 the fifth kind. For me the white rabbit that led me into this territory was in the Bible and it led me quickly into the world of ancient Sumeria, Babylonia, Syria, and Acadia, and to the ancient cuneiform texts of those cultures. There's this passage in the Atrahasis which is basically written from the son of the last king of Sharupak in the Sumerian king list, Iraq king list, and he talks about how at one point in the creation aspect of us with these Anuna gods that seem to have come here from another higher dimension or another star system, it talks about these dominions that these beings took up within our reality and it says, Enki, where you went, you were to undo the chain and set us free. It's like what chain are they talking about? Are they chained to our reality and somehow because they created us? Our education system is very much based on a doctrine that was created after the Holy Roman Empire. It went around the world and conquered all the pre-Christian civilizations and the knowledge places people like the Gnostics and the Egyptians, burning the library of Alexandria. There's an ancient story that exists far beyond and before the time that we're told and we're taught in school and that story has been heavily guarded. Let's not pretend we live in this warm and cozy little situation where the government wants us to all be knowledgeable, all these sites, the narrative, all this is being covered up. Matthew LaCroy is a researcher and author whose work has probed quantum mechanics, string theory, and the history of ancient cultures. Matthew published his first book at the slender age of 22 and then followed it up in 2016 with the illusion of us probing human origins and consciousness at the stage of time going deeper into our understanding of ourselves and the cosmos in which we live. Matthew is a popular presenter on Gaia TV and equally important, a great friend of ours here at the Fifthkind TV. Matt, welcome back to the Fifthkind TV. Paul, thank you so much for that fantastic introduction. I love being on the Fifthkind. I love what you and Tony are doing. It really is an inspiration. Oh, thank you. I always enjoy my conversations with you, Matt. I love the way we bounce off each other and we're on a very similar page. Whenever we speak, we always feel like we just scratch the surface when we need to pause and take a break, just enough to wet people's appetite for your work. And I'm sure we'll do exactly the same today because the scope of your work is so broad, it's so deep. I love your integrity as a researcher. You're someone really who sifts and discerns you've got your feet on the ground. And today, we're going to go all around the world. We're going to go into space. But so much has happened since we last spoke. I thought it might be helpful, actually, to go back to the beginning to where you and I first met. Because for me, the white rabbit that led me into this territory was in the Bible. And it led me quickly into the world of ancient Sumeria, Babylonia, Syria, and Acadia, and to the ancient cuneiform texts of those cultures. Now, in case people don't know, that's modern Iraq and its borders with Syria, Turkey, and Iran. How did you get there, Matt? What was it that first attracted your attention to that part of the world, those cultures, and what are the fields of study that that's opened up for you? Thank you. Thank you, Paul. That's certainly the area that, of course, I study a wide variety of ancient texts around the world and civilizations, but really the core of what is the most exciting to me in terms of having historical data and information that goes back to a time when really none of that information really could have existed and survived. And I think that's the beauty behind how brilliant the ancient Mesopotamians, especially the Sumerians, and then the later Akkadians and Babylonians, the way that they were able to protect their narratives and their stories through the etching in into clay tablets and then firing those clay tablets, which truly, cuneiform into solid stellar rock like the Code of Hammurabi or into clay tablets is the most effective way to leave a message behind that can survive for thousands and thousands of years, and that's exactly what they did and they knew. And so how did I get started on all this? Well, like a lot of other people, Zechariah Sitchin was definitely is like a launching pad for this. But for me, it was a different journey than perhaps others. I do respect some of the work that he's done. But when I was looking at those stories, and I was like, is this accurate? Like I wanted to know on a detailed firsthand level in terms of reading all the tablets, whether or not that fantastic story that he was telling was accurate or not. In the 20th century, the writer Zechariah Sitchin began pouring over the cuneiform texts. He highlighted the clear implications of the Sumerian stories that the Anunnaki were powerful and advanced extraterrestrial species. Their arrival on planet Earth put them at the top of the terrestrial food chain. To create a local workforce, the Anunnaki used sequences of their own genetic code to hybridize a primate ancestor into a human, ready to put to work for their Anunnaki masters. Sitchin argued the word Anunnaki means those who came from the heavens to Earth, a phrase that made clear their extraterrestrial origin. Zechariah Sitchin was not an academic. He was not a PhD or a professor. He had a degree from the London School of Economics and worked in commerce, and the LSE, I should say, is a pretty august institution. He wrote at a popular level, that's to say for a general audience, and not with the kind of referencing and footnotes that you'd expect to see in an academic kind of tome. And academic critics don't like that. They think that's slack. Some might identify mistakes or bias in his work, and that's then their pretext to disregard his contribution, which is an important one. Now some writers in the field reject Sitchin's translation of the word Anunnaki, and they would contend that the word's usage tells us that it simply means nobility or royalty, the rulers. I'm not persuaded by that. It's not that that's not true. It's just a very partial answer. It's a very lazy explanation. It simply doesn't ask enough questions. Who were the rulers identified by this word? Why is that word associated with the rulers? You see, if you look at the etymology of the word at its root meanings, look at the component parts. You have Anu, which means heavens. Ki, which means earth. Anunnaki are those who came from the heavens to the earth. You can follow the logic. But even if you didn't have that narrative embedded in the word itself, as soon as you read the Kuneiforms, the stories themselves unpack that that is exactly what was going on. The glyph that they used to indicate the rulers who come down from the heavens at the beginning of the story, that glyph simply indicates the sky. These Anunnaki are from the heavens. They're sky people. I later came across some of the greatest translators in the world who had done a lot of those translations that are really largely unknown, which is rather sad because he's a well-known figure in this field. But then really no one's ever heard of George Smith or Samuel Kramer or Stephanie Dally and a number of others who are really the, in my mind, the top tier. They're called the seriologists, even though it's also Sumer, but the top tier experts in translating a truly ancient dead language. And when I read their versions that verified each other, I saw how, okay, here we go. I can trust what this message is. And since then, I've actually started to try to learn how to decipher and read Sumerian, which is an ongoing process. But that's the whole point is that this is something that, if you're an expert in it, it's something you got to study almost your entire life. And so those experts put together those stories from these ancient cultures. And when you read what those agreements on translations, they want to be very clear. When you read them, you get the most incredible story about ancient history and about who we are and about the past that is truly almost like something you would see out of a movie. It's incredible, the idea of catastrophes coming through, being driven by the gods and destroying entire areas, and having some ancient creation story and like a war in heaven over great beings over what our future would be. And how, in many ways, it seems like when you look at it that there, it was more of like a karma connection or something. And I'll just mention really quickly, there's this passage in the Atrahasis, which is my favorite set of Cuneiform tablets of all, which is basically written from the knowledge that came from the son of the last king of Sherupak and the Sumerian King Lest, Iraq King Lest. And Sherupak was the last pre-Diluvian city before all of them were destroyed. And he talks about how at one point in the creation aspect of us with these Anuna gods that seem to have come here from another higher dimension or another star system, but they basically state, there's this line in there that's so profound that it says, it talks about these dominions that these beings took up within our reality. And it says, Enki, where you went, you were to undo the chain and set us free. And when you look at that and you think about it, it's like, what chain are they talking about? Are they chained to our reality and somehow because they created us and they got intermingled with our karma? It opens up more questions than answers, but in the end of the day, it seems as though the conclusion you get out of all those, the most important tablets is that we truly are powerful and amazing beings. And you can see that in like the myth of Adapa. If you read about Adapa being called the greatest among the Anunnaki. So we are them. And so when you read all those stories from the greatest translators, it's so captivating that that alone will set you on a path for life to understand what I consider is like the greatest story, our story is like the greatest story ever told. I absolutely agree with that. And I very much like you, when I started studying this, I went to the translations that are most widely accepted to where the translations agree with each other and affirm each other. Because when I wrote escaping from Eden, I didn't want people to say, Oh, no, you've built that argument on a bit of faulty translation. I thought, no, I have to go to the most authoritative, most widely accepted translations and go from the story that emerges from that. And you did exactly the same thing, which I really admire. I think it's really important to have that solid foundation. And I think people forget when they hear these stories coming from out of ancient Sumeria and everything in that culture in the written record, we are hearing from a culture that existed within what we call the Stone Age. These stories, this record of a civilization has survived just as you said, it's baked into stone. So it survived for thousands and thousands of years, given us a window into the Stone Age. But when I say the word Stone Age, I was taught