 Okay. All right. So up until now, we've looked at the foundations of building a foundation, a biblical foundation towards matters. So the last couple of chapters that we've done was just building that foundation, just laying, you know, doing the spade work, laying all what was necessary for us to understand. Now we're going to be looking at specific elements of what really makes a good marriage. And also, so the next couple of chapters are going to be a lot practical, yet we're going to look back at the word to, to understand these practical ways of dealing in marriage with the biblical principles. So we're going to start our first element for a good marriage is communication. Okay. So I'd like to understand probably from, from maybe some of you. What do you think communication enhances in a marriage? Why is it important? And why should we strive to ensure that we work on communication? Because it doesn't come easy. And I'm sure we've all been there. We've known that it doesn't come easy. So why do you think it's important to focus on communication? Yeah, there are a couple of remarks or, you know, thoughts from you all would be helpful. Yes. Yes, Anita, go ahead. Mom, when we love anybody that time, we want to know them more, like what is their preferences? What is their likes dislikes? Unless and until we know that we cannot make that effort, because as a person, we have different likings. When we want to give, we want to show love, we keep reference to their likings. That's how we can show that we are striving to become one. Okay. So communication helps in a greater understanding so that you can express and understand the other. Thank you. Thank you, Anita. Yes, Samuel, thank you, raised your hand too. Yeah. So I think communication is to a certain extent almost everything that helps in stabilizing a marriage. So one is, like Anita was saying, preferences likes dislikes, but also I think resolving conflicts. And like a lot of what we're talking about, you know, if I'm and I'm taking both aspects of communication, which is speaking as well as listening. And unless there is not enough of speaking and listening happened, then there's I think a lot of space or distance created between the couple, which makes the marriage very vulnerable. Right. Thank you. Thank you, Samuel. Yeah. So I think, you know, an important observation to make is that, you know, we're looking at, let's say when two people come together, you're looking at the kind of styles, communication styles that they've been used to in the early years of their lives, let's say 25, 26 years of their lives. They're used to a way of communication in their homes, the way things are spoken about, you know, do emotional experiences get talked about, our conflicts resolved, our appreciations given, you know, is there is there a chance for members of the family to express what they feel or what they are or all of that. So you can see that the it's it's very different, very dynamic in every setting. And two people coming from different settings definitely brings about its own challenges. So and learning that art of communication in itself takes time, takes effort, takes intention. So, you know, I don't know how many of us have been here that, you know, we've been right from day one of our marriage, we've been able to completely communicate well by being understood and also helping the other one understand us. We mean, a lot of us may have come through that journey of, you know, finding a way of changing our styles of communication, the way that we express and what we should be doing. So this is definitely one area very important and very essential in building that that strong marriage. Okay. So when we look at, you know, levels of communication, we probably can see different levels of communication. So the initial, the understanding or the main aim when you are communicating to someone is that they understand you and you also feel understood. Those are the main aims of communication. But nevertheless, there are different levels of it. Like the first one would probably be those casual ones, you know, you casually communicate with people, but many people in a day, it could be, you know, someone you just see on the street, you're going for a walk and you see the person every day and there's a quick hey, hey, how are you doing? How is your morning or good morning? And that's it. That conversation ends there. It's extremely casual, right? Or maybe you are, you know, you're getting into into a public transport, you see somebody there, something falls down, you pick it up and say, hey, thank you, thank you so much. That's it. That's all. It's a very, very casual communication. The next level could be the professional one. The professional communication is where there are a lot of ideas and facts and data that is, that is communicated apart from beyond that, there isn't any anything else. It's generally used in your office space. It's used in a professional setting where, you know, with that information, you make a decision or you work together as a team. So that becomes a professional communication. The third level of communication is friendship. It goes up a notch higher where you are, you're not just communicating facts or not just communicating maybe events, but it's, there are other things that are