 Coming up on DTNS, we explain the Facebook Oversight Board's decision not to reinstate President Trump's account for now, signals battle over Instagram ads, and Dr. Nicole Ackerman talks the tech you use for 3D imagery of bashing bovid skulls. This is the Daily Tech News for Wednesday, April 5th, 2021 in Los Angeles, I'm Tom Merritt. And from Studio Redwood, I'm Sarah Lane. From Salt Lake City, I'm Scott Johnson. I'm Roger Chang, the show's producer. And as I just mentioned, joining us, researcher from Mount Sinai, Dr. Nicole Ackermans-Nickey, welcome to the show. Hello. Thank you. Glad to be here. We were using your expertise to determine if people can turn into coyotes on good day internet. If you'd like that wider conversation, of course, become a member at patreon.com slash DTNS. Let's start with a few tech things you should know. What's At Pay is now available in Brazil after receiving regulatory approval at the end of March. The feature is rolling out slowly and for now only supports linking payments to MasterCard or Visa debit cards from select national banks. Dell released a security patch for its firmware update utility, fixing a driver flaw that could let an attacker gain full kernel level permissions in Windows, though Dell said there's no evidence it has been actively exploited. The flaw impacts more than 380 Dell and Alienware PCs going back to 2009 with almost 200 of them listed as no longer receiving service. You can now bid in an online auction to get a seat aboard the first official flight of Blue Origin's new Shepard spacecraft. The private bids will be unsealed to show how much money is at play with a live action to settle the matter on June 12th. Money will go to STEM Career Focused Foundation called Club for the Future, and the winner of the auction will ride with five other passengers on July 20th to just less than 100 kilometers above Earth. That lets you experience weightlessness and the ability to see the curvature of the earth. Closer to home, Facebook rolled out a test of neighborhoods on mobile, which group users who opt into geographically defined groups for local sharing, recommendations and questions. So next door, but on Facebook. The feature is available on iOS and Android across Canada and rolling out also to Charlotte, North Carolina, San Diego, California, Baton Rouge, Louisiana, and Newark, New Jersey in the United States. I wonder if they'll eventually be a neighborhood 100 kilometers above Earth. Oh man. Check in real quick, see what people are saying. Twitter is adjusting the prompts that it shows users if it detects abusive language. The prompts are meant to make a user think before deciding to post, but they don't actually stop post from being made and posted. The algorithm will take into account if two users follow each other, if they reply to each other frequently, and it has improved detection of actual strong language and profanity. The hope is that fewer prompts will show up in situations of sarcasm or banter or just when it misinterprets what was being written. All right. Let's talk about Facebook's oversight board. It upheld Facebook's decision to suspend US President Trump's Facebook account back in January, but it is requiring that Facebook review the period of the suspension. So they're saying the initial suspension, we think was justified, the indeterminate length, not so much. At the time of the suspension, Facebook had said it would last at least two weeks. After that two weeks ended, COO Sheryl Sandberg told Reuters the company had no plans to lift it. The oversight board's decision said, quote, it is not permissible for Facebook to keep a user off the platform for an undefined period with no criteria for when or whether the account will be restored. And the decision also said it was not appropriate, quote, to impose the indeterminate and standard list penalty of indefinite suspension, adding, Facebook's normal penalties include removing the violating content, imposing a time bound period of suspension, or permanently disabling the page and account. They didn't do any of those things. The board gave Facebook six months to, quote, determine and justify a proportionate response that is consistent with the rules that are applied to other users of its platform. So either come up with a time period that follows your own rules or make it permanent based on your own rules. Now, a lot of people today are paying attention to this and wondering, well, who is this oversight board? Are they even independent? It's just a bunch of Facebook hired people. What is this all about? The oversight board began operation last year. We've covered it on DTNS, but we'll cover it again here, too. Facebook provided initial funding of $130 million as a grant. So it's not ongoing funding. It's like, here's $130 million. Now you, the oversight board, control that. They want the board to become self-funding eventually, though Facebook may give it more money down the road. Facebook appointed six trustees to form the board. These aren't the people who decide the questions. The trustees picked the board members who decide the questions. One of the trustees is president of freedom of expression firm called Intrinsic. One is a former South African and Namibian judge and a professor of human rights law at Oxford. One is a professor of constitutional law at Yale. One is a retired lawyer and former SEC attorney. And one is the former chairman of ICANN. The last is a former Wall Street banker. Three of them are men. Three are women. One is African American. The rest are white. The trustees that I just