 All right back here live in Austin for Linux Foundation open source summit. We've got our J frog folks We're back-to-back here. We're gonna be doing a few interviews. I want to introduce you. He's a new frog You tell he's not that green yet. Yeah His name is Peter McKee and and Peter welcome. Thank you. I'm Kind of honored to be breaking you in here on on the texture on devops.com first time Yeah, your first time. I think we've only lost Well, no, we haven't But Peter why don't you introduce yourself to our audience? Yeah, my name is Peter McKee I run the developer advocacy team at J frog hard word to say I should practice it more But yeah, I came from Docker was there for about five years ran the community and DevRel teams there Super excited to come over J frog great people great products. Absolutely It's funny. We were just talking that our last guest was Jeff from IBM And we did like a quick history of Kubernetes and talked about Docker and swarm and all of that stuff No, boy, you know, there was some history there But anyway, you know a lot of people look at this and say yeah dev dev advocacy a Lot of us think that's the new sales people. Yeah, because we don't do sales people We do dev rel and dev advocacy and and your job is to just make sure the software is delivering delight. Yeah Yeah, yeah, I tell people I tell my advocates. I want people to know like and love you Right and else or no, no like and love too. Well, yeah, okay. Okay But yeah, and I think it's one of the best jobs in the world, right you still get to Talk and speak and connect with the community, but you can still also write code contribute to open source Yeah, I think I think nowadays software is eating the world, right and software engineers are the new king makers No, not in my terms. Absolutely Yeah, and is it liquid it better be it should be it will be if we have our way You're gonna be here, man. You got to be saying it will be that's a wheel. Yeah, um, I was just kidding with you But you know when we talk about Jay frog it it's look I will tell you is I started DevOps.com, right? There are a lot of software companies that I'm fond of right who I think do a good job Jay frogs one of in my mind dollar-for-dollar does the best job of balancing being a for-profit company While nourishing a thriving community and if you do it, right you can do both well and be successful at it And I think yeah show me and Fred and yove and the whole team there have are a shining example of it I'm interested to know you coming from Docker Like what do you know about the Jay frog software? What attracted you to this position? You know, it's not that they pay. Yeah, a lot more than everyone else does they do now. I'm just kidding Well, well number one the team is the phenomenal and then we had a factory at Dell I was at Dell many years ago. I think in 0809. We had a factory which was completely a new concept Yeah, and to be honest, right? It took a little bit. Why are we doing it? What do we and until you get it then you get it, right? And I think it was that a combination of the products the people and then their open-source initiative, right of Persia and the in a different cone and and different projects. We're doing like you said I think they have a great pulse on the community. They basically started the DevOps movement, right? It's kind of like Docker started containers movement change how we run our run times and DevOps has changed the way we deliver software Yeah, and I really it's a great stable company that I want to be part of take it to the to the next level, right? Yeah, and so it's interesting. I think of Jay frogs mission Especially as it relates to open source There's there's like two sides of that open source coin one is Jay frog does a really or tries to and I think does do a really good job of Securing open-source software, right? So a lot of the stuff in Artifactory is open Yeah, right and and using x-ray and other tools, you know, they're securing these open-source software At the same time Jay frog also and and I think more recently than in past has been a Progenitor a producer of open-source software, right with some of the projects you just mentioned And we're gonna dive more into them with our next guest even but It's interesting. You don't see a lot of companies that play both sides of that street. Yeah I don't think most companies understand that right they I think they feel if they give away their technology They're they're they're gonna lose right there lose their advantage. Yeah, I think Jay frog going back to the dev advocates too Right, it's give back to the community Make people happy and then when they have a choice, they're gonna come to you right They start to see you as leaders in the industry thought leaders. I hate that term, but it's true, right? And I think Jay frog does a fantastic job about that especially around dev ops and other things is hey We want to help you wherever you're at and if you want to come to us and pay us we'd love that also But we know eventually you'll find the right product and hopefully it's ours, right? But we want you to be successful first Got it. Yeah, I think that's given and it's that open-source mentality to give back to the community, right? Excellent, so, you know, I forgot to hit the star button here, but I'm gonna assume about where we are Let me ask you what maybe seemed like an obvious question, but not what are you doing here at the open source summit? I'm just here to support the community and yeah support our open-source projects. I'm looking over at Steve But yeah, I live here. I'm here in Austin local, so I can't can't miss the conference Oh, yeah, well, yeah, you're here and come down and I call it You know shaking hands and kissing babies and building relationships with folks. Are you? Up on what's going on with this offer a supply chain security and I am but I'm not a security professional So I got to be careful, but I am a developer right and it's interesting You know back in the day We were just talking last night So I worked on Dell comm we were on HTTP Right, I've written software where you log in you're passing the the password and the username in the URL unencrypted, right? That's and I did yeah, yeah It's in so I think developers we caused a lot of this for you know trust first kind of approach And now we're all now we're all need to go back and fix it. So I love the shift left because I Think we caused a lot of it the