 vehicles that we can use in order to grow the property market with South Africans, you know, who are who are looking to do the same thing, which is build the nation. So let's talk about how you guys operate in terms of do financial institutions and banks and other institutions that are financial portfolio managers on all of those, do they recognize dogfills and are they able to give you guys services that are for your unique needs and specifically to allow you guys to do what you need to do. Good evening and welcome to the private property podcast right here on our private property Facebook page. It's 7pm and it is a weekday. So that means you see me on your screens talking everything and anything property. If you are joining us for the first time, this is the podcast where we talk about investing, buying, selling and maximizing your overall private, your property portfolio. So if you are joining us for the first time, thank you so much. And if you are joining us on the Twitter spaces, a special shout out to you tonight, I have an interesting topic for us to talk about because it's something that for some of us grew up with, but has evolved over the years to become something that is in the property space and that is making people money. So if you are a property investor or looking to enter the property market, maybe this might be the thing for you. I have as usual, I guess who is going to give us insights and give us tips and tricks on how we can do this effectively. We are talking how to build a profitable property stock fell. And I am sitting with Slyndy Lee Lisegna, who is a property investor as well as a coach in the Sakissis where property stock fell. Slyndy Lee, good evening and thank you so much for joining us. Good evening to me, thank you so much. I'm really looking forward to having this discussion because, you know, I grew up in one of those places where every street has a stock fell, but it wasn't specifically for properties. So today, I want us to talk about what is a property stock fell? How does it look? How does it operate? And who can be a part of it? And I know that's a couple of questions in one, but let's just hit it and start talking about what it is and how does it operate? OK, so as we all know, having grown up in our communities, we all knew what stock falls were as a concept, right? But each of them are unique in that they're characterized by the members themselves, what it is that they intend to achieve from participating in the stock fell. So really, there are no two stock falls that are exactly alike. I know that we sort of use the umbrella term of property stock fell. But, you know, being in the space, I've realized that each of them are unique, they are different because the members that join and the objectives for joining the stock fell are different. So some people participate in the property stock fell merely for the fact of, you know, having that level of accountability of raising money together. And then that money is then used to put down a deposit towards acquiring a home if you're a first time home buyer. That provides that level of commitment and consistency with savings to achieve that goal. You may find another stock fall, for example, where they buy each other building materials and that way they then buy and they material in bulk and then they're able to build and they even help each other with labor and all of that. And then you also then find, you know, investment focused stock falls who say, you know what, we don't want to buy properties that we are going to live in. We want to actually accumulate properties for the fact of placing tenants in for an income. So no stock fells are exactly the same. They're all different. The space that I primarily play in is the investment stock fall. So which are different in that we are not acquiring property for the purposes of residing in them. We are merely investing in acquiring properties for profit or for income purposes. Sure. Thank you so much. So tell us a bit about Sakissi's where and the property stock fell that you guys have set up. You already mentioned that it's for investing. Tell me how you guys started and what was the motivation behind it? We spoke a little bit of air and you told me that you guys have almost 300 people who are part of the stock fell. So that's a lot. How do you guys manage it? And you know, going through the day to day is isn't it a lot to manage? Isn't it like a full-time job? OK, so the stock fell started with an idea that with the frustration that I had had, I'm a property investor in my own right. And I had started investing in property. And I realized that I couldn't access certain opportunities because they required more capital that I couldn't access on my own. And so having grown up in a community, in a family where stock falls were the norm and they were common and they were used for various reasons. So for me, it really was a no-brainer in terms of combining the best of both worlds because I had already been playing in the property space. I already saw the benefits. And I mean, I mean, I'm obviously pushing to acquire due to the audience that's on this podcast. But we all know the benefits of investing in property or even acquiring property for residing in. So for me to combine the best of both worlds where with the stock fell, we are able to raise a lot of money that I wouldn't be able to on my own. And so we then combine that with the ability to access profitable property opportunities. There was the thinking behind the start