added to it. There are emotions, there are thoughts, there are ideas that are being expressed. There are feelings that are being expressed. So that moves in to the next level. And usually this kind of communication is usually seen among friendships, among people who are good friends. There is some sense of freedom to really share things that's going on in life and coming to a place of supporting and encouragement. The level that we are seeking for in marriage is the intimate level of communication. And what do we seek here? It's not just facts, it's not just feelings, but it's also a place of vulnerability and trust where you bear everything about yourself knowing that what, where you have placed it is within a committed relationship, in a relationship where you can trust that the other person will preserve what has been shared with them. So this, this kind of an intimate communication is where you know, you share of who you are, what you feel, what you think of, what you hope for, what you dream of, what you're going through, what's been biggest challenges. So that is the best place, the intimate level of communication is the best place for a husband and wife to experience. Okay. We often do see that a lot of times, you know, many, maybe there are a lot of couples who are still at the professional level, you know, just being able to share facts and ideas in the sense of, okay, the children need to go to school, the children need this, you know, the house needs that, the parents need this and it remains at that. Okay. So typically, we see that there's distance in the, in the relationship because there is no sharing of ideas or feelings or thoughts. It's not, they don't find it is a safe place to, to communicate in that, in that area. Okay. We need to, and this, like we said, is something that is intentional. These kind of communication, building an intimate level of communication comes only with intention and comes with practice and comes with time, comes with those trials and trial and errors. Okay. Now, there are three specific factors that we look for when we are talking about a healthy communication or an intimate level of communication, three specific factors, which is time, which is trust and transparency. So as, you know, even as Agni brought up the question in the last class about, about attention, attention is equivalent to time. So setting aside specific parts of your day in order to connect together and this can happen over any point. It can happen over, you know, just a morning walk or it can happen over a cup of tea or it can happen over breakfast, but some place where there is set aside time to, to talk. Okay. And of course, it needs to be at those times when both seem to have the energy to have a meaningful conversation. So something that we really struggled with, with our initial years of marriage was, I'm a morning person and my husband's a night person. So, and my husband gets quite chatty in the night and it would, it would, you know, he would be very offended because it would be lullaby to me and I would often, often, often go back to go to sleep, not go back to sleep, but go to sleep, you know, just to wake up in, in between knowing that he stopped the conversation and, you know, you kind of say, I was listening. He said, no, I know you weren't listening. You've gone off halfway asleep. And this, this became a challenge for us, you know, but, you know, through, through understanding living together, we figured, okay, that this morning time, night times don't work for conversations. It was more of a challenge to keep set aside time. So this had to be done intentionally. It needs to be structured. There needs to be a place where you can accommodate those changes. So ensuring that, you know, having that time, it can, it can, it can be on a regular basis. It can be smaller periods and over extended periods. It can be, you know, longer points of time where it could be either weekends or, you know, certain vacations, but taking that priority, giving communication that time is essentially important. The next that we look at is trust. Now trust is something that we not only give, but also need to be earned. So what do we mean by trust in communication? Is that confidence and that assurance that whatever you share or whatever you bear out is, is not just kept preserved confidential, but also not bought back at a def not thrown back at a difficult point of time of a conflict, you know, the assurance that you will not use some information against them at a time of a disagreement. So that's how you earn trust. You also give trust by not doing the same. You earn and give trust by ensuring that, you know, especially when you're giving a word, scripture says, let your yes be yes and your no be no. So when you're giving a word, ensuring that it's backed up with an action. Because when it isn't, there is, there is a huge vacuum that comes by and that there can be a refusal or not a refusal, a fear to trust. Okay. So just being able to one to preserve, to protect information that is being shared to be to to have the confidence that whatever is being shared will be kept. The second is not throwing back vulnerable information that someone gives you towards them. Like I can give you certain examples. Let's say, you know, in in an honest