 The addition of the sportsmax zone by continuing to discuss the fallout from the decision by the Jamaican government not to bid for matches in the 2024 T20 World Cup. This discussion has taken several spins, including the issue of an overall lack of international matches at the country's cricket mecca, Sabina Park. In recent times, the ground has been predominantly used for football matches at the school boy, Premier League and international levels. The last time international cricket was played there was August 2022, the West Indies took on New Zealand. In defending the decision not to bid for the T20 World Cup, Jamaica's Minister of Sport Olivia Grange said her government will invest 100 million Jamaican dollars or just over 646 thousand US dollars into the development of youth cricket. Joining us to weigh in on the discussion are Dean of the Faculty of Sport at the University of the West Indies, Mona Campus, Dr. Akshay Man Singh and Chris Daring, who was the CEO of the 2007 50 over World Cup held in the West Indies. Gentlemen, it's a pleasure to have you on the new look sportsmax zone. It's a pleasure to be here, you've come a long way. We have come a long way indeed. First let me start with you, 2007 you were the CEO of the 50 over World Cup, successfully held in the West Indies, 13, 16 years later, it is that long, we have another World Cup now for the third time actually and for the second time, Jamaica will not be hosting matches. How did that new stake you? How disappointed are you at that? I had two feelings, first very disappointed because of all the work that would have been put in 16 years ago, now is the time to take advantage of that work, whatever mistakes were made in the past, you now have the opportunity to exploit what is a totally new paradigm in the world of cricket. As you said it's 16 years and what has happened with cricket, I mean T20 has been a paradigm shift. I don't even like to talk about cricket in general, T20 as a phenomenon has been an inflection point in the global explosion, the geographic explosion, the commercial explosion in the world of cricket and so we are now looking at an opportunity that everybody else in the world seems to know something that we don't know. I don't know what it is but when you see all those billionaires investing heavily in T20, not just cricket, T20 specifically across the United States, you see the explosion in non-traditional countries like Japan and China and the Netherlands and so on, somebody knows something and it's just a pity that we clearly don't know here in Jamaica and it would have been good to get that experience. I use the example of Mukesh Ambani who is a billionaire who is investing heavily in cricket both in India and the United States. This is the 10th richest man in the world. We could have had the opportunity to invite him here to Jamaica along with Metta and Strenivasa and the other billionaires who are investing in the sport across the United States. Maybe that would have been the opportunity to apply them with some good Jamaica and Roman and Reggae and get them to talk and tell us what is happening, what are we missing, why they are investing millions. Hundreds of millions which makes the potential investment Jamaica was looking at seem paltry. Dr. Mansingh, well it's a bit of a trend which is upsetting because as you mentioned we had the 2007 World Cup, we did not have the T20 World Cup that took place two years later, we did not have the women's World Cup that took place in 2019 or 2018 and this is another World Cup we haven't had coupled with the fact that we don't have CPL, we don't have the big tours in cricket like India and England where you have to bid for, it suggests that there is a tendency to shy away from it but let's just look at this event in itself. It's the second largest sporting event in terms of viewership after World Cup football. So you've got World Cup football, ICC World Cups and then the Olympics. Now we're not going to ever get World Cup football and we're not going to host the Olympics even though we contributed significantly to it. So the only big event that we can actually hold on a world stage is this event and what comes with it is the fact that you get tourism, you get eyes, you get investors as mentioned by Chris, you get that sort of viewership you can sell your country to and Jamaica does need a lot of selling. So we're missing out on massive opportunities outside of cricket along with missing out on the opportunities of cricket. But I was saying though the other side of it is I'm almost relieved that we did not put in a last minute bid because we've had five years knowing we're hosting this event to plan to get to mobilize the kind of resources we need in terms of personnel. People who are experiencing the global and in these types of events. You know you have a Stephen Price from who was the head of commercial operations for the Cricket World Cup who set event records and so on. You have a Don Webby who CEO of Grace Kennedy who's