 Ireland's winning in the Rupi 9-6. Ireland is winning in the Rupi 9-6. Firstly, it's time to read the email. Ladies and gentlemen, we've come to the last lecture of Genetic Genealogy Ireland's 2015, and it gives me great pleasure to welcome back Brad Larkin, to talk to us about the future of genetic genealogy. Now, Brad is editor of the CERNM DNA Journal, the 1970s was inspired by watching Alex Haley's television series Roots and thought, if Alex Haley can do it, why can't I? He is now editor of the CERNM DNA Journal, founder of genetichomeland.com, a DNA Project Administrator, a member of ISOG, and the Southern California Genealogy Society. He isn't on that, Liam, but I'm expecting he will be in some stage in the near future. Please give a warm welcome, Brad Larkin. Thank you, Morris. Coincidentally, I run several CERNM DNA projects, and we see similar results to what James and Morris are talking about. It is the combination, the truest insight comes from the combination of SMPs with STRs. One alone isn't going to do it until we really get the full sample, in which case we'll have the STRs just in one test. So I felt this way similarly for a couple of years now. So again, some companies that are only testing autosomal and not offering STRs, that's probably not a good place to put your sample if you're interested in this kind of family tree of things. Today we're going to talk to you about the future of genetic genealogy. I did a similar presentation last year. It was pretty well received. This is my 2015 forecast. And so it kind of builds on what Morris was talking about there, with all the work he's doing trying to make this tree that is the true family tree of the Gleasons, which is to say combining SMPs, STRs, historical information, named people, representing people that you don't know their names by their genetic markers. And so I think there's some exciting possibilities, because sampling coverage is going to approach 100% of the genetic lineages in the British Isles. We're going to continue to see an expansion of the number markers commercially feasible to test. And we're going to continue to have more reference databases with phased results of people, which is sort of what Morris is showing there. So these elements in combination will make it such that one day people will be able to get that answer instantly as some people come to the conference to expect. They can take a test, find out a great deal of information about their genealogical heritage. So sampling can coverage and convergence. So when you look at all these trees and all these table of numbers, it's easy to think, God, Lee, how are we ever going to do this? You know, we've gone from, this feel really commercial genetic genealogy really started in 2000 or so. And so it seemed like there were so many people to sample, we're never going to get it. But because of so many hard-working genetic genealogists that are represented in this room, we're getting close to covering all the lineages. We probably need to upgrade the number of markers covered. But just think about that. There's only a fixed population of people in, say, the British Isles. And within the population of people, there's actually only so many genetic variations, right? We're all descended from a fairly small number of people that lived, let's say, 2,000 years ago. So this tree was done a long time ago in 2006. It shows the insights when we were first starting to figure out the why R1B diagrams, John McEwen of New Zealand came up with that. But the point here for the future is that we are going to cover all the lineages. It's not an impossible task. It's not even going to take that much longer. Here we're going to talk about lineage variation just a little bit. A very brief history of Ireland. 8,000 BC first humans. 2,000 BC probably the arrival of R1B. 1,000 the Viking era. 2,000 AD genetic genealogy. So in the big picture of Irish history, those are the big eras, and 2,000 probably starts this era of genetic genealogy. So the question I thought coming into preparing for this presentation was how close are we to getting 100% wide DNA lineage coverage? Anybody want to take any guesses? Is James Irvin still in here? No? Anybody want to take any guesses? No? 60%. Okay. So of course there's no, I can't give you any, you know, there's no set answer, but from what I could tell, I gave it more thought than other people I had seen just in trying to get ready. And I looked at it a few ways. I looked at it like how many, the matches, the coverage that we have in the databases, how complete is that? So I did some things around a screen set of people from the British Isles. And one thing, this histogram shows you that most of the samples have come in in the last few years, even though genetic genealogy has sort of since 2000, most of the samples have come in in just the last few years. So we're little, the tsunami of SNPs is exploding, but also the number of people tested is exploding. And so to think about how close are we to coverage, I said, let's look at match count distribution. And so I just, to kind of use something that I could get some figures for, I looked at Y25 STR samples, how many of them matched and how many people they matched with those Y25 markers. And what we saw was this kind of very bimodal distribution. There are some people, about 15%, who have over 1,000 Y marker matches at the 25 marker level in the Family Tree DNA database. That's a lot of matches. Then you have a few people here that have none. And then you have a lot of people here that have just a few. Very large percentage. You overall, 13% have three or fewer matches. And 27% have 500 or warming, 500. That's a lot of matches, right? When you get that many matches, you probably sort of tune out to thinking you're going to get some insight out of that list. So the bottom line here is if my hypothesis that the lineages that we may not have tested is probably maybe the same of those that don't have any matches at all, then we're probably at 95% lineage coverage. So just a hypothesis. But it gives you a theory and it also helps to look at the lineages we've tested. So that's how we've done on Y. Y is easier to do