 So, the only way to install and to consolidate the way for us is to share the notes to replicate these learners, to replicate all these national resolutions that we are developing here. So, that's the only way in order to protect the whole region. Good morning, everyone. My name is Ani Dasgut. I am the CEO of WRI. And welcome, and welcome to all of you watching online. You know, it's been a fantastic forum this year because there's so much about nature this time. And you feel it, right? I've been, all of you, been to. And I am mostly interested also in nature that we are actually specifically talking about one of the greatest biome in the world, the Amazon Rainforest. An extraordinary thing happened at Cal and Glasgow. I don't know how many of you were there. Preston Duque and 140 other leaders of the world came together and pledged to stop deforestation by 2030. Not only that, it wasn't just a pledge. Twenty, about 19.5 billion dollars were pledged to actually fund that work to stop deforestation. So, the recognition of this and how important it is for our biome, our systems to work, to love us, to work for climate change in the world to take place of our three big rainforest system. This is the biggest system. So, we know this, right? All of us know this, how important the system is. The system itself, actually, we just published Global Forest Watch just a few weeks back. The numbers are not positive. The numbers you just heard about the deforestation numbers. So, of course, the world needs the Amazon Rainforest to preserve, to thrive. Today, we're going to take a slightly different angle to the discussion. We're going to take angle like what do people, millions of people who live in the biome in multiple countries, what is their economic outcome, what is their social outcome, what transformation does need to take place. So, the outcome is standing forest, free-flowing clean rivers, increasing biodiversity. What is the system change we're going to do? What is the kind of conversation we're going to have today? We have a fantastic panel. I'm going to introduce them as I ask them questions, but I want to tell them what the construction of the panel is. We have two leaders, two countries, part of the Amazon system. We have two bankers who are trying to finance investments in the Amazon system. And we have an academic and a banker in the past who have been thinking about it. So, that's the structure. One question is the first, but then hopefully we will have a free front question. President Duque, you know that I'm going to go to you first. President Duque from Columbia, I think this is your fourth year of leadership there, right? And you've been working constantly on the Amazon Rainforest, but also heeding to the science of tipping point, of what is going to happen. We all want to hear in this years of actually leading, not Columbia, but the region, pushing Letitia back forward, what are the lessons for us to move this forward with momentum? Well, first of all, Ani, it's a great honor to be in this panel, and thank you for being the leader of this panel. Ricardo, Madam Vice President, and two great bankers, the president of the BNDES, and the chief economist Obita, it's a great honor to be here with you. So I'll begin by saying this. In the 1970s, Latin America, and especially the Amazon countries, made a big move creating OTCA, which was the treaty to protect the Amazon. And OTCA was there for a long, long time. But what happened is that all over the years, the issue of protecting the Amazon lost the weight it should have at the presidential level. So it was in 2019, after we had been almost a year in office, looking at the challenges that we had to protect this very important biome, that I called other presidents of South America and say, let's get together, and let's build a presidential pact to protect the Amazon biome. And that's how the Letitia pact came together. And we had President Bolsonaro sign it. We obviously were there. Peru was there. We had Suriname, we have Guyana, we had Bolivia, and Ecuador. And the interesting thing is that we left ideology aside. So it was not an ideological debate. It was not the right. It was not the left. It was all together thinking about how to protect this biome. And so the first lesson is we have to elevate this to the presidential level, to the presidential discussion, and to the political action. The second thing is we have to be precise in what are the objectives to be addressed. The first one is we have to stop deforestation. And in order to stop deforestation, we have to make moves that are based on carrots and moves that have to be based on sticks. Now, on the carrots, for example, in Colombia, we should have the creek to cut all the illegal wood production in the region and try to give incentives to use Amazonic products and have a cycle that is sustainable. Copuazú, Acaí, we did a Kamukamu, we did a Sachainchi, and we started working with communities. So they no longer have the incentive to get into the illegal wood production. And instead, they can have a cycle where they can produce in a sustainable way and they get the private sector to buy those products. The other element is based on our nature-based solutions. So declare protected areas, sustain the declaration of protected areas, and be able to pay the families for those environmental services to conserve the process of rebuilding and the