 Hi, and welcome to Bright Minds from Tick Mill. I'm your host, Patrick Munnily, and in this series we're setting out to answer some of the most commonly asked questions around investment and trading through entertaining and insightful conversations with seasoned insiders. With the constant motion of markets, high stakes, uncertainty, and risk all at the centre of our trading lives, it's no wonder that Business Insider named being a trader the second most stressful job on Wall Street, with 75% of traders quitting within a year. Research shows that elevated stress levels can impede performance on tasks that require divided attention, working memory, retrieval of information from memory, and decision-making. When you take all these findings into account, it's clear that seeking out ways to manage stress should be a top priority for any trader. We know that mindset is one of the most important factors that affect successful outcomes when trading, and over the past 40 years, researchers have found that regular mindfulness meditation practice can reduce stress and anxiety, aid focus, and attention and increase self-awareness, resulting in the reduction of negative thoughts and biases. The American Psychological Association also recognises clinical hypnotherapy as a way to alleviate symptoms of stress and anxiety, and as a way to modify problematic behaviour patterns. For anyone serious about increasing their chances of success in trading, these findings can't be ignored. Our guest today, Louise Nonwheeler. Louise is a multi-award-winning clinical hypnotherapist, the founder of Hypnosis for Traders, and the creator of the Trading Mindset programme. She is also the co-founder and co-host of Trading in the Zen and the Trading Mindset podcast. We'll be discussing how our trading lives might benefit from hypnotherapy regular meditation practice. We'll also talk about the many benefits of cultivating your trading mindset, as well as practical tips on how to start your own meditation practice. Louise, thanks so much for taking the time to join us today. Could you get things started by telling us a bit more about your career so far, and why you're particularly interested in the world of trading? So I guess trading has always been in my life from a very young age. I come from a family of successful traders. I traded Forex for many years, and then I eventually ventured into working with traders on their psychology. So I've been working with traders for a decade now. The main therapy that I use is hypnosis, hypnotherapy, because that's where the results, the fastest and the most profound results are. So it's a very rewarding career. I really enjoy it, and it's just over the years, just grown and grown. Excellent. Could you describe for us the process of hypnotherapy and how it can, in real terms, benefit traders? So hypnosis is safe, it's relaxing, and it basically works with the subconscious mind. So our subconscious mind is where we have our beliefs, behaviors, habits, and more. So it's very powerful, and hypnosis is simply guiding a person into a very relaxed state, just by guiding, using the sound of my voice. And it's about really reframing, changing, eliminating certain patterns and behaviors, and so forth. So with hypnosis, there is kind of a misconception that a hypnotherapist is going to take over the patient or the client's mind. It's absolutely not true. It's quite the opposite. Hypnosis is a heightened state of awareness. So we're actually more in control because we're more relaxed. So hypnosis, the changes can be fast, powerful. It's a number one therapy for stopping smoking in the UK. It's a number one therapy for stopping or reducing symptoms of IBS. So, yeah. Excellent. And typically, how long do these sessions last for? And how many sessions are normally required if there is a norm or an average? Obviously, coming from a trading mindset, I'm always looking at that. How does that process actually work? That's a good question. Everybody's different, and it depends on how deep-rooted certain habits and behaviors are. You know, I work a lot with beliefs as well. So sometimes beliefs can be around for decades, and that can take some time with traders to eliminate and to change. Generally, between four to six sessions is very sufficient. Some traders or most traders notice changes after the first session. So the changes are quite subtle. So they'll feel more relaxed when trading. They'll be more focused, more disciplined, and then over time, it's like repetition. It's like driving a car. The more we do something, the more we listen to something, it becomes subconscious. So the answer to your question is, from the first session generally, traders do start to notice change. Four to six sessions is sufficient. However, I have been seeing some traders for over six years because they just feel like it's such a good investment. You know, they come some come every month, some come every quarter. It just depends. Listeners will probably already understand the basic concept, I guess, of meditation as a way to relax, but perhaps less so with hypnotherapy. What are some of the similarities and differences between the two practices? So basically, meditation and hypnosis, we're in the same state. We're in the alpha state. So we're in a very deep state of relaxation. The difference between meditation and self-hypnosis is simply with self-hypnosis, we can bring in suggestions, which are affirmations, and the subconscious part of our mind is generally in a much more kind of awake state because the conscious part of our mind is more relaxed and asleep. So the subconscious takes in and absorbs all of those suggestions, images very, very quickly. So it's very similar to meditation. I guess one of the key challenges for traders is the issue of burnout. And it's common amongst a high level of traders. Could you explain how hypnotherapy might help a trader to avoid burnout specifically? Yes, it can help in so, so many ways. One of the biggest things that traders struggle with as we know is FOMO. So it can affect sleep, relationships, burnout. So how hypnosis can help is an accumulation of things. Number one, it can help to detach and reduce FOMO. So they're spending less time at the charts, at the screens, and they're being more productive. It can also help with sleep, the quality and quantity of sleep. It can help to reduce stress, anxiety. It can also help with physical symptoms, helping to relax the body, the stomach. It can just, it generally helps with a real good kind of overall sense of well-being, happiness, and just bringing in the right mindset, behaviors and feelings. What are some of the most pronounced changes that you've seen in some of the clients that you've worked with? The first one that comes to mind is my first client, my first trading client. He contacted me. I never thought really about working with traders. Obviously, I