right because we know it only comes from one of our paternal lineages. But autosomal convergence is going to happen the same way. As more commercially, more tests are commercially available, more people get tested, then all those many lines of heritage, we're going to get those converged too. We're going to have tested every variant kind of, or every set of shared DNA, we'll probably be able to identify. In Morris's slide, he had like a number, A255. With autosomal, it'll probably be a shared segment that has a certain pattern. And we maybe have to give them numerical designations for that pattern, whether we do or not anyway. That pattern you'll be able to see back through your different ancestors. So sampling coverage is going to converge to 100% for autosomal too one day. What Bennett Greenspan, the president of FTDNA calls, moving from survey to census, counting every single person a variation. And that leads us to something we call phasing. Phasing is where we look at our autosomal DNA and we figure out where did I get that particular piece on chromosome 8 from grandfather Waldron, grandmother Leary, whatever. And it's done by testing multiple persons with the shared segment and figuring out the ancestor in common. So there's some good references here with AT, Dr. Tim Janssen, and the ISOG Wiki. And you've been seeing the concept of phasing and a lot of the stuff Morris has done as well. And if you've taken on the family tree DNA, the chromosome browser, this is a simple form of phasing. I call it kind of impressionist phasing because it's not going by every marker, but it's kind of painting the picture of where, in this case we have a mother, a son, and a grandmother, where they share, right? So we're kind of at the beginning days with that. Real phasing is like this here where we'll look at individual markers and the patterns and be able to see which came from dad, which came from mom, and so forth. And Witt's paper here was where he was solving the problem of, and he wrote a paper on it, he had an autosomal sample from his mother himself and I think two siblings. And what his paper said was that when you have one parent missing because his father was passed away, he could go back with enough siblings, with two siblings, he could compute all of his father's DNA. So we do that in small bits when we triangulate in our family finder and when we do that, matches in common with on the family finder test, but if you take it to another level, you could actually impute all of his father's DNA, even though his father was passed away. Tim Janssen's done a really good job of doing his whole tree. And so you can see here, he knows his ancestor Gustav Janssen, he got these pieces of DNA from him, he got these from this other fellow, he got these from Peter's. He got this from Peter Peter's, right? So that's when we say we want to know, who are we, where are we from? By working this phasing and getting a lot of his cousins tested so that together they could get that inference, he's done tremendous work on phasing his own autosomal results. So right now it's still early days because Tim Janssen obviously is a pioneer, I mean he is like a Columbus out there. But eventually we're going to be able to do universal human phasing. So this is the future. So as the number of people tested and we can impute more individuals, then they help us impute the DNA of other individuals, to be able to have, actually predict everybody what their DNA was. And especially we can accelerate this if we had laws where every child born was mandated to get a full genetic sequence sometime near their birth, which I call universal phasing. If we were able to get everybody new tested by replicating this process of imputation, we'd be able to know the DNA sequence, basically phase everybody who's ever lived that has living descendants. So everybody on your family tree would be identified. So the thing Morris showed you by showing numbers for his ancestors because he doesn't know their names, you'd be able to do that with their whole autosomal picture. I believe that's going to happen. Now of course some people say universal human phasing, there'll be laws against that. Well maybe there will be, but there are some drivers that are outside of genealogy that argue that maybe there's a lot of health problems in the public policy. Healthcare cost savings, genetically targeted medications and vaccines, integration with wearable real-time health informatics, the Apple Watch, so forth. And so it's going to happen in phases probably where first we're going to get people tested, then we're going to get people phased, and then we're going to have phased databases. But you can see you reach a critical mass because once you have enough people you can impute his father. In the same way we'll be able to impute all our fathers. So this is kind of what I said before. Traditional genealogical pedigrees become better informed. They're a key part in linking our phased results to our ancestors' names. We have a lot of names on our trees, often we may have a name and we don't know where exactly it fits. When you get enough of this going on you'll actually know where it fits because the autosomal piece that you got from that person can only be here on your mutual tree. That is their DNA. You'll know their DNA name whether you know their traditional English name or not. So the power becomes tremendous. In the same way we've talked about ancient DNA. Ancient DNA becomes important too because it gives us milestones when we look up. We're going to shift gears now and talk about technology. The feature of genetic genealogy, technology, Moore's Law. Anybody here that's not familiar with Moore's Law? Pretty well talked about. Last year Spencer Wells talked about it. It was a man named Moore who was electronics engineer who wrote an article, I love this title, cramming more components onto integrated circuits. This is considered one of the most important articles in technology in the last 50 years and it starts with the word cramming. So basically his thing was that we're going to keep putting more circuits onto the same space and essentially often you hear it related as doubling