process of conserving. And that goes also intertune with the idea of a circular economy, produce conserving and conserve producing, so the damage is not made there. And then the stick. Destroying the Amazon is an environmental crime. In my opinion, it should be called an ecocide because it's affecting the whole world. And what happened is that all of the crimes that were connected to those practices didn't have imprisonment and didn't basically have any meaningful sanction. So we passed an environmental crime bill in the Colombian Congress, but we launched the Artemis campaign with the Colombian Army and the police in order to do more surveillance and start pushing out those deforestation lines that we had in some of the national parks, including our national parks in the Amazon. And the other interesting thing is that we turned, for the first time in a country in the Western Hemisphere, we put the protection of the environment as a matter of national security. And today, we have more than 1,000 troops in Colombia who are planting frailejones in the high-altitude ecosystems and are planting trees in the Amazon and are working with communities to protect those symbols of the Amazon. So those are connecting the dots. And last but not least, and this is something that emerged out from the discussion, we have 40 million people living in the Amazon biome. So people in the world don't realize that there are cities there. But those cities have to combine carbon neutrality and nature-positiveness. And that's how the strategy that we launched here at the web two years ago called Biodiverse Cities came to place. And I'll finish with this. We need to get the mayors. We need to get the private sector. We need to get all the communities to understand that a biodiversity in the Amazon has the highest responsibility, which is to protect the ecosystems and make this sustainable. So those are the lessons that I'll take. And maybe the invitation, because we have bankers here and Ricardo has been a politician, a banker, an academic. So he comes second and I'll say this. Green financing is the most important way to monetize the protected areas and the net zero policies there. And if we get the funding, we can give that funding for the families, the peasants and the communities building nature-based solutions. We started with 10,000 families in Colombia that are now being paid for environmental services and connecting this with the green taxonomy, with the green bonds that we have issued. I think it's the best way to monetize and provide those resources to the communities. So that will be my lesson, Sammy. Thank you, President. Okay, also, the whole systems approach you have taken and pushed forward, how the different pieces work together. I think it's a critical lesson from what you have done. Well, I'll come back to you. Madam Vice President, I'm going to go to you. Vice President Volote from Peru, social inclusion is also in your portfolio. What are your incoming priorities for the Amazon biome, especially on this tipping point? What are the things you want to focus on as you think about the Amazon from your perspective? Thank you very much for the panelists, as well as the rest of the members of this panel. And also, thank you, the audience, for being in this web that is so important for our region. Peru is the second country, the greatest country in the Amazon region, almost 60% of the Peruvian territory is the Amazon forest, the rainforest. But we should also say that this part of our region was historically forgotten by the state and so much so that we have big rivers and our sisters and brothers from native communities don't have rivers up to the date. That's why President Pedro Castillo generated management policies to attend such sisters and brothers from these communities that have been forgotten historically. But what we are concerned with is, for instance, the way it is affecting the Peruvian Amazon in a negative way and this is due to illegal tree cutting and deforestation in the last 20 years, over 200,000 hectares have been deforested. This is sad and I would like to ask private businesses to support us to recover this area of the Amazon because we all know that the Amazon of South America and Brazil and Peru, especially, is the lung of the world. And if the whole world doesn't know, if we don't tell the rest of the world that they should do something to stop deforestation, that they should stop this crime against the lung of the world, well, the lung of the world will be affected. What do we do with regards to social inclusion? We have a program in the indigenous language. We have over 500 projects where we have supported the households in the rainforest and I'm talking about over 60,000 households and they can get these brothers from the rainforest maybe supported by us so that their products with technological support from this Novataya program as well as with an economic support from us, they will be able to bring their products to the market. And I would like to thank the private company called Acha because through purchasing products as the drink, Aguache and Kamukamu, both are drinks that this company buys at a fair price and they've turned it into organic drinks. Aguache and Kamukamu are very famous for their high percentage of antioxidants and they're very much appreciated worldwide and these products are exported and these are products from