of Sarkis is a property stop for to say, how can we get more people involved so that we may be able to access bigger and better opportunities? Sure. And I absolutely love the name Sarkis is because, and indeed, you guys are building the nation. This is one of those vehicles that we can use in order to grow the property market with South Africans who are looking to do the same thing, which is build the nation. So let's talk about how you guys operate in terms of do financial institutions and banks and other institutions that are financial portfolio managers and all of those. Do they recognize stock fells? And are they able to give you guys services that are for your unique needs and specifically to allow you guys to do what you need to do? OK. So stock fells are an informal entity, if I can call it that. So they're not really a recognized entity, but they do have some certain powers in that they can enter certain transactions, right? Basically, the chairperson or the nominated person can then enter into certain transactions on behalf of the stock fell. But so for example, we can purchase shares, unit trust, and those kinds of investments. But where it relates to immovable property, like buying a house, whatever. Unfortunately, as a stock fell, we can't go and say, Sake-Siso stock fell has bought this particular property. We would either need to come in as the individuals or collectively go and buy that property. So it gets a bit tricky, especially when you have a lot of individuals in that, just the nightmare and the administration of managing and getting a home loan, for an example, as a group becomes almost impossible. So it becomes necessary then as a stock fell that you migrate and move on to a different kind of entity that will enable you to be able to access funding from the banks and traditional finances. This means that you would either need to incorporate into a company or a trust. That way you then have access to funding from the banks. But the challenge comes in that because the stock fell is made up of various individuals, the banks need to ultimately hold someone accountable for that home loan. So this is where it does get a bit tricky and that is why you find that traditionally stock fells tend to then acquire properties all for cash because just because of the numbers involved and how that works, it becomes a bit difficult to be able to access funding. But once the entity is set up either a company or a trust, it then becomes easy because it is that entity that acquires that particular house and therefore selling the house or managing it becomes easy because there's an entity that is effectively managing that process. And so the leadership of the stock fell then becomes the executives or the people that run the company or the trust depending on how you structure it or you even can get external people that may have the skills that don't reside within your stock fell to help you to run that particular entity that you've set up. Sure, and what are some of the challenges that are associated with you guys? I'm setting up these entities. I mean, as we mentioned before, you guys have 300 people, 300 individuals. And in a traditional stock fell, there would be a time where everybody gathers and there's like a sharing of money. So in this case, you guys can't really do that because there's a lot of people involved. And with COVID and with all the restrictions that have been placed, how have you guys been managing this because there must be a level of trust when these things are concerned. And a by-question to that is that on the podcast not too long ago, we had a co-sharing or a co-ownership series where we spoke a bit about it or episode rather, where we spoke about it and one of the things that came out from that episode was that the most important thing is an agreement. So they need to have a very solid agreement that details what everybody's responsibilities are and the out close that if somebody wants to leave, this is what happens. Just talk to us a bit on how the agreement specifically looks for the entity that becomes psychesies where that now evolves into getting these properties or acquiring these properties. How does that agreement look? And how do you guys also manage the payments in terms of the return on investment because ultimately when we invest we want to be able to get returns, dividends and ask to be able to make some money. So please just talk to us about those two things. Okay. So the first phase is in setting up the actual stock file. So you're absolutely correct. There needs to be an agreement which you then sign or enter into or co-opt into when you join a stock file. So it will specify things like how much do we contribute? What is the frequency? What happens if you don't pay? What happens if you exit the stock file specifically? So the second phase is when we evolve into a trust and we operate both entities in parallel. So the stock file is still very much there as an entity and we still have the trust as an entity. So the funds are raised within the stock file and then once the stock file has identified a particular opportunity, those funds are then moved over into the trust. And so there's essentially two agreements here. The one is what we call the constitution which governs the rules of engagement of if you will, of the stock file. Then we've got the trust. The trust itself has got its own set of agreement. We've got what we call a trust deed which is a document that outlines the terms and conditions of how the trust