 As the federal government threatens to impose state of emergency in Anambra, the People's Democratic Party, a state commissioner and the Middle Belt Forum, registered their displeasure and disagreement. And President Mohamed Buhari presents Nigeria's 16 trillion Naira 2022 budget to the National Assembly. So, we wonder, should we borrow to fund the budget for the 20 joint economists on the show? In order to ensure the sanctity of the November 6 governorship elections in Anambra state, the federal government indicated that it was prepared to impose a state of emergency in the state. Now, this was said by the Attorney General of the Federation and Minister of Justice Abu Bakar Malami. In response, the Anambra state governor, Willy Obiano, disclosed that the threat to the declaration of a state of emergency in the state was not President Mohamed Buhari's idea. Governor Obiano disclosed this after a meeting with President Buhari in the presidential villa in Abuja. He reported Malami to the president on the matter. The governor also described the threat as unfortunate, wondering why he had not contemplated the imposition of an emergency rule in northern states during massive killings, occasioned by banditry. However, the People's Democratic Party PDP condemned the plan, saying that it was a ploy to buy the APC-led government to reek the governorship election come November. The commissioner for information in Anambra state, Don Adirumbra, also spoke against the threat stating that the Anambra state government had not experienced the level of killings recorded in Kaduna, Boronu Zamfara and other states where bandits had murdered many citizens. Well, we are going to be joined in the studio this evening by the Honourable Commissioner for Information in Anambra state, Don C. Adirumbra. He is joining us live via Zoom. Thank you very much for joining us. Thank you very much. And also joining us live here in the studio is a legal practitioner, Tundi Abdulameed. Thank you very much for joining us. So I'm going to start with you Honourable Commissioner because it's very interesting what's happening in Anambra states. First things first, we've seen reports and stories emanating from your state, massive killings on rest states, sit-at-home orders, I mean, the list is endless. And you are in the hit of preparing for an election come November. In fact, it's just a few weeks from now. And so it makes us wonder for those of us who are watching from the outside, who's in charge, especially for the sit-at-home order, I remember the last time we went into the streets and were speaking to people in your state and of course the southeast about the sit-at-home order, many complained that their businesses were suffering. Many were tired of sitting at home, but they were afraid mostly as to what would happen to them if they decided to go about their businesses. So I want to ask you, sir, who's in charge of the state in Anambra? There is no doubt, we'll say that the elected government of Anambra states is fully in charge. Once in a while, we can have one or two roguelicans who can come out of nowhere, cost a mischief and then disappear into the air, that's going to be good. Just two days ago, the governor and the after-presidential candidate, Professor Tukumasaludo, went on a campaign of two local government areas and the rallies were hugely successful. So many people, and we were very happy, singing, dancing, felt so much at home. We are continuing our 12 local government series. We are visiting every local government area. There's one of them, the Anambra states. I think the press takes to exaggerate the poor chance level of violence in our environment currently. Well, it's no more than two weeks to start with. Secondly, leaders are still running, judges are full every day. All of our marches are on, no disturbance, not even security men in any of the marches. The protests are near, thriving, only once in a while somebody comes, does some mischief and escapes. And for your information, by the way, you do have musculoskeletal and Anambra state no. We have recorded the 12 casualties in the last two weeks and the casualties include very unfortunately, the most revered son of Anambra states, Dr. Chike Akobebe, the husband of the legendary former director general of NAVNAC, Dr. Akobebebe. Dr. Akobebebe has also been killed, these are the two high profile cases, but I do know that in a place like by two states, as many as 18, one night, Zafara, over 34, Eruna, a bad self-figure, but Zafara sometimes 50 in one night. We have had only 12 in two weeks than Anambra states and I can tell in the next few days everything will come to an end. Well, I'm more curious, I'm so sorry to talk over you. I'm more curious, and I don't want to us in any way in the cause of this conversation to make light of the number of people who have been casualties, whether it be one or two, value is placed upon every life that is lost. But I'm more curious to understand why all of a sudden Anambra is facing what it is facing. I'm more curious because your government is in charge like you said from the beginning. So we want to know what do you think as spokesperson for the government is responsible for this recent unrest or uprising. And you said that recently you and your governor, the party, have been campaigning in two local governments. But we also have been made to understand that some of those campaigns were obstructed by gunmen. No, no, it's not possible. It was reported that Anambra, and it was not just your campaigns. No, no, no, no, it's not possible. No, we are sorry, Anambra, please, I don't understand, who gave you the report? It's all over the paper. We went to Anambra East local government area. We went to Anambra West local government area. Absolutely peaceful. We have not stopped for the moment. We are