 Good afternoon, everyone, and welcome to session T9 of the 2022 Virtual Regulatory Information Conference, the RIC. This session is entitled Reimagining Nuclear's Role in Energy and the Electric Grid. My name is David Wright, and I'm one of the commissioners here at the USNRC. And before we go any further, my panel members and I would like to know a little bit about you, our audience. So we have a live polling question that Mr. Producer, I'm going to ask you to put up and open for live voting and that'll provide that information to the panel. So please take a moment and vote. And again, leave the, leave the question up so that we can see it populate Mr. Producer. You can put it up, visit up. So while he's getting that live polling question up. I think I want to briefly thank a few people. I want to take a moment to thank Candice de Messiers for her passion for this topic, and for the time and skill required to organize the panel this year, as well as for her efforts to organize our first panel on the electric grid last year. And Candice, not only are you knowledgeable on this and many other topics, you're also a pleasure to work with. So thank you. I'd also like to thank my staff, the staff of team right for their help and attention to detail on this panel as well as in support of the plenary session where I gave my record march just a couple hours ago. Based on the results that that we're seeing it, it looks like a lot of rent, nuclear regulation and followed by, you know, operating reactors and So it's pretty heavy on that. And new advanced reactors seem to be falling third so gives you an idea who you got listening to you today. So, Miss producer, you can now take down that first question. I appreciate it. The today's panel is going to focus on the reimagined role of nuclear and a carbon free future with nuclear providing both electricity to the grid and process process heat energy for applications such as hydrogen production fuels fertilizer steel plastics chemicals to salamation space heating and others. So this question is going to features across sector perspectives and examples from a number of experts here we've got lined up and on how the safe and secure use of existing a new nuclear technology can address near term and future needs for a resilient and reliable electricity grid and heat energy sources so that's going to lead us real quickly to our second live polling question number two, which is, are we ready for the future. So Mr producer if you could put that up so that we can open it for live voting and what I'd like you to do audience if you would, based on what you know on this topic do you believe we are ready for the future or not. So we're going to leave it up for a minute while it populates enough and I introduced the panelists of the group that we've got we've got an awesome group of presenters today. And I believe you're going to learn a great deal from each of them as we address this topic. So to maximize our time for this topic today I'm going to give a brief question for each panelist but I would encourage you to please visit the speaker pages of the Rick program and agenda to view their full bias. It's an it really is an impressive group of experts kicking off today is going to be Dr. Arshad Mansour president and chief executive officer of the electric power research Institute, known as every Dr Mansour will start with a short video and will follow that with high level overview and vision of nuclear role in a carbon free future. Next, we will be he'll be followed by Dr. Shannon Bragg sit director integrated energy and storage systems division at Idaho National Labs. And she's going to provide some technical and economic perspectives on the topic as well as some near term and current initiatives and projects. And she will be followed by Mr. Mike Melton, business development manager at x energy, and he will follow with a presentation on advanced nuclear role, and helping to meet future electron and non electron energy demands, and, and hopefully address the regulatory nexus And then, last but not least, he's going to be followed by Dr. Kevin Roanhorst, who is live from the Netherlands today, and it's nighttime there. And he's going to provide some technical and economic perspectives and speak to the current and future role of nuclear in ammonia energy production. So a user that's going to be be very interesting. As the panelists present will have time for some questions and answers but please put your questions in the chat as we go along as the panelists can do them and possibly address them in their remarks. And so looking at the live polling results. Most people think we're not ready. Some people think we're not ready. So thank you for that so this producer thank you you can take him down now. And with that, I'm going to turn the floor over to our shot man soar, Dr. the floor is yours. Great great thank you Commissioner right it's always been an honor and pleasure and good to be back after a year, and what a difference a year make. I mean, we are never before in the time in the history, the role of nuclear reimagining the role of nuclear for clean affordable and reliable energy. There wasn't a time that was more important now. And one year had made actually quite a bit of difference when we were there last year to today. When you wake up today you look at the forward pricing day ahead in Europe it's $500 per month 500 euro per megawatt hour, which is around $600 per megawatt hour. Then you look at what's happening in Ukraine, the suffering of the people, the brave people who are running the nuclear power plants in safe operation, energy is becoming critical in every aspect. And the role of nuclear is going to be even more critical countries after country in just 12 months have announced that they're going to go back to nuclear. You know, France is a great example of that state after state in the United States, where West Virginia and other states that had a moratorium on nuclear they're looking into advanced nuclear. In that backdrop, you know, if you go back six months ago when we had the COP26 the UN climate summit in Glasgow, that was also a milestone because aspirations of different countries on clean energy became ambition, and the ambitions are now grounded by targets and targets not 2050 targets near term even in 2030. So I want to provide a backdrop on that context of how the world reaches those lofty goals of clean energy, not just in the electric sector, but across electric transportation and industry. And I'm going to show a video from a US perspective. What does that stretch target means, but all countries in the world that are signed to the UN climate summit have very ambitious goals till 2030. So with that, if he can quickly play the video, then I'll come back. The Electric Power Research Institute is examining the pace of US carbon emission reduction based on the goal of cutting economy wide emissions in half by 2030. Across the US economy, annual energy related carbon emissions declined one gigaton between 2005 and 2020. Driving CO2 about 50% below 2005 levels by 2030 means tripling the rate of decarbonizing ocean, accelerating from a one gigaton reduction over 15 years to one gigaton every five years. Additional reductions are expected in the decades ahead as the US targets net zero emissions economy wide by 2050. Between 2005 and 2020, the power sector reduced its carbon emissions by 35%, driven by end use efficiency gains coupled with natural gas and renewables replacing coal. Electric sector reductions will need to accelerate over the coming decade to achieve a three times increase in the economy wide pace with high solar and wind penetration and advanced low carbon technologies emerging. Achieving net zero power sector emissions will take time and involves substantial technology innovation to make the transition affordable and reliable. The transportation buildings and industry sectors achieved relatively small carbon reductions between 2005 and 2020. These sectors will have to substantially accelerate reductions to meet 2030 goals. Electrification will play a central role in the decades ahead. Transportation buildings and industry are expected to continue reducing emissions, powered by electrification, low carbon fuels and carbon capture and storage. The development of negative emission technologies will benefit all sectors. The power sector is poised to play a crucial role in realizing the US carbon goals in the coming decades through direct emission reductions and by enabling reductions in transportation, buildings and industry. As we decarbonize and further electrify the transportation and building sectors, we simultaneously need to ensure the electric grid can withstand the changing weather and climate of today and tomorrow. Adapting the grid and proactively planning upgrades to handle extreme weather require evaluating trends in future climate projections, assessing grid vulnerabilities and investing in robust risk mitigation options that account for regional differences. Maintaining and improving resilience will be a critical part of the decarbonization journey as we seek to build a clean, affordable, safe and reliable energy future. I hope the video provided a context on how daunting the challenge is, but it's also an opportunity and I want to unpack it quickly on two different areas. The one area is the near term and near term is this decade. And the longer term is net zero till 