communication, maybe one of the spouses does say, you know, there were periods of time that I, I truly found it hard to trust you or to love you. Right. And at a later point of time, maybe when there is a conflict, this can be bought up, you know, by the other spouse, anyway, you don't trust and you don't love me. So what's the point? Right. So that becomes like a breach, you know, that's, and when the person has actually opened up that that place of being vulnerable to you, it is taken with the understanding that the desire to build that intimacy and as a result have shared that very personal or vulnerable information and you preserve that by not throwing it back to them. So trust is a very important area within communication. The third, of course, is transparency. Transparency is being is knowing that that you can share your most deepest thoughts and whatever it may be without, without feeling a sense of judgment or a sense of condemnation or a sense of scrutiny or criticism. So just saying that, you know, just I know I can be transparent because I know it will not be seen as something that is, that is, that shouldn't be shared. So transparency definitely takes, it's not, it doesn't come all of a sudden, it comes through practice, it comes through mutual understanding that whatever is being shared is being preserved and taken and accepted. Okay, so that definitely takes time to build. So three things, time, trust and transparency are specific elements for basic communication. Quickly, we're going to just look at what are, why, why is communication important? And I think some of you did mention a few of these pointers, but to just look at what, what does communication actually have to do? One, yes, communication helps to, to know and understand each other. Christopher, sorry, you had a question, Christopher, do you want to, you want to bring that up? Yes, Christopher, go ahead. Yes, I had a question on transparency. So I think my view is that, you know, it's easier for, you know, women to be more transparent and, you know, men usually are, you know, withhold or keep things closer, you know, to their, to their chest. My question is more about, you know, in a, in a, in a long-term relationship between, you know, I mean, in a marriage where the transparency, you know, may be, may not always be completely, I mean, total transparency may not be possible. And I mean, I think, you know, if you were to put on your, you know, counseling hat, you know, versus, you know, the, the sort of the spiritual, in a spiritual hat, there is a view that, you know, total transparency or there, or there's a view that, you know, there are some things that perhaps it's better not to discuss, you know, things, maybe in the past, things that, you know, that could come in the way of, of, you know, the understanding that, that a spouse may, I mean, the inability of, you know, understanding, you know, what has happened in the past. So just not even bring that up. So just wanted to get your view on that. Okay. So I want to bring it with a context of, okay, so I'm just going to speak of this in context of, let's say, a premarital, a couple who's yet to be married. Right. So something that, that I personally recommend is that, you know, in your initial years or months of courtship to be transparent about things of your past. The reason being, now, so, so there, there have been a lot of, you know, questions I have received on that. But I, I feel, I mean, now this again, it's through a practical aspect of, let's say, sharing some things of the past with the person you are to marry, definitely puts you at a place of freedom. Because let's say way into marriage, through some form, through some means, the past has been brought up or has been revealed or concealed or brought up or, you know, found out, there can tend to be a breach of trust there. So to avoid that, I personally think you walk into marriage with a clean slate of having shared whatever important necessary information without really getting into too many details of, you know, of a specific incident of whatever is, needs to be known. When it is shared, there is a lot more freedom in knowing that you have been true and right in your expressions of what has been in your past. So that's what I personally believe in. And that's something that I have seen that in, especially in premarital work when we do that. And there are couples who actually bring about certain issues of their past. Some of them have taken it well. Some of them have not taken it well. But it has helped them to, that has given, helped them to decide on whether they would like to pursue that relationship. Okay. And I think it's fair. It's a sense of respect that you're allowing the person to make that choice knowing whatever has been, you know, those skeletons of your past. So you're giving them that choice to make that decision. So that's what I would say in a premarital, let's say work or a progress as we're working through a premarital couple. Now, for a married couple, I would, I would specifically again say, you know, there are, there are things in out in the open, definitely can be painful and can, can be bought, can be taken in a way that's, that's, that's probably, you know, very hard or there can be serious hardships. In fact, I am dealing with a couple right