described selected the 20 board members that will decide the appeals. The board can't expand to as many as 40. Right now it's got 20. I won't go through the entire board, but there are 10 men, 10 women, six from the U.S., three from Europe, three from countries in Africa, two from countries in South America, and one each from Australia, Taiwan, Pakistan, Indonesia, Yemen, Israel, and India. Board members do get paid out of the oversight board's trust, that $130 million, the trustees decide the salary, though most of the board members hold other jobs. Board members are from media and journalism, three of them from media and journalism, 11 are either teaching or practicing law or both. Four of them are from human rights organizations, one from the Cato Institute, and one is the former prime minister of Denmark. Each appeal is reviewed by five members of the 20-member board. So they create a sub-panel, at least one member of that panel has to be from the country of the account holder, or at least the closest country to it. The members of the panel are kept anonymous so that there's no backlash against them. They meet remotely and they study the facts of the case, any statements from the appellant, and comments from the public. In the case of President Trump, more than 9,000 comments were submitted. This is the 10th decision that the board has made. The first decisions include reinstating comments critical of India's prime minister and reinstating offensive comments posted by a user in Myanmar. Facebook has agreed to be bound by the decisions of the board regarding the applications of its own policy. So reinstatement or leaving something down, they are bound to follow it. They have agreed to do that. The board can also advise on policy changes, but Facebook is only bound to consider policy changes. They don't have to make the policy changes. In President Trump's case, the board issued seven policy recommendations for handing high-profile content during crisis in the future. Those involve specialized staff to deal with these cases, transparency about the decisions, clear policies that are applied independent of the person involved, and asking Facebook to examine its own contribution to the problem. Board Co-Chair and Stanford Law Professor Michael McConnell said this is not the only case in which Facebook has engaged in ad hocary, in other words, just coming up with the decision at the moment rather than based on rules. Co-Chairman and the former Danish prime minister, Hal Thorning-Schmidt, said they cannot invent new unwritten rules when it suits them. Meanwhile, President Trump said that he did not agree with the decision and has launched his own website at donaldjtrump.com slash desk where you can keep up with him directly. So only silenced on Facebook for now. So a blog, just to clarify, it's a blog, right? It's a website. So this is interesting because, you know, I was thinking earlier, we talked a little bit on TMS about this and I'll say this briefly, but it feels like a little bit like what the games industry felt like they had to do in the 90s. They had to either apply a pretty good and rigorous self-regulation or have it regulated upon them by various governments and institutions. So why not do it ourselves and make it as independent as possible? And then we're going to be better off. And it turned out it kind of worked for them. The difference here is this is a Facebook funded effort that Facebook hopes other companies will use and isn't just focused on Facebook. But I wonder if that never happens, I feel like it will always be seen as a Facebook serving entity and will always be up to various bits of scrutiny whether it's deserved or not. But I personally would rather have this than have them just do whatever they do willy-nilly and then have to have others come in and tell them what to do. I'm sure they don't want that. And as a user of products on the internet, I kind of don't want that. So I mean, the oversight board is, I mean, this is a good example of the oversight board saying, yeah, well, Facebook, you didn't try hard enough. You either ban somebody indefinitely or you say how long they're banned or you don't ban them. You know, there's, there's, there's definition here that, that the company didn't do. Of course, this is a very specific account. You could almost compare it to no other Facebook account on earth. So in that sense, I kind of get where Facebook was like, let's make the oversight board figure this one out. But I, I gotta agree. I think, I think they, they make good points, you know, of, of the folks on the board who were involved in this decision saying, you gotta make a, make a call here. You know, what, what is it? It's not just indefinite because that is sort of like saying, let's put it, we'll just put it in that, that, you know, deep storage and think about it never. Yeah. I mean, the criticism here would be that the oversight board kicked the can down the road six months. They didn't tell them to reinstate the account. They just gave them six months to, to figure things out, which, which leaves the status quo. So they kind of didn't make a decision in that way. But I think you're right. Techdirt had a piece on this saying, look, you, you all are looking at this like it's a quasi governmental agency. It's not. An internal look at it as an internal Facebook board. And it's like a really well constructed internal oversight, right? Big companies have oversight and audit teams. And this is a really interestingly constructed one. If you look at it that way, it is Facebook trying to hold their