also involved in cricket or fair with all cricket matters and so on served on the cricket West Indies who would have been able to perhaps maybe give us some insight into how we could exploit 30 million cricket fans in the United States with a per capita income of 100,000 U.S. I just think maybe he might have been able to point it a direction to make a return on this event. So I'm relieved we didn't do this last minute thing because this takes planning this to really truly exploit it and with nine months to go before an event clearly we have not thought about it until now and so therefore I'm glad we haven't wasted money. I'm quite happy that you went there because one of the things I wanted to get your expertise on 2007 when the West Indies hosted the 50 over World Cup and Jamaica was one of the territories that hosted. How soon did the planning begin for one the bid itself and by extension how it would be executed? Well remember as I said cricket and back then it was 50 over was a big event. Yes. It's the second largest sport in the world and this was the third largest global sporting event. We had never hosted anything on this magnitude and it's almost impossible to explain to you the magnitude of hosting these events except to say the liabilities of hosting these events are incredible. You do it well, you benefit, you do it badly. Their financial claims are going to be coming at you at rates and these are multimillion dollar claims. So the planning had to be precise. We'd never hosted anything of this magnitude. We never knew the term called ambush marketing before the cricket World Cup. We never understood those sort of commercial liabilities. So it was a preparatory process that started as far back as 1997 when we first pulled together with the governments met with the governments of the region Pat Rousseau of blessed memory pulled the Prime Minister together said this is what we're looking at doing. We had lots of lots of meetings with the Prime Ministers looking at the pros and cons. They decided to go ahead and bid to even host the cricket World Cup. We pulled together that presentation, took it to the ICC and won the rights in 1998. So we didn't host until 2007. To understand the kind of preparatory of that magnitude. But back then we didn't even have a single venue that met international standards. So we had to build all new venues. So it was a much longer planning process. But it just exemplifies the type of planning that has to go into place just to be able to deliver the event and meet the host venue obligations so you don't have financial. I want to make the point though Chris that the bids weren't offered to the Caribbean nations from my understanding until April of this year. Is that something from your perspective that is bad timing? No, look, it's not ideal from the perspective of you having as an individual country to be able to put in the details of your bid. We had five years knowing the T20 cricket World Cup was coming here. You do all the preparatory work knowing that you're going to bid by pulling together the kind of expertise that you need to put together this kind of business case. The research, the data that has to take place. You get the opportunity to look at what T20 World Cups are doing in other countries. Take that information. Take that information, put it into your database to then prepare yourself for when the bid comes. That's how it's done. You mentioned just now when you were speaking about 16 years on and an opportunity if the Jamaican government had taken this one to correct some of the mistakes that may have been made in 2007. Might it be that some of those mistakes could have influenced or flavored the government? Undoubtedly. And especially visible reminders that reverberate like the Trilon in multi-purpose stadium. I just wanted to add that there was some foresight that was missing then too. For example, instead of putting all your resources into Sabina Park, we built the Trilon in multi-mistake stadium. Multi? Sorry, what do you call it? Multi-purpose stadium. But the point is, can you imagine even in 2007, putting a stadium without lights? Only Barbados and Jamaica did so. Barbados learned the mistake they made and rectified it immediately. Could you imagine then putting up a monochrome scoreboard? Which was obsolete when it got here. So a lot of infrastructural changes that you talk about now for this World Cup are because of decisions or bad decisions that were made at that time. So I want to bring that forward. I want to also put on record that remind everybody that Trilon in multi-purpose stadium had nothing to do with the Cricket World Cup. That bid was rejected by Cricket World Cup. Jamaica on their own decided to still build a cricket stadium and then they hosted the opening ceremony there. But that had nothing to do with the Cricket World Cup. So that should have been an entire plan on its own. What you're going to do with the stadium, now and into the future, nothing to do with the Cricket