2050. So if you look at the near term, there are a couple of things that we have to do and we make sure that we are continuing to do that, which is if you're looking from a US perspective, the largest carbon free source of energy needs to be there for us to have any chance to reduce the emission at the level that we are projected in 2030 or the target for 2030. We got to make sure that the market is valuing nuclear not just as a clean energy source, but a source of capacity source of resiliency source of inertia. And we have seen some very encouraging signs over the last 12 months that it is happening. We also have to make sure that we continue to operate the plant safely. We continue to look for opportunities where plant life can be extended 406080, but do it in the right way. There's a lot of hard work going on in the industry at every at national labs to make sure that we have that opportunity to continue this asset that we have built for the most important thing this decade that we'll have to do is we have to double down on innovation and we have to reimagine nuclear and in terms of reimagining even existing fleet and I'm talking from a US perspective. We've been talking about that we need to be more flexible, because we are getting more wind and solar that are variable and flexibility typically a nuclear wall has meant that we will be able to maybe go down or go up ramp up or ramp down some reactors can do it better than other reactors. But now we have a great opportunity. I and L and others are leading that work where well when electricity is not needed, maybe that same existing nuclear power plant can actually produce clean molecules like clean hydrogen and that hydrogen can turn into liquid ammonia. So now flexibility has a different context. There are several pilots in US that's happening. How do you integrate an electrolyzer in the right way with existing plant. But go beyond that go beyond on doubling down on innovation and advanced nuclear. We are so excited just over the last, I would say 18 months, not just significant interest, interest from nations, interest from states, public funding, private funding, there's two and a half billion dollars for advanced reactor demo that is in the job bill in US. And we fully expect before this decade is over. In the United States that will be at least one fully operational SMR advanced like water reactor type. We also fully expect that there will be an operational advanced nuclear molten salt high temperature sodium, and that would be operational within this decade, and also micro reactor. The 15 megawatt scale reactor will be operational, you have heard announcements from Alaska you have an announcement from Idaho, and that is a great opportunity because that allows us to rethink nuclear. Because when you look at some of the high temperature reactors, it can produce steam it can produce hype, it can actually produce hydrogen more effectively than what we can do today, you know you produce hydrogen by breaking water. The water is the less energy you need to break. So, whether it's hydrogen production or steam production, or production of electricity, these advanced like water reactors, with a totally different thinking on safety, whether it's redesign totally different thinking on refueling, you may have, there are current designs out there that are looking at a 60 year, you refuel it after 60 years. It's an opportunity for the world, you know, Poland just signed a deal with us. Other countries are looking into this to regain the leadership in developing the next generation nuclear is amazing. And just in one year we have seen so many, one after another. And another place this year the innovation this decade the innovation has to happen is we need to think broadly. No longer just electric utilities. Yes, electric utilities need nuclear to get to net zero, you need advanced nuclear. But if you look at industry, they can only go to 3040% decarbonization for them to go even 6080 hundred. The industry cement industry fertilizer industry steel industry, they are looking at hydrogen and other sources that this advanced nuclear could be the producer off. So you have even world maritime organization that is looking into net zero by 2050 for the shipping sector is either looking at liquid ammonia, which could be produced from advanced reactors. And they're also now looking into actually having nuclear reactors we have been propelling ships with nuclear reactors for a long, long time. This decade we have to seize the opportunity to not only operate the existing plans. Make sure we are operating it safely extending the life where life needs to be extended, but also doubling down on this rethinking of advanced nuclear, both from a utility point of view from an industry point of view. I want to end up with a couple of things that every and I think all of what we have to look into in this new world of reimagining nuclear. We have to look at every was instrumental in developing utility requirements document of the advanced like water reactor back in the 80s and early days. Well, now you're looking at a utility requirement document for a very different type of reactors. It's not a what is the utility a cement company could have a small SMR and that you know they have their own utility. And you know Commissioner right and RC plays a huge role. The way we license existing 1000 megawatt reactors. That needs to be revisited to look at how do you do it in some advanced like what a reactor design is the power island and the nuclear island, totally different than what our thought processes. And then end up with a more positive note than we are not ready. We have seen sign after sign is just 12 months. And if these signs and actions turned into reality, and we are all focusing on how do we safely bring this next generation of nuclear for industries for electric utilities, and maybe even for transportation. I think that would be one of the best thing that we're doing in this clean energy transition. So with that I'm going to pass it on back to Commissioner right and thank you so much for the opportunity. Thank you. Thank you so much our shot I really always enjoy listening to you. You're, you're easy to understand and you're very knowledgeable. And a lot of the things that you're talking about me, just the poll, you know, you obviously have a brighter, more positive outlook than what we offered, you know, like 79% of the people saying we weren't ready. And that's coming from the mainly nuclear and the operating reactors out of things. So, you know, hopefully, you know this this today was going to help people understand more about what we need to do and things that we've got to the hoops we've got to jump through to get there. So thank you so much. And so with that, I'm going to turn it over to Dr. Brexit, and Shannon you're up. Thank you so much, Commissioner right, both for the introduction and for the opportunity to speak on this panel today on a topic that I'm very passionate about. You've all just heard from Dr. Monsour the really ambitious goals that have been established for economy wide net zero solutions, and I'd like to amplify what we are working on with regard to nuclear energies role in helping us to achieve that across all of these power industry and transportation. And I hope when we go back and reflect on our readiness at the end of this session. The outcome will be a little bit different in that poll. Next slide please. So the Department of Energy Office of nuclear energy program on integrated energy system, as well as partner programs across the DOE complex has been really looking at this issue for quite some time. We're instead of looking at the traditional single input single output solutions where we might have a single reactor producing electricity to support the grid. We're looking more holistically at these solutions, where we can look at ways in which we can combine multiple clean energy generation technologies such as nuclear energy, working alongside renewables to meet a wide array of energy demands. This could mean better coordination within a grid balancing area, or it could mean that we are directly integrating these generation technologies behind the grid interconnect within an energy park scenario. So right now, if we have a region that has a significant amount of renewables when renewable generation is significant some of those nuclear plants the traditional base load supply, maybe asked to dial back that power output. But if we look more holistically at all of the energy demands both for the electricity grid and industrial heat users that we might also couple within these energy parks. We now have a means in which we can dynamically deliver the energy produced to the grid, or to these other energy users potentially replacing some of the traditional resources utilized for thermal energy such as fossil fired units within an industry application. When renewable generation is high and grid demand is potentially low, we can redirect high quality heat, as well as electricity to these coupled industrial processes. Now one of the questions we have to address when we look at these holistic solutions is, what about the reliability of meeting that demand in that coupled industrial application as well. So before we begin to look at the role of energy storage, which you see at the very center of this image, where that could be in the form of electrical energy storage, or it could be thermal