 Hello everyone. Welcome to our second CCC OER webinar for 2018. I'd like to welcome you this afternoon to another wonderful webinar we've scheduled for you. My name is Regina Gong and I am from Lansing Community College. I am the OER project manager there and I am also the VP for professional development here at CCC OER. We're thrilled to have folks from the Washington State Board for community and technical colleges and the Florida Virtual Campus to talk about the findings that they have from their student surveys on college textbook affordability and its impact on our students. So for our agenda today, I'll just give you a brief overview of what we do here at CCC OER, including the activities that we have for you in the next month or so and then we'll hear from our speakers. We'll do the Florida research from Florida Virtual University first and then the SBCTC and then after that we'll have Q&A. So if you have any questions just feel free to type them in the chat box and we'll answer them towards the end of the presentation. So I'd like you to meet our speakers. We'll start with Boyong Che and Sarah Delaney of SBCTC and then we'll go and then we'll do Robin Donaldson of Florida Virtual Campus. So Boyong, would you like to say hello and introduce yourself? Hello, thank you for the opportunity. My name is Boyong and I'm a policy associate of open education at the Washington State Board for community and technical colleges. Hi, this is Sarah Delaney. I'm a research analyst here at the Washington State Board. Hi, Robin Donaldson. I'm the director of instructional research and member services at Florida Virtual Campus. Thank you, Boyong, Sarah and Robin. Just I'm just going to give you a brief overview of what we do here at CCCOER. For those of you who might be new to CCCOER, we are celebrating our 10th year anniversary this year and since we were founded, we were founded to support community college mission of open access. Basically, we want to expand awareness and access to high quality OER. We also support faculty choice and professional development through webinars such as this and our face-to-face workshops for faculty and staff engaged in OER projects. Ultimately, our goal is to improve student access. So just to give you an idea or a quick update on our membership map, we'd like to welcome our new members who joined us this year. If you are here, a big shout out to you. We have new members from Butte College in California, Central Maine Community College, Lakeshore Technical College in Wisconsin, Montwa-Chuset in Massachusetts and the Rayrattan Valley Community College in New Jersey. We actually have 65 CCCOER members, 11 system-wide memberships across 28 states here in the US and we also have members from Canada as well. So if you want to see a list of the schools we have as members, just go to the CCCOER.org website and under that you'll see our membership list. Also just want to remind you of this, our big annual celebration, which is the Open Education Week. It's gonna happen in less than two weeks. It will be on March 5 to 9 and it is actually run by our parent organization, which is the Open Education Consortium. So basically what Open Week does, it's a global celebration and an annual opportunity for us to create awareness on our campuses, sharing our Open Education projects and activities with our colleagues around the world. And so you can actually highlight the activities and projects that you plan on doing during that week by submitting it and you know that those projects will be available for the whole year for other people to take a look at. So I suggest you take a look at Open Education Week.org and see the many activities that our colleagues around the world will be doing. Also want to give a plug to our Open Education Global Conference. This year it will be held in Delft, the Netherlands, on April 24 to 26. I personally haven't been to any of the Open Ed Global Conference, but I hope I'll be able to do that next year. It's actually a wonderful opportunity for us to meet educators around the world who are focused on broadening Open Education and expanding access. So if you are able to join Open Education Global Conference this year, we'll welcome you. And so moving on now to our presentation today. We are so lucky to have our speakers today who will talk to us and share with us results of their survey and research regarding the impact of affordable learning materials on students. Most of you have probably seen or familiar with the surveys done by Florida Virtual University. I myself use the results of their survey when I do my presentations here on campus. And you will hear from Robin the many interesting things that they are doing, what they will be doing. She's actually been doing the survey since 2010 and would be interesting to hear what's coming up next for the FLBTC survey. And as for our colleagues at SBCTC, Boyung and Sarah will share with us key findings from their survey of 10,000 Washington community and technical college students. This survey is very, I mean it's unique, I think, because they have partnered with the Washington Community and Technical Colleges Student Association to deploy this survey. And it will be interesting to hear from Boyung and Sarah the results of that. So without further ado, let me turn it over to Robin. Here we go. Okay, I'm requesting access now so I can go through the slides. Okay. Okay, there we go. Okay, I'd like to explain a little bit about Florida Virtual Campus. We're actually not an institution. We don't have students here. We are legislatively mandated and funded through the Florida Legislature. And what we do is we have several units and we provide statewide innovative educational services to Florida's K-12, well, K-adult rather, students. And one of our roles is to try and continually find ways to improve affordability and accessibility