World Cup. But what I'm getting at is that the minister is saying that it's going to cost about $400,000, let's put it in US terms. In fact, she was quoted as saying $1.62 million in infrastructure improvement, $1 million for the bid. But by saying that that's that much amount of money for four matches is not worth it. It's not right because the $1.62 million you're putting in is for infrastructural development to hold events like this and other international events in the future. You're going to have to invest it at some time if you want to have international cricket. So the bid price is actually just a million. The rest of the infrastructure development, which as I said, a lot of it is because of the bad decisions made in 2007 that we're having to rectify that right now. So if we hope to hold international cricket in the future, we still have to put in $1.67 million. Which brings us to a broader issue, doesn't it? Because I listened to you Chris and based on everything that you said in terms of the process and the amount of time that it takes to plan, it seems to me that the idea of hosting the 2024 T20 World Cup caught the government by surprise. I don't blame the government at all. They're partly responsible. Where was the opposition for the last five years? Sure, they're going to jump up now and say, hey, you missed out. Where was the media for the last five years expounding the fact that we're hosting this event and mobilizing people, telling us all the research and data? Where was the private sector who are looking at, hey, this could be an opportunity for us. They're 30 million cricket fans in the United States. Well, let me ask you this. I do not blame the government on its own. It's all of us, collectively as a nation. We need to take responsibility. We've missed this vote. Let's not miss the next one. Cricket is returning. There's so many indicators out there. I don't know what it means. I just know it means something big. All these billionaires are pumping massive amount of money into this T20 sport. Cricket is returning to the Olympics in 2028, first time since 1896. Something is happening. We need to find out what it is. And the Saudis are coming with a massive leap. Saudis, the Qataris are coming. I don't know what's happening. This is way above my pay grade. But we need to, we have an incredible history and still a brand in the world of cricket. We need to make use of it. Whose responsibility is it, though, to lead the process? Because in my opinion, I think we have fallen short because of a lack of quality leadership this time around. And if that leadership doesn't improve, then we're going to be in the same situation in five, six years down the road. So is it the government's responsibility to lead? Is it the Jamaica Cricket Association's responsibility to lead? I believe, like every other industry, the industry leader is who government governments have many things on their plate, many imperatives on any given day. Thankfully, quite frankly, we actually have a minister of sports and culture who is actually one of the few ministers probably in the history of our country whose portfolio is our subject matter expertise. So we should be thankful for that. But the reality is that you have to look out for your industry, your business, and cricket in Jamaica is under the auspices of the Jamaica Cricket Association. So you have to be out there pounding the pavement, just like the various private sector interests are out there with government lobbying for what they need and so on, demonstrating to government with empirical data why they need to be doing what they are asking them to do, what are the benefits for both the sport and the country, and so on. You have to pound the pavement. Does it create a problem in the politically volatile Jamaican situation that the head of a Jamaica Cricket Association may be a supporter of the opposing party? Could that cause problems from the standpoint of discussing a partnership and so on? One beautiful thing about sport, it tends to bring us all together. You'll see GLP and PNP right beside each other in the stands cheering on the reggae boys and so on. When they leave the stadium, they're fighting start again. But sport is that, I think, that unifying, you know. I strongly believe there's no P in Jamaica. No P. When you're dealing with Jamaica, you've got to get beyond P. There's no P in Jamaica, no party. The issue is this. There's a foresight that you have to have. Having an event like this is not just about hosting cricket. It's much like having Olympics. If you have, you know, London Olympics was a transformation for the city of London. It's married with infrastructural development and so on. I was telling Chris off here that every time I go through the airport, I still hold him responsible because normally the airport was upgraded for cricket World Cup. They only got the departure section done and the arrival section was supposed to happen by then. Never did and 16 years on still hasn't, right? So