the rainforest and not long ago we also visited with the ambassador of the Netherlands, the Achae area where our communities have organized themselves into a cooperative and this way they were able to harvest and therefore they joined their harvest and they got a better volume to export the best coffee and also we hope that through these cooperatives we will be able to sell our cocoa to the world so that we can offer the best chocolates that you eat here in Switzerland because here you eat the best chocolate worldwide. Thank you very much. I'll finish with Swiss chocolate. I must have chocolate. But this connection of inclusive economic development getting the coffee growers together is exactly one of the screening devices we need to talk about. Ricardo, I'm going to come to Ricardo next. As you heard, Ricardo has had many lives. Right now is the growth level at Harvard and Ricardo has been looking at this region for a long time. Ricardo, I have a specific question. In Brazil specifically, there's a lot of discussion and active discussion actually on bioeconomy and sometimes called bioecological economy. It'll be good to share with us what do they mean by that and what is the path forward here? So let me say I've trespassed into issues of the Amazon and the environment because the Moore Foundation asked us to think about sustainable livelihoods and so on in the Amazon and we started working on Peru in the Loretto Department where the city of Iquitos is and then they asked us to look at Caquetá, Putumayo and Goaviare in Colombia and try to see what was driving deforestation and how could you have livelihoods there. The first thing I want to say is that there might be a desire to save the rainforest but we don't necessarily have the knowledge and the capabilities to manifest that desire and in the same way as we don't have the technologies to stop global warming, we don't really have the technologies and the business models yet to do the vision that we all wish to have and that's in part because we are not slicing and dicing the problem the way it is. For example, there are major cities in the Amazon like Iquitos, like Manaus and that's not where deforestation is happening because we know that prosperity is about human interaction. That's why people try to live in these cities densely connected to other humans because that interaction between humans is the source of growth. That's how knowledge gets embedded into products and ideas and so on. The same is in that region. People could live more densely put together and use resources more intensely. The deforestation is happening in a big scale because people want to transform the forest into cattle ranching. That's not where the big populations are and that's not where the indigenous people are. That's not their business model. Cattle ranching is just a business and it is a business. It's an investment for these illegal groups if you want but to make the thing worthwhile you want to do it near roads so 90% of deforestation happens within 10 kilometers of tertiary roads. Who builds tertiary roads? Well, mayors and governors and what do mayors and governors do? They try to get reelected and what do people in the communities ask for them? Maybe roads, right? So if the country wants to save its forest it has to decide that some parts of the territory are not under the control of mayors and governors that can decide where to put tertiary roads. There has to be some democratic decision of saying we want the forest to be protected. That national decision might differ from local priorities and we take the power away from governors and mayors to build where they shouldn't be building. But secondly, we also found in the context of Colombia that different legal regimes have different effectiveness in controlling the forest. For example, there are three regimes in Colombia. One is national parks. Another one is indigenous reserves and another one is something that they call baldillos nacionales which is sort of like other reserves. We find that controlling for how far is the forest from the nearest tertiary road there's three times more forestation in baldillos nacionales than there is in national parks or indigenous reserves. So there's something about how the state exercises its property that's more or less capable of protecting the forest. Finally, I want to say that we have all this excitement about making these business models work about carbon capture, the price of a ton of CO2, etc. When we did the numbers for Colombia, the numbers yet don't add up. Maybe they do add up in Brazil and it's going to be interesting to see why. Let me tell you how distorted this market is. Europeans are willing to pay $100 per ton of CO2. The equilibrium price in Colombia has been hovering between $3 and $5. Now between $3 and $5, let me do the numbers so that this is the way I remember them. A hectare captures about 5 tons a year for about 20 years and then it stabilizes. 