to picture a primitive human being sitting in front of a cave, wearing a bare skin, going ug, and ancient Sumeria was not like that. Can you just unpack for people who don't know why Sumeria is such a surprising revelation in the history of humanity? Absolutely. And the first place we have to start is we need an understanding. They're listening to this, probably know this already, but we have to lay this basis down, is that our education system is very much based on a doctrine that was created after the Holy Roman Empire basically went around the world and conquered all the pre-Christian civilizations and the knowledge, people like the Gnostics and the Egyptians burning the library of Alexandria, and then eventually going up to the last strongholds of the Druids and basically eradicating them, which is what we think of as St. Patrick's Day. But all those things take us down a road where there's a story, there's an ancient story that exists far beyond and before the time that we're told and we're taught in school. And that story has been heavily guarded and hidden. That's why it's been called by some forbidden knowledge or attributed to what are known as the lost or master civilizations of history. And that narrative though, what we're taught in school about a 6,000 year timeline of civilization, like you mentioned before that, we're supposedly just cavemen banging on rocks and making weird noises. Like you said, this very primitive aspect of what we are. But really what happens is when you say to yourself, okay, I'm an open-minded person, first and foremost, I'm going to look, I'm curious about a different story. I'm curious about a different version. I'm able to be open-minded enough to maybe entertain the idea that our story is much more ancient and much more sophisticated and interesting than we're really told. And when you have that mindset, and then you look at the evidence all around the world, whether or not it's Q&A-formed tablets and the stories from Mesopotamia and Sumer to all of these civilizations all around the world that have this incredible megalithic sophistication and these things they left behind that do not match with this timeline at all. And we actually know that. This isn't just a theory that what we're known as like alternative researchers are playing with. I mean, we've already found like in a place like Gobekli Tepe, which is in the northern part of the Fertile Crescent above Iraq, in Turkey, we find this site that was deliberately buried thousands and thousands of years ago. And because of that though, the organic matter that's found on some of these giant T-shaped pillars, these multi-ton monolithic pillars, we find organic matter that has been radiocarbon dated in numerous locations across those sites because Gobekli Tepe is not just one site. It's an enormous set of different astronomical temples that cover an entire mountain. And when they did organic testing in these multiple variety of locations, they actually came up with a date of 11,600 years ago. And of course, the problem with that is that that's double the age of the narrative of civilization that we're told. However, we are told that civilization began in Sumer, but the time that it began and the different civilizations that have come and gone from that region, from what I've established, is very, very different than we're told. And that's where the really interesting aspect of this all begins because in Sumer, just like in Gobekli Tepe actually, you find this previous set of cultures that was there, right? There were hundreds and hundred gatherers. There were nomadic type of people that existed on the earth. But just like we have today, with all the technology and sophistication we have, you can still go to remote places in the Amazon and others and find very primitive tribes. So that's how we want to think of this as is there were different groups of humans on the earth during this time. And when that time was, it's how far back it goes is the ultimate question. But it's well over 13,000 years ago, well over. I'm of the mindset that it's over 50,000 years old. But the point is that when you look at how, whether it's Gobekli Tepe or whether it's the ancient Sumerian civilizations, it you find this complete immersion of knowledge into these civil these cultures that came from somewhere where all of a sudden they became sophisticated civilizations. As in, for instance, if we were to look at where the origins of really everything in the in the blue, the blueprint of what we are in terms of our civilization, you know, you go to the store and you buy vegetables. And then you've got to you got to learn some laws and rules of your society to be functional. And you got to you fast a farm with animals. It doesn't matter all these things that build into our civilization, things that's known as animal husbandry, or the or the birth of agriculture, right, knowing how to clear river channels and how to plant in a way where you can grow large amounts of crops. Because those are the blueprints of civilization, you can't have that occur unless you have those fundamental things to everything from mathematics and astronomy and astrology and lane complex languages and you could go on and on and on. Everything seems to have started from nothing. That's the point to really make here is that it's not like these cultures figured out these little things along the way. What we find in the actual archaeological evidence of looking down into the layers of soil is that these civilizations just emerged out of nowhere. And that we find that same telltale sign all over the world in different places. So what the real question is, you know, who were those influencers? And is does that mean that they influenced into into becoming like what we are? You know, is the homo sapiens sapiens story very different than those hunter-domatic gathers? You know, what happened there? I think that's where that those texts can become so valuable. Well, that timeline is really intriguing. And I think there's kind of a smoking gun in that time frame that you mentioned just now, because talking about Gobekli Tepe, that correlates with finds off the coast of Cuba, Malta, Japan, Yonaguni Jima, the Gulf of Cambay off the coast of India, megalithic cities, megalithic sites that would have been above sea level no more recently than 10,000 years ago. It's intriguing how that correlates with our knowledge of the most recent cataclysm on the planet as well, the before, during and after of the Younger Dryas Cold period. But to make it more focused, I want you to take us to Eridu because there's something about Eridu and what has been found there that relates to the timeline of the Sumerian stories and how that fits into the timeline of humanity. Absolutely. That's my favorite ancient site in the world. As you probably know, I'm somewhat of a warrior of trying to protect that location when very few are right now in the world. I just want to mention, before I discuss Eridu, it's a place that's truly dear to my heart. I've created a campaign called the Campaign to Protect Eridu. You can find that information on my website. I've done an open minds on Gaia discussing this. I've done other videos as well. Why is Eridu so important and why is this something we should know and talk about? When you look at that sudden emergence of civilization in Sumer, the pre-Diluvian cities, meaning pre-flood cities that are identified in numerous texts. This is not some mistranslation where these cities are just as old as some of the other ones. No, there's the point here to understand the archaeological evidence and the ancient text tell us very distinctly that there was five cities created before the flood, and then there were other cities created after. But how many floods there have been and how far back they go is really the problem and the question here. But more importantly, if we were to just start from the beginning, because that's where we should start, is that in a lot of ancient, I think half a dozen Cuneiform texts, whether it's the Sumerian King List, the Iraq List of Kings and Sages, or Eridu Genesis, or numerous other ones, they all say the same thing. They say that when kingship was lowered from heaven and the first city was ever created, not like a group of primitive houses that slowly built up over time, no, no, just something that came out of nowhere, something that was built in a very divine, in a pure place they call it. They say laying the bricks in a pure location energetically is what I think that means. But when we look at all those texts, they all say the same thing, that the very first city ever created and where our story begins is an ancient city of Eridu. Now, Eridu is found near the Euphrates River and the Tigris River in southern Iraq, in what's known as the Fertile Crescent, and that area used to look very different back pre-13,000 years ago than it does now. It wasn't as Erid, it was definitely greener, and it was a place where there was extreme abundance, because if you have a location not only energetically, which is like we're going to get into some conversations like with the 30th parallel relating to that, but also if you have a place that has an enormous amount of sunshine, but it's also almost like a fertile oasis, you get something like the Nile Delta of Egypt, where you can grow enormous abundant crops, and you can have civilizations that can truly thrive. And so in Eridu, the tablets state that this Anuna God, this Creator God of humanity, and they all agree. There's no text that's like, oh, this other supposed being is our Creator, and then this one says this. No, they all say the same thing. This being known as Enki, who is later called Ia, to the Akkadian civilizations, and he's got many other names, but he talked about in this how they were non-physical, non-corporeal beings, something that is a truly powerful, sophisticated group of Creator Gods that goes way beyond our understanding and concepts, in my opinion, of something like an alien or something. This is something on a whole another level that may actually tie into somehow the creation of the universe with these fractals of beings that are somehow like Creator Gods. But they came here and they created these civilizations here. And what they state is that Eridu was the first city ever created, and it was originally ruled over these lower beings they called the Ajiji, and they wanted basically to create mankind in their image to do the workload of the Gods in our realm, because reality is as non-physical as it is physical. Energy is truly the underlying factor that rules the universe and our world, and so the earth is an energetic place that has incredible abundance, and we are like stewards that were created here to basically run and manage this entire world. That's really what they state is that that's what we are. We're not a slave species. That's not what the texts say at all, and we weren't created to mine gold. It doesn't say that either. It states though that we were created to do things like clearing lifelines, river channels, building temples, growing crops, and basically being doing all the