there's massive infrastructural development that took place throughout the Caribbean. As we're speaking behind us, you can see all these stadiums going on the screen, which are brand new. So it's a way of focusing on... Hotels. Hotels were built. Your roadways were fixed. So five years ago when you heard there's a World Cup coming, it's not just about holding crickets. It's about mobilizing the infrastructural plan for developing your country. You're utilizing the event. And that foresight was missing. You're utilizing the event to mobilize your country towards this timeline. That's the beautiful thing about hosting these events. That is governments I wrote to mobilize them. But in terms of brand building, I mean, I hear St. Kitts is up in arms now and I was telling Akshay about a story. When we were hosting our World Cup, I took a delegation. And this is something we took for granted in Jamaica and we take for granted. Everybody knows about Jamaica and our brand and who we are and so on. I took a delegation of the local organizing committees over to South Africa. And when we were entering customs, there are two countries that their customs and immigration had never heard of to the point that it was not even in their system. And it took us hours to get clearance. They had to get clearance all the way up to the national security because nobody had ever heard of those countries, Caribbean countries. And it was not even in their system. Understand that they ended up hosting Cricket World Cup. And so the benefits to those two countries, one of whom the representative was a former test cricketer. So you can imagine the teasing we gave him. But you know, it's something that hosting these events, that's what it does. Hold it right there, Chris. We have to go to a quick break here on the sports mic zone but we'll return with this discussion. And we're talking cricket here and the vexing issue of the Jamaica government and the Cricket Association under some pressure for not bidding for hosting matches at the 2024 T20 World Cup. And one of just a few countries in the region that did not actually bid later in the show. We'll get a St. Kitts and Nevis perspective as well. But at the moment, we have Chris Thering, who was CEO of the Cricket World Cup, 2007 red, held right here in the Caribbean. And Dr. Akshay Man Singh, who is Dean of the Faculty of Sport at UWI Mona. And gentlemen, we discussed in the first segment what's on the table here as far as the non-bid is concerned, where it's left us. And Chris made the point earlier on that given the late staging of the whole issue being put on the table, he's actually happy that the Jamaican government turned it down because it would have been a missed opportunity to maximize on something that would have been good if it was properly planned for. Exactly. You know, one of the things that irks me sometimes when I talk about things like viewership of cricket. And I'll say, hey, you know, it's a two billion viewership in the US, it's 30 million cricket fans. People out here will go, you dismiss it and say, oh, where's mainly Indians? If it was mainly Americans, what do I care if they have spending power, if they are a large economy? And there's the fifth biggest economy in the world. You know, the third, if you look at the 30 million cricket fans in the United States, let's say it's an average per capita of 60,000, my elementary maths tell me that's 1.6 billion in spending power. What do I care whether it's mainly Indians or Australians and English and West Asia? I don't care. And the digital world and the globalization makes now it much more easy to access and exploit those economies. I don't know how to do it, but we must have those people here in Jamaica who can tell us how. Dr. Mansingh, a point was made a few days ago when we countered the argument of supporting a bid and not supporting a bid, that there are some fans who feel that Jamaica would have just gotten a few matches, probably not having a group that involved the West Indies and as far as they're concerned, we've not missed much by not hosting this. Well, I mean, that's to some extent echoing what Chris said, that if you haven't started working 105 years ago, then maybe it's not worth it. But when you bid, you're not guaranteed to get what you're bidding for. But then it also depends on how the bid goes, what it's about. Just think about it. The hotel rooms we have, the infrastructure we have, even for the last World Cup, West Indies were in Jamaica. That's where they started. The home team was in Jamaica. I don't know what the process of allocating the matches are, but the point is, whatever you have, you've got to make it big. Now, to make it big, you put a party around crickets, so to speak. I mean, the CPL recently, not only did people flood in to watch cricket, but they had Sean Paul. Last year, they had Beres Hammond, now with Marshall Montana, and so on, entertaining people. So you make it an event that people want to go to, whether they're interested