5 tons a year, say $5, that's $25. They put half a cow per hectare. You need 2 hectares for one cow in that region. So half a cow is worth more than $25. So you'd rather put a cow than leave the forest. Now at $100, there's no question, the Brazilians are telling me that at $15 it's sort of like almost no. So the prices are not there yet and why are they not there yet? Well, because the markets in Europe don't know if the forest that they're paying for is going to be there tomorrow. They don't know if they start paying for reforestation. What's going to prevent, that's going to create a new incentive to deforest so that you can reforest and get into a cycle. So you cannot do this away friendly market without government coercion and you cannot have incredible legitimate government coercion because there's a democratic mandate that asks the government to do that. So I think, and by the way, and I have not seen, maybe the Brazilians are going to tell us, I have not seen a viable business model where you get paid the ecological services of keeping the forest. So I've seen something that works for reforesting but we don't want to reforest. But that's not a second best. That's like a 17th best, right? We want to keep the forest. But how to pay to keep the forest, that's not a business model that I have seen work yet. But I'm here to learn. So you've said two things, one controversial and one not so much. But on the controversial one about, you know, powers between national government and state-level government, who decides what. Interestingly for all of you, there's actually a session on Parra, the governor, I don't know if he's here, who's leading the discussion just after this. Oh, here, okay. So I'm looking forward to that discussion about exactly what you think. And I'll come to you in the end of the discussion about who should build roads and who shouldn't. But your second point about why the markets are not working is very important, about lack of traceability and lack of monitoring, multi-year monitoring. One of the things, and this is this very small plug, one of the things we are working with many other people is to develop a geospatial platform that in a year or two, it's called Land and Carbon Lab, will be able to actually monitor any biological acid at 10 square meter across the world. That'll allow what Ricardo was just saying that if you actually paid for restoration, you will actually do a transaction that is monitorable. So I think things like technological shifts are happening that will allow to do the market failure that you were just talking about, but it's a very good point. But talking about business model, we have two people, two very important banks here. Gustavo Montesano, let's go to you first. Gustavo, heads BNPS. I know that when we met a few months back, you talked about you are actually actively investing in the Amazon region. Talk about the sustainable investment model but sustainable development model. You told me you're thinking about investing in bi-economy. What are we learning from that? And if you can respond to the Ricardo's point, his point is the economic model doesn't exist. That is profitable, right? Love to hear from you. Thank you. Good morning, everyone. I will answer the question, start by telling a personal history, which I think somehow testimony the moment you are living in Amazon now. And the scientists, they say that you are living a tipping moment for the bio-economy or the ecosystem in Amazon. I like to say that you are living a tipping moment for the bio-economy, for the economy in Amazon. And I think my history is a history of many Brazilians. I'm a Brazilian native. When I joined BNDS three years ago, I realized that I didn't know Amazon. Really not. I'm a banker, my professional. We're pretty many sectors. But as a Brazilian, I didn't know the region. And I was ashamed of that. So I took the decision to, like, visit the whole region. So I spot on, like, 30 or 40 places in the Amazon for almost two months, over the last two years. And this experience proved to myself that the signers of the market that we do live in a tipping economic moment for the Amazon is right. It's right now. And why do I say that? Just one step back, professor. We created a ward where we give the economic incentive to destroy the forest. If you look at 15 years ago, 20 years ago, destroying the forest was creating value, economic value. And we, society, the rich people, we created this ward. For the last 10, 15, five years, the mindset has changed. So the mindset has changed for this is a value there. The bio systems, the economic systems, the biodiversity has a value, which is a good news. So we live now in a proper mindset moment to understand the value of the forest, which is a very good news for South America, for Africa, and for Asian rainforest countries. The second part of this puzzle is technology. So technology is moving fast. It's quite fast, and we can even not imagine how technology will be available for five years to support this region. So mindset has changed. Technology is shifting. So let's put the work on the ground. Let's make it happen. So it's all about regulation, legislation, and putting the ground for the people from the forest to become entrepreneurs, and they want that. They really want that. I agree with the Vice President here that somehow we forgot those people for many decades in South America. And going to the last mile and having been caught alongside of yourself and President Duque, I do see that we're making the steps into this direction. So we reached out Article 6 in COP. Last week in Brazil, we launched the decree, launching the carbon markets in Brazil, and all the steps that we need are the same technology, digital access, infrastructure, and now land tenure are moving on. Of course, land tenure in Brazil, and it's not easy to be done, but