 Lauren Selby here and Kate Snell here, and then staff we have Carol DeLugas, Valia Donald here, and Serar. Here. At first let's go to item number two approval minutes from our December 12, 2023 meeting. I have a motion. Motion. Second. All right. I have a motion and a second. Any discussion on this? All right. Let's vote. All ayes. Aye. Aye. All in the against, made. Sentions. All right. Motion passes. Number three public committee heard. Number four, relational updates. I'm not sure they'll have any organizational updates. Not from the staff side. Okay, okay. All right. Number five, development project updates. So, I will go ahead and take this one. So, village on May. I'm just going to call it the village so I don't have to go in between them. We issue MTP on Friday. The first move out start on Monday and construction starts on Tuesday. So we're doing all the last minute, making sure we've got some middles from the construction firm going through architecture and making sure everybody's ready to rock. We're going to do move outs like two a day and then the construction guys are going to come in and start demoing in and right behind them. So it's going to be rolling for this first phase and on the way, but that's how we'll get started. So, they are getting everything ready to go to start staging across the street at that empty lot that is across from the pump house and then we're just making sure that they've got their things like our flooring, like the flooring that we selected. Suddenly the lead time is too long to match up with our schedule. So rather than change the schedule, we're changing the flooring color. So nothing major, it's all a medium brown that we're picking for flooring. So just all of those last minute type of things just to make sure there's no schedule to pass. So getting everything ready to go for that. We're also working with the city comms team to get messaging out because there's multiple projects happening downtown over this next year and just coordinating messaging around parking and where construction will be and will there be any sidewalk closures or street closures, anything like that. So we're trying to get some messaging out there and so you might see some stuff in the paper because the Times call is already asking like, what's this and that. So there might be some traffic on that. Everything else on the finance side for the project is all set and ready to go. We're just getting our bank accounts all set up. We're going to do our first draw here for the invoices that we've been paying since housing and everything there is all lined up. The residents seem excited. No last minute, you know, anxious feelings that we've been hearing about. It mostly is excitement. So I think we've been working with them for almost two years to prepare. So we have some, as soon as I get the final flooring sample settled, I've got some mock-ups of what the finishes are that will take over to the buildings that I see and just plunder around with them. So trying to do everything we can on that front. The relocation team has been amazing. It is so different than asking my nose just because we have true capacity and professional experts that do this every day. And so that is going incredibly smooth. Everyone in the first round has had their one-on-one meetings with the relocation team and that's been happening for a while. And they're starting the one-on-one meetings for the phase two moveouts here this week. Just keeping everything moving right along. I think that's all the updates on the little domain unless there's questions about that one. Start seeing some progress. For our ascent and over-crossing project, okay, so what have we written these weeks since December meeting? So there was, recall, a $3 million gap on the early childhood education center. And so we have filled that partially with the city has brought in about $525,000 of ARPA funds. We were successful at getting $150,000 of worthy cause funds. I may have reported that not last month, but just in case I didn't. We requested about $750,000, so still grateful. But we have more work to do. We applied the Dola Strong Communities Infrastructure Grant and had, we were one of their first interviews and they were very much oversubscribed. We had one of the first interviews and the energy felt very positive and so we were very hopeful that we did not get a big award as strong communities infrastructure. So we have just Friday, we finally got our invitation to apply to the Colorado Health Foundation requested $2 million. And they're still working with the Longwood Community Foundation. They want to participate. We just have to figure out the mechanism of how it would work on their side. Otherwise, we've contacted Boulder County Sustainability to see if they could work with their budget allocations of sustainability tax to help fund some of the all electric nature and the heat pumps and things like that would still help the overall gap. So we're still working on filling the funding. And we still have some time, but we're trying to get even more for you. Otherwise, design is in full force because they have a pretty aggressive schedule to get building permit by July. And so working through design elements and making sure that we work with the city planning side and public works to make sure that we're getting quality of the middle and turn on quite the idea. So what's the shortfall right now? We said about, we've got about 700, so 2.3. So we're still trying to fill. If you don't get all of that by the time you open it, child care services will be open and on. We need the funding to be able to include it in the construction. I think that we have not yet started talking about the true backup plan because we've got a lot of opportunities out there still. The Colorado Health Foundation, we are quite hopeful about and that's the biggest size one. But I think what we would start to talk about next is what about a shell? Because it's still most advantageous to get the shell in. How could we work with the funding that we do have to do as much as we can? But we have not yet started out in full force. Any questions about the sin? And we have our donated, I'm sorry, got the donate. The vacant land at the Royal Move-A-Home Park that we're still just holding. But we also tonight, Council is going to be considering a land donation at 19th and Terry Street as part of an IH satisfaction, an inclusionary housing requirement satisfaction, will sit just like Royal if it goes through and is approved and the agreements are all done in 2024. It would sit like Royal where it's in city ownership for the moment, but that could be a long-term land banking plan that involves LHA. We're going to talk about recovery cafe in a moment. So I'm not related to LHA, but property that started out as LHA tonight on the Council agenda. You will see a housing project that we're taking. So if you remember we purchased nine acres of property associated with Costco redevelopment. We're looking at affordable housing. Since then we've purchased an additional 7.2 acres of property to give you a sense of the deal that we got on the Costco property. We paid $3.45 a square foot on the seven acres. We paid $10 a square foot. So the nine acres was definitely affordable. The seven acres was conditioned upon attainable housing being built from the land over. The property appraised at like 1875 a square foot. So that sort of puts into perspective the deal really good. And it really was driven by the property owner wanting affordable on one side and attainable on the other who wanted to do that deal. We told you all we changed from looking at the rental side to the ownership side. And I'm telling you this because I think it's good for the sport to be aware of everything we're doing with housing. And also if we need support we may reach out to you all to say we need help. It's getting dicey with neighborhood and things. So what we put together is a project to build 188 four-cell owner occupied units. Let's say plus or minus three because we're still going through the final months and designs to change things. Right around 40% of those houses will be permanently de-restricted affordable housing units. So that's going to be about 55. The units that will be under 80% AMI. So the price point just to give you a sense is on those homes you give me a second. And while you do that I'll give the numbers on the land. So the city used all leverage funding, no local dollars for 16 total acres at 4.6 million but the value of the land is 13.1. So we've got a scramble deal. Did you guys sign off at IGA to have to be able to manage? We have our own, we're the only ones, but this was designed from the beginning. We don't participate so this is the IGA for compliance specifically on homeownership at the moment for smaller communities that are building IH programs that don't necessarily have the capacity to do all long-term compliance with it. We do that in-house. So we helped, we supported it. We helped craft it, but then they've taken it from there. So to give you an example on the 15th, we've got the 15-foot affordable town. So A, let me back up. What's different about this, this was a, what do you call it? Dr. Ford, un-solicited proposal that they brought to us. What intrigues us about this is all of the units are actually over a thousand square feet. So when we've seen this product built like in Berthold, you'll see 750 square feet. So I think everything's over a thousand and that's something that was important to us. The sell price on it is the 15-foot affordable townhome is $284,000. The affordable townhome is $300,000. And then when we get into the attainable side, well, let me back up. $295,000 and $319,000 before realtor. We're still trying to figure that out. The attainable side will run from $412,000 to $480,000. So this project's taken a lot of bandwidth. As we were working on the other projects, part of the challenge on it was we figured out at the end that if we wanted to just do attainable, attainable's pretty easy. As long as you can get land and fee waivers, attainable starts constantly out. When you draw the affordable into it, it changes the volume completely and when you have 40% of affordable in that development, it really stretched us and highly figured it out. So generally we're putting in land, we're putting in fee waivers, and then we're recommending to the council to put in $6 million of affordable and attainable housing runs over five years, which is about half a million or over half a million each year. But we know there's other options. And so we've been talking to the state about Prop 123 funds. I'm talking to the county about their new affordable, attainable tax they've created. And so we're kind of fighting into that a little bit early. So that's going to die. And it could pass as well as second reading in two weeks. But we're hoping that if it does pass tonight, lunch will start construction later this year. That actually I think balances in with what reason why I wanted to bring it up. It balances with the work