at our colleges in Florida. And one of the ways we do that is to conduct research on student success and affordability. So during this presentation, I'll be providing you with a summary of our 2016 statewide research on the cost of textbooks and instruction materials. And as Regina said, we've been doing this since 2010. And then I will also give you an update throughout as far as how things will be changing for 2018. We'll be administering it this year also. So Florida has 40 public higher education institutions. And we've got, this is back in 2016, but we have almost three million students with uncompleted college degrees. And college affordability, as you know, is usually viewed as a financial challenge for the textbooks instructional materials. And that's been an ongoing concern here in Florida and other states. So what we've done is we administer this survey. In 2016, we had more than 22,000 students participate. And the findings are suggesting that the cost of textbooks and materials is negatively impacting our students' academic success, not just their financial debt. So between financial debt and success, it hits them doubly hard. So the reason we administer this survey is to provide, since we're legislatively funded, we want to provide the state university system and the Florida college system as well as all 40 institutions. But basically, since 2010 to 2016, a snapshot of what was happening in spring 2016, or spring, as far as the cost of textbooks and how it's impacting them. So statute was changed. And so where before we used to only ask them about textbook costs, we now also asked them about instructional material costs. And then for 2018, we'll be deploying that through March and April. We also are collecting cost data on what the students would have spent in fall 2017, and what they will spend in 2018. In addition to really get us a better focus on the impact we're also trying to understand, we'll ask them how many courses they're taking in the spring term and the fall, and then how many of those courses required them to buy textbooks. Because as you know, there's a huge initiative for Z programs and zero cost or OER courses. So we want to find out if they say they're spending, let's say, $300 in spring, well, how many courses are you, how many courses is that actually for? They might have been registered for four, but only two of them are requiring them to buy textbooks. So as I mentioned, the purpose is to inform the institutions, the Board of Governors and the college system. We get system level support in the deployment of this survey, which has been really had a huge impact on the participation level. So and the objective is to to really find out from the students how much they're spending in fall 2017 and spring 2018, how often they're having to buy books that they're not using, how it's impacting the cost is impacting them and the choices they make, the study aids they like, and how this is changing over time. So we had 40 institutions, like I mentioned, 22,000. And then here you can see the distribution of who's participated in it. And in 2016, we had a new university that joined that was created and they joined into this this survey. And I just provided you the link to the legislation why why we actually do what we do. It addresses access and affordability. So in Florida, over 53%, they were spending 300 or more and 18% were spending 400. And that's just in the one term that's in spring. And as I mentioned, we weren't aware of how many courses say they were enrolled in. So it'll be interesting to find out that aspect in 2018. Then we had the course materials, instructional materials. So those are things like your my math lab, my physics, etc. So so in addition to the textbooks, they're also spending at link, you know, 200 or less. But some of them are spending two to $400 in a few of them, 6% are spending 400 or more on instructional materials alone. And so in terms of the cost of our the textbooks, it was our college students. So we do a comparison of college students and universities also. So it's the college students who seem to be more heavily impacted by the cost of the textbooks and instructional materials. So for textbooks, 56% were we're spending $300 or more. And that's versus for the university side, about 45% were spending 300 or more. Then we have for instructional materials cost. Again, 12% of the college students were reporting spending 300 or more on their course materials. And that's compared to the 9.8 of the university students. So you can see for some reason it is impacting our students more heavily. The this survey does not get down into to the details with the students as to why so we can't answer the question why this is impacting the college students more. All we can see is that it is impacting them more. And one of our other questions that we want wanted to find out is so of the college the books that you're being told you're required to buy them. We're also wanting to know, okay, are you actually using them? And it doesn't seem like a lot. It may not seem like a lot to you. But to go from 2012 to 2016 and for them to report a change from 1.6 books to 2.6 books. That's a big jump. And again, we're not sure why that was occurring. So then we've got the financial aid component. So this goes into the debt and it also impacts them as far as when they can get access to their book. Because as you know, many of your students have to wait until their financial aid comes in before they buy their book. And so we also want to know how much it was impacting their overall college debt. So what was interesting in this is that there was less financial aid covered for textbooks in 2016 versus in 2012. And if those who are receiving financial aid 20% were reporting that the financial aid covered the total cost. But 50% reported that the financial aid only covered some of the textbook costs. And then the 29% reported it didn't financial aid didn't cover any portion of their textbooks. So then we have, so what's the impact? How is this really impacting our students? So it's not just financially. It's their progress through their degree program. Because as you can see here, it may cause them to withdraw from their class, you see you've got 20% there, or even drop a class. So what happens is they enroll in that course, they find out once they get in there that that textbook, they can't afford the textbook. They may have been able to afford the course, but they can't afford the textbook. So they drop the course. That's going to impact how quickly they may get through their degree program. So here you can see 45% are saying they don't register for a specific course, or they may take fewer courses. 