continuing. It won't be there. No, no, no, no. I've told you, we are fully in charge. Just wasn't in line. Some rascals, some criminals, strides from nowhere, and it's a chance to think about what's going to happen in Anambra, in the south east, for example, we are up to 30 persons, it's going to be killed in one day. In the states, well done, so, and nobody's thinking of having, sort of, imagines in any of these states, even in APC control states, like major states, and military aircrafts on the mission have been brought there. In Borneo states, APC control is set free. Nobody is thinking of, instead of imagining any of these places, rather, the glaciers have been held, and they were successful, and they were peaceful, and they were transparent. I want to move on from that. But you're asking, why all of a sudden? Yes. You're having this problem in Anambra states. You can guess the answer. You know it. It is evident to us that the killings we are organized. By whom? Politically motivated people. The events of the last few days tell us the direction we were coming from. We are comparing evidence. Once we have enough to prosecute substantial in cuts, we do just that. We go after those people one by one. But you mentioned that they come out from nowhere and then they disappear again into thin air. How are you going to be able to catch them if you do not know where they come from? Well, that's what I'm looking into now. And we are getting very useful leads for the past seven and a half years. Anambra remained the most peaceful state in the whole country. I will proudly tell you we are the only state in the last seven and a half years that has only experienced one bank armed robbery. One bank armed robbery, despite having the biggest markets, the whole of West Africa, open markets where people trail in raw cash. That's how peaceful Anambra state has been. Not one single incident of kidnapping in the last one year, for example. I don't know if there is any other state that has that record. And all of a sudden, from nowhere, innocent people are being shot. There is only one in the series of measures taken to import themselves on the leadership of Anambra states. How do you fail to discourage people from coming out to attend rallies that are now thinking of emergency rule? Very simple. The same people who did everything possible to stop Professor Saludo from flying the Abda Plan. They went to the estates of going to Brunikudi in Jagawa state. Twenty kilometers to the Jehre problem. And we fear the partnership being aware of this. They go to Kangeru, which I'm glad to announce that the cause of appeal sitting in Kani has, of course, discovered. But let me ask you, usually shared coincidence, that in the last five months, Anambra state has had five commissioners of police at a peace. In the last five years, sorry, five months, five commissioners of police, can you be that ready? You will come to Anambra state as a commission of police before you can know your left from your right. You have to go. Another person comes. Does that make for stability? Does that make for proper police? So I want to put this last question to you before we talk about the state of emergency and its implications. So you're insinuating or you're trying to point us in a direction. You're saying that all of the unrest, the killings in Anambra state are perpetrated by your political opponent. And when you say political opponent, it means that it could be the PDP. It could be the APC. Is that what you're saying? And again, it's a two-pronged question. Why would the people in those parties want to kill the husband of a former NAFTA head in this country or try to disrupt the political setting in the state if they're also going to have to benefit from it? Because if there's a state of emergency in the state, it affects everybody. Please help us to understand this. You have seen people seeking a state of emergency. You can only have a state of emergency when there is an extraordinary situation where there is a total breakdown of law and order or when there is a poor or such a grave circumstance, which is not what they have in Anambra state today. If they're not going to do their normal business, we are going to have our own rallies with huge numbers of people, huge crowds everywhere. But two stations could run 24 hours throughout the night, throughout the day in Anambra state. So where does this come from? I am glad that the President of the Federal Republic of Nigeria has decided himself on this move. Just one person is having a brainwave, not the Federal Republic of Nigeria, not their demonstration of President Muhammad. Let me engage the lawyer in the studio because we want to talk about the legality of the AGF mauling over the idea of a state of emergency in Anambra state. I mean, I listened to one of our reporters who said they were in Abuja after his meeting, the Governor's meeting with Mr. President, and the President said that he had no idea about this declaration. So let's talk about the AGF making this statement. And let's break down what the state of emergency is and what would even predicate it in the first instance. I think it's unfortunate that the Attorney General is making that such statement. As far as I'm concerned, he's just eating up the polity because it's unnecessary at this level to call for state of emergency in Anambra state. What has happened in Anambra state is not even half of what has happened in San Fara, Kaduna, and some other states in the North. And in that circumstance, I don't see the reason why a state of emergency has to be declined in Anambra state. And to me, again, I also feel the concentration of declaration of emergency in any state of emergency in Nigeria as an indictment on the federal government. How so? Yeah, because if you look at our structure, the security architecture