 This is St. Tech, Hawaii. Community matters here. I should join her. And this is cannabis chronicles, a 10,000 year odyssey. And so there's so much to talk about, so much to learn about cannabis. And it's this, what do we say, tell me news of that plant of many resources, which wondered far and wide the ancient plant of food, fuel and fiber cultivated for millennia. 10,000 years or more have passed and 50,000 different products made from this plant and all of the uses. And yet here we are just discovering hemp, cannabis, ashes. We talk about cannabis and religion, cannabis and medicine, cannabis and dear old Uncle Sam. And so that's where our odyssey begins, right here in the state of Hawaii with Senator Willis Barrow, who has been a avid supporter of medical cannabis since, what, 2002? Well, I was here in 2000, when that was my first year in the legislature, when we were the first legislature in the nation to pass medical cannabis, a medical cannabis program for our citizens. And you're right though, hemp has so many uses and going back to the 13 colonies who were required to grow hemp because it was an export crop. And they made paper. Right, and so many other products and now we've come full circle. It took some industrialists, rich millionaires to conspire with fake news to ban a product, cannabis. Congress did that through lies and deceit and just telling the American people false information about marijuana, about cannabis and what it would do to society, which was just not true. First fake news, or some of the first fake news. Then we can depend on. But now we're going to start in 2018, a pilot program for industrial hemp, the State Department of Agriculture. And hopefully that will bear some productive fruit and efforts. It has the opportunity, let me put it that way, to create a whole new industry in Hawaii so that we can have something other than tourism and the military. When you think of 50,000 products that can be made from hemp and you have three crops a year, boy, just think what people can create out of that. You know how many trees it takes to create a roll of toilet paper? Can you imagine? This is mind boggling. If we could concentrate on three areas, a biofuel for our energy needs with our vehicles, a construction material, because there is a home in Maui I believe that is built out of hemp. Yeah, and it's called a hemp creek. And then of course the fiber, the clothing. Why can't we have a line of aloha shirts, hemp aloha shirts? I mean, so many possibilities. It could be our next golden crop. It should be. And when you think of ropes, for thousands of years, the ropes, the lines for ships and boats were made out of hemp. And now just think of the industry alone in Hawaii with all of the boats that we have here. It's just a gold mine if you just begin to think of it. Right. And many, many other countries have a hemp industry and it's about time that the thinking of the past ends. And the United States gets into hemp and eventually adult use. When we look at, like I said, this industry and what it can be, you're right, shed that yesterday's thinking and look forward because yesterday's not going to come again. So if we look forward and what it can be, because there are crops now that things now made like the 3D printer. If you made fuel, the oil or whatever it's called, or 3D printer, the 3D printer didn't even exist 20 years ago. So how would we even think that hemp could be a use in a 3D printer? Exactly. I have knees made on a 3D printer. I have two artificial knees. They were made on a 3D printer. Whoever just thought that we could do that. Technology, exactly. It's incredible. But let's talk about where we are today in the state. With the medical cannabis. With the medical cannabis. And for anybody that's interested, the state did decide to get rid of the word marijuana. And so now everything, the medical products, everything says medical cannabis. And I thought that was a great idea the state came up with because the word marijuana has negative connotations. They decided to reach out and come into the 21st century. Yes. And now this year we've had our first medical cannabis dispensaries selling in a retail establishment. I believe there are three operating and eventually statewide there will be 16. With a breakdown of three licenses on Oahu, two on Big Island, two on Maui and one on Kauai. And there's going to be some trial and error as this new healthcare industry starts to mature and become better. But we have I think approximately 19,000 plus patients. And then it's grown considerably in the last year just because people knowing that the dispensaries are going to be available. And they don't have to grow their own like they're doing now. And hopefully the price point will also come down because the supply is limited, especially with just three out of 16. So you know that there's a big gap that needs to be filled. But I expect that as more dispensaries come online, the price will come down. And it's going to have to come down if it's going to compete with the black market. If it's not cheaper or at