own feet to the fire with some independent voices. And you see that here where they're like, yeah, you don't get to just make up the rules as you go along. You need rules for this, which is why you get those seven policy recommendations, as well as the, you have to come up with a timeline. Fix that. You got six months or we will rule on that, at which point the oversight board would step in and make a ruling. Well, we talked about this a little bit on our GDI post show after DTNS yesterday, but it is worthy of more discussion. Tuesday in a blog post, Signal, the company Signal, said that it created targeted ads designed to show Instagram users what kinds of targeting the platform Instagram owned by Facebook is capable of. The ads shown on the blog were just text on a blue background with ad targeting keywords that were highlighted. The Signal logo was in the bottom right. So you understood that Signal was involved. One example read, quote, you got this ad because you're a certified public accountant and an open relationship. This ad used your location to see you're in South Atlanta. You're into national natural skincare and you've supported Cardi B since day one. Signal then noted that its ad account had been disabled. Now several reporters quoted a Facebook statement that said in response, quote, this is a stunt by Signal, who never actually tried to run these ads and we didn't shut down their ad account for trying to do so end quote. Signal tweeted in response, quote, we absolutely did try to run these. The ads were rejected and Facebook disabled our ad account. These are real screenshots as Facebook should know end quote. Then Facebook spokesperson Joe Osborne wrote on Twitter, quote, quote, these screenshots are from early March when the ad account was briefly disabled for a few days due to an unrelated payments issue. The ads themselves were never rejected as they were never set by Signal to run. The ad account has been available since early March. The ads don't violate our policies and could have run since then. So somebody's lying or at least misunderstanding. I suppose it could be possible that Joe Osborne doesn't know all the facts and thinks these are screenshots from early March, but in fact they are more recent and there was a rogue employee doing something that Osborne's unaware of that's certainly possible. But if Signal isn't lying, I would like to see Signal run the ads. Let's let's do it. Run them. Yeah, no kidding. Take a screenshot in the wild. And if you can't get them run, then say like we just tried to run them and you wouldn't let us, which is I think what Signal's saying is like, no, you have suspended our account. We can't run ads. That's why nobody sees any of our ads anywhere. Yeah, I would like to see those ads as well. They're they're I think they're effective at what they're trying to say, which is a very signal thing to say anyway. But it feels like five year olds are running big tech sometimes to me. And it seems like this is just such a weird, slappy, weird fight, and it shouldn't be that hard for one side of the other to sort of say yes or no to, you know, like, does this thing, is this one weird enough that if they did try to place those ads again and still couldn't get through, does this go to that oversight board? Like, I'd love to see that thing argued. No, no, because that's for Facebook. I mean, I guess it could be. I mean, it's not for Facebook. That's for comments. It's it's for for comments, not for ads. Right, right. So I don't think that the oversight board gets involved in this sort of dispute. Yeah, be interesting, though. But yeah, Nicky, I'm curious, I think from your point of view, if if if you were to see an ad like that, that said, you're a functional morphologist in New York City and blah, blah, all these other personal things, how would that make you feel depending on what's advertised, I'd be like, you don't know me. Don't don't tell me what I want to see, even though sometimes they do get me. And sometimes I'm like, well, I might buy that, but not because you told me to. And these ads, these ads don't try to sell you anything. They just tell you like, we know who you are. I'd I'd be a little like a little weirded out, but I also know that, yeah, I know they know that I'm not particularly good at hiding my online presence. So maybe that's the other thing, right? Like, Nikki, I'm the same. Like I'm not, I kind of know they have it, but being told that they have it, there's something weird and wrong. And it's kind of hard to put your head around. But I would also know, like it would tell me more about who signal is because I would I would get the the subtext, which is signal saying, oh, and by the way, we do a thing where our app does everything's encrypted. Nothing gets out and we don't give anybody anything. So we knew all this by coming here. Why don't you come over here? Well, we don't know any of that stuff. And that's kind of effective. That's a good point. Yeah, I think it's also, I mean, I only read one example, but you kind of get the gist of what these PSAs, I guess you could call them are trying to do. And having such personal information all in one paragraph about yourself is probably going to be a big wake up call for anybody who says, yeah, you know, they kind of have my data. But to know the specifics all at once, you sort of go, oh, wait a second. Yeah, that's location, personal interests, what I do for a living, who I might love or not love, that kind of thing. It's it's it's the more you know. Well, moving, you know, I like k-dramas. Exactly. I know, I