the power of computers for the next two years. That's how it's most often paraphrased to you. But what he actually was saying was we're cramming more into a smaller space. And so I put a little analysis together here of when genetic genealogy kind of got started a lot of it was using this AB370 machine. You hear about the cost. You hear about the yield. If you think about it in terms of space it could be 12 bases per square inch per day. In case you needed that's about the yield you got out there. What's your next generation big Y tester done with an alumina high sec 2000 machines? These are different synthesis. They're about like that. They're about the size of a large room. They do about 14,000 bases per square inch per day. So it's come a long way but chances are that the future will get even more and we're actually outpacing Moore's law with this rate of growth. So that's the technology. We've got the technique, the phasing. We've got the technology. We also need reference databases and that's where maybe in some ways we're weakest now because this stuff is so new. We have some from the government and they're trying to keep up and some for genealogy we see them evolving we're going to have to develop them for ourselves as Morris did an excellent sort of preview on this which is to say we need the SNPs, we need the STRs we need the shared segments which are the autosomal pieces that you have in common with others that are illustrated on the chromosome browser. We need to know our matches. We need the phasing analysis. We need the geography. Where do I come from? And of course probably people that really use it they want it on a mobile platform. So that's part of what we're trying to do on geneticomeland.com is put the where along with the genetic genealogy patterns and combine them into one thing. So where this is going to lead to is what I'm going to dub the instant ancestry field meter and I have to give credit to Tyrone Bose who kind of crystallized this which is to basically say you'd carry around a small device you'd meet somebody, test them it would take the sample, do the critical analysis go online to compare it to the databases of people we already know that most people in this room are helping build and then it would email you out a report that would say oh, glad to meet you. Your ancestors were in 9-temporary in 1867 they were lived in Laura 1585 they lived in East Galway. Thank you, have a good day. So that's where it's going but you can see it takes the combination of markers knowledge, database it has to pull all that together and into a small space So I got all this ready before our meeting last year about two weeks before somebody came out with something getting kind of close which was the Freedom 4 this is the DNA sequencer it's not the size of the table over there it's about that size of a book and it's a PCR based sequencer which means it's pretty flexible and in the past year they're not available for commercial use yet they have to go through the FDA process but they did use them because they were obviously had a very dire situation with Ebola in Africa they did bring some of these into Africa because the best way to diagnose Ebola was to do DNA tests to go oh, Ebola virus because viruses are basically little pieces of DNA so they did pretty well there we think and they're going to, they are applying for FDA permits now so they're just one of several there's several other competitors and there's much larger companies trying to these are some kind of upstarts that came out of the University of New Zealand that are doing it so anyway, some of the future is getting here and we kind of talked about the the tsunamis and the SNP tsunamis and so forth so the future is more DNA sequencing performed faster on smaller machines sampling coverage approaching 100% remember in your big Y they're trying to do these how can we put it they're trying to do potentially millions of base pairs that still takes a lot of DNA processing time in the lab today I mean they work on your big Y sample at least a day and I think they run it probably for a week that they have your sample, your individual sample on the machine but as the sampling coverage goes up and through this process of identifying the important markers where we have about a 100 SNP panel now they'll get to something like 500 or 700 a thousand and they'll be able to put that on a much smaller device to run much faster because they'll say these are the ones that are genealogically significant at least in Ireland, maybe they'll be in Ireland packet that they go out into the field with that field meter and do that's going to do most of it so that's going to help they'll be testing faster but also they'll be testing smarter and with bigger databases more integrated you would be able to hand that person those results that fast so with that said questions Any questions for Brad? Jerry will take you first There are a few reasons about that firstly on the Oxford Nanopore they all use the the size of a memory state and they cost about $1 they use the sequence over during the emergency and it's successful and it works now on the few developments recently Illumina and Felix which will sequence the genome for $250 it will be a shared genome that means you get part of the genome information the sequence once and the next time you go the sequence will pay maybe $100 to get so it's bring down the cost and the second one with great vendors venture and they're also offering the $2,250 excellent half of it paid by the consumer and half paid by the insurance so it's moving in the right direction Super Any questions here if you want more? Actually Gerard mostly answered my question I was going to ask about the cost of the machines and how fast they produce results but in analogy I'd use this would be great if we could get like a machine with the size of an expressive machine or smaller and it could produce results within a minute or two just like you do at Starbucks and pay the cost of a cup of coffee for your results Right but see that it actually points out in a way although you're pointing at the progress I would say you're also pointing at the paradox which is