to be careful because I'm a council member non finance, you know, anything that would be great. You know so I'm not saying bargain way down but but that was the first thing I looked at at the staging of it. And the way just so everyone knows the Community Preservation Act is allowed to take on debt. So, they wouldn't be saying out of this year's flow it's 3 million so it could be 10 year or 20 year. They also look at when they would and shown as well can correct me when I misstate the show them but they look at when that when this would be incurred so that it doesn't get incurred until you need the money so there's some spacing when you make your presentation that the actual costs for this would be. It sounded like starting in fall of 2026 you know the building has been taken down and now you're putting the field so it wouldn't hit the CPA budget until after they go out for the debt so just trying to think of that staging and Sean am I correct you know in terms of yes so then it hits as if it's a 20 year bond it's plus interest and going out so so you're going to be pushed. Or the town is going to be pushed for competing wants, all of which we've listed as high priority. So there's some flex and it's so just be be thinking about that as you're fielding the questions because I know it's or it's already come on the screen and oh my goodness we're asking for five times more than CPA has or whatever the it's it's a big as this year. So those are my two on thinking about where you could scale it back if you need to without losing the real offset for what we have to ask the taxpayers for for the the rest of the project. So thank you very much. Yeah, really appreciate we and we have thought thought of that. That's why I was very excited to hear in today's presentation. Donna speak about having the putting the conduits to have this because I think the important thing is that you wouldn't want to take this beautiful site that we've just created and then a couple years later say oh here come back here's construction equipment back to lay in the conduit so I think demonstrating the importance of comfort station and field lighting and that sort of thing and preparing for it in a future year if that cannot be funded now. That's that's important but I think it's important to lay literally lay the groundwork now for that to happen. I think we're going to take any money they will give. Right. We hope it is more than less. We're not going to turn our nose up at a dime. So, do you have any thoughts any more thoughts about the funding timing and all that. I thought on, you know, that was something we thought about that the north part of the site is not scheduled to begin until 2026. And so any expenses incurred for the athletic fields wouldn't be encountered until then, and the CPA committee did ask us when do you think the funding would come out of our accounts. So it is a couple years out and I know that they ask for a three year window, you know use it within three years of getting it. So that doesn't always happen so we are conscious of that. And if I may I was just wondering where is the geothermal well field going to go now because I haven't seen it on recent drawings and I'm wondering how that plays in to the development of the fields. That's a different. The field will be south of the building in the bus drop off loop and then to the east of that so the planter guard in that area. So, Margaret and Sean both have hands up Margaret. So, I, you know, I think in as Bill mentioned at the beginning of his presentation, you know, I think the, what the school project is going to carry is sort of preparing a field that's available and I think it is reasonable to do what Donna's talking about which is provide conduits and connections for future facilities because it's really not big money in the scale of this. But I want to be a little careful in talking about this to be clear that the, there are pieces of this that would never have been recently part of the project so the comfort stations, the field lighting for athletics those kinds of things. I, I never anticipated we developed a price for them as part of feasibility, but it's a little bit. I think we need to be really clear about what's in the base project and, and what this athletic project is. So, because it's not exactly reducing the overall cost of the project. It's actually really adding something to the school project for public use. I think what you have done is wonderful but I just think that we need to get some clarity about that. And that will come with the schematic design estimate, and we'll have to have kind of further discussion about that. And, and just Margaret, to build on that if, if Dinesco can tell us the conduits and I thought even for the comfort station. It's not zero cost to put those in, but that could be, that could be a piece of information you have to be using with the CPAC committee because right now what is explicitly in is the dirt and the drainage. Well, we would have to do that work as part of the base school project, the MSBA would exclude it from reimbursement, but it's a decimal, it's like smaller than a decimal point and the price of the project. So the work to make to make sort of form the fields and stall those pieces mark, you know, everything that's required to do that would not typically be embedded in this way provide we estimated it as part of feasibility, but I think we're going to have to kind of get into the nitty gritty and I, I want again want to be clear