energy storage providing longer duration storage and an opportunity for coupling those nuclear plants with an industrial application, or it perhaps could be chemical energy storage such as the production of hydrogen that can then go on to produce electricity during peak power demand, or to support other systems as well, such as transportation and industry. By looking at this in more of a holistic framework, we can begin to understand ways in which we can maximize how we utilize these generation resources, thus maximizing how we utilize that invested capital to put those systems in place. We can make sure that those generators were named profitable, but then also they maintain affordable energy to the customer, while also maintaining grid reliability and resilience. We can also look at this with the environmental lens to minimize not only emissions to the air of CO2 and other greenhouse gases, but also looking at the footprint of these plants minimizing land utilization and water utilization. So we are looking across the board at integration opportunities for large scale light water reactors, high temperature advanced reactors, and also very small scale micro or small modular reactors, matching those sizes to the intended application, and to the technologies that they may be coupled to on the renewable side. Next slide please. When we look to these solutions, they truly are a wide array of opportunities that can be supported via nuclear energy. Now I want to remind you that this would also potentially incorporate those renewables in the region, but I'll focus on the nuclear side for this particular audience. Now when we look to integration opportunities, they might involve thermal integration or electrical integration behind the grid, or even the production of process intermediates such as hydrogen and click once more. And you'll see how all of those begin to become feedstocks to a number of industrial applications on the right side. There should be one more image that pops up on this slide I'm not seeing it. So I'm going to go ahead and keep going. We can actually provide connection to the chemical industry petroleum refining. There we go. Thank you. As well as many of these areas that that are significant emitters and we can prioritize those areas that we evaluate based on energy use, temperatures of operation and the potential to reduce emissions overall. In this way we can better exploit the capabilities of our nuclear systems which is primarily a provider of heat that we traditionally convert to electricity. According to some of these processes may require that we upgrade that heat, going through a number of heat augmentation opportunities such as chemical heat pumps or recuperation to ensure that those temperatures match well to the needs of the process. For example, we may need to boost the heat from a light water reactor to better match the demand for high temperature operations of hydrogen production. That hydrogen is a highly versatile energy carrier and that has been one of our high priority areas because of this versatility. If you just scan down the right side of this image you can see that light blue arrow going into many of these processes in industry. And that is that versatile energy carrier that can be transported and it can be stored. The area that we're looking into more deeply is the production of synthetic fuels, where we can use captured co2 working with that hydrogen to produce these drop in fuels that can support the harder to abate sectors such as the airline industry and provide those drop in liquid fuels. We're also working deeper into carbon conversion processes. What this means is taking those traditional fossil based resources that would be utilized for electricity production or for heat and industrial applications. And looking at that as a feedstock a carbon resource that can provide higher value products to consumers, such as plastics polymers, or asphalt for our roads. And in this way we can convert some of that income to those communities that currently rely on the fossil fuel industry from the sale of those fossil fuels for electricity production to higher value products changing this energy transition in those communities from a potentially negative economic impact to actually economic growth in those communities. And so if we'll go to the next slide, I want to talk a little bit about how we evaluate these different opportunities. One of the first questions that we have to ask is whether or not these systems would be competitive. The first example looks at the estimated costs of high pressure steam produced using natural gas or produce using nuclear energy with this slide focusing on that produced with existing fleet light water reactors. You see a range of steam temperatures for light water reactor technologies as a function of plant size, how many units might be operating on a single site, and the capital investments necessary to upgrade the plant to provide steam as a product. On the diagonal lines what you see is some price points for natural gas and thus the corresponding costs of steam from those resources and those numbers come from the energy information agency. Overall what you see is that we're already competitive. The price of steam from a light water reactor can be competitive today with a natural gas package boiler. So this gives us opportunity to really look at where we can make impact in the industrial emissions area. Next slide please. So when we began this process we needed to develop an approach to evaluate these potential opportunities. It was a long list of options that we could support using high quality heat, steam and electricity from a nuclear plant. So how do we choose the best ones and where do we choose to deploy those. We did find a need to develop a tool set to help support that because most of our tools used in industry focus on those single input single output systems and don't look at these cross sectoral solutions. So just stepping quickly through that process. We need to identify appropriate scenarios based on where we'd like to deploy such a system we need to understand the renewables availability in that area. We need to understand what type of reactor might be of interest is there an existing reactor or potential new reactor that we might build and what are the energy needs to be energy needs that would be met is it flexible electricity supplies we discussed earlier. Or is it also provision of heat and hydrogen and water purification to those communities. We can then look at the data inputs necessary to drive those scenarios. This means looking at data for societal energy demand what is it today and what do we expect it to be over the next several decades out to that 2050 timeline perhaps. And we can then approximate what the plant capacities might be that we bring together. What are the size of those demands that need to be met and what size plants might we want to build. And what are the associated timelines with those what are the lifetimes and maintenance scheduled associated with these plants that we're talking about directly integrating and bringing together. Then we look to the economic aspects of this. What is the capital investment required operating costs. What is the energy price expected to do over time. Is it expected to go up how much is it expected to evolve. All these pieces come together into this suite of analysis tools that allow us to give a very quantitative. And then we look at both the technical potential and the economic potential of these systems on the right you see an example plot from this process where we're beginning to look at optimization of the size of a hydrogen production facility at an existing fleet light water reactor that is operating in a wind dominant region. On the X axis you see the high temperature steam electrolysis capacity the size of the hydrogen plant on the Y axis you see the size of the coupled hydrogen storage facility because we need to make sure that we not only provide electricity to the grid, but that we always meet hydrogen market demands as well. And then on the Z axis what we see is the hydrogen market size and how that is expected to grow. And we can optimize the net present value by building the system at the right size. Then if you'll click once more. You can see that in the next step we can look at how that energy would be dispatched once we build that system. See it's not updating yet on my screen but in the lower plot on this next click what you'll see is a time evolution of grid prices over a multi day period. And that rises and falls as a function of demand and a function of what wind is being produced at times of low grid price what we see is hydrogen being produced and sent to storage. When the grid prices high corresponding to high electricity demand, we can dispatch that hydrogen from storage while we send electricity from the plant to meet grid demand. So in this manner we can shift where the energy from the nuclear plant is going whether that is going to electricity production for the grid, or to support that hydrogen production. Let's go ahead and go to the next slide we might see that image I just spoke of. Yes, so you can see that evolution but I'm going to go ahead and move on unless we run out of time. So to do these types of analysis, analysis we did find that gap in the commercially available tools. So we developed this tool suite for techno economic assessment and optimization this