that for genetic genealogy especially tables of numbers results don't mean anything we already have enough numbers to confuse all the new people so one of the challenges is that we need the database development we need the integration and so far what I've heard is it's mostly being done by it's not being done by the big companies it's mostly being done by small entrepreneurs and hobbyists which is fine but if I could do anything I would try to create a public policy where we kind of move those things in tandem together, database and technology and I'm not sure how to do that because it's a political question but we get to the future better when we go technology, database like that, yes John Yeah, thanks for that and the development of what we can but we will be able to do in the future because for most genetic genealogists the other big dimension is what's going to cost them so how soon do you do you foresee the cost of big tests like a whole wide read or even a whole genome read coming down to be low enough to be attempting to most people to feel it before doing that and making the best we can do if they really really want to so how soon will it be simple and easy to do? I would say two to three years would be my guess just because it will happen when the manufacturer has a new machine that costs a trillion quid to sell them and then they want to get rid of all the old machines that do the job we need better, perhaps So for example, like big wide $575 how much will that come down to and why will it come down to price because presumably is the machine going to change to a more efficient machine that will bring down the price or will they use a new technology other than the next generation a new type of next generation sequencing that will actually allow greater efficiency are they going to improve what they already have or are they going to have something different that will bring the price down? I think it's likely to be some of both they're definitely going to incrementally there's revolutionary change and evolutionary there will definitely be evolutionary changes in the testing machines to make them double, triple, quadruple faster because this, that high stick 2000 is from what I can tell is basically a first of its generation machine so it's going to go through lots of renovations the other thing is the number of machines they're making is going up I believe when Bennett, Greenspan and FTDNA started buying those machines there was no way they were going to be able to support them on your genetic genealogy dollars and I think they launched some initiatives around using the machines also to do medical related testing to help cover the cost of the machine so I know that there's more medical testing going on so I just think there's more competition and as they make more machines the price of those machines will go down just like all our other consumer electronics do and in terms of DNA projects on Tamatree DNA so quite a few of us here are running certain projects or part of certain projects happen with projects do you think that happen with projects what's going to happen do you think in terms of the way that we manage these projects or report these projects where do you see that going I see it going I've been impressed with the tool development I'm a software engineer so I look for tools and I'm impressed with the tool development I've seen in the last year I think that will continue to accelerate and it's already you know it's already consolidating some in certain tools so I see some of those tools getting better some will die some will you know go on some might get acquired by bigger companies and what about the interface between academia and large scale genomic testing and what we do because for example in the UK they have the 100,000 genome project so we've gone from the human genome project which was just to sequence one human being now we've got 100,000 and Barack Obama in the US has also recently announced that he's going to have a massive genomic screening project as well so this is going to create huge reference databases how are we going to interface with these academic and governmental initiatives well you know it's about our personal opinion my personal opinion is that we won't we won't get much useful information out of it I think this community driving the innovation and creating some commercial viability for testing companies that's what's going to drive to solve the genetic genealogy part of this I wouldn't my advice would be don't wait for them to save us because they're not going to they have constraints around privacy you know Dan Bradley was here when that Trinity study first came out I wrote him to find out this certain group of people certain members of that first study had similar pattern to me and so I wrote him privately to say you know hey could you give me any clues on where to look for Larkins you know and of course he couldn't answer me because they have confidentiality so I don't look for that to be very fruitful but I hope I'm wrong I'm just thinking about how long it might take to get from the one in a thousand coverage that James Irvin mentioned earlier today to 100% coverage you're aspiring to to take it back to when I got my first results two years ago I think I had about 450 autosilver matches and there were about 900 so I think the databases are doubling about every two years so that continues for the next 20 years 20 years to get to 100% coverage but I think the great innovation I've seen today is Ancestry offering buy one kit, get one free I think if everybody in this room goes out and recruits three more family members to submit DNA within the next 12 months before we come back next year we can get that growth rate to increase and bring 100% coverage maybe from 20 years time back to 5 years time but we all really need to recruit other people into the databases my number one match turns out to be my fourth cousin my first cousin's number one match I know we both have at least 1,000 people more closely related to us than that still living but they're not in the databases yet so to bring the future closer we need to go out and recruit more people to test oh well I have no