47% are saying they take fewer courses. This is troubling right here. 37% they're not buying that textbook. And that can cause them to earn a poor grade. No surprise there that it would cause them to earn a poor grade without a textbook. And then then you've got those who aren't buying that textbook. And they feel that that's caused them to fail the course. This number right here as an adjunct instructor seeing that 66% are reporting that they don't buy that book, that's really troubling. So one of the key findings is that well, hang on a sec, is also let's see, did I do the back? Okay, so here this was just the comparison here. So here you can see that 2012 is blue 2016. So here is this is gone up a little bit here, as far as not purchasing the textbook. And 30 this went up to they're not buying the book and they say they feel that it's caused them to earn a poor grade. More of them are reporting they're not buying the textbook in it. They're failing the course. So then we looked at so what what are they doing to try and reduce their textbook course. And as a faculty member, I have to say this this is something you hear over and over again, they're buying the book from somewhere other than their campus bookstore. And almost 50% are saying they're buying used books and then and then renting books. So but here right here you can sell for almost 49% are saying they're still using that campus bookstore. Some of the libraries will keep a digital or hard copy of a textbook. And here you've got shared shared book with a classmate 23% almost 24%. And one of the problems with that is that when you share a textbook with a classmate, while on it looks like it would be okay to do that. But what happens is is once you've got a test or assignments to you may not get that book until midnight or later. So or somebody who actually bought the book might say stop being willing to share it with you. So while on the surface surface that looks like a good idea, this also has problems. And so so overall are the big take away from this is is that really getting access to your instructional materials that shouldn't be a barrier to them being able to access a course and be successful in it. And it shouldn't be a barrier to their being able to complete their degree in a timely manner. And what we want to do here in Florida and I'm sure in other states is try and assess whether or not the use of the OER is having a impact on student success their time to graduation and whether or not they're carrying a heavy heavier load because they are able to register for courses that aren't requiring them to buy textbooks. And the student success rate is not just having access but having access on day one. So those are those are some of the areas that we would like to explore more heavily. I did want to mention for the 2018 survey if you your institution or your state is interested in having us administered the 2018 textbook instructional material survey for you, we'd be happy to do that. There isn't a cost. What we do, this is a free service that we provide our institutions. So what we end up doing the way it works is we provide our institutions with the link to the survey and the institutions are responsible for putting it in their LMS or communicating it through whatever campus channels they want to use for surveys. And then after it closes what we do is we then send each of the institutions their data as well as the you know the survey instrumental give you the nice graphs and charts and we'll provide them that. So if your institution is interested in having us do that we'd be I'd be happy to talk to you about it. My contact information I believe is in one of the earlier slides. So Regina, how do you want to handle questions? Um, you want to wait till the end? Yeah, maybe we'll wait till the end. Okay. Okay. Um, this is oops. And I'm having trouble. There you go. That's all I've got then. Thank you. Thank you, Robin. Welcome. Um, now we are turning over to Boyung and Sarah to show us the results of their surveys in Washington. So there's going to be a hand over here. So excuse us for a bit. Sarah, I'm going to stop share. I'm here. I did already. Hi, can everyone hear us? Yes. Thank you. And can you see the screen that we are sharing? Yes, we can see it. Perfect. So thank you again for the opportunity. We are without further ado, we're we'll go right into it. So first some contextual information to help you understand how this research was initiated and where it is going from here. So Washington SBCTC is actually a state government agency that supports our systems study for community and technical colleges. And our agency manages a coding manual that states how to code and categorize the courses. So all of our system college courses are electronically coded based on these rules. So I'm in there. We actually added a brand new code that tags the courses that use open educational resources in May 2016. And after that, we conducted a statewide survey asking for the input from our faculty members on the name description and