developers and we need to be an integral part of fixing it Right. Yeah, but you know something I've so so I was never a developer I come from security I'll make a confession. I used to think developers didn't give a crap about security now. We're getting into the conversation Yeah And so I used to think that we'll never have good secure software because developers don't give a crap about security But since my time in DevOps the last eight years, whatever Nine years I've come to the realization that no one raises their hand and says I want to deliver insecure software Right, or I can't wait to develop some software. That's full of holes Right, everyone has pride in their orphanage of you know ownership of what they do. Yeah It's just a question of what your priorities are and what the state of the art is yeah, you know You talk about passing stuff in in the URL, you know change That was the state of the art then yeah people weren't thinking about Wow, man in the middle of tax. How do I jump that you know know all of these things and in IE not to cut Sorry, no, no, just think about the Internet Explorer, right when you used to download the demise the Internet Explorer They should have blown that thing out. But yeah, and yeah, well down something just automatically execute it because it's good for the end user That was great for my parents, you know, 30 years ago when they weren't computer people Now it's horrible right and we again set ourselves up for it. But yeah, I agree. I think the honestly I didn't give to pennies about security when I was you know 15 years ago frontline developer I was worried about hitting my features and my deadlines and then then the security then you folks will walk in We're going to production the day of the launch, you know, go. No, you're not wait a minute We didn't do all the security stuff compliance issues here. Yeah, and you want to go to jail. Yeah Yeah, it was one of those guys and it was an adversarial type of very much roles, right? And yeah, now I think that's starting to blend and we do software differently to your point. We have well I think that's been the yeah, so that's you know When we look at what's going on at this show and it's a little quiet now because it's later in the day But look every person we're talking to is talking about software supply chain security in the OSSF and and all of these things In my mind none of that's possible without what DevOps is done to change the way Yeah, we built software we went from people like you just sitting on coding Like building what we call let's get called bespoke software right custom written software for a given Project to a factory to an assembly line to a pipeline Right where we we just add in third-party parts like we're building a car Yeah, right Deming and and and all of that, you know, we night and lean manufacturing if you didn't have all of that You wouldn't have an open SSF you wouldn't have You didn't have a software supply chain. So what do you got worry about so white chain security? Yeah, no, it was me. It was me launching into production and then fixing it well into production I was selling security back then and you know We had a vulnerability management tool that I was trying to convince people That you should scan your infrastructure once a year once a year And it was a hard fire. It was a hard. It was a hard sell. Yeah dad You know because they just thought it was a bad news generator. They didn't want to know about it. Yeah until Yeah, until crap hit the fan then they wanted to know about it, but You know, it I really you know, I blame DevOps. Yeah, and I I think it's a good thing Yeah, it accelerated it made things easier and then it just then it exposed. Oh, wait a minute We got to get better at plugging holes attacking security. But yeah On some sense software engineering's come easier, but then on the other sense, it's become way way more complex Well, I think this was straws on the developers back today. Yeah, yeah, right this morning production code code the cloud, right? Yeah, no, it's it's a big name We haven't even look you're gonna start seeing edge stuff come in and then all this other stuff Let me ask you another question. How long you with JFrog? What about eight weeks now? Okay? What is if I'm talking to you six months from now, what does success look like for beyond saying? Oh the company sold more software or something that's obvious But yeah, what is success for you personally look for for me personally right now is to have our free product Everybody using Artifactory go try it out get a free trial use it understand what why you should use it and Bring that into your DevOps practices it right try it out and eventually you're gonna love us You're like us and you're gonna come purchase But just use the software as you do now if if I can help get more people to know like and love our products Get to use them and maybe not in pay yet The sales folks will take care of that down their own right but if we have really good technology and people are using them They're gonna stick around and pay right and so I think my team's job is to show people that right So if we can do that and I can help raise the weekly users of our free tier Success from that's what it's like one of that. Yeah, it's one of the key things After eight weeks biggest difference between the culture of JFrog and and I'm not asking a bad man But differences between JFrog and darker be friendly to everyone. Yeah, I mean I mean Dockers a phenomenal company right phenomenal people. I didn't stay there as long as I did I mean the technology was incredible, but yeah, the folks were wonderful. I mean smart Empathetic people and I found the same at JFrog Probably even more so J-Frog folks are awesome. Yeah, I mean that culture they care about their people truly care about their people Not only, you know, are you productive and happy, but are you happy? Then you will be productive, right? It's it's a subtle difference, but I think it's key, right? Yeah, everybody I've met at the company is fantastic. Cool, man Yeah, all right. Peter was a pleasure meeting you. That's the block with JFrog man. You're with some good people Yeah, thank you appreciate it. We're gonna come to have you come back in six months and tell you So you did see if I hit my KPS You know, whatever makes whatever makes you happy or show me one or the other Um, all right. Thank you so much new developer advocate here at JFrog