that we're doing on the rental side and the senate because what I think we're starting to do by building this is that we're now expanding that pipeline. So let's take a step where we have families and we can get families and start working with them. And then we get them ready to buy because that's probably the biggest challenge. There is a lot of anxiousness with being in the other writing on this one because of the pool of buyers and things that you can just you can have somebody qualify and something happens in their entire life. So I bring this up because I think when we look especially at the senate and potentially even at Aspen Meadows we may want to start working with the people that are in those units and having conversations about getting involved by the buyer so we can start sliding into the ownership of building well. Do our residents participate a lot in the pipeline? Is that the... The one that you save and then it gets matched and then you can use it for education or just in the home. I don't think I know very much about it. But we do have... We send everybody that participates on the city side programs for rehab or other portable housing pipe items go through Boulder County's personal finance counseling which is we also call it housing counseling just preparing people for home ownership so we would do that certainly for these but this is a very high risk project from a developer perspective so we've built in a lot of ways for us to work through it if we need to and that really ties to the attainable fee waiver program which is brand new as of November is the first project that's going to be using it and that is also part of the approval for counseling tonight which is 100% fee waiver on all these units to make it happen. Yeah so we're pretty excited about it. I don't think there's been a project like this built in the state. You all heard of anything like this, let me know. And the attainable is not restricted at all? No it is. Is the attainable... So we have tenured deed restrictions and we've painted this with, I mean this is really creating stuff because it doesn't exist as we have a tenured rolling deed restriction so if you're in it for ten years you can sell it and you can sell it at what would be market value for that property. That's the wealth building component. Once it changes hands within ten years it resets? It resets. I like that because I never understood why you would let someone gain a windfall. Right? Because the idea of building a town home for ten years is pretty usual. Right. Whereas like me and one veteran condo starting a family we were never going to stay there long term. The point really for a permanently de-restricted affordable for sale unit is really it's for housing security and so that you're not subject to rent increases and it's more of a protection. When you get into this level it's more like you need some people that can do starter homes and prepare them to enter the market and keep that rolling. So it's balancing letting people generate the wealth with also making sure the city investment helps as many people as possible. Yeah, now if you sell it and you sell it to someone who qualifies then you're right it just resets to ten years. So we think we've diversified in a fact that 40% of the affordable permanently de-restricted unless you have a ten year de-restriction let's say you have someone that's un-affordable or their job situation changes and they can move into the attainable then as long as they're in that category you can take whatever equity is built up in those AMI points as they're moving over time. So no matter what happens people can't take equity out. Because of the underwriting and the reduction in the buyer pool we did in this case have to negotiate a buy out provision at year seven and so because the underwriters were really concerned that it would yield at the pool because it's already limited anyway and so at year seven, eight, and nine you can buy out of it but you have to pay back a percentage of the equity game that you sell it to field the market and that was specifically satisfied with the limited performance and that's like what we model this at 60 50 40,000, some version it's not bad but it's enough to reprimand people and how they want to sell it. And that's the negotiation of this deal that's not built into our attainable program I mean we built in a flexibility option for future projects that if they need something like this they can remember writing it into their shield. And the whole reason we agreed to it was because we're putting 40% for it long and so that's a big piece that we were trying to figure out there are preferences so you can't put right at first refusal under their housing laws there are preferences and so part of the negotiation is because if the city is putting in an X amount of money we get a preference on the housing on that percentage of the total value for people who work for the city because those are city bills and payments for all of the units it's a preference for people who work in the long line and so what we were hearing from our business community is that there's not any options for their staff to purchase homes here and so the whole intent of the attainable housing program is to build housing so that people can work in the long line. So again that's a preference and what it looks like for us is we're probably going to go through a lottery process because we think there's going to be so much interest in this that instead of just first in, first out we're probably going to look at a lottery process initially but have people ready to slide in if things are falling out we've also thought about looking at land trust but the problem is the interest rates kind of just blew that through the water, blew that out of the water so on the affordable side and so yeah, that's what's going tonight we hired the city side hired a home ownership position she started yesterday her name is Katie so we all have two Katie's one Katie that changed her name for the office so three Katie's but down the two so she started yesterday, we're really excited she's going to help us with this pool of fires and working through our lottery system specifically on this one again, very good at the whole development process then and then we have a few operational or organizational issues so two positions open right now that's right the assistant director position and then we also so well so we posted a position for what's it called, it's a title on that one I was an investment manager I was an investment manager because we're pretty sure at the end of the day one of our staffers and then I got approached to go to Brealy and what we're finding is the places that don't have affordable housing programs are what's interesting is they're starting to mimic what we're doing and so organizational updates that's like the front and center for me is that oddly enough I think now people aren't looking at Boulder in Boulder County they're really starting to look at what we're doing and how we're doing it which scares me and so I'm talking to the council tonight about organizational updates and so yeah, we're people are getting opposed from our organization on a weekly basis and so we're in a dog fight so those positions are open, my goal is to hire them as soon as possible but we open up it's open into a bill because I've got a provider lead from Holly and all of this and we need to start focusing on higher levels sort of future aspirational and then we just need some help so we also think that PROC 123 the attention on housing generally funding sources coming out for housing even though they're not all here yet there are communities that are here and so they're trying to be very competitive we have people that can come in and stuff for them that they might not have had before so that's our take on why I really was able to do this but so changes coming but it's going to be good we've got an overall team in it I just have a comment which may be inaccurate if I recall correctly it seems to me that the governor indicated that one of his priorities is that we have affordable housing within a 200 to 300,000 range if that's the case then I think we're at the leading edge on that this Mustang alone which is probably not going to be called Mustang, I've just been called back in general terms for a while it's called Mustang because that was the project name that we gave to Costill because it can't be public it's just kept Mustang but 60 of the units would qualify under our proper 2-3 counts so the city's goal to the end of 2026 is 304 units so this would be 20% of that that's not a perfect calculation because this is going to be phased in and probably not all of them will hit this this three year cycle but it would hit the next one but it's still significant probably for a long time in this one project probably more affordable for sale affordable housing units in one project we probably have in 15 years through our traditional program so and just so you all know the modeling on this is there's a lot of folks that I've been talking to that are waiting to see this because I think there's an opportunity to show how it works there may be people who own significant parcels of land 10 acres, 10 to 15 acres that are sitting back there going if it works and the deal structure works and we can use it to benefit our employees they may be willing to put their land in sort of the contribution so this is really set in the stage and I think is seeing bigger parcels from the LHA side I was thinking about this this weekend is maybe how do we have more of a mixed development in terms of having some remling and some poor sale units and working together so that's why I brought this to you all because we're going to learn a lot through this but we're going to learn fast and know that we need to get the next project ready plus we know light tech going forward until light tech is funded more than it is which there's no education that it might be you've got to be really creative to get an award from this point on the standard standard project without something creative attached is not looking pretty attractive compared to how many are out there trying to get really creative all those affordable housing units that are feed restricted can you elaborate a little bit on more you said it resets after 10 years affordable is coming attainable has a reason so if somebody buys these affordable units and they sell it they can keep some of the equity and some of it goes back to the city on the affordable ones the city already has a calculation it's based on percentage growth and it's based on incomes, HUD incomes at the time it's a calculation that we've been using for years and years we might be looking at that I would like to look at that as a project probably this year hopefully since we're planning for this but generally on the attainable side if you purchase a unit that's affordable to 100% AMI then and it goes between 80.1 to 120% AMI if you stay for 10 years you can sell it at market rate and keep all your proceeds if