the criteria of the code. And based on the feedback received, we modified the implementation guideline for that OER code. And after that, meanwhile, during the 2017 less-lative session, a supporting bill passed requiring that colleges mark the courses that use OER and make that information available at the time of registration for our students. So OER code was safely added to the coding manual with the implementation guideline. And now there is a supporting law that mandates this coding. But what happened was there was this feedback that consistently given during the faculty survey. And it was that feedback was about the need to mark those courses that use other affordable course materials that are not technically OER, such as library resources or really inexpensive commercial textbooks. They don't really fit into the definition of OER because they are fully copyrighted with all rights reserved. But those resources do offer more affordable options for our students, and they do need to be visible at the time of registration as well. So we have begun another journey. And this time to establish a low cost code. And we immediately faced this challenge to identify a cost threshold, you know, like to tell how low is low enough. And we realized that the answer really has to come from our students. So we have conducted another statewide student survey, and that is what we are presenting today. The findings of the survey. So that's the whole background. And these were the specific research questions that were investigated during the survey. And identifying the threshold for the low cost code was the primary purpose of the survey. But we were hoping to explore the influence of the course materials costs, and also wanted to have a chance to hear students' student ideas to improve the affordability issues of the course materials in our system. And here are the steps taken for the survey design and distribution. So from the beginning to end, from the beginning to end of the survey distribution, it was clearly a student led process. It started with creating a partnership between us, state agency and WACSA, Washington Student Association. And textbook affordability was one of our student associations, let's say the agenda for years. So we bonded immediately and we devised a survey together. And then WACSA was in charge of distribution entirely. And the members of the Student Association of each college distributed the survey on campus. They went to the school cafeteria, or they waited outside of the classroom holding iPads, or they were set up a table outside on the club days, talking to fellow students about the survey. So remember, the survey was done during the winter time. So their contribution and their contribution was beyond what it was beyond what anybody could imagine. And when the survey responses reached over 5,000, we sent an email to all system councils and commissions asking for support. And those system groups were really moved and inspired by our students' effort. So they really rallied voluntarily and connected with their Student Associations to increase the number of survey responses. So as a result, from this one time student survey, we received over 10,000 responses from our students. And we have organized our preliminary finding in a dashboard to offer more interactive experiences. And Sarah, our data analyst will guide you through the major findings. Hi, this is Sarah. I'm going to go right to the what I'm calling our splash page of our dashboard here. And I knew that Boyan wanted this to go out nationally and maybe even internationally to OER people. So I wanted to give people a sense of context of where we are and who we are. So you can see that we're listing all of our 34 colleges, and we have a map that indicates where they are. And we have some information at the top that was the kind of demographic information that we were interested in for our students. So we kind of wanted to crow about how many people participated in the survey. And then another category of students that that we pay particular attention to are those that intend to transfer to a four year. So in our vernacular, those are those are transfer students. So we wanted to show out of these 10,000, 6,000 were intending to transfer. We also wanted to know what their financial aid status was. And we're always concerned about getting our students through. And we know if our students aren't carrying 15 or more credits per quarter, they're not going to graduate on time. So we we ask them if they're just meeting the financial aid criteria, which would be 10 to 14 credits, 15 or more, or if they're they're doing less than less than 10. So just this last page is going to show that for you. And another thing to note, because I'm this is also an introduction to Tableau, Tableau allows you to encode a lot of information. So right now, color is encoding, whether it's a community college or technical college, but I have a control here that I can now change it by college size. So now color is encoding the college size. So if you're from a medium sized community college, you can check out what one of our medium sized community colleges did. The other thing that you can do here or that you should notice is that the size of the circles and the length of the bars matches their relative participation in the survey. And another Tableau tip here is that always hover over something because a tool tip will pop up. So right now I'm hovering over South Puget Sound, which is located in Olympia, Washington, just a couple of miles from us. And if you click on it, all of a sudden, you're just going to see South Puget Sounds participation level. And you'll see everything else recede into the background on both the map and the bar chart to help you find things better. And you click on it again, they come back. So it also works the other direction. So Edmunds was