functional things that one would need to do in a civilization with a physical being, which is what we are. So in those tablets, Enki describes himself as he incarnates as this being, this physical king known as Nunamet. That's the first name ever used for him in a physical way as a king of Eridu, and he is. He is the king and it's the city is dedicated to him. He's the patron god of Eridu, and Eridu was broken up into two areas. There was an old part of the city that was where everyone lived, the inner city, and then separated from it. There was a mountain that sticks up, a small mountain that sticks up in a vast plains. It's the highest point anywhere, and that's where this was known as the Ziggurat of Eridu was located. Also called the Temple of the Abzu, and that's where this story of how the tablets all state that civilization, the first city ever created on earth, was created there. And that's the place where ancient tablets have come out, and so many secrets still lie. But the problem is, as we're about to get into, Paul, is what happened to that site? Exactly. I mean these stories speak so profoundly to our history as a species, who we are, where we've come from. You would think that this would be a site that's a world heritage site, protected, researched meticulously year by year, but something different has happened to that. It was excavated in the 1800s. There were excavations through till 1948, and then it all seemed to stop. Can you speak to that? Yeah. In my opinion, the site of Eridu is the saddest and most corrupted ancient site in terms of being so obvious for what has happened there in a very nefarious way of anything in the world. And I mean that in a very serious way, because if you look at ancient sites around the world, it doesn't matter what they are. Gobekli Tepe, yeah, maybe only 5% has been excavated, but it's still being excavated. And then other places, like in the Ziggurat of Urok, or the Ziggurat of Ur, or places in Peru, in Bolivia, these ancient megalithic sites, they're at least identified as being an ancient site, and they're being looked at or uncovered everywhere. There's no place on the planet that an archaeological ancient site that exists in the state that Eridu does, nowhere. And that's what's so sad is that it's not like this is a site that doesn't matter. This is one of the most important sites of our entire story, and it's the most neglected and the most covered up in terms of people. Most people have never even heard of Eridu. It doesn't get any attention. And like you said, the main part of the city was excavated in the late 1800s, and then Oxford University did some further up follow-up investigative digs up through 1946 through 1948, and then everything stopped, like you said. It was almost like everyone got a memo that's like, this site is now off limits. I mean, there's no other way to describe it. I have done documentaries, I have some videos on my channel where I've taken photos from Google that people uploaded from the last year or two showing that site right now, and they uploaded it because nobody cares, and there's no infrastructure. So if you were to look at what those images entail, we find that Oxford University went there and found ancient tablets, and we have some of them on record still, then they abandoned the site, and these pictures depict no infrastructure anywhere in place. This ancient city site that's only partially excavated is in the Ziggurat Temple, which was never even touched, and that's where the majority of the ancient text are, which is what we're going to get into and why that's so interesting in a second. But those two sites have been completely abandoned in the desert, and they're being looted by people from Baghdad and other parts of Iraq that are just walking up into these locations. They've shown, these are what's so crazy, they took pictures because they're like, whoa, look at this, and it's interesting to them, but those pictures depict tablets just sticking out of the ground, and you can't find anywhere in the world. So what happened in 1948, it wasn't that we stopped examining the place because we didn't find anything, there was nothing of interest there. It's more like we found something, and that's why the story ends and we're not doing any further research here. It reminds me of what happened with the tomb of Gilgamesh in 1993, where there was all this fanfare, oh, we think we found the tomb of Gilgamesh. Here's the opportunity to test the historicity of these ancient stories, and oh no, we decided not to, we buried the site, we're not going to investigate any further. It's a similar pattern, and when you've got, when you know where to look, you know where the city is, and then you know where to look in the city. You mentioned the ziggurat, what's the logic of stopping? It would make more sense to carry on researching in secret, which I think is what happened with the Gilgamesh find. What has happened at Eridu? Is there research in secret, or do we really not want to know what we're going to find in that ziggurat? That's a great point. You mentioned the tomb of Gilgamesh. I want to mention another couple of similar places that give emphasis for why this is possible. In Egypt, there have been numerous, almost like too many to count, tunnel systems that have been found underneath Giza. The Great Sphinx itself has at least three to four entrances that go down into the earth. They have ladders installed. We've seen Zahi, the famous archaeologist, curator, and protector of the doctrine of Egypt, going down, as that long title, going down into these areas and photographs, and then we never see or hear anything about them, or they find, they do analysis and using ground penetrating radar to see underneath the ground. They find these huge cavities, and then a news article come out, and they'll be like, we found all these cavities underground, and then you never hear about it again. And then I want to give one more example. A colleague and friend of mine, Brian Forster, was part of a group in Egypt looking at a number of entrances known as the Tomb of the Birds, in which it was an entrance that I think was associated with both, where it was these underground areas that went in towards the pyramids and the Great Sphinx, these massive underground areas, and they started to explore them. And after they subsequently were exploring some aspects of it, they were going to come back and do a much more detailed exploration. And when they got back, the entrances were all barred with gates, and they weren't allowed to get in anymore. So what is going on here? Clearly, this doctrine of history that's been protected by very, very powerful individuals around the world prevents anyone from an archaeological degree to ever challenge the narrative, ever. And so therefore, anyone else that's doing this are people that are most likely not archaeologists, as in trained archaeologists, but there are those who are trying to push this narrative and change it based on the evidence. That's exactly what happened in Eridu. As you mentioned, you can find on, if you go on the Oxford University website and you look into this story and you look at what they found, they found tablets. They found all kinds of tablets and they even have one on display right now. But imagine finding an incredible archaeological site and you start going down, you just start finding all kinds of things, and then you're like, well, that was fun. I guess we'll just move on now and we won't come back there again ever. But no, in all seriousness, this obviously was a decision made because they found such incredible relics that challenged this narrative to such a degree that they had to completely abandon the site. And they did it in a way that's rather clever, instead of, let's say, covering the site in fences and not letting anyone in. That would have a lot of it, that would create a lot of attention. But they did something clever in a way where they're almost covering themselves, where instead, how about we just leave this out in the open, not have any infrastructure and just let the wolves and people just loot it and steal everything. Because then, when those things are stolen, they end up on the black mark and they can't be traced ever again. They're gone. And it's just like, it's almost like, if you look at Iraq in another way, the insurgencies that went through like the terrorist group of ISIS that went through and demolished ancient sites all throughout the Middle East and also Al Qaeda and some of these groups in the Taliban that went in and destroyed the gates of Nineveh, which is outside of Mosul, Iraq, which is where the most important ancient library in the entire world was located known as the Royal Ashurbanapal Library was found. So what we're seeing here is this clever tactic where they're either hiring these groups to destroy it for them as like a proxy or they're just allowing people to just loot them freely in a conflict-ridden zone where nobody can go, really. And trust me, I've been trying to get into Eridu in Iraq and I've been told that it probably wouldn't be a very good idea. But anyway, I just want to just say that essentially that's the way that they're allowing this history to just disappear by allowing it to just be openly looted and destroyed. Yes. And what's being destroyed and deleted is information. And the information is there in cuneiform texts coming out of a city covered in seashells. So there's a reminder that we've got written information coming from a a pre-Diluvian culture. That's where we are in the timeline of humanity when we're looking at Eridu. So I mean, it ought to be a World Heritage site, but it isn't and it is being trashed. Is it what can we do about that? Is there anything, if you can't get there, Matthew, who can? Yeah, that's a great point. And I want to just I want to just mention a good just a tiny bit more depth than what you just said, because that's so important. Okay. If the text says, hey, this is a pre-Diluvian site, the narrative that we're told as a myth goes into these details on how this is the first city created at this time or before the flood. And then it was destroyed from these catastrophes that came through. And all this information about being a patron city of Enki and all these things. Let's say you were not sure that was true or real. You were like questioning that. And then you figure out, you find out that we have photographic evidence. Thank you to those looters only because they provided this photographic evidence of a place that we can't get into. But imagine you are the Oxford University and a number of other Iraqi archaeological groups when you were in there in 1946, 1948. And you go to the Ziggurat of Eridu that's completely unexplored in terms of excavations. And you find what was shown in the photo that I have in my documentary that I told you about. You find seashells covering this mountain top temple. And I mean hundreds of seashells, right? That right there is one of those smoking guns. Because to me, when you look at the stories about how that region had a great massive deluge that it came through, incredible