falls under what we call the framework for optimization of resources and economics or force. And bottom line this allows us to integrate very detailed dynamic physical models of those plants so we really understand the time evolution of how they operate with the technical and economic optimization to assess the performance potential of these systems and those tools are available open source and can be accessed by by anyone and we encourage feedback so that we can continue to enhance those tools. Next slide please. Now those tools are being utilized to assess that potential for a number of different projects and at the National Laboratories we've partnered with a number of folks in industry to evaluate a very site specific potential for co location of hydrogen production. So these aren't just computational analyses we are now moving to steal in the ground demonstration projects. The first two projects listed here, focus on electrical behind the grid electrical integration of hydrogen technology, low temperature electrolysis with those nuclear plants. They are operating in different regions and therefore responding to different external signals on how that energy is shifted between grid support and hydrogen production. But the first of these will be in producing hydrogen at the nine mile point plant in New York in October of this year with the Davis Bessie plant in Ohio producing next year with installation of hardware corresponding with the outage plant there. In the third project we move that next step forward we move to high temperature thermal integration of high temperature electrolysis with that nuclear plant operated by Excel energy. So we begin to lay the framework for these highly efficient operations and understand how that co location may work, and how we may move through the regulatory licensing process associated with that. Finally the fourth demonstration at the Pellegrine generating station in Arizona will move from these small scale systems to that much larger scale hydrogen production at that site where that hydrogen in that case will be utilized within gas peaking turbines to meet peak demand, and they will also highlight as sin gas facility for the production of synthetic fuels. Next slide please. One of the questions we get asked is, how does this impact safety of the operations how does it impact licensing. So my colleagues within the light water reactor sustainability program have conducted a generic probabilistic risk assessment to evaluate that identifying the top hazards and concluding that the licensing criteria is met for co location of a large scale high temperature electrolysis facility, located within a kilometer of a generic light water reactor. Now this would have to be repeated for specific sites based on those specific plants and geographic locations but this gives us promise of this potential for co location of these systems. And now we don't just jump straight to deployment at a nuclear plant. We also have opportunity for electrically heated testing of these complex integrated systems within a laboratory at Idaho National lab. And this just quickly allows us to understand how we integrate these diverse generation sources. We have power and energy systems represented on the right side of the laboratories we can understand how these systems would operate within a grid infrastructure either a micro grid or a larger balancing area, how they would interact and distribute energy to thermal storage or to hydrogen production. And we have a laboratory that sits across the street that mocks up a control room so we understand the human operator interface with these more complex integrated systems. And next slide please. This is my last slide. I just want to point out that again my colleagues at the light water reactor sustainability program have also established a group that allows us to more deeply evaluate co location and production of hydrogen at these existing fleet sites, and that will provide a roadmap and a framework for new advanced reactor deployments as well with members of industry and the national laboratories coming together to discuss these issues within a number of sub committees that evaluate internal and external components, integration of these operations of the facilities and reactor impacts, electrical and switch yard integration potential control system approaches, and then the overarching regulatory strategies so if you'd like to know more and get engaged with that group please reach out and I'll get you in touch with them. So finally my last last side is just to say thank you, and I look forward to your questions and comments. Thank you so much. So, thank you Shannon and when, when Candace first met you virtually, she called me that I mean as soon as you hung up with her said that you were going to be perfect for this panel. And she was, she was right. Your passion for your work shows. And maybe you really do what you do your working bodies, what the reimagine role of nuclear and energy and the grid is going to be about so thank you so much for your comments and hopefully we'll have a lot to share during q amp a preview to So, next up is Mr Mike Melton. Mike the floor is yours. All right, thank you very much. Welcome everybody. Thank you Commissioner right for the team for having me and you're right Shannon is a tough act to follow. I'll do my best so a little bit next slide please a little bit information as we get into x energy and their capabilities but just a pause how amazing it is. We're not in a country but worldwide how things are coming together, the environmental consciousness, the, the technology breakthroughs, and the political alignment. We just haven't seen this kind of, these kind of forces coming together. And these three forces need need to turn around that 75% know we saw so we'll, we'll work on that. I mean, we can do it. The political alignment. Just to comment the tremendous work at the Department of Energy and the technology advancements to support and all types of technology, let alone advanced reactor demonstration project, but also kudos to the state legislators. The council's out there all across the country. They're taking a good look at their energy needs to call, you know, unfortunate coal plant shutdowns the job impacts, and social economical impacts, and they're pulling together and saying what can we do to change things and changing for better the state so we see a tremendous amount of momentum, and we want to be part of it and help support that as a solution for the country. Yeah, please. So a little bit about x energy so this is is advanced reactor technology that we, we will deploy to to actually, you know, help help solve the greenhouse emission issues and the decarbonization goals but at x energy, we're here in Rockville, Maryland. Just a little bit. The main reactor is the x100 is an 80 megawatt electric net 200 megawatt thermal reactor, high temperature gas, Jennifer gas reactor. That's what we'll talk about more in this presentation and the niche that it fills. We're also working on a mobile mobile reactor, which in terms called the micro reactor. So that's currently going on with other departments within the government. But as far as commercial applications, we might be able to start talking about that in 2027. At which point, these mobile reactors offer tremendous tremendous value for remote communities and also areas hit by emergency conditions. So we're looking forward to that future deployment in terms of, you know, human welfare, life saving capabilities hospitals. We manufacture our own fuel or try so x fuel, which is a tri structural isotropic particle fuel. We've got this process under under manufacturer and I'm telling you the results and the production has been just phenomenal in terms of quality, absolutely phenomenal and it'll be highly encouraging to talk about that. And then we also have a space application called ibx, which is a different different area of the company. And it's actually quite large but the reason we bring it up is because the culture of x energy, in addition to creativity, taking on challenges and simplicity, but safety safety is a huge focus here. And you can imagine in space safety would be magnificent focus so little about x energy. Okay, next, next slide please. So that the generation for high temperature gas reactors has quite a bit of history, both in the US and internationally, starting back in the 1960s in the UK, and even as late as some of the recent designs in China that have gone online. But in the US we've had experience in peach bottom and you and also at Fort St. Brain in Colorado. The other it's an evolution of the technology it's not new but with like all things is we're making it better. And like all things we can improve the applications. And so this, this technology is the nearest for deployment. And as Shannon was leading into the application for an advanced reactor technology these other other industries, not just a commercial electricity generation, but also in mining, including the Bitcoin mining oil extraction oil stands, processing applications, hydrogen desalination, the as as we finalize design and deployment see the application opportunities will be will be enormous. And the main difference, one of the main differences besides the fuel is the cool is helium gas versus water so we do not need for this reactor, you know the other advanced reactor designs as much water at all that to go to to