know all about Tom's problem. We won't call it a problem. It's fine. That's a nice thing you do. Hey, speaking of social science, sort of, let's move over to this one. Scientists from BYU, that's Brighamang University here in Utah and Provo, published a study in the journal Sleep Health called, quote, does the iPhone night shift mitigate negative effects of a smartphone use on sleep outcomes and emerging adults? So, you know, one of the soft claims that Apple makes about something like that feature. Night shift is the iOS feature that reduces blue light at night. They studied 167 adults ranges, 18 to 24, 71.3 percent of them were women. Participants were randomly divided into three groups and for seven nights in the hour before bedtime, you would either use an iPhone with night shift, so on or an iPhone without night shift on or no phone at all. Accelerometers attract sleep latency, duration, efficiency and waking. So let's talk about what they found. There was no significant difference in sleep quality across these three groups. However, in the group that didn't use the phone at all before bedtime, sleep quality was better for those who slept more than 6.8 hours at night. So that was the one caveat. But if you didn't use a phone at all, you were better off. And it sounds like at least from these very preliminary and maybe we need more studies type of results that that thing doesn't do much for you to help you sleep. Yeah, I mean, more studies always better at seeing like, well, is it just young people? Is there more of an effect on different different ethnicities, etc. This is a heavily female study. But it's it's pretty good sample group, right, Nicky? Like it's peer reviewed journal and all that. Yeah, the fact that it's just seven nights, I was like, I don't know if that's long enough to change your sleep habit. I don't know about you guys, but when I'm jet lagged, it takes more than a week to get back to normal. So yeah, they can maybe a longer term study. I'm not really surprised by the results. Probably just don't use your phone at night. That's what we all don't want to hear, right? Yeah, that's the one thing. I mean, and I and I do like that companies like Apple and Samsung and everybody else who have got a big stake in the phone business. I like that they're trying to come up with ways for us to see how much time we spend on our phones and maybe cut back on that and things like this. You know, trying to help us with sleep is a noble idea. I think maybe just some of it just plain doesn't work. I can tell you that I use night shift for a lot of the artwork I do on my iPad because I get a lot of eye strain. I had surgeries a few years ago that made me sensitive to light, especially blue light. I'm wearing these glasses now to help combat that while we do the show as well. And I'm running night shift on this computer screen that I'm on. So I like that that features there as it does reduce strain for me. And that, you know, your experience may vary, but I've yet to feel like I got any better sleep because I had that on. And I haven't done my own studies, but I don't think that does much for me at all. Yeah, I mean, there's so many factors, right? It's, you know, I am a new wearer of contact lenses because I can't really see without some sort of either, you know, reading glasses or contact lenses. And it took me a long time to get to the point where I was like, OK, I need to make a decision that's more than just extreme eye strain where I'm super tired and I can't see anything at the end of the day. So, you know, that plays into this, too. I I have night mode turned on kind of sometimes the apps you have to do it within the app, but OS at the OS level, wherever I can, just because I feel like it's better for me. But honestly, sometimes it's not. Sometimes I'm like, ah, there's so much black. Like the it's actually harder on my eyes. And I wonder how much is this really helping me? Because we're not all created equal when it comes to eye strain and sleep patterns. Yeah, I think that's the one thing I would take away from this is we don't really know. So if if it's bothering you to use night shift, maybe turn it off. I have night shift on because I like the way it looks. You know, in the evening, it has a very candle glow feeling. I think that's probably why most people use it. I'm going to guess is like, oh, but it looks warm and relaxing. See, it looks like I have to turn up my brightness more. Yeah. And I like it, but I can't see it as well. Yeah, yeah. I know what it is for you, Tom. You've always said you like the 1940s kind of a tone time. I think that's it. I always put on my fedora when the night shift comes on night shift. You say I knew it was a bad app when it launched. Hey, folks, what do you want to hear us talk about on the show? One way you can let us know is our subreddit. Go into daily tech news show dot reddit dot com, submit stories and vote on them. That's daily tech news show dot reddit dot com. All right, Nicky is a postdoctoral researcher, a biologist, a functional morphologist, and Nicky, you've worked on everything from studying the evolutionary aspects of diet, invertebrates to why sheep and bulls and other bovids don't get brain injuries when they go around bashing each other in the head. You even kindly offered to identify random bones people find, which is very nice of you to do all of that. You need 3D imaging and you work with a lot of fascinating tech to make that happen. Thanks for being willing to explain some of that tech to us today. What should we start with? All these things are