you sell it at year 5 then you use the city's maximum sales price limits that we update every year based on market conditions and a ton of data and you can sell that at that same 100% AMI price level and the new person that buys that income qualifies triggers a new 10 year restriction you get to keep everything that you've gained to that maximum and then we built it where it doesn't make sense to have in this category of units it doesn't make sense to have it permanently there so it's either 30 years or free sales whichever comes first because at 30 years you're starting to need to maybe rebuy and do like updates or recent from a buyer pool perspective and this might help from an employee retention and things like that too but is the city having kind of a matching down payment program? We do have a down payment program it is home funded so federal and it has been extremely challenging to use in the last 5 years of our market we have not had a single person be able to use it in the last 2 years and so we're with this new we want that person to look at our existing program see if there's any ways we can make it more flexible to actually be used or my goal is as we've got these funding sources coming in starting a nest egg of hopefully creating our own DPA program that's more locally funded that matches our market more that's a long term goal and it would take some time to ramp it up but those are ideas that we want this person to start formulating so yes officially there is one we also do have a local lender that does the start to home program and that is for long line residents and it helps with down payment and favorable rates as favorable as they can muster at this point in time but also working with realtor relationships to get more of a a different fee setup trying to make it easier so there's we're hoping to partner with them if you want to there's also a program that came out of development partnership and it's home to start to home so that's a piece where some of the banks are using their fees so we're going to be using all of these so why is the program so burdensome we just can't use it is it because of rising house prices or is it because of interest or what's what are the challenges about rising house prices there's like a maximum house price that there is very few in that price range available in our market and then the person has to qualify and so people come in we get applicants all the time and they can qualify for 300,000 there's nothing there there's just nothing so we got to dig in and see can we use it or should we really scrap that program repurpose it and do something else so because I don't expect things to just suddenly get better where we could use it more if there were if there's a pool of funds available somehow for whatever there's an organization IDF that helps municipalities manage down payment assistance programs for their employees and that might jump-started 40 minutes a day thank you that would be great yeah and the PI program is really cool because it's for low-income folks to start saving they get a sign plate they open up a checking our savings account and then they make realistic contributions to their savings account and then at the end of I don't remember how long in the years it is the county was matching their funds 100% and they bought more than $5,000 that they could even use for education services or to put a down payment on a home so I'll look into that one of the things we built in the contract knowing all of this is a risk I mean because there's risk all over we is that the builder does have the ability if we're not able to sell the home within 90 days of the CEO within 90 days 60 days of CEO we can create a lease purchase option because I've done that in other community which does help the same individual because you figure out how you lease and how you build that equity and so that's that's in a mix too in case that happens this was just so you all know I've given you more information so if you hear people chattering correct it this was completely an open book deal what I mean by open book is when you understand where the lending is going to come from where the interest rates are where all the soft costs are even the developers equity for the developer fee is so they agreed to a fixed developer fee of $8 million which is pretty important because on the lending side the lenders are requiring a certain amount of money because if we get another inflation cycle in to eat out of that so that's a fixed development fee and when you look at the $8 million on the total project cost that's the reasonable percentage of the calculated in two ways if you include the city's investment it's like 15% if you don't include the city's investment it's like a 15% return if you include the city's investment it's like a 10% return and so for us and that type of project with the risk we've got was reasonable based on what we've seen in other places and then the developer agreed in the contract to if there's any savings on it 75% of the savings is returned to the city and we may get 25% so I say all of this because it was as transparent a deal as I've ever been involved in and that was the point of all of our ordinances if you're willing to share and teach us and let us see everything works in E2 it gives us the ability to do more and vertical construction which is the blocker thrash and it's part of the it's an offshoot of the thrash group which ironically that he was introduced to us because the thrash group is the one building on the Delagroses street and then so that's his brother and his dad he's been doing this vertical construction and for the last five years he's been trying to figure out how to build workforce attainable housing and he met Jessica Eric someone she was with the LADP and he was saying what he wanted to do this is the answer was a proposal and Jessica's like you really need to meet this guy and he slid in and said yeah I want to do this and it would give you a sense of what he's invested in it so he's working with an ad agency and a film crew so they have been documenting this video and we've done interviews with them and he's working with a group out of DC PR PR and marketing so he's investing a lot of his own money because assuming that this will work this thing's going to probably go national it's a big experiment pilot project that if this works he wants to replicate he is working with Erie right now to do some it's all for sale he doesn't do rental we have eight units that we have to do for sale it will be a small he's got someone going in Erie he did a ton of the work that's in downtown Westminster so it is a it's kind of split Mississippi is where a thrush group is from but he's centered out of Louisville so it's a local firm yeah so you know it's it was actually the hotel that kind of jump started all of these conversations so gotta tell you this because in the back of my mind at some point I know we have health and human services advisory board because I'm thinking about housing and middle income housing in your advisory role I think there's a part of in my mind where I'm starting to really think about this there's a part where a lot of this I think is better here than it does in other areas and so I'm going to be trying to reference all that because you all understand building economics versus our health and human services advisory boards in my career in the same way so just know that's in the back of my mind so no organizational thing yeah I know I was like how's Nia doing Nia thank you it's great it's vertical we're going to talk a little bit about the operational settings in here in a minute but we are working with them everything's going smooth with construction they coordinate with the suites property side everything we're trying to figure out you know light poles and such right now to make sure it matches across the property well it's totally tough but we are also talking to element about because they do have the option to purchase the land that's behind the suites on the north side and parks is planning a trail connection back there and so we're trying to work with both company groups to just try to plan ahead I don't want to build a trail and then screw up what's been planned or vice versa so we're working with them on kind of still incredibly conceptual on what they might do back there assuming they have substantial option but we're trying to plan ahead a little bit on what might be possible like that I think we're trying to accomplish with that is that if we can use parks funds to build a trail because we do need that connection from village of repeats to sunset that and and they're willing to so what we talked about them is they're willing to do the landscaping along the trail and the trail and concrete that actually is a cost offset on the development the element would undertake the property because they won't have that requirement to be filled in the performance so we know financially it makes sense for element to work this out because it's just upsetting the cost of the project but we're really talking about in terms of what this looks like how we approach it do we do an attached sidewalk because we're working at the maximum of the land space between the trail and that area but there's a financial benefit for that property more affordable and we're just going to figure it out I'll update you later working towards midland okay thank you anything on at work commons so they did not receive a line text award we do they say that they are still working to sort out a way to try again and that is the latest that we've heard so it's not it's not converting to market that we know of at this point I think they're shooting to try again but they're going to have to look at their service model trying to come up with something that's truly creative to indicate it so what do you do here that's the thing with the line text that we saw if you look at everything that received the line text award it was not the traditional line text projects they all had some unique aspects to them that went beyond just building housing and so as more people are playing the competition is increasing and so you have to be creative and you have to do innovative things in order to rise to the top so what sort of creative thing which is like different services models service models to provide services to residents so what kind of I mean obviously we're considering doing a lot of that too other services so what they did put in had a letter from the R center who was right across the street saying that those are income qualified in there which was a segment to them could access R center programs now that's not actually a unique relationship R center would do that anyway but they just supported the project and said yes we'll make sure that this happens I think that that wasn't enough because it wasn't a true partnership yeah like on site something bringing it in so that residents are not having to go out to find it we're it's conjectured on what the what chaplain was looking for but I think it would have to be