it's moving. So all the pieces of the puzzle, they are moving in the right direction. And just trying to give a few examples about what the NDS is acting at the last mile, not only on the Amazon, but I say on the forced economy for Brazil. As of today, we are managing, we are preparing 30 million hectares of projects for concessions, environmental concessions between forest management and parks and visitation. We do think that these 30 million hectares, which like the size of Austria, is the largest environmental concessions problem globally. And while we are preparing those projects, we realize that we didn't have finance to support environmental concessions. So we put it in place, a financing line to support forest concessions. As we finance roads, ports, why can't we finance the forest? So now we can. In Glasgow, in COP, we launched what we think was the largest crowned fund reforestation investment in Brazil ever. So we launched in COP 500 million reais, roughly 100 million dollars a fund, from which one dollar will come from the NDS, one dollar from partners. We estimated that it would take two years to close the fund. We're going to close the fund almost nine months after COP with one billion reais and more than 13 to 15 partners between Petrobras, Vali, Heineken, Phillip Morris, Copper Citrus, Type U, Energisa, Estado do Rio de Janeiro, CDAI. So this work is as a kind of lab for taxonomy operation and mechanics of carbon credit for reforestation. So we see the corporate demand for that. We are announcing tomorrow our first auction of where BNDS is buying carbon credit. So we are officially buying the carbon credit from the forest and we want to act as an inductor of this market, buying the credits, working on them and selling that to the companies, showing to the farmers, showing to the people in the forest that produce the carbon that will be here to buy. On a separate note, we are working with Amazon universities in a bioeconomy CV. So we can graduate and form people in the bioeconomy or in the capabilities of bioeconomy. And lastly, working with blended finance in order to create guarantee funds to support the bioeconomy channel across the Amazon. So there's not one big shot. It's a couple of different actions where we want to tackle environmental services, the carbon credit money, I would say goods from the Amazon, Kakao, Acaí, et cetera, et cetera, and people, tourists. So in the bioeconomy, we're working three layers, environmental services, goods and people visiting and buying from the Amazon. Thank you. I'm going to come back to you on the carbon credit market that you have talked to. We have another banker from Brazil. I'm Mario Mosquita from Itaú. Mario, it was 2020 signed the Amazon plan with other important banks from Brazil. And it's been two years now and you're working very much on the Amazon. Just talk about how that pact and working with other banks has helped mobilize or what the experience has been to take investments in the bioeconomy. And as we just heard from Gustavo, what is the experience and how do you see this moving forward? Well, it's an honor to be here in the Spano. I mean, as President Duque mentioned, there are 40 million people in the Amazon, 30 million of which live in Brazil. And this is a relatively impoverished region of the country. So it's an issue of incentives. We have to incentivize the population there to find alternatives, right, to the forestation. We, as a private sector institution, we are not isolated from society. We interact with society all the time. And we, alongside other banks and other private sector institutions, felt that we shouldn't wait for the government to move. We shouldn't fight the government. We should cooperate with the government. We should move at our own pace, right? And then we agreed with Bradesco and Santander in 2020 to set up the Amazon plan. And we started working on that implementation. It started last year throughout the pandemic, right, regardless of what was happening. The plan itself has three fronts. It's providing alternatives, developing economic alternatives for the population, right? The second is a sustainable infrastructure. And the third is on the basic human rights front. I mean, the Amazon region was where the COVID pandemic was worse in Brazil. Remember the Manaus variant? The Manaus variant was the variant that killed more people in Brazil than all other variants. So part of our effort initially was actually helping that region throughout the emergency. At the end of the day, we think that there should be economic alternatives, right? Be it alternative cultures, as was mentioned in the film we saw earlier, or simply a market that pays enough for people to keep the forest standing, rather than bring it down to use as a space for cattle, right? So we are also trying to help the development of carbon markets so that the prices are right and incentives are right for people to stop the forestation. Maybe it's my background as an economist, but I think that if the prices right, people stop what they are doing, right? So changing incentives is probably going to be more effective than coercion, especially in the region as vast as the Amazon. It's very difficult to implement, you know, coercive measures to hinder people moving around. So that would be my first take on the issue. But Mario, that's exactly a question. What is that nature of the economy? What is