earth changes that destroyed those civilizations, right? And then we find out that others emerged later. If those seashells exist on that temple, the only way that could have been possible is from a great flood. Is when the oceans were having tsunamis and the violent catastrophes were so severe that they came all the way inland and covered that entire site up. And then as they retreated, they left behind those seashells. So right there, imagine for a minute, because this is how we have to try to get in the minds of what they were thinking back then. Imagine you're the Oxford University and you're there and you go up to the temple of Ziggurat and you take photographs of those seashells and you're like, look, look, oh my god, look what we found. How does this is amazing? Look at these seashells on the site and you send them up to the the chain and they see that and then all of a sudden the site's abandoned. None of that can be a coincidence. I don't think it's even just the ancient text. I think it's the geologic evidence that proves without a doubt that that city is truly an ancient city far beyond how far older than our entire narrative should exist. So if that's, people keep asking me, you know, how could this be a conspiracy? Why would they do this? If this site was allowed to exist and be excavated, it would be forced to change the entire narrative of the human story completely. We'd have to tear it down and essentially rewrite it again, which is what I'm trying to do, which is why I created this timeline I have and why I'm trying to like the new book I'm writing with Billy Carson, The Epic of Humanity. We're trying to recreate this human civilization story and allow that old paradigm to be destroyed. Good on you and I'm looking forward to that book and what a wonderful title, The Epic of Humanity. When's that due out Matthew? Well, we're finishing it right now and we're going to hopefully have it out this summer at the fall of the latest. So you can look for that coming soon. And then as we go forward later in this discussion, I'm also going to be writing another book after that, which is going to be probably the greatest project I've ever taken on, which is going to be the title of that is going to be and we'll get into that later on as we discuss, but the title of that's going to be The Dead Star in the Fall of Civilizations. Oh, superb. You touched very briefly on the 30th parallel and that relates to ancient sites and it also relates to the dating of ancient sites. Can you tell us a little bit about that? Sure. One of the things that we come across when we look at these, you can call them the truly ancient civilizations, the lost civilizations, the master civilizations, anything that was a sophisticated civilization that build megalithic stuff or left behind ancient texts that prove that it existed before the Younger Dryas catastrophes of 12,800 years ago. This is where we have this line in the sand, where anything before that we find incredible sophistication and knowledge and then anything, everything after becomes much more primitive as it goes along. So the linear model we're taught of the rise and fall of civilizations or the rise of civilizations as we would say is very antiquated and it doesn't work. And so, but when you look at those sites around the world, you plot them, you look at a globe, you look at just where all these locations are around this sphere, and you look at Giza Plateau of Egypt, you look at where Eridu is in Mesopotamia, you look at Angkor Wat, you look at other sites in the Americas, and you look at other places in the Mediterranean, you find this very peculiar aspect where they all built in the same line around the world in the utmost precision. And the further you go, and of course you delve into the great Periodic Giza and its alignments to the stars and Orion and being half the ratio of the earth and so on, the more we look, the more we find that these civilizations were so sophisticated on an understanding of energy and consciousness in the universe that we are completely basically unaware of what they knew now. They may not have some of the technology we have now, but their understanding of our earth and the cosmos and on the higher aspects of us was to a degree where if we want to learn and truly get to the next stage, we need to study the ancient past, because that's where all the answers are. So these sites all around the world in this line known as the 30th parallel, they obviously knew where that was and they built there for a very specific reason. And I think it comes down to probably two things. One, when you look at the earth, you really, we really need to wrap our heads around the idea that it's not just this physical rock. It's in many ways very energetic. It's an energetic, it's got electromagnetic balance of the north and south pole, and it's got all these energy lay lines around the earth, right? And those lay lines cross in different places and have these enhanced energies, areas of energy, where the earth energy is powerful. And I think that's where that concept, when you look in the Cuneiform Talus, they talk about how they say this term building temples in pure spots. And I think that they were obviously very aware of these energetic locations on the earth where perhaps through building a temple in a very specific kind of stone masonry way that enhances with certain blocks, like whether or not it's anything that's like high quartz base, like whether it's sandstone all the way up to granite, building these temples in very specific locations with very specific architecture, right, with the masonry and create an environment where if you're in that location, could probably allow huge leaps of higher consciousness and spirituality and connection to these portals and gateways to the gods, they call them. It was like the avenue from humankind to these higher realms where there seems to exist these super highly intelligent creator beings that are intertwined in our story in many, many ways. And that's the excitement or the exciting aspect of this, is that we are in many ways children of them, which is why those texts also are so forbidden, Paul, is that they tell this story about how amazing we are and the gifts that we have and what we're supposed to be and how we've fallen since then. And so we simply need to remember all that we have lost and get back to that point. Oh, absolutely. You're singing my song. This is exactly where I've gone in in echoes of Eden. I want to ask you two questions from what you just said. You say that the ancients had the naus to build these sites in high energy points. Does it go beyond that? Do you think it points to the possibility of previous civilization that existed globally? And then my other question was, how do you understand the portal aspect of these high energy spots and what was built there? How literally do you take that? Yeah, that's a great point. Again, looking at that 30th parallel and looking at these civilizations around the world. And for instance, let me give a couple of examples. You go to somewhere like Easter Island. We're told that it's just an isolated culture that the Rapa Nui built these Moai and these walls. And then there's another civilization of the Inca in South America and then Balbek Lebanon and Turkey and all these locations in the Middle East and the Mediterranean and in China and Japan that they're all isolated. They just came and gone at different points and they're within that 6,000-year window. But really what you find to start from where I just mentioned, starting in Easter Island, go to a place called Ahu Vanapu. And that's Ahu is the type of platform where the Moai were basically placed. But in this one location in Easter Island called Vanapu, there is this incredible megalithic wall that has this precision that's unlike anywhere else on the island. And when you look at the way that that wall is designed and the sophistication behind how perfect it is, and then you go to a place like Cusco in Peru or Zaspiulman or Oyayte Tambo, you see the exact same building. It's identical. So then all of a sudden you go, wait a minute, so now Easter Island and Peru and Bolivia are connected. And then you look at a place like Balbek Lebanon and then you look at like the Valley Temple of Egypt and you see the same megalithic style again. And you say, okay, so those areas are connected. And then you look at places like in China like the Yangshan Quarry, and then you look at places like Japan like the Imperial Wall and numerous others around the world. They all have almost the same building style. It's almost identical. And they all have the same creator origin stories about how some group of ascended beings, greater beings came down and either taught or created civilization and then created these massive temples and locations around the world and then just mysteriously disappeared. And what you find when you see that is that they were all connected. They were all connected by some kind of a greater master civilization that once existed probably during the time of when we think of Atlantis and maybe even Lemuria, where there were great civilizations that had influences all around the world and then they just were destroyed and they disappeared all over. It echoes the same thing and the point to prove that the ultimate proof in my mind is these symbols we find in cylinder seals all throughout Mesopotamia of this pinecone being passed to like a king or a priest and then this almost like handbag that they're carrying. Now to be very clear, I think that the language of the ancients is symbolism. So I don't think those were literal things. The pinecone represented knowledge past passing to the back of the head for the pineal gland in the third eye because that's how one can awaken to the true knowledge of all we are and what we've what we've learned. And so they were passing not just the not just general knowledge, but the knowledge of everything. And I think that the handbag symbol represented the totality of them having all of that sacred secret knowledge, right? Something secret to be kept. And what the reason I'm mentioning that is those symbols, we can find those also all around the world. The same symbol of the knowledge in the handbag is on pillars in Gobekli Tepe and it's in La Venta, Mexico with the Olmec and it's in throughout the Americas and it's throughout the fertile Crescent of Mesopotamia and in the idea that going up into into Balback Lebanon and the regions around Turkey. It's it's the same thing. We find this shared similarity around the world that was carried. And that's why this is so important because what we're uncovering is truly a lost chapter of our story. It's something that we need to try to get back again that we really don't just really become unknown. And what was the second part of your question there? You talked about building these ancient sites in high energy points and there being an aspect to those locations and what was built there that relates to consciousness. And so what kind of portal are we talking about? Are we talking about an environment that enables an altered state