true. And I thought it would be fun to start with something that people could actually do at home and some people do. And that is starting with surface scanning. Sometimes you can do this from your phone. This is used a lot in museums with things called photometry or a lighter, which is laser triangulation. And you'll have like a handheld device with lots of little cameras in it. And you can basically as you move along the surface, take tons of pictures and they get stitched together. And they're also sort of have X, Y, Z coordinates in space so that they become a volume without the inside structure. So, for example, T-Rex bones that you see in the museum. There's no such thing as a complete T-Rex skeleton. So most of them have bones that have been scanned from another specimen and then 3D printed and stuck into the museum. And that comes from surface scanning and yep. So could I take my phone into the museum and like without breaking any rules, like just scan a bone and be able to have a scan? I don't know how many rules that be breaking. But Sketchfab has models for museums. I think you're probably not allowed. But I'm not going to say anything in the gift shop, maybe. Yeah. Yeah. And also, there's another thing that's cool. If you do these surface scans of bones and you have multiples and you want to like do science on them, you can put landmarks and you can compare the distance between the landmarks on these different bones. And you can say like, oh, this bone is bigger than this one. And that's really cool for evolutionary stuff. So if you start with like Neanderthals and then you go to modern humans, you can see how the skull shape morphs into the human shape. So you just need a phone with LiDAR in it. If you want really, really bad models, you can do it with a phone. But I mean, if somebody just wanted to play around with it themselves. Yeah, definitely. You can make 3D models from your from your iPhones. They have like three cameras now. So yeah. What about the real stuff, though? The stuff that you use as a professional in the lab? So yeah, I think people are pretty familiar with CT because you can get a medical CT if you're sick. There's also such thing as micro CT. And the main difference is resolution. So actually in some veterinary institutes, you have a smaller CT machine where you can put like rabbits and mice. And this one has much higher resolution. They also use this in other science areas. And then you have a normal CT, which is the medical CT. And these are used for imaging hard tissue like bone. And basically the way that they work is you lay on this gurney bed and an X-ray tube rotates around you. And X-ray detectors are on the opposite side of this tube as it rotates and they pick up the rays once they go through your body. So the body has different densities, depending on if it's bone or muscle or whatever your scanning could be a mummy as well, whatever fits inside the CT machine, basically. And then the computer picks up all this data and there are basically little slices that are like every half centimeter and it glues them all together into a stack. And then from that, you can create a 3D image by playing with the image, the densities of the X-ray that get picked up. And then I assume there's like a proprietary, not maybe not proprietary, but a specific format for those that kind of imagery. Yeah, they're usually in DICOM from CT images, but it depends on the machine. I think usually the output of a medical machine is DICOM. Gotcha. You can transfer it to whatever you want. Now, the next piece of equipment you have to talk about here is one that I've had myself, the MRI. Yeah. So actually, if you've been in an MRI, then you needed things to be imaged that were soft. So your brain and your organs and you shouldn't go into an MRI if you have metal plates in your body, because the MRI is a giant, giant magnet. And the really, really cool thing about an MRI is how it works. Is it forces all of the protons in your body to line up like the magnet just sucks on all your protons and puts them in a row and it creates these different magnetic fields. So a radio wave will go through this magnetic field and it's deflected depending again upon the different densities of these tissues in your body. And the signal that's emitted is then used to recreate an MRI image in the computer. And then this is all black and white. And you can create cross sectional images like this. And you can also re-slice them if you want like a sagittal image or a coronal image. Yeah, yeah, it made my shoulder look like ham in all the images that I was able to look at. I have the image in my mind, yeah. What do you what do you use the MRI for in your line of work? So right now I'm scanning lots of brains. Actually, it's really cool. I you have to have the brain suspended in a solution, a liquid just so that they're not like in the box and the box doesn't get picked up on the MRI. And the liquid has to be anionic. So it doesn't have to have ions, because if not, it will interfere with the MRI. So I'm just scanning ox brains and things like that and cow brains and sheep brains to see if they have outside brain trauma that you can pick up on the MRI. All right, what's next? Next is 3D microscopy. This one probably not as many people are familiar with. It's basically I'm sure you have an idea in your head of what a cell looks like when you look at it under a microscope. You just do that on a few different planes that are very, very close together and you can stack all these images together and something that's called a Z stack because