something I think that the reason are we speculating the reason that a cent was successful and that wasn't is we did three and four bedrooms which are very hard to fund and underwrite and it was family focused we had the ECE we've got children youth and families that were going to come in and do on site parenting classes and getting prevention services and just really trying to engage the families on site rather than having it available but people would have to go and find it so and then from the we look at the states environmental initiatives in terms of putting a partner in our gym you know we included partnering with LBC or in terms of all of your facility and solar all of that and you know we spent a lot of time talking to them about that because they're not used to cities with electric utilities and working through that so it's really understanding what are the state initiatives so solar ready early childcare these issues and incorporating as many of the state initiatives that you can into what you're building because that's I think what shifts the needle we've been in a run of three years obviously that I think is unprecedented for most communities because we've had Christmas get awarded and we had Element get awarded and now we've had Descent get awarded so we've had a project I think in the last three cycles which is highly unusual in the life that we're in I don't expect that to continue necessarily it should probably balance out at some point which might be part of that strong communities where they're trying to spread it out a little bit more maybe but if you build it right you position yourself in a way where they can't ignore you and that was the difference with that it was the standard affordable housing project it did have things for it which was it basically build ready very far through the entitlement process it was it's one of those that if they get far you did see on that line tech list the award list that some that were like the final phase of completion it didn't necessarily have a creative service model but it was just closing it out so eventually because it is so close to just being a go it should get awarded if they keep trying but we'll see and something else I've noticed in a third from our building with respect to the planning the services in Boulder County are not as good as they could be like we have had so many projects where we partnered with certain service providers in Boulder County that they just didn't deliver good quality services like they do the bare minimum and so it's really hard when you think about that permanently supported housing you have to get really creative and start bringing in like people from outside Boulder County really I mean I've been to like one of the things that we're trying to solve for Boulder County is IED housing for home development and disabilities and there's nothing right now in Denver their stuff but trying to get organizations to come into Boulder County or come from Fort Collins like large that's sort of what we're looking at so if you know of organizations that provide services outside of this area start talking to people get them interested in coming here because we're I don't know how you guys have in-house a lot of in-house stuff we're about to talk about where it locks it's like you've got MHP and the homeless shelters that's it so there's a little bit of a desert of services in terms of providers in the same way number six, yeah let's say four pensioners, A's memory, faculty, services so all of these items under this A, B and sub items all are going to be together recovery carpet so recall our idea was that we wanted to build an add-on at this week to have recovery cafe be able to do service non-site and the city committed a million dollars for that end outcome through ARPA funds and some of our CBBGCB funds so we undertook this feasibility model they've been working on it through all of 2023 they got conceptual architecture and site plan and it is a challenging site because it turns out practically every utility in the world feels like it's right under that building so there were some challenges but it was feasible to build the challenge came in we've also been working with the investors of this week which are some of our more challenging ones to work with but we got them on board with the ground lease idea because the land is owned by the investment partnership so they were okay with the ground lease but the problem is recovery cafe was going to have to get a mortgage to cover part of the built cost and so the investor is having a they will not subordinate their loans their primary mortgage they will not subordinate to anything and so recovery cafe was going to have a steep hill to climb to try and get approved for a mortgage for the remainder and so to the point where it's probably not feasible on the financing side and so what we've been talking to them about is whatever you do if you end up making your home base somewhere else can you please still build in a suites service model and we would still commit some city funding to help you with your eventual location so what you have in your packet is a draft generally we've reviewed this with them other than the cost section that you'll see on page expense breakdown anywhere where it's going into expenses I think it's on the third page that is we're modifying that with them but in terms of the service model that they have proposed here we're on board with so far and so we're working with them on what this would really look like but this is what they have proposed that would mean at least satellite services to the suites we've got space for them to office space for them to hold their group meetings but this is kind of what we are considering now and so this would come to the LHA board at the point that we finalize this we're still telling them that the expenses are we're talking about a trade off here the city is going to commit funding to help you get into a space in exchange we would like services not necessarily have to pay the services so that's still being ironed out very similar to what we did with center for people with disabilities as well it's 650 we'll sell it to you for five here's what you need to do they didn't seem to react I mean they got it and there wasn't a bad reaction and I even said I actually know her chair and vice chair really well and I'm like have them call me if there's an issue I haven't had a call from them so I'm pretty sure there's not an issue so in exchange for 900,000 on the CDBG side they're going to give us this and we'll figure out a time frame because we also know it's not real to do it in perpetuity but then lets us slide in to say okay here's how we can start contributing to operational funds to continue this we're also going to try to get the plans because on the other side when I was for the building because on the other side what we've done on the CDB side is we have made significant investments into mental health services so we told you we have a clinician we have a business funding we have a two clinician freeze we've also added some components to over the last few years we're now at the funding pool four core teams we only have two fully staff right now but we have significant space issues and so what I'm thinking about talking a little bit about it many of you have talked with Zach and Christina is that as we're continuing to build out this mental health component within our organization we're going to need a space to house them and it kind of makes sense that if we have plans on the other side we don't have room here in this area but it makes complete sense to build that out there and that's where we start housing some of our mental health services they're already moving into a center of excellence model to where they're working across the organization and so that's something that I'm starting to know around to see how it can be done on the city side because that is easier for us to sort of deal with the coordination issues and things like that so that's kind of in my mind and as you'll see from the next few discussions I think it's incredibly important that we start building other things in that area because we're having issues So, leading into that is there first any questions on the actual service model that Recovery Cup is proposing? My question was so it's essentially six hours on the drive time right? What we're looking at initially in terms of just hours that specialists would be doing programs and people is this still about it? It proposed the weekly recovery circles so that's a three hour situation by the way this is they want to scale this up and have more but they just want to start with making sure they can bring the people in to fill the room That makes sense and so it's really focused on those that are trying to maintain sobriety or get out of addiction So they are already open to anyone in Lauma at their current location or operating out of the church here at the street this would be focused on sweet residents or maybe we could bring in other LHA properties if somebody wants to join we could help figure that out but this is specifically for LEJ residents So basically what their model is they bring in they do recovery circles the people have to they have to commit to attend a certain number to make sure that they're really actually there and investing themselves in the process and really building a community to try and get people that are working on substance abuse challenges to be able to have resources and they can help people with resources navigation for other things as well connections with other nonprofits and other things So one thing that came up at a recent PSH workshop that I went to was the idea that when you have a service provider on site the residents aren't required to accept the services but the service provider is required to try to provide services at all costs in all ways, shapes and forms Has that idea kind of been baked into this We have had very candid conversations that that is what we were looking for like true engagement and outreach not a knock on the door they never answered and we never tried again Good and we know from the sweets community that they talk to each other a lot so if we could get a couple people participating that we would hope that that would help spread the interest too We told them that that is one of our biggest concerns is we understand it's not mandatory but what are you doing for outreach? They already have people that live at the streets that do utilize their services and their service And that's one of their challenges there to get that hour of a bus ride between connections Do we know how many tenants are suffering from addiction of you? That's not data that we specifically collect It might be a mixed bag of those that say that acknowledge that versus more in the active stage They're facing it in some way whether trying to Sorry, that's minimum and that's on the spectrum from marijuana to fentanyl This would be open to people who are sober who are just looking to maintain it And they're pretty