of consciousness? Or are we talking about a physical portal that gets us from here on planet Earth to somewhere far remote? Well, it's interesting how whether or not you want to go from the Cherokee Indigenous stories of the Cherokee in the United States, where they state that they would go down to these underground areas and very specific mountains and they would connect to these realms that were not rock, but there was some kind of a connection that existed long ago there. All the way down to the ancient civilizations of the Inca, the pre-Inca in Peru and Bolivia. And there's a couple places down there that I want to mention. There's a place called Erumuru, which is a gigantic rock stone doorway that doesn't go anywhere, right? Then you have the famous Gate of the Sun right next to it. And these locations, they don't seem to have any function anymore, but did they once have a function? And I want to also mention we find those same types of gigantic doorways in Madin Saleh in Saudi Arabia and Nashi Rustam in Iran. The same aspect of these gigantic doorways or temples that seem to be built in a very specific place of location. And I want to give an example of what I just mentioned. Madin Saleh is in the middle of the desert, like an inhospitable place to be. And maybe it was a little bit more lush back when they built it. But it wasn't like these locations were necessarily chosen just because they were lush in a place to live. They were chosen more importantly because they were energetically important, whether or not it's Eridu or whether or not the areas around like Titi Kaka in Bolivia, they were energetically important. And so they knew that. So they had an understanding of these energy centers around the world. And when they created temples and these doorways, there seemed to be some kind of an ancient technology or some kind of an energy field that no longer is functioning. It's not there anymore. It's a situation where I think that those were portals and gateways to potentially other parts of the universe, maybe other parts of our galaxy, maybe they are portals to places like Orion or other star systems. We don't really know because that energy, those areas are no longer functional any longer. So there was some kind of a grid system with pyramids and temples all around the world that once had a connection with these higher dimensional beings and how they were lowered kingship to these priests and kings that then ruled over the people in a way where they were allowed to basically be consorts to this other group. And that whole system was destroyed and it no longer exists anymore. And so we look at these locations around the world and we're like, why would they build that? It's because we're trying to look at this in the wrong way like a functional physical reason like why we would build something for like a city or something. But we're looking at something I think that's energetically on the metaphysical side of our reality that we just don't understand. Now you're actually going to Bolivia and Peru to further this research. And you're going to be in good company. You're going to be with Billy Carson, Brian Foster. What are you gentlemen up to exactly? Thank you for bringing that up. I'm really excited to go to those sites. I've studied them for years and years and years, but of course there's nothing like actually going to one in person. And so we have quite an agenda where in July we're going to be traveling down with this convoy, I guess you could call it of higher researchers, to visit the most sophisticated and most significant of these megalithic sites around Peru and Bolivia, like Machu Picchu or Sasuke Oman or Cusco or Oyotetombo. And of course we're going to go to Pumapunko and Tiwinaku in Bolivia. And we're going to go to all these locations with the experts, right? Brian Forrester is bar none the megalithic expert of the world in my opinion. And it's been truly an honor to work with him over the last few years. And so we'll be meeting him down there to go and look at all of these different areas of architecture, these building styles and to take to analyze them, to study them and discuss them and visit them to see the energy side of it, to see the physical side of it, to truly prove that there was an entire chapter or chapters of civilization that have risen and then fallen and then have come and gone. And they're literally wiped from our memory as Graham Hancock says in his book. We're literally like a species within Misia, where we don't remember who we are and we don't remember our true past. And so I'm really excited to take that data and really put that into a model to recreate what the ancient world looks like and what they knew. The ancient narratives from out of those parts of the world are really interesting to me because, like others, they are layered with information from different periods of history and prehistory. And so if you read the the Mayan base stories, you can hear stories that would appear to go back to the most recent intervention in our story to further human development. But then there are other aspects of the story that seem to go way back into a timeline in which something is happening in our solar system that's impacting life on Earth in a massive way. And my ears pricked up when I heard this from these ancient stories because I'd been primed for this by reading Plato, the ancient Greek philosopher, and he believed that civilization on Earth is reset periodically by global cataclysms triggered by the movement of objects through space. And so when I started reading and hearing stories about things happening in our solar system that altered the conditions of life on Earth, and these are embedded in the central and South American stories, I thought, well, this is really intriguing because we've got a sequence of stories of beginnings that suggests not just an older human civilization, but an even more ancient timeline than that of repeated resets and civilizations. Can you speak a little to that topic? Absolutely. And you mentioned Plato, I guess that would be a great place to start, is that when you read into the Timmy is Incredious and you find out information about where he got the story of Atlantis, you find out that a philosopher and poet Solon from Greece traveled down to Egypt, he was like the first person from that region to visit those that culture at that time and they recognized him as being a significant voice. And so he met with these ancient temple priests at the temple of Sace, which is a temple in northern Egypt that ended up being destroyed and it disappeared. And so we don't have anything left from that today. But what we do have are the stories they left behind. And the temple priests of Sace, they tell us a story. They say we recorded this story into the temple walls of this temple of Sace. And they also recorded them in oral traditions carried down from great priests and ascended sages from long before. And they tell him that there hasn't been one or two, but many catastrophes that have left and made civilization come and gone multiple times. And they knew that. And those events seem to be shared by every single truly ancient civilization that we have records for all over the world. And if there's nothing left from records that they kept, we find the evidence on their megalithic structures. Things like in Peru or in Abusir outside the Giza plateau in Egypt or you go up into Turkey or you go into Asia. We find this very strange aspect on these megalithic walls where they're blackened or melted in some cases, right? A great example is the Colossae of Memnon outside of modern name Luxor Egypt. These gigantic statues where you can identify on the northeast side of them and others, there's something that happened that was so severe that it melted the rock in these sites all around the world. To have that happen, you have to have temperatures that exceed 2,000 degrees. So if you were on the surface during that, you would be vaporized essentially, which is why underground cities like in Derungku, Turkey are so interesting on why either that story or like the Hopi being led underground during catastrophes, they were being protected from some series of catastrophes that were so severe that I think they came along with them. Yeah, I think there may have been cosmic impacts at times, but I think more importantly, the area of my research that I've really been going into, that I believe it's related to the sun and some other things as well, in the idea that you could have supercharged particles from the sun bombard the planet and disrupt the geomagnetic balance of the planet and the ozone layer, and some of these charged particles in these solar winds can get through during these massive coronal mass ejection events can reach the surface of the earth and literally destroy whatever's there, but it gets worse than that. And I'm not trying to project fear just because it sounds good, but this is what the evidence shows is that this time period of the Younger Dryas, 12,800 years ago, let's just call it 13 a roundup, that time period seems to be a cyclical time of disasters throughout history. So I was just on a show with Randall Carlson a couple of days ago, and we pulled up a chart where we're looking at all the evidence of these mass events that have occurred, and the correlation is overwhelmingly on this 13,000 year time period, not just 13,000 years ago once, but then previous over and over again. That seems like this time period that seems to happen over and over again, and the ancients knew it. And I think that's what the purpose of Rebecca Tepi was really overall, if you were going to map the heavens and track time, you would want to know when your civilization was about to be destroyed, because that would be the only way that you could plan and put procedures in place to then protect those. And that's why when you look at stories of Atlantis and you say, well, did Egypt exist before Atlantis? Or is it that way around? Was Egypt created out of the remnants of the civilizations and the knowledge of Atlantis and then other parts of the world as well? And that's exactly what the stories tell us. It's that these ancient ascended, these sages and mystics of these societies that had all this knowledge, they were truly wise and knowledgeable, they knew about these cycles. And so before they happened, they would go out and send parties and individuals all around the world. I think Kukukon and Quetzalcoatl and the Americas and Viracotia are the perfect example of that, because they're describing the exact same way every time, this group of mystics that traveled around and then created all these civilizations and then mysteriously disappeared. That seemed to be happening around the world, but it seemed to be happening at different points in which catastrophes were coming or had just occurred, and then they had to rebuild things again. The problem is that this time period that we find that these events occurred seems to be between 1,000 and 1,200 years long. It doesn't mean it's continuous, but these events, these extreme events we see in ice cores, samples from Greenland