 conversation for what is remaining. I've got Ines de Danza from Keru, Niko Locke. Where is Keru? I think it's Meru. Okay, I'm not sure. I don't think so. They impose their ideas on us. We Africans, we are the ones copying. I think that's what you mean, the Western culture. We are not proud of our culture. I totally agree with you, sir. Lawrence Kips, Kiprono. For me, they are exposing their culture. For example, taking photography of boys in Jandoni, and their parents end up seeing those photos at Facebook, which is against our culture. Okay, big shame people of Western land and change. Okay, I meant US. I meant Europe, not Western Kisumu. Yeah. Okay, but I thank you. Watching from the golly. In fact, they impose their ideas. Okay, thank you so much. Thank you so much. We're Paul from Nyeri, Ndani. Amanjems, hi. Dominic Africans should be proud of our culture. Thank you so much. And Dan Kilinda, Dan Nicolopt, watching from Wundani. Africans should be proud of our culture. And Anthony Bih, from Rungai. They impose their ideas on us. Have you asked yourself why Saturn is viewed as black, ugly creature, and God is vice-versa, meaning white. Okay, fine. Okay, I hear you. I hear you. Okay, keep those comments coming on our Facebook page. Do you think that the West are, you know, values African culture? And you can also tell me, do you think also we ourselves Africans are proud of our culture as some of the comments that have come in? I'd like to hear you what you're saying. And also in the conversation that we are having about pro-choice, about the matters of abortion, you know, let me know what you think. Right now I'm going to take a few questions from my audience, three questions, brief questions, and then we have, we'll answer them. So we can start from that end. Let's go. Okay, my question goes to Dr. Okafo. From your own perspective, can you describe Africa as foolish for allowing a certain, a certain summit to take place in our continent? You see, from, from the first statement, you say that Africa is seen as a, as a downside for concept trade, for concept trade. So do you think we are foolish enough to allow such kind of summit to be conducted in our continent? Yet it is viewing us down through our culture. Very good. Thank you so much. You can pass the mic to the gentleman right there, to the lady, the lady in front of you. All right, go for it. It's technical college. My question goes to Teresa. Does the use of contraceptives increase sexual immorality in Africa? Does it increase sexual immorality in Africa? Thank you so much. And lastly, we've got the gentleman. Yeah, go ahead. Thank you very much. My name is Peter Son. My question goes to Dr. Richard. And the question is, you talked about pop, population. So, and you said that we, women being allowed to increase the population, this world shouldn't be the case, should be the case here in Africa instead of using contraceptives. Now, if we take a case like Japan, they have always been against the issue of population, and they have never encouraged this. Recently, 2018, a good statistic shows that the country has so much developed, and most of the people in the area are the aged who have made development take place. Taking a country like Uganda and Kenya, developing a number of family members being more than 12, has even brought more poverty in Africa. So, generating numbers in terms of population won't start to increase the rate of poverty in Africa. Thank you so much. Thank you so much. So, the questions are there. So, I'm going to start with his question. You can take up that question. You can respond to him directly. Yes. I wouldn't say Africa is foolish to have allowed the conference to hold here, but I would say that Africa should have actually declared the conference unlawful, because there is something known as freedom of expression and freedom of association, and I feel that pro-family people who expressed interest in attending the conference ought not to have been blocked, because that in itself shows a lack of transparency, and I think the government should have immediately declared the conference unlawful, and also considering that most of the things being discussed in the conference are against religion, our culture, and against our family values. So, all these things should have been brought to the table, and it's either whoever is behind this conference declares their true motives and also accepts our terms of reference, and we dictate what we feel is important for our development and our population, or the conference is declared unlawful. So, this is my thinking. I don't think it's foolishness, but I think our government ought to have been a lot more responsive and taken into consideration the fact that parliamentarians in Kenya were not accredited. For me, that is disrespectful. Okay, thank you so much. You want to take his question first, or? Yes, I think so. You want to add it to something? Start of a little bit from where Dr. Teresa started. ICPD 25 is using the phrase accelerating the promise in sexual and reproductive health and rights. Young people out there, that phrase is deceptive. That phrase is deliberately designed to help you develop a softer approach or to begin to tolerate abortion, to begin to tolerate prostitution, to begin to tolerate the sexualization of your