now, who's, of course, they're not, they're not a believing family, but the husband, you know, had an extra marital affair 10 years back and he has been carrying the guilt and the burden of it for 10 years. And he felt it was time to confess to the wife. He did so. And everything broke loose. I mean, things have really, really gone very sour. She has been traumatized has been taken, it's been taken really badly. And to rebuild it definitely takes that time, takes that, you know, it's, it's a lot of pain. It's a lot of hardships. Yet when it, when you, when you look at the man in question over here, that's something I believe he was convicted to do. Right. And as a result, having done so, he, he feels that, you know, he's done his part of feeling free. However, it has bought about a serious range of repercussions for him. Yet he feels that that was one of the best things that he did because it's begun to re-change, to rework, to revamp the relationship now. So what has been missing over the last 10 years has come out in the open. I mean, you know, some of us may ask, why did he even go there? But I believe that was a conviction that he had. So in situations, and I think this, we may not be able to generalize in every, in every way, you know, it really depends on how the spouse may take such, you know, such confessions, it may depend on how, you know, it reconciliation could happen. But if, if that's something that, you know, as a believer, as a believer, if you feel that is, that you're convicted to seek the forgiveness of one, maybe without needing to give too many details, but being able to, to settle that, I think that's something that, that, that you should be able to do. Right. So again, there is no general rule. I think it depends a lot on the people involved, the kind of relationship that the, that the, that the partners did share in the marriage. All of that really, you know, may decide the outcome of how things may go in future. So those are my thoughts, Christopher. Would you have a follow up question or would anyone like to pitch in anything? So I, no, I understand the, you know, the scenario you had mentioned about, you know, an extramarital affair. I'm, I'm, I'm talking about also about, you know, the past that is before marriage and after marriage and, you know, areas where, you know, we, we kind of, you know, look at it from a point of view as a couple that, you know, the past is the past. What, you know, what, what, what has been, what, what each one has, has done or, you know, not done, for example, is, is the past. And some, some can be shared, some can be, you know, just, you know, kept, you know, not, I mean, not, not shared. Because the individual feels that, you know, it's, it's, it will not help, you know, to, you know, moving forward. It'll make more of a, you know, just, you know, it'll be a sore, or, you know, a wound which will just make, which may not heal. So just taking that, you know, taking that as a sort of example, like, sorry, I mean, maybe you can just provide some, your view. Yes. So if, if there is a view that it, it doesn't, by, by giving the information, it doesn't help the marriage in any way. If it isn't going to, then, you know, it's important that you settle it with the Lord, or, you know, get any form of help that you may need, personal, pastoral, counseling help that you may need to settle that. But if you feel it will not work or help within the marriage, but, you know, or probably cause a lot more of strife, then maybe a visor choice to, to not bring it up at all. Yeah, I, I'd be with you in that, Christopher. Okay, thank you. Right, yeah. Okay, so we're going to, we're moving on to, to just see what, what exactly does communication do and why is it important for a strong marriage is one like, like Anita specifically bought about one of the benefits is that you know and understand each other and that can happen only if you communicate. It, it happens only if you ask those questions, you know, what would you like? What are you thinking? What are you feeling? How do you think about such and such a situation? What do you think about this concept? What do you think about this principle? So that happens only when you communicate and it is by asking questions. So one of the things that, you know, I think I do find, you know, we find in, in our own marriages is that we think that it's, you know, information should be forthcoming. But I would challenge each one of you is, you know, write down some questions and ask, you know, what is your favorite color or what, you know, if you were to go for a holiday, where would you like to go? Why would you do it? Or, you know, if you ask just it's actually fun to bring up, you know, certain questions and, and just ask because you get to have a feel about what the other person is and what they're thinking. Okay, what are your aspirations? If you were, you know, if you weren't whatever an IT professional, what would you have been instead? What do you think you could have been instead? You know, what is it that you speak to God in your, in your most difficult moments? You know, so just ask, asking really helps to understand. Okay, communication also, one of the benefits is, is that when you communicate and understand each other, you are able to work together as a team. You're