and around the world and these layers of soil where there were literally global fires and impacts or just extreme heat or flooding, massive flooding like we see the seashells at Eridu, all of the above, these events seemed to all coincide and be part of the same thing. They seem to occur on that cyclical basis of 13,000 years. The question is, what is causing it? Yes, so we've got this cycle happening on 13,000 years. Plato had a different idea, I think, about the length of that cycle, but absolutely believed we're on a cyclical pattern where the cataclysms on the planet are such that civilization gets taken back to a virtual zero each time and has to reset. He had his thoughts about the movement of objects through space impacting us. You mentioned solar activity, so in that great puzzle of a picture, here's a left field question for you. What is a binary star system and how does that relate to this picture? The first thing I do want to add in before I say that is that what was interesting about that presentation I did with Randall Carlson a couple of days ago, he had this chart, as I said, where we had all the different ages and time periods and where these catastrophes were. The majority of them were all around this 13,000 period, but the second highest correlation was between 5,000 and 6,000 years ago. There was another time. There was another set of events that didn't seem quite as extreme in terms of their impacts, but they were still pretty extreme. Plato may have been onto something with that number. There may be two different cycles, but one is the most significant of all. Really, we're looking at something that is truly great. Now, you mentioned the binary star. If you look at the galaxy and our understanding of the universe, astronomers and scientists believe that roughly 80% of all star systems are binary, and in many cases, they're trinary or in some examples have even more than three stars. But when solar systems develop, they usually are developed in pairs with the stars themselves, in pairs. We're, of course, taught in school that there are nine planets and there's a central star known as our sun. Of course, there used to be 10, but the whole contention on Pluto type of aspect on what that is. Of course, I do think that that's a satellite moon that was basically thrown out into the outer side of the solar system in that area, but that's where this evidence of what I'm about to describe really comes in. Can I just intrigue as well? Do you believe in a missing planet where the asteroid belt now sits? That asteroid belt that we're talking about that's referenced for that. That's the Mars between Mars and Jupiter asteroid belt. And yes, that's something where there's some pretty compelling data. If you look at these different time periods of the earth and the moon, as well as tablets like the Enuma Elish that discuss these strange events with this planet Tiamat and this idea that some enormous catastrophe event occurred long, long, long ago, probably millions of years ago, that separated and fragmented some object that was there. Now the modern academia will argue that there's not enough mass in the asteroid belt between Mars and Jupiter to account for that planet, except if you look into the effects of what Jupiter would have done to though that area, it would have been very easy to essentially throw out a lot of those objects in the different places and only remain the smaller core of what used to exist there. So yes, there's certainly been enormous catastrophes in our solar system in the past. Mars is the perfect example of that. We find radioactive nuclear isotopes across the entire planet where we know that that planet was once lush and some disasters event occurred that destroyed the ozone layer in that planet and caused it to basically turn into a frozen wasteland. And that that understanding builds us off into another more complex theory that I would like to talk about tonight. You go right ahead, Matthew. Carries with you. Okay. So as I've been looking at this, and a lot of these alternative researchers that I have enormous amounts of respect for, the consensus that has really come in by a lot of them is that these cyclical events on the earth, especially the younger dryus, was created by an impact or impacts from all across the world. The problem I have with that is that the evidence I see from around the world and the lack of direct impact craters really tends to have me and the data that I'm about to present right now has made me veer to a different direction. Now, again, like I mentioned before, I'm not saying there hasn't been cosmic impacts. In fact, that five to six thousand year period that Plato mentioned, maybe that's when the torus meteor shower comes through and on a cyclical basis. And then sometimes those objects do hit and various other things. So there's other things that happen. But I think the core of this cycle of destroying civilizations revolves around something that I think has a lot of data to really back it up. And I'm going to present some of that data right now, which I think is very, very compelling. So the first piece of that to connect to present is in the 1970s, NASA and some of the governments were very curious and almost concerned because what they recognized is that the entire ecliptical plane of our solar system, all the planets have this tilt to them that seem to be on that's being affected by something, right? The best examples of that are the outer planets like Uranus and Neptune. They have an extreme tilt to them that seems to suggest that there's a strong gravitational field that's basically pulling on everything. Everything in the whole solar system is being pulled on by something and they didn't know what it was. And so what they did is, and this is a fascinating story in my mind, what they did is they essentially sent out two probes. I'm going to pull up the image while I talk so that I can basically have a reference to discuss this. So what they did is they sent out two probes in 1983. They sent out a probe called, thank you, perfect Tony. They sent out a probe, one of them was called Pioneer 10 and the other was called Pioneer 11. And I really want to break down this because I think this is one of the greatest secrets of all time. And I can get into why I think it's a great secret and the evidence behind proving that this is part of our cycle and how it was very much covered up. So clearly they're sending these probes out. They didn't know what was going on. That's the first place I want to establish. So they were unaware of what was causing this tilt to all these objects in our ecliptical plane of our solar system. So at that time, it was pretty open knowledge. Hey, we're sending the probes out, everyone. This is exciting. Let's see what we find. And if people remember from the 1980s, these were wildly publicized that this was happening. So they send Pioneer 10 and 11 out and when Pioneer 10 and 11 get either past the... I want to go back and just to clarify something. They sent them out, obviously as this chart shows, and I'll explain what this is in a second, they sent them out in different directions. So they sent the two probes in completely different directions of our solar system to try to figure out what was going on. And that is exactly what this image that you're looking at right now is depicting. This image is depicting the only source of information that anywhere you can find on the internet that verifies what these probes found. And it comes from the 1987 Science and Invention Encyclopedia. And they did... There's a section on space before the internet was popular. And in that section, they discussed probes and they talked about Pioneer 10 and 11 and they had this beautiful graph here. I'm really thankful that this exists. And it took me a very, very long time to track this down in a PDF high def image of this. And this can be found on my website, thestageoftime.com. And this image is to me the great smoking gun of us understanding this entire cycle. Now, I want to just add to this that we have an understanding that our solar system has cycles known as the Zodiac cycles that form this 12 Zodiac 1,200 year period that adds up to 26,000 years. And that's known as the Great Year. And in the ancient civilizations like in Gobekitepi, that's essentially what they were tracking. They're tracking the ages because they knew that certain things were happening. And I think they also recognized that there was leaps of consciousness during certain ages as well. So it wasn't just one thing. So what's causing the Great Year? Why is the earth wobbling on its axis to face different constellations? And why is there this cycle that exists within our solar system? What is causing it? Well, going forward again, leaving that little note there, go forward up to 1983, NASA sends these probes out, and they go in completely different directions in our solar system because they don't know what they're going to find. Space is vast. And so Pioneer 10 passes beyond the distance of Uranus in the direction it was heading, and then Pioneer 11 gets near the distance of Uranus, and they both find something. They both discover something phenomenally important. In that diagram, you can see that it's mentioned as being the 10th planet. And in 1983, this 10th planet was identified at 4.7 billion miles out. For some who don't know how far that is, we're talking about beyond the Sun and beyond the Kuiper Belt. No longer in the inner solar system, and no, I do not think this object passes through the Kuiper Belt. I think we're talking about an energetic, metaphysical interaction with objects that exist way beyond our understanding of what we think exists out there. Now, at that time, though, and we can piece this together based on some logic, at that time, notice how close that object is. It was the one that was first discovered because it's the closest. So the two probes both discover, they both discover this planet that is out there beyond the Kuiper Belt. And at the time, NASA was not hiding it. They actually came out in the 1990s, and they were in the mid 1990s, and they said, everyone announcement, the Pioneer probe data has discovered a planet that exists beyond the Kuiper Belt that is four to five times the size of Earth. And that's a paraphrase quote that you can find if you go look it up. It was a major announcement, right? And everyone's like, Oh my God, there's another planet. And they were calling it the 10th planet because at the time Pluto was still a planet. So that's why it became nine or became 10. Of course, now you go back and this is theoretically this will be planet nine because there's now there's eight planets if we demote Pluto. So at this, at that moment in time, this wasn't a covered up thing. Clearly, this wasn't really concerning to them. They're they're thinking, Oh, okay. So this large planetary object, is this the reason that this gravitational disruption is occurring on all these on our on our inner solar system? Is it from this object? And they're and they were like wondering. But then something happened is a very defining moment there that occurred