least equal, competitively there will be people who just may bypass dispensaries and go to the black market if they can save a few dollars. Which basically to a bill I'm going to be introducing that would allow dispensaries to give away medical cannabis to people who are very poor below the poverty line. And they can't afford it if they want it. So that's one of the pieces of legislation that we'll be drafting in 2018. Oh, very good. So now you belong to an organization that meets quarterly about this whole issue of medical marijuana. What is it called? Well, it's the legislative, medical cannabis legislative oversight committee. Oversight committee. So with an oversight committee, this made up of legislators or the public who is part of the oversight? Well, there are four legislators, two from the Senate, two from the House, and multiple, multiple stakeholders. Another 20 or so. They include law enforcement, the healthcare industry, the owners are represented, patients are represented, the university. So you can see it's a gamut of people and organizations that have different perspectives and views and interests in the cannabis industry. So what do you do exactly? We talk about ideas and recommendations that we will be looking at in the 2018 session. And I do have a list here of some of them because we passed legislation now in 2015, 2016, 2017. And we're likely going to again in 2018 because this is a new industry. It's in its infancy. So we're going to learn some things we can do through legislation, other ways the Department of Health can make changes through rulemaking. Oh. But sometimes legislatively it's quicker than rulemaking, which many people know. Oh yes, the Health Department has what is it, 12 to 1900 new card holders each month. And yet they have empty vacant positions and so they're behind. Right. So anyway, the Health Department is always an issue. Next year the law states that Hawaii can begin a reciprocity system program for tourists who come through Hawaii who have medical cards. So I'm expecting that there's going to be legislation that will allow that and set up a process where we can cater to, you know, the potentially hundreds of thousands if not millions of tourists who may be medical cannabis patients. Because they can't carry it across the state lines. The only way is if they, so if you're a veteran with PTSD and you're going to come to Hawaii on vacation, then you can go to the dispensary and with your California card. Yeah. You mentioned that I can see Hawaii carving out a little niche market for medical cannabis patients who want to come to paradise or looking or looking for a place that is friendly to their needs as medical cannabis patients. Can you see medical cannabis resorts? Let's go there. Yes. You know, let's look at Hawaii as medical tourism. Exactly. A healing place. Yes. A place to unwind, to relax, and to get better mentally and physically. And physically. Exactly. So that's another industry we need to look at. Yeah. Medical cannabis resorts and tourism. I can see somebody getting into that in the future. I know the exact place on Kauai, what is the beautiful place that was damaged 25 years ago in the hurricane? Cocoa palms. Cocoa palms is still sitting there languishing. Wouldn't that be perfect? That would just be perfect. Right, right. Okay. Let's go on. Another big issue in the news has been the opioid crisis, especially nationwide. It's been hitting the mainland, the continent worse than here in Hawaii, but it is a problem. And we're looking at legislation that will allow medical cannabis to be used for helping people with substance abuse. Right. Issues or addictions, and in particular, including opioids. Okay. Because people are dying weekly, if not daily. Yes. Opioid overdoses, but not many people are overdosing on medical cannabis. They don't. Nobody is. Nobody is. That's the point. So we need to take a break. Okay. We'll be back in a minute, and then we will talk about some of these other issues on your extensive list here. Very good. Okay. Thank you, Marsha. This is Think Tech Hawaii, raising public awareness. The process helped people of all abilities imagine the possibilities in their lives. I'm Lucas, host of Hawaii Is My Main Land, here on Think Tech Hawaii Fridays at 3 p.m. Hawaiian Standard Time. We explore environmental issues, political issues, keeping it local any way we can. Aloha. And we are back with Senator Will Esparro, my dear, dear friend for many, many years. I can count on him to talk about medical cannabis. Yes. We were talking about this opiate addiction, and what, I guess, what really bothers me about not the opiate addiction. Well, yes, that too. But in the scheduling, cannabis is scheduled at the very top. Schedule one, yes. Opiates, which are killing people, are number two. So how is it that this opiate, which is written, it's legal, doctors write prescriptions for it all the time, it's killing people, but here we have cannabis that's not killing people, that is a schedule one. And we in the state have the ability to deschedule and we don't. Well, at