operates, what happens, what the beneficiaries, et cetera, et cetera. So that happens within the trust. So once the funds are in the trust and the property is purchased or whatever the case might be, then it runs like any other business in that it's got an income, it's got expenses, and then once the profits are available, they then get distributed. So how we manage all of this process is fortunately for us, we live in the digital age and we are fairly comfortable with technology. We use an app which we use to manage contributions, to manage payouts, to manage people to join and exit. All of that is managed on the app. We also meet virtually on Zoom at least once a month. This is to cater for our members which are all over the country and now recently even South Africans who are outside of the country are also coming on board and joining us. And so using technology like that enables us to stay connected and to be able to share information. So that's how we manage that process. We also are in a WhatsApp group where we communicate all the time with those who've opted to be in the WhatsApp group. So there's just that level of communication and being connected through those various platforms that I've mentioned. You spoke about decision making being one of the biggest or hurdle that you guys had to cross and probably cross all the time because there are always decisions that are being made. What are some of the other challenges that you guys have gone through and probably overcame or some of those challenges that you guys are still working to overcome because the market is volatile. At different points in time there are different things happening. The interest rate has been going up. There was a time it was going down. Now it's going up again. And that causes fluctuation and movement dynamics in the industry. What are some of those things that you guys are doing in order to make sure that you keep the investment profitable? So we outline our investment strategy very well in terms of what are the opportunities that we enter into. So as I said earlier that because we are stockful we tend to then obviously lean more towards acquiring properties for cash. So we're not really exposed to the volatility of the interest rates in that regard. But obviously it's got its downsides in that you can leverage in whatever you. But anyway, so that's the thing that dried. The challenge is that we need to wait until we have enough money to acquire an asset. We can, for an example, just raise 100,000 rent and use that as a down payment on a million rent house. We need to raise the full million rent which is unfortunate in that we cannot do that in the way that we are functioning at the moment. But it is definitely something that we are hoping to overcome at some point. So that's just some of the challenges in that we need to raise the money. We need to make sure that we find the right opportunities and we need to make sure that they, we overcompensate in terms of analyzing the risk. We need to make sure that, for example, we look at multi-tenanted properties because we don't want to find out the situation We're finding one property has got one tenant and that one tenant doesn't pay. We always want to make sure that we identify our risks and we say, how do we mitigate this? And we involve the members in the decision-making process to say, guys, this is the opportunity that we've identified. These are the pros, these are the cons, these are the risks, these are the benefits. So when we are investing, we are all collectively, not only are we collectively raising funds, but we're also collectively learning about the property industry. So that is one of the big benefits of belonging to a network like Sakizu that you don't only benefit from the income that you earn or the returns, but you also benefit from the collective knowledge that we are undertaking together. Recently, we've entering now the commercial space. So now we're having to learn about what is commercial properties, whereas previously we were playing in the residential space. So now we're all co-learning about how commercial properties work. So that is just one of the big benefits around that as well. Sure, and looking into 2022, where do you guys see the market going? Just before we start rounding up our conversation tonight, where do you see the market going in terms of stockfiles? Do you see more stockfiles coming up? Do you see maybe even the financial institutions opening up their hands to, or their hands and services to you guys to say, listen, we are recognizing that you guys are doing something special in this space and they're giving you service offerings. Are you guys approaching banks, approaching financial institutions to say, this is what we are doing and it's working? So the property stockfile market has been a big focus, especially from the financial industry, because there's so much anti-potential there. And I think they're starting to slowly come on board now and look at what are some of the solutions that they can offer for property stockfiles. One of the banks, for example, is offering now a home loan solution where up to 12 people can actually go and get a home loan together. So as specifically as the case of the property stockfile, one bank has actually approached us to say, how can they provide home loan solutions for our members? So our members have got a dedicated bank at one of the banks and all our home loan solutions are taking care in that way. So they are slowly coming on board and saying, how