in cricket or not. Now, if I happen to get an India, or if you can maximize on West England, all the better. But the event, the value of the event, how you market it should be attractive enough that people say, hey, I want to go to Jamaica. I've always wanted to go to Jamaica. Here's a chance to watch some cricket and so on. Now, the cricket fans, especially in North America, from every country of the world. So no matter who you get, if you target them, you can still make something out of it. But is it that the USA having venues to stage the World Cup would take away some of the prospects of fans traveling from the US to Jamaica? Fair enough. I mean, once again, it depends on what matches they get, what matches we get. But there's the added enchantment of Jamaica that you want to market as well, or any other country for that matter. Our connectivity is better than any other country in the region, but with North America especially. Our proximity is closer than anybody else. The flights are shorter and so on. And there may be somebody in one part of the USA. Than any other cricket playing nation? Yeah, otherwise, because the Bahamas are next to the world. Not all of the bidding nations. Those who are likely to hold the World Cup. Bahamas are part of cricket. But they play cricket. They play ICC qualifying to one of themselves. Yeah, that's Burmese though. Bahamas is also. Yeah, Bahamas, they have played. But that's the point. Just to add to what you're actually saying, though. I'm sorry, I've been involved in the hosting of a global sporting event. Nobody can tell me that Jamaica, that ICC and Cricket West Indies are not bitterly disappointed that Jamaica is not a part of hosting. And Johnny Cree have said this. Because the challenges of hosting and event of this magnitude, Jamaica has the room stock, the airlift, the expertise and personnel. You need resources. Well, Cricket West Indies said that they extended the bidding deadline three times in an effort to get Jamaica to... Not even to mention the proximity. Do not underestimate that proximity to the U.S. Because in logistics, you're trying to move teams in between venues. In all case, those venues happen to be countries. You want the countries to be as close as possible together. You have player issues to deal with, transportation issues to deal with, television equipment to move around the region. But two additional things, Chris. One is the road infrastructure compared to the last World Cup. It's such that you can have people on the North Coast coming in. All the North Coast that has no comment to play. In the perspective that what I would have liked to have seen in 2007, for example, is to have people stationed at Inochirios and the North Coast and told that, listen, we're going for Cricket to Kingston. Don't have breakfast, because on our way, Lin said it's going to get a bus, Jorten's going to get a bus, Bauga's going to get a bus, and they put on a breakfast for the guests. And on the way back, likewise, dinner is put on, and you get the whole country involved. You're a thinker, Dr. Mansi. Of course, all the little bars and restaurants along the way. What would benefit? So it's a matter of how you do that. Along the way, going on, and even worse, on the way back. But then, listen, my thing is, you get two Bollywood directors into Jamaica. Nowhere is suited to shoot a film in Jamaica. You need to get people to come here and see, because otherwise, like Chris said, people don't know the country. They've heard it. The other thing, you know, actually, 2007 World Cup, we were kind of robbed, because India and Pakistan got eliminated early. So the Caribbean has never seen what we have seen. I worked in the South Africa Cricket World Cup. When India qualified for the final, all the tickets had already been sold out, you know. Jumbo jets, private jets, arrived in, I've never seen anything like this. And these are all multimillionaires, very wealthy people that came in droves, parked outside Joburg, Wanderer Stadium, offering people insane amounts of money for their ticket. I was offered 20,000 US for my ICC pass. I did not sell it, because I could not sell it. But, you know, it was a kind of... I saw that 10 years ago, I went, whoa. Mind-boggling isn't the word. It's mine, yeah, so, but that is 16, that is no, actually that is 20 years ago, South Africa Cricket World Cup. We are cricketers going to know, and all proximity, I just, there's something we just don't know. I just want to make the point as well, because my understanding is that the bid proposal by Jamaica, of course, it never went in, is that they would have one group of matches plus a semifinal, and that there was a specific request to have the group that India would be involved with. So, I just want to put that out there. If you have one India match, one, I don't care against who. But why bid just for the semis? We could have hosted the final. We have that kind of infrastructure, and I know commercially it would, because the final was