argument there no argument there and another thing in the whole world scheme you know I mentioned the British Isles because of the enthusiasm here in America and stuff we're a way ahead of most of the rest of the world in terms of genetic genealogy sampling you know I think the coverage here is going to get to 100% I would say certainly in the next 3-4-5 years of lineages not population but lineages the rest of the world is not getting necessarily the same I think we have to do a better job also of promoting genetic genealogy I mean these type of conferences are great but it's amazing how how few people you know a lot of people come up and say oh we never knew this was on or never heard it was there the Irish Times or the Irish Independent or any of the national newspapers is difficult I wrote 33 radio stations before the events of two of them got me on from this little interview but it's because we don't have that kind of commercial backing behind us it's very very difficult to do this as volunteers and to get the word out there and I think you're absolutely right Patty one of the biggest things we have to do is DNA outreach work and word is mouth and running people one at a time is going to be a way forward I would love to see maybe in 10 years time in Ireland that instead of having inborn errors of the metabolism tested for by the helicric test in newborn babies we actually have whole genome sequencing and the the parents get a list of their ancestors at the same time question for you it's a slightly unfair question because you're American but it appears to be there are various EU programs which could offer an opportunity to create in these major relational databases because that seems to be at the heart of being able to advance this we've got the live program Horizon 2020 and so on I don't know if I saw the evidence of this or considered it I've been in terms of the inside center of big analytics they have about funded by 80 million from the Horizon 2020 and those others if you come to them with a project I'm really close to that and you provide one part of the funding they will match it with three months and we specifically talked about genomics I think they are rapidly becoming aware of the importance of genomics obviously for healthcare in Ireland it's capital genomics the the government just signed the $350 million deal with the Irish Capital Leaders Association to sequence two million capital followed by one million per year per year so we're going to get the capital over there so I hope that by this and next year we should have I will have x stolen or borrowed the one quarter funding so that they can give us three quarters matching funding and kickstart some something like that it brings up the it brings up the question in my mind and I was listening to Brian Swan's talk about the compilation of those Welsh pedigrees Brian that fellow that I'm sorry I've lost his name he basically did that himself through his own drive and determination right exactly so two models for progress one is the government decides they're going to do this they're going to mobilize these large resources and it's official there's going to be press releases and it's going to be great and you as the individual don't have to do anything sometimes that works space program but I think more often in things like this it's individuals or small groups of people highly motivated that drive it craftsmen explorers, thinkers, tinkerers and I personally think that's what's going to produce the databases that are going to be used remember email was an accident it was one guy in a cube that wanted to send a message to his friend over in the other cube it was too lazy to walk yeah exactly so now we have one more question over here it's political politics and how they could feed sensitivity of people to collect the material I have a cross-sand experience of that my father's family I know a little bit about the Atari in different jobs I was spending about a year of my mother's family and certainly things I do often because they got over-sensitive to the information and the problem might not use it if they thought that about their relation not particularly about the American government or the British government giving money which I'm going to say to do various things here in Ireland I'll give my own pinnipot pinnipot it was a political attitude to have side opinions emerge here in sensitivity of people who are interested in information which could be used as people take for parents' reasons discrimination etc is that being considered or am I am I on the one way? I mean even ancestry wasn't here last year because I don't think ancestry could legally sell a test in Ireland last year they just had to sort out the legal analysis of it but now they're setting it up and we got shut down in the United States for releasing medical information all of a sudden they just started taking the kids they received and throwing them in the garbage because they could have gotten prosecuted for testing them so we have to certainly find the balance you have to be advocates on both sides I would just say don't be afraid of information and if you're an advocate for this be vocal, let the other side be heard because I think sometimes the people that want to close down the theater the Shakespearean theater we'd never have Shakespeare if we let certain people close down all the theaters in 1610 or whatever year that was roughly in there to me it's the same since close the theaters it's dangerous to have people together watching plays with crazy ideas in them so I say okay but you don't come to the theater but I want to go to the theater and I want to see the play you're absolutely right a lot of sensitivity is China does not allow DNA testing France will put you in prison for 12 months and find you 15,000 euro if you do a DNA test so it's very very different approaches in different countries with 100,000 genome projects in the UK they are actually having a series of public meetings for a year and a half before the project actually gets up the way to get feedback from the members of the public about what their concerns are and what kind of issues this type of project raises