siblings and your children that you're going to have in future, to begin to tolerate transgenderism, if I would say that. And for some reason, the zero document has a commitment asking governments to provide universal health care coverage for sexual and reproductive health and rights, meaning that a person like me who wouldn't be okay with abortion on demand, my taxes will be used to fund abortion, meaning that NHIF, okay, where we all are contributing money, would cover all the diseases that are ailing us, including lifestyle problems like gender reassignment hormones and gender surgeries. So that's why we need to be careful with the resistance, okay, the resistance that our government put up. You know, our president spoke clearly that we are going to commit to those things consistent with our development agenda, and we are not going to deal with things that he has always called non-issues. Now, let me, as you take up his question, let me ask you something, so that you can answer that question of Japan. You know, the countries that have accepted what ICPD is saying are developed, okay. They have high technology, the countries are doing very well economically, they are doing very militarily, you know. So what, and for us who we are saying, no, we don't want that, we are not doing well by any stretch of imagination. I will start with China. China tried to walk that path. It had these numbers and it bought into that argument and they applied this one child policy, literally. As in you don't have one child, then you will be taxed if you had a second one. The result was when a woman would conceive, she would go to an ultrasound and once they would find the baby is a girl, they would abort the baby. So we get this whole generation of young men in a developed country and they can't find wives to marry. The next thing is what? Homosexuality. You get the logic, the connection of the problems that we are going through. So I would like to answer your question again in the platonic irony in Crito. You know, Plato asked this young man, do the gods, is something good because the gods like it or the gods like it because it is good. The same question I would ask with Japan. Do you think that Japan is developed because there are few or there are few because they are developed? It depends. If you choose to pursue the development path, the numbers will drop naturally. The numbers will get regulated. But if we choose to say that let's control population as an end in itself, pulling down the numbers, we are going to pay expensively. Look at it this way. The recommended ratio in a classroom is one to 40 children, isn't it? Okay, quality education if you go in a school and say one teacher, 40 kids, that's good. The academy is having it low, one teacher 20 or whatever. In my estimation, we young people who are looking for jobs need to know that for every 40 children, that's a job for a teacher. Every 40 children, that's a job for a teacher. If you understand that dynamic, if we treat our people and the babies being born as an asset, we are seeing jobs. Imagine the farmers out in Krinjaga, the farmers out in Nyandarwa, okay? The more people there are, the greater the market for what they produce. There's something connected to the economics of numbers there. It is not by accident that China and India are becoming an issue globally. It is their numbers. We have a continent here, Africa, with capacity to carry five billion people. We are only one point two billion and we are the largest resourced continent. Are we together? That the governments, which are having the lowest total fertility rate, you know, total fertility rate is calculated by the total number of women of childbearing age in a country divided by the number of babies born in that country, okay? In that area, okay? Once you get a result that is below two, that's what Dr. Kaforo is saying, below replacement. Now, Denmark, Norway, Sweden, all these governments that are deeply excited about funding our population control are below replacement. They are paying for women to have children. They are paying women to damage their ovaries and uteruses. There must be something that young people should see about that, whether those are real friends or they are not good friends. Okay. Interesting. And let me add to what he said. The economy of Japan is already going down. It is depleting. And the reason is because Japan is experiencing what is called demographic winter, which is the population of Japan is imploding. It is reducing. And so their economy is going down. So you can see that there is a strong relationship, connection between population and economy. Now, why highly populated places in Africa are not experiencing this strong correlation of feeling the impact is because we need to diversify our economy and we need to be more self-reliant because we have been blessed with rich resources. But most of these resources are taking their exploitation because these resources are taking out of Africa in their crude state and then refined outside our country and then brought back to Africa and sold at a very expensive rate. So unless as soon as our government begins to manage our economy better and as long as we don't have this problem of distribution of resources and as long as we don't have issues around corruption whereby a