going to be in the Caribbean, right? Yes. As far as I'm understand. Yes, as far as we understand now, Barbados, Guyana, and Trinidad and Tobago. Also bid for the final. The front runners. But what I'm telling you is that I believe, my opinion, we would have had an excellent chance of the final, because if they're thinking India is going to get to the final, the proximity to the United States, the airlift between Osan and the United States, the number of hotel rooms that we have, all of that would have factored prominently in where the final goes. Know that we have missed this opportunity, gentlemen. Where do we go from here? Let's not miss the next board. We have to start planning. I'm very heartened by the funding that the minister has said that he's going to commit to youth cricket. It needs to be part of our plan. If cricket is part of the policy plan going forward and hosting cricket events, then get the people that you know have experience in it, have all the international collections to find out what's going on. I'm sorry we didn't get the opportunity to invite all those people to Jamaica for this event, to play them and get them to talk. But we need to plan. And we need to plan knowing that cricket is now going to be an Olympic sport. There are 20 teams next year in the T20 World Cup. Yes. Are you telling me that Jamaica wouldn't be good enough to get there at some point in the future? 20, 25 years from now? Are you telling me Jamaica won't be good enough to get to the Olympic Games? Certainly there's not going to be a West Indies at the Olympic Games. There can't be. There can't be. So we have something to look forward to plan towards to explore. I gathered from Dr. Mansingh's previous pronouncements though that he has an overall worry about the current administration's attitude towards cricket. So I had mentioned that it's not just a matter of money. Yes. But you know, the Taluas won last year in the CPL. Yes. The Scorpions won the Super 50. Yes. The Under 19 won the 50 over and the 3D competition. But we didn't hear any congratulatory message or any posting or something about it. So to me it was the attitude. Now on the flip side, we're hearing that there's a hundred million dollars or whatever to go towards youth development. The point is this, that cricket arguably has made more money for an athlete in Jamaica than any other sport. So yes, our top athletes have made a lot of money, but how many of them? Over the years, cricket has sustained many livelihoods. And we have that talent pool, which if we don't invest in, we're gonna lose that livelihood. Number two, half of the West Indies population is in Jamaica. Therefore, it's wrong for the cricket West Indies as well as the Jamaican government to ignore Jamaica because it's half of the population base. But going forward, the development of cricket is towards both things, to promote Jamaica as a cricketing country, but also to provide employment opportunities in the world scene. For our talented Jamaican cricketers, and both of those seem to be diminishing at rapid, rapid rates. And that was my concern. Yeah, that's very worrying because a call was made about, even seeing the current West Indies stars playing in Jamaica, players like Fabian Allen and Robyn Powell, there is a period of this generation of youngsters now that would not have seen these players live. Well, I've said a whole generation of young, well, a whole generation of Jamaicans have not seen 50 over cricket live in Jamaica, the super 50 cricket. I can't remember when last it was held in Jamaica, but it was certainly more than a decade and a half ago or so, right? So I mean that competition, which is a cricket West Indies competition has not come to Jamaica for over a decade. So that's the point that you're not seeing your stars. You're not being able to create that cricket culture. So going back to the statement, one of the things that had sort of made my curiosity arouse was when it was said that stakeholders were consulted and collectively decided that we should not bid for this World Cup. I would really be interested in who these stakeholders are. What was the discussion? When was the discussion? And what were the conclusions? What was presented to the stakeholders? Well, that's the point. You know, because that didn't come when we rejected the bids initially. That's just come out recently. That stakeholders were consulted. Yes, so I want some details. So Ricardo, the information that you've gleaned about the nature of the bid and what it entailed, who would have produced that bid? Well, so initially, the proposal would have come from the Jamaica Cricket Association to the government of Jamaica. So that would be the process. Of course, my concern, and you asked that question at the top of the show in terms of timing, because I wondered if April, for example, when the bid went to the government, would have been enough time to put in place anything substantial to say that we can really benefit from this. But I think Chris has