successful That's the thing is this is a national program that came out of Seattle that's now made its way across the nation but in seeing the folks that work with and talking to them they can get them engaged and keep them The recovery campaign is actually probably one of the most successful that I've ever seen I agree I'm going to segue into service provision at PSH But if there's any other specific questions about this, we will present this to the court at some point once we iron out the details and get a finalized proposal But if there's any questions about recovery campaign before we go into fence services Alright So PSH I'm going to try and structure this into our umbrella issues and then dive down to what we're trying to do on each end of it Overall services for permanent supportive housing generally and then for all across the board but we're going to focus on permanent supportive housing The funding sources out there are dismal We hope that the county tax money that starts to be available in 2025 but they have to ramp up and bring in tax revenues first We really have a program to fund people but that would be an el- services would be an eligible cost under that We're hoping Prop 123 brings in more opportunities So far there's been one round that was not nearly enough to serve what people are looking for So there's potential sources on the horizon to help fund supportive services Right now there's nothing In order DOH the state will fund supportive services and vouchers to go with them but they also have case management ratios of a minimum of 15 to 1 Preferred 12 to 1 insane $7,000 and it's not enough money to even do it So there's a broken piece there Plus right now before we get our solutions in place we have a property manager on site and we have our mhp person if they are staffed up on site like a day or two we are at like an 80 to 1 ratio in real life which is not even close There's a ton of history with that with how DOH has funded the suites originally and what they do now but that is what it is So right now we have half of our vouchers at the suites are administered by mental health partners because they are the state approved administrator of DOH vouchers We know that those that voucher program is broken as well They barely fund administration and so we know that mhp is strapped for capacity and funding to even do what DOH is requiring of them to start However, our agreements with mhp and DOH for when the suites was put into place that it's supportive services I mean, there's an outreach component that's required We're supposed to be matching these DOH case management Now DOH, I'm sorry mhp is having a hard time keeping staff just like a lot of agencies but it is severely under capacity, underfunded it is just not working We know that for us we could either do a lot of things to try and solve this situation try and hit the system go into the state try and hit the funding cycle which is like two years out at least and then or try and just solve it ourselves and go around the established process So what we have done on the city side and lha is fund the three clinicians We're trying to basically whether or not you're having capacity struggles or funding struggles we need this and the city and lha have stepped up and we're going to do it that doesn't mean we're going to say you're off the hook mhp or state but we have to do something and it is the situation is we're in a dire need we have had we've had the holidays were tough for the weeks but this week residents there was an instance with a tenant that was being evicted where it just got very scary very fast and we need on-site people that are trained to do escalation crisis management we need that very badly so in terms of our work around we've got our clinicians funded with those fine job descriptions that are being finalized right now they should be posted here imminently we're also because of what happened over the holidays we've modified or I should say supplemented our security on-site we have free building attendants one of them did resign because of this it was just not a choice which I do not believe our building attendants are just for a presence on-site after hours weekends and nights but they're not trained security personnel they're not armed so we brought in a security firm on short notice just because we were worried about the presence of this individual and so that has brought a lot of things to light they're doing a really great job of keeping an eye out and trying to make sure that they're reporting to us anything that they see that is that is not good and so we're thinking long term what should that model look like for clinicians security if needed because we have some residents that are so happy and relieved that there's security on-site we have some residents that are not so happy because now they're getting in some trouble so how do we plan for but Zinnia coming Zinnia will be leasing up this fall we will have 55 more PSH individuals these are all MHP vouchers all 55 they do have a boulder shelter providing services so that will be something that's different from the sweets model and however MHP they have to work with DOH on their tenant selection so we have worked with MHP where they'll take every other person that they refer in comes from our local case conferencing so they have a local tag but they do have to pull from the statewide list as well and so working with them on Lisa is coming so now that's kind of a bigger picture I'm going to just give the plan for Lisa first the element who is building Zinnia right before Zinnia did the bluebird boulder which is 40 units of PSH virtually the same model as Zinnia they just completed construction and they just think they're just about done with Lisa and so they are going to come in boulder shelter and MHP we're starting to talk to them here this month about preparing for Zinnia and doing the lessons learned from the Lisa process on bluebird so we are lucky that we are coming in second and being able to they've already been through it less so those conversations are coming as we think to next fall with Zinnia being fully leased by probably by the end of this year we just want to make sure we've got systems of personnel in place to be able to make it a smooth transition and just make sure everybody has a safe and welcoming place to live and nobody is scared or causing pain in the face and there's a fight coming on this one just to let you all know so as a result of what happened with the addiction of the sweets we had to take protection orders out on staff we had to take protection orders out on residents we had protection orders out on buildings this building was on other Sarah was great and serving and doing stuff because we couldn't get other jurisdictions to serve we started having Sarah and I started having a conversation with Lisa and Molly and so it just kept blowing up to the point where the individual was in hospital got released earlier than we thought and so we had to pull the trigger and bring in security we just everything that we knew we couldn't take the risk of something really bad happening and so we brought in security and said well we're going to do it for two weeks thus far in the two weeks we have probably seen and learned more about things that are happening at the sweets that we've ever seen and it's kind of like one example was they caught somebody with a gas can coming into the building they stopped them and wouldn't let them bring it in I think we know what they're doing with the gas can but all of a sudden they let them keep it outside they ended up finding it under the Z-Bo the Z-Bo smells like gas so my gut is it will probably pour it into other containers and bring it in what do you do with gas you actually use gas to cut suited for one of the things you can use to make gas we've then subsequently heard that there was a strong metallic odor coming out of the unit that was associated with these individuals so then they posted it on a 24 hour notice and we went in and did our best test and go on the hold super high so as a result of what happened with this weekend what was the odor we had a suicide attempt we had regarding the unit that you're speaking about a lot of traffic in and out one of the authorized staying there is going to other units in the building so I'm working with security on identifying what those people are what's going on and we was to say like Carol just said we're seeing things that we haven't seen in a long time that's probably I mean no fault of Corinne or even Ruby they're not up 24-7 they might have been and that's when things happen and the security company is doing a good job of identifying problems and even last night the gentleman that's unauthorized at the unit we're speaking about he's been going around the building so they trespassed him and he has been back as a right man so the issue that comes up is that the tenant invites him in which at this point we haven't had that come up and security knows that you know I went over it within the day he's very good so we're working together so it's right I'm just going to ask if the security now is 24-7 in the two weeks what are the prices like it sounds like it's probably not sustainable it is a short-term price model right now but it might work with us we did a long-term more regular so they've said I asked for a quote we didn't have to go up for RFP anyway because of this but I asked for a quote it depends because he did send it to me and so there's different models you can only do this property and if there's any of which I can figure that out that helps us a little bit because you can make revenue and you can provide the broader piece there's also a component where if we hire them to actually do grounds through other properties that kind of reduces the overall cost as well which helps us because then there could be more options but my gut says it's probably going to be somewhere between $135 and $225,000 a year now that's the cost of two units having to be rebuilt and it's the cost of our three building attendance with benefits as well so my gut's telling me that since we have one vacant building attendant one is shifting into a custodian that I'm probably just going to have to make the organizational decision to eliminate the three building attendant positions capture that money figure out what we have embedded in that and then we'll do an RFP for security and then try to look just holistically at what gap is and I mean I understand zoning in two one two mesonics so all of that's in play in what we're looking at the offshoot of this is so I've been looking at the evictions and everything that we have going on and so about 40 weeks ago I went to Lee's and I said no hurry but can you give me a breakdown on evictions and lose tissue when this issue blew up with this guy I said I need that now and basically what I can tell you is that of the significant evictions now not significant evictions failure of A but of the significant evictions 70% of those evictions are MHP voucher holders 75% 75% of those