few people are benefiting and do not want the economy, the population to feel, do not want large families to be supported and do not want the people to feel the impact of the resources that we have, then the problem that simply going to continue. But I need to answer her question because she asked a very important question, which is, she said, is there a relationship between condom use and sexual immorality? There is a relationship because the problem is that what condom tends to do is that it tells you you can have sex and avoid the consequences of sex because it's a sex has a natural consequence. It could be pregnancy. And then the truth is that there are sexually transmitted diseases and sexually transmitted infections. Some of them are viral, which are incurable and some of them are bacterial, which can be cured if you discover it on time. So sex is such a powerful thing. And it's only safe when you keep it within the confines of marriage. Outside of marriage, there is so much to lose and so much to contend with. Now, sexual immorality is an addictive behavior and people who engage in permissiveness suffer consequences as a result of that addiction. So what condom tends to do is that it tends to give people a false sense of security. A married man would say, okay, I can have sex with a woman who is not my wife and she will not get pregnant, you know, or a young girl can say, I can have sex and use condom and not get pregnant. But that is not the reality. The reality is that condom can be, it does not guarantee 100% safety. It can slip, it can break, the material used in making condom is porous and some of the, and doctors need to tell the truth. You know, World Health Organization needs to tell people the truth about the condom. So condom can slip during sex, it can break, it's porous, there are tiny holes that some of the virus are even smaller than those those and can't penetrate. So to use the condom, you are really taking chances. You may be lucky today, tomorrow you may not be so lucky, you know. So there is a strong link because it gives us false sense of security, making people think that yes, you can take the pleasure, remove the consequences and I'm sorry, the consequences will still catch up with you sooner or later. Okay, and we also need to emphasize when she, you see, the sexual act is meant to create trust. And that's why we keep it within marriage. The young people know this. They will use the condom today. The other day, the third day, chances are they will not use it the fourth time. Chances are they will get out of the equation because the sexual union is usually meant to to bond people. Now you're getting to bond with someone who you don't actually intend to spend your tomorrow, spend your life with. So that's why the condom is not really a solution. It just grants false security, as Dr. Tresa says. The question that I might have to ask as we as we close it up as well, the world you are mentioning is a good world, is an ideal world. But what they will say is, but right now, there are diseases, there are problems young people are having sex. So don't you think therefore these condoms and these contraceptives are actually a necessity, you know, because okay, the ideal situation is sex should be within marriage. But when you look outside, these kids are having sex as young as 11 years. Okay, so do you want an 11-year-old kid who is pregnant or with an STD, or should we at least allow this kid to be to have, if it's at least having sex, at least be protected from the STDs and the pregnancy? What would be a better option as we close it up? I don't know who wants to start with this. Okay, I think you need to ask yourself, what is my objective in life? Where do I hope to go? You know, what do I hope to attain in life? You understand? So I think basically education is important, quality education is important, and people should aspire towards the good of this life, the higher goods of life, you understand? And we cannot just assume that our children lack control, because that would be to say that children are like animals that don't have any self-control. I think parents have a role to play as primary educators and need to form children in self-control, especially when their bodies are developing, you know, in the age of puberty, adolescence, they need guidance, they need, and this is the job of parents, not the job of the school. Condom is not a solution. I'll give you a scenario. It's like baking a cake, you know, and then putting poison in a portion of that cake, and then I present the cake to you and tell you, this is my gift to you, but when eating it, careful, you know, because it has 30% of the cake contains poison, but the rest of it should be fine, go ahead and eat it. Would you take the cake? Would you eat it? Or if you take a flight and then they tell you, you'll take the 70%, are you sure the 30 has not penetrated? They'll be taking a big risk in life, or you take a flight and you're told that this flight has 30% chance of crashing. Would you fly that plane? Well, unless I'm running away from zombies and from fire, yes. Yeah, no, I hear you. So I'm going to, Luis Moryo, Moryo Wanjiro is saying, following the talk very closely, the western countries have noted hidden gold in our culture, that's what they are after, we need to