this time, the big issue with schedule one, everybody sees it as a federal issue and problem. With it being schedule one, we're categorized with heroin. Yes. And schedule one is that there's no medicinal value, and it's highly addictive in particular, which we know cannabis is not. It's not highly addictive, and it does have medical benefits. So the schedule one goes back to what we were talking about in the 40s, where Congress passed bills and laws based on lies, false information. And they got away with it, and that's where we are today in terms of the prohibition on cannabis as recreational, except for the states that have done it. So I know there's people out there that says, why you should change it to schedule two or three or whatever the case? And we haven't. And I think part of the reason is because at this time, unless the federal government does anything- But we don't have, we've already, the Supreme Court already decided that. We're moving 100% forward with our medical cannabis program. Nothing's stopping us. Nothing is in the way, the federal government. Unless and until the federal government says anything, we're just moving forward. No. What I'm getting going with that is that in 2006, the federal government, the United States Supreme Court said the state has the right to control its medical industry. And so that takes this out of the realm of waiting on the feds, because you've already decided that. So what is the holdup of the scheduling? It's not the feds. That's a myth. Well, that's a myth that we've already- The health chairman. The health chairs are the ones that would schedule these hearings. And unless there's a large and big outcry to push for schedule one to schedule two, it just hasn't happened. And so we're still moving on. See, the fact that we have a medical cannabis program states that we disagree with you, state of Hawaii, with the United States. Right. And you've already proven that there's a medical benefit and that no one is addicted to it. And in spite of this, what is it called, gateway drug, which it's not. So nobody, nobody has been killed in an automobile with cannabis. Thousands of people are killed with alcohol. Nobody. So what's the nonsense here? It's all a myth. So what do we need to do with what I'm saying as voters, as people with cards? How do we, what do we need to do with the legislature? Because that's where this is now. To move this, so to de-schedule and move on to the next step. Well, I believe there are some in the legislature who don't think de-scheduling is a high priority right now. And that there are other more important permit issues because no one is threatening our medical cannabis program. The federal government is not. They're not. But having, I mean, you know, they're not using the schedule one issue and closing us or 30 other jurisdictions that are doing this. Medical cannabis is here to stay and. Well, that was with this police department, you know, they're, I got all crazy because of the feds, which shouldn't be. That's what I'm talking about. When you look at the others, even with the hemp program that the state is supporting. They have certain roles and regulations that go back to the feds. That just shouldn't be. That's all I'm saying is how do we move from that stigma to let's get real, you know. That's the issue. Well, we do. So what do we need to do as ordinary people to move this? What do we do? You're the legislature. You're the senator. What do we need to do? Well, like all bills, contact your legislators and contact your representatives, your senators. And if you have a special interest on any bill, you know, let them know you'd like to see a bill heard or drafted or whatever the case may be. And this the schedule one issue has come up sometimes and we just haven't been able to get legislation passed on it. But it hasn't impeded any movement and improvements on our medical cannabis program. But it is a problem with the hemp program. Well, we do have the pilot beginning next year. But if you read the directions in the pilot project, even that because of the schedule one, which is crazy. Right. But they're basing that schedule one on the federal interpretation. Right. And that's why we need to get rid of that so that we can move this project on without that nonsense. And there's some thinking that, you know, until the feds take action on the schedule one, nothing's stopping Hawaii and our medical cannabis program. Yep. And we're not even talking legalization, at least not anytime soon, I don't think. So the medical cannabis is the area we want to focus on in which we are. So let's finish your list here before we run out of time. Okay. Well, there's a discussion on edibles. We don't have edibles. We do have tinctures, lotions, lozenges. But when we're talking about edibles, we're talking about candies, pastries, cookies, drinks. Well, I would think that if you have a child that has epilepsy, you want something that this child can take, wouldn't you? Well, we're close to... Well, I'm talking about... Medical. I'm talking about if you say that this cannabis