of the country is basically in the hand of the President. In other words, it is commander-in-chief on armed forces. It controls all the apparatus of the security in the country. In other words, you cannot deal with the IGP, the Commission of Police in the states must take order from the IGP. And IGP is accountable to the President. So indirectly, it is responsibility to provide security. So if you are declining state of emergency because there is no security in the state, you are saying you are failed in your responsibility to provide security in that part of the state. Well, very quick to say, declare a state of emergency on healthcare, declare a state of emergency on this and that. But do we really know what a state of emergency is? That's why we have you as a lawyer in the studio. What are the implications? What is a state of emergency? What are the key components of a state of emergency? Because I've heard people say that when you say it's a state of emergency, it means that you are abdicating responsibility as a civilian government for the Army to take over. There is nowhere that is stated in the Constitution. Section 305 of the Constitution provides what is the circumstances when the President can declare or can make permission regarding state of emergency. In other words, for the President, the President has the power to make the declaration of a proclamation of a state of emergency. So the Constitution clearly says the President has the power, not the attorney general. Not the Vice President, not the Speaker of the House. The President. But the Attorney General has been the legal officer of the country as a duty to attract the President on that aspect. But does he have the right to make that declaration? If the President wants to do that, the President has to make a request to him in the internal arrangement to seek his advice as to what to go about. But does he have the right to make that declaration? Ask the Attorney General of the Federation. No, he doesn't have it. He can't declare it. If you look at his statement, that statement can be considered in two-fold, for me. If you read it, if you look at the statement critically, not only the last aspect of it, he said they would do everything possible to ensure election hold in Anambra, including consideration of the declaration of state of emergency. In other words, this concern is about having election in Anambra State. And if you look at that section 3052, 2003, when you say you are the client state of emergency in the state, you are saying you want to use extraordinary measures to ensure peace and order, if there is no peace and order in that state. Which means, and for you to declare state of emergency, there must be war. There must be actual breakdown of law or peace and order in the state. There must be threat of violence that cannot be, that is difficult to stop due in the state. Under the former President Goodlock Jonathan, there were three states that he declared a state of emergency in. And remember, at the time, Boko Haram was trying to declare those states a caliphate. Hence, you know, the President's calling for a state of emergency, and it was three states. And just as you have said, so there has to be a total breakdown of law. There must be breakdown of law. There must be war. There must be issues that cannot be resolved in terms of security and peace in the state. And when you declare, you see the President was on job, used a state of emergency when he was in power, but he was on abuse. Because there is nothing in that position that says, when you are imposing a state of emergency in any state, the governor should be sent packing. There is nothing in that constitution. What the constitution is saying is that you can apply extraordinary measures. You know what I have been doing in this country before? Didn't I have been also considered as an extraordinary? No, that's not an extraordinary question. That's not an extraordinary constitution. There is no president that has the power to remove any governor. So that cannot be an extraordinary measure. Because you see, when you say that I'm not a measure, we are used to deployment of a military. But ordinarily, you cannot deploy military without the approval by the National Assembly. But in this country, we are doing that. So if you are deploying, if you are saying state of emergency now, that means you can deploy military in any state, the other types of military. So the general police and another is stopped in that particular class. But today, we have turned the state of emergency to once it is declared, the governor will send the department packing. They will send all of the commissioners or whatever, the structures on land. They will send it packing. To me, the extraordinary measure maybe been taught about by the AG is about imposing the military, deploying military force in that state. But I'm worried, I'm worried that the AG or any other person is thinking, they are just thinking about doing extraordinary measure to cure security crisis in the state country when election is approaching. That means it's only when we have an election that they will think of finding solutions to issues. The responsibility of the government is to provide security and welfare. It's not only about ensuring election is conducted. So it's worrisome for me, for us to say, look, it's only when we have election issue that the government will be more active in ensuring that this election takes place. I remember in 2015, prior to the election, the first election, the first election that brought the president into power, there was a crisis in Buenos Aires, which made it impossible for them to do election. And the president said, give me just two weeks. Behold, they were able to ensure peace and order in that state. So which means if there was no election, the crisis