watch out. Okay, so now I'm going to give you a chance to, I'm going to give you a chance to say your final remarks as we close up the show, thanking you for, you know, helping us to understand what's happening at ICPD, and maybe if you think maybe I have left out something, maybe can give you a minute each to give you a closing remarks, I'm going to start with the gentleman. Richard? Yes, I need to point out that yes, it is true young people are sexually active. Actually, there's someone who asked me a question recently, they started the usual statistic, one in six of every girl, I think under 25, is sexually active or pregnant. But you know, you see it is one in six. When you flip it around, it means five in six are either not sexually active or they're not pregnant. Then it would seem that the wise policy has to be celebrating and affirming the majority and then helping the minority recover. The term we usually use these days is that young people who are not supposed to be sexually active, if they are, that's a form of delinquency, we need to rehabilitate them and return them to the flock. I hope you get the argument there. So we shouldn't be giving them the tools now. The sexual and reproductive health and rights that ICPD 25 is about accelerating, it doesn't care about the children actually. Its interest is to take the children away from their parents, sexualize them, make them consumers and participants in the sex industry so that the big sex industry makes money. A young kid of 10, once they are activated sexually, they will demand contraception. Take it or leave it because they still have to go to school and contraception is likely to fail so they will demand abortion. This is a business entirely and when the abortion takes place, the abortionists sell the baby parts. We know these facts about how they are selling the baby parts and making money of them. So it is an entire cycle and if they have not gotten pregnant, they've taken the contraceptives and the contraceptives give them cancer down the road. Again, the pharmaceutical companies make the money through chemotherapy and all this stuff. So it is an entire cycle that turns our generation and I appeal to the young people not to dive into the game because they are being used and this concept of sexual and reproductive health and rights is just about sexualizing everyone and making sure that the money makers in the sex industries continue to stay afloat. That's what I would like to say. We are opposed to ICPD, not for the sake of it. It has a very good three no zeros at zero maternal mortality, zero animate need for family planning, zero gender best violence, but the solutions they're offering are not good. So we organized side events for the purpose of offering alternatives that are consistent with our culture and our church teaching. We are offering the human dignity curriculum as an alternative to comprehensive sexuality education. We are offering fame and of a little less cycle and fertility awareness as an alternative to contraceptives and these things are scientific and they work 100%. But no one will invest money in them because they will not send money to the pharmaceutical industry. Richard, thank you so much for that. Yeah, I think Richard has made very important point about the vicious cycle, you know, and why we need to be very, very careful about this obsession about sex and sexual permissiveness. He said it all, you know, so I think our youth should be encouraged and we on the other hand should ensure that whatever law we accept, we should make sure that it intersects with morality. Morality is so important. We can be found deficit in morality because at the end of the day we would regret our action. So he's explained the vicious cycle. He's explained that there is a form of exploitation going on and he's explained that we actually had an alternative event suggesting authentic human solutions to the problems and these are alternatives we're offering and we hope that we will be given a hearing. And we're meeting tomorrow as they're closing in KCC. We'll be meeting in the Basilica tomorrow to pray from around eight o'clock and give a declaration. We are calling it the Nairobi Declaration on Life and Family. Nairobi? Nairobi, yes it depends on what you eat for supper. Okay, family first. Thank you so much Dr Teresa Okufo from Nigeria, the regional coordinator for World Congress of Families and Richard Kaketo, lecturer at Schathilik University of Eastern Africa and also from statt and Dominic from Kenya. Thank you. Thank you for making time to be on my show. I really appreciate. I hope that the conversation you have had today has been helpful to you to help you to help you understand what's happening with ICPD and maybe you still have further questions so take time to ask as we say the devil is in the details sometimes you know you need to go the details that you understand where the devil is hiding because maybe presenting himself as an angel outside but inside is that's where the devil lies so I hope that this conversation has been helpful to you my dear viewers and I watch again the show tomorrow from 11 to 12 and I hope the conversation will continue and if you have any questions ask them they can form parts of another show God bless you do have a good night and see you sometime