as the probes are traveling further out. They find something else. And what they found is fundamentally the most important thing I believe in not only understanding the cycles of destruction of civilizations on earth, but the entire balance of how our solar system functions. Okay. So way out at 50 billion miles, almost inconceivably far out, they found what they identified based on the signature that came back, because the pros were had technology available on them to identify signatures of objects, they identified with what they call a dead star. Okay. Now, that announcement never made it though. And that's what I want to point out. As soon as that was found, everything was buried. It all disappeared. Now, I want to point out as well at the same time that this was being discovered. There was two famous astronomers. One was named Thomas van Vlander. And another was named Robert Harrington and Robert Harrington, these were top of the line astronomers. Robert Harrington was the head of the U.S. Navy Observatory, right? Top of his class in charge of the entire project. And he started working with Thomas Vlander because Thomas Vlander was the one who figured this out. He started, he found this data from Pioneer probe data because he was an astronomer. He was a pretty high level individual at the time who was pretty well known. And he found this data and he started looking into this planetary orbit. Okay. And he told Robert Harrington and then Robert Harrington started looking into it as well. And right when that announcement was made from NASA and then subsequently everything was buried. And I mean like scrub, like if you go on the internet and you look up Pioneer data, there's like nothing. It's gone everywhere. They scrub, they scrub the entire world, the internet, except for that one 1987 science and events invention encyclopedia. That's the only evidence we have anywhere in the world on what actually these probes found. Okay. Now, Robert Harrington and Thomas Vlander started sniffing around, right? They start really getting into this and they're looking at it and they have a lot of knowledge and they're gonna, they're figuring it out. And so what happens, the announcements made from NASA, this whole thing gets buried because they find the dead star. They realize that oh my God, this is part of something so much greater that we know. It's on, it's, to me, it's on the same level as like if you've discovered a comet or an asteroid that's gonna hit Earth. It's the same thing. It's the same narrative where anyone who knew about it and wasn't part of a higher, higher up elites group would be like taken out. And I, and some people don't believe that those things exist, but I really do believe they do. And subsequently Robert Harrington, Thomas Vlander, both mysteriously died of throat cancer within a short time period of each other. Gone. And right when they died, Miles Standish, another astronomer that worked for high level astronomy, came out and stated that all of these discoveries that they had made with the pioneer data in this planet, because, because they weren't talking about the dead star, that wasn't discussed, but they, that planet and all the data revolving around that was based on mathematical incalculations. And then everyone's in the astra and the scientific community is like, oh, okay, so it wasn't real. And then everyone forgets it. And then those men disappear into the, the bookmarks of history. And then for years and years and years and years, everyone thinks that all of that wasn't real. Okay. Until a few eager people noticed that diagram in that 1987 encyclopedia and started wondering about it. Not only that, but the only organization that started pursuing something separate was Caltech University. Some, some mathematicians and astronomers at Caltech noticed that there was disruptions to the Kuiper belt, the outermost asteroid belt that's beyond the sun, where there was objects that were in a really weird elliptical orbit. So something was influencing them just like the planets beyond them towards towards the inner solar system. And they started figuring out that there had to be a planet that was gravitationally influencing them to do that. So some of the research started to reemerge again, and you would see some announcements, but then it would disappear in Peter off again, because I believe that that information revolving regarding that planet, which is a companion of the dead star is the greatest secret of all, because it is, it's, it's descriptions of what it does and how it interacts with our solar system provides us with basically an entire narrative that fits together that pieces together exactly. Now, did you want to interject at all before I keep going, Paul? Well, yes, I was just going to ask how you see the trajectory of this story, because to find a 10th planet, or as it would now be a ninth planet seems uncontroversial, to find a dead star, okay, we can announce that. What is the thing that we can't announce if we are not worried by a dead star? What should we be worried by? What we should be worried about is the interaction of this dead star with our sun and our solar system. Now, so then what is tilting the entire solar system? What's tilting the Kuiper Belt? I think that planet plays a small part gravitationally, but I think it's this dead star. Now, let's go into what that means. Now, instead of a red or a brown dwarf, a dead star means in most cases that that star went into a supernova and exploded, and all that's left is the remnants of the core of that star. Now, when a star explodes, there's only two things that can happen to it. It either turns into a black hole, or it turns into a super dense object that's completely invisible and dark, because there's no longer any nuclear fusion existing within it. And so it's very difficult to see, but it's easiest to find based on the influences that it has, okay. Now, this object has been identified by some, and there was a wonderful documentary that came out called The Great Year. I highly recommend people check it out. So I'm not the first person to discuss this, but it's very hush-hush, and it's very controlled. This information, because I believe that the interaction that this dead star has is the answer to all of these questions that we've had, but more importantly, it also presents that great catastrophe challenge of our time on whether or not we will disappear just like so many civilizations before us. Now, imagine this dead star is in a synchronous orbit in like a dance with our sun, okay. But instead of being a close orbit, it's an enormously long elliptical orbit, okay, with these objects. Now, when this dead star approaches, and I've done the mathematical calculations, and guess what? It looks like its orbital track is 26,000 years, exactly the same as the great year of our entire solar system and of Earth with the procession of the equinox. So it seems to be the reason why this cycle even exists in the first place. Now, secondly, what's half of 26? 13,000 years. Now, if you have that dead star having a rotational pass that revolves around an interaction with our sun, then when it comes towards what's known as perihelion, which means the closest approach to the sun, it would interact with our sun and cause all kinds of problems. The first thing would happen is you'd have immense heat build up in our sun because it's trying to maintain equilibrium with this massive super dense object that's coming around, coming close enough to interact with it. Now, when we look at ice core samples around the world, we see this temperature flux all throughout history where the Earth gets very cold and then it gets very warm in very short amounts of time. And I now believe that in the entire cycle of not only the disappearance of civilizations, but on ice ages and the temperature fluctuations on Earth is largely to do with this object. Now, imagine for a moment, yes, you have the heat and all those things, and I'll talk about that in a second, but as that object were to leave known as apihelion and go away, it would get cold again because the heat that latent heat that it's transporting and the interaction with our sun would dissipate. And so then all of a sudden you'd have this shift towards a colder climate, which would explain why ice ages seem to develop and then disappear over and over again on these cycles. Now, this is where the disaster aspect comes into this. On apihelion, sorry, upon perihelion, when this when this dead star were to come within close proximity of our sun, you would have this 1000 to 1200 year period as it's passing where our sun would go through these massive changes. And what we're talking about is imagine the sun is having these these effects that are going on for over 1000 years, right? They're sending charged particles out because if you have an object that it's it's being disrupted from its equilibrium, it's not going to just explode. It's going to go through these periods of releasing energy, okay? And then it's going to build up and build up and then it's going to keep releasing energy and some of those releases of energy may be extreme, okay? But what would happen is you'd have a build up to it. That's where our time period right now gets in very interesting because we're 13,000 years since the last event. So what you would have is the sun would start sending increased charge solar particles out more and more and more of them, right? And they would bombarded hit our earth and then you would have things like volcanoes would start going off because the earth is interacting with that energy and it has to release energy too. So you'd have increased earthquakes, you'd have volcanoes increased, you'd have storms would be would be disrupted and you'd have a weird some climatic disruptions and then you'd have the magnetic North Pole and South Pole would start moving. Now right now we know that magnetic North has moved so far in the last 15, 20 years that it's now going towards Siberia, okay? And they've had to fly up there and basically remap out the whole system because everything's going haywire. Meanwhile, we get all these announcements that the sun is sending all this stuff out and our satellites are getting disrupted and all these things right now. But what I argue is that this is simply the precursor to a much larger event that occurs as we go along because we're talking about a very long time period of these things gradually building up. And what would that be? It would be a gradual weakening of the magnetosphere of our planet as the poles move and then shift dramatically, maybe even flip. You would have a breakdown of that balance of energy on the earth and then what would happen is that energy balance is what creates this grid system of an ozone layer and an electromagnetic grid system that prevents these solar winds from coming in. It basically protects us from all of those effects of the sun. But as this is continuously sending out charged particles, you're going to slowly disrupt that balance and you're going to disrupt that system here. And then eventually, if you get a coronal mass ejection, you have