will continue and people will suffer. So it is unfortunate that... So this statement implies that maybe our governments know what to do to quell this insurgency that they would rather do it. Exactly my point. That shows what they are doing without not taking a fair measure to ensure this crisis are resolved or restored is deliberate. Because when it comes to election, they know the way out and they would want to use every measure to be able to get a peace and order in that state to be able to conduct election. Honourable Commissioner, let's come back to you and talk about the way forward. Because the elections, like I said at the beginning, is drawing closer. And even INEC has come up to say that they're really worried as to how safe and secure these elections will be and violence free. What is the state government doing to make sure that people can leave their homes and be certain that they can cast their votes peacefully and make sure that their votes count and not be having to scamper for safety or because they want to exercise their franchise? You know, in the last three years, say four years, we have had two major relations, one humanitarian in November 2017 and the other, the general election of 2019, was very peaceful, not one incident of violence at a peace, not even one incident of violence anywhere in the United States. So we're not used to electoral violence. It's a link to our people, to our society and country. What is going on is very unusual. It's contrite, it's artificial, it's strange, and it's organized by vested interests. That's what I've been trying to do. I couldn't believe it when I had the Attorney General of the Federation say yesterday that a few of the state governments are not doing their job to provide security for the people. I'm happy the Lennard consul there with you, the exterior, has many points, eloquently, that security is basically on the exclusive federal basis. The federal government has no control over the police force or the army or the army or even the civil defense. This thing begins and ends with the federal government of Nigeria. So when Malami seeks to indict the administration of Hanhambra states, he's actually indicting the president of the federal government of Nigeria, who is the commander-in-chief and who oversees the police force and other security agencies. So he's actually passing a vote of no confidence in the federal government. And that's serious. He begins to wonder if he has the moral right to hold that office, especially after the president has informed the governor of Hanhambra states that he had no heart in the plans to impose a state of emergency in Hanhambra states. As the lawyer has pointed out, it is a responsibility of the president to impose, not the attorney general, but the attorney general to assume the duties of the president shows something is certainly wrong. Yeah. And you don't do what is proper and it's personal to hold that office. And by the way, the attorney general is a member of the Anbuber Campaign Council, the duty, the office of the attorney general is a sacred trust. It's one of the few public offices created directly by the constitution and named by the constitution and written in the constitution. He's not double into local politics, let alone be a member of the gubidana council of any states. So we get it. You're saying that there's vested interest in this election, but you haven't answered my question. He is a proud member. How do you intend to clear your name because you have to have a clean slate of sorts to be able to deal with the issue of public interest or the threat. I call attorney general of the federation, not of any campaign council. And he is number one in the list of members of Anbuber Campaign Council. You can see why he's a good office. How does the state government intend to make the state safe enough for elections to happen and without any doubt, any iron tab? Yes. I don't want to disclose to you. But will that be the case? Can we say that in the next few weeks, Anbuber is going to experience some sort of peace and calm and we will not be having to read from the waiting of our papers that there's one more upsurge or killing here and there? Yes. You know very well that our government has the reputation of being the most security conscious governor in our history and has been rewarded so many times for his commitments to peace and safety. We are very proud of that record we hold and we have held it for the past seven and a half years. So these are the nice things, the organized violence. We come to an end in not more than one week from now. And I also reveal that part of the reason why the government has to go to the president is to discuss security in the states. As I've told you, a situation where the federal government changes the commission of police every month is unacceptable. Okay. For the past five months, we have had five commissioners of police. Would you like that? Well, we have to go. I know that our time is up. I want to say thank you. Donald Adinomba is the Honorable Commissioner for Information in Anambra City. Thank you for speaking with us. My name is Sidon Adinomba. I'm not Don Sidon Adinomba. Oh, Sidon Adinomba. I should have called you earlier. Sidon Adinomba. Okay. Sidon Adinomba. Not Don Sidon. That's the difference. Not mine. All right. Thank you very much for speaking with us. We appreciate it. My pleasure. Of marriage. Soonji Adulamid is a legal practitioner. Thank you so much, Soonji, for helping us to understand the situation. Thank you very much. All right. Well, thank you all for staying with us. We'll take a short break now. When do you plan the newly proposed 2022 budget? We're going to be talking about it. And of course, the question is, how much should Nigeria borrow from the 2022 budget? And we'll be back in a couple of minutes.