our college that had the highest participation level. So if I click on Edmunds, the numbers now change at the top. So they just reflect Edmunds and the map recedes so that you can find out where Edmunds is. And it's just outside of Seattle. So now I'm going to go to our first of our findings pages. And as Bo Young said, one of the main reasons that we wanted to do this was to establish a threshold. And in this case, I think that this is establishing a ceiling. So our students said $50 would be a reasonable cost to pay. And the way that I would look at that is that that's a ceiling. They would also be happy if we said $30 or $40, but 50 would be the ceiling. And again, this is Tableau. So hover over it and you'll get a tool tip. Click on it. And I'm going to show you some information about the students who selected this amount. And you can see that it's roughly 50-50 on whether they receive Bate or not. So if you remember, Edmunds was the college with the highest participation level. So let's change that. And the way I'm going to do that, I'm going to deselect everybody. So we're not sending a query through to the dashboard at all. So everything disappears. And we go down here and we find Edmunds. Click on it. And now we've repopulated. And if you notice, $30 was the most popular with Edmunds. So let's click on that. And you'll notice that Edmunds has more people that aren't receiving financial aid. So that's worth paying attention to on this. So we've done it this way. So colleges can go through and look at themselves. Somebody who's a legislator could go through and pick everybody in their district. Somebody from outside of us can go through and remember the college size. And you have to remember from the first slide, but you can go through and pick out colleges by college size. And one more thing I want to point out here is that we're encoding the information with color here so that the lower costs are a lighter blue and the higher costs are a darker blue. And you can see that they're not quite sorted in the same order that we had people that would tolerate $100 textbook. $100 instructional materials, which would include textbook and other materials. But when you look over to the right for comparison and new entry level chemistry book would cost $210. So if you're already paying that $100 textbook does sound better to you. Let's go on to finding two. We asked just some information for people to indicate where they're getting their funding from and personal funds came out on top with that. Then now let's start looking at these this other set of questions on the influence of course materials and the Florida survey has similar kinds of things. And we also found that we have many of our students who are requiring the borrowing the required materials from somebody else. And I find that very interesting. So again, the way I've designed this, if you click on it, you're going to find more information about those particular students who have who often borrow the materials and click on it again and you bring everybody back again. So we have some of the same questions on whether people are dropping from a class or not registering. If I'm remembering right from Florida, we have fewer students who are actually dropping or withdrawing. So our students are finding a way to persevere through this and you'll see some of the adaptations in the student recommendations later on. But we also we have students who are not registering for specific class or they're taking fewer classes. As to having the required materials, we have many students who are going without the required materials. Again, you can click on this, it's going to show more information about who they are. We have people who don't have the required materials on the first day of class and they've taken other classes due to the material cost. We ask people specifically early on whether they were getting financial aid or not. And they weren't consistent with how they answered that question and with how they answered this question. So we wind up with a smaller subset if we're only looking at the people who said yes, they're receiving financial aid. And we're finding out that a lot of our students either never or rarely have their aid in time to purchase their course materials by the first day of class. You can click again and it's going to show you more information about those particular students. And again, you can filter by college if you desire. So we ask students, like if you had a hundred dollars to invest in these various ideas to improve textbook and instructional material affordability, how would you do it? And the most popular answer was to develop more free or low cost course materials on it. And you click on that and you can find out the number of responses that people had to that. And now we're coming to the section that I think is the coolest thing about about displaying data this way. We had lots of student comments and people wrote lots of words in their comments on this. And you can go through here and comb through it to see what our students had to say. So there's there's two filters here. So if you click on here on the top one, you'll get a subset. So if we if we now select course materials, then you get these sub themes that you have to actually click on in order to see the number of comments that people had. Now I'm going to turn this back over to Boyoung who has these student recommendations in a higher summary level. Do we all see the PowerPoint screen back? Yes. Thank you. So as you have just glanced, our students have recommended various strategies for improving textbook offerability issues in our system. And there's suggestions range from the issues of instructional practice to course materials acquisition to financial aid to policy and business practice. So when it comes to instructional practice, many students recommended to recommended