can we meet you guys halfway so that we are able to provide solutions? But obviously this is still a new space and so obviously the banks are gonna be cautious and they wanna slowly come in until they understand it a lot better. I know there's been a lot of research as well that has gone into the space within the private sector as well as in the academic spaces. I get invited to participate a lot in this research. So I know that there's a lot of research that's going in and obviously on the other side, it's to find out how can they provide better solutions for us. And so also my role as a coach, even within the property stockfiles, I'm seeing a lot of stockfiles now, not only going into property, but also either businesses or opportunities like farming, franchising, hospitality. So they're now thinking beyond just the traditional stockfiles that we know, which are just grocery stockfiles or funeral stockfiles, and now going into actually investment-focused stockfiles that are actually gonna generate an income for the members. I think definitely if the objective is clear, the model works, if the objective is clear and there's good intentions with the people who run it, then it definitely can be profitable and can work. I mean, it's worked for generations and that's the reason why a lot of people are now deciding to evolve it and bring it into the property space and into the different spaces that we see ourselves having these days where we can take advantage of. So someone is sitting at home tonight who's a property investor who wants to go into a property stockfile or wants to start one. Someone wants to come into the market and be in a property stockfile. What is your advice? What are the steps that they need to take tonight as they are watching us? What can they do, actionable intelligence for them to be able to do from tonight in order to either start one or join one? I think you mentioned the key point that you said that if the intentions and objectives are clear. So in order to be clear on what it is that you want, you need to have the right knowledge because a lot of people go in and just say property but they don't even understand, especially if you're looking at it with the investment focus. So you need to understand that now you are an investment stockfile and you need to make sure that when you are buying a property, it is an investment-grade property Never mind the fact that you're buying it cash but the fundamentals still need to be there. It still needs to make sound financial sense for you to be able to invest in it. So that comes with having the right level of knowledge. So the knowledge would be the first thing that you would need to get. You would need to understand if you are deciding that property is the asset class that you as a stockfile want to invest in, get yourself a property coach. I provide coaching services around making sure that you are making the right investment decisions. You are right buying the right properties that are right for your particular group in your stockfile. And you need to make sure that your stockfile is solid. It runs smoothly. It's got all the things that are in place that need to make sure that it runs accordingly like a constitution, like a contribution management system. All of those things need to be in place before you can run a stockfile because otherwise then you may just run into trouble. Sure, thank you so much for that and I'm sure that a lot of people sitting and watching us right now are already convinced that where do I sign up? I need to start today. Any last word of advice in terms of how you can make it profitable, how you can make it work and to all categories of players in the property industry? So understand what you're getting yourself into. And especially if you're joining like a public stockfile where it's people that don't know each other, you need to just do your research and do diligence so that you don't end up losing your hard earned money. So definitely do your right research. And I mean, property can be very profitable when done, right? So make sure that you surround yourself with the right people and you surround yourself with the right knowledge so that you may be able to realize your investment objectives. No, definitely. And if anybody has questions and things that they would like to ask or want to get in contact with you, where can they contact you? They can contact me on my email, hello, at meetcylindila.com. Let's hello with H-E-L-L-O at meetcylindila.com. Otherwise, I'm on Facebook and Instagram as Cylindilisianne as well as Twitter. Thank you so much for joining us. Man, I'm really encouraged. I'm inspired and motivated already to look for a stockfile to join because, wow, the way you've given us information and those examples really, really appreciate you coming through tonight and really giving us that knowledge. We really appreciate it and have an absolutely beautiful night. Thank you so much. And that is how we wrap up the show tonight. So the stockfile works, guys. It is not a flat by night and it will definitely, if done right, if with the right intentions and clear objectives, it will definitely be profitable. So if you're a property investor, if you're someone who wants to get into the property market, this may just be a way for you to explore to ensure that you can start that property portfolio or increase it. Till the next time, we see you right here on the Private Property Podcast every weekday, 7 p.m. My name is Dumi. Have an absolutely beautiful night.