deploy these reactors. They are phenomenally simple and safe. And that's that's a good starting point for for going forward in the future. Okay, next, next slide. So, I won't say on this too long, as I said it's a very simple design relies on inherently safe design features allows us to sort of revolutionize the way the tricky solutions are delivered the way we put them in licensing the reduction of effort in engineering. The goal is to improve certainty, improve confidence, reduce costs, and have a bulletproof safety case through the licensing process. And really, when it comes to manufacturing about a 10 of the components of the traditional nuclear plant. Once again, reliability, safety, and economics. So the, the fuel is not traditional fuel you might see the commercial plants essentially the fuel as manufactured here, the tricycle x fuel has been as we deemed the most robust nuclear fuel on earth by Department of Energy will take that. Essentially, it retains waste and fishing products within the fuel during all conditions, even the worst case accident conditions. And when you have that capability of the fuel containing your radioactive waste and gases, and you can keep it the size of a cue ball. Your accident source trim calculations your emergency planning zone calculations are reset and that safety case enables us to present a potential deployment, a safe deployment and much more locations throughout the country. So it's not new it's a proven safety approach. And I think, I think as we get in as we get into more details and and work on work on the deployment will see that the, the fuel is the safety case and it's just a tremendous asset for those high temperature gas reactor. Finally, from a safety case point of view the XZ 100 is meets all the general requirements for safety in terms of being walk away safe, zero core damage frequency, all passive safety features and resiliency and there's a great question on the panel about resiliency will touch on. Okay, so next slide. And I won't spend too much time but these are the ladders of innovation, starting with the field safety after the design, leading to the standardization and integrated delivery. We'll talk a little bit more about that because when it comes to nuclear power plant deployments the rubber is going to hit the road. In terms of, can we plan schedule construct and commission on schedule and on budget. So, next slide. As with as with most advanced reactor designs we're working very hard with the Department of Energy, we have the advanced reactor demonstration program award from the DOE with the project in Washington State. We're talking about first deployment by really the end of the century just being conservative, our goals are in the 2027 2028 timeframe. The, the important part of this and the award also that with the nature and project is that the recognition we got the recognition from the DOE is advanced reactor technology. And it secures our first customer deployment, and then the industry. No one wants to be the first of a kind deployment, but they'll, you know, next of a kind sense a whole lot better for a lot of good reasons. And so we want to build a blaze that trail, prove, prove the safety case, prove the licensing, prove our ability with the supply chain, fuel and then construction. That actually would be the demonstration product, all that will build tremendous confidence and, and for future deployments. Okay, next slide please. All right, so what are what our future deployments well there's there's always the part about the commercial generation, like Kristen. But really imagine, imagine a 30, 30 acre site with a four reactor 320 megawatt, like electrical station, dedicated to a refining, refining facility, or ammonia production. In the case of coal plants, which unfortunately are on are in the closure process but let's replace the coal plant with the x100 standard plant. More so, maybe we can refurbish a coal plant, and install a nuclear island instead, and read, and even real utilize some of that equipment. We have to do the feasibility study economic reviews, but there are jobs being lost with these coal plant shutdowns and there's opportunities to retrain refill and reiterate these communities with the SMRs. Particularly with the x100, which is advanced safety case makes it makes it a high candidate in the direct competition with any natural gas combined cycles. This is a standard brought up hydrogen production that is probably as big worldwide as anything, as countries move to hydrogen production and hydrogen fuel for transportation. And we also have steel steel manufacturers other other companies trying to replace natural gas with hydrogen as their ignition source. It's very difficult to pipe hydrogen over long distances, but if we can get a plant pretty darn close are posting up for shipping, then they'll have their dedicated hydrogen from that point. And of course, natural gas plants will be will be available because the ability of x100 and advanced the advanced reactors to ramp and perform just like a combined cycle unit just makes them tremendously attractive. For greenhouse emission reduction. It's the tremendous opportunity. What's not on this slide is desalination desalination efforts. And in Europe, the ability to provide district key for communities has come up over and over again. And that that also would be extremely important for heating. Okay, next slide. Thank you. And just a short slide and some of the industries that that would be available for advanced reactors just like the high temperature gas reactor for the XC 100, which includes cogeneration for electricity and steam and steam reforming natural gas so we're looking at all all the potential energy markets industrial sectors and what's what's great is they're looking at us to and we're working on we're working on how to how to match up how to deploy and that's the kind of audience I think the NRC would hopefully be seen in the future. We'll talk about that a little bit more. Next slide please. The discussion on resiliency. It really resonates where the weather plays havoc in certain parts of the country. So, the move for to solar and wind. And then, you know, for the gaps where where solar can't work or wind doesn't work and battery storage doesn't work you have to build a fill the fill that gap. And advanced reactors like the X100 can do that with very fast ramp up rates about 5% per minute. To keep the grid stable. So when there's a knockout going on and you need to ramp up quickly. The, these advanced reactors like ours can do the job. An adder is if your neighboring state is taking a hit and also markets going crazy. This will enable an owner of the X100 gas reactor to actually capture some of that market and participate in the grid. So that is a huge advantage, but also a huge, you know, important improvement for resiliency during emergencies. Okay, next slide please. It's coming. Yes. There we go. So, from a regulatory nexus point of view, there will be a lot of diversity. And so the question is, are we ready. Well, we will be ready. So in terms of what's going to come to, you know, you can't just go put one out you need you need to get it licensed with the regulatory commission that's first and foremost, and there's coordination with her obviously. So what, you know, who's going to be coming to Rockville right so you got to cogeneration and industrial process heat customers. There's there's factors about it, you know, economics and deregulated markets so that's going to be a priority for certain certain clients and customers. Some people are going to want it for peeking and renewable integration. We see that. So, there'll be potential partnerships with when when when mill companies, renewable companies that will need that stability. And then you got the end to end solution providers, you got the industries industry sections that just wants to steam but maybe doesn't want to plant, or maybe they'll be a co-owner and plan so these kind of projects will generate new kinds of ownership potential that will be coming coming and saying okay what's what's our licensing, what's our regulatory strategy, what will we come to present to the NRC, and it'll be impressive. I mean, it will be extremely impressive to see how these developments go. So just this is coming. Just a little bit of technical details on the advanced reactor landscape and what's changing but it's all for the better functional containment mechanism source terms. How we calculate that how we how we demonstrate adequacy of barriers is changing we're talking about different barriers now and the analysis and the computational methods, the testing and the validation work to support that. Fuel qualification. All in process in tremendous progress is made already until qualification but as I said, the fuel the fuel is different. It's safer. It offers tremendous benefits. What what is a licensing basis event or just beyond beyond design basis event for current operating nuclear plant completely different now when we consider advanced reactors. So a tremendous amount of work is already done by now in the NRC to help define those will be will be using using that as a basis for submittals. But essentially the conversation has changed. And what what was turned as a beyond a bite design basis event of importance for a gen two reactor is not important for a gen four reactor. And it's an amazing discussion. So many requirements