evictions are MHP voucher holders now Sarah crossed through the crime-free multi-family housing program that we're now seeing that a similar situation community-wide with other properties so I asked Sarah will you go to this one of these other groups and have them do the same thing which they don't have just they're they were more willing to give us the data so they're gathering that and what I'm assuming is that it sounds like they don't have they don't have that many MHP vouchers or we'll get to that as regards so at the end of the day what I've now seen is that 70-50% is not an anomaly you know and so where I say probably the fight's coming is that we have an organization administering vouchers on behalf of the state of Colorado adhering to the contract so we have to hold the contracts and what they're supposed to be doing pretty clear they're not doing that and up until a week ago anytime we had an issue with one of their individuals they would not engage with us something until the eviction until the eviction and then it's scrambling something happened last week and I think it's this and there's probably a mistake coming down on them that all of a sudden they changed it but we're going to schedule a meeting and you know our question is unfortunately perhaps in Boulder County there's not another agency that administers the voucher from the state and we're going to have to potentially make a business decision to say do we just jump into this program and do we take on that role even though we know there's going to be an operational loss from a financial standpoint because there's no way I mean what we should see of significant evictions this should be balanced because we're having the same rules and so it's a problem and we're getting ready to dig into it here's where the fight might come what does housing first really mean housing first is the model that everyone accepts is what we should be doing what that really means is if you are homeless you cannot generally see your life beyond 24 hours if you don't know what you're going to eat or where you're going to sleep tonight thinking about your life decisions tomorrow is not a thing and so if you are first housed then that eliminates that 24 hour period and it lets you look further down in your life and then you can start addressing things like substance abuse, jobs or health or all of those types of things the problem is housing first doesn't mean get people into houses and leave them alone housing first gives people into houses and then you come in with that stuff to help address their issues in their life and if that second step is not happening which our perception is that it's not then here we are that our contract requires that there are funding and capacity struggles but we got to figure something out so we know that so because of our security there is a lot of more minor violations somebody you're walking through the building with a marijuana joint that is a violation of our crime-free addendum it's not allowed by the HUD founded funding that pays for your voucher don't do that okay you're going out of the building but you're walking through past the security guard with it in your hand so we've issued some warnings like you are violating your your lease and there is consternation about that from MHP already don't you believe in housing first don't you believe in housing first so that is a pretty strong statement to make here in the public meeting but we are going to be pretty open about this conversation with MHP in the state because we are trying to work around it but that does not mean that your obligation should not be in health part of it is thought about, do I say this this on and answer yes because at the end of the day those individuals that we're having to deal with when we go through the eviction process and this is a key thing to state or when you go through an eviction the eviction is sealed unless you specifically ask not to seal the eviction very clear that when we're going through these significant issues my directive to Lisa is everyone of these we ask not to have it unsealed suppressed so we're asking to unsuppress every one of these that we're dealing with because it's not fair to the other landlords in the community to know this that's that was slightly different from what you point on that my understanding is law is they're suppressed until the point of judgment and then they're unsuppressed unless there's an agreement between all the parties to continue this oppression it's supposed to be the problem is industry is likely they still get around to doing it one way or the other would you say that most of that suppressed I can play this in my stipulation that I do I don't do LHA there's always statements in there that permanently suppress them in most cases they keep the possession if they make all the agreements that was done a couple of years ago by the legislature and frankly that's the one of the only levers that exists get people to sign agreements of course they're kind of encouraging I know I heard this the other day I would say it's absolutely unreasonable it's plain to me there's a lot of legal reasons why LHA does that we're not just to be clear it's not for non-payment rent it's for if this person has threatened violence to a landlord or a meth unit where if that goes into a private landlords then they're screwed for us the thing with the whole I have some opinions about some of the stuff you were talking about there are questions maybe one of the things to an eviction court you never know what a judge is going to do in this particular case a judge did something and I've seen you this twice now and everybody is in shock over and that was bleeding in 10 days because right now by law you cannot evict somebody for 10 days sure but I've seen this judge when I've seen him twice now waved at him we're all kind of in shock because it doesn't claim to match now the other side of the coin is the sheriff's saying I'm still going to go to the judge's by law I'm not going to do this but this is not as clean as you think it is the other thing I wanted to say was I was going to just bring this is minor compared to what you're talking about but at the sweets when I was at one of the other properties here today and people were very upset because the man of you there is going to lock bathrooms on the first floor when she leaves because it's homeless people getting in the city down and down and down to me what I thought of that is the answer is not lock in the bathrooms we have a security problem in these buildings and people are getting excited it's bad enough that we have to shut the bathrooms off it's probably an education security problem so what did you say that was at the sweets yeah that was a hard stuff to launch basically at least it was but that is true I mean one of the issues we have at that building we have that happening yeah so my question was being going to be was are we at a point where we should be considering security around the clock security in all these buildings because we may have some pretty big exposures where people are just wandering in there and I know we keep telling people don't let people know that's never gonna happen they're letting me in all the time occasionally people know me when I get all this all the time but I know a lot of people that come to do that over and over from me I have no idea about it I don't even ask yeah I mean part of it is a cost issue I understand yeah that's the hard part of this is there's a personal responsibility and then there's the organizational responsibility and it's a challenge because even at Spring Creek we had an issue where somebody was cropping the door open with a rock or something and so most of the issues outside of the facilities are actually the creation of the people that live within the facilities which is why I'm kind of thinking about this wrong insecurity kind of concept if we can do it financially because you see it in different areas and what's interesting is like we had a major problem when we took over the LHA with somebody breaking into getting into the village so we put cameras and other stuff hopefully in two weeks the camera thing will be resolved because of all the federal funds it's turning into just a bloody nightmare but hopefully in two to three weeks we'll have the best value again and we can do it but so cameras are going to be part of that the way we did the best value is that cameras will be associated we're asking them to let us know whether or not there are options they can also deal with access control systems and parking systems because if you can integrate access control with cameras then all of a sudden to your point if we're seeing certain things then we can adjust access control via technology but yeah I think we do need it but the difference was a village place we said okay we're going to put cameras in and almost immediately changed it changed the situation to where we're not experiencing the issues that we were what's probably happening and we've seen this in other properties is that people have their own viewpoint of how they help people and they let people in and where they let people in at Fall River where I think we have to admit this person where they were letting unhoused individuals again allowing them to stay in their unit do you know Harold one of the things that I think about we have basically a multiple population in all of those whole people sick people security, when I lived in I had an apartment in New York City right back before they was you couldn't walk in the front door without three people asking who you were and that was they were doorman of course they weren't security and again this building far forward when you look at our population as vulnerable as they are it seems to me that exposure is big enough that we should be looking at how we make that a primary option and how we spend our money yeah and I think the challenge is some of the properties can very cover maintenance and management yeah and I think that's kind of where we have to as part of the broader financial strategy of building projects building up the fund balance building up the general fund to where we can are absorbing that down the road using the general fund we're just not quite there yet and yeah, I mean if we had the money I'd probably have security in every building I thought you better say that it's kind of a good thing when I've heard no that's good because when I would say the advantage is let's not lock it let's look at a different door lock handle there's a code that's required to lock doors so we were having problems with our building and then some of those populations have identified that as a place to go so they were breaking in so one way to help security reinforce more is we do this with a camera to move the mesh window but what ultimately helps is the tenants with the property including our laundry we did a coded door lock that was unique the code was unique to that tenant to that tenant and we did the door code so we knew we had one tenant whose son was he