the shape of it? What is the social values of the economy? That allows the forest to stand, right? We have nine minutes left. I'm definitely going to go to the governor. So there's a mic there in a minute. I want to ask quick questions and be short in your answers. Madam Vice President, I want to go to you first. You have two Brazilian bankers next to you. You won't get a chance again. Because you talked about inclusion in whatever economic model there is, right? The people need to benefit. Otherwise, nothing of this will work. That's very effective. What are the things, two of the, actually one of the two of the biggest banks, what they should be looking out for as they start investing and develop the models in the Brazilian bio? Okay. Thank you very much for your question. Well, here in Peru, our forest is very diverse. So when I started saying that Peru is very much affected, it's because there is biopiracy. And this is something that makes us think, and I would like to invite the bankers here and the pharmaceutical companies to go to the country to speak with our native indigenous peoples who know ancestrally what plant it gives, how each plant is important for the health. But you need to speak with them sincerely and you need to buy to purchase these medicine plants that save the world at a fair price. This is bioeconomy. Now we're being impacted by biopiracy because there are huge companies, pharmaceutical companies that go there and extract our plants for free. And there are all our indigenous peoples, our women and girls impoverishing themselves. So this is not only because the state has completely forgotten them, but it's because also due to this biopiracy that is killing our communities. So here in this world forum, we invite all entrepreneurs, pharmaceutical companies, banks, industries to go to Peru, but not only to buy. Peru is a huge country. We want to generate a pharmaceutical industry in our country. We don't want them to go and extract raw material. We want to have an industry in Peru. And in this way, we will give jobs to our brothers and sisters in the forest, our Peruvian brothers and sisters in the forest. And in this way, they won't become poorer and poorer because in fact they are rich. And I would like to give the right importance to the OTCA. We know that an agreement was signed in Peru with the CAP to generate more revenues for the Amazon. And I would like to say, since President Duque is here, the eight governments that are part of OTCA, we will be able to work closely together and promote this agreement because OTCA exists, but it's like it's there and that's all. So it's important because I know that President Duque will leave the presidency in a couple of days, but your follower President Duque, your successor President Duque, needs to promote this cooperation among the countries in the region for us to be able to protect and promote the Amazon for the development of our peoples. So the Iquitos is the most important city in the forest or town of the forest. And let me tell you Iquitos and Peru is waiting for you. Thank you very much. Thank you, Vice President. I'm going to come to this cooperation model in a minute. President Duque, I wanted to get back to you on the question of carbon markets, which is fantastic here, BND is investing in it. Historically, as you know very well, it is not actually when it's red plus started, it got not a good reputation for actually helping the communities that live in that area. What are the things we could do? What have you learned to make sure that is actually helpful for the community? Well, the first thing I would like to say is that if we want to create prosperous environments for people to live in, you know they can live in towns and cities in the Amazon. They don't have to live spread out. Deforestation is not happening by the indigenous people mostly. It's happening by larger investors with longer horizons, with the aspiration that they're going to get property, eventually property rights on the things that they're deforestation and so on. They have a longer term horizon. They're land speculators in some sense. So that's not about, so we have to separate deforestation from poverty. And there's a lot of many ways in which we can create jobs and human activity in much denser uses of that space in these areas. I mean, Florencia is a potentially thriving city in the Amazonic region of Colombia. It's being constrained by the fact that you don't have primary roads that connected better to the rest of the country. They don't need tertiary roads into the forest. They need better integration to the rest of the country and then better attraction of people there. There is a lot that Colombia can do to increase agricultural output by using more intensely the land that it has. It has plenty of land. By controlling for the amount of land that it has, it produces remarkably little. So you want to generate activities that concentrate production, that use land less intensively and other factors of production more intensively. So I think, but going back to the question on carbon markets, I've seen funds that being created and announcements, et cetera. I don't see the cash flows that are going to pay back those loans. And that's where we need to think. Where are the cash flows that are going to pay back those loans? And once you tell me, well, it's Acaí, et cetera, what guarantees me that Acaí