once again completely changed. And really, it's not so much educating ourselves on these changes, but it's the public we need to educate on the changes and the stakeholder engagement as part of these citing disability studies and deployment plans. The stakeholder engagement is probably the biggest part of this conversation that we will talk about this but what does it really mean to the person you know living in the communities and school teachers and lawyers the doctors who say what is it say so collectively we need to help the communities we need to help the state legislators we need to help city councils, turn this information into something that is usable and makes sense and plain English for the public. Before, you know, they allow something like this to be actually this close, they need to understand why it's safe and from their questions so we've been wrestling with that and working on it it's I mean, I can think of questions. You know, I'm too biased nuclear industry forever. We need to get we need people that have no haven't been there and what are their questions, and that's that's the script we need to work on. Because they are a part of this approval process they are part of the success process I guarantee you. We can't do it without that kind of engagement in our communities. Okay, next one. I'm almost done so talking about regulatory regulatory processes and confidence, I mean, Commissioner is no different than any other process that the good practices are the same. A lot of communications. And if we can, when we when we work out, you know, who's going to be partners for a certain deployment for a certain industry once we work that out, we're all coming in. And we're going to come in early, there's going to be a lot of high and communication low communication. No surprises on that aspect it's so important, you know, having a regulatory engagement plan. And now we're going to propose regulatory approval. Essentially, there are options here with part 15 part 52 part 53 being developed. We will we will choose you know the hopefully the path of least resistance or we'll take a shot at it and go for it so. And then task and resource planning very important. A number of policy issues always need to be identified early early in the process. So I can go through this list but essentially it comes down to a strategy, which involves high level of communication in depth reviews on policy and regulatory requirements, the path forward identified, and then an execution plan. And, and it's doable. I've done it. I've done it a few times. It's doable for the advanced reactors, and we'll take no for an answer. So, I'm looking forward to come to the table with some new faces. In the industry, you know, she hasn't seen before with the high level of motivation and excitement, and that can do attitude because I'm telling you, these are the professionals and these other industries know how to get work done, and we'll bring that skill set to the table. And I think that's my last one one more slide. Definitely a part of the team to decarbonize industry and reduce great greenhouse emissions. We have a simulator here on our next slide here in Rockville, and individuals and companies are welcome to come participate and see the simulator and see how high temperature gas reactor is all the simplicity works. And there it is. There it is. So, we look forward we look forward to advancing the ball. So, that's all I have back to you sir. Thank you very much. Thank you so much might come and I can tell you're excited about the future with what we're ex energies headed. And I know you're actively engaged with at the NRC. And I think what I hear things are going well. But to those who are out there. May have a technology to right. I would be remiss if I did not encourage them and tell them of the importance of early gauge with the NRC and and encourage them to do just that engage us early and often. Just as you you were doing and thank you so much for your hearts and look forward to Q&A with you as well. Next, Dr Kevin Rowan Horst of the ammonia association will he's going to be the final presenter before we get to our third live polling question and then the Q&A. So, Dr, the floor is yours. Thank you so much for the kind introduction. So let me first introduce the ammonia energy association. Next slide please. So the ammonia energy association is a global industry association that advocates for the responsible use of ammonia in a zero carbon energy economy. So that means on the supply side, we need to decarbonize ammonia production. And we see that the bigger ammonia producers for instance CF industries in the United States, but also YARA in Europe are committed to net zero ammonia production by 2050 along the entire supply chain. On the demand side, we see that various industries, including, for instance, the shipping industry are looking at ammonia as a way to decarbonize their energy system. So the ammonia energy association is growing in terms of members and they're globally oriented and across various sectors along the ammonia supply chain. So these are small and medium enterprises up till very large companies. Next slide please. So here you can see a list of all the members of the ammonia energy association. Currently we have about 150 members. We've already mentioned across the entire value chain. And we see that the number of members is increasing rapidly. So since 2020 there's been a rapid momentum towards ammonia. So on the ammonia production side. Next slide please. All right. So we see that. Yes, yes, it's, it's moving. So we see that currently ammonia is globally produced. And the production capacity of about 183 megatons per year. This is the second most produced chemical around the world after sulfuric acid. And essentially, all of this ammonia production is also based with about 55% going to urea. And looking at the uses about 80% is used for fertilizer productions of mainly urea and ammonium nitrates. And the other uses are for the chemical industry. Ammonia is one of the most important chemicals produced around the world, because ammonia is used for fertilizers. And fertilizers sustain about half of the global population so without the invention of the Haber-Bosch process so the process to produce ammonia so NH3 from hydrogen and nitrogen from the air. So it sustains about half of the global population. However, there's also a downside to that, because essentially all the ammonia is currently produced from fossil fuels. So you see that with all the colors on the right hand side. See some colors of ammonia and some colors of hydrogen. And what you see is that about 75% of ammonia production is based from natural gas, which are remaining 25% based from coal. So essentially no ammonia is currently produced with zero carbon footprint. So that could be ammonia produced from green hydrogen from renewables or ammonia produced from pink hydrogen from nuclear power. So the key message here is we need to decarbonize and another message here is that essentially the ammonia storage is a hydrogen. Ammonia story isn't a hydrogen story as hydrogen production accounts for about 90% of ammonia production. Next slide please. In looking at new ammonia markets developing, we see that current uses are fertilizer production so it's about 85% of current ammonia production and 15% goes to chemical production. So you also see that ammonia is attracting a lot of interest as a hydrogen carrier and a zero carbon fuel. So what we see is that new markets are developing. So it can be the use of ammonia as a hydrogen carrier to use ammonia to transport the hydrogen from locations with a lot of low carbon electricity to locations where you need to hydrogen but with not with a lot of low cost low carbon electricity. So it can produce hydrogen but ammonia is also considered as a transportation fuel and as a stationary fuel. So in Japan we see a lot of movement to decarbonize the current assets from gas turbines and coal fired power plants to use ammonia in these installations. And also for transportation fuels we see in the maritime market we see a lot of emphasis of ammonia as the shipping fuel of the future. And we also see that when we look at the demand in the future. Currently ammonia is about 183 megaton production but by 2050 this could triple to about 600 megaton with about half of the demand going to new applications in the energy industry. Next slide please. When we are actually looking at decarbonizing ammonia production in a one and a half degree scenario, what we then see is that the current fossil based ammonia production capacity needs to decarbonize. This means that about half of the existing fossil based assets needs to shut down. We also need about 500 megaton of low carbon capacity added. So this can be done by solar and wind, but it could also be done for instance by nuclear. And when looking at all the announcements around the world we actually see some momentum towards low carbon ammonia production. So we can note that about 55 megaton of ammonia capacity, just based on low carbon alternatives so mainly renewables but also decarbonization of fossil based ammonia production is announced by 2030. And you see that some, most of this is in Australia, where you have a lot of solar and wind resources, but also some movements in the Middle East, and also in Africa, Latin America, but also for instance in North America. Next slide please. If you look at nuclear