can control the seizures. But this is a child. So what do you give? How do you give them? No. Let me explain. I'm sorry. This is edibles to be sold in dispensaries. So right now, you're right, many of the patients, they're growing and they're making edibles. And they're getting oils and whatever else they get out of the plant. Well, I was just thinking, how do you give a child a dosage as opposed to smoking? Yes, yes. You can put it in an oil form and then put that oil in food or whatever it may be. That's one way. Okay. So insurance reimbursement working group, what is that? Well, patients, since this is a, in essence, a health care issue, right now patients just paying straight out of their pocket cash for this medicine. Whereas in our system, the way we set it up, forgetting about the schedule one. Right. But if it's a medicine, why shouldn't insurance companies give you a reimbursement? And that's what this issue is about. Oh, very good. That getting all the stakeholders, including the insurance companies, and seeing can we add this into the list of reimbursables. Well, that makes perfect sense. Right. So that would be one thought is a working group to look at that. And a working group to look at the, just to get more specifics and details on the edibles. Because once you're talking edibles, you're talking about a place where these items are going to be prepared, kitchens, Department of Health. Yes. So that really opens up a gamut of rules and regulations that's going to have to be followed. But I'm hoping we could get some edibles available at the dispensaries by 2020. But we'll see on that one. Now, this is a big one here. The patient's inter-island transportation, that is a big one. For me, it seems really... Well, it is and it's not. Because if a patient can now get cannabis on every island or eventually, then there's really no need for them to... No need to. But until then... Well, my understanding, and I think we just need to look at this because it's sort of gray, but my understanding is that TSA has not been taking people with small amounts of medical cannabis. So that's good. But we're going to, I think, just make that language stronger. But if you look above there, that's an area that I like to see UH get involved with. Right now, the university, because of the Schedule 1 problem, doesn't want to get involved in any experimentation research that has to do with growing, touching the plant, the seeds. But what I like to see... So if we did the schedule, then they could get into the research. Well, what we can do now is see if the university can partner with the Department of Health. And we could tell patients to give us your information. This is a voluntary reporting. And we can start collecting. So if someone is a patient, they've got this ailment, they're taking this much product or cannabis in this form or that form, dosage, and start collecting and getting a data bank so that once you see research and development getting the green light from the federal government, then we'd be... So that's when we need to get rid of the federal government. We're back to schedule. Okay, I get it. Now, we're back to schedule. Okay. But we can gather data without the Schedule 1 change. Yeah. We can voluntarily have patients give us information about their dosage and how it's helping them. Well, anybody, any research group could do that. It doesn't depend on federal... No, but it would... We'd have to pass a law. Yeah. Let's see. The university, we'd have to pass a law. I understand. But if you were a researcher and you're not dependent on federal grant, you could do this. Right. But we're... Well, yeah, but I'm talking about getting the University of Hawaii involved. So let's... We have a minute left. Okay. Let's... What is this use outside the home? Well, we had a discussion on that on... Right now, you're only supposed to ingest at home. Uh-huh. Right. But what if somebody... And not smoking, but could somebody take some... On the park, you know... And I guess if you're not being obnoxious and rude and making a... I mean, nobody would even know. But just someone was talking about just clarifying that you could if you wanted to go to the park, go to the beach. But you can't if you're smoking. Right, right. But not... Because I'm smoking anything. Exactly. We have our anti-smoking laws already. Yeah. Right, right. So what is discrimination, adult use? Well, this is an area that the Senate has supported in the past, the decriminalization of the adult use of cannabis. Oh, okay. So people wouldn't be going to jail for small amounts. And this is an area that the Senate has supported, but we've had problems passing it in the house. Oh, okay. And usually in other states, they went from medical cannabis to decriminalization to adult use legalization. That's... Okay. So we are coming up on 2018. You will be back to tell us more how we're progressing with these issues. Yes. And how we can help. Certainly. And... So thank you so much for coming again. We will see you soon. Thank you, Marcia. Happy to be here with you. Aloha. Happy...