was giving the code to the son so the son could send the code now because he didn't want to know this but we knew that that person his code was unique to his so we knew that he had given that code to someone else to that tenant so we haven't had problems since we started doing that we've got back to this I mean it costs us a ton our boiler guy who just asserts on the state boiler he was saying that there was like a B12 unit in Gordon and it has the same thing the homeless people constantly they've done problems we did and the boiler guy the cert guy actually started they had unscrewed the air vent on the other side and the corral through the ventilation system and entering the boiler so they were doing all the things we did to secure the front door but they were all coming back so we knew ours has the same thing so preemptively since we told this a story we welded it was great to the air vent is it an upfront cost to the thing or is it an ongoing cost to the keep up it's an upfront cost and then each unit has a unique code to the door and then you can also if they properly are open they don't be cheaper they can be way cheaper so that way you know which tenant's code is clean and they had to have given that to somebody and that's the access to control connected to the cameras because when you can integrate when you see an issue then the camera can connect to the access to the control system so then beyond just the rest we have the camera so we have a company has done this for us we started using personable because we would put the cameras were monitoring much noise and because I didn't have to go check the cameras so we started using them and then we also used them now so is that in such a location families are focused on all the doors all the properties yeah this is correct yeah ours is a little different because it will be working with the parts cameras eventually working with everything and so public safety will have access to it so will the managers or Lisa and myself and so initially it's just cameras but these cameras actually move and then when they detect somebody in the area they zoom in to see what's going on is that live monitor on there you can but rarely do you have the capacity to live monitor right now but it couldn't be done by emergency center public safety so ultimately that exact dream but capacity right now there's no way so what we end up doing in our control room we have a large TV and it's got about four or five cameras up and any officer can go and change the cameras up to view their partner or whatever and say something comes out like right now and they're in that room they can go to that camera and then rewind it or go to the that time which it could be real time and they can actually see the incident itself and it's it's amazing the camera systems how we were watching I was watching with one of the sergeant Colin one day we were looking at car park so I was asking him to put there's some dead spots and we had some problems so I was like hey we need to I do that a lot too as far as our cameras and some of the park issues so we were watching our park and it had zoomed in on this car and the guy sitting there smoking out of the pipe in his car the picture is super clear so we can catch a lot of things but we don't have the full time we don't have the full time to watch right so part of it in terms of capacity what we're working on what we're working on organizationally is in terms of call centers we started bringing things together so Valerie Dodd Becky Doyle Sandy Cedar are working on this and working on utilities and that we know some point in the near future we're going to have to shift to the next slide and as we're thinking about that we're going to bring public safety in because right now for our utilities our after hours calls go into the non-emergency dispatch line and dispatch has to handle it which is a problem in its own right as we're moving organizationally into this 24 hour kind of world then to Sarah's point when Zach and I talked about is literally probably kind of operation center where there's always somebody in it and the cameras are always going but we're talking hundreds of cameras and so and then some of the technology with the cameras they have audio devices on it so hearing like begging or something there's things that we may be able to do but it's just a capacity issue for us right now and so we know the companies that are leading edge of that and so hopefully they submit the cool thing about it is that we also want to mimic what what NOLA provided is that we then give the ability for individual property owners to say we want to participate in this program and you can buy the camera system that integrates the metal arts and then the individual property owners can give public safety access to it so then if something happens then you can utilize it and so that's part of our broader smart city initiative but that's in place but to kind of go back to where we started is on those substantial violations what we found is they probably had issues other places but to your point whether it's the judge they're not unsuppressing it and so you don't know who you're getting we're making sure they're unsuppressed on substantial violations but back to the housing first conversation our point to MHP is going to be by you not doing what you're supposed to you're harming the client because once they create a substantial violation and we say it's unsuppressed it's almost impossible to get housed so I apologize that I've been typing during this conversation because we just got an email from the OH really strongly worded MHP has gone to the OH to complain about us so I was writing a direct email back and so you'll see that and yeah so it's happening it's happening now whatever reason it's a question what do you do if you raise this couple of weeks ago you know we have a so set of people that are not they can't live in the environment that we're going to create what are we going to do are we going to create a heat to go here but you know some people would say well they're either following the rules or they're in jail no matter what you create there's an impression of a confinement type situation or a field that will help hospitals and we're kind of going to break them right now in the next couple of weeks so I want to make sure we're talking about some really bad scenarios but the number of residents of the sweets that are trying to do good that should really be the message I don't want especially to our partners to the state to MHP seeing the examples that we're taking strong action on for individuals that does not mean that 78 and other individuals are doing the same thing are we do want to balance we are in the same business of if we evict somebody we know that once if they're homeless again that is still our problem to help solve and so we want to make sure that the messaging is not that we are hardline to you are not welcome here it's more that we're trying to fix a couple of bad situations to make the 78 other individuals that are doing okay safe and able to still work on their own lives so that's something I think we got to make sure we start with in all of these conversations to make sure that just because the LHA has a partnership with the city that has a police department does not mean that we are coming in clean in house I don't want that perception to be out there there's a broader issue in just the nation around homelessness and housing as a housing provider you know the housing first model it's really hard to do it when you have investors and lenders and it's business and they don't want to see these people house because it's affecting their return it's almost like there needs to be a separate category of service and housing if that is really the model that's going to work there are people who believe that you should be allowed if it's housing first you should be allowed to use that in your unit you know if that's what you have to do to survive that's great in theory but you're putting other people at risk you're putting the whole entire building at risk you're putting the lenders and investors they don't care they're there to make money I mean that's the li-tech side of it it's a business they're not doing it out of the goodness of their hearts banks aren't lending millions of dollars in construction and permanent financing because it makes them feel good they're required to by law to invest in the community where they have 30 more banks so the perception warm fuzzies it's not true not really I mean that's what it really comes down to people like us yes we want to see people thrive but we're at the mercy of this entire system that is built to fail those vulnerable people so I totally agree with you but we're our hands are tied in some ways but I think also going to Mama's point and what's going on right now there needs to be a sense of accountability and there needs to be a sense of these are you know whether you live in your own home I mean I was just fighting with my son last night I mean we have rules right we have rules no matter where you live and when you live in a community like the Swedes there has to be you have your lease you have your community goals you know these are things you have quiet hours you have to have accountability and when you lose this sense of accountability it's mayhem and that's ultimately I'm not saying mayhem right now but what I'm saying is that if we don't start holding these folks accountable then it will turn well and there's the other right so we're on the other side with the tenants that are following the rules that are coming to us going I can't sleep at night because of all of this noise I can't do this or I'm scared and you need to do something about it and so you get put in between these two groups and at the end of the day the ones that are complaining right this activity is not allowing them to live in a safe, peaceful environment where they can be successful and so for the most part we're pretty tolerant on issues and do creative things to solve it it's when those individuals refuse to do it and you just keep going and it's a systemic issue so for the question from this letter you just talked about what does that really mean to us what I think we need to do is make sure DOH, MHP and us have a frank and transparent conversation to make sure we all understand who is actually responsible for what when it comes to support services knowing that there are funding challenges and capacity challenges but who is actually responsible and who is actually taking the steps to try and make this right I think that there hasn't been a three-way conversation in recent years at least partly because everyone's just working with old systems because there's nothing out there to create a new system right now I think everybody just needs to know the real world on the ground not just seeing a report on a piece of paper that you get once a quarter that shows that you're meeting your requirements and set by the state it needs to be much more of a conversation about what this is