based ammonia production, there are some benefits so solar and wind are very nice, they can be low cost, but there's a drawback. They are intermittent in nature so in that sense nuclear could be a nice option to have a steady electricity supply to an ammonia plant. When we look at literature, we don't see ammonia so much discussed in one and a half degree scenarios for ammonia production. And also when looking at literature, we see a main focus on nuclear hydrogen production rather than ammonia production. One of the few, few publications on nuclear based ammonia production is from the Idaho National Lab. And also the ammonia energy association is currently working on a white paper, where we assess how nuclear power could be coupled with ammonia production. Next slide please. Actually the idea of nuclear based ammonia production is not new. So actually already in the 1980s in the wake of the oil crisis, there were the first mentions in literature of ammonia based on nuclear power. And back then the idea was to couple nuclear based nuclear reactors with alkaline electrolyzers which have been in use since the 1920s to produce the hydrogen and then convert the hydrogen together with the nitrogen to form ammonia via the Haber-Bosch process. And what's so nice about this is that in the US there's currently ammonia transport by pipeline connecting multiple states in the Midwest with a total length of about 3000 kilometers. So you could actually transport the ammonia where you need it. However, we all know that this has not come to fruition. And the main reason for that is the low cost of fossil fuels. However, nowadays we see increasing CO2 taxation and a decreasing cost of solar and wind anti development of advanced nuclear reactors. Next slide please. But there are some hurdles to overcome here, because conventional nuclear reactors and ammonia plants are not always compatible. If you're looking at the time to build a nuclear reactor, then on average that would take about seven and a half years, but an ammonia plant takes about three years. And also in terms of size, renewable ammonia plant or low carbon electrolysis based ammonia plant will be a lot smaller than a large scale conventional nuclear plant. So the cost is an issue because when you look at the ammonia market, this is a very competitive market and the cost needs to be as low as possible and most nuclear reactors simply cannot provide it nowadays. And also when looking at safety, especially when you integrate an ammonia plant with a nuclear reactor, there can be some safety concerns from a regulatory perspective. What we actually need is to have maybe smaller nuclear plants with a lower KPEX, for instance via SMR, so small modular reactors, or what we can do is operate current nuclear based reactors and have long term operation such that we can drive down the electricity cost such that we can be competitive against fossil alternatives. Furthermore, we can also do some innovations so we can look at how we can combine for instance the heat output from a nuclear reactor with steam electrolysis and this way we can lower the electricity consumption and therefore get a lower cost of ammonia. Also, we can take the best of both worlds from renewables and from nuclear and in that way drive down the cost of the ammonia production. But lastly, I would recommend also not just to look at innovations but actually to implement what's already there because they're all already nuclear plants operating and there are already electrolysis operating. And what we actually see right now is that there is going to be a nuclear ammonia facility operating in France around 2025. So to answer the question, is this possible? Are we ready? Yes, we are. So in France what they have is they're going to introduce 30 megawatt with connected electrolysis to produce hydrogen for an ammonia plant. And in France about 70% of the electricity is derived from nuclear power, so this could be the first reference we have to produce nuclear ammonia in that way this is the first of a kind and we can roll this out to the end of a kind. Thank you very much for your attention. Thank you so much. So, that was an interesting 45 minutes or so Kevin thank you so much I mean as a future user of this technology. It's your perspective is very important here, and the way you envision using it. It's something that we really need to hear. So, thanks to each of you for your presentations and remarks and for your willingness to be a part of this panel. We've got a little over 15 minutes to go. And before we get into the Q&A, we do have a third live polling question that I'd like the audience to answer today for you and Mr. Sir, if you go ahead and put it up. And that question is, what is the biggest challenge to nuclear role in a carbon free future. And if you put it up and go ahead and activate it for voting. And then I'll let you know to take it down. So, everybody has been using the chat section that we've got some questions that are that are starting to come in. And I think I'm looking at the results of the poll. So, all of the above right. That seems to be carrying the day. So, so thank you you can pull down the poll now thank you. To my panelists if you want to have a dialogue with each other ask questions that's fine. But I think what I'm going to do is allow some of the questions that we had in the chat start asking those right away. And this one right here is it was initially for our shot, but I think everybody could could answer it. If you want, and so there's a lot of interest in going green and the Green New Deal but nuclear power seems to be left out of most mainstream discussions with nuclear having zero carbon emissions. And the question as to why nuclear is often referred to as not being an environmental environmentally friendly option when compared to wind and solar, which both require significant significantly more land for the same output. The individual asking the question asked what is being done to change that discussion on nuclear such that it is considered a green power source. Our shot if you want to take first shot. I'm always glasses have full I think just look at the last 12 months and see the announcements coming from country after country. See the announcement coming from states after state. Even in California there's discussion from very thoughtful people on shut down of the a block any and so I think things have changed significantly just in the last 12 to 18 months. There's no point where it's no longer it's renewables or it's nuclear. It's clearly both and carbon capture and storage and other clean energy solutions. Shannon software one additional remark that I have on that I think our shot is correct that it's changing, it's evolving, we're seeing the impact of energy dependence on other countries we're seeing the language around what is considered green changing in Europe and us across many different areas. But I've often gotten that question in different groups and one of the ways it's been posed is how can you consider nuclear green when you don't have resolution to the fuel cycle. And so that's always the elephant in the room for for nuclear. We do have solutions we just need to get them over the finish line, and that is something that we have to resolve now that's not unique for nuclear we have challenges to other technologies as well upstream materials as well as transition downstream management of the the used materials the waste, but it is one that we always have to deal with front and center so that that is what I hear from the green energy community against nuclear. Yeah, so I would like to add on to that. Indeed, it's in the end not about either or it's and and and so you need to decarbonize fossil based feedstocks with CCS you need to use renewable feedstocks but you also need to use the benefits of nuclear power. So we are going to need all of that is in the end the carbon footprint will be leading here. Thank you, Mike. Thank you for being here with everything. It's just that when a legislation and and other darkness of being drafted will want to make sure we pay attention to that and I believe the conversation and the changes are happening now renewable includes nuclear, and just continue that transition. Thank you. Okay. We look here. Mike, there was a question that came in a minute ago for you and specifically for you after your presentation. And it had to do with the, the citing I think of the project and where it was going to be was in Washington, Washington state where it was at Columbia where was it. So the Washington state pilot deployment. Can you tell us a little bit where it's going to be in Washington state. Yes, in Washington state with the within this decade is a good public statement to make. We're a little more ambitious on that. But that's correct in Washington state and we're working with our utility partner up there energy Northwest. Thank you. Shannon. There was a question that popped through earlier. We've talked about several different ways to utilize energy created by nuclear generating facilities. Do you believe that the current grid system would support all these initiatives of, if not the have any insights to scale or what kind of upgrades might be needed. Sure. Let me recast that question just a little bit. So as we seek decarbonization I see a big push and a lot of areas for electrification of anything and everything as much as we can. The grid is not ready for that. I