is not going to become sort of like a reason to deforest or a reason to interfere in the forest. So I think that it's great that we're exploring. It's great that these initiatives are happening. We need to focus on how much we need to learn to actually make this vision of more voluntary, more incentives-based and coercion-based approaches, whether we can make them work. Because up to now, I think it's more an aspiration than a reality. It wasn't okay. Madam Vice President said a few days later, you actually have a few months left in government. Three shifts, I think, so it'll be nine months. Yeah, you have time. I think the question was very important, though, about collaboration among government, because it's multi-country, right? The biome is multi-country. What are your views and lessons for how does that collaboration among government go forward? What do we need to do? Well, Ani, first of all, I think that's why these discussions are so enriching, because I think my perspective is not as maybe pessimistic as Ricardo has put it here, because I think at the end, we have to realize that no climate action is going to work if we don't understand that it is the world's objective to protect the Amazon. So when people ask me, what is the best technology to capture CO2? Well, the Amazon has the best technology in the world to capture CO2, and that's our trees. That's the best technology. So if we understand that we have this biome, that without it, no climate action is going to work, I think now when we think about how those countries that have contributed the most to the climate crisis, they have to contribute resources to protect the biome itself. And also because if we're moving to have the leaders pledge for nature in order to have 30% of the world declared a protected area, there are some countries that don't have that 30% area, but they could really contribute to protect that 30% within the Amazon biome. So the resources that are being put from the whole international community, they have to be also devoted to protect the Amazon biome, which means you can call it a subsidy, you can call it a compensation, but that ought to be done. So that's issue number one. The second thing is when we look at the models, what is it that is causing deforestation in the Amazon? So there are three enemies there. First enemy, illegal mining. So we need the whole world to understand that we need to fight illegal mining. So where are all these yellow machines coming to the Amazon? How can a yellow machine that weighs 500 tons get into a town in the Amazon? Where was that machine bought? Who brought that machine? What's the traceability? I think we all need to work because the companies that produce yellow machines in the world are not that much. So we need to focus there. So the third element is how is it that we're going to fight the illegal crops? So coca, people don't regularly know that cocaine is the biggest emitter of CO2 within all the drugs in the world. In order to plant one hectare of coca, two hectares of tropical jungle are destroyed. And in order to produce a kilo of coca, 40 gallons of gasoline are used and almost 10 kilos of cement are used. So we need also to make this clear that that's an enemy that we have there. And then you have illegal cattle. And in the case of Colombia, and that also helps us to work among government leaders, we have a massive, massive land that has been used for cattle production. We don't need that much land. So we need to start reducing that land, have more rotation, and try to compensate the emissions having more silver pastures. And that's why we had the goal of getting to 100,000 of silver pastures. We got to 158,000 hectares of silver pastures. But that has to be put on the discussion. And now on the other question that Ricardo has placed, which is very interesting, is agroforestry is also part of the way to recover. You can recuperate some of the land that you have lost with agroforestry, and that agroforestry also generates an income for those communities. So I think there is an optimistic view of this. But definitely, Ricardo places a very important question. The ethics behind the cost of a ton of CO2. So you can't tell me that a ton captured in the Amazon is $5, and then a ton captured in Belgium is $50, because that is simply unethical. So I think we have to get to the final discussion on the right pricing, the ethical pricing, and then that's where the bankers come. Because you have the price, and what you need to generate is the immediate cash flow in, then you start compensating, and then you guarantee the sustainability of the flow. And I'll finish with this. We have moved on the voluntary market, but we have moved on the regulatory market in Colombia. But we issued the green taxonomy of Colombia, first country in Latin America who issued the green taxonomy. And now for ESG bonds that start from the national government that can also go to the local governments, that is a way that we can get money in to make the short investments while we start receiving the compensation that should come from the rest of the world as well on the contributions to cut down CO2 emissions and connect COP26 with COP15 on biodiversity. Thank you. Governor, can I bring you in? I know we have a whole session about your state. Parbaho, can I'm pronouncing it correctly? There was a discussion between what should states do and what should