traded myself. I traded forex for many years. I come from a family of successful traders, but I never kind of thought about helping traders. So he contacted me and he said, look, I'm really struggling with FOMO and my mindset. Can you help me? We actually worked together face to face. So he would come to see me at my office. And within just two to three weeks, the changes were phenomenal. He had literally done a 180. He went from being stressed, not sleeping, having an unhealthy relationship with alcohol, just not performing well in trading. He just literally just cut down alcohol, was sleeping better and his trading results were just consistent and profitable. And he just felt a lot better. So that's the first one that comes to mind. There's hundreds, hundreds of success stories over the last decade. Excellent. And what would you say in looking back at the past decade and your body of work and the clients you've worked with, what would you say is probably like the number one most common issue that people come to you with? I think for traders, the thing that they say the most is, look, I've got a really good strategy. I've got sensible risk management, but I just cannot stick to my trading plan. And so when we have that conversation, I'll ask three questions. What's going on in your mind? What's going on in your thoughts? How are you feeling in your body? And we'll go through a series of questions. And that will give me more of an identity of what's going on. Are they holding on to a limiting belief? Are there fears, which they generally are fears. But to go on to your question, the number one is that traders find it very challenging to stick to their trading plan. And this is because trading causes the fire or flight in us. Interesting. I know personally a bunch of experienced traders who have challenges with sticking to a trading plan, even though they know the trading plan has been backtested and is successful. At the root I tend to find is just ill discipline. I guess ill discipline comes in many forms. Like you're saying about the client who had issues with alcohol, I guess if the stress levels are increasing and you're frustrated with your lack of discipline, one outlet might be to use alcohol, another might be to take excessive risk or to revenge trade is often an issue that occurs amongst traders where they find themselves frustrated with their lack of discipline. So they commit acts of indiscipline almost as a tantrum. Yeah. Is that something that you've witnessed yourself? Yes, I have and I'm going to talk about this subject because it is such an important subject for traders to understand and it comes down to our beliefs and our belief system. Now I talk about this a lot. I talk about it on every podcast. I work on it with every session with traders. It's in every course available because it is fundamental. If we have a limiting belief that we're not good enough, we're not deserving, it will manifest and show up in our trading performance and our results and I have seen it hundreds of times. So I always work on a trader's belief system. Number one, the first thing is we try to identify what their beliefs are. I do this through asking them to do journaling. I also can identify what beliefs they've got through their self-talk, their language they're using, their body language and then what we do is we get to the root cause, which is their belief system because if they've got a belief that they're not good enough, it can manifest and show up in their trading performance. Perhaps they'll reach a certain blueprint. Perhaps they'll kind of just kind of have that a really good run and then they have this self-destructive behavior of giving it back, revenge trading, over-trading. So this can be a form of limiting beliefs and so I always work on that. I think it's so important for traders to understand and to identify if they have any limiting beliefs and if they do, to invest the time to work on them. An excellent holistic approach I guess to the issue as opposed to just trying to identify the behavior as a symptom of a deeper limiting belief is what you're getting at I guess. Absolutely. I've seen it so many times with traders. Of course I work on things such as discipline, patience, focus, confidence, self-belief. I do work on that and it is very important and the mindset and managing emotions, of course it's very important, but if I don't get to the root cause that's potentially causing those issues, the lack of discipline, the lack of self-control, then I'm basically putting a plaster or a band-aid over a cut. So I work on the whole 360 when it comes to traders. If there's anything that's affecting their performance from sleep to their lifestyle, we'll work on that. Superb. And although obviously your practice predominantly focuses I guess on people's professional lives, have you seen in your experience that your clients frequently notice benefits outside of their trading lives? I think you mentioned earlier about one of your clients having improved relationships. Is that something that tends to be quite common once you've got to this, you know, the root of the issue and you started to I guess get people to reinvest in themselves and start to move forward with a better belief system? Yes. I would say every trader, every client sees changes within other areas of their life. They have a lot more self-respect or they can have a lot more self-respect. They lead a healthier lifestyle, they're sleeping better, they're feeling better. So it can really help. It can really help just with all areas, not just with trading performance because as we know it's really important to have peak performance. You know, and if we've got good health and well-being we're going to perform better as traders. Now I guess the obvious question at this stage is does hypnotherapy work for everyone? Good question. It does. I don't know one client who it hasn't worked for. You know, I have had clients who have turned round to me in the beginning and said, look, I'm going to be really honest here. I don't know if I believe in this and I'm like, look, all you need is two things. Number one, an open mind and number two, commitment to change and the will to change. That's all you need with hypnosis. The answer is yes. Well, look, Louise, thanks very much for joining us today. This has been a fascinating conversation and a fascinating aspect of working on mindset that I guess not many traders would automatically think of a route to to resolving issues for themselves. Is there anywhere our listeners can go to to follow you online or access your work online? I run a podcast as well. It's called Trading in the Zen. It's on all major platforms. I also have a UK website which is www.hypnosisfortraders.co.uk So that's the best points of contact. Excellent. Thanks again, Louise, for your time. Thank you very much, Patrick. It's a pleasure.