able to do things together as a team. Like, you know, simple things like what meal are you going to make? I mean, these are just very, very simple examples, right? But, but let's say maybe it's, it's the children, something to do with the children or it's some ideas that you have for the children or for a holiday. So you, you talk together, discuss that and you work together as a team to ensure that you get that done. Okay, communication also helps to strengthen and support and encourage each other. So there are like, like it's written in Ecclesiastas, you know, when one falls, the other helps to pick the other up. So communication is just encouraging, supporting, hey, I'm with you. I'm there to pray for you. I'm there to support you. You know, I'm sure you can do this. I know this must be tough on you, but then I'm praying for you. I'm backing you up. And the more that you verbalize it, the more that you articulate it, it helps to build that encouragement and support. The next thing that it does is, it helps to resolve those conflicts. There are going to be differences in ideas or differences in the way that you decide, but conflicts can be resolved only through communication, by actually working out what are some of those differences and finding answers to this, brainstorming together, coming together to evaluate what went wrong, what are meaningful ways that situations can be dealt with. And all of this happens only when you resolve conflicts through communication being a medium. The next is, yes, growing spiritually together, sharing your journey spiritually, sharing about your faith, what you have learned, how the Lord speaks to you, what kind of knowledge you're attaining, where you are spiritually, maybe in a dry part of your spiritual journey. So there can be encouragement or there can be prayer or support that comes in. Maybe you just speak a verse over them. So that helps the two of you to grow together spiritually. It also helps to protect your marriage. Communication is one way in ensuring that there is unity and there is closeness and that the focus is on other. Often what happens within how generally marriage is drift away is because there is a concealing of emotions or there is a concealing of what you are going through. But the more that you share your experiences or your thoughts about yourself, about each other, about what you're seeing around, you've got someone who, you know, someone like a support that you have, someone who's like, I'm trying to get the right word, a sounding board, a sounding board for whatever you're going through. So it helps to guard the marriage. It also helps to bring up children, to nurture the children. When parents do come together, parents do work together as when they communicate, it definitely impacts their parenting, impacts what is being taught to the children, how they are to be disciplined, how they're to be loved, how they are to be cherished and nurtured. So communication, a good part of communication is about helping the children and bringing them up as well. And lastly, of course, communication helps in bringing memories and keeping, you know, going back in time to reflect about things that you've enjoyed together, going back to those moments, reliving those moments that have, you know, that were good times or things that work together or even situations that have been difficult, just expressing how, you know, looking back as to how things have worked out. So this is what communication specifically does and that's how the benefit of it comes by. Any questions here before we just move into some facts, elements of communication, we're just going to be looking at one of them today and we will take on the other next week. Any questions before we move on? You'll have been awfully quiet today. We're supposed to be communicating. Can I share some thoughts past? Yes, yes, yes, go ahead, sir. From what I have experienced as one is it's quite complex in the whole area of communication. I feel it's complex because, you know, I mean, I think it's a combination of so many factors, the way we've brought up our own personality. Like some of us are very direct. Some of us beat around the bush. Some of us take a long time to actually articulate and some of us just expect. For some of us, you know, there's always a chatter in our minds that needs to come out. And for some of us, there's just silence. So I don't know if there is like one, I mean, I understand and I totally agree with the more we communicate, the stronger relationships especially in the case of husband and wife. It becomes a foundation and communication helps to build a strong foundation on which the matter stands. But again, I think, I don't know, could it be like what Christopher was saying earlier, like better at holding things close to chest or something along the lines? I mean, I do feel like women, the way women resolve conflict, I don't know if there is gender bias, but most women I think like to resolve conflicts by talking it out, sharing it with everyone, friends. Whereas men, they like to internalize it, churn it inside, keep percolating it and then, you know, somehow come to a conclusion that talking it out is probably for some of us as a personal preference, like the last thing that we wanted to, we just want to, you know, just