to avoid costly homework website access, which they are required to purchase on the top of the expensive commercial textbooks. They also expressed the concerns about ever changing book editions and they wish to be able to use older editions. And they also demanded a way to evaluate the usefulness of the required materials claiming that often only a small portion of the books is is used throughout the quarter. And many strongly recommended that their department and faculty members to be more proactive in searching for the free and open resources. All the years I mentioned that our students to persevere and one of the ways they managed to take classes without a textbook was that they would go out and search for the affordable materials that offer matching content. So they so they do know that equivalent materials with quality do exist out there. And finally, many wish to see a clear distinction between required and optional materials in the syllabus so that they will be made they'll be able to make more informed choices when it comes to purchasing the books needed for their coursework. And when it comes to a course materials acquisition, they also do share brilliant ideas. And one of the strongly recommended and strongly and frequently recommended ideas was this the development of statewide or college wide book trading system where our students can donate to trade or exchange the exchange used books. And some also suggest suggested a subscription based rental system like Netflix for the books. And our students also strongly recommended avoiding the materials that cannot be resolved. And they wish to have a longer checkout period for the library text reserves. And when it comes to the financial aid, many asked for creating a textbook fund for needy students to help them out help them out of the financial emergency so that they can finish the program as scheduled rather than being delayed because of the cost of the instructional materials required by one course. And when it comes to policy, our students, many of them argue that we need more statewide policies that promote the use of open and affordable materials. And they wanted to have more student involvement in the affordability discussion statewide. So and so we and this is actually the end of our presentation and we are going to paste links to the slides research brief and the dashboard on the chat window. And they're all CC by licensed, of course. So please feel free to share them out. And we wanted to note that this is only a preliminary findings. So a full report with detailed data collection process and student narratives and and our recommendations will be released in March. So please stay tuned. And if you have any questions, our contact information is on the slides and feel free to contact us any time. And we are going to stop sharing this screen so that Regina could share back the original PowerPoint. Yeah, and while I'm doing that, boy, um, um, our participants have a few questions for you. And I'll start with Amy Huffer. Amy asked, have schools raised concerns about this available data being used for ranking purposes? So ranking purposes, meaning that in terms of number in terms of level of participation from each college, could you elaborate your question a little bit? Um, Amy, maybe you can unmute yourself. Okay, let's see. Um, okay, concerned that college specific info might be sensitive if used for comparison with other schools? Well, if it was if if you refer to the number of response survey responses received, it was by no means to those information was not displayed to increase the competition between the colleges. It was more about showing the level of interest from our students and their level of commitment and motivation to participate in this study. So that actually chart was requested by our students and our many of the system counselors and commissions, and they wanted to see the specific data from their own college. So it was created based on the demand from our colleges. So I think their desire to have the to learn about the level of interest from their college was really was real. And I there was appreciation expressed from many of the system colleges to be able to figure out what's currently going on on their campus. Okay, well, thank you for that answer boy young. Um, we also have one question from Quill. Um, and she asked, do you think that the how would you invest the $100 question in your survey? It's influenced by the fact that the WACTSA, who was distributing this survey, a pretty focused on OER as a cost savings measure for the past few years. She's wondering if the results would be different if the survey was distributed through the institution instead? Oh, that's actually a really good question. And we were aware of the we were aware of it before the survey was sent out. So actually our focus when it comes to a full publication of this report, our focus will be on sharing the recommendations submitted by our students, not about how they ranked those recommendations. So we so that's almost a secondary finding. And what we would be really focusing when it comes reporting would be those creative ideas that were directly recommended by our students without having any preconceived ranking or ideas. This is Sarah. I heard the question a little bit differently. Our survey was was student led. So there was no connection with a national or we are group. So can you say that question again? It's a little long, Sarah. So it wasn't submitted under the umbrella that that where we are answer the survey, it was it was initially brought out by the students themselves. Okay, so it was labeled as the I actually have this survey instrument instrument in front of me. It it was labeled student survey affordable cost for class materials. And I can ask this question off like this is quill. And and my question was actually the student group that