like day in the life because I think there's a complete gap in understanding of funding this from the very top level versus operating this on the ground level I would really just talk about the suites too with Zinnia doing a lease up as well MHP is what is really to pay about before we go there I think the conversation is really interesting because we have the data to show and I don't think DOH knows this and MHP I don't think knows this but we have the data in hand to show that we're all tapping into the same populations that there is a distinct difference whether it's in the selection process or how we're engaging with the residents in terms of the success of those that are the 50% that LHA deals with and the 50% that MHP deals with and so in this while they made this point is that we're going to take a very tactical position to work off data and facts not off of perception and hyperbole and it's going to be I think incredibly hard for MHP to reconcile those issues and you know on the other side of it is I think we all agree that it's a systemic failure and I think that's a product of what we see come out of the state on a regular basis and I can't tell you how many programs we dealt with that they build it or they're building and playing as it's flying and you can't ground sure it doesn't make sense whether that's the MHOP project whether it's the family leaves that they're building and so I think it's having that frank conversation because I think we have enough information that I'm willing to have a public conversation with a council in an open session and discuss these issues and I'm going to tell it that is I'm responsible to the board and we're talking about this but I have to talk to two boards in a public session and I'm more than willing to do it because we can't allow this to be slept under the rug because it is penalizing way too many people in our facilities people struggling with addiction to where we know there's something happening and we can see them moving into other units we know that's occurring and how can we ask Recovery Cafe to be successful on the other side with the DLH piece that they also don't know about is that we funded three clinicians to come in we're working on an agreement with the Recovery Cafe that we're dealing with other sources of funding to bridge the gap that they're not providing funding to him and I can talk about that publicly all day long because I think people have to start bringing this stuff out otherwise there are a lot of people that need help that aren't going to be successful and for us we still deal with those individuals even with the eviction because they're staying in our community and it's just another arm of our organization that's having to deal with that whether it's lead, core, police senior services and so it's not like we're just wiping our hands of these individuals we're still dealing with them and I think they don't reconcile with that piece which I think makes our argument stronger as we're dealing with them we find people with an emergency condition we have any kind of plan that we look at along to try to get back away from that I have no idea we work with people for months trying to sort out issues and bring in mediation and do payment plans or like you know the world word but mutual plans for getting things back on track and the eviction is absolutely the last resort money I can understand but what I'm really focused on is like well if you're up at that level that is the risk is too high and our people that are living by sort of that person that to us is that's a life safety issue I mean they were literally trying to bring a full gas can into a building that's kind of my point when I've seen an eviction I haven't really paid that close attention but I haven't really seen LHA or a bunch of payment issues it's been significant violations that started I remember there being a significant change even before you guys came on in how much we were worth with a tenant to avoid eviction I'm not really sure that's wrong no that's the right thing to do I don't know what I mean is I'm sorry I'm not when I look at the docket it's nonpayment nonpayment LHA substantial violations substantial violations I'm not so sure we're going wrong next we've been in a lot of heat for it but as you said yes I mean math all these issues are immediate safety issues for you and so do we sacrifice the majority for the 304 unfortunately it's not 304 anymore I think you're right I think you're right and that's our approach if it's something that endangers the life safety of the others that are in the building we've been pretty open with everyone in talking to conversations we have zero loss for those I mean it's not like they don't know that that's our position in that part of the conversation when we get to numbers they will see why numbers are the way they are it's the direct communication for these folks that's the last last meeting we talked about we wanted to do a picture of the passage it leads to that so we have 15 minutes left do we want anything else we want to talk about the students campus are going to probably cover it all and we're not doing property updates because it was the holidays it was mainly president parties we can go over if there's questions or if you just want to suggest do you have the elution numbers is that what you were saying no these were called for service let's go over the anything on the resident quality of life anybody want to bring on alright so let's go on to number 8 the elution report anything on the occupancy report any questions on I have just a little bit of questions today I don't have any details for time to take we're looking there's no I'm assuming there's no additional units or no new ones except for the recent test we just got that's not reflected on here yet public health and safety updates alright so these for this first sheet the small box the last three years at our properties as you can see the community that has the highest numbers the one we've been discussing this last year we were there 487 times that's quite a bit this other sheet breaks calls for service down for each property in the last three years when it calls for service so once I wanted to highlight for you we could take a deep dive into data and how we collect it and I just want to share with you things that should be highlighted so when you look at the assist under the sweets 168 assists and then you look at the follow ups down below those are all the same things and those are basically when we had a change we went to our body cameras a lot of the we said follow up we had to change it to an assist for whatever reason our body camera and the data and the collection we had to change it so those are all basically the same thing and the majority of the folks that ever cleared a call with that were our coordinates more myself so that helps with that piece on the second page the suspicious the suspicious situations that are called in there is 56 of the sweets I believe that that number is so high due to in the last few years is due to the involvement with public safety and the coffee and conversations in the communications with management with everyone there and really the residents contacting me and a lot of times I'll call I'll call it all the time and I end up loading calls for people the welfare check 239 welfare checks in 3 years so over over half of those I would say Corvus caught the 2 I did pull a separate I didn't print it out but we had 4 at the sweets 152 times last year so that's a pretty significant number whether it be on a welfare check maybe it was they were following up a lot of times the 4 units the negative referral they follow up on these folks all the time and so follow ups mental health mental health holds, welfare checks and I feel like the contributing factors also with some of these numbers at the sweets we did lose our resource specialist there and I can't remember what time of year we lost Valerie but I think not having that person around at all contributed to some of those numbers as well you can see all the other properties are pretty pretty low that's a really quick deep dive into data and if any of you have questions or if you end up looking at this and want to have a conversation with me and definitely do that with you I have a question about the welfare checks are those mainly done by say related to the residents or where are the welfare checks coming from so who's the reporting party so it could be a neighbor it could be mental health case murder like MHP there's few of them in there, believe it or not they come from all over a family member maybe a manager it could be coming in from a doctor hospital so that it's a wide variety of who's reporting welfare checks I just wonder how how often the families are even involved in the people that are there that's a comment sure, yeah the other thing that comes out to me is that harassment is not 50-80 and that's that's residents calling on other residents that could be a resident being harassed from someone outside that could definitely dig into that piece to see how many you know, how many resident on resident harassments we have I mean the gentleman we were just talking about that was evicted, he was charged with harassment on two residents so the other kind of line with the disturbances as well as the some of the service so it's kind of a spread in the state I don't know if there's anything else so that was a quick preview in the last few years as far as any property updates we've really just been like we've been talking about the past few weeks of this week really working with the security team there and patrol and getting information out timely was very important for public safety and for residents this week so I think we did a fantastic job about hanging tires up communicating with residents Harold and Lisa went to talk to a few folks they were directly involved I went down and spoke with a couple residents with Ruby so I think as the entire staff we did an amazing job working together and making sure the residents felt comfortable with it and as safe as possible Lisa talked about it he needs to address the right in the conversation any additional things for you Harold do you have any other business I just have a question about village the village the village there we go and you probably have addressed this in the past and after that the whole solar panels out there are we going to get those to a point where they're functional and can actually work for that so we're going to take them off those are solar panels just to do a water heating system solar energy PV solar panels the panels will come off we are going to re-purpose the mountings and put actual PV solar panels on so we will have solar energy offsetting not all electric there is still gas for the boilers because that is a really hard thing to represent but we will still offset what the panels propose offset 65% of the energy so just building building so I'm going to hold it and let's adjourn and attack the p7 this meeting is February 13th take care all