will definitely say that if we were to elect electrify everything in industry. We simply can't support that and would require a significant amount of transmission significant reduction of bottlenecking and some of these regions but when we start looking at integrated systems and provision of heat from these advanced nuclear facilities that changes the equation it changes the calculus of this such that we don't put so much stress on the grid. But now we have that heat being provided to some of those applications as well. Yes, I do think there are some upgrades that are probably needed for trans transmission infrastructure. There are challenges with regard to planning tools that don't look to these cross sectoral applications where a single plant might support the grid but then shift from grid support to providing that heat that thermal energy to other applications. So there are certainly some areas but those challenges change as we look to different solution sets. Let me follow up again staying with kind of the grid here. And this could be to all pick all of you but I think are there areas that are being considered to make the grid more robust to risk that could adversely impact the grid like cyber attacks or sabotage. All I have the Michael to say a couple of things do we does have a grid modernization initiative that brings together experts across the National Laboratories to look at very specific challenges, and there is work with regard to cybersecurity in fact we have a model called the North American electricity reliability or is it reliability or resilience NERM is the model that looks to these cases very specifically. So I would say work is being done I can't speak to detail about that but there is certainly work across the board and our shot with every may be able to offer a little bit more insight as well. I think you mentioned that the two areas one is more looking to redundancy redundancy of substation redundancy of lines but what you're seeing in California during wildfire it's not a sabotage. It's a natural event, but similar situation when the transmission lines are down, could you create local micro grid during the time that you shut off power upstream. So that's another form of resiliency I think all forms of resiliency and now explored for cyber events physical attack, but more importantly the changing climate that is causing whether to be more extreme, and more frequent. So I think a nuclear place a role in that resilient future. Right. So, Kevin, a question has come in about, and it's specifically why is hydrogen production from nuclear listed as pink rather than green. Yeah, so I think in the end the coloring schemes are not leading here. I think in the end the carbon footprint is leading. So for instance at the ammonia energy association we're working on a certification scheme for low carbon ammonia. So in the end, it doesn't matter then what's the color. Yeah, but in the anti carbon intensity is the most important thing here. Okay, thank you. Thank you for your answer. Our shot and come back at you here. Moving towards a macro grid with diversified resources be more beneficial overall than attempting to tie specific generating technologies to specific industrial processes when the when the need is electricity versus steam. The same answer is green, you know, green is renewables is not the only option. We have other options and macro grid is not the only option macro and micro grid, both have that and have their role to play in a resilient clean energy future. Okay, thank you for the answer. So have utilities assessed the need. I get a realization of the produced hydrogen in terms of sales fuel for hydrogen fuel transport cars and things like that. Yeah, that's a great question what is that hydrogen market doing so colleagues across the national laboratories worked a couple of years ago to look at the hydrogen market growth based on these evolutions toward clean energy systems. And based on the assumptions they saw a growth on the order of four times as much as 16 times in the hydrogen markets that that could be addressed by various resources. And so specific markets around individual plants or utilities those have to be assessed independently, and each of those demonstration projects that I mentioned. Those are focused in different areas around our country and they have done very deep dives looking at the hydrogen markets in their specific regions, and based on the current market and the expected growth in that market. They do see a potential economic viability for doing those hydrogen demonstration projects. And I saw another question in the chat on demonstration projects I want to point out that those four projects I highlighted are cost shared projects. We have a demand of energy working with industry to move the technology forward more rapidly, because we see a market there we see that potential and we see that need and demand for hydrogen growing. One area I love to call out is steel manufacturing. If we look at the potential emissions reduction from steel manufacturing that would utilize hydrogen in a direct reduction of iron process. We can reduce the emissions from that plant by 90%, 90%. There is a huge potential market for that and we see new DRI plants being built that could be impacted by some of those demonstration projects. Let me also point out significant investment in hydrogen being made by the US Department of Energy. If we look into the bipartisan infrastructure law. We see 9.5 billion associated with clean hydrogen production one and a half on clean hydrogen manufacturing storage and transport, and another 8 billion associated with establishing hydrogen hubs, one of which is specifically called out to be linked with nuclear energy technology. So there is significant potential for market growth across transportation and industry. And this is, this is a force that will continue to grow. And we'll see this impact dramatically I think. Thank you. Thank you so much. I'm going to come to you and then I'm going to go back to the panel again with a larger question. So you mentioned that X-Energy is preparing to bring in non-traditional customers that desire nuclear options. Are there any strategies that X-Energy is applying that are also applicable to the current operating fleet? I don't see one. As we engage with the current operating fleet for other business reasons, we'll be discussing those kind of strategies, but we can't get a lot done without the current operating fleet actually in some sort of cooperative mode. So yeah, there will be some strategies for addressing common resources, strengths, definitely their experience, definitely their plant knowledge, just brings so much to the table. And it's like a huge confidence factor for us to have those kind of relationships, especially when we're talking about non-traditional industry. So yeah, a little bit of turn to blinds a little bit, give a light on that, but yes, it's a resource that's supremely important to us and vital to us in the industry. So from your perspective as you see things, what are the most important regulatory considerations relating to non-traditional uses of nuclear energy? Well, the starting point is, assuming we get through the technology approvals, but really it's deciding when it comes down to it, and it's a hazard analysis that goes along with a particular site. So not so much from an emergency planning zone, but in terms of hazard analysis, in terms of we're going to bunk near other industries that offer different hazards, that type of analysis from a PRA, probabilistic risk analysis as well as safety considerations will probably be the new part of the work that we'll mix in. So we're looking forward to putting that together in a safety case, but if you bring it closer, you know, they're not going to be out in the middle of nowhere. They're going to be closer to industrial centers and city centers, and those hazards will be accounted for. I think Commissioner, that's probably the new part that we'll be talking about. Kevin, I want to come back to you real quick. Based on your experiences, how can the nuclear industry better communicate and collaborate with non-traditional nuclear energy customers? Actually, the role of the Ammonia Energy Association, for instance, is also to bring different actors across the value chain together, of course. So for instance, we have the Ammonia Energy Conference, where also nuclear people are there from a nuclear energy perspective, and we are working on a white paper. But we think also an important thing here is to show the feasibility, to show with demonstrations, for instance, in Oppenheim in France, to show that it's actually running. So actually, nuclear people should probably not talk too much how safe it is, but demonstrate it works, because these are more important than talks in the end. Thank you so much. We're almost out of time here, so I want to take a second and thank each of you very much for your participation and what you brought to the table today. It's about telling your story. Arshad, you started off with a really great vision and painted the picture in each of you, followed and just added more color to it. It is important that you tell your stories and, again, communicate, communicate, communicate. We've got to do that. I look forward to meeting up with you, each of you again. Arshad, Kevin, Shannon, Mike, thank you again. And with that, we will bring this to a close.