that this is presented as it's a great project. It's not necessarily in itself reducing the overall cost of the school project in my opinion. Yeah, I think that one of the reasons that we wanted to seek CPA funding to have this additional separate source from the MSBA is to say there is money from the CPA to develop these parts of the project that are not specifically school required, right? So comfort. Yes, field lighting, a softball field, you know, the amenities and the amenities that you need for softball field is far less than even the the field lighting it's it's really not much to put in backstop and bases and that sort of thing. But by having that other source, it's not adding that it would not add to your cost of the school building project. Other, Rudy, let me just make sure there's not another question but then I definitely call on you. Any other. Kathy, I was going to ask a question similar to what Margaret asked I'm a little confused now so I think I would say it would just be really good and maybe Tim if you can help identify what part of the request is included in the sort of total project and what part would be the value add because my understanding was at least part of the $3 million request is already part of the project budget and would actually reduce that overall cost and maybe there's parts like the lighting and the and the comfort station that are additional but knowing what that split is I think will be important for the CPA committee and also to Kathy's point about maybe part now part later depending on you know what the CPA committee is looking at. The work associated with the field so the first light item that Mary showed with the project and the other two are that include irrigation is up is irrigation part of. Thank you. And Tim I just had a question. When you, I had asked him separately and I gave it to the team for the estimates and you of course we're looking at the same estimates but they rolled up to get from the one one and point two million of direct contingency fees so does that feel about right so when they feel questions on it, you know so it went from. And so everyone knows it's Jonathan's question went from around 1.2 to 2.5, you know it was not a small add on for the contingency the design and the overhead so is that in the realm of the numbers that were shown. We're in the realm. I don't know about all the breakdown and percentages and what was in contingency what was in marking up for soft costs. But the overall numbers look right but the actual breakdown I without looking at the. That's what I can share. I can share what we did. I mean it's it's kind of a bottom bar of that table to get from direct to construction costs we added 38% because that's kind of that's what it looked like it was in. In the cost estimation to get from their direct to construction and then to go from construction to total project cost for soft costs we add a we use the 25% you know, addition there so that's how we got from direct to construction to total project. Well, you know what I'll do is after this Maria I'll just resend that to them because I think you're going to need, at least someone saying, you know, blessing blessing that know that that 2.5 very much appreciated thank you. So, Rudy you had your hand up. And just obviously part of our intent was to help reduce the ask. So, the field costs are important because they're there essentially a dual use they're both for school and serve a community recreational purpose. So, we want to make sure that that that help for the debt exclusion asked is in how we phase this so. About the lights I just wanted to add the point that the lights actually will help. As you saw from Maria's presentation there early slide we're losing some field space effectively in the new plan. That's by allowing a different timing of the field use into the evening actually effectively increase the community playing field area, because you can running the softball in the evening. And then that freeze up field space, you know, the day for ultimate and so forth so there will be an important add on. I'm not sure it has to be phased. As you know we got a question or two about doing that. So just wanted to make that point about the lights the lights have a function besides convenient they actually effectively expands the community field area. Because we're, you know, you have those fields that are overlapping where you can't play ultimate and softball at the same time, but by skewing the time of use, you effectively get more space. So I think you heard Donna say that they, if they run the conduits, it would set up so it's on a separate meter because one of the issues has been that the school doesn't bear the cost of the after school non school use. And that's been a little bit of a contention but but keeping that completely separate, you know, makes a lot of sense to be, and I don't know if that was ever figured out whether the current lighting is on the town meter separate from that was a question that came up. In speaking with facilities, school facilities and Amherst track, the, the metering is not currently separate, it doesn't appear to be. So having it separate makes sense. Yeah, that with that does make a lot of sense. There's potential for Amherst recreation to charge a surcharge for evening use to offset the cost of running those lights. And as I was researching field lighting and bill you probably know a lot more about this. And there's potential to have solar powered flood lighting also. I