was sending that wax has they mean it they've been talking OER with our legislature in Washington state for years. So they are it just depends on how they shared the survey at their colleges. And I'm mostly just playing advocate for the other side of the answer to that question. I think that the creative answers they came up with are much more useful in a variety of ways. But I think that there is bias in that that particular group has been talking about OER as a if they were doing the survey one on one with students in their cafeterias, for example, they've been advocates for OER for, you know, five or six years. You know, actually, I could address that question. I'm easily because it wasn't so we as as we mentioned, the total number of responses for this one time survey was 10,000. And extra and then the number of surveys that were conducted by that one on one connection with the student leadership were, I think the percentage is really low compared to the overall number of the responses. We after after we reached the 5000 mark, the rest of the 5000 responses were received after our system groups started posting the link to their website or LMS login page. So they didn't have any chance to have any kind of pre have preconceived conversation with any student groups. And then all they had was on their survey invitations and by those school school admins was that here is your chance to share your ideas about textbook affordability. Click this link. That's all they had. So I believe that majority of the responses were received without having any preconceived ideas. And if you actually read through the student comments, the shared in the dashboard page, you can see that their level of understanding about free, but free and open materials and affordability issues were pretty matured and deep, a lot more than I mean, it's pretty matured and deep and educated answers. So I could tell that for them, it was it was nobody's research or charity project for them. It was a survival issues that they think they ignite about it. Thank you, Boyoung. I there's one question directed to Robin. This is for Kevin Kelvin. And he asked this the survey cover courses with the highest cost or course in which students are less likely to have access to the textbooks. We don't ask them specifically what courses they're taking. So there wouldn't be a way to to answer that question. However, what we do ask them is we relate all this back to what degree they're seeking and what major area of study they're in. And we'll include that detailed analysis in the 2018 survey because the college system has provided us a way to collapse. We asked them about gosh, it must be like twenty six different areas of study. And that's too many to get an analysis of. So the college system at least has provided us a way to collapse it down to a more reasonable number so we can give them some data on the major. Okay. And did you say you're going to start collecting for the 2018 survey in April? What we're going to do is the email will be going out as soon as the IRB gives me the final approval. And so it will be open in Florida all of March and April. And then if a an institution or a state other than Florida wanted to be engaged, I don't think it would be a problem to open it up through the end of May if that's what they needed. Okay, well, thank you. And we have one more question for Boyung and Sarah. What percent of the 10,000 student response represents the student population? How long was the survey available for students to participate? I think the total number of our student population in our study for community and technical colleges is about 365,000. And the study duration was three months starting from the end of September 2017 and ended on the December 27, 2017. So for about three months, did that answer answer your question? Yeah, I think so. Yes. Okay. So if you have any more question, just feel free to type it in the chat box. If we don't get to answer it, we'll get back to you with answers. But before we end, I just want to make a plug about our forthcoming conferences again. I've mentioned about the Open Education Global in Delft April 24 to 26. The Open Ed Conference. So this one is always held here in the US. Last year it was in Anaheim. And this year it's going to be in Niagara Falls in New York. It's going to be on October 10 to 12. I am in the program committee. And now we're actually contacting our keynote speakers and soon we'll announce that and also open call for proposals. So and of course, stay in touch through our community email. It's free to sign up. If you go to the CCCOER website under Get Involved, you can take a look at that. We'd love to have you. We always have a very engaged and active participation in our listserv. So we invite you to join us there. And let me see. And if you have any questions. Oh, okay. So before I forget for the Open Ed Week, we have here at CCCOER, we are featuring OER adoption showcases. That will happen March 7 from 9 to 2 Pacific Standard Time or 12 to 5 Eastern Time. We will be featuring all throughout those five hours. Community colleges from Arizona, California, Michigan, Texas, Virginia, and many more. You will hear, you know, OER degrees, how they've implemented, including details about their OER projects in their respective institutions. So I invite you to attend. If you can't attend the whole five hours, you can just pop in and out and would love to have you join us. And again, this are our contact information. If you have questions that you'd like to ask Boi Young or Robin or myself and Una, our emails are here. So I think that's that's the end of our webinar. I'd like to thank you all for joining us. And please watch out for our upcoming webinars. Just go to CCCOER.org to see our future webinars. We'll see you in March. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you, everyone.