I think the pressure of, you know, we need to communicate that that pressure of like when at least one person is not able, like it's not one of the strong suits, like for me to communicate and for me, not to communicate and internalize is a more preferred or a natural option. But then, you know, there is a need, like everyone, like the wife is saying, like, you don't tell me things, you know, you need to communicate or, you know, you go to a counselor or most people suggest you need to communicate. And I don't know if there is a harm in that, like the textual pressure of I need to communicate. And I didn't mean to pose it as a question, just sharing random thoughts, but came out as a question. Yeah, you're right. You're, I think you've, you've hit that saying, yes, it is very complex. It's not as easy as, you know, we say, listen, express, speak, and it'll be fine. No. However, I think in whatever, whatever way, whatever limited way that we can, we ensure that we do it. Even if it is complex, even if it is hard, we still make attempts to do it. So it, it can, it can cause issues, but some communication is better than no communication at all. So the more that you do it, the more that understanding comes about. And this is something that doesn't get attained by, you know, I think you can continue learning to communicate for years and years and years. I mean, I have parents who, who's 83 and 80. Okay. They're still learning to communicate. And there are times they feel offended at the way one communicates at the other. But, and, but, but I'd say all, all because we come to, you know, a knotted place or, or a standstill, we shouldn't stop there. We keep learning, we keep growing in those areas of communication. The more that I think, now, now going back to what Christopher said about, you know, women probably being a lot more verbose, more articulate in the way that they share and men be tending to hold back and, you know, and keep away. Now this works like, you know, like a lock and key. And the more that a couple is able to understand that, you know, the more that I nag as a wife, the more that he's going to shut down. Okay. But the more that I give him that free space, maybe the more that he will open up, or understanding the more that he opens up, you know, I encourage and give him the space to talk, appreciate that he's bought up those things, you know, respect what he's bought. So I think it works like a lock and key. Every time you turn, turn the key, you know, the lock opens. And every time you lock it, you have someone else helping you open it. So it works. It's a circular communication, I'd say, is very circular in itself. You have to provide a space to, to allow the other person to be, you know, wrong in the way that they communicate, till they probably get right to it. So I think that's how I see it. Yes, it is complex, but nevertheless, keep doing it is, I think is the, is the, is the answer that I, that I may have. Okay. All right. Thank you. Thank you. Okay, so we'll quickly go on to the, to one of the in communication, the really important part of communication, of course, is listening. Okay, be attentive in your listening. And, you know, you have structure that talks of, there's another question. Was that a question or did somebody, Christopher? Yes, yes, Christopher, go ahead. No, actually, I was just going to mention about nonverbal communication. And, you know, as I was, as I was thinking about it, you mentioned about listening. And I think that is definitely a form of nonverbal communication. And that, you know, so that's why I put up my hand. I was actually going to take it, take it back. The reason is that, obviously, listening is a nonverbal communication is a form of nonverbal communication. And it's all, there's also, you know, just being able to, you know, be in a, in a, in the right sort of, you know, mode of, you know, of listening or being attentive, you know, to, to your spouse, I think is, is, is important. And it's just, you know, you know, just makes it a much more easier way of being able to, you know, to, to get along with each other. So for example, both could be non, I mean, the communication could be both nonverbal in the sense that, you know, if, if husband and wife are cooking in a kitchen, and they're not cooking in the kitchen and they're not talking at all, but still being able to, you know, be attentive to each other, you know, be aware that, you know, there may be something that, some way that one could help, help the other while they are, while they are doing the, doing the work. It's, it is a form of nonverbal communication. And it makes, it definitely makes a difference. And I've seen that in the case of, in my own personal experience. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you, Christopher. Yeah. So listening, yes, it expresses that you are there, that, you know, you are paying attention, you are present, you're expressing, and I think there are very many ways that you express that, you know, even through your body language, that that's what nonverbal communication is when you're actually paying attention to someone, it's, you know, looking at them, engaging an eye contact, it's probably leaning forward, it's showing your interest rather than, you know, sitting back with your hands up and with your legs up. It does express some form of a, your, your nonverbal posture, definitely express that you are attentive, you know, keeping aside any form of a distraction, or any work that you're doing, leaving it aside and paying attention, definitely shows that you are there, you are interested, and you would like to engage in that meaningful conversation. So I think scripture also mentions, you know, brings about that principle of being, being quick to listen, but slow to speak, right? So, you know, that you have that cliched thing that says you have, that's why you have two years in one mouth, no, so more to listen and less to say. So just being there to pay attention and, and to listen. So what would this active listening be like? Active listening is, I think in our conversation, maybe certain principles that we can pick up is, you know, when we're communicating with each other, what we often tend to do is when someone is speaking, we are looking for answers to respond. We want to ensure that we are going to say something before we can actually openly absorb and listen. So we lose patience half the way, and we tend to either interrupt, or we tend to pick on, we have something called a selective listening, we pick on something in that entire 15 sentences of one word that's been said, pick on that and, and get on to that, but not look at it as a whole, look at it as something that's come as, come in as a package. Okay, so active listening is one where you can, you know, it would be nice if you could just shut off the thinking part of us to respond and just be in a place of just listening, just, just bearing our hearts out to them so that they can, that we can listen. Why is this important is, you know, and I'm sure for those of you who've really had a chance to open up with somebody and Sharon, who's really listened, you begin to see that the more that you're able to express and talk without any form of a judgment or interruption from the other, other person, you begin to feel so much lighter about your challenge or your issue, and you also begin to find ways of dealing with your issue without the person having to, having said anything. Right, so just being able to listen goes a long way in helping the other person sort out the chaos that is going on in their heads. So husbands, when your wives come to you and talk to you, you know, he talked, John Gray talks about putting on the, the fix, the Mr. Fixit, right, the Mr. Fixit is whenever she comes to you and tells you something, you're looking through your dictionary or your manual and saying, okay, how do I fix this? What, what should I do? You know, I must say this, I must say this, tell her this is what she should do. This is what the, the best advice that you can have is don't say anything, just listen. And in fact, you know, if you do give her an advice, she will, she'll get very upset with you. She said, you don't care. You don't, you don't even listen when you've actually been listening all the while. And then you give her a solution. She'll, she'll be really upset at you, right? But the, the, the understanding is when you're listening, you're only listening. You're not, you know, formulating a response on what you should be saying. However, you need to be responsive. Something, okay, so what do we mean by being responsive? And I, and I want to take it in two ways. Being responsive can one be showing your, you know, you're, you're actually showing that you're listening. That is maybe you nod your head or you, you know, you are agreeing, you say, mm-hmm, or, or, oh, really, you know, that, that is one way of being responsive. Another way of being responsive is actually providing a feedback. So saying something like, you know, this is what I heard you say. You said that you said this, you're giving them the content. Okay. This is what you've said. You know, that, that my mom said this about you and they all came in together and, and you know, did this, whatever, whatever the situation. And I, and I hear that you're feeling quite upset and angry at what my mom did. And is that right? Did I hear you right? So being responsive also means you have heard enough to paraphrase and give back and say, this is what I heard you saying, is that right? That's what responsive means. Where in your, actually you haven't shut off, but you've taken the gist of what you've heard, put it in as best as two, three sentences and bring it back and say, this is what I heard you saying, is that what you were trying to communicate to me, right? Rather than finding an answer, formulating an answer so that you can, you know, you can give it your best shot or you can defend all of that. But listening means you get the content, you pick up maybe a feeling in it and you feed, give it as a feedback. Okay. And that really helps in the other person to you know, either give you clarity that yes, that's exactly what I was trying to say or say, hey, you've missed the mark totally. That's not what I was trying to say. I was trying to say this. And that really helps in, in getting you all understand the process of communication. So listening means all of this, paying attention, you know, giving that undivided attention, being open to listen without actually jumping into a conclusion or defending it or trying to find a solution