found some projects around the country that that use that separate to the solar for the school. So, Mike, before we, I think, I'm not seeing any other hands up but Mike, are there any questions you might have from the school because I know that was one of the concerns the metering and, you know, the comfort station looks like it's near enough to the road it is on its own sewer line I mean whatever that connection is because it's pretty far from where the school bathrooms will be so I mean that would have to be figured out in some way. Rupert. Oh, I just was going to throw out the idea if we're looking at trying to figure out how to pay for ongoing costs that we might want to look at metering irrigation water as well to share those costs. Yep. And so thank you Rupert for that and thanks folks for coming and doing the presentation doing the work and the submission. You know, I think, you know, I reiterate what I said earlier that's why I didn't have my hand up because I know I've said this in other meetings is, you know, my main priorities is cool and I appreciate the thoughtfulness of the presentation today as well as the partners, how we're trying to make sure that the community site and use supports the school instead of conflicts with it. So I just wanted to share my appreciation for everyone working on this both in the design side as well as a community interest side that that remains at the forefront. So that's really all I had to say thank you. I in that regard, I think it's really great that the new design gets rid of the lazy river and sort of pulls the fields more to towards the school building, because the fields are obviously during the daytime during the school day time, they're they're a facility for the school and will be used for recreation by the students so I think even though this proposal seems to separate community use versus school use. It's really overlapping and drawing those fields near the school with no water barrier and sort of right next to the play space I think is going to be great encourage the kids to use the fields during the day and I think that's one of the functions you'll have them right there. So I want to be conscious of time. It's 1010. So if there are no other questions for the committee on this gets presented to see pack on the give me the date Maria. December 1. And if you'd like you can there's you can watch our recreation commission presentation that's that's up on Amherst media YouTube as well but December 1 is when we go before the CPA. Hey Tony do you have one point because I want to open it up for general public comment too. Yeah I just wanted to make a pitch for a perhaps a vote of support. From the elementary school building committee I think the CPA committee is going to ask us, what does the school building committee think of this what do the designers think of this, are they on board. So once you have a chance to ponder it and think it over and discuss it it would be fantastic if it was a possibility to get some vote of support from this committee that we can bring to the CPA committee on the first of December. Thank you. So, I think with that. I am ready to open it up for general public comment and I could return the three of you to the audience but if you just consider that you're, you're not here in terms of responding to general public comment. So, is there, is there anyone I see one. I see one hand is up right now for public comment. And I will bring you in Bruce. Hi, for things actually all to do with what just been said. And particularly as relates to the committee and to the design process I think first of all I support to what Tony just said I've made a number of applications to the CPA. There's always the historic commissions endorsement that we're after but the committee vote is really important, and this does seem like a very contiguous activity here so I encourage the committee to deliberate and with the idea of foreign support. And the, the lighting, I've already sent this through to the CPA through my colleague on the planning board who's the CPA representative I guess and has to do with the lighting poles that exist. Great value, I believe, in those existing I think Cedar wooden poles which are way taller than they probably need to be so that they could be locked off at the ground and even buried or however they might be but I think that lighting budget might be lowered by the salvation and reuse of those wonderful wooden poles. Looking at Maria's plan for the softball which I think was very helpful to see how all of those activities could be lined or will coexist on those fields that made it for me anyway. I'm a member of the public easier to understand the, the, the value and how value is extracted from this very large amorphous grass area. I wonder though, whether the two softball fields the outer band lines could overlap. They were showing just touching tangential. And if they were to be able to overlap a little that would allow that infield that that that stop that that backstop construct structure that this advocated in the southeast corner could be pushed further in and it was like it was a tight fit and I think if those field lines were able to overlap which I think for the level of play that we're talking about here would probably reasonable that might be a benefit to the flexibility of the land. And finally, this may or may not be useful but I've had over my years considerable experience with the composting toilets and so forth and on the surface of it a