central government do in this discussion of roads in the Amazon forest. I would love to hear your view. First of all, the institutional commitment and the institutional strengthening so that we can set forth state-level policies, both sub-national and federal state policies that somehow guide the initiatives and that can lead the way when it comes to the development of the regions. Most notably the state of Pará, the state where we have most greenhouse gas emissions in Brazil. We concentrate 42% of the Amazon GDP, 40% of the population and the entire region. And right now we have some state actions that allow the reduction of deforestation lands, guiding the population towards a new model where we might be able to maintain some extractive action, but no longer with the extensivity logic, but intensivity so that a state can still produce food while having the logic of bioeconomy in our state. The largest producer of acai in the world, also the largest producer of cacao in Brazil, and for us such activities, such bioeconomy activities should allow for the reconciliation of peoples with the economy and with the inclusive process that will translate into restoration and a new relationship with this tangent forest. It's important to say that in addition to the bioeconomy, if we want to change the concept of land use and the forums are important in this sense, we need to compensate environmental services. It's important for us to understand the value of this tangent forest and it is a new model to convince people that in the past occupied the Amazon for land ranching, for crops, to change this mindset because presently one hectare for crop if compared to one hectare of a standing forest, we have a 10% difference only. So we needed to change that. We needed to monetize the standing forest to encourage bioeconomy and I believe that the carbon credit market is a new model that will allow to conciliate peoples' economy and environmental preservation. To join us in the next session, I don't know exactly where it is. We have a minute left. Look, we have heard from our bankers from Carlos, we have heard from the vice president, but President Duque, if I can give you the last word, so to speak, the fact is, all these good things are happening but on totally we are not actually moving fast enough or at scale in the Amazon biome. So there needs to be a step change, right? A step change of something. Let me hear from you. You have nine months left, you said, in 89 days. Three shifts? Three months? I want to hear from you from my experience. What should all of us look for the step change? What other things need to do differently? So there is actually a real shift in the outcomes for people, for the forest and for the rivers in the Amazon. So, Annie, I'll say that we are full of commitments in the world, so we have committed to be net zero in 2050. That's a very long term. We have committed to cut by 51% our CO2 emissions in 2030. Good goal, but still long term. So I would say that the most important decision at least in Latin American countries in the shortest term is to get to the 30% declaration of protected areas. In our case, we're now waiting until 2030. We're doing it in 2022. But then the thing is, if you declare that, what is the next thing that has to happen? And I have to say, we need to connect COP 15 with COP 26. In COP 26, we have all the world leaders. In COP 15 on biodiversity, it's like the leaders are not there yet. But the cheapest way, listen to me, the cheapest way to do a very important impact is to commit and achieve zero deforestation to 2030, protecting the Amazon biome and all the ecosystems in Latin America. And I mean the cheapest is because we can mobilize a great amount of resources and cut down the deforestation rate. In Colombia, when I assumed office, we were losing 200,000 hectares per year. We have been able to cut down that rate in more than 40%. Am I happy? No, it should be zero. But we have to keep on cutting it down year over year. And then my suggestion is all the ones who are here, private sector, public sector, if we concentrate of cutting down the deforestation rate in the Amazon biome by 60%, 70% in the next three years, I think we will have the best contribution of connecting the protection of biodiversity with getting to net zero emissions in the timeframe that we have settled. That's why my opinion is net zero, nature positive. Both concepts need to come together and if we get the right pricing and we connect that pricing with the payment for environmental services. And I'll say something on this very briefly. We can expect that everybody who gets paid for environmental services is based on a sound economic revenue-generating model. It might get there, but at the beginning, we have to subsidize. We have to provide the income and we got to get the families to get into the daily behavior of protecting. Once we have it there, while we have the right pricing, maybe we'll have the most sustainable cash flow. But this has to be done right now. It's the cheapest, it's the fastest, it's one with the highest impact in the world. Well said, well said. I hope that we get the pricing right soon. Thank you all of you for joining us. I want to advertise the session that's going to happen next with you, Governor Farah. Thank you all of you joining us. Give a big hand for this fantastic panel. And we have a lot of work to do together.