to it, being patient to listen through the entire thing, being responsive in the way that you physically express yourself, maybe some kind of verbal encourages that you give, also being able to pick up a certain feeling and being able to give it as a feedback. Now, these are all ways that you can listen. I mean, we're talking about a topic that we can speak ours for in 10 minutes. But nevertheless, it's something that we all can learn to do. And in any one of our relationships to be at a place of being sensitive, to being patient, being open, being willing to listen without coming up with our own judgment or our own conclusions. Okay. On page 75, there is, you know, a small questionnaire on listening, on how, on different aspects of listening and how well you listen. Maybe, you know, you could just take that test yourself to really figure out, how do you pair as a listener? And if you're married, probably talk to your husband or your wife to find out what kind of a listener you are and how good a listener you are. So these are some aspects that we've covered today. I think main takeaways for today's lesson is one, yes, communication is complex, it's hard. Nevertheless, you know, it's just like going to the gym is hard. Nevertheless, you got to do it, right? It hurts. You know, the lesser you do it, the more flabby are your muscles are going to be. So the lesser you communicate, the lesser skilled you're going to be. So continue doing it, even if there are mistakes, even if there are sprains and strains, go about doing it. Pick up these skills of how maybe just for today we've said about listening, how can I, can I listen and how can I be intentional in the way that I listen? How can I put myself second or put myself apart and allow the other person to really share, all right? Okay, I think we are good for today. Anybody else has, anyone has a comment or a, you know, question or anything, a sharing anything that you would like to, if not, we can close today's session. Yes, Anita, go ahead. Ma'am, I just wanted to complete my testimony. Actually, I did not give glory to God that day. What happened is that time, my daughter, it is last, it is before in 2019 till then, my daughter, she was suffering with wheezing and every month at almost twice she was getting admitted. And in all of this, we did not have a good marriage and it was the things were really haywire. It was so much of stress and all of this. I was going through heartache and so much of like, you know, that strong horse in the mind, like, then, but I was just praying and crying to God. And it happened that I went to Mumbai in 2019. I went into one church service. The pastor had prophesied over me. He said that all of your heartache and all pain has been taken away. And I said, it's not, it's there. How is that? The pastor is saying, but over the period of time, it took almost three, four months, it's totally gone, all that, if there was peace in my heart, like, his words would not trick me anymore like that. And the second thing is that my sister, she had a dream where she saw me crying to God for my marriage. And then she saw that pastor was there. He kissed my forehead and he said that you're going to have a blessed marriage. All that happened. And it was her dream. She told me that dream and till then, the things were not so good like that. But from the time lockdown started, my husband started working from home. My daughter miraculously, she came out of the two years of wheezing, totally no wheezing at all. And then because my husband was working from home, we started communicating and all that. Then I could see that whatever dream she had, everything was fulfilled. And I wanted to give glory to God, then whatever we are praying, how much ever things look like that they cannot happen, the things are very impossible in marriage also. But when we are communicating, God is listening. And he has his ways, his time, when at the spur of time, everything changes. That's what I just wanted to testify. Thank you, Anita. Thank you so much. Thank you. Yeah. Thank you for sharing that. I'm sure it, you know, it encourages those of us who may be struggling to keep, to keep in hope, in the living hope that God has called us for, that all things will work together for his good. Thank you. Thank you for sharing, Anita. All right. I think we'll close. Could I, can I have someone pray? Maybe I'll, Salome, can we, would you like to please pray? Salome? Yes, yes, yes. Okay. Shia, thank you. Thank you, Jesus. Thank you, Lord. Thank you, God, for all I have done, Father. Thanks for the teaching that you've given to me, Father. So I pray, Lord, I hope to God, Jesus, that we could take forward this teaching of Father, that we could learn, Lord, Father, when we're deeper, closer to you, Father. And it's telling your Lord, ask for me in my house, if you're just close to God, that I pray, Father, God, to be as a family, to be as together, come together, and worship your Father. Thank you for all that you've done. Thank you, God, for the blessing of Father, that you've been teaching us so very, for the blessing of God, Jesus. Thank you for all that you've done. Amen. Amen. Thank you. Thank you, Salome. Thank you all. Have a blessed week ahead. Thank you. Bye-bye. Thank you, ma'am. Thank you. Bye, ma'am. Bye-bye.