addressed that point in that. That's dotting on the I's and crossing the T's. We've known for five years. We shouldn't have gotten there. Yes, we can do all the planning or run all the numbers. Then when you get the detail, you drop in those two. We should have been ready. In April, we should have been ready for when the official documentation came from Cricket West Indies or came from the JCA. You know, we would have had a policy about whether or not we want to host any major events. You know, what are the parameters of that policy? What do these events have to achieve, meet? You set the objectives. You said something earlier, Chris, recognizing the fact that governments have a lot on their plate. And obviously, government has to consider sport as just one facet of so many things that they have to... And cricket within sport. Okay, yes, that they have to govern for an entire country. So it just leads me to put the question to you, gentlemen, that is there too much pressure on the government, given the fact that they have so much that their response to the fore, that it's hard to be too critical of them if they did not pursue this project as a priority event or as vigorously as we think they could have. Governments have a job to govern. Yes, and they've got to look short-term, mid-term and long-term. So five years ago, it would have been a long-term project. But then, and that's why I'd be interested to know what, for example, happened in cabinet when it was discussed in cabinet. Because you have a tourism budget, you have a tourism marketing budget, but here you're going to get two billion eyes watching Jamaica. How much is tourism going to pay towards that? Because you don't have to put in those many ads necessarily because you're getting free advertising for your country by hosting it. In other words, it has to be a concerted and coordinated government move. So yes, JC has to provide the cricket specifics and so on. But as a country, now to hold an event like this, a mega event, not many countries get that opportunity. So the government, that's why I would like to know what the discussions were at a cabinet level, because of collective decision. So put up your hand and say, yeah, we discussed it and we decided we're not going to host it. That's fine. But let's know the details of what turned you away from it. I think Jamaica has a bit of a disadvantage, actually, and I were talking about it earlier, the fact that we are big and we do have other more pressing matters. And so our leaders tend to be a bit far removed from the execution at the lower levels and so on. You have a St. Lucia, for instance, that the Ernest Hillier, a brilliant gentleman, the kind of intellectual hospital that those countries have that have been involved in cricket, because Ernest was the head of their local organizing committee in cricket workup. And he's now deputy prime minister, virtually the prime minister. You have Mayor Motley. You don't get more intellectual intelligence than that, who was the head of my security operation for cricket workup in 2007, who's now the prime minister. So you had these people who, I think, were sitting right at the top of the pole. Also understanding exactly what the event could bring and how they could try and exploit it. We probably are missing that in our scenario. I don't, as I said, it's difficult for me to simply throw the stones at the government, because when I think about where the media has been, where it's cricket sources, we don't get defensive. No, man, I'm not getting defensive. Leadership is missing somewhere. We don't need to identify where that leadership is missing. I totally agree. And I accept that point. But I always think that, hey, the leadership of your particular industry or your particular business has to lead your interests and get in front of the government. You cannot tell me that if a proper business case showing the financial, economic returns and plans and how we're going to get there and get them and account for them, the social returns of hosting, the economic returns nationally of hosting, the political returns of hosting, all of which would be done in a normal business case to host these events. If a proper one was put together and put before Prime Minister Holness, Nigel Clark, and Babsie Grinch, that they would have said no. Because it, you know. Except that I just believe that a major role in that is that of the government, to drive that as well. Absolutely. So it is maybe a chicken and egg. But I just believe that, hey, my bottom line, we're missing something big. I don't know what it is. I don't know what, but somebody knows something. And we need to get one of those billionaires here to tell us why they're investing so much money in T20 cricket. Well, gentlemen, we've got to leave it there. Certainly, an engaging discussion that we've just had Dr. Akchai Man Singh and Chris staring. And we will continue this discussion. And we have a lot more to come on the Sportsmax on after this. Thanks, then.