huge areas that are now open that have no protection. And then those solar winds and then extreme solar activity can just bombard earth and reach our planet and they can cause things like massive earthquakes on a level that is 10.0 and creating volcanoes all over the earth and creating tsunamis that are miles high. That would exactly explain why we would have Indigenous stories and ancient stories from around the world of these great floods that seem to be shared everywhere. Because I believe that those events were largely to do with the description of Atlantis. It's not just said that water destroyed it. It first says, and Timmy is crazy, that volcanoes and earthquakes preceded it, then a massive wave and the ocean swallowed it up. So we're seeing this build up of these events, Paul. Exactly. So Paul, one of the last things I want to mention regarding this diagram relating to this dead star that I think is one of the smoking gun pieces of evidence that proves this entire theory, it comes to this one very critical piece of information that we find on this diagram. Notice between Pioneer and Pioneer 10 and 11 what it states in the wording at the top when it identifies this dead star. It says something incredibly important. It states there's equal pull. Now what does that mean? Imagine, so we have earth in the center of that diagram and then Pioneer 10 and 11 go out to completely different parts of the solar system because you remember they didn't know what was causing these perturbations to these planets. So they sent them out in completely different directions in the solar system. But what happened? They both identified this dead star as equal gravitational pull. Now why is that important? It's extremely important because it means that the gravitational pull from this object is so significant that it's affecting everything in the solar system equally. And what that means is that it's responsible for the entire cycle because it has such a massive gravitational influence that it doesn't matter where you are in the solar system. It's equally affecting everything. I mean obviously stronger if you're in the far outer part of our solar system, but in terms of affecting the whole solar system on like a tilted axis, it's affecting everything. And so therefore that wording right there is what, to me, states that look, we figured out what is causing not only the cycles but the entire tilt of our solar system and the entire dynamic of our solar system itself. So just to conclude on this, essentially what we're looking at here is a situation where, and I really want to emphasize this point strongly because I know people listening to this, they're going to be scared out of their mind right now. I believe that based on not only the ancient stories about their prophecies of the future, but also on the technology that I've been studying in relation to what's going on right now with certain geoengineering and certain secret projects in Antarctica. I think that's the entire reason why we have so many scientific institutions and government entities down in Antarctica right now is that they, for the first time in human history, I believe that we have the technology available to prevent our own destruction. So again, going back, why would they cover all this up right? Because they found this dead star, they had the best astrophysicists in the world obviously, probably working for them, and they did calculations and they go, oh my god, this object comes through every 13,000 years and would destroy our civilization. And they then went through and there's a whole another aspect of that story that we could talk about another time, building underground bunkers at various things that were going on in the early 2000s in the late 1990s. But they basically determined that using different technological means through reflecting solar particles that are coming in to not have the magnetosphere be weakened, but also I believe what they're doing in Antarctica is they're using Nikola Tesla technology to affect the entire orbital wobble of our planet so that they can affect the poles from shifting enough that they would set off every tectonic plate in volcano on the earth. And I think that that's why there's so much going on in Antarctica, because if you were going to affect the energy sphere of the planet, you would not be in the North Pole because that's where the energy leaves. Look at a territorial energy field. The energy would basically come in from the bottom and it would come out the top in this system. So in order to affect that and prevent it, you'd have to be in the South Pole, Antarctica, and you'd have to use some kind of a massive magnetic device, something that they could artificially create a system to prevent the influences of this binary. Now imagine it's going by during perihelion and they have this technology set up and they're seeing how there's effects from our poles wobbling. I think they have the ability to go in and shift the opposite way and recalculate over and over and over again to not have this disaster occur. That doesn't mean we're not going to have large earthquakes and volcanoes and events that are going on the planet like we're seeing right now increase, but I think that they're knowledgeable enough in this and we have the technology of the first time, I think, in any of our past civilizations that we are going to prevent our own destruction and we will be able to then reach the next stage of wherever we're going to be going as this highly conscious creator being, but that's why I want people to feel that comfort is knowing is like look at look at elites around the world. There's no one behind green screens. There's no one that's like mysteriously underground anywhere. If we were about to be destroyed, they wouldn't be on the surface like they are now. To me, they've determined between the geoengineering that's being done, reflecting solar particles and this massive set of projects in Antarctica with preventing the pole shifts and flips is that they have calculated with all those things that we will be successful in doing this or we would see a very different world than we do today. And so I just want that to be the overlying message of this. Yes, that's a really superb point. So we now have an explanation on the basis of cosmological studies for the periodic cyclical timelines and stories that our ancestors bequeathed to us have been telling us for thousands of years. We can understand why there might be this 13,000 year cycle, why it would have the impact that it does. I agree with what you've just said that there is more evidence that our elites are sticking around rather than about to take off as a breakaway civilization like in the movie Don't Look Up. And I share that sense of reassurance that you derive from that. But beyond that, what can you and I do? I mean, when we talk about forces on this scale storing cans of food in my pantry and casts of water, it doesn't seem to amount to very much. What can you and I do in the light of where we think we are in this period of history? That's a great question. Now, that technological aspect of saving us, yeah, that's going on. But let's not pretend we live in this warm and cozy little situation where the government wants us to all be knowledgeable and these things. I mean, all these sites, the narrative, all this is being covered up. Ancient knowledge from our past, erudu, we can remember all this darker side of our reality exists where people are fluorinated to have lower consciousness and calcify their pineal gland and like all those things are real. You don't think they're real, just do a little bit of research into them. We have to understand that there isn't this need for us to reach higher states of consciousness. This is simply to protect their ass and the system so that everything isn't destroyed because it would be a lose-lose for them as well. There's a system here that's been created where everything's going along the way it needs to, but what does that mean for us? Well, it means that just because this is happening, it doesn't mean that we just sit back and just watch it all unfold and like eat popcorn while we're going into the age of Aquarius. We have to understand at the same time, we are conscious co-creators here. It's our job because there's no one in modern academia that's going to do anything about returning the knowledge of the past, about changing us into a higher form, about returning all of what we've lost. That's on us and that's what our job here is to do, is to raise the consciousness of the entire planet to change and disrupt this dismantle, this entire system of controlling information and knowledge from the past and that's where we come in because it may seem simple to some. Someone just sitting in their house watching this right now be like, well, what does that matter if I understand these things and I study these ancient cultures and I put those practices into my own energy and my consciousness? It matters because we all have fields of energy and we're all playing a part in this collective consciousness in the whole entire planet and when people shift, when you have these beacons and nodes of higher conscious people in communities, it shifts everything around them. It's a projection of energy and consciousness that can affect all of the people around them and so as we have these nodal points of like Paul Wallace in Australia, this nodal point of higher consciousness, it affects such a larger area than we can ever understand that we are those great sages and mystics that are here to awaken humanity and bring back this great time that we have because guess what, it looks like we finally have the time to do that so let's use it wisely. Oh, I agree with everything you just said Matt and I absolutely applaud the role that you're taking in doing exactly that. You too my friend. We're going to have to have you back another time because we've run out of time for today but while you're with us, let people know how can we keep up with what you're doing because I just love the way your research is going, where you're taking us, you've got to tell us more about Bolivia and Peru after you get back from there. How can we follow Matt LaCroix and everything you're up to? Thank you so much Paul, I really appreciate everything you do as well my friend, I really do. People are interested in my work, they can visit my author website at thestageoftime.com, my YouTube page at Matthew LaCroix or Instagram at the stage of time and I'm going to be doing, I'm increasingly doing a lot of things with Gaia so check out Gaia for things like Open Minds and Beyond Belief and other shows that I can't say yet but there's a lot going on right now and there's a lot of exciting things and I'm very honored to play the part that I am right now and I'm really excited for everything that's going to be coming in our story. Matt, thanks for everything you shared with us today, it's been a great pleasure having you. We'll look forward to having you back another time and we wish you well in the meantime. Thank you so much guys. 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