composting toilet is very good fit for this kind of activity. What's not obvious to me is that with the this the very level slope and the high water table feasibility might be challenged, but I don't know where the sewer lines run and I don't know how difficult it is to get there but depending on how difficult it is to get to the sewer line and this can be established to make composting toilets accessible in the location shown with the ground conditions we've got in the topography and so forth. I would at least dismiss that possibility before I move to a more conventional sewer connected toilet because these composting toilets are very good fit for the kind of need that is associated with sports field tie way stops camping trials and all those kind of things. It's a good fit for this kind of activity. Thank you. Thank you Bruce. So, I see both Rudy and Maria have their hands up as public comments so Rudy then Maria. I just wanted to make again the point that I think it would be good to add a connecting drive between the two loops in order to increase the flexibility of the site layout. The convenience potentially during non bus hours and potentially even some safety advantages. One of the great advantages of the Fort Riverside is that it has two entrances, and I see the merits of separating the bus loop from the parking loop during bus hours. But I think you could capture that efficiency and that advantage, while also capturing the advantage of a two entrance property for the parking lot. The connecting loop, separated with a bar gate that could be, you know, open and closed during bus hours and signage at the beginning of the southern entrance that excludes car traffic during bus hours. So I hope you'll look at that as a possibility again, because I think we'll make the, especially night events tournaments things like that where there's going to be heavy parking lot demand or even teachers and staff coming in after the bus hours, being able to use either entrance will take pressure off of the northern entrance onto Southeast Street so I hope that will get another look. Thanks. Thank you, Rudy. Maria. Thank you. I will say, in response to, to Bruce, I'm ashamed that I did not think of composting toilets myself. Thank you for bringing that up I think that is a really valuable thing to explore. And also the reuse of the poles. Yes, curious George reduce reuse recycle love it. In terms of, I'll just give you my softball thing. The other part of the, the outer part that curved part of the outfields overlapping is that you don't have to worry about it with me hitting the ball this far, but there are people who hit the ball country mile. So having overlapping fields would prevent two games from occurring at the same time which they have historically in the past. Two softball fields at the same time so that would be the, the issue there. There is no fence planned for going around the outfields which is fine. So that wouldn't be in the way but it's really outfielders crashing into each other in center field. I don't see any one else with their hand up. Let's get back to the committee Rudy your hands still up but I'm assuming it just didn't go down. If there are any final comments or questions and the one thing I just want to remind everyone is that the two weeks from now we're scheduled for the 130 start time this alternative and and Alicia Miracle has been able to join us for the 830 start time so we are thrilled that you're here. So just I may or may not be able to be there. So Jonathan in your volunteer role as the chair when I can't my, our daughter is having surgery that day and I just don't have the time of the day and it's in New York. So, there's a strong chance I won't be there but I wanted to have make sure people have in their calendar and we're not. We haven't been meeting interim in in between for the design subcommittee. I think we may want to schedule a sustainability committee meeting and that hasn't been scheduled yet because I know there's been a lot of modeling with the EUI with the windows. We just heard about the ceiling coming down the height glazing so that that look on are we still on target and are there any decisions that meet to be made so that has am I correct on it and Tim we haven't scheduled that yet but that will be something that we'll be able to do as we gather all this information correct. That is correct we haven't scheduled yet but we are expecting relevant results at the end of next week that would give us the ability to have that conversation so we will be reaching out to schedule that soon. I'm not seeing any hands up. I want to thank everyone including bill who stayed to write to the end which we appreciate very much and I can't tell you to me how exciting this is and Angelica I don't know whether you caught it but there's not just room for dining tables but they're thinking of the can be artwork outside to so this responding to using the out of doors as much as possible is part of this design and I will start to try to see how we get this into some district meetings council meetings so that the public starts to see and I figured out a way to embed your little movie of the building and it really works well in a presentation because you talking so we we can think of that as a soft roll out of people starting to see that there's something more than the school building committee is working merrily away. Thank everyone else and I don't see any hands up so we are adjourned at 1021 on Friday. Thank you. Thank you.