for them because certainly when we first started doing the genetic testing for health matters in the US for example I think was George Bush probably called out the Gina law which was the genetic discrimination law so that insurance companies could not discriminate against you on the basis of your genetic profile and that was very very important I think here in Ireland I'm not sure what the legal status is I think it's similar to the UK where there is a moratorium on insurance companies using your genetic data to decide what your insurance premiums could be because you've got a higher risk for that and a lower risk for that these are really important questions that we as a community and we as a nation need to address so these kinds of things do exist but it's great to raise that question I know that's a country in which British islands need institutional approach to this would cause a certain amount of power it's an Irish one it's a British one perhaps but to use the words of British islands is not very acceptable in various levels of society in Ireland but we're not British and that's it shows that the sensitivity perhaps in a matter which would be pretty sensitive that's true that comment has been made before as well I think a lot of the ethnic and mixture results that you see are talking about British Isles and it's just a big blob over Britain Island even exist in Ireland it would be better to say Britain and Ireland or Britain Slash Ireland would be more more diplomatic I'm hoping the Irish genetic Atlas will change that to any map or others on their origins map to where it doesn't look like it's entirely over the Irish sea that it could be kind of like one color for Ireland for that matter England, Wales and Scotland certainly what the came to me is that one of the things we need to do is change public attitudes about either getting their DNA testing done and sharing their family trees as many of you have noted speakers during the time we've been here have said while I've tested that when you go and look to see how you match there's no listing of their closest ancestor there's no family tree there so it's really hard to connect and that's certainly been one of my goals I've got these second and fourth cousins I'm sure are related to it's right about the threshold of the 1840s and I really would feel wonderful by kind of moving how closely related I am to them whether they are second or third and we'd all achieve a much more fuzzy feeling at the end of it very, very true and I think no matter how advanced we become in terms of the technology we are still going to need to address the basics every single day, every single month, every single year so this conference when it comes back year after year it will always start with DNA for absolute beginners or the basics of DNA which test is best for you because we will need to have a constant program of education to bring people's level of knowledge up to DNA and what we can actually do for genealogy Patrick would you like to comment here on that? As we finish here today I would hope that we would leave with a positive note and I'd like to bring to your attention I've been in the senate for 20 years huge developments have taken place in the area of information the public servant is no longer affected in these ways and so on so there's absolutely huge changes now there are changes in relation to data protection legislation I'm set to practice in Ballester and I think you use the key word for me is balance we should not keep the wrong impression as we leave here and that's why I wanted to say these few words I can also tell you that the minister of state of this country a minister with a very special relationship with Tisha Jimmy Deanin has been appointed with special responsibility so on special responsibility of the diaspora his door is always there anytime I go to functions around the country Jimmy Deanin is there he started with little speeches with knowledge and so on and so on and so on he does his own thing and his door is there and I'm sure my experience is he's open for all new ideas and will be supported so get your ideas ready because there's going to be a massive submission of new ideas to Jimmy Deanin in the very near future and Jared will be your contact man in that regard thank you Jared and welcome to your welcome to your son good advice great well listen it's been a wonderful genetic genealogy Ireland 2015 thank you Brad for a fabulous talk and a very interesting discussion afterwards so a round of applause for Brad thank Family Tree DNA for sponsoring these series of DNA lectures we would not it would not be possible to actually sit here and listen to the wonderful speakers all of whom are voluntary they haven't been paid for coming here it's the love of the topic and the love of the hobby that actually brings people out here so I want to give a very very heartfelt thanks to all of the speakers who devoted their time and energy to prepare this wonderful set of DNA lectures that we've had the pleasure of listening to over the last three days the other people I want to thank are all of the volunteers who have been out there on the Family Tree DNA stand again a lot of them have paid their own way from America to be here because of their passion and enthusiasm for genetic genealogy I really appreciate that effort and time and money that they've put into that initiative and they've been working hard for the last three days getting the DNA that we all need to match with and discover who are our cousins and how do we break through those brick walls so a big thank you to them as well and lastly I'd like to thank everybody in the audience I know a lot of you have come to many of the lectures some of you have come to all of the lectures so it's because of people like you that we get sponsorship from Family Tree DNA to come back and deliver a new set of lectures every year so thank you for being the members of the audience that inspire us to keep doing what we do so on that note I would like to officially close genetic genealogy Ireland 2015 thank you have a safe trip I hope Ireland are still winning and hopefully see you next year God bless and thank you