it's on the Z plane. And you have a 3D cell. So that's 3D microscopy and you can use this for right now. I'm doing it for neurons to see like where the little arms of the neurons are going to things like that. Yeah, so the really, really tiny stuff. Really, really tiny. Yeah. Yeah. All right. And then I know there's some 3D printing involved as well. Yeah. So basically, any time you have a 3D model, you can bring it into Ultimaker or Cura or whatever software you use and you can 3D print it. I've definitely 3D printed a skull from my CT scan sheep. And like I said, there's those T-Rex leg bones that get printed on these huge machines that they have in museums. I don't know if you've heard about the story a while back where a mummy got its larynx CT scan and then they printed the larynx and made a sound out of it. And it was a really silly sound. Yeah. Also really cool for humans. They'll scan CT scan your face, for example, and say you need a new nose. They can make a model out of your face and fit the prosthetic exactly to the shape of your skull. And so you have like a custom prosthetic that way. And they'll often 3D print that as well. So yeah, those are some examples. Yeah. Thank you for sharing all this stuff with us. This is fascinating technology that I think when people hear biologists, they're not going to think of all the technology that you have to use. So it's really interesting to hear about it. We get to play with a lot of fancy machines. Yeah. Yeah. That's cool. All right. Let's check out the mailbag, Sarah. Let's do it, David. In getting hot out here, Phoenix wrote in about conversation we were having about chip making in Silicon Desert. David says, got some thoughts about he goes to the Valley of the Sun, like Alison Sheridan said yesterday, the incentives that are provided here are really good. Also helps that we have a ridiculous amount of state or government owned land. We also have a pretty stable environment. We don't have a lot of flooding, earthquakes, tornadoes, hurricanes or volcanoes. We just have heat and dust makes it easier to deal with this as it's a known expected thing every year, unlike other natural natural disasters. The only real concern right now is water. We are in what they're calling a mega drought and there are no signs of it getting any better anytime soon. As I hear things, I'll let you know I'm literally 10 miles away from where the first planet is supposed to go in. Yeah. Thank you, David. We also got someone send us a view from their backyard of the Intel plant in New Mexico or at least near the Intel plant in New Mexico. So thanks for all the on the ground reports, everybody. That's awesome. And it makes sense, David, now that you've now that you've written in that it would be easier to deal with heat and dust because it's a more stable threat to your manufacturing versus, you know, you never know when there's going to be a volcano or a her or an earthquake. If we did be a whole different word. Mega drought, kind of scary sounding. If you have if you have on the ground reports of anything that we talk about on the show, you want to share them with us, please do. We love your feedback. Feedback at daily tech news show dot com. We also like to shout out patrons that are master and grandmaster levels. And guess what? We have three today. They include Mike McLaughlin, Reed Fischler and Mark Ibsen. Also two new bosses, Seven Nation Army and Brian Bennett just started backing us on Patreon. Welcome. And thanks to our new bosses. Also, thanks to Scott Johnson for being with us today. Scott, what's been going on with you? Well, today we achieved a goal. Thirty days ago, I started a Kickstarter for a very modest little card game that I had written and made and did art for. And it really blew up. And I just wanted to say thanks to everybody in the DTNS crowd who went and supported it. I know there are many names in there that are recognized from the chat rooms from the show. And it means a lot that you guys would go do that and support it. I can't wait to deliver this for you. We're all shooting for June for delivery dates. If you're like, what is this even about? You can go learn all about it at rockrunners.art and learn why we succeeded. And part of it is on the hands of you guys. So I really, really appreciate it. For everything else you're looking for from me, you can find it at frogpants.com. Excellent. There's also a big thanks to Dr. Nicole Ackermans for being with us today, also known as Nicky. Such great information. Thank you so much for sharing. And where can people find out more of your vast wealth of knowledge? Well, maybe you've heard my voice on the Sunday Science Tips supplement at Daily Tech Headlines. I'll be there for a while because I'm interning at DTNS. Otherwise, I'm on Twitter at AckermansNicole and my website. You can just find it by Googling my name. And I have a podcast that's not scientific at all, but still very fun. It's called Stories Your Granny Never Told. And that is dot com and at all the handles on the internet. Yeah, I can't wait for your upcoming granny that's guesting. Scott Jones. It's going to be a very, very young guest. She's having a real geezer on this week. So this coming up, it's a look forward to that. It'll be awesome. Well, we'll be back tomorrow doing Daily Tech News Show again. Reminder, we're live Monday through Friday, 4 30 p.m. Eastern, 20 30 UTC. Find out more at DailyTechNewShow.com slash live and join us live if you can. We'll be back tomorrow with Justin Rubber Young. Talk to you then. I hope you have enjoyed this program.